MONDAY, JULY 20, 2020                                                                 2:05 P.M.



                                 SPEAKER HEASTIE:  THE HOUSE WILL COME TO

                    ORDER.

                                 IN A MOMENT I WILL ASK ALL OF YOU TO JOIN ME IN A

                    MOMENT OF SILENCE TO HONOR TWO OUTSTANDING PUBLIC SERVANTS WHO WE

                    RECENTLY LOST.  THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE TODAY AS WE CONTINUE DOING

                    THE PEOPLE'S WORK.  IT HAS UNDOUBTEDLY BEEN A CHALLENGING YEAR, BUT

                    TODAY OUR HEARTS ARE A LITTLE HEAVIER.  SINCE WE WERE LAST TOGETHER WE

                    HAVE LOST A MEMBER OF OUR ASSEMBLY FAMILY, ASSEMBLYMEMBER DAVID

                    GANTT.  AND JUST THIS PAST WEEKEND THE COUNTRY LOST A CIVIL RIGHTS ICON

                    AND CHAMPION, REPRESENTATIVE JOHN LEWIS.  BOTH THESE MEN WILL BE

                    GREATLY MISSED.  ASSEMBLYMEMBER GANTT DEDICATED HIS LIFE TO PUBLIC

                    SERVICE AND WAS A FIERCE ADVOCATE FOR HIS CONSTITUENTS AND HIS

                    COMMUNITY.  HE HAD AN UNWAVERING COMMITMENT TO THE PEOPLE OF

                                          1



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ROCHESTER, WHICH HE SHOWED IN EVERY STEP OF HIS CAREER.  FROM HIS TIME

                    AS A YOUTH COUNSELOR IN ROCHESTER TO SERVING ON THE MONROE COUNTY

                    LEGISLATURE, AND HIS MORE THAN THREE DECADES OF SERVICE HERE IN THE

                    ASSEMBLY, DAVID WAS COMMITTED TO IMPROVING PEOPLE'S LIVES AND

                    ENSURING THAT EVERY NEW YORKER HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SUCCEED.  HE

                    WAS A FRIEND AND MENTOR, AND I KNOW WE WILL ALL MISS HIM DEARLY.  MAY

                    HE REST IN PEACE.

                                 AS I SAID ON FRIDAY EVENING, OUR NATION LOST A TRUE

                    HERO AND ROLE MODEL WITH THE PASSING OF CONGRESSMAN JOHN LEWIS.

                    REPRESENTATIVE LEWIS DEDICATED HIS LIFE TO THE FIGHT FOR RACIAL EQUALITY

                    AND BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS.  WHILE HIS CONTRIBUTIONS ARE IMMEASURABLE,

                    LIKE SO MANY AMERICANS, HE KNEW THAT OUR WORK WAS NOT DONE.

                    REPRESENTATIVE LEWIS WAS DEEPLY MOVED BY THE GLOBAL DEMONSTRATIONS

                    FOLLOWING THE DEATH OF GEORGE FLOYD, AND HOW INCLUSIVE THE FIGHT FOR

                    RACIAL JUSTICE HAS BECOME.  IN HIS ABSENCE, WE MUST HONOR HIS LEGACY BY

                    CONTINUING THE MOMENTUM OF THE FIGHT FOR EQUALITY.  HIS ACTION OPENED

                    THE DOOR FOR SO MANY AMERICANS, INCLUDING MYSELF.  WITH THE PASSAGE

                    OF THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT, JOHN LEWIS TRANSFORMED THE POLITICAL

                    LANDSCAPE FOR AFRICAN-AMERICANS.  IT ALLOWED PEOPLE OF COLOR TO NOT

                    ONLY PARTICIPATE IN ELECTIONS, BUT TO REPRESENT THEIR COMMUNITIES AND

                    GOVERNMENT AS ELECTED OFFICIALS AS WELL.  THANKS TO HIS WORK, THE

                    DIVERSITY OF THE LEGISLATIVE BODY HAS CONTINUED TO GROW YEAR AFTER YEAR.

                    I'M ETERNALLY GRATEFUL FOR HIS DEDICATION TO RACIAL EQUALITY, AND WILL

                    CONTINUE TO HONOR HIS LEGACY HERE IN NEW YORK.  MAY HE REST IN POWER.

                                 SO BEFORE WE BEGIN OUR WORK, LET US TAKE A MOMENT OF

                                          2



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SILENCE TO RECOGNIZE ASSEMBLYMEMBER GANTT AND CONGRESSMAN LEWIS.

                                 (WHEREUPON, A MOMENT OF SILENCE WAS OBSERVED.)

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 ONCE AGAIN, THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE AND LET'S GET

                    TO WORK.  LET ME NOW TURN IT OVER TO REVEREND ELIA WHO WILL OFFER A

                    PRAYER.

                                 REVEREND DONNA ELIA:  LET US PRAY.  HOLY

                    GOD, YOU ARE WITH US EVEN IN PLACES WHERE WE DID NOT EXPECT TO BE.

                    AS THIS LEGISLATURE GATHERS FOR A SUMMER SESSION, POUR OUT A GENEROUS

                    MEASURE OF YOUR BLESSING UPON EACH ONE AND UPON THEIR WORK FOR THE

                    BETTERMENT OF OUR COMMUNITIES, OUR STATE, OUR NATION AND THE WORLD.

                    WE GIVE YOU THANKS FOR THE LIVES OF ASSEMBLYMAN DAVID GANTT AND

                    CONGRESSMAN JOHN LEWIS.  THANK YOU FOR THEIR PASSION FOR JUSTICE, FOR

                    ALL IN THEM THAT WAS GOOD AND COMPASSIONATE, JUSTICE SEEKING AND WISE.

                    MAY THEIR MEMORY BE A BLESSING AND MAY WE CARRY ON THE WORK THAT

                    REMAINS UNFINISHED.  AS THIS BODY CONVENES, INFUSE IT WITH WISDOM

                    AND UNDERSTANDING AND HELP THE MEMBERS FIND GOOD AND JUST SOLUTIONS

                    TO THE CHALLENGES THEY FACE.  STRENGTHEN THOSE WHO ARE WEARY.  GIVE

                    GOOD HEALTH TO ANY WHO FEEL UNWELL.  THANK YOU FOR THEIR COMMITMENT

                    TO PUBLIC SERVICE.  THANK YOU FOR THE STAFF, THOSE VISIBLE AND FOR THOSE

                    WHO WORK BEHIND THE SCENES, FOR THEIR LONG YEARS OF TIRELESS DEDICATION,

                    WISDOM AND HUMOR.  WE ASK YOUR BLESSING AND YOUR STRENGTH TO BE

                    UPON THEM.  BLESS THE FAMILIES WHOSE LOVE AND SUPPORT UNDERGIRDS THIS

                    ASSEMBLY AND STAFF.  KEEP THEM HEALTHY AND STRONG.  BRING HEALING

                    MERCY TO THOSE WHO SUFFER FROM THE CORONAVIRUS, AND WE ARE GRATEFUL,

                                          3



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    O LORD, THAT THE WORK THAT WE ARE DOING IN NEW YORK STATE IS KEEPING

                    OUR NUMBERS LOW.  LET US CONTINUE TO BE RESPONSIBLE AND CARING FOR ONE

                    ANOTHER.  HELP US ERADICATE SYSTEMIC RACISM.  PRESERVE OUR DEMOCRACY.

                    LET THE VOICE OF EACH PERSON BE HEARD.  ENABLE US TO STAND AGAINST

                    OPPRESSION AND HATRED, AND BRING US PEACE AND JUSTICE IN OUR TIME, O

                    HOLY ONE.  AMEN.

                                 MEMBERS:  AMEN.

                                 SPEAKER HEASTIE:  THANK YOU, REVEREND ELIA.

                                 VISITORS ARE INVITED TO JOIN THE MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE

                    OF ALLEGIANCE.

                                 (WHEREUPON, SPEAKER HEASTIE LED VISITORS AND

                    MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.)

                                 A QUORUM BEING PRESENT, THE CLERK WILL READ THE

                    JOURNAL OF SUNDAY, JULY 19TH.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, I MOVE

                    THAT WE DISPENSE WITH THE FURTHER READING OF THE JOURNAL OF JULY THE

                    19TH AND ASK THAT THE SAME STAND APPROVED.

                                 SPEAKER HEASTIE:  WITHOUT OBJECTION, SO

                    ORDERED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER, FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO, AGAIN, OFFER A QUOTE TO GUESTS AND

                    COLLEAGUES WHO ARE IN THE CHAMBERS AND IN AND AROUND OUR ZOOM

                    SESSION.  THIS QUOTE TODAY COMES FROM THE HONORABLE REPRESENTATIVE

                                          4



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    -- HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES JOHN LEWIS.  JOHN SAYS TO US, DO NOT GET

                    LOST IN A SEA OF DESPAIR.  BE HOPEFUL.  BE OPTIMISTIC.  OUR STRUGGLE IS

                    NOT THE STRUGGLE OF THE DAY, THE STRUGGLE OF THE WEEK, THE STRUGGLE OF THE

                    MONTH OR THE YEAR.  IT IS A STRUGGLE OF A LIFETIME.  NEVER, EVER BE AFRAID

                    TO MAKE SOME NOISE AND GET IN GOOD TROUBLE, NECESSARY TROUBLE.

                    AGAIN, FROM THE HONORABLE JOHN LEWIS.

                                 MR. SPEAKER, AGAIN, I WANT TO WELCOME ALL OF OUR

                    MEMBERS AND STAFF WHO ARE IN THE CHAMBERS WITH US AND THOSE WHO ARE

                    PARTICIPATING REMOTELY.  MEMBERS DO HAVE ON THEIR DESKS OR IN THEIR

                    PRESENCE A CALENDAR, AN A-CALENDAR AND A DEBATE LIST.  AT THIS TIME,

                    MR. SPEAKER, I WOULD LIKE TO ADVANCE THE A-CALENDAR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES' MOTION, THE A-CALENDAR IS ADVANCED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  OKAY.  JUST SO FOLKS ARE

                    AWARE, THIS IS GOING TO BE A PRETTY BUSY WEEK.  I WANT TO THANK YOU IN

                    ADVANCE FOR YOUR COOPERATION AND -- AND YOUR PATIENCE BECAUSE IT'S

                    GOING TO TAKE BOTH OF THOSE TO GET THROUGH THIS.  OUR MAJOR WORK FOR

                    TODAY, MR. SPEAKER, WILL COME FROM THE DEBATE LIST, FROM THE MAIN

                    CALENDAR AS WELL AS FROM THE A-CALENDAR THAT WE JUST ADVANCED.  I

                    WOULD ALSO LIKE TO REMIND MEMBERS THAT WE WILL BE OPERATING UNDER THE

                    SAME RULES AND PROCEDURES THAT WE DID WHEN WE MET THE LAST TIME IN

                    SESSION.  THOSE PARTICIPATING BY ZOOM SHOULD USE THE ZOOM "RAISE

                    HAND" FUNCTION WHEN YOU'RE SEEKING TO BE RECOGNIZED FOR EITHER A

                    DEBATE AND/OR TO EXPLAIN THEIR VOTE.  AS IN OUR PREVIOUS REMOTE

                    SESSIONS, WHEN WE ARE ON A FAST ROLL CALL OR A PARTY VOTE, MEMBERS

                                          5



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WISHING TO BE AN EXCEPTION SHOULD CONTACT THEIR RESPECTIVE MAJORITY

                    LEADER OR MINORITY LEADER OFFICES.  SO AS WE BEGIN TODAY'S SESSION,

                    MR. SPEAKER, ONCE AGAIN, I JUST WANT TO, YOU KNOW, THANK MEMBERS

                    BOTH REMOTELY AND IN THE CHAMBERS FOR THEIR PATIENCE WITH THIS PROCESS.

                    THIS IS -- WE'VE DONE THIS BEFORE, BUT IT'S STILL A CHALLENGE.  AND I THANK

                    THEM FOR THEIR COOPERATION AS WELL.  NOT JUST ON MY SIDE OF THE AISLE BUT

                    ON ALL SIDES OF THE AISLE, MR. SPEAKER.  WE WANT TO BE THANKFUL FOR OUR

                    COLLEAGUES.

                                 WITH THAT, I BELIEVE WE CAN BEGIN WITH OUR DEBATE

                    CALENDAR.  WE'RE GOING TO BE GOING TO CALENDAR NO. 40, FOLLOWED BY

                    CALENDAR NO. 58.  AND IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THAT, CALENDAR NO. 68,

                    MR. SPEAKER, IN THAT ORDER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES,

                    WE WILL TAKE CARE OF SOME HOUSEKEEPING BEFORE WE BEGIN.

                                 ON A MOTION BY MR. DINOWITZ, PAGE 18, CALENDAR NO.

                    99, BILL NO. A.2331, AMENDMENTS ARE RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON A MOTION BY MS. WALKER, PAGE 45, CALENDAR NO.

                    322, BILL NO. A.8280-A, AMENDMENTS ARE RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON A MOTION BY MR. ZEBROWSKI, PAGE 45, CALENDAR

                    NO. 324, BILL NO. A.8308-A, AMENDMENTS ARE RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 WE'RE NOW ON PAGE 9, CALENDAR NO. 40.

                                 THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00794-E, CALENDAR

                    NO. 40, SIMOTAS, COLTON, AUBRY, ENGLEBRIGHT, BRAUNSTEIN, DENDEKKER,

                    JAFFEE, PERRY, COOK, WEPRIN, SANTABARBARA, ROZIC, HEVESI, QUART,

                                          6



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LIFTON, OTIS, MOSLEY, FAHY, SEAWRIGHT, TAYLOR, ZEBROWSKI,

                    L. ROSENTHAL, REYES, CRUZ.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PENAL LAW,

                    THE CRIMINAL PROCEDURE LAW, THE CORRECTION LAW, THE SOCIAL SERVICES

                    LAW, THE VEHICLE AND TRAFFIC LAW, THE FAMILY COURT ACT, THE CIVIL

                    RIGHTS LAW, THE CIVIL PRACTICE LAW AND RULES, THE AGRICULTURE AND

                    MARKETS LAW, THE JUDICIARY LAW AND THE DOMESTIC RELATIONS LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO SEX OFFENSES; AND TO REPEAL CERTAIN PROVISIONS OF THE PENAL

                    LAW RELATING THERETO.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT JANUARY 1ST,

                    2021.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 40.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MS. PAULIN TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 (PAUSE)

                                 MR. GOODELL FOR EXCEPTIONS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  VOTING

                    NO ON THIS PARTICULAR BILL WILL BE ASSEMBLYWOMAN BYRNES.  THANK YOU,

                    SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES FOR EXCEPTIONS.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MAKE SURE WE RECORD

                                          7



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MEMBER PAULIN AS A NO VOTE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A01184-A, CALENDAR

                    NO. 58, GLICK, FAHY, STIRPE, GRIFFIN, COLTON, WALCZYK.  AN ACT TO

                    AMEND THE EDUCATION LAW, IN RELATION TO MANDATORY REPORTING OF

                    CERTAIN CONVICTIONS, PROFESSIONAL MISCONDUCT AND/OR EMPLOYMENT

                    TERMINATION; AND TO AMEND THE CRIMINAL PROCEDURE LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    NOTICE TO THE EDUCATION DEPARTMENT.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 58.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY AND/OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY

                    PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A01329-A, CALENDAR

                                          8



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    NO. 68, GALEF, WALLACE.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE REAL PROPERTY TAX LAW,

                    IN RELATION TO A RESIDENTIAL REVALUATION EXEMPTION.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 68.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. CRYSTAL PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  TO CONTINUE OUR CONSENT

                    FROM THE DEBATE LIST WE'RE GOING TO GO TO CALENDAR NO. 120, THEN

                    CALENDAR NO. 159, AND THEN CALENDAR NO. 201.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02832, CALENDAR NO.

                    120, CYMBROWITZ, ABBATE, BRONSON, MALLIOTAKIS, PEOPLES-STOKES,

                    WEPRIN, ABINANTI, SEAWRIGHT, BICHOTTE, HEVESI, RAMOS, REYES,

                    GOTTFRIED, WALCZYK, WALLACE, CRUZ.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE INSURANCE

                    LAW, IN RELATION TO ALLOWING VICTIMS OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO DESIGNATE AN ALTERNATE ADDRESS FOR HEALTH INSURANCE

                    CLAIMS OR BILLING PURPOSES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                          9



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT JANUARY 1ST.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 120.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A04061, CALENDAR NO.

                    159, ENGLEBRIGHT, PEOPLES-STOKES, GLICK, GALEF, ABINANTI, SEAWRIGHT,

                    LUPARDO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC OFFICERS LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    DEFINING THE TERMS "RETIREE" AND "BENEFICIARY" WITHIN THE FREEDOM OF

                    INFORMATION LAW.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 159.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05306, CALENDAR NO.

                                         10



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    201, GUNTHER, ORTIZ, ZEBROWSKI, WALLACE, WILLIAMS, GLICK, GALEF,

                    D'URSO, BLAKE, SANTABARBARA, MONTESANO, ABINANTI, GOTTFRIED.  AN ACT

                    TO AMEND THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO THE USE OF VOICE

                    RECOGNITION FEATURES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 120TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 201.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, WE'RE STILL

                    ON OUR DEBATE LIST.  HOWEVER, WE ARE ACTUALLY GOING TO DEBATE.  WE'RE

                    GOING TO START WITH CALENDAR NO. 12 BY MR. STECK, FOLLOWED BY

                    CALENDAR NO. 27 BY MS. ROZIC, AND THEN CALENDAR NO. 33 BY MS.

                    ROSENTHAL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00292-B, CALENDAR

                    NO. 12, STECK, SEAWRIGHT.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE CIVIL RIGHTS LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO THE IMPOSITION OF PENALTIES AND REMEDIES IN SUITS BROUGHT

                                         11



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FOR THE VINDICATION OF CIVIL RIGHTS OR HUMAN RIGHTS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MR. STECK.

                                 MR. STECK:  OKAY, NOW -- NOW I SEE I'M UNMUTED.

                    SO THIS LEGISLATION GOES BACK TO THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1871 WHEN

                    CONGRESS RECOGNIZED THE NEED TO PROTECT THE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS OF THE

                    FREE SLAVES, RECENTLY FREED SLAVES.  AND TO DO THIS, CONGRESS ESTABLISHED

                    A DAMAGES REMEDY FOR ANY PERSON WHOSE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS WERE

                    VIOLATED BY A GOVERNMENT OFFICIAL.  FOR SOME REASON THAT IS UNKNOWN TO

                    ME, THAT PROVISION OF LAW NEVER MADE IT INTO NEW YORK STATE LAW FOR

                    OVER 100 YEARS.  AND, IN FACT, THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1871 LAY DORMANT

                    FOR SOME TIME BEFORE IT WAS RESURRECTED BY FAMOUS LAWYERS LIKE

                    THURGOOD MARSHALL.  AND THIS WAS USED TO VINDICATE THE CIVIL RIGHTS OF

                    NOT ONLY AFRICAN-AMERICANS, BUT FREE SPEECH RIGHTS, THE RIGHTS OF

                    WOMEN AND MANY OTHER THINGS.  IN NEW YORK WE PASSED LEGISLATION TO

                    CREATE AN EQUAL RIGHTS AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION, AND THAT

                    INDICATED TO ME THAT WE NEEDED LEGISLATION TO PROVIDE FOR AN

                    ENFORCEMENT MECHANISM.  OTHERWISE, YOU CAN HAVE A RIGHT ON THE

                    BOOKS THAT CAN ONLY BE ENFORCED THROUGH INJUNCTIVE RELIEF, WHICH

                    MEANS AN ORDER TELLING PEOPLE TO STOP.  A LOT OF TIMES PEOPLE OBEY THE

                    ORDER AND THEY STOP, BUT THEN THEY DO IT AGAIN LATER BECAUSE THERE'S NO

                    DISINCENTIVE FOR THEM TO ABIDE BY THE LAW.  THIS STATUTE HAS A LONG

                    TIME-HONORED HISTORY IN FEDERAL PRACTICE, AND WE FEEL BRINGING THE

                    EXACT SAME ENFORCEMENT PROVISIONS TO NEW YORK STATE LAW IS LONG

                    OVERDUE.  THERE ARE OTHER STATES THAT HAVE THESE CIVIL RIGHTS ACTS, AND

                                         12



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THAT IS, IN ESSENCE, WHAT THIS BILL DOES.  I'VE HEARD ARGUMENTS, AGAIN,

                    THAT, FOR EXAMPLE, YOU CAN GET ASSISTANCE FROM THE CIVIL LIBERTIES

                    UNION IF YOUR RIGHTS ARE VIOLATED.  THAT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH.  IF YOU LIVE

                    IN SOME SMALL TOWN IN UPSTATE NEW YORK AND YOUR RIGHTS ARE VIOLATED,

                    YOU'RE NOT GOING TO COME DOWN TO THE CITY OR ONE OF THE -- OR EVEN

                    ALBANY, TO SEE IF THE NEW YORK CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION WILL TAKE YOUR

                    CASE.  YOU NEED SUPPORT FROM YOUR LOCAL ATTORNEY LOOKING OUT FOR YOU,

                    AND THAT'S WHAT THIS BILL DOES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  WILL YOU YIELD, MR.

                    STECK?

                                 MR. STECK:  ABSOLUTELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. STECK.  I THOUGHT IT

                    MIGHT BE HELPFUL FOR OUR COLLEAGUES TO REVEAL A LITTLE BIT HOW THIS LAW

                    APPLIES IN RELATIONSHIP TO THE EXISTING FEDERAL STATUTES.  YOU MENTIONED

                    SECTION 1983 AND 1988 I THINK ALSO APPLIES.  WOULD THIS BE BROADER OR

                    THE SAME AS THE FEDERAL PROVISIONS THAT ALREADY EXIST UNDER SECTION

                    1983 OR 1988?

                                 MR. STECK:  SO, THE LAW WOULD BE BROADER BECAUSE

                    WE HAVE THINGS IN OUR CONSTITUTION THAT THE FEDERAL CONSTITUTION DOES

                    NOT HAVE.  THERE ARE ALSO DIFFERENCES.  NEW YORK HAS A -- A MORE

                    ROBUST TRADITION OF ENFORCING FIRST AMENDMENT PRINCIPLES THAN DOES THE

                                         13



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.  THE STATUTES ARE NOT THE SAME.  AND THE IDEA THAT

                    -- FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU WANT TO BRING A 1983 ACTION IN NEW YORK STATE

                    COURT - WHICH YOU'RE ALLOWED TO DO - THERE -- THERE'S CONCURRENT

                    JURISDICTION, BUT THE DEFENSE WILL INVARIABLY REMOVE THAT TO FEDERAL

                    COURT.  ANOTHER THING THAT WE'VE DONE IN THIS LEGISLATURE, WE HAVE

                    VERY, VERY CONTROVERSIAL CONCEPTS THAT HAVE DEVELOPED UNDER THIS LAW,

                    MANY OF WHICH ARE JUDGE-CREATED.  THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT WAYS THAT

                    COURTS COULD GO.  WE, IN THE BILL, SAY THAT THE COURTS CAN USE BUT ARE NOT

                    REQUIRED TO USE EXISTING FEDERAL PRECEDENT AS GUIDELINES.  SO THERE'S A

                    LOT OF CONCERN ABOUT THE CONCEPT OF QUALIFIED IMMUNITY THESE DAYS.

                    THIS BILL NEITHER PRESERVES IT NOR ELIMINATES IT.  IT ALLOWS THE NEW YORK

                    STATE COURTS TO DEVELOP THEIR OWN CONCEPTS AS TO THE APPROPRIATE

                    ENFORCEMENT OF THIS LAW.

                                 AND IN THE BILL MEMO, I ALSO NOTE THAT ONE OF THE MOST

                    IMPORTANT THINGS HERE IS THAT A LOT OF NEW YORK STATE AGENCIES ARE

                    KNOWN FOR BEING HEAVY-HANDED.  AND ONE OF THE REASONS THEY ARE IS THE

                    LACK OF ENFORCEMENT MECHANISMS.  SO THIS BILL PROVIDES SAFEGUARDS FOR

                    OUR CITIZENS WHO HAVE BEEN MISTREATED BY GOVERNMENT, AND IF WE DON'T

                    HAVE THIS LEGISLATION THEY WILL CONTINUE TO BE MISTREATED BY

                    GOVERNMENT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YOU NOTED IN -- IN PARTICULAR THAT

                    SECTION 1983 AND 1988 COVERED A LOT OF THE SAME GROUND.  YOU

                    INDICATED THERE WERE PERHAPS PROVISIONS IN THE STATE WHERE THE STATE

                    CONSTITUTION IS DIFFERENT THAN THE FEDERAL.  BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE

                    REMEDY SECTION ON THIS BILL - I'M REFERRING TO PAGE 2 STARTING ON SECTION

                                         14



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    2 - IT SEEMS TO REFERENCE THAT THE REMEDIES WOULD BE THE SAME AS

                    PROVIDED, QUOTE,"... TO THE EXTENT THAT THE LAWS OF THE STATE OF NEW

                    YORK FURNISH A REMEDY."  THAT'S THE FIRST PROVISION, WHICH INDICATES

                    THAT THERE'S ALREADY A REMEDY OUT THERE FOR MUCH OF THIS.  AND THEN

                    CONTINUES TO SAY AND IF IT DOESN'T ALREADY HAVE A REMEDY THERE WOULD BE

                    AN EXTENSION OF COMMON LAW.  IS THAT YOUR READ AS WELL?

                                 MR. STECK:  NOW, MR. GOODELL, WHAT THIS BILL DOES

                    IS PROVIDES A DAMAGE REMEDY IN ADDITION TO THE REMEDIES THAT EXIST

                    NOW.  THE REMEDIES THAT EXIST NOW DO NOT PROVIDE DAMAGES REMEDIES

                    FOR VIOLATIONS OF CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.  THAT'S WHAT THE FEDERAL LAW HAS

                    HISTORICALLY DONE.  1983 IS A CONSTITUTIONAL TORT.  THIS IS THE SAME THING.

                    WE DON'T HAVE CONSTITUTIONAL TORTS IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, AND WE

                    WOULD UNDER THIS LEGISLATION.  SO THE OTHER THING THAT IS VERY DIFFERENT

                    ABOUT FEDERAL LAW, WHICH WE DON'T HAVE IN THIS STATE IS TYPICALLY, UNDER

                    FEDERAL LAW, ATTORNEY'S FEES ARE MANDATORY.  SO IF YOU GO INTO COURT AND

                    YOU WIN A CASE AND THE JUDGE DIDN'T LIKE IT AND HE DENIES YOU ATTORNEY'S

                    FEES, THE FEDERAL COURTS DO NOT PERMIT THAT.  ATTORNEY'S FEES ARE

                    MANDATORY.  NEW YORK COURTS HAVE ALWAYS HAD THIS CONCEPT THAT

                    DISCRETIONARY -- THAT ATTORNEY'S FEES ARE DISCRETIONARY WITH THE COURT.

                    THAT IS VERY DESTRUCTIVE OF CIVIL RIGHTS ENFORCEMENT.  AND THE REASON

                    BEING IS THAT CIVIL RIGHTS CASES TEND TO BE QUITE EXPENSIVE.  THEY TEND TO

                    REQUIRE OVER $100,000 OF ATTORNEY'S TIME, AND NO LAWYER IS GOING TO

                    TAKE A RISK ON A CASE UNLESS THEY HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE PAID IF

                    THEY'RE SUCCESSFUL IN THE ACTION.  AND THAT IS -- SO WHAT WE'RE DOING

                    HERE IS WE'RE BORROWING FROM FEDERAL LAW, BUT WE'RE ALSO CREATING THE

                                         15



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    OPPORTUNITY FOR STATE LAW TO PROVIDE STRONGER REMEDIES THAN IN -- IN

                    FEDERAL LAW.  SO I COULD GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.  I KNOW OF A CASE WHERE

                    THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION, A -- A TEACHER HAD BEEN SUSPENDED FOR A

                    YEAR, AND 20 YEARS FOR SOME ACT THAT HE COMMITTED 20 YEARS EARLIER.

                    AND THEN HE -- HE GOT A JOB TEACHING AS A LONG-TERM SUBSTITUTE IN A

                    SCHOOL DISTRICT, AND THE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION SENT A FAX TO THE -- TO

                    THE SCHOOL DISTRICT THAT SAID THAT HE'S UNDER INVESTIGATION AGAIN AND THEY

                    FIRED HIM.  IT WAS COMPLETELY UNTRUE.  SO IN FEDERAL CONCEPTS OF

                    QUALIFIED IMMUNITY, FOR EXAMPLE, YOU HAVE TO HAVE AN APPELLATE CASE

                    SHOWING THAT THE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT IS WELL-ESTABLISHED.  WE ARE

                    LEAVING IT OPEN FOR NEW YORK STATE COURTS TO SAY THAT THAT POINT OF

                    VIEW NEED NOT BE FOLLOWED BECAUSE A LOT OF TIMES WHEN A PRINCIPLE IS

                    ESTABLISHED IN THE TRIAL COURT LEVEL, ONE OF THE REASONS YOU DON'T HAVE AN

                    APPELLATE DECISION IS BECAUSE NO ONE APPEALS IT BECAUSE IT SEEMS PRETTY

                    SELF-EVIDENT.  SO NOT ALL OF FEDERAL JURISPRUDENCE IN THIS AREA MAKES A

                    LOT OF SENSE.  AND WHEN WE WERE LOOKING AT THIS BILL, WE CERTAINLY WANT

                    TO TAKE GUIDANCE FROM WHAT HAS BEEN DEVELOPED IN THE FEDERAL COURTS,

                    BUT WE DON'T WANT TO TIE THE HANDS OF OUR STATE JUDGES TO EXAMINE --

                    REEXAMINE SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT HAVE MADE CIVIL RIGHTS LITIGATION

                    PROBLEMATIC IN FEDERAL COURT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, AS YOU NOTED, THIS LITIGATION

                    CAN BE VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE.  AND AS YOU NOTED YOU CAN INCUR OVER

                    $100,000 IN LEGAL FEES.  THAT WAS YOUR EXAMPLE.  IN OTHER AREAS OF THE

                    LAW, LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, IN UNEMPLOYMENT WHILE YOU CAN BE AWARDED

                    ATTORNEY'S FEES THERE'S RESTRICTIONS ON THE AMOUNT OF ATTORNEY FEES THAT

                                         16



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    YOU CAN BE AWARDED.  AND IT'S SUBJECT TO THE REVIEW OF THE

                    UNEMPLOYMENT BOARD.  YOU ACTUALLY HAVE TO SUBMIT AN AFFIDAVIT AND A

                    PETITION AND THEY HAVE TO APPROVE THE ATTORNEY'S FEES.  AND OF COURSE,

                    AS YOU KNOW, IN CIVIL LITIGATION IF YOU'RE TAKING A CONTINGENCY FEE WE

                    HAVE RULES OF THE APPELLATE DIVISION THAT LIMIT THE AMOUNT OF THE

                    ATTORNEY'S FEES THAT CAN BE CHARGED.  IS THERE ANYTHING IN THIS LEGISLATION

                    THAT WOULD LIMIT ATTORNEY FEES OR WITNESS FEES IN BRINGING SUCH AN

                    ACTION?

                                 MR. STECK:  ABSOLUTELY.  BECAUSE THE COURT ALWAYS

                    HAS THE ABILITY TO REVIEW ATTORNEY'S FEES FOR REASONABLENESS.  I

                    REMEMBER ONE CASE THAT WE HAD IN ALBANY COUNTY WHEN I WAS A COUNTY

                    LEGISLATOR.  IT WAS A REDISTRICTING CASE.  AND THE PLAINTIFFS WERE IN A FIRM

                    FROM NEW YORK CITY THAT PUT FIVE PEOPLE AT A DEPOSITION WHEN ONLY

                    ONE OR MAYBE AT THE MOST TWO WOULD BE REQUIRED.  THE COURT CAN

                    REVIEW THAT.  THERE'S A LONG LINE OF JURISPRUDENCE AS TO WHAT TYPE OF

                    ACTIVITIES ARE RECOVERABLE, WHAT TYPE OF RECORDKEEPING YOU HAVE TO

                    HAVE, AND, YOU KNOW, DUPLICATIVE BILLING IS NOT ALLOWED.  THERE --

                    THERE'S ALL KINDS OF JURISPRUDENCE THAT MAKES SURE THAT THE FEES ARE

                    REASONABLE.  BUT THE PROBLEM IS THAT IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE ATTORNEY'S FEE

                    REMEDY, THE INDIVIDUAL OR ENTITY VIOLATING SOMEONE'S CIVIL RIGHTS HAS NO

                    DISINCENTIVE TO STOP DOING SO AFTER AN ORDER IS ISSUED.  IT'S THE DETERRENT

                    EFFECT OF DAMAGES AND ATTORNEY'S FEES THAT MAKE SURE THEY WON'T DO IT

                    AGAIN, AND THAT'S HOW SECTION 1983 WORKS AND THAT'S HOW THIS LAW

                    WOULD WORK.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  NOW I NOTE, THOUGH, THAT WHEN IT

                                         17



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    COMES TO REIMBURSEMENT OF ATTORNEY'S FEES AND WITNESS EXPENSES YOU

                    PROVIDE THAT THE PREVAILING PARTY WOULD BE ENTITLED TO REASONABLE

                    ATTORNEY'S FEES AND WITNESS EXPENSES UNLESS THE PREVAILING PARTY WAS

                    THE STATE OF NEW YORK.  IS THERE A REASON WHY THE TAXPAYERS OF THE

                    STATE OF NEW YORK SHOULDN'T BE ABLE TO RECOVER ATTORNEY'S FEES IF IT

                    TURNS OUT THAT THE STATE HAD TO EXPEND, AS YOU POINT OUT, POSSIBLY

                    HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS IN DEFENDING AN IMPROPER OR

                    UNJUSTIFIED CLAIM?

                                 MR. STECK:  SO YOU'VE MIXED UP TWO THINGS THERE.

                    YOU'VE MIXED UP THE IDEA OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK AS PLAINTIFF NOT

                    GETTING ATTORNEY'S FEES, AND THEN THE STATE OF NEW YORK AS DEFENDANT

                    NOT GETTING ATTORNEY'S FEES IF IT WERE SUCCESSFUL --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I WOULD JUST -- JUST TO CLARIFY, I WAS

                    REFERRING TO THE SITUATION WHERE THE STATE IS THE DEFENDANT.

                                 MR. STECK:  RIGHT.  WHICH WOULD BE THE SAME AS

                    TRUE IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR, MR. GOODELL.  THE -- THE -- IN THE PRIVATE

                    SECTOR IF YOU WERE SUCCESSFULLY DEFENDING AN ACTION OF THIS SORT, ANY OF

                    THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIONS IN -- THAT ARE FEDERAL, YOU DON'T RECOVER YOUR

                    FEES.  YOU WILL ONLY RECOVER THE FEES AS A DEFENDANT IF THE ACTION IS

                    FRIVOLOUS, AND THE PRINCIPLES OF FRIVOLOUS LITIGATION APPLY ALL ACROSS THE

                    BOARD IN -- IN MODERN JURISPRUDENCE.  SO IN CIVIL RIGHTS, THE UNITED

                    STATES CONGRESS AND THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT HAVE MADE THE

                    JUDGMENT THAT IF YOU ALLOW THE RECOVERY OF ATTORNEY'S FEES BY THE

                    DEFENDANT IN EVERY CASE THAT WAS WON, EVEN IF THE CASE WAS REASONABLE

                    AND APPROPRIATE, THAT WOULD DETER PEOPLE FROM LITIGATING TO ENFORCE

                                         18



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THEIR CIVIL RIGHTS.  AND SO THE ONLY CIRCUMSTANCE WHERE A DEFENDANT CAN

                    RECOVER FEES IS IN THE EVENT OF FRIVOLOUS LITIGATION.  SO AGAIN, THE

                    PRIORITY HERE IS ENABLING PEOPLE TO ENFORCE THEIR CIVIL RIGHTS.  THIS HAS

                    BEEN DONE EFFECTIVELY IN FEDERAL COURT FOR YEARS, AND THE OTHER STATES

                    THAT HAVE THIS LAW OF THIS TYPE HAVE BEEN DOING IT.  THERE'S ABSOLUTELY

                    NO REASON BASED ON ANYTHING IN THE HISTORY OF LAW THAT NEW YORK STATE

                    SHOULD NOT HAVE THIS AS WELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. STECK.

                                 ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUE'S

                    COMMENTS, AND I THOUGHT I MIGHT SUGGEST A FEW REASONS WHY MANY OF

                    MY COLLEAGUES WILL HAVE A CONCERN OVER THIS.  AS YOU KNOW, WE'VE SEEN

                    THE STATE ECONOMY SHUT DOWN FOR AN EXTENDED TIME PERIOD WHICH HAS

                    RESULTED IN A HORRIFIC LOSS OF REVENUES TO EVERY LEVEL OF STATE

                    GOVERNMENT.  WE SAW A MORE THAN 30 PERCENT DROP IN SALES TAX

                    REVENUES, FOR EXAMPLE, LAST MONTH.  AND SO, RECOGNIZING THAT ALL OF OUR

                    GOVERNMENTS ARE BASING EXTRAORDINARILY SERIOUS FINANCIAL CHALLENGES

                    JUST TO PROVIDE THE BASIC SERVICES AND MEET THE MOST CRITICAL NEEDS OF

                    OUR RESIDENTS, THIS MIGHT NOT BE THE RIGHT TIME TO INCREASE LIABILITY ON ALL

                    OF OUR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS BY EXPANDING THEIR CIVIL LIABILITY.  I WOULD

                    POINT OUT THAT THERE'S A QUESTIONABLE NEED FOR THIS.  ALREADY NEW YORK

                    STATE HAS ARTICLE 78.  IT'S AN EXPEDITED PROCEDURE.  THE COURTS ARE VERY

                    FAMILIAR WITH IT.  THEY MOVE VERY QUICKLY BECAUSE IT'S AN EXPEDITED

                    PROCEDURE, AND THAT PROCEDURE IS ALL DESIGNED TO RESULT IN AN INJUNCTION,

                                         19



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    IF NECESSARY, TO STOP IN A VERY QUICK WAY ANY VIOLATION OF CIVIL RIGHTS OR

                    VIOLATION BY THE GOVERNMENT.  IN ADDITION, THOSE INJUNCTIONS ARE

                    ENFORCEABLE BY THE COURT.  IF THE INJUNCTION IS NOT FOLLOWED, THE COURT

                    HAS DIRECT AUTHORITY UNDER A CONTEMPT OF COURT PROCEEDING TO ENFORCE

                    THAT INJUNCTION.  SO WE ALREADY HAVE THE INJUNCTION REMEDY AVAILABLE TO

                    PROTECT THE RESIDENTS OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK.  IN ADDITION, WE HAVE

                    THE FEDERAL PROVISIONS THAT ARE ALREADY IN PLACE, AS MY COLLEAGUE NOTED.

                    THAT'S SECTION 1983 AND 1988.  THOSE PROVIDE FOR CIVIL REMEDIES IF

                    THERE'S A VIOLATION OF ANY CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISIONS THAT OVERLAP WITH

                    THE FEDERAL CONSTITUTION.  I WOULD ALSO NOTE, THOUGH, THAT IN ADDITION TO

                    SUBJECTING ALL OF OUR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS TO CIVIL LIABILITY, AS MY

                    COLLEAGUE NOTED, IT SUBJECTS LOCAL GOVERNMENTS TO THE HIGH COST OF

                    PAYING FOR THE VERY LAWSUIT AGAINST THE TAXPAYERS.  AND AS YOU NOTED,

                    THOSE EXPENSES CAN EXCEED $100,000.  THAT'S A HUGE, HUGE FINANCIAL HIT

                    FOR A SMALL VILLAGE WHEN WE ALREADY HAVE A REMEDY, AN ARTICLE 78

                    ACTION, WHICH STOPS THE ALLEGATION WITHOUT IMPOSING A HUGE LIABILITY ON

                    OUR TAXPAYERS.  SO AS WE MOVE FORWARD, RECOGNIZING THAT MOST OF OUR

                    CIVIL RIGHTS STATUTES ALREADY HAVE REMEDIES - AND THAT'S REFERENCED IN

                    THIS LAW - THAT WE ALREADY HAVE BROAD REMEDIES UNDER ARTICLE 78, WE

                    ALREADY HAVE CIVIL REMEDIES UNDER 1983 AND 1988 ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL.

                    THIS WOULD IMPOSE LARGE POTENTIAL LIABILITY, FINANCIAL LIABILITY, AT THE

                    VERY TIME ALL OF OUR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ARE STRUGGLING TO PAY FOR THOSE

                    ESSENTIAL SERVICES THAT WE NEED HERE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

                                 THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. STECK.

                                         20



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. STECK:  MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 MR. STECK:  THE ISSUE OF ARTICLE 78 IS NOT CORRECTLY

                    RAISED.  ARTICLE 78 HAS NO ATTORNEY'S FEE REMEDY.  A LOT OF TIMES PEOPLE

                    WHO BRING ARTICLE 78 PROCEEDINGS OR WHO TRY TO CAN'T GET A LAWYER

                    BECAUSE THEY CANNOT POSSIBLY AFFORD THE HOURLY COST OF AN ARTICLE 78

                    PROCEEDING.  THAT IS WHY CONGRESS AND THE UNITED STATES SUPREME

                    COURT RECOGNIZED THE APPROPRIATENESS OF A SECTION 1983-TYPE REMEDY.

                    WITH RESPECT TO INCREASING COSTS ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT THERE'S A SIMPLE

                    WAY TO AVOID THOSE COSTS, AND THAT'S NOT TO VIOLATE PEOPLE'S

                    CONSTITUTIONAL AND CIVIL RIGHTS.  THEN YOU DON'T HAVE LITIGATION AGAINST

                    YOU.  AND ONE OF THE PROBLEMS THAT WE HAVE WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT IS

                    BECAUSE THERE'S NEVER BEEN AN ENFORCEMENT MECHANISM IN THIS STATE,

                    WHEN CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS GET VIOLATED THERE'S NOT NECESSARILY ANY

                    DISINCENTIVE TO DO IT AGAIN.  THEY GET A SLAP ON THE WRIST AND THEY'RE

                    TOLD, "STOP" AND THEY STOP.  AND IF THEY CONTINUE TO DO IT WITH THAT

                    SAME PLAINTIFF, YES, THEY WOULD BE HELD IN CONTEMPT.  BUT THERE'S

                    NOTHING TO SAY THAT THEY DON'T DO IT AGAIN IN ANOTHER CIRCUMSTANCE, AND

                    WE HAVE SEEN THAT OVER AND OVER AND OVER IN THIS STATE AND THAT'S WHY

                    YOU HAVE SO MANY ARTICLE 78S EXPLORING THE VERY SAME ISSUES.

                                 SO I THINK THIS BILL IS NEEDED FOR THE VERY SAME REASON

                    THAT IT WAS NEEDED IN FEDERAL LAW.  I THINK IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A

                    CONSTITUTION IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT PROHIBITS

                    DISCRIMINATION ON THE BASIS OF SEX - WHICH, BY THE WAY, THE FEDERAL

                    DOES NOT - IF WE -- NOT ALL SEX DISCRIMINATION IS IN EMPLOYMENT AND

                                         21



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THEREFORE COVERED BY THE HUMAN RIGHTS LAW.  THERE'S LOTS OF OTHER

                    FORMS OF DISCRIMINATION, AND WE NEED AN ENFORCEMENT MECHANISM FOR

                    WHATEVER -- WHATEVER CONSTITUTIONAL AND CIVIL RIGHTS ARE VIOLATED.  AND

                    BY THE WAY, I WILL POINT OUT THAT IN NEW YORK STATE TODAY IN OUR

                    HUMAN RIGHTS LAW IF YOU'VE BEEN THE VICTIM OF RACIAL DISCRIMINATION

                    AND -- AND YOU BRING A CASE UNDER THE HUMAN RIGHTS LAW YOU CANNOT

                    RECOVER YOUR ATTORNEY'S FEES.  SO THIS -- THIS LAW WOULD ALLOW YOU TO DO

                    THAT IF YOU'RE BASING IT IN THE CONSTITUTION OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 90TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 12.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THEIR CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.  THE

                    REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS BILL.  IF

                    THERE ARE MEMBERS OF THE REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE THAT WOULD LIKE TO

                    VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE, PLEASE CONTACT THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE

                    IMMEDIATELY.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                         22



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THIS WILL BE A PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  MEMBERS

                    DESIRING TO VOTE NO SHOULD PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY

                    LEADER'S OFFICE.  THERE ARE PEOPLE THERE AWAITING YOUR CALL AND WILL

                    RECORD YOU IN THE NEGATIVE IF YOU CHOOSE TO.  SO OTHERWISE, MR.

                    SPEAKER, AGAIN, THIS IS A PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.  SO NOTED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.  I FOUND

                    THIS IS AN INTERESTING BILL BECAUSE A FEW MONTHS AGO WE AMENDED

                    SECTION 28-A OF THE EXECUTIVE LAW TO PROVIDE OUR GOVERNOR WITH MUCH

                    GREATER AUTHORITY UNDER EMERGENCY SITUATIONS.  AND SECTION 28-A OF THE

                    EXECUTIVE LAW STARTS RIGHT OUT BY SAYING SUBJECT TO THE STATE

                    CONSTITUTION.  AND WE'VE ALREADY HAD SEVERAL FEDERAL CASES

                    INVALIDATING SOME OR ALL OF THOSE EXECUTIVE ORDERS THAT'S VIOLATING THE

                    FEDERAL CONSTITUTION AND EVEN THE STATE CONSTITUTION.  AND IN MY

                    COUNTY WE HAD THE ANOMALOUS SITUATION, IF YOU WILL, OF HAVING OUR

                    ECONOMY SHUT DOWN BY A STATEWIDE EXECUTIVE ORDER WHEN THERE WERE

                    NO CONFIRMED CASES WHATSOEVER IN MY COUNTY.  AND IT'S HARD TO JUSTIFY

                    SHUTTING DOWN AN ECONOMY WHEN THERE ARE NO CASES IN THAT COUNTY.

                    AND IT'S BEEN EXTRAORDINARILY FRUSTRATING THAT WE'VE SEEN THESE

                    BROAD-BASED EXECUTIVE ORDERS THAT APPLY STATEWIDE THAT IGNORE THE

                                         23



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LANGUAGE OF THE STATUTE THAT SAYS IT SHOULD BE A MINIMUM DISRUPTION

                    AND THAT WE SHOULD MINIMIZE THE NEGATIVE IMPACT.  AND THOSE

                    SHUTDOWNS DIRECTLY AFFECT PEOPLE'S LIVELIHOODS AND THEIR BUSINESSES.

                    AND THERE WAS NO DUE PROCESS.  NONE.  YOU WANT TO KNOW IF YOU'RE

                    ESSENTIAL BUSINESS OR NOT, YOU ASK THE GOVERNOR'S STAFF.  NO DUE

                    PROCESS.  AND SO MANY PEOPLE ACROSS THE STATE QUESTIONED WHETHER OR

                    NOT THOSE EXECUTIVE ORDERS VIOLATE FUNDAMENTAL CONSTITUTIONAL

                    PROVISIONS ON DUE PROCESS, ON TAKING, ON LIMITING PEACEFUL ASSEMBLIES.

                    I MEAN THE GOVERNOR SHUT DOWN THE CHURCHES IN MY COUNTY WHEN WE

                    HAD VIRTUALLY NO CONFIRMED CASES.  ALL OF THOSE ARE CONSTITUTIONAL

                    VIOLATIONS (UNINTELLIGIBLE/BUZZER SOUNDED).  SO WHILE I'D LIKE THE

                    CONCEPT OF BEING ABLE TO SUE THE GOVERNOR FOR THOSE, OVERALL I DON'T

                    THINK THIS IS A GOOD BILL AND THEREFORE I'LL BE VOTING NO.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL IN THE

                    NEGATIVE.

                                 MR. BARRON TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. BARRON:  I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR OF

                    THIS BILL.  YOU KNOW, BLACK PEOPLE IN AMERICA FROM THE BEGINNING

                    WE'RE TRYING TO GET THIS COUNTRY TO RESPECT US AS HUMAN BEINGS MUCH

                    LESS CIVIL RIGHTS.  THE VERY LEAST THAT WE CAN DO IS TO HAVE A BILL THAT

                    WILL HAVE -- OR GIVE MORE STRENGTH, MORE TEETH FOR ENFORCEMENT.  AND IF

                    SOMEBODY ELSE DOESN'T WANT TO SUE THE GOVERNOR BECAUSE OF WHAT'S

                    HAPPENING IN THEIR PLACE, THAT'S YOUR BUSINESS.  BUT THE BOTTOM LINE FOR

                    US AS A PEOPLE IN THIS STATE, THE LEAST WE COULD DO IS SUPPORT LEGISLATION

                                         24



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THAT GIVES US -- GIVES US MORE TEETH FOR ENFORCEMENT OF OUR CIVIL RIGHTS

                    IN A COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T EVEN RESPECT OUR HUMAN RIGHTS.

                                 SO I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL AND

                    VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. BARRON IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  ON THIS BILL WOULD

                    YOU PLEASE RECORD ASSEMBLYMAN WALCZYK AND ASSEMBLYMAN SCHMITT

                    IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00587-B, CALENDAR

                    NO. 27, ROZIC, AUBRY, BLAKE, DE LA ROSA, D'URSO, GALEF, JAFFEE,

                    JEAN-PIERRE, NOLAN, SEAWRIGHT, EPSTEIN, RODRIGUEZ, TAYLOR, CRUZ,

                    SIMON, GRIFFIN, PICHARDO, ORTIZ, DICKENS, ARROYO, COOK, FERNANDEZ.

                    AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC AUTHORITIES LAW, IN RELATION TO GENDER

                    BALANCE IN STATE AND LOCAL PUBLIC AUTHORITIES; AND PROVIDING FOR THE

                    REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON THE EXPIRATION THEREOF.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MS. ROZIC.

                                 MS. ROZIC:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS BILL

                    WOULD AMEND THE PUBLIC AUTHORITIES LAW TO ESTABLISH A PROGRAM TO

                                         25



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CREATE A PREFERENCE FOR WOMEN TO BE APPOINTED TO STATE AND LOCAL

                    AUTHORITY BOARDS.  JUST TO GIVE YOU A SENSE OF THE LAY OF THE LAND, THERE

                    ARE OVER 1,000 LOCAL AND STATE PUBLIC AUTHORITY BOARDS.  ORIGINALLY

                    WHEN I PROPOSED THIS BILL IN 2015, ONLY 14 BOARDS HAD PARITY.  TO GIVE

                    YOU A COUPLE OF EXAMPLES, THE THRUWAY AUTHORITY.  OUT OF AN

                    EIGHT-PERSON BOARD ONLY TWO ARE WOMEN.  NEW YORK POWER AUTHORITY,

                    OUT OF SIX TRUSTEES ONLY ONE IS A WOMAN.  NEW YORK STATE BRIDGE

                    AUTHORITY, OUT OF FIVE COMMISSIONERS ONLY ONE IS A WOMAN.  THE LIST

                    GOES ON AND ON.  THIS WOULD APPLY TO ALL STATE AND LOCAL AUTHORITIES.  IT

                    WOULD REQUIRE THE APPOINTING POWER WHEN MAKING APPOINTMENTS TO THE

                    GOVERNING BOARD OF STATE AND LOCAL AUTHORITIES TO GIVE PREFERENCE TO A

                    WOMAN, WITH THE WEIGHT OF SUCH PREFERENCE DEPENDING ON THE GENDER

                    DISPARITY OF THE BOARD.  IT IS A PREFERENCE.  IT IS NOT THE FULL FACTOR, IT IS

                    ONE OF MANY FACTORS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. ROZIC, WILL YOU

                    YIELD?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  GLADLY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. ROZIC YIELDS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MS. ROZIC.  AS YOU

                    KNOW, IN NEW YORK STATE THE PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION THAT ARE

                    WOMEN IS 52.3 PERCENT.  IS IT YOUR VIEW, THEN, THAT IN ORDER TO COMPLY

                    WITH THIS ALL THE STATE BOARDS AND AGENCIES SHOULD BE LOOKING TO HAVE A

                                         26



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MAJORITY OF WOMEN ON THEIR BOARDS?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  I AM LOOKING FOR GENDER PARITY.  I THINK

                    IT'S IN -- IN THE INTEREST OF THE STATE TO HAVE MORE EQUITABLE DISTRIBUTION

                    BETWEEN GENDERS ON PUBLIC AUTHORITY BOARDS.  STARTING THERE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, YOUR OVERALL OBJECTIVE WOULD

                    BE TO HAVE 52 PERCENT WOMEN?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  THAT WOULD BE GREAT.  IF IT WENT TO ALL

                    WOMEN THAT WOULD BE GREAT, TOO.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  LOOKING AT PAGE TWO OF YOUR BILL

                    AND STARTING ON LINE 18 THROUGH 21 IT SAYS, PERSON SHALL BE

                    RECOMMENDED FOR APPOINTMENT, APPOINTED OR REAPPOINTED TO ANY STATE

                    OR LOCAL AUTHORITY ONLY IF THAT RECOMMENDATION, APPOINTMENT OR

                    REAPPOINTMENT IS GENDER-BALANCED AS PROVIDED IN THIS SECTION.  ISN'T

                    THAT A VERY EXPLICIT PROHIBITION ON AN APPOINTMENT THAT -- OF A MAN?

                    FOR EXAMPLE, IF THE BOARD IS NOT GENDER-BALANCED?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  THIS DOESN'T PREVENT SOMEONE FROM

                    FINISHING OUT THEIR TERM.  IT DOESN'T -- IT DOESN'T DEMAND A QUOTA OR AN

                    EXACT NUMBER.  IT IS JUST TELLING THE LOCAL APPOINTING POWER THAT THEY

                    SHOULD GIVE THIS PREFERENCE WHEN CONSIDERING CANDIDATES FOR AN IDA,

                    FOR AN LDC OR WHATEVER PUBLIC AUTHORITY THEY'RE TAKING A LOOK AT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL THEN I GUESS I DON'T

                    UNDERSTAND.  WHAT'S MEANT WHEN YOU SAY THAT THAT -- A PERSON WILL BE

                    RECOMMENDED ONLY IF THAT RECOMMENDATION IS CONSISTENT WITH THIS

                    GENDER BALANCE?  ISN'T THE PHRASE "ONLY IF" VERY CLEAR THAT YOU CANNOT

                    REAPPOINT, FOR EXAMPLE, A MALE MEMBER IF THAT BOARD ISN'T 52 PERCENT

                                         27



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WOMEN?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  AGAIN, PREFERENCE MEANS THE ACT OF

                    FAVORING ONE PERSON OVER ANOTHER, AND IT AIMS TO BE INVERSELY

                    PROPORTIONAL.  IT DOESN'T -- IT'S NOT THE SOLE CONTRIBUTING FACTOR.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, JUST ABOVE IT SAYS --

                                 MS. ROZIC:  AND THAT'S THE INTENT OF -- OF -- OF THIS

                    BILL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, JUST ABOVE IT ON LINE 14 IT

                    SAYS ALL APPOINTIVE STATE AND LOCAL AUTHORITIES, ALL SHOULD HAVE

                    RECOMMENDATIONS THAT ARE GENDER-BALANCED.  THAT'S PRETTY CLEAR, ISN'T IT,

                    THAT ALL HAVE TO BE GENDER-BALANCED AND YOU CANNOT MAKE A

                    RECOMMENDATION AND YOU CAN ONLY MAKE A RECOMMENDATION IF IT IS?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  RIGHT.  BUT THEN IF YOU LOOK AT THE

                    DEFINITION OF PREFERENCE, SUCH FAVORING SHALL NOT BE (UNINTELLIGIBLE).  SO

                    IT SAYS THAT IT'S NOT THE SOLE FACTOR.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I SEE.  NOW THIS ONLY APPLIES TO

                    GENDER, RIGHT?  IT DOESN'T APPLY TO RACE, NATIONAL ORIGIN --

                                 MS. ROZIC:  CORRECT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- AGE, RACE, NATIONAL ORIGIN.  IT

                    DOESN'T COVER ANY OTHER PROTECTED CLASS, JUST GENDER?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  WE ARE TAKING A LOOK AT GENDER IN THIS

                    BILL.  I WOULD GLADLY LOOK AT DOING OTHER SIMILAR BILLS IN THE FUTURE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS.

                                 ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL.

                                         28



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT THE SPONSOR'S

                    DESIRE TO INCREASE THE REPRESENTATION OF WOMEN ON BOARDS.  I ALSO

                    SUPPORT THE DESIRE OF MANY OF US TO INCREASE THE MINORITY

                    REPRESENTATION ON BOARDS.  I THINK BOARDS THAT HAVE A DIVERSE

                    REPRESENTATION OF HIGHLY-QUALIFIED INDIVIDUALS BRING A REALLY GREAT

                    WEALTH OF BACKGROUND AND EXPERIENCE AND INSIGHTS INTO OUR BOARDS.

                    I'M ALSO, HOWEVER CONSTRAINED, BY THE U.S. SUPREME COURT CASE UNITED

                    STATES V. VIRGINIA THAT FOUND THAT GENDER-BASED GOVERNMENT ACTS MUST

                    DEMONSTRATE, AND I QUOTE, "EXCEEDINGLY PERSUASIVE JUSTIFICATION FOR THAT

                    ACTION."  THIS LANGUAGE IN THIS BILL GOES WAY BEYOND JUST ADJUSTING AND

                    ENCOURAGING SENSITIVITY TO INCREASING GENDER BALANCE.  THE ACTUAL

                    LANGUAGE IN THE BILL - AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE CALLED ON TO VOTE FOR OR

                    AGAINST - STATES THAT ALL, ALL APPOINTED STATE AND LOCAL AUTHORITIES SHALL

                    HAVE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT ARE GENDER-BALANCED.  GENDER-BALANCED.

                    AND IT GOES ON TO SAY PERSONS SHALL BE RECOMMENDED FOR APPOINTMENT

                    OR REAPPOINTMENT ONLY IF THAT RECOMMENDATION, APPOINTMENT OR

                    REAPPOINTMENT IS GENDER-BALANCED.  AND SO WHAT THIS BILL SAYS IS IT

                    DOESN'T MATTER HOW QUALIFIED AND EXPERIENCED YOU ARE.  IF YOU'RE A MALE

                    COMING UP FOR A REAPPOINTMENT AND YOUR BOARD'S NOT GENDER-BALANCED,

                    YOU CANNOT BE RECOMMENDED FOR REAPPOINTMENT.  OUR FIRST PRIORITY TO

                    THE CITIZENS OF THIS STATE IS TO TRY TO GET THE VERY BEST QUALIFIED PEOPLE

                    ON ALL OF OUR BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS.  THAT'S OUR FIRST MISSION.  AND

                    WHEN WE DO THAT MISSION WE SHOULD BE COLOR-BLIND.  WE SHOULD BE

                    BLIND TO GENDER.  WE SHOULD NOT BE SELECTING PEOPLE BASED ON WHETHER

                    THEY'RE WHITE OR MALE OR FEMALE OR ANYTHING ELSE.  WE SHOULD BE

                                         29



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SEEKING OUT THE VERY BEST QUALIFIED PEOPLE.  AND IN LOOKING FOR THE VERY

                    BEST QUALIFIED PEOPLE WE SHOULD LOOK FOR A DIVERSITY OF BACKGROUND.

                    AND SO WHEN WE'RE SEEKING THE DIVERSITY OF BACKGROUND WE SHOULD

                    LOOK FOR THE VERY BEST QUALIFIED PEOPLE WITH DIVERSE BACKGROUNDS.  THIS

                    LANGUAGE GOES FURTHER.  THIS LANGUAGE SAYS YOU CANNOT BE

                    RECOMMENDED FOR APPOINTMENT OR REAPPOINTMENT TO A BOARD IF YOU'RE A

                    MALE.  REGARDLESS IF YOU'RE A MALE OF COLOR, REGARDLESS OF THE WEALTH OF

                    EXPERIENCE YOU BRING, REGARDLESS OF YOUR QUALIFICATIONS, YOU CANNOT BE

                    RECOMMENDED -- OR TO BE MORE ACCURATE, YOU CAN ONLY BE

                    RECOMMENDED IF THAT RECOMMENDATION IS GENDER-BALANCED.  THIS TAKES

                    A GOOD IDEA, WHICH IS TO SEEK DIVERSIFICATION, AND CARRIES IT TOO FAR AND

                    WAY BEYOND THE CONSTITUTIONAL-ALLOWED PERSPECTIVE.  SO LET'S KEEP OUR

                    FOCUS IN BRINGING IN THE MOST QUALIFIED, THE BEST QUALIFIED PEOPLE WE

                    CAN, KEEPING IN MIND THAT PART OF THOSE QUALIFICATIONS MIGHT BE THEIR

                    GENDER AND PART OF THOSE QUALIFICATIONS MIGHT BE THEIR MEMBERSHIP IN A

                    PARTICULAR GROUP OR ETHNICITY OR MINORITY, ALL OF WHICH STRENGTHENS OUR

                    BOARD.  BUT OUR FIRST AND FOREMOST MISSION IS TO SELECT THE VERY BEST

                    PEOPLE, AND NOT PUT IN THE LAW THAT A PERSON SHALL BE RECOMMENDED

                    ONLY IF THAT RECOMMENDATION REFLECTS WHETHER THEY'RE A MALE OR A

                    FEMALE.

                                 BECAUSE THIS LANGUAGE GOES TOO FAR, EVEN THOUGH I

                    SUPPORT THE OBJECTIVE OF INCREASING DIVERSIFICATION I WILL VOTE AGAINST IT

                    AND RECOMMEND MY COLLEAGUES DO THE SAME.  THANK YOU, SIR, AND THANK

                    YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. BARRON.

                                         30



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. BARRON:  I WANT TO HIGHLY COMMEND THE

                    SPONSOR OF THIS BILL AND SAY TO MY COLLEAGUE WHAT COLOR-BLIND SOCIETY?

                    WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN?  COLOR-BLIND?  THIS IS A SOCIETY THAT HAS ALWAYS

                    GIVEN AN ADVANTAGE TO THE WHITE MALE SINCE ITS INCEPTION.  SINCE ALL OF

                    THE FOUNDING FATHERS, WHITE MEN.  AND WHITE MEN STOLE THIS LAND

                    FROM THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE, STOLE US FROM AFRICA TO BUILD THE WEALTH

                    AND DISCRIMINATED AGAINST WOMEN.  DIDN'T EVEN ALLOW WHITE WOMEN TO

                    VOTE, ANY WOMEN TO VOTE, UNTIL 1920.  THIS IS NOT A COLOR-BLIND SOCIETY.

                    THIS IS A RACIST AND SEXIST SOCIETY THAT PREDOMINANTLY WHITE MEN HAVE

                    PERPETUATED.  WHEN YOU WANT TO GO TO MERITOCRACY WHILE EVERYTHING IS

                    UNEQUAL, WHITE MEN HAVE HAD AN ADVANTAGE FOR CENTURIES OVER PEOPLE

                    OF COLOR AND WOMEN.  NOW YOU WANT TO GO TO MERITOCRACY.  WE SHOULD

                    ONLY DEAL WITH PEOPLE BASED UPON MERIT.  TREAT EVERYBODY EQUAL.  WELL,

                    IT'S NOT EQUAL.  IT'S LIKE THIS.  IT'S UNEQUAL.  SO IF YOU KEEP TREATING

                    EVERYBODY EQUAL IT WILL KEEP MOVING UP LIKE THAT. (INDICATING)

                                 THIS IS A GOOD BILL.  AND DON'T ASSUME BECAUSE YOU

                    HAVEN'T GENDER-BALANCED THAT YOU WON'T HAVE COMPETENCY.  THAT'S

                    ANOTHER SEXIST NOTION AS WELL.  THERE'S PLENTY, MORE THAN PLENTY

                    COMPETENT WOMEN TO SERVE ON THESE BOARDS.  MORE COMPETENT THAN

                    SOME OF THE MEN WHO SERVE.  SO, THIS IS A GOOD BILL.  I COMMEND THE

                    SPONSOR.  AND LET'S MOVE FORWARD AND HAVE A REVOLUTION IN AMERICA

                    AND THEN MAYBE WE WON'T HAVE A RACIAL -- WILL HAVE A COLOR-BLIND

                    SOCIETY IN THE FUTURE.  BUT I COMMEND YOU FOR -- FOR THIS BILL AND I'LL BE

                    VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND ENCOURAGE ALL MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE

                    SAME.

                                         31



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 MS. SEAWRIGHT.

                                 MS. SEAWRIGHT:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I JUST

                    WANT TO COMMEND MY COLLEAGUE, THE ASSEMBLYWOMAN, FOR INTRODUCING

                    THIS RESOLUTION.  AND IT'S A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, WE HAVE A LONG

                    WAY TO GO.  AND I'M PROUD TO CAST MY VOTE STRONGLY FOR THIS BILL TODAY.

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MS.

                    SEAWRIGHT.

                                 MR. DIPIETRO.

                                 MR. DIPIETRO:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I FIND

                    THIS REALLY RICH.  THE REPUBLICANS ARE GETTING ATTACKED FOR THE DEMOCRAT

                    BILL WHEN YOU'VE HAD A DEMOCRAT GOVERNOR IN THE MAJORITY FOR TWO

                    YEARS, THE GOVERNOR FOR EIGHT YEARS-PLUS WHO CONTROLS ALL THESE BOARDS,

                    ESPECIALLY IN THE CITY.  HE'S THE ONE, AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE ONE

                    THAT PUT THESE PEOPLE ON THE BOARDS.  I FIND IT RICH THAT YOU WOULD EVEN

                    ATTEMPT TO BLAME A REPUBLICAN FOR ANY OF THIS.  THAT'S A JOKE IN MY

                    MIND.  I WON'T BE VOTING FOR THIS BILL.  IT GOES WAY TOO FAR AND I'M 100

                    PERCENT AGAINST WATCHING THIS DISPLAY ON THE FLOOR TRYING TO BLAME

                    OTHERS FOR THEIR OWN PARTY'S MISTAKES AND THEIR OWN PARTY'S

                    SHORTCOMINGS.  THEY HAD THE CHANCE AND THEY HAVE HAD THE CHANCE TO

                    FIX THIS WITH THEIR OWN LEADERSHIP AND THEY DIDN'T DO IT.

                                 SO THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                         32



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS --

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ONE MINUTE, PLEASE.

                                 MR. REILLY.

                                 MR. REILLY:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WILL -- WILL

                    THE SPEAKER -- WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR A QUICK QUESTION?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. ROZIC, WILL YOU

                    YIELD?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. ROZIC YIELDS,

                    MR. REILLY.

                                 MR. REILLY:  MS. ROZIC, THANK YOU SO MUCH.  I JUST

                    HAVE TWO QUICK QUESTIONS.  I WANT TO ASK YOU A QUESTION ABOUT WHEN

                    THEY APPLY FOR A POSITION, I KNOW THAT LIKE APPLYING FOR JOBS YOU DON'T

                    HAVE TO ANSWER THOSE GENDER QUESTIONS.  WHAT WOULD -- HOW WOULD

                    THAT IMPACT THIS -- THE INTENTION OF THIS BILL, WHICH -- WHICH I -- I WILL

                    ADMIT IS -- IS WELL-INTENTIONED, BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS HOW THAT WILL PLAY IF

                    THEY DON'T HAVE TO ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS.

                                 MS. ROZIC:  THE APPOINTING POWER IS REQUIRED TO

                    TAKE ALL EFFORTS NECESSARY TO OBTAIN A LIST OF QUALIFIED CANDIDATES AND

                    RECOMMEND THEM FOR APPOINTMENT.  SO IT'S WITHIN THE DISCRETION OF THE

                    LOCAL OR STATE APPOINTING AUTHORITY.

                                 MR. REILLY:  SO -- SO IF THE -- IF AN APPLICANT WHO

                    MAY BE QUALIFIED DOESN'T ANSWER THAT QUESTION, DO YOU -- DO YOU SEE

                    HOW THE AUTHORITY WOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  AGAIN, IT'S UP TO THE DISCRETION OF THE

                                         33



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LOCAL OR STATE AUTHORITY.

                                 MR. REILLY:  OKAY.  SO -- SO IN NEW YORK CITY NOT

                    TOO LONG AGO THEY APPROVED PUTTING AN X AS THE GENDER ON BIRTH

                    CERTIFICATES.  IF SOMEONE WANTS TO IDENTIFY AS AN X, I -- I -- AND I'M ONLY

                    ASKING THIS BECAUSE I -- I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE -- AND I'M IN NO

                    WAY TRYING TO BE INFLAMMATORY.  I REALLY WANT AN ANSWER ABOUT HOW THE

                    BOARDS CAN ENSURE THAT THEY GET THAT INFORMATION.  WOULD IT BE UP TO THE

                    CANDIDATE TO -- TO ACTUALLY BE WILLING TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION?

                                 MS. ROZIC:  UNLESS -- IN THE CASE OF SOMEONE WHO'S

                    NON-BINARY OR GENDER NON-CONFORMING, THIS BILL DOES NOT DIRECTLY

                    ADDRESS THAT.  BUT I WOULD BE HAPPY, AGAIN, TO LOOK AT THAT ISSUE GOING

                    FORWARD.  IF YOU WANT TO PUT TOGETHER A BILL ON THAT TOPIC I'D BE HAPPY TO

                    COSPONSOR IT.

                                 MR. REILLY:  WELL, I MEAN, I -- THAT MIGHT BE A

                    GOOD -- A GOOD WAY TO -- TO ENHANCE THIS BILL NOW.  BUT THANK YOU FOR --

                    FOR ANSWERING THOSE BRIEF QUESTIONS.  I APPRECIATE IT.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT AUGUST 1,

                    2020.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 27.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THEIR CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                         34



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING NO.  IF THERE ARE REPUBLICAN MEMBERS THAT

                    WOULD LIKE TO VOTE YES ON THIS, PLEASE CONTACT THE MINORITY OFFICE -- THE

                    MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE FORTHWITH.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 MRS. CRYSTAL PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, THIS WILL BE

                    A PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THIS IS A VERY GOOD PIECE OF LEGISLATION

                    THAT JUST SEEKS TO ADD INCLUSION.  THOSE WISHING TO VOTE AGAINST THIS,

                    THOUGH, HOWEVER, SHOULD FEEL FREE TO CALL MY OFFICE, THE MAJORITY

                    LEADER'S OFFICE, AND WE WILL RECORD YOU IN THE NEGATIVE.  ABSENT THAT,

                    MR. SPEAKER, THIS WILL BE A FULL PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. LAVINE TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. LAVINE:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS IS

                    REALLY A GOOD BILL.  IT IS NOT MANDATORY.  THERE'S NOTHING MANDATORY IN

                    THIS BILL WHATSOEVER.  THIS BILL IS WHAT'S CALLED -- LEGALLY IT IS CALLED

                    PRECATORY, P-R-E-C-A-T-O-R-Y.  IT IS EXPRESSING A WISH OR A DESIRE OF THE

                    STATE OF NEW YORK TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE GENDER BALANCE.  YOU KNOW,

                    IT'S VERY FITTING THAT THIS BILL IS ON OUR CALENDAR AND OUR AGENDA FOR

                    TODAY, ESPECIALLY GIVEN THE FACT THAT WE LOST OUR COLLEAGUES DAVID

                                         35



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    GANTT AND -- AND JOHN LEWIS.  BECAUSE IN THE FACE OF THIS PANDEMIC, IF

                    ONE THING DOESN'T STRIKE CLEARLY, IT IS THE FACT THAT WE ARE ALL IN THIS

                    TOGETHER.  AND UNLESS WE'RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER WE'RE NEVER GOING TO GET

                    THROUGH THIS.  THIS BILL SIMPLY TRIES TO ENSURE THAT, IN FACT, WE ARE ALL IN

                    THIS TOGETHER, MEN AND WOMEN.

                                 I'M VERY PLEASED TO VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. LAVINE IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MS. WALLACE TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MS. WALLACE:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR

                    GIVING ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I JUST WANT TO NOTE FOR

                    THE RECORD THAT STUDY AFTER STUDY HAS SHOWN THAT DIVERSITY IN TEAMS AND

                    ORGANIZATIONS AND BOARDS LEAD TO BETTER RESULTS OVERALL.  IN ONE

                    PARTICULAR STUDY, AN ALL-MALE TEAM WAS FOUND TO MAKE BETTER DECISIONS

                    58 PERCENT OF THE TIME, BUT WHEN THERE WAS A GENDER-DIVERSE TEAM THE

                    RESULTS WERE 73 PERCENT OF THE TIME THAT THEY REACHED A BETTER RESULT.

                    AND WHEN THERE IS GEOGRAPHIC AND AGE DIVERSITY, THE RESULTS IMPROVED

                    TO 87 PERCENT OF THE TIME.  SO IT'S NOT JUST ABOUT WHETHER THERE NEEDS TO

                    BE ONE -- THE INDIVIDUAL HIMSELF IS THE MOST QUALIFIED, BUT IT'S ALSO WHEN

                    YOU ENSURE THAT THERE'S GENDER DIVERSITY YOU'RE MAKING SURE THAT THE

                    ENTIRE GROUP IS MAKING A BETTER DECISION OVERALL.

                                 SO I THINK THIS IS AN EXCELLENT BILL.  I'M VERY PROUD TO

                    SUPPORT IT AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. WALLACE IN THE

                                         36



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  PLEASE RECORD THE

                    FOLLOWING ASSEMBLYMEMBERS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE:  BRIAN MILLER,

                    ASSEMBLYMAN MORINELLO, ASSEMBLYMAN NORRIS, ASSEMBLYMAN

                    PALUMBO, ASSEMBLYMAN REILLY AND ASSEMBLYMAN SCHMITT.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.  SO

                    NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00694, CALENDAR NO.

                    33, L. ROSENTHAL, PERRY, WRIGHT.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE CIVIL RIGHTS

                    LAW, IN RELATION TO PRIVACY OF ELECTRONIC FARE AND TOLL RECORDS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MS. ROSENTHAL.

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  HI.  YES.  THIS BILL ESTABLISHES

                    REASONABLE UNIFORM PROVISIONS FOR MAINTAINING THE CONFIDENTIALITY OF

                    ELECTRONIC TOLL AND ELECTRONIC FARE RECORDS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. WALSH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR A FEW

                    QUESTIONS?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  WILL YOU YIELD, MS.

                    ROSENTHAL?

                                         37



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. ROSENTHAL

                    YIELDS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  SO, MS.

                    ROSENTHAL, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE ELECTRONIC RECORDS WE'RE

                    TALKING ABOUT THINGS LIKE E-ZPASS, IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  YES.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO E-ZPASS RECORDS, WHY -- I

                    GUESS AS A PRELIMINARY MATTER, WHY SHOULD SOMETHING LIKE E-ZPASS

                    RECORDS BE CONFIDENTIAL?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  I THINK THAT -- THAT PEOPLE HAVE

                    AN ASSUMPTION THAT THEIR WHEREABOUTS ARE NOT TRACKED BY GOVERNMENTS

                    AND THAT THOSE RECORDS ARE CONFIDENTIAL AND SHOULD BE.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WELL, THEY MAY BE TRACKED BY ALL KINDS

                    OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE; EMPLOYERS WHO WANT TO KNOW WHERE THEIR

                    EMPLOYEES ARE, SPOUSES WHO MAY WANT TO KNOW WHERE THEIR SPOUSE IS.

                    A LOT OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE, NOT JUST THE GOVERNMENT.  DO -- DO YOU

                    BELIEVE THAT THAT'S A REASONABLE EXPECTATION OF PRIVACY GIVEN THE FACT

                    THAT WE HAVE CELL PHONES IN ALMOST EVERYBODY'S HANDS THAT HAVE

                    CAMERAS.  WE HAVE MANY CAMERAS OUT ON THE STREET THAT COULD RECORD

                    SOMEBODY'S WHEREABOUTS.  WHY SHOULD E-ZPASS RECORDS BE ENTITLED TO

                    SO MUCH OF A PRESUMPTION OF CONFIDENTIALITY AND PROTECTION?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  WELL, REFERRING TO WHAT YOU SAID

                    EARLIER, IF A SPOUSE OR A WORKPLACE WANTS TO KNOW WHERE SOMEONE IS

                    THEY SHOULD ASK THEM.  HOWEVER, ONCE THIS BILL PASSES AND IS SIGNED

                                         38



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    INTO LAW, IF SOMEONE -- LAW ENFORCEMENT, FOR EXAMPLE -- WANTS ACCESS

                    THEY CAN -- THEY CAN GET IT UPON COURT ORDER.  SO IT'S NOT JUST EASILY

                    ACCESSIBLE.  IT'S STILL ACCESSIBLE.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO PICKING UP ON THAT.  SO THERE ARE --

                    THERE'S CRIMINAL LAW AND THEN THERE'S CIVIL LAW.  SO AS -- AS TO CRIMINAL

                    LAW, IN THOSE TYPES OF CASES I WOULD DEFINITELY AGREE WITH YOU THAT THE

                    BILL LANGUAGE AS IT'S PUT OUT THERE DOES ALLOW FOR A PROCEDURE TO OBTAIN

                    THE E-ZPASS RECORDS.  AND IN FACT, THERE WAS A -- NOT SO LONG AGO THERE

                    WAS A CASE HERE IN ALBANY COUNTY WHERE A MURDER WAS SOLVED IN PART

                    THROUGH THE E-ZPASS RECORDS.  THE DEFENDANT IN THE PORCO MURDER TRIAL.

                    SO THAT -- THOSE DO -- THOSE RECORDS DO COME INTO PLAY SOMETIMES IN

                    CRIMINAL LAW.  AND I DO SUPPORT THE SECTION OF YOUR BILL THAT TALKS ABOUT

                    THE PROCEDURE THAT WOULD BE FOLLOWED FOR A COURT TO BE PETITIONED FOR A

                    -- A SEARCH WARRANT TO BE ISSUED BY A COURT ON REASONABLE CAUSE.  MY

                    CONCERN I THINK WITH THE BILL AND WHAT I'D LIKE TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT HAS

                    TO DO MORE WITH THE CIVIL SIDE OF THINGS.  SO, UNDER -- THE LANGUAGE OF

                    THE BILL AS I'M READING IT, AND PERHAPS YOU COULD CLARIFY IT FOR ME, IT

                    LOOKS AS THOUGH THE ONLY TIME IN A CIVIL MATTER THAT YOU COULD ACCESS

                    E-ZPASS RECORDS WOULD BE IN A PROCEEDING RELATING TO THE COLLECTION OF

                    TOLL OR FARE REVENUES.  IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  CAN YOU REPEAT THAT?  I'M SORRY,

                    IT CUT OUT FOR A SECOND.  CAN YOU REPEAT THE LAST LINE?  YOU CUT OUT FOR A

                    SECOND ON MY END.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OH, I'M SORRY.  OF COURSE.  IN THE BILL,

                    SECTION -- LET'S SEE, SECTION 2 OF SUBDIVISION (C) IT TALKS ABOUT HOW IN

                                         39



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CIVIL MATTERS, THE ONLY CIVIL MATTERS WHERE YOU CAN ALLOW FOR E-ZPASS

                    INFORMATION TO BE DISCLOSED WOULD BE WHEN YOU HAVE A MATTER RELATING

                    TO THE COLLECTION OF THE TOLL OR FARE REVENUE.  IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  YEAH.  THAT IS IN CASE YOU

                    HAVEN'T PAID YOUR BILL, FOR EXAMPLE.  E-ZPASS IS ONE -- ONE WAY YOU PAY

                    FOR IT IN ADVANCE, BUT OTHER CASES THEY TAKE A PICTURE OF YOUR LICENSE

                    PLATE OR OTHER AND THEN THEY BILL YOU.  AND THIS IS FOR CASES WHERE YOU

                    HAVEN'T PAID, BASICALLY.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO -- OKAY.  SO IN ALL OTHER

                    CIVIL MATTERS, I MENTIONED EARLIER A MATRIMONIAL MATTER WHERE THE

                    SPOUSE IS QUESTIONING THE WHEREABOUTS OF THEIR SOON-TO-BE EX-SPOUSE OR

                    AN EMPLOYMENT DISCRIMINATION MATTER WHERE AN EMPLOYEE IS PERHAPS

                    NOTING ON TIME RECORDS THAT THEY'RE IN ONE PLACE WHEN E-ZPASS RECORDS

                    MAY SHOW THAT THEY'RE IN ANOTHER PLACE.  IN THOSE TYPES OF

                    CIRCUMSTANCES THERE IS NO PROCEDURE UNDER YOUR LEGISLATION WHICH

                    WOULD ALLOW FOR THE DISCLOSURE OF THE E-ZPASS RECORDS.  IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  YEAH.  THIS IS JUST FOR THAT ONE

                    PARTICULAR CIVIL MATTER.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  AND SO THE EFFECTIVE DATE IS --

                    STATES THAT THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.  SO IF, FOR EXAMPLE, AN

                    INDIVIDUAL USED FOIL PERHAPS TO OBTAIN RECORDS LIKE THIS IN THE PAST

                    AND THEN THIS BILL BECOMES LAW, WOULD THIS BILL AFFECT THE ADMISSIBILITY

                    OF THIS EVIDENCE IF OBTAINED PRIOR TO THE PASSAGE OF THIS BILL IN, FOR

                    EXAMPLE, A MATRIMONIAL MATTER?

                                 MS. ROSENTHAL:  UNSURE.  UNSURE.  I MEAN, I'M

                                         40



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SURE THE COURTS CAN WORK IT OUT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  ALL RIGHT.  THANK YOU VERY

                    MUCH FOR YOUR ANSWERS, MS. ROSENTHAL.

                                 MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, I -- I GENERALLY THINK THAT THE

                    CONCEPT OF BEING ABLE TO PROTECT THE PRIVACY OF ONE'S WHEREABOUTS IS IF

                    IT ISN'T GONE, IT'S GOING, I THINK IN TODAY'S SOCIETY.  I THINK THAT WITH

                    CAMERAS PRETTY MUCH ON EVERY CORNER, CELL PHONES IN OUR POCKETS,

                    THINGS BEING RECORDED ROUTINELY, IT -- IT'S -- I THINK IN A WAY WE CAN'T

                    UN-RING THAT BELL.  WE'VE -- WE'VE PUSHED OUR -- SOCIETY IS PUSHED TO A

                    PLACE WHERE THE PRIVACY OF ONE'S WHEREABOUTS IS PERHAPS NOT A

                    REASONABLE EXPECTATION ANYMORE.  HOWEVER, I DO THINK THAT -- I THINK

                    THAT THE BILL DOES HAVE A GOOD INTENTION IN THE -- IN THE SENSE OF TRYING

                    TO ESTABLISH SOME ROUTINE REASONABLE PROCEDURE THAT CAN BE FOLLOWED.  I

                    LIKE THE WAY THAT IT'S WORDED TO HELP PROTECT THE CONFIDENTIALITY OF

                    RECORDS EXCEPT FOR IN CRIMINAL MATTERS WHERE YOU HAVE THIS PROCESS OF

                    ASKING THE JUDGE FOR A SEARCH WARRANT TO BE ISSUED UPON REASONABLE

                    CAUSE.  OR A SUBPOENA DUCES TECUM TO BE ISSUED UPON A FINDING THAT IT'S

                    RELEVANT AND MATERIAL.  I -- MY PROBLEM WITH THE BILL IS THAT I WISH THAT

                    IT HAD ALSO CARVED OUT AN EXCEPTION FOR CIVIL MATTERS TO FOLLOW THE SAME

                    KIND OF PROCEDURE SO THAT IF YOU HAD A MATRIMONIAL CASE OR AN

                    EMPLOYMENT LAW CASE, YOU COULD TRY TO GO TO A JUDGE AND MAKE AN

                    ARGUMENT THAT THIS WOULD BE RELEVANT MATERIAL TO THE CASE THAT YOU'RE

                    PUTTING ON AND HAVE A JUDGE WITH DISCRETION BE ABLE TO MAKE THOSE

                                         41



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DECISIONS ABOUT WHETHER A SUBPOENA COULD ISSUE OR A -- OR SOMETHING

                    ALONG THOSE LINES.

                                 SO I THINK THAT ON THIS BILL I'M GOING TO BE VOTING IN

                    THE NEGATIVE.  AND IT'S BECAUSE OF THAT, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THAT THE

                    EXCEPTION IS BROAD ENOUGH TO ENCOMPASS REASONABLE REQUESTS FOR THIS

                    KIND OF INFORMATION.  AND AGAIN, FOR THAT -- FOR THAT REASON I WILL BE

                    VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 33.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.  IF YOU WOULD LIKE YOUR VOTE

                    RECORDED IN THE AFFIRMATIVE I WOULD ENCOURAGE THOSE MEMBERS TO

                    PROMPTLY CONTACT THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE

                                         42



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FOR THIS BILL.  THOSE WISHING TO VOTE NEGATIVELY SHOULD CALL MY OFFICE

                    AND WE WILL SO RECORD.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU, MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  WOULD YOU PLEASE

                    RECORD THE FOLLOWING REPUBLICAN ASSEMBLYMEMBERS VOTING IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE:  ASSEMBLYMAN BYRNE, ASSEMBLYMAN MONTESANO,

                    ASSEMBLYMAN SCHMITT AND ASSEMBLYMAN WALCZYK.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 MRS. CRYSTAL PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, IF YOU

                    COULD RECORD OUR COLLEAGUES MEMBER BUTTENSCHON, GUNTHER AND

                    BUCHWALD IN THE NEGATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, WE'RE

                    MOVING ALONG PRETTY NICELY HERE.  LET'S CONTINUE WITH CALENDAR NO. 35

                                         43



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    BY MS. NIOU, CALENDAR NO. 77 BY MR. GOTTFRIED, AND CALENDAR NO. 93

                    BY MS. SOLAGES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00711, CALENDAR NO.

                    35, NIOU, WRIGHT, BARRON, KIM, DINOWITZ, EPSTEIN, SIMON, FRONTUS,

                    RICHARDSON, D'URSO, FALL, SAYEGH, WEPRIN, D. ROSENTHAL, BLAKE,

                    REYES, SOLAGES, ABINANTI, CRUZ, SEAWRIGHT.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING DEBT COLLECTORS TO

                    INFORM DEBTORS THAT WRITTEN COMMUNICATIONS ARE AVAILABLE IN LARGE PRINT

                    FORMAT.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MS. NIOU.

                                 MS. NIOU:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK BRIEFLY ON THIS BILL.  THIS BILL WOULD OFFER

                    PROTECTIONS AND ASSISTANCE FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE IN DEBT WHO SUFFER FROM

                    VISION IMPAIRMENT, SUCH AS SENIORS OR MY WHOLE FAMILY.  OFTENTIMES,

                    DEBT COLLECTORS WILL BOMBARD DEBTORS WITH INFORMATION THAT CAN BE

                    INTIMIDATING AND ALSO DIFFICULT TO UNDERSTAND.  MUCH OF THIS

                    INFORMATION IS PURPOSEFULLY SENT IN SMALL TEXT SIZES, AND WITH SOME OF

                    THE TEXT SIZES AS SMALL AS SIZE 8 FONT.  THIS MAKES IT EVEN MORE DIFFICULT

                    FOR INDIVIDUALS TO READ AND UNDERSTAND THE INFORMATION SENT TO THEM,

                    ESPECIALLY IF AN INDIVIDUAL HAS A VISION IMPAIRMENT.  THIS BILL WOULD

                    ENSURE THAT DEBTORS WHO HAVE VISION IMPAIRMENT AND ARE

                    HARD-OF-SEEING WOULD BE ABLE TO RECEIVE CLEAR AND CONSPICUOUS NOTICE

                    THAT THE COMMUNICATIONS THEY ARE RECEIVING CAN BE PROVIDED IN LARGE

                                         44



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    PRINT AND REQUEST LARGE PRINT FORMATS FOR FURTHER COMMUNICATIONS.  THIS

                    SERVICE WOULD ENSURE THAT THOSE WHO ARE INTENDED TO READ, UNDERSTAND

                    AND COMPLY WITH THESE COMMUNICATIONS ARE BETTER PREPARED TO DO SO.

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  WILL YOU YIELD, MS.

                    NIOU?

                                 MS. NIOU:  YES, OF COURSE, I WILL YIELD.  AND I MISS

                    YOU, MR. GOODELL.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YES, NORMALLY YOU SIT JUST A COUPLE

                    ROWS AHEAD OF ME.  THANK YOU, MS. NIOU.  I AGREE WITH YOU, BY THE

                    WAY.  I GET FRUSTRATED WITH THE VERY SMALL PRINT THAT I SEE ON CREDIT CARD

                    APPLICATIONS AND -- AND SOME OF THOSE COMMUNICATIONS.  AND THE OLDER

                    I GET, THE MORE I APPRECIATE NORMAL SIZE PRINT.  BUT THIS DOESN'T REQUIRE

                    NORMAL SIZE PRINT, RIGHT?  THIS REQUIRES 16-POINT PRINT WHICH IS QUITE A

                    BIT LARGER.

                                 MS. NIOU:  SO, I MEAN, AS THE DEFINITION OF NORMAL, I

                    MEAN, I THINK THAT MOST OF US ARE VERY USED TO 12-POINT FONT OR 16-POINT

                    FONT WHEN READING DOCUMENTS.  I -- I MEAN, MOST OF OUR TERM PAPERS

                    WHEN I WAS IN SCHOOL WAS IN 12-POINT FONT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  JUST A COUPLE QUESTIONS.  IF IT TURNS

                    OUT THAT A DEBT COLLECTOR IS PERHAPS NOT AWARE THAT THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE

                                         45



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    16-POINT FONT ON NOTICES UPON REQUEST BUT MAKES A MISTAKE, IS THERE AN

                    OPPORTUNITY FOR THE DEBT COLLECTOR -- COLLECTOR TO CORRECT THAT MISTAKE

                    UNDER THIS BILL?

                                 MS. NIOU:  I MEAN I THINK THAT THERE WILL BE SOME

                    TIME GIVEN, BUT I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS ESTABLISHES VIOLATIONS FOR A

                    FIRST OFFENSE A CIVIL PENALTY OF $250, AND THEN FOR ANY SUBSEQUENT

                    OFFENSES, A CIVIL PENALTY OF $500.  SO THERE IS A CHANCE, OBVIOUSLY, TO

                    CORRECT BUT IT'S ALSO, YOU KNOW, A WARNING AS WELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YOU MENTIONED THE PENALTIES OF

                    $250 TO $500.  CAN THE DEBT COLLECTOR APPLY THAT PENALTY AGAINST THE

                    AMOUNT OWED?  SO IN OTHER WORDS, LET'S SAY THE DEBT COLLECTOR IS

                    COLLECTING A DEBT THAT'S WORTH $10,000 AND BY MISTAKE THEY DON'T SEND

                    LARGE-PRINT FONT, CAN THEY JUST SIMPLY REDUCE THE AMOUNT OWED TO

                    $9,750, FOR EXAMPLE?

                                 MS. NIOU:  I DON'T THINK SO BECAUSE THE -- THE FINE IS

                    TO US AND THE -- THE DEBTOR IS -- THE PENALTY WOULD OBVIOUSLY BE

                    SEPARATE FROM THE DEBT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I SEE.  DOES THIS LEGISLATION PROVIDE

                    ANY EXEMPTION FOR DOCUMENTS IN CONNECTION TO LITIGATION LIKE THE

                    SUMMONS OR COMPLAINT, A JUDGMENT EXECUTION, NOTICE TO PROVIDE

                    INFORMATION ABOUT YOUR ASSETS?  ANY OF THOSE COURT-RELATED DOCUMENTS,

                    OR WOULD THEY ALL BE SUBJECT TO 16-POINT FONT?

                                 MS. NIOU:  THIS BILL WOULD NOT APPLY TO THOSE

                    SITUATIONS.  IT ONLY APPLIES TO COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN THE DEBT

                    COLLECTOR AND THE CONSUMER.

                                         46



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO IF THE DEBT COLLECTOR SUES

                    SOMEBODY AND THE DEBT COLLECTOR IS NAMED AS THE PLAINTIFF - WHICH THEY

                    WOULD BE, BY THE WAY, IF THEY BOUGHT THE DEBT - WOULD IT THEN REQUIRE

                    THE SUMMONS, THE COMPLAINT, ALL MOTION PAPERS, NOTICES OF DEPOSITION

                    AND ALL THE OTHER LITIGATION DOCUMENTS TO BE IN 16 POINT FONT?

                                 MS. NIOU:  NO.  NO COURT DOCUMENTS.  THE COURT

                    DOCUMENTS ARE BETWEEN THE COURT AND THEN THE DEBTOR AND THEN THE

                    COURT AND THE -- AND THE BUSINESS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO LOOKING AT THE TERMS OF THE

                    LANGUAGE OF THE STATUTE, CAN YOU POINT OUT WHERE COURT DOCUMENTS ARE

                    EXCLUDED?

                                 MS. NIOU:  IT'S ONLY -- LIKE I SAID, THE LANGUAGE ONLY

                    PERTAINS TO THE COMMUNICATION BETWEEN THE DEBT COLLECTOR AND THE

                    CONSUMER.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, ON LINE 22 ON PAGE 1 IT REFERS

                    TO ANY WRITTEN COMMUNICATION.  IS IT YOUR INTENT, THEN, THAT ANY WRITTEN

                    COMMUNICATION DOES NOT INCLUDE WRITTEN COMMUNICATIONS INVOLVING

                    LITIGATION?

                                 MS. NIOU:  CORRECT, BECAUSE THE LITIGATION IS

                    BETWEEN THE COURT AND THE BORROWER.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH.  I

                    APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS AND LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU HERE ON THE

                    FLOOR OF THE ASSEMBLY AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE.

                                 MS. NIOU:  SAME.  SAME, SAME, SAME.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  ON THE BILL, MADAM SPEAKER.

                                         47



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  ON THE BILL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUE'S DESIRE

                    TO HAVE A LARGE-PRINT FORMAT ON ROUTINE COMMUNICATIONS FROM DEBT

                    COLLECTORS UPON REQUEST, AND I WOULD SUPPORT THAT IF THIS LEGISLATION WAS

                    CLEAR THAT IT DID NOT APPLY TO COMMUNICATIONS RELATED TO LITIGATION.  AS A

                    PRACTICING ATTORNEY I CAN TELL YOU THAT SOMETIMES THAT COMMUNICATION,

                    WHICH IS SENT DIRECTLY BY THE PLAINTIFF - IN THIS CASE THE DEBT COLLECTOR -

                    TO THE DEFENDANT CAN BE QUITE VOLUMINOUS.  AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE AN

                    EXPRESS EXCLUSION, YOU MIGHT HAVE A UNIQUE SITUATION WHERE A PERSON

                    WHO IS OWED MONEY WHO BRINGS A LAWSUIT USING STANDARD 12-POINT FONT

                    COULD BE FACING A FINE OR A PENALTY.  AND IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WHEN WE

                    DO LEGISLATION THAT IF WE DON'T WANT IT TO APPLY TO COURT DOCUMENTS THAT

                    WE EXPRESSLY STATE IT DOESN'T APPLY TO COURT DOCUMENTS.  AND THAT'S

                    ESPECIALLY IMPORTANT IN THIS AREA BECAUSE TYPICALLY, THE SUMMONS AND

                    THE COMPLAINT WILL ATTACH TO IT MULTIPLE DOCUMENTS.  AND THE COST AND

                    DIFFICULTY OF CONVERTING ALL OF THE ATTACHMENTS TO 16-POINT FONT CAN BE

                    SUBSTANTIAL.

                                 SO I APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUE'S DESIRE.  I CERTAINLY

                    WOULD SUPPORT LEGISLATION REQUIRING THAT IT BE AT LEAST 12-POINT, AND I'D

                    BE MUCH MORE SUPPORTIVE OF LEGISLATION IF IT EXCLUDED COURT DOCUMENTS

                    AND GAVE DEBT COLLECTORS AN OPPORTUNITY TO CORRECT AN HONEST MISTAKE IF

                    THEY MISSED THAT REQUEST.

                                 THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MADAM SPEAKER, AND AGAIN,

                    THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  READ THE LAST

                                         48



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 30TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES -- ON CALENDAR NO. 35.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.

                    ANY MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  MADAM SPEAKER, THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING NO ON THIS BILL.  IF THERE ARE REPUBLICANS

                    WHO WOULD LIKE TO VOTE YES, PLEASE CONTACT THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE

                    IMMEDIATELY.  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MADAM SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  THANK YOU.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MADAM SPEAKER, THE

                    MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS PIECE OF

                    LEGISLATION.  THOSE DESIRING TO VOTE NEGATIVE SHOULD CONTACT THE OFFICES

                    AND WE WILL MAKE SURE YOUR VOTE IS PROPERLY RECORDED.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  THANK YOU, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

                    PLEASE RECORD THE FOLLOWING REPUBLICANS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS

                                         49



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    PARTICULAR BILL:  MR. BARCLAY, MR. GIGLIO, MR. MONTESANO, MR.

                    MORINELLO, MR. PALUMBO, MR. SCHMITT, MR. SMULLEN, MR. NORRIS, MR.

                    REILLY AND MR. BYRNE AND MR. BLANKENBUSH.  ALSO, MR. GARBARINO.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR -- THANK YOU, MADAM.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  THANK YOU.  SO

                    NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A01526-B, CALENDAR

                    NO. 77, GOTTFRIED, DINOWITZ, COLTON, CAHILL, WEPRIN, D'URSO.  AN ACT

                    TO AMEND THE UNIFORM CITY COURT ACT, THE UNIFORM DISTRICT COURT ACT,

                    THE UNIFORM JUSTICE COURT ACT AND THE NEW YORK CITY CIVIL COURT

                    ACT, IN RELATION TO OBTAINING JURISDICTION OVER CERTAIN DEFENDANTS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SPEAKER.

                                 ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER WOERNER:  ON THE BILL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AS YOU KNOW, WE HAVE DIFFERENT

                    COURTS FOR DIFFERENT REASONS, AND ONE OF THE COURTS WE HAVE IS THE SMALL

                    CLAIMS COURT.  AND BY ITS VERY DEFINITION, IT'S ONLY FOR SMALL CLAIMS,

                    THE PROCESS IS EXPEDITED AND THE RULES OF EVIDENCE DON'T APPLY.  THE

                    PLEADING RULES DON'T APPLY, AND THE JURISDICTION IS VERY LIMITED.  AND

                    THE SMALL CLAIMS COURT WAS ALL DESIGNED TO BE AS CONVENIENT, FAST AND

                    EASY AS POSSIBLE FOR BOTH THE PLAINTIFF AND THE DEFENDANT, AND THAT'S WHY

                                         50



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    IT HAS LIMITED JURISDICTION.  AND ONE OF THOSE LIMITATIONS ON JURISDICTION

                    IS THAT A SMALL CLAIMS COURT WILL ONLY HEAR A CLAIM AGAINST A DEFENDANT

                    IF THE DEFENDANT RESIDES WITHIN THE JURISDICTION OF THE COURT, OR HAS A

                    PLACE OF BUSINESS OR REGULARLY CONDUCTS BUSINESS WITHIN THAT

                    JURISDICTION.

                                 NOW, IF SOMEBODY WANTS TO BRING A LAWSUIT AGAINST A

                    DEFENDANT WHO DOESN'T LIVE IN THAT IMMEDIATE JURISDICTION, THEN THEY

                    CAN BRING THE ACTION IN SUPREME COURT THAT HAS MUCH BROADER

                    JURISDICTIONAL REACH.  THIS BILL CHANGES THOSE JURISDICTIONAL PROVISIONS

                    IN JUST ONE GROUP OF PLAINTIFFS.  AND IT SAYS IF IT'S A TENANT THAT WANTS TO

                    BRING A SMALL CLAIMS ACTION AGAINST A LANDLORD, THEY CAN BRING IT WHERE

                    THE APARTMENT EXISTS EVEN IF THE LANDLORD DOESN'T OTHERWISE MEET ANY OF

                    THE JURISDICTIONAL REQUIREMENTS FOR AN ACTION AGAINST THE LANDLORD,

                    MEANING YOU DON'T HAVE TO BRING THE SMALL CLAIMS ACTION WHERE THE

                    LANDLORD LIVES OR WHERE HE DOES BUSINESS, YOU CAN BRING IT ANYWHERE

                    THE APARTMENT IS.  AND THAT CREATES A REAL PROBLEM IF YOU HAVE LANDLORDS

                    THAT HAVE A SECOND HOUSE, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT'S QUITE A WAYS AWAY.  AND

                    IN MY COUNTY, WE HAVE A LOT OF SUMMER RESIDENCES AND THE LANDLORD

                    MIGHT LIVE IN FLORIDA, FOR EXAMPLE, DURING THE WINTER AND RENT THE

                    HOUSE DURING THE WINTER TO SOMEBODY WHO IS IN MY JURISDICTION 1,700

                    MILES AWAY.  AND SO, TO SAY THAT THAT PARTICULAR LANDLORD WOULD BE

                    SUBJECT TO LONG-ARM JURISDICTION IN A SMALL CLAIMS COURT REALLY

                    CHANGES THE RULE AND NATURE OF THAT JURISDICTION.

                                 AND SO, FOR THOSE REASONS, I AND MANY OF MY

                    COLLEAGUES WILL LIKELY VOTE NO ON THIS.  I KNOW THE LAST TIME THIS CAME

                                         51



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    UP FOR A VOTE, WE HAD CONSIDERABLE OPPOSITION, PRIMARILY BECAUSE IT'S

                    FUNDAMENTALLY UNFAIR TO CHANGE IT; WE HAD 33 NO VOTES THE LAST TIME THIS

                    CAME UP FOR A VOTE.  AND I WILL BE OPPOSING IT AND WOULD RECOMMEND

                    MY COLLEAGUES VOTE NO AS WELL.  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT SEPTEMBER

                    1ST.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 77.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE, ALTHOUGH IF THERE ARE ANY

                    MEMBERS OF THE REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE THAT WOULD LIKE TO VOTE IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE, PLEASE CALL THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND LET THEM

                    KNOW RIGHT AWAY SO THEY CAN PROPERLY RECORD YOU.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SIR, SO NOTED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THE MAJORITY WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THOSE

                    MEMBERS DESIRING TO VOTE NEGATIVE SHOULD CONTACT THEIR RESPECTIVE

                                         52



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    OFFICES, PARTICULARLY THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE, AND LET US KNOW THAT.

                    WE WILL MAKE SURE THAT YOUR VOTE IS PROPERLY CAST.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    YOU PLEASE RECORD MR. LAWRENCE AND MR. MORINELLO IN THE AFFIRMATIVE

                    ON THIS?  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02176-A, CALENDAR

                    NO. 93, SOLAGES, CRESPO, PICHARDO, LENTOL, PEOPLES-STOKES, BICHOTTE,

                    NIOU, BARRON, DAVILA, DE LA ROSA, DICKENS, EPSTEIN, FERNANDEZ,

                    HEVESI, HYNDMAN, JAFFEE, JEAN-PIERRE, MOSLEY, O'DONNELL, PRETLOW,

                    RAMOS, ROZIC, SEAWRIGHT, WEPRIN, WILLIAMS, WRIGHT, LAVINE, KIM,

                    GOTTFRIED, D'URSO, PERRY, JOYNER, ORTIZ, FAHY, SIMON, BUCHWALD,

                    LIFTON, ARROYO, GLICK, L. ROSENTHAL, TAYLOR, CAHILL, COOK, RIVERA,

                    OTIS, PAULIN, SIMOTAS, CRUZ, CARROLL, LUPARDO, DENDEKKER, STIRPE,

                    RICHARDSON, JACOBSON, BUTTENSCHON, QUART, ZEBROWSKI, COLTON, GALEF,

                    FALL, DINOWITZ, SAYEGH, BRONSON, DARLING, BLAKE, REYES, VANEL,

                    WALKER, NOLAN, AUBRY, BARRETT, THIELE, STECK, D. ROSENTHAL,

                    RODRIGUEZ, WALLACE, RYAN, MCMAHON, ABINANTI.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    CIVIL RIGHTS LAW AND THE JUDICIARY LAW, IN RELATION TO PROTECTING

                    CERTAIN INTERESTED PARTIES OR PEOPLE FROM CIVIL ARREST WHILE GOING TO,

                                         53



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    REMAINING AT, OR RETURNING FROM THE PLACE OF SUCH COURT PROCEEDING.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MS. SOLAGES.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES, MR. SPEAKER.  ACCESS TO OUR

                    COURT SYSTEM IS VITAL FOR ALL PERSONS IN NEW YORK STATE.  THIS BILL

                    WOULD HELP ASSURE ACCESS TO IMPORTANT COURT PROCEEDINGS.  THE BILL

                    WOULD PROVIDE INDIVIDUALS FROM WARRANTLESS CIVIL ARREST WHILE GOING TO,

                    REMAINING AT AND RETURNING FROM A COURT PROCEEDING WHERE SUCH PERSON

                    IS A PARTY OR POTENTIAL WITNESS, OR A FAMILY MEMBER OR A HOUSEHOLD

                    MEMBER OF A PARTY OR POTENTIAL WITNESS.  HOWEVER, SUCH AN ARREST

                    SHOULD BE PERMISSIBLE IF IT -- IF IT IS SUPPORTED BY A JUDICIAL WARRANT OR

                    JUDICIAL ORDER AUTHORIZING SUCH ARREST.

                                 THIS BILL REFLECTS A LONG-STANDING PROTECTION IN THE

                    CIVIL RIGHTS LAW AGAINST CIVIL ARREST FOR INDIVIDUALS GOING TO,

                    REMAINING AT AND RETURNING FROM COURT FOR CERTAIN PURPOSES, INCLUDING

                    SERVING AS A WITNESS.  THE BILL, WHICH HAS GATHERED STRONG SUPPORT FROM

                    BOTH IMMIGRATION REFORM ADVOCATES AND THE COMMUNITY OF LEGAL

                    PRACTITIONERS, WILL HELP PROMOTE THE INTEGRITY OF OUR COURT SYSTEM IN

                    NEW YORK STATE, AND UPHOLD ALL PERSONS' RIGHT TO ACCESS THE COURT

                    SYSTEM.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. WALSH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WILL THE

                    SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  WILL YOU YIELD --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES, MR. SPEAKER.

                                         54



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. SOLAGES, WILL

                    YOU YIELD?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. SOLAGES YIELDS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MS. SOLAGES.  SO, I JUST

                    HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS, AND I THINK WHAT I REALLY WANT TO GET TO IS

                    THE BREADTH OF INDIVIDUALS WHO COULD BE COVERED BY THIS PIECE OF

                    LEGISLATION.  SO, UNDER OUR CURRENT LAW, WE ALREADY PROTECT THE -- THE

                    WITNESS GOING -- GOING TO COURT, DO WE NOT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO THIS -- THIS EXPANSION, THEN,

                    UNDER THIS BILL, PROTECTS A FAMILY MEMBER, AND IT DOESN'T DEFINE "FAMILY

                    MEMBERS", SO I DON'T KNOW HOW FAR THAT GOES, IF IT COULD BE A COUSIN,

                    AN AUNT, AN UNCLE, A TWICE-REMOVED -- WE DON'T KNOW HOW -- HOW --

                    HOW WE'RE DEFINING "FAMILY", DO WE?  OR DO YOU HAVE THAT DEFINED

                    SOMEWHERE IN THE BILL?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, YOU KNOW, WE KNOW THE JUDICIAL

                    PROCESS IS QUITE COMPLEX.  YOU KNOW, AT TIMES, INDIVIDUALS RECEIVE A

                    TICKET, OR A WITNESS, AND IT'S SOMETIMES INTIMIDATING TO GO ALONE.  SO WE

                    SHOULD HAVE NO OBJECTION AS TO WHO IS ACCOMPANYING A POTENTIAL

                    WITNESS OR DEFENDANT.  WE SHOULD HAVE -- WE SHOULD ALLOW PEOPLE TO BE

                    ABLE TO BRING WHOMEVER THEY WANT TO COME TO COURT, EITHER IF FOR MORAL

                    SUPPORT OR FOR ADVICE, IT SHOULD BE PERMISSIBLE.  AND SO, WE DON'T

                    SPEAK TO THAT ON THE BILL BECAUSE WE WANT PEOPLE TO BE COMFORTABLE

                    WITH WHOM THEY WANT TO GO TO COURT WITH, BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE

                                         55



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DAY, WE WANT TO ENSURE THAT THE JUDICIAL PROCESS IS HAPPENING HERE IN

                    NEW YORK STATE.  WE WANT PEOPLE TO GO TO COURT.  WE WANT PEOPLE TO

                    BE MODEL CITIZENS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING REALLY IS

                    THAT IN ADDITION TO A FAMILY MEMBER OR A HOUSEHOLD MEMBER, OR A

                    POTENTIAL WITNESS, IT REALLY SHOULD BE ANYBODY WHO IS COMING INTO COURT

                    SHOULD NOT HAVE TO FEAR ARREST.  IS THAT -- IS THAT YOUR POSITION?  THAT'S --

                    THAT'S MORE EVEN THAN WHAT THE BILL SAYS.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO THIS BILL JUST WANTS TO ENSURE THAT

                    THE FEDERAL ENFORCEMENT AGENTS OR OFFICERS HAVE A JUDICIAL WARRANT, THAT

                    THEY ABIDE BY THE FOURTH AMENDMENT, WHICH REQUIRES JUDICIAL

                    WARRANTS, OR A WARRANT -- OR -- SORRY, A NOTICE FROM A -- A JUDICIAL

                    MAGISTRATE.  AND THAT'S ALL WE'RE ASKING FOR.  IT'S VERY SIMPLE.  I THINK

                    OUR FOREFATHERS BELIEVED IN JUDICIAL WARRANTS AND, YOU KNOW, ALL OF OUR

                    -- OUR LEGISLATORS OUT THERE.  SO, THAT'S WHAT THIS SAYS, THAT, YOU KNOW,

                    OFFICERS CAN COME, BUT WE JUST WANT A JUDICIAL WARRANT WHEN THEY'RE

                    TALKING ABOUT GOING INTO THE COURTHOUSES OR ARRESTING SOMEONE GOING TO

                    COURT OR LEAVING COURT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO WHAT ABOUT JUST A SPECTATOR

                    WHO IS NOT A FAMILY MEMBER OR WHO ISN'T A HOUSEHOLD MEMBER?  I

                    MEAN, REALLY, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS REALLY ANYBODY IN THE COURT SYSTEM

                    SHOULD BE IMMUNE, UNLESS THERE IS A JUDICIAL WARRANT, AS YOU SAID.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO -- YEAH.  WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

                    HAVING THIS IN GOOD FAITH AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE PERSON

                    ACCOMPANYING EITHER A WITNESS OR A PERSON GOING TO COURT.  THAT'S WHAT

                                         56



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THE BILL IS SPEAKING TO, AND WE'RE SPEAKING ABOUT GOOD FAITH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO UNDER THE PROCESS THAT'S LAID

                    OUT IN THE BILL, I THINK -- I THINK THERE WERE SOME AMENDMENTS TO THE

                    BILL MADE LAST YEAR, IT LOOKS LIKE.  SO, CAN YOU DESCRIBE IF YOU ARE A

                    REPRESENTATIVE OF A LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCY WHO IS IN THEIR OFFICIAL

                    CAPACITY, THEY ENTER A NEW YORK STATE COURTHOUSE INTENDING TO OBSERVE

                    AN INDIVIDUAL OR TAKE THAT INDIVIDUAL INTO CUSTODY.  WALK US THROUGH THE

                    PROCESS OF WHAT THAT -- THAT INDIVIDUAL WOULD NEED TO DO.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  WE'RE ALLOWING FEDERAL AGENTS TO --

                    TO COME INTO THE COURTHOUSE, IT'S JUST THE ARREST.  YOU KNOW, THERE'S A --

                    A PRIVILEGE OF THE ARREST CLAUSE LAW THAT WE HAVE IN STATUTE, THE CIVIL

                    RIGHTS LAW, SECTION 25, THAT SAYS THAT CIVIL ARRESTS CANNOT HAPPEN.

                    AND SO, YOU KNOW, INDIVIDUALS ARE WELCOME TO OUR COURTHOUSES.  WE

                    WANT TO SEND A LOUD, CLEAR MESSAGE THAT OUR COURTHOUSES ARE OPEN FOR

                    ALL BECAUSE, AS YOU KNOW, LADY JUSTICE IS BLIND.  REGARDLESS OF YOUR

                    RACE, YOUR INCOME, YOUR NATIONALITY OR YOUR IMMIGRATION STATUS, THE

                    COURTS ARE OPEN TO ALL.

                                 MS. WALSH:  RIGHT, AND I WASN'T SUGGESTING THAT THE

                    PERSON COULDN'T ENTER THE COURTHOUSE, I'M SAYING HOW COULD THEY --

                    WHAT'S THE PROCESS FOR THAT INDIVIDUAL, THAT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE LAW

                    ENFORCEMENT AGENCY WHO WANTS TO EFFECTUATE A JUDICIAL WARRANT WHEN

                    THEY ENTER THE COURTROOM; WHAT DO THEY HAVE TO DO?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, ON APRIL 17TH, 2019, THE OFFICE

                    OF COURT ADMINISTRATION ACTUALLY PUT OUT A DIRECTIVE THAT GIVES A -- A

                    RUNDOWN OF ALL THE PROCESS THAT NEED TO BE DONE.  IT'S QUITE A LENGTHY

                                         57



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DOCUMENT, DO YOU WANT ME TO -- TO READ IT TO YOU?

                                 MS. WALSH:  NO, I GUESS WHAT'S SUFFICIENT -- LET ME

                    -- LET ME SEE IF CAN MAYBE JUST QUICKLY SUMMARIZE IT AND MAYBE YOU

                    COULD JUST CONFIRM WHETHER I'VE GOT IT RIGHT.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  AND THE LANGUAGE IS VERBATIM -- IT'S

                    SOMEWHAT VERBATIM, IN THE -- IN THE LANGUAGE OF THE BILL.

                                 MS. WALSH:  I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO READ ANY

                    LARGE SECTION, IT JUST -- IT LOOKS AS THOUGH THE INDIVIDUAL HAS GOT TO,

                    WHEN THEY COME INTO THE COURTHOUSE, THEY HAVE TO PRESENT TO A COURT

                    OFFICER A COPY OF THE JUDICIAL WARRANT; IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  CORRECT.  YES, THEY HAVE TO PRESENT

                    A COPY -- THEY HAVE TO FIRST IDENTIFY THEMSELVES --

                                 MS. WALSH:  YEP.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  -- THEN THEY HAVE TO PRESENT A

                    JUDICIAL WARRANT IF THEY WEREN'T -- SO, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE PROCESS

                    OF THE LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENT JUST COMING IN TO THE COURTHOUSE, OR THE

                    PROCESS OF DOING A CIVIL ARREST?  I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY.

                                 MS. WALSH:  DOING A CIVIL ARREST IS WHERE I WAS

                    GOING WITH THAT.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, ONCE AGAIN, YOU KNOW, THEY

                    HAVE TO IDENTIFY THEMSELVES, THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE THE DOCUMENTATION,

                    AND THEN, YOU KNOW, EVERYONE WORKS TOGETHER TO -- TO FACILITATE THE

                    PROCESS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WELL, ONCE THE COURT OFFICER GETS THE --

                    GETS THE WARRANT, THEN THE COURT OFFICER'S GOT TO PRESENT IT TO THE JUDGE

                                         58



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THERE TO REVIEW IT, AND THEN - OR THE COURT ATTORNEY - TO PROMPTLY REVIEW

                    IT AND DETERMINE, I SUPPOSE -- I GUESS TO SEE IF IT'S VALID --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  CORRECT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  -- IF IT CAN BE EXECUTED, AND THEN IT

                    SAYS THAT ONLY IN EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES MAY AN ARREST BE MADE IN

                    THE COURTROOM ABSENT THE LEAVE OF COURT, AND THAT -- AND YOU CAN'T DO IT

                    WITHOUT A JUDICIAL WARRANT OR JUDICIAL ORDER AUTHORIZING THE ARREST --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, LET ME CLARIFY --

                                 MS. WALSH:  -- DID I SUMMARIZE THAT ALL RIGHT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  PARDON THE INTERRUPTION.  LET ME

                    JUST CLARIFY:  THERE'S "ADMINISTRATIVE WARRANT".  AN ADMINISTRATIVE

                    WARRANT IN IMMIGRATION MATTERS IS AN AGENCY-ISSUED ARREST REQUEST THAT

                    A PERSON TO BE TAKEN INTO CUSTODY FOR ALLEGED VIOLATIONS OF FEDERAL LAW.

                    SO, ADMINISTRATIVE WARRANT IS REQUESTED FROM THE FEDERAL AGENCY,

                    WHEREAS A JUDICIAL WARRANT IS SIGNED BY A JUDGE, WHICH MEANS THAT

                    THERE NEEDS TO BE PROBABLE CAUSE, THAT THERE'S A REASON.  AND SO, WE'RE

                    JUST PREVENTING FEDERAL AGENTS FROM USING AN ADMINISTRATIVE INTEROFFICE

                    DOCUMENT TO TRY TO DO CIVIL ARRESTS -- A CIVIL ARREST IN OUR COURTHOUSES,

                    BECAUSE WE'VE SEEN THAT IT'S -- IT'S PROVED POSITIVE THAT, YOU KNOW, AT

                    TIMES, FEDERAL AGENTS COME INTO THE COURTHOUSES AND DISRUPT THE

                    PROCEEDINGS.  IF THEY DON'T GET WHAT THEY WANT, THEY CAUSE DISRUPTIONS.

                    FOR EXAMPLE, IN YONKERS IN NOVEMBER OF 2019, AN ICE -- EXCUSE ME, A

                    FEDERAL AGENT WASN'T ABLE TO ARREST, AND ACTUALLY KICKED THE DOOR OF THE

                    COURTHOUSE, WHICH HAPPENED TO BE MADE OF GLASS, AND BREAK THE GLASS

                    OF THE COURTHOUSE.  AND THIS IS SOLIDIFIED BY A POLICE REPORT.  SO, YOU

                                         59



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    KNOW, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ENSURING THAT WE HAVE PEACE IN OUR

                    COURTHOUSE, THAT PEOPLE CAN GET THROUGH THE JUDICIAL PROCESS AND SEND A

                    MESSAGE THAT OUR COURTS ARE OPEN FOR ALL.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO -- YES.  AND SO, WE'VE -- WE'VE

                    TALKED ABOUT THE ARREST -- THE SITUATION WHERE THE ARREST IS -- IS BEING

                    EFFECTUATED IN THE COURTHOUSE ITSELF, BUT YOUR BILL ACTUALLY GOES FURTHER

                    THAN THAT.  IT GIVES PROTECTIONS TO THAT FAMILY MEMBER - WE -- WE'VE

                    DECIDED THAT THAT'S NOT REALLY EVEN DEFINED WHAT "FAMILY MEMBER" IS, OR

                    A HOUSEHOLD MEMBER.  THEY CAN'T BE, UNDER YOUR BILL, ARRESTED ON THEIR

                    WAY TO COURT OR WHILE THEY'RE AT COURT, OR WHEN THEY'RE ON THEIR WAY

                    HOME FROM COURT; IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES, IT'S CORRECT.  IT'S ACTUALLY A

                    100-YEAR-OLD LAW, AND I'M TRYING TO FIND THE DOCUMENTATION - JUST GIVE

                    ME ONE MOMENT, PLEASE --

                                 MS. WALSH:  WELL, YOUR BILL ISN'T THAT OLD, THOUGH.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  NO, NO, NO, BUT THE ENGLISH COURTS

                    IN THE LATE 1800'S REPEATEDLY RECOGNIZED A COMMON LAW PRIVILEGE

                    AGAINST CIVIL ARREST FOR ANYONE PRESENTED IN THE COURTHOUSE, OR ON THE

                    GROUNDS OR COMING TO AND FROM COURT.  BUT IT GETS EVEN BETTER:  DURING

                    THE 19TH CENTURY AND EARLY 20TH CENTURY, AMERICAN COURTS, INCLUDING

                    THE NEW YORK STATE COURT, AS WELL AS THE U.S. SUPREME COURT

                    CONFIRMED THAT THIS PRIVILEGE WAS A PART OF THE LAW.  SO, THERE IS

                    ACTUALLY A PRIVILEGE OF -- OF NOT GETTING ARRESTED GOING TO COURT OR

                    LEAVING COURT OR BEING AT COURT.

                                         60



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MS. WALSH:  AND AS WE --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, THIS IS --

                                 MS. WALSH:  I'M SORRY.  AND AS WE DISCUSSED AT THE

                    BEGINNING, WE -- WE DON'T -- WE DON'T CHALLENGE THE EXISTENCE OF THAT.

                    WE KNOW THAT FOR VERY MANY YEARS - I DIDN'T REALIZE IT WAS THAT LONG -

                    BUT FOR VERY MANY YEARS, WE HAVE PROTECTED THE -- THE WITNESS WHO WAS

                    COMING INTO COURT.  BUT -- BUT, AGAIN, THIS -- YOUR BILL BROADENS THE

                    SCOPE OF THE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE PROTECTED --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO --

                                 MS. WALSH:  -- UNDER THAT LONG-STANDING RULE.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  ONLY SUBPOENAED WITNESSES ARE

                    PROTECTED.  BUT, AGAIN, WE ARE TRYING TO PRESERVE OUR JUDICIAL PROCESS.

                    WE WANT EVERYONE, REGARDLESS OF THEIR IMMIGRATION STATUS, TO FEEL

                    COMFORTABLE TO GO TO COURT, YOU KNOW, JUST -- LIKE I SAID BEFORE, JUSTICE

                    IS BLIND.  EVERYONE HAS A RIGHT TO DUE PROCESS.  EVERYONE HAS A RIGHT TO

                    GO TO COURT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  HOW LONG AFTER THE INDIVIDUAL

                    WHO IS THE HOUSEHOLD MEMBER OR A FAMILY MEMBER, HOW LONG AFTER THEY

                    RETURN -- COMING HOME FROM COURT MAY THEY THEN BE ARRESTED?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, YOU KNOW, WE WANT INDIVIDUALS

                    TO BE ABLE TO BE COMFORTABLE TO GO TO COURT.  WOMEN WHO ARE ASSAULTED

                    SHOULD BE ABLE TO GET AN ORDER OF PROTECTION.  WITH COVID-19, WE'RE

                    GOING TO SEE MASS EVICTIONS, AND MANY OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS ARE

                    MIXED-STATUS FAMILIES.  SO, WHAT THAT MEANS IS THAT SOME OF THEM ARE,

                    YOU KNOW, NON-CITIZENS, ASYLUM HOLDERS, UNDOCUMENTED AND OTHERS ARE

                                         61



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ACTUALLY U.S. CITIZENS.  SO, WE WANT TO ENSURE THAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON

                    HAS A RIGHT TO GO TO COURT, AND FEELS COMFORTABLE.  THIS BILL IS SENDING A

                    MESSAGE THAT -- THAT EVERYONE CAN GO TO COURT WITHOUT FEELING THAT

                    THEY'RE GOING TO GET ARRESTED OR DEPORTED, BECAUSE THAT IMPEDES, IT PUTS

                    A CHILLING EFFECT ON OUR COURT SYSTEM.  AND I KNOW THAT IF A WITNESS,

                    MAYBE THEY HAPPEN TO BE A NON-CITIZEN, A WITNESS WANTS TO POINT OUT

                    MY ACCUSER AND TESTIFY, BUT IS AFRAID TO GO TO DO THAT, THAT'S A TRAVESTY

                    ON JUSTICE, AND THAT HURTS THE WHOLE JUDICIAL PROCESS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  VERY GOOD.  SO, MY QUESTION IS, SO

                    YOU'VE GOT A PERSON WHO IS UNDOCUMENTED AND THEY HAVE GONE TO COURT,

                    THEY HAVE BEEN THERE FOR, AS YOU SAID EARLIER, MAYBE MORAL SUPPORT OR

                    THEY'RE SPECTATING OR THEY'RE A MEMBER OF THE FAMILY, OF THE HOUSEHOLD,

                    AND THEN THEY LEAVE THE COURTHOUSE AND THEY GO BACK TO WHEREVER.

                    HOW LONG -- HOW LONG AFTER THAT CAN THEY THEN BE ARRESTED BY LAW

                    ENFORCEMENT?  DOES YOUR BILL SPEAK TO THAT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  IT'S -- THE -- IT'S CLEARLY STATED IN THE

                    LANGUAGE.  IT'S ONLY TO AND FROM.  IT'S VERY SIMPLE.  TO AND FROM IN GOOD

                    FAITH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  BUT WHERE ARE THEY GOING BACK TO,

                    THEIR RESIDENCE, OR THEIR PLACE OF WORK OR...

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  IT'S LEAVING TO AND FROM COURT.  SO,

                    WHEREVER THEY'RE -- WHEREVER THEY'RE COMING FROM AND WHEREVER

                    THEY'RE GOING.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  ALL RIGHT.  WELL, THANK YOU

                    VERY MUCH FOR YOUR ANSWERS TO MY QUESTIONS.

                                         62



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, I TRIED TO -- TRIED TO BRING OUT IN

                    MY QUESTIONING THAT, YOU KNOW, WE -- WE HAVE NO OBJECTION TO THE

                    CONCEPT OF THE WITNESS BEING PROTECTED, AND HAS BEEN FOR MANY, MANY

                    YEARS.  I THINK THE PROBLEM WITH THIS BILL IS THAT IT GREATLY EXPANDS THE

                    SCOPE OF THE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE PROTECTED.  I UNDERSTAND AND GREATLY

                    RESPECT THE SPONSOR'S EXPLAINED RATIONALE FOR THE BILL.  I THINK, THOUGH,

                    THAT DURING OUR CONVERSATION, AND ON DEBATE, IT APPEARED THAT THE BILL

                    WAS EVEN BEING EXPANDED MORE BEYOND THE BILL LANGUAGE ITSELF JUST

                    DURING THE DEBATE TO BE REALLY JUST SOMEBODY WHO IS SPECTATING AT -- AT

                    A COURT PROCEEDING.  AND I DON'T KNOW THAT AN INDIVIDUAL SHOULD BE

                    ENTITLED TO THOSE TYPES OF BROAD PROTECTIONS, GOING TO, STAYING AT AND

                    LEAVING A COURT PROCEEDING SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY ARE A MERE SPECTATOR.

                    SO, FOR THOSE REASONS, I'LL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. SOLAGES, WILL

                    YOU YIELD?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  YES.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH.  FROM YOUR

                    COMMENTS, IT APPEARED THAT YOU'RE PARTICULARLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE

                    SITUATION WHERE A NON-WITNESS, NON-PARTY TO A COURT PROCEEDING, A

                                         63



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD, FOR EXAMPLE, MIGHT BE STOPPED GOING TO OR

                    FROM COURT BY AN IMMIGRATION OFFICIAL, AND TAKEN INTO CUSTODY BECAUSE

                    THEY'RE HERE ILLEGALLY OR THEY'RE LACKING DOCUMENTATION; WAS THAT REALLY

                    ONE OF YOUR MAIN CONCERNS ON THIS BILL?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  I'M SORRY, COULD YOU ELABORATE ON

                    YOUR QUESTION?

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SURE.  WAS -- WAS YOUR MAIN

                    CONCERN ON THIS BILL THAT AN IMMIGRATION OFFICIAL MIGHT EXECUTE A

                    NON-JUDICIAL CIVIL ARREST OF A UNDOCUMENTED OR AN IMMIGRANT WHO IS

                    HERE WITHOUT LEGAL AUTHORIZATION WHILE THAT PERSON IS GOING AS A

                    MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD TO WATCH A COURT PROCEEDING?  WAS THAT

                    REALLY THE THRUST OF YOUR CONCERN?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  MY CONCERN AND, YOU KNOW, WE

                    HAVE COUNTLESS DAS FROM ALBANY, FROM -- FROM NEW YORK CITY, FROM

                    LONG ISLAND, FROM ACROSS THE COUNTRY WHO HAVE EXPRESSED CONCERN,

                    EVEN CHIEF JUDGES, WHO EXPRESSED CONCERN THAT THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO

                    FACILITATE THE JUDICIAL PROCESS.  AND SO, THE JUDICIAL PROCESS ISN'T JUST,

                    YOU KNOW, GOING TO COURT, IT'S ALSO GOING TO THE CLERK'S OFFICE TO HAND IN

                    PAPERWORK, IT'S ANYTHING DEALING WITH -- WITH COURT OPERATIONS.  AND SO

                    MY CONCERN IS THAT THE COURT OPERATIONS WERE BEING IMPEDED BY A

                    THIRD-PARTY, ESPECIALLY A FEDERAL THIRD-PARTY.  AND, YOU KNOW, I -- I

                    DON'T BELIEVE IN STATE VIOLENCE AGAINST US, AND SO, I WANT TO STAND UP

                    AND PUSH BACK AND ENSURE THAT OUR -- OUR JUDICIAL PROCESS IS PROTECTED,

                    OUR STATE JUDICIAL PROCESS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  CERTAINLY, AND I APPRECIATE THAT

                                         64



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DESIRE, BUT THE CONCEPT OF A CIVIL ARREST IS -- IS NOT VERY COMMON.

                    THERE'S ONLY A FEW SITUATIONS WHERE CIVIL ARRESTS OCCUR, RIGHT?  ONE

                    MIGHT BE, FOR EXAMPLE, IN VIOLATION OF A COURT ORDER WHERE YOU HAVE AN

                    ORDER OF CONTEMPT; THAT'S A CIVIL ARREST, RIGHT?  IMMIGRATION OFFICIALS,

                    THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO MAKE A CIVIL ARREST, RIGHT, WITH OR WITHOUT JUDICIAL

                    ORDER.  ARE THERE OTHER EXAMPLES OF CIVIL ARREST?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, I'M JUST GOING TO TAKE A -- A

                    QUOTE FROM THE FEDERAL JUDGE THAT ACTUALLY PUT OUT A -- A -- A DECISION -

                    THANK YOU - A DECISION, AND HE SAID, IMMIGRATION DETENTION HAS ARISEN

                    TO A NEW, INCLUSIVE FORM OF CIVIL ARREST, AND THAT'S STRAIGHT FROM A

                    FEDERAL JUDGE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  BUT THAT -- IN TERMS OF THE CONTEXT,

                    SO WE UNDERSTAND WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- CIVIL ARRESTS ARE TYPICALLY ORDERS

                    OF CONTEMPT --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  AN INDIVIDUAL --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- VIOLATION, MAY BE A VIOLATION OF

                    AN ORDER OF PROTECTION, ALTHOUGH THAT CAN BE CRIMINAL, AS WELL, AND

                    IMMIGRATION.  IS THAT THE THREE?  I MEAN, ARE THERE OTHER CATEGORIES,

                    OTHER TYPES OF CIVIL ARRESTS THAT YOU'RE CONCERNED ABOUT?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, AS -- AS I SAID BEFORE, YOU KNOW,

                    THIS IS A, YOU KNOW, AN OLD STANDING PRIVILEGE AND, YOU KNOW, THIS IS

                    SOMETHING THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN PROTECTED.  WE --- WE DON'T SUPPORT CIVIL

                    ARRESTS IN THE -- IN THE COURTHOUSE.  SO, YOU KNOW -- AND WE HAVE TO BE

                                         65



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CAREFUL ABOUT PAINTING ALL IMMIGRANTS AS CRIMINALS AND PUBLIC SAFETY

                    THREATS, AND IT'S RACIST AND DANGEROUS.  IN A COUNTRY, EVERYONE,

                    INCLUDING IMMIGRANTS, HAVE RIGHTS, INCLUDING THE RIGHT TO ACCESS COURT,

                    TO DEFEND THEMSELVES IN COURT AND TO SEEK LEGAL REPRESENTATION OF THE

                    COURT.  SO, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO NOT LOOK AT THE INDIVIDUAL NUANCES,

                    BUT LOOK AT THE LANGUAGE.  IT'S CIVIL ARREST.  THERE'S A PRIVILEGE FROM CIVIL

                    ARREST THAT'S WITHIN 100 YEARS, OF, YOU KNOW, CIVIL RIGHTS LAW SECTION

                    25, AND I CAN READ IT TO YOU IF YOU'D LIKE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  NO, I'M -- MAYBE YOU CAN HELP ME

                    JUST UNDERSTAND THIS.  LET'S SAY THAT A RELATIVE OF A WITNESS OR A PARTY OF

                    THE COURT IS STOPPED, OR SOMEONE IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD IS STOPPED

                    GOING TO OR FROM COURT, AND THEY'RE STOPPED BY AN IMMIGRATION

                    OFFICER --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- WHO WANTS TO TAKE THEM INTO

                    CUSTODY BECAUSE THEY ARE HERE ILLEGALLY, OR WITHOUT DOCUMENTATION.

                    AND THE PERSON SAYS, WELL, WAIT A MINUTE, UNDER THIS NEW BILL I'M

                    PROTECTED FROM CIVIL ARREST.  WHAT SHOULD THE OFFICER DO?  SHOULD HE

                    JUST TAKE THEIR WORD, OR CAN HE DETAIN THEM TEMPORARILY WHILE TRYING TO

                    VERIFY WHETHER THEY'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO OR FROM A COURT PROCEEDING;

                    HOW WOULD THAT WORK?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, I WOULD -- I WOULD HOPE THAT THE

                    FEDERAL -- YOU KNOW, THERE'S BEEN A DIRECTIVE, THERE'S A FEDERAL

                    DECISION.  ICE OFFICERS ARE VERY FAMILIAR WITH THE PROCESS, OR, YOU

                    KNOW, FEDERAL OFFICERS ARE FAIRLY FAMILIAR WITH THE PROCESS.  SO, YOU

                                         66



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    KNOW, IF SOMEONE SAYS THAT THEY'RE GOING TO COURT, THAT INDIVIDUAL IS

                    PROTECTED.  BUT, THEY CAN GET THEM -- THEY CAN ASCERTAIN THEM IF THEY GET

                    A JUDICIAL WARRANT, AND I WOULD HOPE THAT THEY WOULD WALK AROUND AND

                    OBTAIN A JUDICIAL WARRANT IF THEY -- IF THEY WOULD LIKE TO, YOU KNOW,

                    ARREST SOMEONE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, KEEP IN MIND, UNDER THE

                    CURRENT PROTECTION, THE CURRENT PROTECTION COVERS ANYONE WHO IS A

                    WITNESS OR ANYONE WHO IS A PARTY, AND THAT'S VERY EASY TO DOCUMENT,

                    BECAUSE IF YOU'RE A WITNESS YOU'D HAVE A SUBPOENA, SO, YOU KNOW, IF

                    YOU GOT STOPPED, FOR EXAMPLE, COMING OR GOING, YOU'D PULL OUT A

                    SUBPOENA AND SAY, OFFICER, HERE'S A COPY OF THE SUBPOENA, AS YOU CAN

                    SEE; I'M PROTECTED.  OR, IF YOU'RE A PARTY, OF COURSE YOU CAN BRING OUT A

                    COPY OF THE SUMMONS OR COMPLAINT, OR WHATEVER THE -- THE COURT

                    DOCUMENTATION.  HOW WOULD YOU DOCUMENT --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, I --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- THAT YOU ARE GOING TO OR FROM

                    COURT --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, I --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- WHEN YOU ARE - JUST LET ME FINISH

                    THE QUESTION - WHEN YOU LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD OR YOU'RE A

                    RELATIVE, BUT NOT A PARTY, PARTICULARLY IF YOU ARE NOT TRAVELING WITH THE

                    PARTY.  LET'S SAY YOU'RE GOING TO COURT IN A SEPARATE VEHICLE OR ON THE

                    SUBWAY IN A SEPARATE -- YOU'RE MEETING THEM THERE.  HOW DO THEY

                    ESTABLISH THAT THEY ARE GOING TO OR FROM COURT SO THAT THE IMMIGRATION

                    OFFICER IS NOT ARRESTED, AS THEY COULD BE UNDER YOUR LANGUAGE, RIGHT?

                                         67



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AN IMPROPER STOP WOULD SUBJECT THE IMMIGRATION OFFICER, A FEDERAL

                    OFFICER TO ARREST FOR FALSE IMPRISONMENT, RIGHT?  SO, HOW DO THEY

                    DOCUMENT THAT THIS MEMBER OF THE HOUSEHOLD OR THIS RELATIVE, WHO MAY

                    NOT EVEN BE IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD, FALLS WITHIN THE SCOPE OF THIS

                    STATUTE?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, YOU KNOW, FEDERAL OFFICERS,

                    IMMIGRATION OFFICERS ARE USING OUR COURTHOUSES AS -- AS TRAPS.  SO,

                    THEY'RE PURPOSELY LOOKING AT THE COURT DOCKETS, THEY'RE LOOKING AT

                    NAMES, THEY'RE CROSS-REFERENCING IT WITH THEIR LIST, AND IDENTIFYING WHO

                    ARE -- WHO ARE -- PEOPLE WHO ARE IMMIGRANTS.  SO, THEY'RE USING OUR

                    STATE DATA AND INFORMATION AS A MEANS TO BE ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, ARREST

                    INDIVIDUALS, WHICH ONLY MAKES THE CONSEQUENCES THAT, YOU KNOW, THE

                    CONSEQUENCE BEING IS THAT THAT PERSON IS NOT ABLE TO GO TO COURT, WHICH

                    HURTS OUR JUDICIAL PROCESS.  AND SO, JUST TO EXPLAIN --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  JUST TO BE FAIR, JUST TO BE FAIR -- ALL

                    --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, IF YOU GO TO A CASE-BY-CASE

                    BASIS, IT MAKES IT DIFFICULT, BECAUSE THERE'S DIFFERENT NUANCES, BECAUSE,

                    YOU KNOW, AN INDIVIDUAL CAN HAVE A CONVERSATION.  IT SEEMS LIKE THESE

                    FEDERAL AGENTS ARE FOLLOWING A PERSON IF THEY WERE TO -- YOU KNOW -- IT

                    SEEMS FROM YOUR -- FROM WHAT YOU'RE SAYING FROM YOUR -- FROM YOUR

                    EXAMPLE.  SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S -- IT'S VERY DIFFICULT BECAUSE EVERY

                    SITUATION IS VERY DIFFERENT.  BUT LET ME READ, PLEASE LET ME READ THE CIVIL

                    RIGHTS LAW REALLY QUICK --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, MY --

                                         68



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  -- I'LL READ THE LAST SENTENCE, REALLY:

                    AN ARREST MADE CONTRARY TO THE PROVISION OF THIS SECTION IS ABSOLUTE

                    AND VOIDED AND IS CONTEMPT OF COURT IF ANY FROM WHICH THE -- THE

                    SUBPOENA WAS ISSUED, OR BY WHICH THE WITNESS WAS DIRECTED TO ATTEND.

                    SO -- SO, THAT'S CURRENT LAW.  SO, THAT'S -- THAT'S THE EXACT CURRENT LAW.

                    SO, IT'S ONLY THE PEOPLE WHO ARE SUBPOENAED.  SO, WE'RE NOT PROVIDING

                    PROTECTIONS FOR NEW YORKERS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO MY QUESTION, AGAIN -- I

                    APOLOGIZE - AND I APOLOGIZE FOR ALMOST INTERRUPTING YOU.  MY QUESTION

                    WAS VERY SPECIFIC.  I UNDERSTAND ALL THE THEORY THAT YOU MENTIONED, AND

                    I APPRECIATE THAT.  MY QUESTION IS VERY SPECIFIC:  WHAT DOCUMENTATION

                    WOULD BE SHOWN TO A FEDERAL OFFICIAL TO INDICATE THAT A PERSON WHO

                    DOESN'T EVEN LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD, A, IS RELATED TO SOMEBODY IN

                    THE COURT AND, B, IS ON THEIR WAY TO OR FROM THE COURT.  WHAT

                    DOCUMENTATION IN THE PERSON WHO IS STOPPED WHO IS UNRELATED TO

                    ANYONE IN THE COURTHOUSE, LIVING IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD, OR,

                    ALTERNATIVELY, IS RELATED, BUT DOESN'T EVEN LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSE, WHAT

                    DOCUMENTATION CAN THEY SHOW THE IMMIGRATION OFFICIAL SO THAT THE

                    IMMIGRATION OFFICIAL DOESN'T RUN THE RISK OF BEING ARRESTED FOR FALSE

                    IMPRISONMENT?  WHAT DOCUMENTATION - THAT'S THE QUESTION - WHAT

                    DOCUMENTATION WILL THEY HAVE?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, YOU CAN HAVE A TICKET, YOU

                    KNOW, COURT DOCUMENTATION.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, THAT WOULD BE AVAILABLE TO

                    THE WITNESS OR A PARTY.  I'M TALKING ABOUT A NON-WITNESS, NON-PARTY OR

                                         69



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    RELATIVE WHO LIVES IN SOME OTHER HOUSE.  WHAT DOCUMENTATION WOULD

                    THEY HAVE WITH THEM, OR COULD HAVE WITH THEM, TO DOCUMENT THAT

                    THEY'RE COMING TO BE A SPECTATOR AT SOME OTHER COURT ACTION?

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, SIMPLY, IF THE -- IF THE INDIVIDUAL

                    SAYS, I AM WITH SO-AND-SO PERSON, YOU KNOW, THAT PERSON ALSO PRODUCES

                    SOME DOCUMENTATION --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AND IF THEY'RE TRAVELING

                    SEPARATELY -- IF THEY'RE TRAVELING SEPARATELY TO THE COURT, WHAT --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SEE --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- WHAT DOCUMENTATION --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  NOW -- NOW YOU'RE BRINGING

                    NUANCES.  WHAT IF THE PERSON'S JUMPING DOWN FROM A PARACHUTE, LIKE,

                    YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T PROVIDE THESE EXAMPLES.  I TRUST FEDERAL AGENTS TO

                    BE ABLE TO ASCERTAIN AND BE ABLE TO COMMUNICATE AND BE ABLE TO HAVE --

                    TO MAKE AN ARREST AND MAKE A SOLID, LAWFUL ARREST.  AND IF THEY'RE TRYING

                    TO WIGGLE THROUGH LOOPHOLES AND SUCH, IT JUST REALLY IS -- IS A

                    DEFAMATION ON JUSTICE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, AND I

                    APPRECIATE --

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  SO, I WAS JUST GOING TO --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  OH, I'M SORRY, I DIDN'T MEAN TO

                    INTERRUPT YOU.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  I'M SO PASSIONATE, SO I JUST --

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YES, INDEED.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, IN THE

                                         70



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DIRECTIVE, SO IN JANUARY OF 2017, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DID AN

                    EXECUTIVE ORDER AND ALSO THERE WAS AN IMPENDING MEMO DONE AND

                    CIRCULATED AMONGST FEDERAL OFFICIALS SAYING THAT THE ARRESTS HAVE TO BE

                    LAWFUL.  AND LAWFUL MEANS AND ENSURE THAT FAITHFUL EXECUTION OF THE

                    IMMIGRATION LAWS OF THE UNITED STATES ARE -- ARE DONE IN SUCH A WAY.

                    SO, YOU KNOW, EVEN WITHIN DOCUMENTATION, THEY WANT TO EMPLOY ALL

                    LAWFUL MEANS.  AND SO, I WOULD HOPE THAT THESE LAW ENFORCEMENT

                    AGENTS ARE, YOU KNOW, DOTTING THEIR I'S AND CROSSING THEIR T'S AND NOT

                    GOING WITH HYPOTHETICALS OR MAYBE.  YOU KNOW, THESE INDIVIDUALS

                    KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING.  BY IDENTIFYING AND GOING THROUGH OUR COURT

                    DOCKETS AND WAITING FOR INDIVIDUALS COMING TO AND FROM COURT, THEY

                    KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THEY'RE DOING.  AND SO, ALL THAT WE'RE SAYING IS THAT

                    WE NEED TO PROTECT OUR COURT SYSTEM.  WE NEED TO PROTECT ALL NEW

                    YORKERS REGARDLESS OF THEIR IMMIGRATION STATUS AND ALLOW THEM TO GO TO

                    COURT.  THEY SHOULD NOT BE USING OUR COURTHOUSES AS TRAPS -- AS TRAP

                    HOUSES.  THANK YOU.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, AND I

                    APPRECIATE YOUR PASSION AND I APPRECIATE YOUR ANSWERS, AS WELL.

                                 ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AS MY COLLEAGUE NOTED, FOR WELL

                    OVER 100 YEARS, NEW YORK, ALONG WITH MOST OF THE NATION, HAS

                    RECOGNIZED THAT A WITNESS OR A PARTY TO A LAWSUIT IS IMMUNE FROM CIVIL

                    ARREST WHILE TRAVELING TO OR FROM THE COURT; THAT'S THE CURRENT LAW.  IF

                                         71



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    YOU'RE A PARTY OR IF YOU'RE A WITNESS, YOU'RE EXEMPT FROM CIVIL ARREST.

                    WHAT THIS BILL SAYS IS IF YOU'RE A SPECTATOR, NOT A PARTY, NOT A WITNESS,

                    BUT A SPECTATOR THAT'S RELATED OR MIGHT EVEN LIVE IN THE SAME HOUSEHOLD,

                    IF YOU'RE A SPECTATOR, THEN YOU ARE ALSO PROTECTED.  AND IT TURNS AROUND

                    AND IT SAYS IF YOU ARE A FEDERAL IMMIGRATION OFFICIAL AND YOU STOP AND

                    EXECUTE A CIVIL ARREST ON ONE OF THESE SPECTATORS, YOU COULD BE ARRESTED

                    FOR FALSE IMPRISONMENT OR BE FACING A FINE.

                                 AND SO, HERE WE HAVE A LAW THAT SUBJECTS FEDERAL LAW

                    ENFORCEMENT OFFICIALS WHO ARE CARRYING OUT FEDERAL LAW TO BEING

                    ARRESTED IN NEW YORK STATE IF THEY ARREST A SPECTATOR WHO CLAIMS THEY

                    ARE COMING OR GOING TO WATCH SOME LEGAL PROCEEDING INVOLVING A

                    MEMBER OF THEIR HOUSEHOLD OR A RELATIVE.  KEEP IN MIND THAT WE ARE

                    CREATING AN IMPOSSIBLE SITUATION FOR THOSE FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT

                    OFFICIALS TO VERIFY THAT THE PERSON IS ACTUALLY GOING TO OR COMING FROM A

                    COURT PROCEEDING, BECAUSE UNLIKE A PARTY OR UNLIKE A WITNESS, THERE'S NO

                    SUBPOENA TO THE -- TO THIS SPECTATOR; THEY ARE NOT NAMED IN THE

                    PROCEEDING AND THEY WOULD HAVE NO DOCUMENTATION.

                                 THE CURRENT LAW STRIKES THE RIGHT BALANCE.  THE CURRENT

                    LAW SAYS IF YOU ARE A PARTY OR YOU ARE A WITNESS, YOU ARE EXEMPT FROM

                    CIVIL ARREST.  THIS LAW SAYS WE ARE NOW MAKING SPECTATORS EXEMPT FROM

                    CIVIL ARREST IF THEY HAPPEN TO BE RELATED TO ANYONE IN THE COURT OR LIVE IN

                    THE SAME HOUSEHOLD.  THAT GOES TOO FAR AND IT MAKES FEDERAL LAW

                    ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS SUBJECT TO CRIMINAL PROSECUTION FOR CARRYING OUT

                    THEIR DUTIES TO ENFORCE FEDERAL LAW.  THAT'S AN INAPPROPRIATE CHANGE IN

                    THE WAY WE DEAL BETWEEN THOSE WHO ARE HERE ILLEGALLY AND THOSE WHO

                                         72



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ARE (UNINTELLIGIBLE/BUZZER SOUNDING).  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  I RISE TO JUST THANK THE SPONSOR FOR THIS LEGISLATION.  THIS IS A

                    -- A REALLY DIFFICULT THING TO DO WHEN THERE IS SO MANY WITHIN OUR HOUSE

                    AND WITHIN OUR SOCIETY WHO DON'T THINK THAT PEOPLE WHO YET -- DON'T YET

                    HAVE THEIR AMERICAN CITIZENSHIP SHOULD HAVE THE SAME PROTECTIONS AS

                    EVERYONE ELSE.  I CAME FROM A FAMILY THAT WASN'T NECESSARILY

                    IMMIGRATING TO AMERICA, BUT WAS FORCED HERE.  I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE

                    ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO COME TO AMERICA BY THEIR OWN WILL, AND

                    SOMETIMES WE REALLY DO NEED TO HAVE THAT PERSON THAT CAN HELP YOU

                    UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON DURING THE COURT PROCEEDINGS THAT YOU HAVE

                    TO GO THROUGH.  THEY WILL HAVE THE SAME EXPERIENCE YOU'VE HAD, THAT

                    HAS A LEVEL OF EMPATHY FOR YOU, THAT CAN HELP YOU SPEAK AND UNDERSTAND

                    THE LANGUAGE.  MOST AMERICANS SPEAK ONE LANGUAGE, BUT MOST PEOPLE

                    WHO COME AS IMMIGRANTS SPEAK MORE THAN ONE LANGUAGE.  ALL OF OUR

                    COURT SYSTEMS ARE NOT NECESSARILY AT A PLACE WHERE THEY CAN ARTICULATE

                    AND/OR HANDLE.  AND SO, WHAT IS WRONG WITH HAVING -- BRINGING

                    SOMEONE WITH YOU WHO CAN SUPPORT YOU DURING THE PROCESS AND THEN

                    THEM NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT BEING ARRESTED ON THEIR WAY HOME.

                                 NOW, IF SOMEBODY HAS DONE SOMETHING THAT THEY NEED

                    TO BE, YOU KNOW, PICKED UP OR PROSECUTED FOR IN THE FUTURE, THAT'S NOT

                    WHAT THIS BILL IS TALKING ABOUT.  THIS BILL IS TALKING ABOUT GOING TO AND

                    FROM A PROCESS THAT HAPPENS WITHIN OUR JUDICIAL COURT SYSTEMS.  SO,

                    AGAIN, I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR AND I HOPE THAT COLLEAGUES WILL

                                         73



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    HAVE AN OPEN MIND WHEN MAKING THEIR DECISION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT

                    THIS -- THIS LEGISLATION MOVES FORWARD.  I, FOR ONE, HOPE THAT IT DOES.  IT'S

                    IMPORTANT WORK AND IT'S WORK THAT NEEDS TO BE DONE, PARTICULARLY IN

                    2020.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. BARRON.

                                 MR. BARRON:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SPEAKER.

                    THIS IS ALWAYS VERY INTERESTING TO ME, HOW WE JUST FORGET HISTORY.  THE

                    PEOPLE WHO ARE COMING HERE NOW, WHETHER THEY ARE FROM MEXICO OR

                    FROM THE CARIBBEAN, OR FROM AFRICA, THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE OF THIS LAND

                    WERE AFRICAN AND SO-CALLED "INDIANS" AND, AS A MATTER OF FACT, IF YOU

                    MIGHT REMEMBER, TEXAS SECEDED FROM MEXICO AND BECAME A COUNTRY

                    OF ITS OWN FIRST, THEN THEY JOINED THE UNITED STATES, SO YOU DONE RIPPED

                    OFF A PART OF MEXICO AND MADE TEXAS A STATE.  TALK ABOUT A SPECTATOR,

                    MY COLLEAGUE, YOU LIVE IN A BUBBLE.  YOU ARE THE SPECTATOR.  YOU CAME

                    HERE FROM OTHER PLACES AND TOOK LAND FROM PEOPLE, YOUR ANCESTORS DID

                    THIS.  SO, WHO IS THE REAL SPECTATOR?

                                 I THINK THIS BILL IS GOOD.  IMMIGRANTS CONTRIBUTE

                    BILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO THIS ECONOMY, SO-CALLED "IMMIGRANTS"; SOME EVEN

                    FIGHT IN WARS.  BUT, YET, THE ONLY THING THIS BILL IS SAYING, YOU CAN'T USE

                    THE COURTS TO ENTRAP IMMIGRANTS.  YOU CAN'T DO THAT, WHETHER THEY'RE

                    SPECTATORS IN THE COURTROOM OR NOT.  ICE, UNDER THE OBAMA

                    ADMINISTRATION, DEPORTED MILLIONS AND THEY CONTINUE TO DO THAT.  THEY

                    TERRORIZE IMMIGRANTS.  THEY'RE RACIST, AND THEY SHOULD BE DISMANTLED.

                    BUT THIS BILL IS SIMPLY SAYING, NO, YOU CANNOT ENTRAP IMMIGRANTS IN THE

                    COURT SYSTEM.  YOU CAN'T HANG AROUND THE COURT SYSTEM PREYING ON

                                         74



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THEM - P-R-E-Y, NOT P-R-A-Y - PREYING ON THEM, SO YOU CAN, WHAT,

                    MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN?  KEEP AMERICA AS WHITE AS POSSIBLE?

                    AVOID THE BROWNING OF AMERICA?

                                 THIS IS A GOOD BILL.  THIS IS A SIMPLE BILL.  THIS IS A BILL

                    THAT AIN'T CALLING FOR NO REVOLUTION, IT'S JUST CALLING FOR PROTECTION OF

                    IMMIGRANTS WHEN THEY HAVE TO GO TO COURT.  AND, YES, EVEN IF THEY'RE

                    SPECTATORS TO SUPPORT A FAMILY MEMBER.  GOOD BILL, SPONSOR.  WE

                    SHOULD SUPPORT THIS.  THIS IS A NO-BRAINER.  IT'S SIMPLE.  AND IT'S

                    INTERESTING, WHEN YOU GOTTA FIGHT FOR SUCH SIMPLE, NO-BRAINER BILLS.

                    YOU WOULD THINK PEOPLE LIVE IN SOME BUBBLE, THAT THEY DON'T KNOW

                    WHAT'S GOING ON OUTSIDE OF THEIR LITTLE BUBBLE.  BUT, WE NEED TO GET HIP

                    TO REALITY.  AMERICA IS CHANGING, AND THERE'S NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT

                    IT.  NO KIND OF SUPPRESSIVE LAWS, NO KIND OF AGENCY LIKE ICE IS GOING

                    TO STOP THE BROWNING OF AMERICA.

                                 SO, I SAY THAT WE SHOULD APPRECIATE IMMIGRANTS.  THEY

                    CONTRIBUTE TO THE CULTURAL RICHNESS OF THIS COUNTRY, TO THE INTELLECTUAL

                    CAPACITY OF THIS COUNTRY.  THEY CONTRIBUTE TO HARD-WORKING LABOR IN THIS

                    COUNTRY, AND THIS BILL MERELY SAYS IF THEY HAVE TO GO TO COURT, LET THEIR

                    FAMILY COME AND SIT AND BE SUPPORTIVE OF THEM WITHOUT BEING IN SOME

                    TRAP SET UP BY THE RACIST ICE THAT NEEDS TO BE DISMANTLED.  WHEN THE

                    EUROPEAN IMMIGRANTS CAME, IRISH, POLISH, JEWISH, GERMANS, ITALIANS,

                    YES, THEY WERE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST, BECAUSE THE WHITE ANGLO-SAXON

                    PROTESTANTS FROM ENGLAND DID THAT.  BUT THEY DIDN'T GET TREATED LIKE THIS.

                    WHEN THE COLOR OF IMMIGRATION CHANGED, DON'T EVEN WANT THEIR FAMILIES

                    TO GO TO COURT WITH THEM, ABSURD.  I APPLAUD THE SPONSOR.  GREAT BILL.

                                         75



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LET'S DO THE RIGHT THING, ASSEMBLY, AND PASS THIS BILL.  I VOTE IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. CRUZ.

                                 MS. CRUZ:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

                                 MS. CRUZ:  SO, I HAVE A COUPLE OF RHETORIC

                    QUESTIONS.  I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHO THESE SPECTATORS THAT ARE GOING TO

                    COURT JUST FOR FUN ARE, BECAUSE AS A FORMER LEGAL SERVICES ATTORNEY, I

                    CAN TELL YOU THAT THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLINGLY GOING TO COURT ARE

                    FAMILY MEMBERS ACCOMPANYING THE FOLKS WHO HAVE TO GO TO COURT, THE

                    FOLKS WHO HAVE TO GO TO COURT, AND US, THE LAWYERS, AND THE WITNESSES.

                    AND THE IDEA THAT THERE COULD BE ACCEPTANCE TO SPECTATOR ARREST ALMOST

                    STRIKES ME AS THE IDEA THAT IT WOULD BE OKAY TO CONDUCT RACIAL PROFILING,

                    BECAUSE HOW WOULD ICE KNOW THAT A SPECTATOR IS SOMEONE WHO SHOULD

                    BE ARRESTED?

                                 AND THEN THAT GETS US INTO THE QUESTION OF ICE

                    WARRANTS ARE CIVIL IN NATURE.  ICE WARRANTS ARE NOT AUTHORIZING CRIMINAL

                    ARREST.  AND THE PROMISE THAT THIS COUNTRY GAVE US WHEN MANY OF US

                    CAME -- HAVE COME WHO COME FROM OTHER COUNTRIES AND THOSE OF US

                    WHO CAME UNDOCUMENTED AND FLEEING WHAT ARE BASICALLY LAWLESS

                    COUNTRIES AND OTHER PLACES, IS THAT HERE IN THE UNITED STATES WE HAVE A

                    CONSTITUTION, AND THAT CONSTITUTION PROTECTS US REGARDLESS OF THE COLOR

                    OF OUR SKIN OR THE STATUS THAT WE HAVE.  AND THAT THAT CONSTITUTION

                    DOESN'T SIMPLY STOP BECAUSE OF HOW WE LOOK OR BECAUSE OF STATE -- I'M

                                         76



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SORRY, A FEDERAL AGENCY WANTS TO STEP INTO A COURTROOM AND, AS MR.

                    BARRON SAID, ENTRAP US.

                                 AND SO, I WANT TO THANK THE SPONSOR OF THIS LEGISLATION

                    BECAUSE IT IS A LONG TIME COMING.  HOW DO YOU PROMISE A WITNESS, HOW

                    DO YOU PROMISE A HUMAN TRAFFICKING VICTIM - AND I MENTION A HUMAN

                    TRAFFICKING VICTIM BECAUSE BACK IN JUNE 16TH OF 2017, ICE ATTEMPTED

                    THE ARREST OF A HUMAN TRAFFICKING SURVIVOR, AT HUMAN TRAFFICKING COURT

                    IN QUEENS.  HOW DO YOU PROMISE ANY OF THESE FOLKS THAT WHEN THEY

                    STEP INTO COURT, THEY'LL HAVE THEIR DAY IN COURT, THAT THEY'LL BE PROTECTED,

                    THAT THE PROMISE OF THIS NATION TO KEEP THEM SAFE WILL REMAIN SO WHEN

                    THEY STEP INTO THE ONE PLACE THAT IT SHOULD ABSOLUTELY BE CLEAR EXISTS.

                                 IT DOESN'T HAPPEN RIGHT NOW, AND UNLESS WE PASS THIS

                    BILL WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO SEE THE BEHAVIOR OF ICE GET WORSE, THE

                    BEHAVIOR OF FEDERAL AGENCIES GET WORSE, BECAUSE IF YOU HAVE BEEN

                    PAYING ATTENTION TO THE NEWS, YOU SAW WHAT HAPPENED IN PORTLAND.

                    AND IT IS ABOUT TO START HAPPENING IN NEW YORK.  AND WE NEED TO MAKE

                    SURE THAT WE PROTECT VICTIMS, THAT WE PROTECT WITNESSES, THAT WE PROTECT

                    LAWYERS AND THAT WE PROTECT THE FAMILY MEMBERS WHO ARE SIMPLY

                    LOOKING TO GIVE SOME SUPPORT TO THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN COURT SEEKING

                    JUSTICE, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT OUR COURTS HAVE PROMISED US.

                                 AND SO, THE IDEA THAT WE WOULD EVEN HAVE TO ASK FOR A

                    BILL THAT BASICALLY SAYS WHAT A JUDGE HAS ALREADY DECIDED SHOULD BE THE

                    LAW OF THE LAND, IS, QUITE FRANKLY, INSANE.  I'M GOING TO BE VOTING IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE AND I'M ASKING MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME BECAUSE WE

                    GOT ELECTED TO PROTECT THE CONSTITUTION OF THIS COUNTRY AND OUR STATE,

                                         77



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AND WE HAVE A ROGUE FEDERAL AGENCY, A ROGUE ADMINISTRATION TRYING TO

                    FIND EVERY AND WHICH WAY TO KEEP OUR PEOPLE DOWN, TO ARREST THEM, TO

                    DEPORT THEM, TO TAKE THEM AWAY FROM THE ONLY FAMILIES AND THE ONLY

                    COUNTRY THEY HAVE KNOWN.

                                 AND SO, I WANT TO REITERATE A COUPLE OF THINGS BEFORE I

                    END.  ICE DOES NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO CONDUCT CRIMINAL ARRESTS.  THAT IS

                    WHY WE'RE ASKING THAT THEY GO AND GET AN ORDER FROM A JUDGE.  THE

                    CONSTITUTION PROTECTS US NO MATTER WHAT STATUS WE HAVE.  THERE IS A

                    NOTION OF INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY THAT MANY OF US WENT TO LAW

                    SCHOOL AND HAVE BEEN FIGHTING OUR ENTIRE LIVES FOR.  AND IF YOU ALLOW

                    ICE, AN AGENCY, TO COME INTO A COURTHOUSE AND ARREST SOMEONE BEFORE

                    THEY'VE EVEN HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE THEIR DAY IN COURT, OR, BECAUSE

                    THEY'RE ENGAGING IN RACIAL PROFILING BECAUSE LET'S GET IT CLEAR, IF THEY'RE

                    ARRESTING SOMEONE BECAUSE THEY'RE A SPECTATOR, SPECTATOR, THAT IS RACIAL

                    PROFILING BECAUSE HOW THE HECK DO YOU KNOW THAT SOMEONE IS AN

                    UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANT SIMPLY BY LOOKING AT THEM.  I CAN GUARANTEE

                    YOU THAT NOBODY KNEW IT ABOUT ME UNTIL I SAID IT.

                                 AND SO, I AM ASKING THAT WE, AS LEGISLATORS, UPHOLD THE

                    CONSTITUTION OF THIS COUNTRY AND PROTECT THE PEOPLE WHO ELECTED US TO

                    PROTECT THEM, BECAUSE I WANT TO REMIND EVERYONE, WE DIDN'T GET ELECTED

                    JUST TO PROTECT THE PEOPLE WHO VOTE FOR US, WE GOT ELECTED TO PROTECT

                    EVERY SINGLE PERSON THAT LIVES IN OUR DISTRICT.  AND I'LL BE VOTING IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. GLICK.

                                 MS. GLICK:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I WANT TO

                                         78



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CONGRATULATE THE SPONSOR FOR BRINGING THIS FORWARD.  ESSENTIALLY, ICE IS

                    OPERATING WITH INTERAGENCY OR INTEROFFICE MEMOS, AND THAT'S HOW THEY

                    PROCEED.  AND THEY COME TO THE COURTHOUSE UNDERMINING THE ABILITY OF

                    ALL OF US TO GET JUSTICE.  IF SOMEBODY HAS BEEN A WITNESS OF A CRIME,

                    THEY MAY BE A WITNESS OF A CRIME THAT HAS BEEN COMMITTED AGAINST ANY

                    ONE OF US AND THEY -- AND WE MAY DEPEND UPON THEM IN ORDER TO HAVE

                    THE PERPETRATOR IDENTIFIED AND PROSECUTED.  UNDERMINING THAT ISN'T

                    UNDERMINING IT FOR A PARTICULAR GROUP OF PEOPLE, UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE,

                    IT IS UNDERMINING IT FOR EVERYONE.

                                 THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS BROUGHT A STRANGE, NEW

                    NOTION OF HAVING UNIDENTIFIED FEDERAL OFFICERS APPEARING IN THE CITIES

                    FROM WASHINGTON, D.C., FIRST, NOW TO PORTLAND, AND WE'LL SEE WHERE

                    ELSE.  THIS IS DISGRACEFUL, IT IS FRIGHTENING, IT REMINDS ME AND MY

                    HISTORY, MY FAMILY HISTORY, OF THE BROWNSHIRTS OF THE '30S, UNIDENTIFIED

                    OFFICERS SHOWING UP AND TAKING PEOPLE OFF THE STREET.

                                 SO, IT IS -- IT MAKES SENSE THAT WE ENSURE THAT SOMEONE

                    WHO IS A FEDERAL AGENT, AN ICE AGENT OR ANY OTHER AGENT, HAS TO HAVE A

                    -- A WARRANT, NOT A MEMO, WHICH IS SAY ESSENTIALLY WHAT ICE WARRANTS

                    ARE, THEY'RE AN ADMINISTRATIVE WARRANT.  SO, TO ME, IT'S AN INTEROFFICE

                    MEMO IDENTIFYING SOMEONE, AND THEN TROLLING THE COURTHOUSES TO

                    IDENTIFY -- TO TRY TO FIND PEOPLE DOES NOT MAKE ANY OF US SAFER.

                                 SO I APPLAUD THIS MEASURE.  I THANK THE SPONSOR FOR

                    BRINGING IT FORWARD.  IT IS A MEASURE OF PROTECTION FOR ALL OF US, BECAUSE

                    YOU DON'T KNOW WHO YOU MAY NEED TO DEPEND UPON TO COME FORWARD IN

                    A COURT ACTION ON YOUR BEHALF.  AND MAKING CERTAIN THAT THE COURTS ARE

                                         79



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SACROSANCT IS IN EVERYBODY'S INTEREST.  SO THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, AND

                    VERY MUCH THANKING MEMBER SOLAGES FOR BRINGING THIS FORWARD, SINCE

                    I'M NOT EXPLAINING MY VOTE, I CAN MENTION HER NAME.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MA'AM.

                                 MR. EPSTEIN.

                                 MR. EPSTEIN:  ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 MR. EPSTEIN:  THANK YOU.  I ALSO WANT TO APPLAUD

                    THE SPONSOR FOR HER LEADERSHIP ON THIS IMPORTANT ISSUE.  I, AS SOME OF

                    MY COLLEAGUES JUST SAID, I AM A LAWYER, I'VE BEEN TO COURT HUNDREDS IF

                    NOT THOUSANDS OF TIMES, AND I SEE HOW THE COURT SYSTEM IS USED TO

                    CONTINUE INJUSTICE IN OUR SOCIETY.  AND RACIAL PROFILING, UNFORTUNATELY,

                    IS PART OF THE SYSTEM -- OF THE SOCIETY WE LIVE IN.  ICE JUST WANTS TO PUT

                    THAT ON STEROIDS.  THEY WANT TO BE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO GO INTO COURT AND

                    TARGET PEOPLE BASED ON - THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF IS THEIR RACE -  AND

                    TO TRY TO GET WHAT THEY BELIEVE IS UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE OUT OF COURT.

                                 THESE, QUOTE, "PEOPLE" ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE THERE

                    SEEKING JUSTICE FROM THE SYSTEM.  THESE COULD BE, AS SOMEONE SAID,

                    THEY MIGHT BE "SPECTATORS", BUT SPECTATORS ARE NOT THAT, SPECTATORS ARE

                    POTENTIAL WITNESSES, THEY ARE MORAL SUPPORT FOR PEOPLE, MAYBE SOMEONE

                    WHO IS A DOMESTIC VIOLENCE SURVIVOR.  THEY COULD BE A TRANSLATOR, THEY

                    COULD BE A TRUSTED FRIEND.  THE PEOPLE WHO GO TO COURT ARE AN INTEGRAL

                    PART OF OUR COURT SYSTEM.  AND IF WE BELIEVE THE COURT SYSTEM SHOULD BE

                    OPEN TO ALL, WE NEED TO ENSURE THAT IT IS OPEN TO ALL.

                                         80



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 WE LIVE IN A SYSTEM THAT'S RACIST.  WE LIVE IN A SYSTEM

                    THAT'S UNJUST.  WE LIVE IN A SYSTEM, AS WE SEE EVERYDAY, BY, YOU KNOW,

                    WHAT WAS HAPPENING ACROSS THIS COUNTRY AND WHAT WE'VE SEEN FROM THE

                    BLACK LIVES MATTER MOVEMENT THAT WE NEED A BETTER WAY TO APPROACH

                    INJUSTICE IN THE WORLD.  THIS IS ONE STEP FORWARD.  THIS IS HOW WE MAKE

                    THE COURT SYSTEM A LITTLE FAIRER.  THIS IS HOW WE ENSURE THAT PEOPLE WHO

                    ARE GOING THERE TO SEEK SOME LEVEL OF GRIEVANCE HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO

                    THAT WITHOUT THE THREAT OF DEPORTATION OR ARREST FROM ICE.

                                 ICE IS DEEPLY TROUBLED AND DEEPLY PROBLEMATIC AND

                    WE SHOULD ABOLISH IT, BUT UNTIL THAT DAY THAT WE DON'T HAVE A SYSTEM

                    WHERE PEOPLE GO ROGUE ALL THE TIME AND ATTACK PEOPLE BASED ON THEIR

                    RACE AND POTENTIALLY TAKE -- RIP FAMILIES APART WHO HAVE BEEN HERE FOR

                    DECADES, UNTIL WE HAVE THAT DAY, WE NEED THESE IMPORTANT VICTORIES.

                    AND, ASSEMBLYMEMBER SOLAGES, I WANT TO APPLAUD YOUR EFFORTS HERE.  I

                    ENCOURAGE ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL, I KNOW I'LL

                    BE VOTING IN FAVOR OF IT, AS WELL.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. SIMON.

                                 MS. SIMON:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

                                 MS. SIMON:  I, TOO, WANT TO COMMEND MS. SOLAGES

                    FOR HER -- FOR THIS BILL, FOR ARGUING IT SO ELOQUENTLY.  ICE IS LAYING IN

                    WAIT OUTSIDE OUR COURTHOUSES, THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING.  THEY ARE JUST

                    LAYING IN WAIT, THEY ARE THERE TO TERRORIZE ANYONE WHO ICE MAY HAVE

                    PROFILED AS BEING UNDOCUMENTED AND SUBJECT TO DEPORTATION.  THEY ARE

                                         81



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DOING IT BY USING FALSE DOCUMENTATION.  THEY ARE NOT USING PROPER

                    PROCESS, AND THEY ARE THERE TO SIMPLY FRIGHTEN PEOPLE.  THEY ARE THERE

                    TO FRIGHTEN THE PEOPLE WHO ARE -- HAVE A MATTER BEFORE COURT OR

                    SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BE ASSISTING SOMEONE OR JUST SUPPORTING SOMEONE,

                    OR MIGHT BE TRANSLATING, ALL OF THE VARIOUS PERMUTATIONS OF WHY

                    ANYBODY WOULD GO TO COURT TO BE THERE FOR SOMEONE, TO JUST SUPPORT

                    THEM IN ANY WAY.  AND THESE TACTICS HAVE A VERY DARK PAST AND A VERY

                    DARK HISTORY.  WE KNOW THAT HISTORY.  AND THAT HISTORY SHOULD NOT BE

                    HAPPENING, THAT SHOULD NOT BE REPEATING IN THE UNITED STATES OF

                    AMERICA, AND IT SURE AS HECK SHOULDN'T BE HAPPENING IN NEW YORK

                    STATE.

                                 AND SO, I ENCOURAGE ALL MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE FOR THIS.

                    AGAIN, I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU SO VERY

                    MUCH.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 93.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                                         82



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING NO ON THIS BILL IN GENERAL, BUT ANY

                    REPUBLICAN MEMBERS THAT WOULD LIKE TO VOTE YES, PLEASE CONTACT THE

                    MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THIS WILL BE A PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  MEMBERS

                    WISHING OR DESIRING TO VOTE NO ON THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION SHOULD

                    CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND WE WILL MAKE SURE YOUR VOTE

                    IS PROPERLY RECORDED.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MA'AM.

                    SO NOTED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. PICHARDO TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. PICHARDO:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR

                    ALLOWING ME TO TAKE A PAUSE AND EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  FIRST OF ALL, I WANT

                    TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR ON THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION AND I WANT TO

                    MAKE SURE THAT IT'S CLEAR TO ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES THAT REGARDLESS OF YOUR

                    DOCUMENTATION STATUS, EVERYONE DESERVES EQUAL PROTECTION UNDER THE

                    LAW.  AND WHEN THE LAW FALLS AND IS HEAVY-HANDED IN ITS ENFORCEMENT,

                    IT CREATES A COUNTERPRODUCTIVE SCENARIO AND, MORE IMPORTANTLY, IT MAKES

                    LAW ENFORCEMENTS' JOBS HARDER BECAUSE YOU WILL HAVE LESS COOPERATIVE

                    COMMUNITIES AND THE FACT THAT PEOPLE WILL HAVE LESS OF A LIKELIHOOD OR

                    EVEN WANT TO COOPERATE WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT AUTHORITIES.  I THINK THE

                    IDEA OF MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE FEEL SAFE TO NOT ONLY INTERACT WITH THE

                                         83



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    JUDICIAL SYSTEM, BUT ALSO FEEL THAT THEY ARE PROTECTED BY THEIR

                    GOVERNMENT IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCE OR ANY OTHER SITUATION.  SO, I

                    COMMEND THE SPONSOR FOR THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.  I COMMEND MY

                    COLLEAGUES FOR VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND I ENCOURAGE EVERYBODY TO

                    DO THE SAME, AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. PICHARDO IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. RODRIGUEZ.

                                 MR. RODRIGUEZ:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  AND I JUST WANT TO COMMEND THE

                    SPONSOR FOR THIS IMPORTANT PIECE OF LEGISLATION.  YOU KNOW, IT'S

                    IMPORTANT, CERTAINLY AS REPRESENTATIVES OF THE -- OF THE LATINO AND

                    LATINX COMMUNITY, BUT ALSO FOR ANYBODY WHO IS, YOU KNOW, LOOKING TO

                    GO TO COURT TO HAVE THEIR DAY AND TO RESOLVE MATTERS, TO UNDERSTAND AND

                    KNOW THAT THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE FURTHER PREYED UPON OR VICTIMIZED

                    BY LAW ENFORCEMENT AS A RESULT OF SHOWING UP TO THOSE PROCEEDINGS AND

                    LOOKING TO GET THEIR FAIR -- FAIR DAY IN COURT.

                                 SO, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT FOR US TO SEND THIS MESSAGE

                    THAT, YOU KNOW, CERTAIN PLACES, YOU KNOW, SHOULD NOT BE TARGET AREAS

                    FOR -- FOR EITHER THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT OR ANY OTHER AGENCY, YOU

                    KNOW, TO -- TO FURTHER VICTIMIZE PEOPLE AND -- AND -- AND ALSO MUST

                    KEEP IN MIND THE SANCTITY OF THE JUDICIAL PROCESS AND -- AND THE SYSTEM

                    FOR ALL ITS FLAWS, BUT MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE CAN ACCESS IT WITH THE

                    SAME LEVEL OF EXPECTATION, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF WHAT THEY'RE EXPECTED

                                         84



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    TO DO WHEN THEY'RE -- WHEN THEY HAVE TO GO TO THEIR DAY AT COURT -- IN

                    COURT OR TO THEIR APPOINTMENT, THAT THEY HAVE THE SAME PROTECTIONS AND

                    ARE NOT VICTIMIZED AS A RESULT.  SO, I WILL BE VOTING AND SUPPORTING THIS

                    LEGISLATION AND I ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. RODRIGUEZ IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MS. SOLAGES.

                                 MS. SOLAGES:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, TO EXPLAIN

                    MY VOTE.  A VICTIM IS NOT A PARTY UNTIL THEY FILE DOCUMENTATION WITH THE

                    CLERK.  WE HAVE DAS FROM ACROSS NEW YORK STATE, ALBANY, BRONX,

                    NEW YORK COUNTY, NASSAU COUNTY, WESTCHESTER, WHO WROTE A LETTER TO

                    LEGISLATIVE LEADERS SAYING, AS ICE AGENTS BECOME AN INCREASING

                    REGULAR PRESENCE IN OUR COURTHOUSES, THERE IS A DETRIMENTAL EFFECT ON

                    THE ABILITY TO INVESTIGATE AND PROSECUTE CRIMES.

                                 A WOMAN WHO -- WHO HAS BEEN ASSAULTED NEEDS TO BE

                    ABLE TO TESTIFY AGAINST HER ABUSER.  A TENANT SERVING WITH AN EVICTION

                    NOTICE NEEDS TO BE ABLE TO DEFEND THE CASE.  A CONSUMER WHO PAID

                    MONEY, BUT DID NOT RECEIVE A PRODUCT SHOULD BE ABLE TO GO TO COURT.

                    WE'RE NEW YORK STATE.  WE HAVE SENT A SIGNAL, AND WITH THIS BILL WE

                    SEND A SIGNAL THAT OUR COURTHOUSES ARE OPEN FOR ALL, AND THAT THE JUDICIAL

                    PROCESS CAN BE DONE, AND THAT YOU -- WHEN YOU GO TO COURT, YOU'RE

                    GOING TO BE SAFE.  SO WITH THE PASSAGE OF THIS BILL IN THE ASSEMBLY AND

                    THE SENATE, WE SEND A LOUD MESSAGE TO OUR COMMUNITY THAT YOU ARE

                    HERE TO STAY.

                                 I WOULD LIKE TO THANK IDP, WHO HAVE DOCUMENTED THE

                                         85



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    1,700 PERCENT OF INCREASE OF FEDERAL AGENTS ARRESTING PEOPLE TO AND

                    FROM COURTHOUSES; NEW YORK IMMIGRATION COALITION; THE COUNTLESS

                    LEGAL AID LAWYERS WHO, YOU HAVE SAID THAT THIS -- THIS PIECE OF

                    LEGISLATION NEEDS TO PASS THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS.  I THANK THEM ALL.  I

                    THANK EVERYONE WHO CHAMPIONED THIS BILL, ALL MY COLLEAGUES, AND

                    SPEAKER HEASTIE FOR BELIEVING THAT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR

                    JUDICIAL PROCESS IS OPEN TO ALL.  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, AND I VOTE IN

                    THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. SOLAGES IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MS. DE LA ROSA.

                                 MS. DE LA ROSA:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I SIMPLY WANT TO UPLIFT MY COLLEAGUE

                    FOR ALL HER WORK IN DEFENDING THIS IMPORTANT PIECE OF LEGISLATION.  AS

                    HAS BEEN SAID TIME AND TIME AGAIN, THIS IS ABOUT ALLOWING ACCESS TO

                    JUSTICE AND OUR COURT SHOULD BE THE PLACE WHERE ACCESS IS HELD AND

                    WHERE PEOPLE HAVE THE ABILITY TO GO AND DEFEND THEIR CASES AND WATCH

                    CASES AND BE THERE FOR THEIR RELATIVES AS THEY DEFEND THEIR INNOCENCE.

                    SO, THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE, AND I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. DE LA ROSA IN

                    THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, WE DO

                    HAVE ONE OF OUR COLLEAGUES, MR. SANTABARBARA, WHO WOULD LIKE TO BE

                    RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.  SO

                                         86



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, IF WE

                    COULD CONTINUE ON OUR DEBATE CALENDAR.  WE'RE GOING TO GO TO CALENDAR

                    NO. 108 BY MR. DINOWITZ, 116 BY MR. DINOWITZ, AND 118 BY MR.

                    ENGLEBRIGHT.  ON DEBATE, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  PAGE 19, CALENDAR

                    NO. 108, THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02479-A, CALENDAR

                    NO. 108, DINOWITZ, L. ROSENTHAL, MOSLEY, GALEF, ABINANTI, JAFFEE,

                    FAHY, COLTON, CRESPO, ORTIZ, WEPRIN, LAVINE, ARROYO, REYES, CRUZ, DE

                    LA ROSA.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE LABOR LAW, IN RELATION TO PROHIBITING AN

                    EMPLOYER FROM REQUESTING OR REQUIRING THAT AN EMPLOYEE OR APPLICANT

                    DISCLOSE ANY USER NAME, PASSWORD, OR OTHER MEANS FOR ACCESSING A

                    PERSONAL ACCOUNT THROUGH SPECIFIED ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATIONS

                    DEVICES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MR. DINOWITZ.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  GOOD EVENING.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  GOOD EVENING, SIR.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  THIS BILL WOULD PROHIBIT AN

                    EMPLOYER FROM REQUESTING OR REQUIRING THAT AN EMPLOYEE OR APPLICANT

                                         87



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DISCLOSE ANY USER NAME, PASSWORD OR OTHER MEANS OF ACCESSING A

                    PERSONAL ACCOUNT THROUGH SPECIFIED ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATION DEVICES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. RA.

                                 MR. RA:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WILL THE SPONSOR

                    YIELD FOR A FEW QUESTIONS?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. DINOWITZ, WILL

                    YOU YIELD?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  I WILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. DINOWITZ YIELDS.

                                 MR. RA:  THANK YOU, MR. DINOWITZ.  GOOD TO SEE

                    YOU VIRTUALLY.  I HOPE YOU AND YOUR FAMILY ARE WELL.  I KNOW THIS --

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  THEY ARE.  I HOPE YOURS ARE AS

                    WELL.

                                 MR. RA:  THANK YOU, WE ARE.  I APPRECIATE THAT.  SO,

                    YOU KNOW, WE LAST VOTED ON THIS BILL A FEW YEARS BACK, SO I'M GOING TO

                    START WITH SOMETHING THAT I -- I THINK IS A -- IS A GOOD THING AS -- AS I

                    LOOK THROUGH THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.  I -- I HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO READ

                    THE TRANSCRIPT FROM THE 2014 DEBATE.  IT TOOK ME ON A TRIP DOWN

                    MEMORY LANE, INCLUDING SOME OF OUR PAST COLLEAGUES, AL GRAF, WHO

                    WAS DEBATING YOU.  AND ONE OF THE THINGS HE BROUGHT UP WAS THE

                    POTENTIAL THAT LAW ENFORCEMENT MIGHT NEED TO ACCESS SOME OF THIS

                    INFORMATION.  SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS NOW WITH THE CURRENT VERSION OF

                    THE BILL, LAW ENFORCEMENT, CORRECTIONS AND FIRE DEPARTMENTS WOULD NOT

                    BE SUBJECT TO THESE RESTRICTIONS.  IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  AS YOU KNOW, WE TRY TO TAKE INPUT

                                         88



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FROM BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE WHEN DISCUSSING OUR BILLS, SO WE DID MAKE

                    SOME ADJUSTMENTS TO THE BILL OVER THE YEARS.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  THANK YOU FOR THAT.  SO I JUST WANT

                    TO GO THROUGH EXACTLY WHAT IS COVERED AND -- AND HOW THIS WORKS.  AS,

                    YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALL AWARE, YOU KNOW, AND WE -- WE'VE SEEN THIS, YOU

                    KNOW, OVER THE YEARS AS THE SOCIAL MEDIA HAS -- HAS BECOME SOMETHING

                    THAT IS, YOU KNOW, VERY WIDESPREAD AND -- AND -- AND IN SUCH WIDE USE,

                    YOU KNOW, THE INDIVIDUALS MAY BE -- SOMETHING COMES TO LIGHT THAT

                    THEY SAID ON -- ON A SOCIAL MEDIA ACCOUNT YEARS BEFORE.  WHETHER IT'S

                    RACIALLY INSENSITIVE, WHETHER IT'S HOMOPHOBIC, WHETHER IT'S ANTI-SEMITIC

                    OR, YOU KNOW, SOME OTHER TYPE OF -- YOU KNOW, A VIEWPOINT THAT -- THAT

                    WE VIEW TO BE SOMETHING THAT IS, YOU KNOW, OBJECTIONABLE AND THAT,

                    YOU KNOW, AN ENTITY, WHETHER IT'S A -- A SCHOOL, UNIVERSITY, A -- A

                    BUSINESS, AN ORGANIZATION DOESN'T WANT TO NECESSARILY BE ASSOCIATED

                    WITH.  SO MY UNDERSTANDING OF THIS, THOUGH, IS THAT IT WOULDN'T PREVENT

                    THAT PROSPECTIVE EMPLOYER FROM LOOKING AT SOCIAL MEDIA, BUT RATHER

                    FROM ASKING TO ACTUALLY HAVE THE LOGIN INFORMATION FROM AN INDIVIDUAL.

                    IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  I'M SORRY, SAY THAT AGAIN PLEASE.

                    I'M SORRY.

                                 MR. RA:  SO, IF -- IF I'M A POTENTIAL EMPLOYER AND I'M,

                    YOU KNOW, GOING TO BE INTERVIEWING A PERSON OR I JUST INTERVIEWED A

                    PERSON AND I WANT TO KIND OF TAKE A LOOK AND SEE IF, YOU KNOW, THERE'S

                    SOMETHING ON THEIR TWITTER OR SOMETHING ON THEIR FACEBOOK ACCOUNT

                    THAT IS SOMETHING I DON'T WANT MY ORGANIZATION TO BE CONNECTED TO, I

                                         89



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CAN STILL DO THAT, CORRECT?  BUT WHAT I CAN'T DO IS ASK THE INDIVIDUAL FOR

                    THEIR LOGIN INFORMATION TO LOG INTO THEIR SOCIAL MEDIA ACCOUNT.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  YES, THAT'S RIGHT.  I MEAN, YOU CAN

                    GO ON -- I CAN GO ON A LOT OF PEOPLE'S FACEBOOK OR TWITTER ACCOUNTS AND

                    PEOPLE DO IT ALL THE TIME.  THE QUESTION IS WHETHER OR NOT WE SHOULD

                    FORCE SOMEBODY TO GIVE UP THEIR -- THEIR PASSWORDS, AND THE ANSWER IS

                    WITH THIS BILL, NO.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  NOW, ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS I KNOW

                    IT SAYS IS THAT YOU CAN'T REPRODUCE ANY, YOU KNOW, INFORMATION FROM

                    THEIR ACCOUNT.  SO, I MEAN, WITH THAT -- IF I WERE TO INTERVIEW SOMEBODY

                    AND I'M CONSIDERING OFFERING THEM A JOB AND I SEE SOMETHING THAT, YOU

                    KNOW, I -- I THINK SOMETIMES THERE ARE THINGS THAT WE CAN LOOK AT AND

                    SAY, GEE, THIS IS A PROBLEM, I DON'T WANT TO BE ASSOCIATED WITH THIS, OR

                    MAYBE THERE'S SOMETHING THAT MAYBE IS BORDERLINE THAT MIGHT BE A

                    CONCERN.  WOULD THAT PROVISION -- IT -- IT SAYS HERE DISCLOSING OR

                    REPRODUCE IN ANY MANNER PHOTOGRAPHS, VIDEO OR OTHER INFORMATION

                    CONTAINED WITHIN A PERSONAL ACCOUNT.  WOULD THAT PREVENT ME OF, SAY,

                    YOU KNOW, TAKING A SCREENSHOT OF SOMETHING AND MAYBE I GO AND HAVE

                    MY H.R. DEPARTMENT LOOK AT IT OR -- OR I GO TO, YOU KNOW, MY -- MY

                    BOARD OR MAYBE I'M IN CHARGE OF HIRING AND I GO TO THE -- THE OWNER OF

                    THE BUSINESS TO SAY, YOU KNOW, IS -- IS THIS SOMETHING THAT -- THAT IS A

                    PROBLEM FOR YOU?  WILL I BE PREVENTED FROM DOING THAT UNDER THIS

                    LANGUAGE?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  IF THE -- IF THE INDIVIDUAL DOESN'T

                    WANT YOU TO HAVE THEIR PASSWORD OR ANY OTHER -- OR ANY OTHER LOGIN

                                         90



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    INFORMATION, YOU CAN'T -- UNDER THIS BILL YOU CAN'T FORCE THEM TO GIVE IT

                    TO YOU.

                                 MR. RA:  WELL, I UNDERSTAND THAT AS IT REGARDS TO

                    PASSWORDS.  BUT WHAT IT SAYS HERE --

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WHAT -- WHAT LINE ARE YOU LOOKING

                    AT?  LET ME JUST FIND IT.

                                 MR. RA:  I'M LOOKING AT PAGE 2, LINES 11 AND 12.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WELL, IT'S -- IT'S PRETTY PLAIN WHAT IT

                    SAYS.  CAN'T REPRODUCE IN ANY MANNER PHOTOGRAPHS, VIDEO OR OTHER INFO

                    CONTAINED WITHIN A PERSONAL ACCOUNT.  THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  SO WOULD -- WOULD I BE, AS THE

                    EMPLOYER, UNABLE TO -- I MEAN, BECAUSE THESE THINGS -- YOU KNOW, THE

                    SAYING GOES, THE INTERNET IS FOREVER, RIGHT?  BUT OBVIOUSLY, PEOPLE

                    SOMETIMES WILL DELETE A SOCIAL MEDIA POST OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

                    WOULD THIS PREVENT ME FROM -- FROM STORING SOMETHING THAT I SAW?  I

                    MEAN, MAYBE SOMEBODY SAYS, YOU KNOW, GOES HOME AFTER AN INTERVIEW

                    AND SAYS, OH, GEEZ.  I -- I REMEMBER FIVE YEARS AGO I POSTED SOMETHING

                    REALLY STUPID.  I BETTER GET THAT OFF OF MY, YOU KNOW, TWITTER PAGE.

                    WOULD THIS PREVENT THE -- THE ORGANIZATION FROM -- FROM TAKING A COPY

                    OF THAT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WELL, THAT'S EXACTLY WHY I NEVER

                    POST ANYTHING STUPID, BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN LOOK AT IT.  IT DOES NOT PREVENT

                    THE EMPLOYER FROM VIEWING OR ACCESSING PUBLIC INFORMATION IF IT'S

                    AVAILABLE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN ALREADY.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  NOW, I -- I THINK YOU -- YOU -- YOU

                                         91



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MAKE AN IMPORTANT POINT WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT PUBLIC INFORMATION.  ONE

                    OF THE THINGS ANY OF US THAT ARE FAMILIAR WITH SOCIAL MEDIA MAY KNOW IS

                    THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE ACCOUNTS THAT ARE PUBLIC IN TERMS OF, YOU

                    KNOW, THERE'S NO SECURITY RESTRICTIONS, ANYBODY CAN SEE THEM.  YOU

                    KNOW, SO I COULD HAVE A FACEBOOK ACCOUNT THAT'S COMPLETELY PUBLIC SO

                    THAT ANYBODY COULD JUST PULL IT UP, LOOK AT ANYTHING THAT'S THERE AND

                    THEN THERE'S PEOPLE THAT HAVE DIFFERENT LEVELS OF SECURITY.  MAYBE ONLY

                    PEOPLE WHO ARE MY FRIEND ON FACEBOOK CAN SEE IT.  YOU KNOW, SAME

                    GOES FOR TWITTER, INSTAGRAM, AND REQUIRES THAT AN INDIVIDUAL ACTUALLY,

                    YOU KNOW, ACCEPT THAT PERSON AS A FRIEND OR -- OR A FOLLOWER, YOU KNOW,

                    WHAT HAVE YOU, DEPENDING ON -- ON THE SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORM.  SO I -- I

                    KNOW THERE IS LANGUAGE IN HERE THAT I BELIEVE IS INTENDED TO ADDRESS THAT

                    SITUATION, BUT I JUST WANT TO BE SURE.  IF THE, YOU KNOW, EMPLOYER WERE

                    TO FRIEND REQUEST OR REQUEST TO FOLLOW THE INDIVIDUAL BECAUSE THEIR POSTS

                    ARE PRIVATE AND THEY WANT TO BE ABLE TO TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT'S IN THERE

                    BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT -- IT'S NOT PUBLIC THAT ANYBODY CAN ACCESS,

                    WOULD THE EMPLOYER BE PERMITTED TO DO THAT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WELL, THE EMPLOYER CAN CERTAINLY

                    MAKE A FRIEND REQUEST, BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO ACCEPT IT.  NO ONE CAN

                    FORCE YOU TO ACCEPT A FRIEND REQUEST.

                                 MR. RA:  YES, I -- I -- I WOULD AGREE NOBODY CAN

                    FORCE YOU TO ACCEPT A FRIEND REQUEST.  SO I THINK, THEN, YOU KNOW, IF YOU

                    WERE TO -- WOULD THAT THEN BE TREATED BASICALLY THE SAME AS SAYING, GIVE

                    -- YOU KNOW, GIVE ME YOUR PASSWORD?  YOU'RE NOT ABLE TO DO THAT?  YOU

                    WOULDN'T ALSO BE ABLE TO SAY, LISTEN, YOU KNOW, MY H.R. DIRECTOR IS

                                         92



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    GOING TO FRIEND REQUEST YOU.  I NEED YOU TO ACCEPT THAT FRIEND REQUEST

                    BECAUSE WE NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, WHETHER YOU'VE POSTED

                    ANYTHING THAT WE MIGHT FIND OBJECTIONABLE.  WOULD THAT BE PROHIBITED?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  I'M -- I'M NOT SURE I SEE WORDING

                    IN THE BILL EXACTLY ON POINT TO THAT, BUT I THINK THE INTENT OF THE BILL

                    BASED ON WHAT IT SAYS IS THAT THAT WOULD HAVE THE SAME NET EFFECT OF

                    DEMANDING THE INFORMATION THAT IS BANNED IN THE WORDING OF THIS BILL.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  NOW I -- I JUST -- IS THERE ANY

                    DIFFERENTIATION, BECAUSE I KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS BEING USED NOT

                    JUST, YOU KNOW, FOR APPLICATIONS BUT DOES IT -- DOES THIS ALSO APPLY IF,

                    SAY, YOU'RE TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, DO SOME TYPE OF INTERNAL INVESTIGATION

                    OF AN INDIVIDUAL, YOU KNOW, FOR, YOU KNOW, JOB PERFORMANCE OR -- OR,

                    YOU KNOW, DISCIPLINE OR -- OR ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  IT WOULD APPLY TO PEOPLE APPLYING

                    FOR EMPLOYMENT, PEOPLE HOPING TO GET A BETTER POSITION WITHIN -- WITHIN

                    THE ORGANIZATION.  YOU KNOW, MOVING THEIR POSITION.  IT APPLIES

                    THROUGHOUT.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  AND JUST ONE OTHER PIECE OF THIS.

                    AND I -- I UNDERSTAND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT I -- I THINK WOULD BE --

                    MAKE -- MAKE SENSE TO BE INCLUDED, BUT I'M JUST WONDERING IF THERE'S

                    ANY PARTICULAR EXAMPLES OF -- OF THIS THAT -- THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE.  IT -- IT

                    BASICALLY PROVIDES AN AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE IF THE EMPLOYER ACTS TO

                    COMPLY WITH REQUIREMENTS OF FEDERAL, STATE OR LOCAL LAW.  DO YOU

                    KNOW OF ANY, YOU KNOW, LAWS THAT WOULD -- WOULD BASICALLY NECESSITATE

                    SOMEBODY TO HAVE TO GIVE UP THAT INFORMATION WHEN REQUESTED BY A

                                         93



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    PERSPECTIVE EMPLOYER OR AN EMPLOYER MAKING A -- A PROMOTION

                    DECISION?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WELL, I -- I THINK IT SAYS IN THE BILL

                    HERE WHAT THE EXCEPTIONS ARE, AND -- AND IT'S PRETTY CLEARLY LAID OUT HERE.

                    SO, I MEAN, THAT'S MY ANSWER.

                                 MR. RA:  OKAY.  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR.

                    DINOWITZ.

                                 MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL.

                                 MR. RA:  AS I -- AS I STATED EARLIER, I -- I -- I AM

                    CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, APPRECIATIVE OF -- OF THE SPONSOR'S ACTIONS IN -- IN

                    MAKING THAT CHANGE AS IT RELATES TO LAW ENFORCEMENT.  I THINK WE CAN

                    DEFINITELY SEE CIRCUMSTANCES UNDER WHICH GETTING, YOU KNOW, THIS TYPE

                    OF INFORMATION MIGHT BE HELPFUL IN MAKING SURE WE'RE NOT IN THOSE

                    TYPES OF JOBS HIRING INDIVIDUALS, LAW ENFORCEMENT, CORRECTIONS, FIRE

                    DEPARTMENTS.  AND I -- AND I DON'T THINK WE WOULD WANT TO TAKE AWAY A

                    POTENTIAL TOOL THAT COULD WEED OUT SOMEBODY WHO WAS NOT FIT TO

                    PERFORM ONE OF THOSE -- ONE OF THOSE TYPES OF JOBS.  SO -- SO I AM HAPPY

                    TO SEE THAT AMENDMENT HAVING BEEN MADE.  YOU KNOW, THIS IS CERTAINLY

                    A DIFFICULT ISSUE IN SOME WAYS.  I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND THE PRIVACY

                    ASPECT OF IT, BUT I THINK WE'VE SEEN VERY, VERY OFTEN IN MODERN TIMES,

                    EVEN RECENTLY, YOU KNOW, WHETHER IT'S INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE, YOU

                    KNOW, LOST A SPOT IN A -- IN A COLLEGE OR UNIVERSITY WHO HAD PREVIOUSLY

                    ADMITTED THEM OR AN EMPLOYEE WHO ENDS UP GETTING FIRED AS A RESULT OF

                    SOMETHING THAT THEY POST ON SOCIAL MEDIA OR SOMETHING THAT COMES TO

                                         94



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LIGHT ON SOCIAL MEDIA THAT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A THOUGHT THAT THEY

                    OUGHT TO HAVE KNOWN ABOUT BEFORE THEY HIRE AN INDIVIDUAL.  YOU KNOW,

                    PARTICULARLY IF IT HAPPENED BEFORE THAT HIRING DECISION WAS MADE.  I -- I

                    THINK THE SPONSOR MADE A GOOD POINT WHEN -- WHEN HE SAID THE BEST

                    APPROACH IS NOT TO SAY STUPID THINGS ON SOCIAL MEDIA, BUT I THINK WE

                    ALSO ALL KNOW THAT THERE ARE, YOU KNOW -- YOU KNOW, YOUNG PEOPLE

                    SOMETIMES SAY THINGS, THEY DON'T CHOOSE THEIR WORDS TOO -- TOO WISELY

                    ON SOCIAL MEDIA AND THEY FORGET THAT THINGS THAT YOU POST ARE -- ARE

                    GOING TO BE THERE FOREVER AND -- AND SOMEBODY MAY LOOK AT THEM LATER

                    ON, AND EVEN IF IT'S NOT INDICATIVE OF THEIR TRUE FEELINGS ON A SUBJECT, IT

                    MAY REALLY CAUSE ISSUES FOR THEM IN EMPLOYMENT IN THE FUTURE.  SO MY

                    CONCERN WITH THIS IS THAT, YOU KNOW, IF SOMEBODY HAS A PRIVATE ACCOUNT

                    AND SAY YOU HIRE THEM -- AND IT COULD BE ANYTHING.  IT COULD BE, YOU

                    KNOW, A SMALL LOCAL BUSINESS, IT COULD BE SOMEBODY THAT GETS HIRED TO

                    BE, YOU KNOW, A JOURNALIST THAT RISES THROUGH THE RANKS AND ALL OF

                    SUDDEN, YOU KNOW, IS A -- YOU KNOW, IS A FAMOUS JOURNALIST OR ON TV

                    OR WHATEVER, AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN SOMEBODY GOES AND LOOKS IT UP

                    BEFORE THAT ENTITY HIRED THEM, THEY SAID SOMETHING REALLY RIDICULOUS ON

                    SOCIAL MEDIA THAT THEIR EMPLOYER DOES NOT WANT TO BE ASSOCIATED WITH.

                    AND THEIR EMPLOYER NOW IS IN A SITUATION WHERE PEOPLE MAY BE SAYING,

                    HEY, HOW ARE YOU EMPLOYING SOMEBODY WHO PUT THIS TYPE OF LANGUAGE

                    OR PUT THIS TYPE OF THOUGHTS OUT ON TO THE SOCIAL MEDIA?  SO THERE

                    DEFINITELY IS KIND OF A DOUBLE-EDGED SWORD HERE, AND THAT IS WHY, YOU

                    KNOW, WHILE THE PRIVACY ASPECT OF IT IS VERY IMPORTANT, I THINK THAT

                    THERE HAS TO BE SOME ABILITY FOR AN EMPLOYER -- AND IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE

                                         95



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THAT THEY HAVE TO BE ABLE TO TAKE AND REQUEST AND ASK FOR SOMEBODY'S

                    PASSWORD, BUT MAYBE THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY WHERE YOU HAVE A

                    SITUATION WHERE THEY CAN LOOK AT THE INFORMATION.  THEY CAN REQUEST TO

                    LOOK AT THE INFORMATION, BUT -- BUT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, CAN'T DISCRIMINATE

                    AGAINST AN APPLICANT WHO DECIDES TO NOT GIVE THEM ACCESS TO THAT

                    INFORMATION OR THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE ABLE TO ASK SOMEBODY TO PULL UP

                    THE INFORMATION AND LET -- LET THEM LOOK THROUGH IT SO THAT YOU HAVE THAT

                    BALANCE SO THAT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN ALLOW A BUSINESS TO -- TO REALLY TAKE

                    ADVANTAGE OF THE INFORMATION THAT'S OUT THERE ON SOMEBODY WHO THEY

                    MAY BE HIRING OR MAY BE PROMOTING WITHIN THEIR ORGANIZATIONS.

                                 THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS WILL

                    BE A PARTY LINE VOTE.  THE REPUBLICAN PARTY WILL INITIALLY VOTE IN THE

                    NEGATIVE.  ALTHOUGH IF THERE ARE MEMBERS THAT WOULD LIKE TO VOTE IN

                    FAVOR OF THIS, PLEASE CONTACT THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IN 180 DAYS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD --

                                 (PAUSE)

                                 MR. MCDONALD.

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  YES, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS IS A

                    PARTY LINE VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  ANY MEMBER WHO WOULD LIKE TO

                                         96



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    VOTE DIFFERENTLY PLEASE CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  JUST A LITTLE OUT OF

                    ORDER, GENTLEMEN.

                                 THE CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 108.

                    THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL -- THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY MEMBER WISHING TO

                    BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION IS REMINDED TO

                    CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY

                    PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  PLEASE RECORD THE

                    FOLLOWING REPUBLICAN MEMBERS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE IN ALPHABETICAL

                    ORDER:  MR. ASHBY, MR. BYRNE, MR. GARBARINO, MR. GIGLIO, MR.

                    MANKTELOW, MR. MILLER, MS. MILLER, MR. MONTESANO, MR. MORINELLO,

                    MR. NORRIS, MR. REILLY, MR. SALKA, MR. SCHMITT, MR. SMULLEN AND MR.

                    WALCZYK.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 THE CLERK WILL READ PAGE 21, CALENDAR NO. 116.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02611-E, CALENDAR

                    NO. 116, DINOWITZ, L. ROSENTHAL, CRESPO, BUCHWALD, WEPRIN,

                                         97



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    M.G. MILLER, RODRIGUEZ, OTIS, ABINANTI, SEAWRIGHT, SOLAGES, REYES,

                    TAYLOR, SAYEGH, GOTTFRIED, EPSTEIN, D'URSO, STIRPE, ARROYO, BLAKE,

                    HYNDMAN, DE LA ROSA, STECK, COOK, GLICK, CRUZ, ZEBROWSKI, ORTIZ,

                    WALLACE, FALL, FRONTUS, FERNANDEZ, DARLING.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO PROHIBITING THE DISCLOSURE OR USE

                    OF A PERSON'S CONSUMER CREDIT HISTORY TO AN EMPLOYER, LABOR

                    ORGANIZATION, EMPLOYMENT AGENCY OR AGENT THEREOF FOR PURPOSES OF

                    EMPLOYMENT DECISIONS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. DINOWITZ, AN

                    EXPLANATION HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  THIS BILL WOULD PROHIBIT AN

                    EMPLOYER OR POTENTIAL EMPLOYER FROM USING A JOB APPLICANT OR

                    EMPLOYEE'S CONSUMER CREDIT REPORT IN HIS OR HER DECISION TO HIRE,

                    TERMINATE, PROMOTE, DEMOTE, DISCIPLINE, COMPENSATE OR IN SETTING THE

                    TERMS, CONDITIONS OR PRIVILEGES OF EMPLOYMENT.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. WALSH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WILL THE

                    SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. DINOWITZ, WILL

                    YOU YIELD?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  YES, I WILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MR. DINOWITZ.  SO JUST TO

                    RECAP, AND YOUR EXPLANATION WAS VERY COMPLETE, BUT THIS DOES INCLUDE

                    POTENTIAL EMPLOYERS AS WELL AS CURRENT EMPLOYERS OF AN EMPLOYEE,

                                         98



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CORRECT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  YES.

                                 MS. WALSH:  AND THIS ALSO SAYS THAT YOU MAY NOT

                    REQUEST OR USE THE CREDIT REPORT.  IS THAT RIGHT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WELL, I'D HAVE TO CHECK THE BILL TO

                    SEE IF THE WORD "REQUEST" IS THERE, BUT I'M SURE THE ANSWER IS YES, YOU

                    CAN'T USE IT TO MAKE THOSE KIND OF DECISIONS BECAUSE -- WELL, I'M SURE

                    YOU'LL ASK QUESTIONS SO I'LL GO INTO MORE DEPTH AS YOU ASK THE QUESTIONS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  CAN'T REQUEST IT OR USE IT, RIGHT?

                    SO, THERE ARE JUST A COUPLE OF CARVE-OUTS FROM THE PROHIBITION OF USING

                    THE CREDIT REPORT.  ONE INVOLVES POLICE, AND ONE INVOLVES ANYBODY WHO

                    IS -- EMPLOYERS WHO ARE SUBJECT TO SEC REGULATIONS.  SO IN THOSE TWO

                    EXAMPLES, TWO CARVE-OUTS, YOU COULD USE REQUEST AND/OR USE A CREDIT

                    REPORT IN MAKING AN EMPLOYMENT DECISION.  IS THAT CORRECT, MR.

                    DINOWITZ?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  IT'S A CARVE-OUT, YES.

                                 MS. WALSH:  VERY GOOD.  SO THERE ARE A HOST OF

                    OTHER JOBS THAT MAY REQUIRE INDIVIDUALS TO USE THE FINANCIAL

                    BACKGROUND; BOOKKEEPERS, CASHIERS, PEOPLE WHO ARE INVOLVED IN A

                    FINANCIAL ROLE OF SOME KIND BUT WHERE THE EMPLOYER IS NOT SUBJECT TO

                    SEC REGULATIONS.  AND IN THOSE INSTANCES THE POTENTIAL EMPLOYER OR

                    EMPLOYER COULD NOT REQUEST OR USE A CREDIT REPORT IN EVALUATING THE

                    EMPLOYEE.  AM I RIGHT?

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.

                                         99



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  AND THERE'S A REASON FOR THAT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  WELL, WHY DON'T YOU GIVE ME

                    THE RATIONALE FOR THAT.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  WOULD YOU --

                                 MS. WALSH:  YEAH, GO AHEAD.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  -- LIKE ME TO EXPLAIN THE REASON?  I

                    DON'T HAVE TO.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WELL --

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  THERE ARE A FEW REASONS.  ONE IS

                    THE CREDIT REPORTS OFTEN HAVE MISTAKES, SERIOUS MISTAKES.  AND WE'RE

                    NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT A SMALL NUMBER OF THE CREDIT REPORTS, BUT RATHER A

                    SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF THE CREDIT REPORTS.  THAT'S BEEN PROVEN TIME AND

                    TIME AGAIN.  TO THE TUNE OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, THERE ARE MISTAKES IN

                    THOSE CREDIT REPORTS AND IT WOULD BE UNFAIR TO THE PEOPLE TO MAKE AN

                    EMPLOYMENT DECISION BASED ON A CREDIT REPORT WHICH HAS MISTAKES.  BUT

                    SECONDLY, THERE IS NOT THE SLIGHTEST INDICATION WHATSOEVER THAT A BAD

                    CREDIT HISTORY HAS ANY CONNECTION TO JOB PERFORMANCE FOR BETTER OR

                    WORSE.  THERE'S JUST NO CONNECTION.  THERE'S NO CORRELATION AT ALL.  AND

                    VERY OFTEN WHAT HAPPENS IS THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE, I GUESS YOU

                    WOULD CALL THEM SOMETIMES "UNFORTUNATE VICTIMS."  PEOPLE WHO RUN UP

                    MEDICAL BILLS WHO DON'T HAVE INSURANCE, BUT, YOU KNOW, NONETHELESS

                    HAVE MEDICAL BILLS SOMETIMES DUE TO LIFE OR DEATH SITUATIONS, AND

                    THEREFORE, THEY HAVE BAD CREDIT HISTORY.  OR PERHAPS A YOUNG PERSON

                    WHO HAS A -- A VERY LARGE AMOUNT OF STUDENT LOANS THAT THEY HAVEN'T

                    PAID OFF YET.  SO SIMPLY BECAUSE SOMEBODY OWES MONEY, DOESN'T MEAN

                                         100



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THEY WON'T DO A GOOD JOB AT WHATEVER JOB IT IS THAT THEY'RE LOOKING TO

                    GET.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU, MR. DINOWITZ.

                                 MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU.  SO, NEW YORK STATE IS AN

                    AT-WILL EMPLOYMENT STATE.  AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS THAT THERE IS THE

                    NOTION OF A CONTRACT BETWEEN THE EMPLOYER, POTENTIAL EMPLOYER AND THE

                    EMPLOYEE.  WHEN I WAS PRACTICING IN THE AREA OF PRIVATE SECTOR LABOR

                    LAW, THE WAY IT WAS EXPLAINED TO ME IS THAT AN INDIVIDUAL CAN BE FIRED

                    FOR A GOOD REASON, A BAD REASON OR NO REASON AS LONG AS IT'S NOT AN

                    ILLEGAL REASON.  AND THE -- THE CONVERSE IS TRUE IN THE SENSE THAT IT'S AN

                    AT-WILL HIRING SITUATION AS WELL.  PRIVATE EMPLOYERS HAVE AN ABILITY TO

                    TAKE A LOOK AT POTENTIAL EMPLOYEES, EVALUATE THEM, AND THEY HAVE THE

                    FREEDOM TO TRY TO GATHER RELEVANT INFORMATION, INFORMATION THAT THEY

                    BELIEVE IS RELEVANT TO MAKE THE VERY BEST HIRING DECISION THAT THEY CAN.

                    AND THEY KNOW BEST WHAT THE NEEDS OF THEIR PARTICULAR BUSINESS IS.

                    THEY KNOW WHETHER THAT INDIVIDUAL WOULD BE TASKED WITH MANNING A

                    CASH REGISTER, BALANCING BOOKS OR PERHAPS WORKING IN SOME TYPE OF

                    FIELD OR JOB WITHIN THAT EMPLOYER WHERE A GREAT DEAL OF DISCRETION AND

                    TRUST IS VERY IMPORTANT TO THAT EMPLOYER.  AND IN THOSE INSTANCES, I

                    DON'T BELIEVE IT'S FAIR TO HAVE THE STATE TELL AN EMPLOYER THAT THEY CAN'T

                    CONSIDER INFORMATION LIKE A CREDIT REPORT WHICH COULD SHOW SOME

                    TELLTALE SIGNS, PERHAPS, OR AN -- AN INDICATION THAT AT LEAST IN THE CASE OF

                    A POTENTIAL EMPLOYER WOULD MAYBE TRIGGER THAT EMPLOYER TO ASK THE

                                         101



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    EMPLOYEE FOR A FURTHER EXPLANATION BEFORE ISSUING AN OFFER TO EMPLOY

                    THAT INDIVIDUAL.  WE DON'T WANT EMPLOYERS TO HAVE TO SUFFER THE

                    DAMAGE, THE REALLY GRIEVOUS DAMAGE THAT COULD COME IF YOU MAKE THE

                    MISTAKE OF HIRING AN INDIVIDUAL WHO ENDS UP EMBEZZLING A HUGE SUM OF

                    MONEY, PILFERS AND DAMAGES THAT COMPANY.  WE KNOW THAT NEW YORK

                    BUSINESSES HAVE ENOUGH TROUBLE BEING BUSINESSES IN NEW YORK

                    WITHOUT PUTTING THAT ADDITIONAL BURDEN ON THEM.  BUT AGAIN, THE IDEA

                    THAT I KEEP COMING BACK TO IS THAT THE BASIC IDEA IS THAT PARTIES ARE FREE

                    TO CONTRACT WITH EACH OTHER.  BUT THE EMPLOYER SHOULD HAVE THE ABILITY

                    TO MAKE REASONABLE INQUIRIES, AND I DO BELIEVE THAT A CREDIT REPORT,

                    REQUIRING A CREDIT REPORT, PARTICULARLY IN THESE INSTANCES WHERE

                    DISCRETION AND TRUST IS REALLY PARAMOUNT TO THAT INDIVIDUAL'S JOB

                    RESPONSIBILITIES, THAT THAT INFORMATION COULD BE RELEVANT AND WE SHOULD

                    BE ALLOWING AN EMPLOYER TO MAKE THAT TYPE OF AN INQUIRY.  I THINK

                    POSSIBLY FOR THOSE REASONS, AND MAYBE THERE WERE SOME OTHERS, THE LAST

                    TIME THAT THIS BILL WAS VOTED ON WAS BACK IN 2013 AND ALSO IN 2012,

                    THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT OPPOSITION.  WE KNOW THAT THIS TIME AROUND

                    THERE'S OPPOSITION FROM ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT PLACES INCLUDING THE

                    BUSINESS COUNCIL AND FIB AND OTHERS.

                                 SO FOR THOSE REASONS, MR. SPEAKER, I'LL BE VOTING IN THE

                    NEGATIVE AND I WOULD ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 120TH

                                         102



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 116.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN GENERAL IN THE NEGATIVE.  IF ANY MEMBERS

                    WOULD LIKE TO VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE PLEASE CONTACT THE MINORITY OFFICE.

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THIS WILL BE A PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  I'M ENCOURAGING

                    MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE WITH US ON THIS ONE.  THOSE OF YOU WHO DESIRE TO

                    VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE, PLEASE CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND

                    LEAVE THAT MESSAGE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. DINOWITZ TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. DINOWITZ:  I -- I JUST WANTED TO ADD ONE THING,

                    SO I WILL EXPLAIN MY VOTE BY ADDING THIS ONE THING.  WE ARE NOW IN

                    DEPRESSION-LIKE CONDITIONS IN NEW YORK.  CAN YOU IMAGINE HOW MANY

                                         103



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    PEOPLE THERE ARE WHO'VE LOST THEIR JOB, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) WHO DEPRIVED OF

                    A JOB, THAT IS REALLY OUTRAGEOUS.  AND I DON'T HAVE TO TELL EVERYBODY

                    HERE THAT THAT KIND OF WHAT I BELIEVE IS DISCRIMINATION WOULD FALL MORE

                    ON SOME GROUPS THAN OTHERS.  I THINK IT'S MORE INCUMBENT UPON US THAN

                    EVER TO PASS THIS LEGISLATION AND NOT DISCRIMINATE AGAINST PEOPLE WHO,

                    THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN, ARE SUFFERING.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. DINOWITZ IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER, TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR FOR

                    INTRODUCING THIS LEGISLATION.  THIS IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS, MR. SPEAKER,

                    THAT OFTEN PUTS PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO MOVE FORWARD BACKWARDS.

                    LIFE IS VERY CHALLENGING IN AMERICA, NOT JUST NOW BUT EVEN IN THE PAST.

                    IT'S BEEN VERY DIFFICULT FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE.  AND TO ASSUME THAT BECAUSE

                    YOU DON'T HAVE A GOOD CREDIT RATING THAT SOMEHOW YOU'RE UNTRUSTWORTHY

                    IS NOT ALWAYS THE CASE.  SOMETIMES PEOPLE HAVE A BAD CREDIT RATING

                    BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE MONEY TO PAY FOR IT BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T HAVE A

                    JOB.  AND SO, IF YOU'RE MAKING EFFORTS TO PULL YOUR LIFE TOGETHER AND GO

                    SEEK WORK SO YOU CAN BEGIN TAKING CARE OF THINGS LIKE INCREASING YOUR

                    CREDIT RATING, FOR THAT TO BE USED TO EXCLUDE YOU FROM THAT JOB IS JUST

                    PUSHING YOU FURTHER BACK.  AND SO SOMETIMES I THINK WHEN WE TELL

                    PEOPLE THAT IF YOU WORK HARD, IF YOU DO THIS RIGHT AND YOU DO THIS RIGHT

                    AND GO GET A JOB YOU'LL BE FINE.  WELL, THEN WHEN YOU PUT ALL SORTS OF

                    CRITERIA ON WHY YOU CAN'T HAVE THE JOB BECAUSE OF SOMETHING THAT

                                         104



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    HAPPENED IN THE PAST, YOU DON'T GET ACCESS TO THAT JOB.  AND WHEN YOU

                    DON'T GET ACCESS TO THAT JOB, UNFORTUNATELY, MR. SPEAKER, SOMETIMES YOU

                    END UP STILL RELYING ON THE STATE OR THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WHEN YOU

                    SHOULD BE RELYING ON YOURSELF.  SO I'M ENCOURAGED BY US WANTING TO

                    REMOVE SOME WHAT I CALL "BARRIERS" TO EMPLOYMENT AND GIVE PEOPLE A

                    FAIR OPPORTUNITY TO TURN THEIR LIVES AROUND.  THE ASSUMPTION THAT THEY

                    WON'T IS THE REASON WHY PEOPLE STAY IN THE CONDITION THAT THEY DO.  I

                    THINK WE SHOULD TURN THE ASSUMPTION AROUND IS THAT THEY WILL.  THEY

                    WILL TAKE AN OPPORTUNITY TO TAKE THIS JOB AND DO A GOOD JOB AND MOVE

                    THEIR LIVES FORWARD.  IF THEY MOVE THEIR LIVES FORWARD, THEY'RE MOVING

                    THEIR COMMUNITIES' LIVE AND THEIR MOVING THEIR FAMILIES' LIVES FORWARD.

                                 SO I APPLAUD THE SPONSOR AND LOOK FORWARD TO VOTING

                    IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS LEGISLATION.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I

                    APPRECIATE THE COMMENTS THAT MY COLLEAGUES HAVE MADE THAT

                    SOMETIMES PEOPLE FALL ON HARD TIMES AND THEY NEED AN OPPORTUNITY TO --

                    TO START A NEW LIFE AND -- AND I -- I APPRECIATE THAT.  BUT I ALSO

                    APPRECIATE THAT THIS BILL HAS SOME EXCEPTIONS WHERE IT IS AN APPROPRIATE

                    ROLE FOR THE EMPLOYER TO LOOK AT CREDIT HISTORY.  AND WHAT I WOULD

                    SUGGEST IS THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A MIDDLE GROUND, AND I WOULD

                    RECOMMEND THAT THE SPONSOR CONSIDER ADDING SOME ADDITIONAL

                    EXCEPTIONS WHERE A CREDIT REPORT IS PARTICULARLY RELEVANT.  SO IF YOU'RE

                                         105



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AN EMPLOYER AND YOU'RE HIRING SOMEBODY WHO DOES NOT DEAL WITH A LOT

                    OF CASH OR IS NOT IN A FINANCIAL POSITION, THEN THE CREDIT REPORT IS

                    PROBABLY IRRELEVANT.  BUT IF YOU'RE AN EMPLOYER AND YOU'RE LOOKING TO

                    HIRE SOMEBODY WHO HANDLES A LOT OF CASH OR IS INVOLVED IN YOUR

                    FINANCIAL TRANSACTIONS, THEN KNOWING WHETHER THEY'RE UNDER SEVERE

                    FINANCIAL STRESS IS VERY RELEVANT BECAUSE IF YOU START LOOKING AT THOSE

                    SITUATIONS WHERE EMBEZZLEMENT HAS OCCURRED, NOT ALWAYS, BUT OFTEN,

                    EMBEZZLEMENT OCCURS WHEN PEOPLE ARE DEALING WITH CASH AND THEY'RE

                    UNDER HIGH FINANCIAL STRESS.  AND SO AN EMPLOYER OUGHT TO HAVE THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO KNOW WHETHER EMPLOYEES THAT ARE BEING ENTRUSTED WITH

                    A LARGE AMOUNT OF CASH OR TRANSACTIONS THAT INVOLVE A LOT OF CASH --

                    CASH, WHETHER OR NOT THAT EMPLOYEE IS UNDER FINANCIAL STRESS SO THAT IF

                    THEY DECIDE TO HIRE THEM THEY CAN ENSURE THERE'S APPROPRIATE PROTECTIONS

                    AND CONTROLS.  BUT I AGREE WITH THE SPONSOR THAT IF THE EMPLOYEE'S NOT

                    HANDLING CASH OR FINANCIAL TRANSACTIONS THEIR CREDIT SHOULD BE

                    IRRELEVANT.  SO I WOULD JUST ENCOURAGE THE SPONSOR IF THIS BILL COMES

                    FORWARD TO CONSIDER ADDING SOME ADDITIONAL EXCEPTIONS.  UNTIL THOSE

                    EXCEPTIONS ARE IN THERE, THOUGH, I THINK THE MORE PRUDENT APPROACH IS TO

                    ALLOW EMPLOYERS TO CHECK TO SEE IF THOSE WHO ARE HANDLING CASH ARE

                    UNDER REAL FINANCIAL STRESS.

                                 THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.  MR. GOODELL IN THE NEGATIVE.

                                 MS. GLICK.

                                 MS. GLICK:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I QUICKLY JUST

                                         106



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WANT TO SAY THAT I FIND IT INTERESTING THAT PEOPLE WHO FOR ANY NUMBER OF

                    REASONS MIGHT HAVE A BAD CREDIT RATING, ESPECIALLY THESE DAYS WITH THE

                    LOSS OF HEALTH INSURANCE AND PEOPLE FACING SERIOUS HEALTH PROBLEMS, OR

                    HAVING LOST A JOB AND BEING FACED WITH THE BURDEN OF RENT AND OTHER

                    EXPENSES THAT A BAD CREDIT RATING COULD BE A BAR TO THEM GETTING A JOB.

                    AND I THINK OF ALL OF THE PEOPLE WITH GREAT CREDIT RATINGS WHO ARE

                    RIP-OFF ARTISTS, MANY OF WHOM WHO HAVE ASPIRED TO A HIGH OFFICE.  SO I

                    APPLAUD THE SPONSOR OF THE BILL.  IT'S NOT AN INDICATION NECESSARILY OF

                    CHARACTER.  WE'VE HAD LOTS OF FOLKS WITH GREAT CREDIT RATINGS WHO JUST

                    ARE GREEDY, AND THEY ARE SUBJECT TO EMBEZZLEMENT OR VARIOUS FINANCIAL

                    MISDEEDS AND SHOULD NOT BE TRUSTED WITH ANYBODY ELSE'S MONEY BUT

                    THERE YOU HAVE IT.

                                 SO I APPLAUD THE SPONSOR AND WITHDRAW MY REQUEST

                    AND VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MS. GLICK IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. PICHARDO.

                                 MR. PICHARDO:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR

                    ALLOWING ME TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I WANT TO THANK MY COLLEAGUE FOR

                    INTRODUCING THIS IMPORTANT PIECE OF LEGISLATION.  WE ARE TALKING ABOUT

                    MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE, REGARDLESS OF STANDING, HAVE ACCESS TO

                    EMPLOYMENT AND OPPORTUNITIES.  AND I THINK IT WAS SAID EARLIER BEFORE

                    THAT IF A PERSON DOESN'T HAVE ACCESS TO SOME SORT OF EMPLOYMENT, WHAT

                    TENDS TO HAPPEN IS THAT NOW THEY'LL BE MORE DEPENDENT ON SOCIAL

                    SERVICES AND ISSUES THAT ARE GOING TO COST ALL TAXPAYERS.  I THINK WE

                                         107



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SHOULD TRY TO REMOVE AS MANY BARRIERS AS POSSIBLE TO EMPLOYMENT.

                    THAT'S FIRST AND FOREMOST.  AND SECONDLY, A CREDIT REPORT DOESN'T

                    NECESSARILY INDICATE WHETHER OR NOT A PERSON IS GOING TO BE A GOOD

                    EMPLOYEE OR NOT, A GOOD BUSINESS OWNER OR NOT.  AND I THINK IT JUST

                    CREATES MORE BARRIERS, PARTICULARLY TO PEOPLE AND INDIVIDUALS IN

                    COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, IN ORDER TO ACCESS SOME SORT OF GAINFUL

                    EMPLOYMENT AND CAREER OPPORTUNITIES DOWN THE LINE.

                                 SO I WANT TO THANK MY COLLEAGUE FOR INTRODUCING THIS

                    LEGISLATION AND I WITHDRAW MY REQUEST AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

                                 THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, SIR.  MR.

                    PICHARDO IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. BARRON.

                                 MR. BARRON:  THANK YOU.  YOU REMEMBER THE

                    COMMERCIAL, NO CREDIT?  BAD CREDIT?  WE WILL GIVE YOU MONEY ANYWAY.

                    AND THEN THE PEOPLE THINK THAT'S TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE.  IT IS.  IT WAS A

                    PREDATORY LOAN.  OR IT'S A WAY TO PUT PEOPLE IN BAD CREDIT.  PEOPLE

                    GETTING RIPPED OFF EVEN IF THEY HAVE BAD CREDIT.  SO IT'S NOT DIFFICULT FOR

                    PEOPLE, PARTICULARLY BLACK AND BROWN PEOPLE, LOW-INCOME

                    COMMUNITIES, TO HAVE BAD CREDIT.  AND MY COLLEAGUE SAID, OH, WHAT IF

                    IT'S A JOB WHERE THEY HAVE TO HANDLE CASH?  WELL, IF WE HAD CASH WE

                    WOULDN'T HAVE BAD CREDIT.  SO I'M CERTAIN THAT THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO

                    HANDLE CASH.  IT'S NOT YOUR INABILITY TO DEAL WITH CAPITAL MONEY, IT'S YOUR

                    INABILITY TO HAVE ANY THAT CAUSES THE PROBLEM.

                                         108



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THIS IS A GREAT BILL.  AND I THINK THE SPONSOR SAID IT

                    RIGHT.  THERE'S NO CORRELATION OR CAUSATION THAT CONNECTS BAD CREDIT WITH

                    YOUR INABILITY TO DO 99 PERCENT OF THE JOBS OUT HERE.  SO I THINK IT'S A

                    GOOD BILL.  I THINK WE ALL NEED TO PASS IT AND UNDERSTAND THAT ANY OTHER

                    LAYER OF DISCRIMINATION AGAINST THOSE WHO ARE STRUGGLING TO MAKE IT IN

                    THIS ECONOMY IS UNCONSCIONABLE AND UNACCEPTABLE.

                                 I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU.  MR.

                    BARRON IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MS. NIOU.

                                 MS. NIOU:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR ALLOWING

                    ME TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE VERY QUICKLY.  I JUST WANTED TO SAY THANK YOU TO

                    THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL BECAUSE IT IS A VERY THOUGHTFUL PIECE OF

                    LEGISLATION.  IT IS SO IMPORTANT THAT WE ARE ACTUALLY MAKING SURE THAT WE

                    ARE PROHIBITING THE DISCLOSURE OF THE USE OF CONSUMER CREDIT HISTORY FOR

                    EMPLOYMENT PURPOSES.  I THINK IT'S SILLY, ACTUALLY, BECAUSE I THINK THAT,

                    YOU KNOW, THERE'S SO MANY THINGS THAT CAN AFFECT CREDIT.  AND SO MANY

                    PREDATORY PRODUCTS LIKE THE FORMER -- THE PREVIOUS SPEAKER HAD JUST SAID

                    THAT ACTUALLY DRAW PEOPLE INTO A CYCLE OF DEBT, THAT PREY ON PARTICULAR

                    COMMUNITIES.  BUT ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE IS

                    THAT IF YOU ARE A RECENT IMMIGRANT, IF YOU ARE SOMEBODY WHO HAS BEEN

                    IN THE COUNTRY FOR LESS THAN TEN YEARS, YOU HAVE NO CREDIT HISTORY.  AND

                    THIS IS SOMETHING THAT IS ACTUALLY VERY IMPORTANT TO CONSIDER.  AND FOR A

                    LOT OF FOLKS WHO ARE, YOU KNOW, IN COLLEGE, A LOT OF FOLKS PROBABLY SEE

                    THAT, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES YOU GET OFFERED THESE CREDIT CARDS AT THE

                                         109



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ENTRANCE OF YOUR SCHOOL AND, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE WILL SIGN UP FOR ONE.  IT

                    DOESN'T MEAN THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY ARE -- THEY ARE PEOPLE WHO SHOULDN'T

                    BE HIRED.  THEY WERE YOUNG, THEY SIGNED UP FOR A CREDIT CARD AND THEY

                    LEARNED THEIR LESSON AND THEN THAT'S IT.  YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THE THINGS

                    THAT -- THERE ARE PREDATORY LENDERS OUT THERE, THERE ARE PREDATORY

                    PRODUCTS OUT THERE AND, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE THINGS THAT PEOPLE HAVE --

                    HAVE -- THAT HAVE AFFECTED THEIR CREDIT IN THE PAST, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN

                    THAT THEY ARE --  YOU KNOW, THEY SHOULD BE AFFECTING THEIR CREDIT IN THE

                    FUTURE OR AFFECTING THEIR EMPLOYMENT EVER.  I THINK THAT ONE OF THE

                    THINGS THAT PEOPLE ALSO HAVE SEEN IS THERE WAS A BREACH WITH IDENTITY

                    THEFT, EQUIFAX, ET CETERA.  YOU KNOW, THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT AFFECTED

                    PEOPLE'S CREDIT.  RIGHT NOW WE ARE SEEING THAT PEOPLE HAVE -- HAVE HAD

                    MEDICAL EXPENSES DUE TO COVID AND OTHER THINGS THAT HAVE BACKED UP

                    THEIR CREDIT ISSUES AND, LIKE, HAVE HAD TO TAKE OUT LOANS.

                                 I THINK THAT RIGHT NOW THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT AND

                    CONSCIENTIOUS BILL, AND I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK YOU TO THE

                    SPONSOR OF THIS BILL, AND I THINK THAT IT IS A -- A GOOD PIECE OF WORK.

                    THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MS. NIOU IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    YOU PLEASE RECORD THE FOLLOWING REPUBLICANS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS

                    BILL:  MS. MILLER AND MR. MONTESANO.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                         110



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  SO NOTED.  THANK YOU.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, OUR

                    COLLEAGUE MR. SANTABARBARA WOULD LIKE TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE

                    ON THIS ONE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  SO NOTED.  THANK YOU,

                    MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02655, CALENDAR NO.

                    118, ENGLEBRIGHT, COLTON, LIFTON, GOTTFRIED, GALEF, L. ROSENTHAL,

                    ARROYO, BUCHWALD, COOK, SIMON, SEAWRIGHT, FAHY, ABINANTI, ORTIZ,

                    QUART, CARROLL, STECK, PAULIN, DINOWITZ, TAYLOR, PEOPLES-STOKES, GLICK,

                    REYES, D'URSO, GRIFFIN, JAFFEE, LUPARDO, OTIS, WEPRIN, O'DONNELL,

                    EPSTEIN, NIOU, MOSLEY, WALKER, SIMOTAS.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE UNIFORM TREATMENT

                    OF WASTE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MR. GOODELL, AN

                    EXPLANATION?

                                 MR. GOODELL:  NO -- NO THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MR. GOODELL ON THE

                    BILL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR.

                                         111



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SPEAKER.  THIS BILL IS INTERESTING BECAUSE IT, BY STATUTE, REQUIRES ALL

                    BY-PRODUCTS, INCLUDING WASTEWATER, FROM NATURAL GAS DRILLING TO BE

                    CONSIDERED AS A HAZARDOUS WASTE IF IT MIGHT MEET THAT DEFINITION.  AND

                    THE PROBLEM WITH THAT IS -- THERE ARE SEVERAL ISSUES.  FIRST, UNDER CURRENT

                    LAW THE WASTE BY-PRODUCTS OF NATURAL GAS DRILLING ARE TYPICALLY

                    CONSIDERED AS AN INDUSTRIAL WASTE.  WHICH MEANS THEY'RE NOT FREELY

                    DISPOSED OF, THEY HAVE TO REQUIRE A PERMIT AND PROPER DISPOSAL.  BUT BY

                    ALLOWING THEM TO BE CLASSIFIED AS INDUSTRIAL RATHER THAN HAZARDOUS

                    WASTE IT ALLOWS THE NATURAL GAS COMPANIES TO ACTUALLY RECYCLE A LOT OF

                    THE BY-PRODUCTS, AND PARTICULARLY THE FLOWBACK AFTER THEY'VE FRACKED.

                    AND THIS IS A VERY POSITIVE ENVIRONMENTAL REUSE AND RECYCLING AND IT

                    WOULD BE INAPPROPRIATE TO CHANGE THAT.  SECOND, IT'S INAPPROPRIATE FOR

                    US, BY STATUTE, TO TARGET A PARTICULAR INDUSTRY.  OUR RULES SHOULD APPLY

                    EQUALLY TO EVERYBODY.  WE SHOULDN'T TARGET A PARTICULAR INDUSTRY.  IN

                    PARTICULAR, THE NATURAL GAS INDUSTRY WHICH IS VERY IMPORTANT IN MY

                    COUNTY AND IN MANY OTHER COUNTIES.  THE LAST POINT I WOULD JUST LIKE TO

                    POINT OUT.  FOR MANY OF US WE HEAT WITH NATURAL GAS.  AND IN NEW YORK

                    CITY MANY OF THE BUILDINGS HAD BEEN CONVERTING FROM FUEL OIL TO NATURAL

                    GAS BECAUSE THE NATURAL GAS BURNS SO MUCH CLEANER THAN FUEL OIL.  WE'VE

                    ALSO SEEN SOME OF OUR ELECTRICAL GENERATION FACILITIES CONVERT FROM COAL

                    OR FUEL OIL TO NATURAL GAS.  AND THERE ARE A LOT OF GREAT ENVIRONMENTAL

                    ADVANTAGES, PARTICULARLY WHEN COMPARED WITH COAL OR COMPARED TO FUEL

                    OIL.  AND WHILE OUR STATE HAS MADE A GREAT INITIATIVE TO ENHANCE AND

                    INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF GREEN POWER FROM SOLAR AND FROM WIND, THE

                    BOTTOM LINE IS WE STILL NEED BASE LOAD GENERATION THAT CAN RESPOND QUITE

                                         112



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    QUICKLY IF IT'S A COLD, STILL DARK NIGHT.  SO WE'VE RECOGNIZED THAT WHILE

                    THE GREEN ENERGY PLAYS AN IMPORTANT ROLE IN OUR ENERGY PORTFOLIO, WE

                    NEED TO HAVE RELIABILITY.  AND THAT RELIABILITY IS BEST MET BY NATURAL GAS

                    BECAUSE NATURAL GAS TURBINES CAN BE STARTED QUICKLY AND CAN ENSURE

                    RELIABILITY IN A VERY COST-EFFECTIVE MANNER.  UNFORTUNATELY, RECENTLY, AS

                    YOU -- MANY OF YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD SEVERE NATURAL GAS SHORTAGES IN

                    THE NEW YORK CITY AREA.  IN FACT THERE'S BEEN MORATORIUMS ON NEW

                    NATURAL GAS HOOKUPS, WHICH IS EXTRAORDINARILY STRESSFUL AND UPSETTING TO

                    HOMEOWNERS WHO WANT TO BE ABLE TO USE THIS SOURCE FOR HOME HEATING

                    OR FOR RESTAURANTS WHO WANT TO USE IT FOR COOKING.  AND SO RATHER THAN

                    HELPING ENCOURAGE OUR OWN NATURAL GAS RESOURCE DEVELOPMENT, WHAT

                    WE'VE DONE IS TWO-FOLD:  NUMBER ONE, WE'VE BLOCKED MOST OF THE

                    NATURAL GAS PIPELINES THAT HAVE BEEN PROPOSED, WHICH IS CREATING AN

                    EVEN GREATER NATURAL GAS CRISIS.  SECOND, WE'RE NOW IMPOSING NEW AND

                    HIGHER RESTRICTIONS ON ANY LOCALLY-PRODUCED NATURAL GAS, WHICH MEANS

                    THE NATURAL GAS WE DO IMPORT COMES FROM OTHER STATES.  AND SO WE'RE

                    TAKING MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS AND EXPORTING ALL THAT MONEY

                    AND ALL THAT JOB -- ALL THOSE JOBS AND ALL THAT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT TO

                    OUR NEIGHBORING STATES BECAUSE WE HAVE SUCH A HOSTILITY TOWARD

                    CLEAN-BURNING NATURAL GAS THAT'S PRODUCED IN OUR OWN STATE.

                                 JUST SUGGESTING, MR. SPEAKER, THAT A CHANGE THAT

                    MAKES IT EVEN MORE DIFFICULT FOR OUR OWN NATURAL GAS INDUSTRY TO

                    SURVIVE FURTHER EXACERBATES THE SHORTAGES THAT WE HAVE, AND CREATES A

                    DISTINCTION THAT APPLIES TO ONLY ONE INDUSTRY IS INAPPROPRIATE.  AND FOR

                    THAT REASON I'LL BE VOTING NO AND URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO JOIN ME.  THANK

                                         113



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE CLERK WILL RECORD

                    THE VOTE ON RULES -- ON CALENDAR NO. 118.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING NO IN GENERAL.  BUT IF THERE ARE MEMBERS THAT

                    WOULD LIKE TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS LEGISLATION, PLEASE CONTACT THE

                    MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING YES ON THIS PIECE OF

                    LEGISLATION.  THOSE DESIRING TO CAST A BALLOT NO, THEN THEY SHOULD CONTACT

                    THE OFFICE AND LET US KNOW AND WE'LL BE HAPPY TO RECORD YOU AS...

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  PLEASE

                                         114



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    RECORD THE FOLLOWING IN RANDOM ORDER AS VOTING YES:  MR. SCHMITT, MR.

                    DESTEFANO, MR. MIKULIN, MR. SMITH, MR. REILLY AND MS. MALLIOTAKIS.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  SO NOTED, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, I'M REALLY

                    PROUD OF WHERE WERE MOVING FORWARD IN THIS DEBATE.  WE HAVE JUST A

                    FEW MORE THAT WE NEED TO DO, SO IF WE JUST KEEP PLOWING THROUGH WE'LL

                    GET THERE.  SO NEXT WE'RE GOING TO GO TO PAGE 2 ON CALENDAR NO. 128,

                    146, 149 AND 154.  IN THAT ORDER, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  PAGE 22, CALENDAR

                    NO. 128, THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03076-A, CALENDAR

                    NO. 128, GOTTFRIED, DINOWITZ, GALEF, PAULIN, L. ROSENTHAL, COLTON,

                    JAFFEE, ABINANTI, D'URSO, LIFTON.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH

                    LAW AND THE INSURANCE LAW, IN RELATION TO THE DEFINITION OF CLINICAL

                    PEER REVIEWER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MR. GOTTFRIED.

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WHAT

                    THIS BILL -- THIS BILL DEALS WITH THE INTERNAL REVIEW PROCESS BY A HEALTH

                                         115



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    INSURANCE COMPANY.  IT'S A TWO-STAGE PROCESS.  INTERNAL REVIEW AND THEN

                    AN ISSUE CAN GO TO EXTERNAL APPEAL WHERE THE INSURANCE COMPANY

                    DOESN'T WANT TO PAY FOR A PARTICULAR SERVICE.  TODAY THE INTERNAL REVIEW

                    CAN BE DONE BY A COUPLE OF CATEGORIES OF HEALTHCARE PROVIDERS, BUT THE

                    EXTERNAL APPEAL REQUIRES THAT A PHYSICIAN'S OPINION BE REVIEWED BY NOT

                    ONLY ANOTHER PHYSICIAN, BUT A PHYSICIAN WHO IS IN THE SAME SPECIALITY

                    AS THE PHYSICIAN WHO IS TREATING THE PATIENT.  THIS BILL APPLIES THAT

                    STANDARD - NAMELY THAT THE PHYSICIAN BE IN THE SAME SPECIALITY - TO THE

                    INTERNAL REVIEW, NOT JUST TO THE EXTERNAL APPEAL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. GOTTFRIED.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  CERTAINLY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO JUST SO I UNDERSTAND THIS BILL.  IF

                    THE TREATING PHYSICIAN IS NOT A SPECIALIST, IS NOT BOARD CERTIFIED, WOULD

                    THIS BILL STILL REQUIRE THE INSURANCE COMPANY TO UTILIZE A BOARD-CERTIFIED

                    PHYSICIAN IN REVIEWING THAT?

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  NO.  THE REVIEWER WOULD HAVE TO

                    HAVE CREDENTIALS AT LEAST AS GOOD AS THE TREATING PHYSICIAN.  AND IF THE

                    TREATING PHYSICIAN WERE NOT IN ANY SPECIALITY OR -- OR CERTIFIED IN THAT

                    SPECIALITY, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT WOULD APPLY TO THE REVIEWING PHYSICIAN.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AS YOU KNOW, OF COURSE, WE ASK

                    OUR PHYSICIANS TO MAKE A LOT OF DIFFERENT DETERMINATIONS.  SOMETIMES

                    BEING BOARD CERTIFIED IS ALMOST A PREREQUISITE FOR THAT DETERMINATION

                                         116



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    BECAUSE IT MAY BE HIGHLY SPECIALIZED.  AT THE SAME TIME, WE OFTEN HAVE

                    A BOARD-CERTIFIED PHYSICIAN THAT MAY BE MAKING PRIMARY CARE DECISIONS.

                    IS THE TRIGGER ON THE LEVEL OF REVIEW BASED ON THE TYPE OF CARE PROVIDED

                    OR ONLY THE QUALIFICATIONS OF THE INITIAL TREATING PHYSICIAN?

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  WELL, I'LL -- I'LL READ YOU THE

                    LANGUAGE.  AND THIS IS THE LANGUAGE THAT FOR, I GUESS ABOUT 25 YEARS

                    NOW, HAS APPLIED TO EXTERNAL APPEAL.  SO IT'S NOT NEWLY-INVENTED

                    LANGUAGE.  IT'S BEEN APPLIED TO EXTERNAL APPEAL SINCE IT WAS ENACTED, I

                    THINK, IN '96.  AND WHAT IT SAYS IS THAT WHERE APPLICABLE, COMMA, THE --

                    THE PHYSICIAN IS BOARD CERTIFIED OR BOARD ELIGIBLE IN THE SAME OR SIMILAR

                    SPECIALITY AS THE HEALTHCARE PROVIDER WHO TYPICALLY MANAGES THE

                    MEDICAL CONDITION INVOLVED.  SO IF IT'S -- IT'S -- IT'S GOVERNED BY WHAT

                    KIND OF PHYSICIAN WOULD TYPICALLY MANAGE THAT CONDITION.  SO IF YOU'VE

                    GOT A BRAIN SURGEON WHO'S MAKING A DECISION ABOUT WHAT COLD MEDICINE

                    YOU OUGHT TO HAVE OR WHETHER TO PROVIDE PHYSICAL THERAPY FOR, YOU

                    KNOW, A SORE BACK, YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO HAVE ANOTHER BRAIN SURGEON

                    REVIEWING THAT TREATMENT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU.  AND THAT'S VERY

                    HELPFUL.  UNDER THE CURRENT PROCESS, THE INSURANCE COMPANY REVIEWS

                    THE PROPOSED TREATMENT AND DETERMINES IF IT'S APPROPRIATE AND WHETHER

                    IT'S COVERED.  IF THE INSURANCE COMPANY DISAGREES WITH THE DOC, THERE'S,

                    AS YOU MENTIONED, THE EXTERNAL APPEAL LAW WHICH HAS BEEN IN PLACE

                    SINCE '96, I THINK.

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  DO YOU HAVE ANY DATA ON HOW

                                         117



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MANY DECISIONS BY THE INSURANCE COMPANY GO THROUGH THE EXTERNAL

                    APPEAL PROCESS?

                                 MR. GOTTFRIED:  WHAT PERCENTAGE GET APPEALED, I

                    DON'T KNOW.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  OKAY.  THANK YOU, MR. GOTTFRIED.

                    I ALWAYS APPRECIATE YOUR -- YOUR ANSWERS AND YOUR ASSISTANCE.

                                 ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  ONE OF THE THINGS WE ALWAYS

                    WRESTLE WITH IS THE DESIRE TO BE FAIR AND APPROPRIATE WITH THE COSTS THAT

                    ARE ASSOCIATED WITH THAT TYPE OF REVIEW.  SO UNDER THE CURRENT LAW WE

                    HAVE A TWO-STEP REVIEW PROCESS.  THE INSURANCE COMPANY USES A -- A

                    PHYSICIAN TO REVIEW WHETHER OR NOT THE TREATMENT IS APPROPRIATE AND

                    WITHIN THE SCOPE OF COVERAGE, AND IF THE INSURANCE COMPANY DISAGREES

                    WITH THE TREATING PHYSICIAN, THE TREATING PHYSICIAN CAN APPEAL IT THROUGH

                    AN EXTERNAL APPEAL PROCESS.  AND THAT EXTERNAL APPEAL PROCESS REQUIRES,

                    THEN, A REVIEWING PHYSICIAN WITH AT LEAST THE SAME CREDENTIALS AS THE

                    TREATING PHYSICIAN.  SO UNDER THE CURRENT PROCESS, IF YOU WANT TO GO

                    THROUGH THE EXTERNAL APPEAL PROCESS YOU'RE GUARANTEED THAT THE REVIEW

                    WILL BE CONDUCTED BY A PHYSICIAN WITH THE SAME TYPE OF CREDENTIALS AS

                    THE TREATING PHYSICIAN.  THIS BILL WOULD REQUIRE THAT THE INITIAL REVIEW

                    BE DONE WITH THE SAME CREDENTIALS AS THE TREATING PHYSICIAN.  AND WHILE

                    THAT SOUNDS GOOD ON THE SURFACE, THE PROBLEM IS IT DRAMATICALLY

                    INCREASES THE COST TO THE INSURANCE COMPANY OF THE INITIAL REVIEW.  AND

                                         118



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THOSE COSTS ARE THEN PASSED ON TO ALL OF OUR FRIENDS AND NEIGHBORS IN THE

                    FORM OF HIGHER HEALTH INSURANCE PREMIUMS.  AND WE'RE ALL STRUGGLING

                    WITH THE COST OF HEALTH INSURANCE.  WE'RE ALL FRUSTRATED WITH HOW

                    EXPENSIVE IT IS.  AND SO ALL OF US WANT TO TRY TO KEEP THAT HEALTH

                    INSURANCE PREMIUM AS LOW AS POSSIBLE WHILE STILL ENSURING FAIRNESS.

                    AND THE CURRENT PROCESS MEETS THAT BALANCE BY PROVIDING AN INITIAL

                    REVIEW WITH A LICENSED PHYSICIAN AND AN EXTERNAL APPEAL PROCESS FOR

                    THOSE FEWER CASES THAT ARE APPEALED.  AND I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT

                    PERCENT THAT ARE APPEALED, BUT I SUSPECT IT'S RELATIVELY LOW.  AND,

                    THEREFORE, UNFORTUNATELY, WHILE I APPRECIATE THE DESIRE OF MY COLLEAGUE,

                    AS NOTED BY THE HEALTH INSURANCE ASSOCIATION AND BY BLUE CROSS/BLUE

                    SHIELD, THIS BILL IS UNDULY BURDENSOME AND WOULD DRAMATICALLY INCREASE

                    COSTS TO INSURERS, AND THOSE COSTS WOULD BE PASSED ON TO OUR FRIENDS,

                    NEIGHBORS, EMPLOYERS AND COLLEAGUES.  SO WE'RE TRYING TO BALANCE BEING

                    FAIR.  WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP OUR INSURANCE PREMIUMS AS LOW AS POSSIBLE,

                    AND I THINK THE CURRENT LAW DOES IT.  AND UNFORTUNATELY, I THINK THIS

                    WOULD INCREASE THOSE COSTS SIGNIFICANTLY, AS REPORTED BY THE HEALTH

                    INSURANCE COMPANIES, WITHOUT A CORRESPONDING INCREASE IN BENEFIT TO

                    OUR INSURERS.

                                 FOR THOSE REASONS I WILL BE OPPOSING THIS BILL.  THANK

                    YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  AND AGAIN, THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE.  I ALWAYS

                    APPRECIATE HIS THOUGHTFUL RESPONSES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 90TH

                    DAY.

                                         119



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 128.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THE

                    REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN GENERAL IN THE NEGATIVE.

                    HOWEVER, IF THERE ARE ANY MEMBERS THAT WOULD LIKE TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF

                    THIS BILL, PLEASE CALL THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND LET THEM KNOW

                    YOUR POSITION.  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 MS. WALKER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS IS A

                    PARTY VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  ANY MAJORITY MEMBER WISHING TO VOTE IN

                    THE NEGATIVE, PLEASE CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, MS.

                    WALKER.  YOUR PARTY VOTE NOTED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MS. MELISSA MILLER TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MS. MILLER:  YES, THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I'M --

                    I'M ASSUMING THAT THERE'S MORE THAN ONE DOCTOR AT THESE INSURANCE

                    COMPANIES THAT IS TASKED WITH DOING THESE INTERNAL REVIEWS.  AND I JUST

                    HAVE TO SAY, I -- I APPLAUD MR. GOTTFRIED FOR PUTTING FORTH THIS BILL.

                    HAVING BEEN THE RECIPIENT, OR AT LEAST THE MOTHER OF THE RECIPIENT OF

                    SEVERAL -- FAR TOO MANY OF THESE REVIEWS, IT WOULD BE REFRESHING IF SOME

                                         120



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    OF THESE DOCTORS THAT ARE DOING THE REVIEWS ACTUALLY HAD A CLUE ABOUT

                    THE CASE THAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY REVIEWING.  WHEN YOU HAVE A COMPLICATED

                    CHILD OR WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEBODY WHO IS JUST VERY SICK AND HAS, YOU

                    KNOW, NON-FORMULARY TREATMENTS AND MEDICATIONS AND THESE -- THE

                    DOCTORS, YOU KNOW, IT'S -- IT'S SCARY I KNOW MORE THAN THEM.  AND

                    UNLESS YOU HAVE A PERSONAL PHYSICIAN WHO IS WILLING TO DO -- CALL THEM

                    AND BEG FOR THE PEER-TO-PEER, YOU KNOW, INTERNAL PROCESS, IT WOULD JUST

                    BE A LOT EASIER IF THEY ACTUALLY HAD AN IDEA ABOUT THE -- THE ISSUES THAT

                    ARE BEING PRESENTED TO THEM.  AND LIKE I SAID, IF THERE'S MORE THAN ONE

                    DOCTOR DOING THESE REVIEWS, THEN PICK THE SPECIALITY THAT'S CLOSEST AND

                    MAYBE WE'D STAND A CHANCE.

                                 BUT, SO I WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. MILLER IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE FOLLOWING

                    MEMBERS OF THE REPUBLICAN CAUCUS WOULD LIKE TO VOTE YES ON THIS BILL,

                    AND THEY ARE:  MR. ASHBY, MR. BYRNE, MR. DESTEFANO, MR. FRIEND, MR.

                    MANKTELOW, MR. MILLER, MS. MILLER, MR. MONTESANO, MR. REILLY, MR.

                    SMULLEN, MR. DAN STEC, MR. MIKULIN AND MR. SCHMITT.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                         121



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03535-B, CALENDAR

                    NO. 146, PRETLOW, WOERNER, PHEFFER AMATO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    RACING, PARI-MUTUEL WAGERING AND BREEDING LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    ESTABLISHING THE COMMISSION ON RETIRED RACEHORSES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. PRETLOW, AN

                    EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  ABSOLUTELY, MR. SPEAKER.  WHAT

                    THIS BILL DOES IS CREATES A COMMISSION ON RETIRED RACEHORSES.  IT IS TO

                    FOLLOW, OF COURSE, AFTER THEY END THEIR CAREER RACING THROUGHOUT THEIR

                    LIFE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GARBARINO.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WILL

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR A COUPLE QUESTIONS?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. PRETLOW, WILL

                    YOU YIELD?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  I THINK I WILL.  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  THANK YOU, MR. PRETLOW.  THIS

                    COMMISSION, WHAT IS THE -- WHAT IS IT GOING TO BE DOING WITH ITS TIME?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  EXCUSE ME?

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  WHAT DOES THE COMMISSION DO?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  WHAT THE COMMISSION WILL BE

                    TASKED WITH IS TO FOLLOW THE LIFESPAN OF ALL HORSES - THAT'S ALL TATTOOED

                                         122



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    HORSES, STANDARDBRED AND THOROUGHBREDS - THROUGHOUT THEIR LIVES.

                    RACEHORSES GENERALLY HAVE -- THEY USE AN ACCOUNTING TERM, A USEFUL LIFE

                    OF FOUR YEARS, BUT THEY HAVE AN ACTUAL LIFE OF AROUND 30 YEARS.  AND THIS

                    IS TO ENSURE THAT THOSE RACEHORSES, THAT AFTER THEY'RE THROUGH RACING

                    AREN'T SHIPPED OFF TO PLACES LIKE CANADA WHERE THEY GO INTO THE FOOD

                    CHAIN AND BECOME PART OF THE -- THE MENU ON FRENCH DINING ROOM

                    TABLES AND JAPANESE DINING ROOM TABLES.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  NOW, IS THERE SOMETHING

                    IN THIS BILL THAT BANS THE SALE OF HORSES?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  NO, THE HORSES ARE NOT -- ARE NOT

                    BANNED.  THE ONLY REQUIREMENT IS THAT IF YOU WERE A OWNER OF A -- OF A

                    RACEHORSE AND YOU SOLD IT TO SOMEONE, YOU HAVE TO NOTIFY THE

                    COMMISSION WITHIN 72 HOURS OF THE SALE THAT YOU TRANSFERRED YOUR

                    OWNERSHIP OF THE HORSE TO ANOTHER INDIVIDUAL.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  NOW, THAT WAS ONE OF MY

                    QUESTIONS.  WHO DOES THE NOTIFICATION?  IS IT THE PERSON WHO SELLS?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  THE PERSON WHO SELLS THE HORSE

                    WHEN THEY TRANSFER IT TO A NEW PERSON DOES THE NOTIFICATION.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  THE WAY I READ THE BILL IT SAYS

                    ANY CHANGE IN OWNERSHIP, THE NEW OWNER HAS TO REPORT.  THAT'S -- THAT'S

                    WHY I WASN'T SURE, BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD MAKE MORE SENSE

                    AFTER SOMEBODY ALREADY HAD THE HORSE, THEY WOULD -- THE CURRENT OWNER

                    --

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  MAYBE I'M READING IT INCORRECT.  I'LL

                    CHECK ON IT.  BUT THE HORSE HAS TO BE -- THE COMMISSION HAS TO BE

                                         123



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    NOTIFIED WHEN THE HORSE IS TRANSFERRED TO A NEW OWNER.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  I MEAN, THAT WAS ONE OF

                    MY POINTS.  IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD MAKE MORE SENSE THAT IF THE -- THE

                    CURRENT OWNER WOULD REPORT IF IT WAS SELLING.  THAT'S WHY I WASN'T SURE

                    WHY THE NEW OWNER WOULD BE TASKED WITH THE REPORTING UNDER SECTION

                    712.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  NO, I READ IT DIFFERENTLY.  I JUST READ

                    IT THAT THE -- THE -- THE ORIGINAL OWNER DOES THE TRANSFER.  BUT I COULD

                    CHECK INTO THAT.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  IT SAYS ON LINE 4 THE NEW OWNER

                    OR OWNERS OF THE HORSE SHALL REPORT IT TO THE COMMISSION.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  SO, I -- I -- I -- LISTEN, I

                    -- I COMMEND WHAT THIS BILL DOES.  I THINK IT'S A GREAT IDEA.  I JUST --

                    THERE'S SOME, I THINK, SOME CHANGES THAT COULD BE -- COULD BE MET OR

                    COULD BE DONE TO THE BILL THAT --

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  WE CAN POSSIBLY TWEAK IT IN THE

                    FUTURE.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  NOW IS THERE A REASON -- THE

                    DEFINITION OF THE BILL FOR RETIRED RACEHORSES ONLY APPLIES TO NEW YORK-

                    BRED.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  YES.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  --  THOROUGHBREDS AND

                    STANDARDBREDS.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  YES.

                                         124



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  IS THERE A REASON?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  YES, I WISH I COULD DO IT

                    NATIONWIDE, BUT I DON'T HAVE THAT AUTHORITY, OR WE DON'T HAVE THE

                    AUTHORITY TO DO IT.  BUT THIS IS FOR NEW YORK-BRED HORSES AND HORSES

                    THAT ACTUALLY RESIDE IN THE STATE OF -- OF NEW YORK.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  SO IF I -- IF I WAS A HORSE OWNER

                    AND I BOUGHT A KENTUCKY-BRED THOROUGHBRED BUT I BOUGHT IT AND KEPT IT

                    HERE MY ENTIRE -- ITS ENTIRE CAREER, WE COULDN'T --

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  THIS IS ONLY NEW YORK-BRED

                    HORSES.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  AND THAT'S -- IS THAT

                    BECAUSE WE -- WE JUST -- WE DON'T HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO IT?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  WE DON'T HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO

                    IT.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  NOW, DOES THIS ONLY ALSO

                    APPLY IF THE HORSE IS SOLD TO A NEW YORK RESIDENT?  IS THAT THE ONLY --

                    DO YOU ONLY -- YOU ONLY HAVE TO REPORT THE SALE IF IT'S A -- GOES TO A NEW

                    YORK RESIDENT OR IS IT ALL OVER?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  I'M SORRY, MR. GARBARINO.  SAY IT

                    AGAIN, PLEASE.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  DO YOU HAVE TO REPORT THE SALE

                    -- DOES THIS LAW ONLY APPLY IF THE -- THE NEW OWNER IS A NEW YORK STATE

                    RESIDENT?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  YES.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  SO IF -- IF A NEW YORK

                                         125



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    STATE RESIDENT CURRENTLY OWNS A HORSE, A NEW YORK THOROUGHBRED HORSE

                    AND THEY SELL IT TO SOMEBODY IN NEW JERSEY, THE COMMISSION WOULD

                    LOSE -- COULD LOSE TRACK OF THAT HORSE?

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  YES.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.

                                 MR. PRETLOW:  WE CAN ONLY KEEP TRACK OF HORSES

                    THAT ARE -- THAT START THEIR LIVES IN NEW YORK AND REMAIN IN NEW YORK.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  OKAY.  ALL RIGHT.  THANK YOU,

                    MR. PRETLOW.

                                 ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  MR. SPEAKER, I -- I THINK THIS

                    BILL IS WELL-INTENTIONED.  I DON'T THINK ANYBODY WANTS TO SEE THESE

                    MAJESTIC ANIMALS SOLD INTO THE FOOD CHAIN.  I -- I KNOW THE CURRENT NEW

                    YORK STATE THOROUGHBRED ASSOCIATION AND THE BREEDERS ASSOCIATION

                    SPEND OVER HALF-A-MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR ON AFTERCARE EFFORTS FOR HORSES.

                    I KNOW THEY'VE RETIRED I THINK OVER 470 HORSES SINCE 2013.  I KNOW THE

                    INDUSTRY ALREADY PUTS A LOT INTO THIS, AND I THINK THIS BILL COULD BE --

                    THERE'S SEVERAL ISSUES THAT COULD BE ADDRESSED.  I -- I'M GOING TO SUPPORT

                    IT.  I THINK THE -- THE IDEA IS -- IS GREAT, PROTECTING THESE HORSES.  BUT I

                    THINK THERE'S SOME ISSUES IN THE BILL THAT HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED SO THAT

                    HORSES ARE PROTECTED AND KEPT OUT OF THE FOOD CHAIN.

                                 THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                         126



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT APRIL 1ST,

                    2021.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 146.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MS. WOERNER TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MS. WOERNER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I JUST

                    WANT TO TAKE A MOMENT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR FOR HIS LEADERSHIP ON

                    THIS VERY IMPORTANT ISSUE.  OUR EQUINE ATHLETES ARE RUNNING IN SARATOGA

                    RIGHT NOW, AND SOME OF THEM WILL RETIRE AFTER THIS SEASON.  AND IT REALLY

                    IS IMPORTANT THAT WE KEEP TRACK OF THE HORSES AS THEY ENTER INTO THEIR

                    LATER CAREERS, AND WE WANT TO PROTECT AGAINST THE POTENTIAL FOR THEM TO

                    BE ENTERING INTO THE FOOD CHAIN.

                                 SO I WANT TO THANK THE SPONSOR AGAIN FOR HIS WORK ON

                    THIS ISSUE.  IT IS A -- IT'S A PLEASURE TO VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE FOR THIS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. WOERNER IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GARBARINO TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GARBARINO:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  AS I

                    SAID I'M GOING TO BE VOTING TO SUPPORT THIS BILL.  I JUST WANT TO

                    COMMEND THE SPONSOR ALSO FOR THIS LEGISLATION AND ALSO A LOT OF OTHER

                    BILLS THAT HE'S DONE TO SUPPORT THE STANDARDBRED AND THOROUGHBRED

                    INDUSTRY.  I WAS THE RANKER ON RACING AND WAGERING FOR SIX YEARS, AND

                                         127



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    I DON'T THINK ANYBODY HAS DONE MORE IN THIS STATE FOR HORSE RACING OR

                    JUST THOROUGHBRED OR STANDARDBRED, THE INDUSTRY, WHETHER IT'S THE RACING

                    OR BREEDING, THAN THE CHAIRMAN, MR. PRETLOW.  SO I WANT TO COMMEND

                    HIM FOR THIS BILL AND THANK HIM FOR, YOU KNOW, BEING SUCH A GREAT

                    CHAIRMAN FOR ALL THOSE YEARS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GARBARINO IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03654, CALENDAR NO.

                    149, PRETLOW, ABINANTI.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO PROHIBITING APPROVED ORGANIZATIONS IN THE CHILD HEALTH

                    INSURANCE PLAN FROM LIMITING THE PARTICIPATION OF CERTAIN HEALTH CARE

                    PROVIDERS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 149.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                         128



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03832, CALENDAR NO.

                    154, MCDONALD, GALEF, STIRPE, FAHY, STECK, MONTESANO, CRESPO,

                    SIMON, CAHILL, M. G. MILLER, COLTON, BLAKE, GOTTFRIED, MORINELLO,

                    ASHBY, PICHARDO, ARROYO, LUPARDO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC

                    BUILDINGS LAW, IN RELATION TO THE AUTHORITY OF THE COMMISSIONER OF

                    GENERAL SERVICES TO LEASE PUBLIC BUILDINGS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. MCDONALD, AN

                    EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED.

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THE

                    PURPOSE OF THIS BILL IS TO REQUIRE THE DISCLOSURE OF THE NAMES AND THE

                    RESIDENTIAL ADDRESSES OF THE NATURAL PERSONS WHO ARE THE MEMBERS, THE

                    MANAGERS OR OTHERWISE AUTHORIZED PERSONS OF A LIMITED LIABILITY

                    COMPANY, OTHERWISE KNOWN AS AN LLC, WHEN SUCH LLC EXECUTES A

                    LEASE AGREEMENT IN WHICH THE STATE OF NEW YORK IS A TENANT.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  WOULD THE

                    SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  I WOULD BE HAPPY TO.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. MCDONALD

                    YIELDS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. MCDONALD.  NOW,

                    THIS BILL ONLY APPLIES TO LLCS THAT ARE LEASING PROPERTY OF THE STATE OF

                    NEW YORK; IS THAT CORRECT?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THAT'S CORRECT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AND IT DOESN'T APPLY TO

                                         129



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CORPORATIONS?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  IT DOES NOT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO IF YOU FORM AN LLC, YOU'D HAVE

                    TO DISCLOSE ALL THE MEMBERS' NAMES AND RESIDENTIAL ADDRESSES, BUT IF YOU

                    FORM AN S CORPORATION WITH THE SAME MEMBERS, YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO

                    REPORT ANYTHING?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THAT'S CORRECT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WHY?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  WELL, FIRST OF ALL, THE MAJORITY OF

                    PROPERTIES THAT THE STATE LEASES - FOR SOME REASON, I CAN'T EXPLAIN WHY -

                    TENDS TO BE WITH LLCS.  BUT THE OTHER ASPECT IS THIS, AND I KNOW MANY

                    OF THE COLLEAGUES APPRECIATE THIS, IS THAT SOMETIMES WE TAKE THIS FULL,

                    BOMBASTIC APPROACH AND INCLUDE EVERYBODY IN THE LEGISLATION.  I

                    THOUGHT IT WOULD BE BEST JUST TO START OFF SMALL AND BE INCREMENTAL AND

                    SEE HOW IT WORKS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, IF THESE LLCS CONVERT TO S

                    CORPORATIONS, THEN THEY CAN AVOID ANY REPORTING REQUIREMENTS?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT

                    THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO DO IF THEY CHOOSE TO DO SO.  I'M SURE, AND YOU'RE

                    PROBABLY MUCH MORE ADEPT AT THIS THAN I AM, THAT THERE'S REASONS WHY

                    INDIVIDUALS FORM LLCS, AND THEY SERVE A GOOD PURPOSE IN MANY

                    ASPECTS.  IF THEY WANT TO GO TO THOSE TYPE OF LENGTHS TO AVOID DISCLOSURE,

                    THAT'S UP TO THEM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I NOTE THAT YOUR -- THIS BILL WOULD

                    REQUIRE THE NAMES AND RESIDENTIAL ADDRESSES.  IS THERE A REASON WHY

                                         130



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    YOU'RE ASKING FOR THE RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS OF THE LLC OWNERS AS OPPOSED

                    TO THEIR BUSINESS ADDRESS?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  WE WANT TO HAVE FULL DISCLOSURE

                    OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE WILLING TO ENGAGE IN DOING BUSINESS WITH

                    THE STATE OF NEW YORK.  AS I MAY HAVE MENTIONED IN YEARS PAST, MANY

                    PEOPLE KNOW THAT I OWN A PHARMACY.  THEY KNOW THAT AS PART OF BEING

                    A LICENSED ENTITY IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, I HAVE TO GIVE MY BUSINESS

                    ADDRESS, BUT ALSO MY RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS.  AS BEING A LOTTO OR LOTTERY

                    RE-SELLER, I HAVE TO GIVE MUCH MORE INFORMATION, INCLUDING ALL MY

                    PERSONAL INFORMATION.  AND YOU CAN SEE THE COMMON THEME HERE, IF

                    ONE'S GOING TO DO BUSINESS WITH THE STATE OF NEW YORK, THERE NEEDS TO

                    BE TO FULL DISCLOSURE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  OF COURSE --

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  AND IF I COULD JUST MENTION ONE

                    MORE THING, MR. GOODELL.  I GO BACK TO MY DAYS AS MAYOR WHEN I USED

                    TO DEAL WITH LLCS, PARTICULARLY DEALING WITH TROUBLESOME PROPERTIES

                    AND ABANDONED PROPERTIES AND, AS YOU KNOW, NOBODY HERE SUPPORTS

                    BLIGHT, BUT IT WAS EXTREMELY FRUSTRATING WHEN I WAS A MAYOR TRYING TO

                    HAVE A CORPORATION COUNCIL WORK WITH THE PROPERTY OWNERS, WE WOULD

                    GET A BUSINESS ADDRESS.  AND, IN MANY SITUATIONS, A BUSINESS ADDRESS

                    HAD NOBODY THERE.  SO, I THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, IF WE ARE GOING TO TRULY --

                    BE TRUE ABOUT THE LEGISLATION, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE

                    ACCESS TO THE INDIVIDUALS AND KNOW WHO THEY ARE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I CAN CERTAINLY RELATE TO THE

                    FRUSTRATION ON HAVING A BUSINESS ADDRESS WITH NO ONE THERE, BECAUSE

                                         131



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THIS WEEK THAT'S THE CASE IN MY BUSINESS, SINCE I'M HERE.  BUT, AS YOU

                    KNOW, SOMETIMES MEMBERS OF AN LLC, JUST LIKE SHAREHOLDERS OR OTHER

                    BUSINESS ENTITIES, ARE VERY SENSITIVE ABOUT THEIR RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS.

                    THEY MIGHT BE, FOR EXAMPLE, VICTIMS OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE, AND THEY'RE

                    VERY, VERY CAREFUL ABOUT WHO KNOWS THEIR RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS AND, IN

                    FACT, WE'VE GONE TO GREAT LENGTHS IN THIS LEGISLATURE TO PROTECT VICTIMS

                    OF DOMESTIC VIOLENCE BY PROVIDING FOR ALTERNATIVE NOTIFICATION

                    PROCESSES, AND A NUMBER OF OTHER MEASURES SPECIFICALLY TO PROTECT

                    THEM.  IS THERE ANY PROTECTION FOR THOSE WHO MIGHT NEED TO KEEP THEIR

                    RESIDENTIAL ADDRESSES CONFIDENTIAL FOR A LEGITIMATE REASON?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THE BILL IS WRITTEN IN SUCH A WAY

                    THAT IT GIVES OGS THE OPPORTUNITY, THROUGH REGULATIONS, TO ADDRESS

                    THOSE CONCERNS THAT YOU BRING UP.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO YOU BELIEVE UNDER THIS BILL

                    LANGUAGE, OGS COULD ACTUALLY WAIVE THE REQUIREMENT FOR A RESIDENTIAL

                    ADDRESS?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  I THINK THEY WOULD HAVE, IN

                    EXTREME SITUATIONS -- NOT -- I SHOULDN'T SAY "EXTREME", IN CERTAIN

                    SITUATIONS LIKE YOU MENTIONED, YES, THEY WOULD HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY

                    THROUGH REGULATIONS TO -- TO LAY THAT OUT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT'S

                    ALWAYS INTERESTING IS THAT SOMETIMES LLCS HAVE, AS A MEMBER, A

                    CORPORATION.  AND THIS BILL STATES THAT IF THE LLC MEMBER IS A

                    CORPORATION, THEN YOU MUST DISCLOSE THE NAME AND RESIDENTIAL ADDRESSES

                    OF THE SHAREHOLDERS OF THAT CORPORATION, CORRECT?

                                         132



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  IS THERE ANY EXCEPTION FOR A

                    PUBLICLY-TRADED CORPORATION, OR A CORPORATION THAT HAS, PERHAPS,

                    HUNDREDS OR THOUSANDS OF SHAREHOLDERS?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  YOU KNOW, THE INTENTION OF THE

                    LANGUAGE IS TO HAVE FULL DISCLOSURE OF ALL THE MEMBERS.  I UNDERSTAND

                    WHAT YOU'RE SAYING WHEN A CORPORATION -- I THINK IN PAST DEBATES WE'VE

                    HAD DISCUSSIONS ABOUT GE CAPITAL FINANCE AND BASICALLY ASSUMING A --

                    A -- A -- A MORTGAGE OF SOME SORT OR WHATEVER IT MAY BE, OR PROPERTY.

                    OGS WOULD HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DEAL WITH THOSE TYPE OF EXCEPTIONS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YES, AND YOU GAVE A GREAT EXAMPLE

                    HOW THAT MIGHT OCCUR.  YOU MIGHT ACTUALLY HAVE A WELLS FARGO THAT

                    FORECLOSES ON AN LLC OWNERSHIP THAT WAS PUT UP AS COLLATERAL FOR A

                    LOAN --

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- AND WE MOST ASSUREDLY DON'T

                    WANT TO HAVE OGS DISCLOSE, OR FORCE WELLS FARGO --

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  MM-HMM.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  -- OR ANY MAJOR BANK OR ANY MAJOR

                    CORPORATION TO DISCLOSE THEIR THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF SHAREHOLDERS.

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  AND, TO YOUR POINT - AND IT'S A

                    VALID POINT - IN THOSE SITUATIONS, THOSE FORECLOSURES PROBABLY OCCUR

                    AFTER THE -- THE LEASE HAS BEEN EXECUTED AND, THEREFORE, OGS, THROUGH

                    ITS REGULATIONS, CAN ADDRESS THOSE SITUATIONS, HOPEFULLY RARE, BUT ONE

                    NEVER KNOWS.

                                         133



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL:  YOU'VE MENTIONED THAT OGS WOULD

                    HAVE THAT REGULATORY AUTHORITY, WHICH I THINK IS -- IS REALLY A GREAT IDEA.

                    CAN YOU POINT OUT WHERE THAT LANGUAGE IS IN THIS BILL?

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  I HAVE TO FIND MY BILL.  IT'S IN

                    HERE SOMEWHERE.

                                 (PAUSE)

                                 I DON'T HAVE THE SPECIFIC PART, BUT THE INTENT OF THIS

                    LEGISLATION HAS ALWAYS BEEN TO GIVE OGS THE, YOU KNOW, THE AUTHORITY

                    TO PROTECT CERTAIN THINGS, AS YOU MENTIONED EARLIER IN REGARDS TO

                    DOMESTIC VIOLENCE AND REGARDS TO THESE RARE SITUATIONS.  WE DON'T WANT

                    TO INTERRUPT LEASES BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION.  AS YOU KNOW,

                    THIS LEGISLATION IS PROSPECTIVE SO THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD TAKE

                    EFFECT IMMEDIATELY UPON PASSAGE, BUT AT THE SAME TOKEN, IT'S FOR LEASES

                    GOING FORWARD.  AND I THINK IT SPEAKS TO WHAT THE UNDERLYING THEME HAS

                    BEEN ALL ALONG:  IF YOU WANT TO ENGAGE IN BUSINESS WITH THE STATE OF

                    NEW YORK, YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARED TO EXPECT THAT THERE'LL BE A LEVEL OF

                    DISCLOSURE THAT'S GOING TO BE EXPECTED.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AND IF THIS BILL COMES BACK UP

                    BEFORE US, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO WORK WITH YOU ON THAT TYPE OF LANGUAGE

                    TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT INTENT IS CLEARLY REFLECTED IN THE STATUTORY

                    LANGUAGE.  THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR COMMENTS.  I APPRECIATE

                    THEM.

                                 MR. MCDONALD:  THANK YOU, MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE BILL, MR.

                                         134



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I'M APPRECIATIVE OF MY COLLEAGUE'S

                    DESIRE TO HAVE OGS HAVE AUTHORITY TO PROVIDE EXCEPTIONS WHERE

                    NECESSARY AND APPROPRIATE TO PROTECT VICTIMS OF DOMESTIC ABUSE FROM

                    HAVING THEIR RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS DISCLOSED, OR IN OTHER CIRCUMSTANCES

                    WHERE THAT RESIDENTIAL ADDRESS SHOULD NOT, FOR LEGITIMATE REASONS, BE

                    DISCLOSED.  AND I ALSO APPRECIATE HIS SENSITIVITY TO THE CONCERN THAT YOU

                    COULD HAVE A VERY LARGE PUBLICLY-TRADED CORPORATION BEING A MEMBER OF

                    AN LLC, AND WE CERTAINLY WOULDN'T WANT TO HAVE OGS BURDENED WITH

                    THOUSANDS OF ADDRESSES, NAMES AND ADDRESSES OF SHAREHOLDERS.

                                 THE FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEM I HAVE WITH THE BILL,

                    THOUGH, IS NOT ON THOSE TECHNICAL ASPECTS, IT'S THAT WE PULL OUT ONE

                    PARTICULAR TYPE OF BUSINESS ENTITY AND IMPOSE POTENTIALLY ONEROUS

                    DISCLOSURE REQUIREMENTS ON THAT ONE ENTITY.  SO, WE SAY IF YOU'RE AN

                    LLC, YOU'VE GOT TO LAY OUT EVERYONE WHO HAS ANY OWNERSHIP INTEREST

                    NO MATTER HOW REMOTE, BUT IF YOU'RE AN S CORPORATION, NO NEED FOR ANY

                    DISCLOSURE; IF YOU'RE A C CORPORATION, NO NEED FOR ANY DISCLOSURE; A

                    LIMITED PARTNERSHIP, A REAL ESTATE INVESTMENT TRUST OR ANY OTHER TYPE OF

                    ENTITY.

                                 NOW, FOR THOSE WHO DON'T FOLLOW POLITICS REALLY

                    CLOSELY, I SUSPECT, IT'S JUST A SUSPICION, THAT THIS ALL GOES BACK TO A TIME

                    UNDER OLD LAW WHERE LLCS COULD GIVE MORE MONEY TO THE CAMPAIGNS

                    THAN CORPORATIONS.  CORPORATIONS WERE LIMITED TO THE AGGREGATE OF

                    $5,000 TOTAL IN ANY ELECTION CYCLE, WHEREAS LLCS COULD GIVE MUCH

                    MORE.  BUT THAT LLC LOOPHOLE, AS IT WAS REFERRED TO, HAS BEEN CLOSED.

                                         135



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AND WITH THE CLOSURE OF THAT LOOPHOLE, I THINK THE UNDERLYING RATIONALE

                    FOR THIS BILL WAS, LIKEWISE, CLOSED.  AND SO, I APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUE'S

                    COMMENTS AND HIS SENSITIVITY TO SOME OF THESE ISSUES, BUT IN ITS CURRENT

                    FORM, I CAN'T SUPPORT IT.  THANK YOU SO MUCH, SIR, AND THANK YOU TO MY

                    COLLEAGUE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 154.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE

                    POSITION IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE

                    NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE WILL GENERALLY BE VOTING NO.  IF THERE'S A MEMBER THAT

                    WOULD LIKE TO VOTE YES, PLEASE CONTACT THAT MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                    THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 MS. WALKER.

                                 MS. WALKER:  GOOD EVENING, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS IS

                    A PARTY VOTE.  ANY MAJORITY MEMBER WISHING TO VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE,

                    PLEASE CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.  SO

                    NOTED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                         136



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  PLEASE RECORD THE

                    FOLLOWING REPUBLICAN MEMBERS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS:  MR.

                    MORINELLO, MR. MONTESANO, MR. SCHMITT AND MR. SMULLEN.  THANK YOU,

                    SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  YOU'RE WELCOME.

                                 MS. WALKER.

                                 MS. WALKER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    YOU PLEASE RECORD MR. VANEL IN THE NEGATIVE.  PLEASE, MR. SPEAKER,

                    RECORD MR. VANEL IN THE NEGATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  CERTAINLY.  SO NOTED.

                                 MR. GOODELL, ARE YOU...

                                 MR. GOODELL:  PLEASE RECORD THE FOLLOWING

                    ADDITIONAL REPUBLICAN MEMBERS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE:  MR. NORRIS, MR.

                    WALCZYK AND MR. ASHBY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.  THANK

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MS. WALKER.

                                 OH, MAYBE NOT.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 NOW MS. WALKER.

                                 MS. WALKER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WE CAN

                                         137



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CONTINUE ON DEBATE WITH THE NEXT THREE BILLS:  CALENDAR NO. 165, WHICH

                    IS ON PAGE 27; CALENDAR NO. 183, WHICH IS ON PAGE 29 AND CALENDAR

                    NO. 192, WHICH IS ON PAGE 30.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  CALENDAR NO. 165, THE

                    CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A04310, CALENDAR NO.

                    1 -- 165, AUBRY.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE CORRECTION LAW AND THE PUBLIC

                    HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO BIRTH CERTIFICATES FOR INMATES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  AN EXPLANATION HAS

                    BEEN REQUESTED BY MS. WALSH.

                                 MR. AUBRY.

                                 JUST A SECOND.  WE NEED TO ACTIVATE YOU, MR. AUBRY.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  I WANT TO BE ACTIVATED, NOT AGITATED, SO

                    LET'S PROCEED.  THIS BILL IS TO AMEND THE CORRECTION LAW AND THE PUBLIC

                    HEALTH LAW.  IT IS TO ENSURE THE ACCURACY OF INMATE BIRTH CERTIFICATES

                    AND TO ENSURE PERSONS RELEASED FROM PRISON HAVE STATE-ISSUED

                    IDENTIFICATIONS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR A FEW

                    QUESTIONS?

                                 MR. AUBRY:  ABSOLUTELY, I WILL YIELD.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU SO MUCH.

                                 SO THIS BILL KIND OF EXPANDS -- MY READING OF IT IS THAT

                    IT EXPANDS SOMETHING THAT DOCS IS ALREADY DOING.  DOCS IS ALREADY

                    TRYING TO GET BIRTH CERTIFICATES FOR INMATES WHO ARE -- ARE MAKING

                                         138



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DILIGENT EFFORTS FOR INMATES THAT ARE CURRENTLY INCARCERATED; ISN'T THAT

                    RIGHT?

                                 MR. AUBRY:  I BELIEVE THAT'S WHAT DOCS SAYS, YES.

                                 MS. WALSH:  YEP.  SO THIS -- THIS BILL -- THEN MY

                    UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THIS BILL SAYS THAT IN SOME INSTANCES YOU -- THE

                    BIRTH CERTIFICATES GOT SOME MISTAKES ON IT AND NEEDS TO BE CORRECTED AND

                    THAT THE CORRECTED BIRTH CERTIFICATE IS WHAT THE INMATE THAT'S LEAVING

                    NEEDS IN HAND IN ORDER TO PROPERLY REINTEGRATE INTO THE COMMUNITY, AND

                    THAT'S WHAT IS ENVISIONED BY THIS BILL, A REQUIREMENT THAT DOCS TAKE

                    THAT ADDITIONAL STEP TO TRY TO GET A CORRECTED BIRTH CERTIFICATE; IS THAT A

                    CORRECT READING?

                                 MR. AUBRY:  THAT IS A ACCURATE READING.  CERTAINLY,

                    WE RECOGNIZE THAT IN OUR EFFORT TO ENSURE THAT INDIVIDUALS WHO HAD BEEN

                    INCARCERATED ARE GIVEN THE BEST POSSIBLE OPPORTUNITY TO BE SUCCESSFUL

                    ON THE OUTSIDE, NOT TO RECIDIVATE, NOT FOR THE STATE AND THE COMMUNITY

                    TO SUFFER THAT BURDEN ON THEMSELVES.  WE ARE TRYING TO DO EVERYTHING

                    THAT WE CAN TO ENSURE THEY HAVE THE DOCUMENTATION.  VERY SMALL ISSUE,

                    MAKING SURE YOU HAVE ACCURATE INFORMATION THAT IDENTIFIES YOURSELF

                    GIVES YOU AN OPPORTUNITY TO BE SUCCESSFUL IN READJUSTING YOUR LIFE.

                                 SO, WHAT WE WANT TO DO IS TO DO EVERYTHING THAT WE

                    CAN TO ENSURE THAT THAT IS HAPPENING AND THAT THEY DON'T GET CAUGHT UP

                    WITH THE PROBLEM OF INADEQUATE IDENTIFICATION AND, CERTAINLY, WE KNOW

                    THAT INDIVIDUALS SOMETIMES WHO HAVE BEEN INCARCERATED FOR LONG

                    PERIODS OF TIME DON'T HAVE THAT INFORMATION AVAILABLE.  SOMETIMES THAT

                    INFORMATION IS NOT AVAILABLE AT ALL AND THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH SEVERE

                                         139



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    PROCESSES TO GET THAT.  SO THIS BILL WORKS TO, YOU KNOW, TO -- TO

                    ENCOURAGE DOCS TO DO EVERYTHING THEY CAN, NOT JUST BY THEIR OWN

                    POLICIES, BUT BY LAW.

                                 MS. WALSH:  VERY GOOD.  AND SO, I JUST HAVE A

                    COUPLE QUESTIONS TO TRY TO THINK ABOUT WHAT THIS ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENT

                    WOULD REQUIRE DOCS IN TERMS OF TIME, ENERGY, MANPOWER, PERHAPS, OR

                    FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS.  CAN YOU SPEAK TO, FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU'VE GOT AN

                    INMATE WHO -- WHOSE BIRTH CERTIFICATE WOULD BE FROM OUT-OF-STATE OR

                    MIGHT BE A FOREIGN BIRTH CERTIFICATE, THIS BILL WOULD STILL REQUIRE THAT

                    DOCS MAKE DILIGENT EFFORTS TO TRY TO COME UP WITH A CORRECTED BIRTH

                    CERTIFICATE.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  ABSOLUTELY.  AND DOCS ALREADY

                    REQUIRES ITS COUNSELORS TO DO THIS KIND OF WORK.  THAT'S WHY THEY'RE

                    EMPLOYED.  THEY'RE NOT COMING OFF OF ANOTHER JOB DOING THIS.  THEY'RE

                    REQUIRED TO WORK WITH THOSE WHO ARE GOING TO BE RELEASED TO ENSURE

                    THAT THEY HAVE THE MAXIMUM OPPORTUNITY FOR A SUCCESSFUL RELEASE.  SO,

                    THIS FALLS WITHIN THE PURVIEW OF THE EMPLOYMENT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE

                    ALREADY WORKING THERE.  SO, I DON'T THINK IT OVERLY BURDENS THEM TO DO

                    THE THINGS THAT THEY'RE ALREADY REQUIRED TO DO.  I THINK IT'S -- IT IS JUST AN

                    OPPORTUNITY TO ENSURE THAT WE DO EVERYTHING AND THAT NO CHANGE IN

                    ADMINISTRATION WILL CHANGE THAT PROCESS.

                                 IT HAS BEEN KNOWN NATIONALLY, AND I'VE WORKED IN

                    CORRECTIONS IN A VERY LONG TIME, THAT THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT ADD TO

                    MAKING PEOPLE SUCCESSFUL ON THE OUTSIDE, BY HAVING THE APPROPRIATE

                    INFORMATION.  I ONCE WAS FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO HAVE SOMEONE WORK FOR

                                         140



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ME WHO HAD BEEN INCARCERATED.  AND HE HAD BEEN ARRESTED, GONE TO JAIL

                    AND, IN THE MEANTIME, LOST EVERYTHING THAT HE HAD IN HIS APARTMENT

                    BECAUSE THE LANDLORD JUST TOOK IT AND THREW IT ALL AWAY.  SO, ALL OF HIS

                    DOCUMENTATION WAS GONE.  AND WHEN HE CAME BACK OUT OF HIS

                    INCARCERATION, HE ENDED UP HOMELESS BECAUSE HE HAD NOTHING TO

                    SUBSTANTIATE BOTH WHO HE WAS, WHERE HE WAS AND WHAT HE HAD DONE IN

                    THE PAST.

                                 AND SO, WE RECOGNIZE THOSE ARE REAL WORLD PROBLEMS

                    FOR FOLKS WHO ARE TRYING TO GET THEMSELVES BACK INTO SOCIETY AND

                    BECOME PRODUCTIVE AND STAY OUT OF THE WAY OF THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE

                    SYSTEM.  SO, THAT ALL OF THESE THINGS ARE PHILOSOPHICALLY WHERE THE

                    NATION GOES, THE EVANGELICAL MOVEMENT GOES, THE, YOU KNOW, ACROSS

                    THE COUNTRY WHETHER THEY'RE RED STATES OR BLUE STATES, PEOPLE WHO ARE

                    CONCERNED ABOUT THIS ISSUE TAKE THESE KIND OF MEASURES AND WE THINK

                    IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THIS STATE DOES THE SAME.

                                 MS. WALSH:  NOW, YOU MENTIONED EARLIER THAT THE --

                    IT WAS ENVISIONED THAT THE -- THE COUNSELORS THAT ARE WORKING WITH THE

                    INMATE ARE THE ONES WHO ACTUALLY GO THROUGH THE PROCESS OF TRYING TO

                    TRACK DOWN THIS DOCUMENTATION?

                                 MR. AUBRY:  YES.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO I DID A QUICK SEARCH AND IT

                    LOOKS LIKE THERE ARE CURRENTLY AROUND 54,700 INMATES IN 52 CORRECTIONAL

                    FACILITIES IN NEW YORK STATE.  ANY IDEA HOW --

                                 MR. AUBRY:  I THINK WE'RE DOWN TO LIKE 40,000

                    NOW.

                                         141



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MS. WALSH:  OH, WELL THAT'S GOOD.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  WE ARE BEING SUCCESSFUL.  AS WE

                    KNOW, THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE ALL SAID WE WANTED TO DO,

                    DECREASE THE PRISON POPULATION.  AND OBVIOUSLY, NOT EVERY ONE OF THEM

                    WILL HAVE THIS PROBLEM.  SO, WHAT WE ARE DOING IS THEN WHATEVER THAT

                    PORTION OF THAT POPULATION HAS THIS PROBLEM, SOME MAY HAVE THEIR

                    DOCUMENTATION.  THEY MAY STILL BE CONNECTED TO THEIR FAMILIES WHO

                    PROVIDE THAT KIND OF SUPPORT TO THEM SO THAT THEY HAVE.  SOME MAY

                    HAVE BROUGHT THE DOCUMENTATION WITH THEM IN SOME WAY OR ANOTHER.

                    WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT ARE PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE THAT.  SO, IT'S A MUCH

                    SMALLER NUMBER THAN THE TOTAL POPULATION AND, ERGO, IT WILL BE LESS

                    EXPENSIVE, IF THAT'S WHAT THE ISSUE IS, AND MAYBE LESS TIME CONSUMING

                    FOR STAFF BECAUSE THEY WON'T BE DEALING WITH THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE OF

                    PEOPLE WHO ARE INCARCERATED.

                                 MS. WALSH:  YEAH, SO THAT YOU -- YOU ANTICIPATED

                    KIND OF WHERE I WAS GOING WITH THAT.  I -- I WAS TRYING TO GET AN IDEA OF

                    -- OF THE SCOPE OF THE ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENT FROM THE BILL.  OUT OF

                    THOSE, SAY, 40,000 INMATES, DO WE HAVE A SENSE OF HOW MANY CASES PER

                    YEAR THERE MIGHT BE WHERE THIS ADDITIONAL DIGGING WOULD NEED TO BE

                    DONE?

                                 MR. AUBRY:  VERY HARD TO, YOU KNOW, UNDERSTAND

                    THAT BECAUSE PEOPLE WHO ARE GOING TO GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS,

                    EVERYBODY DOESN'T GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AT THE SAME TIME, RIGHT?  YOU

                    BEGIN A REENTRY PROCESS AS YOU COME INTO THE SYSTEM, AND THEN AS YOU

                    HAVE BEEN IN AND ARE STARTING TO MOVE THROUGH THE -- THE PROCESS

                                         142



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LOOKING FORWARD TO YOUR RELEASE, THEN THESE THINGS MAY BECOME MORE

                    IMPORTANT.  SO, IT'S HARD TO JUDGE WHEN, AT WHAT TIME, HOW MANY WILL BE

                    THERE, OTHER THAN WE KNOW THAT WHOEVER THEY ARE WHEN THEY ARRIVE AT

                    THAT POINT, THAT THIS IS WHAT THEY NEED.

                                 MS. WALSH:  ONE OTHER THING THAT I NOTICE IS THAT

                    UNDER THE LANGUAGE OF THIS BILL, THERE -- THERE'S GOING TO BE NO FEES

                    CHARGED TO THE INMATE FOR THIS ADDITIONAL WORK.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  RIGHT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, THAT GOT ME TO THINKING ABOUT WHAT

                    KIND OF FEES MIGHT THERE BE WHICH DOCS WOULD BE PAYING FOR TO

                    OBTAIN A CORRECTED BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  SO --

                                 MS. WALSH:  AGAIN, FIGURING THE WORST CASE

                    SCENARIO, YOU MIGHT GET SOMEBODY FROM OUT-OF-STATE OR OUT OF THE

                    COUNTRY.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  SO WE -- DOCS ALREADY PROVIDES

                    INMATES WITH A STATE ID WHEN THEY LEAVE WHICH IS GOOD FOR 90 DAYS; 90

                    DAYS, RIGHT.  HARD TO REPRODUCE YOUR INFORMATION.  AND THAT STATE ID

                    COSTS $2.20.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  A BIRTH CERTIFICATE FEE IS $15, BUT IS

                    WAIVED FOR DOCS IN CURRENT PRACTICE.  SO, WE'RE ALREADY IN THE WORKS

                    OF TAKING CARE OF THAT AND UNDERSTANDING WHAT THAT IS.  DOCS BUDGET IS

                    CURRENTLY -- IT'S IN THE BILLIONS, RIGHT, I THINK ABOUT $3 BILLION.  SO, ALL OF

                    THE THINGS THAT DOCS PAYS FOR, AND IT DOES PAY FOR A LOT; A VERY

                                         143



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    EXPENSIVE SYSTEM TO KEEP SOMEBODY INCARCERATED.  THIS WOULD BE

                    MINUSCULE RELATIVE TO WHAT THE -- THE AGENCY SPENDS.  NEVER MIND THEIR

                    CONSTRUCTION, THEIR CAPITAL BUDGET, WHICH IS JUST OUT OF THIS WORLD.  SO, I

                    THINK IN WHAT WE GET IN RETURN -- HOW MUCH DO WE SPEND PER

                    INDIVIDUAL?  SIXTY-FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS TO KEEP THEM IN, $65- A YEAR TO

                    KEEP THEM IN.  SO, WE'RE GOING TO SPEND $15 AND $2.20 ON AN

                    INDIVIDUAL TO HELP THEM STAY OUT?  I DON'T EVEN THINK -- I DON'T --

                    MATHEMATICIANS WOULD GO CRAZY TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE ODDS AGAINST

                    THAT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, I UNDERSTAND YOUR ARGUMENT, MR.

                    AUBRY.  SO, YOU'RE SAYING THAT ALTHOUGH THE BILL MEMO ITSELF SAYS,

                    "FISCAL IMPLICATION - NONE", WHICH ALWAYS KIND OF, YOU KNOW, RAISES A

                    -- A -- A RED FLAG, I GUESS, IN MY MIND; HOW COULD IT BE NONE?  BUT

                    YOU'RE SAYING THAT IN THE SCOPE OF THE TOTAL BUDGET FOR DOCS IT'S

                    MINISCULE.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  I THINK THE WORD WE USUALLY USE IS DE

                    MINIMIS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  DE MINIMIS.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  WHICH NOBODY WANTS TO HEAR, RIGHT?

                    NO.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 NO, RIGHT.  BUT I THINK WE, AS THE BILL HAS BEEN AROUND,

                    IT'S BEEN AROUND A LONG TIME, IT HAS A BEARD, YOU KNOW, WE DEVELOP

                    BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF THE FISCAL IMPLICATIONS AND ARE SO, THEREFORE,

                    BETTER ABLE TO EXPLAIN THAT TO YOU.

                                         144



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MS. WALSH:  VERY GOOD.  THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR

                    YOUR ANSWERS.

                                 MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  ON THE BILL.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, THIS BILL -- I -- I REALLY DO

                    APPRECIATE THE -- THE INTENT OF THIS SPONSOR AND ALSO HIS ANSWERS TO MY

                    QUESTIONS, BECAUSE IT DID HELP ME TO UNDERSTAND A LITTLE BIT BETTER THE

                    IMPORTANCE.  I DID GET ON THE DOCS WEBSITE, AND -- BECAUSE I WAS

                    WONDERING ABOUT WHETHER THIS TYPE OF WORK WAS REALLY CONSIDERED TO BE

                    WITHIN THE SCOPE OF DOCS MISSION, AND IT IS - HELPING AN INMATE WHO

                    IS LEAVING TO REINTEGRATE INTO SOCIETY IS PART OF DOCS MISSION.  AND IF

                    THAT REQUIRES THE ADDITIONAL -- IF THAT REQUIRES PROPER DOCUMENTATION SO

                    THAT THE INDIVIDUAL CAN OBTAIN HOUSING OR OTHER THINGS THAT ARE

                    NECESSARY UPON LEAVING, THEN I THINK THAT ALTHOUGH THERE IS A COST THAT'S

                    ASSOCIATED AND, PERHAPS, DOES TAKE COUNSELORS AWAY FROM THE OTHER

                    JOBS THAT THEY MAY BE DOING, I DO THINK THAT IT HAS VALUE.  I HAVE

                    SUPPORTED THIS BILL IN THE PAST AND I INTEND TO DO SO AGAIN.  SO, I WILL BE

                    VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND I THANK THE SPONSOR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MS.

                    WALSH.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 120TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE CLERK WILL RECORD

                    THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 165.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY MEMBER

                                         145



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE

                    MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY RECORDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. AUBRY TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. AUBRY:  CERTAINLY, MR. SPEAKER.  THANK YOU

                    FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I WAS PREPARED TO RAGE AGAINST

                    THE WIND.  I WAS PREPARED TO BRING DOWN ALL THE POWER THAT I POSSESS IN

                    AN AUDITORY FASHION TO CRACK THE CEILING, DISBARRING MY ANGER, MY

                    HEARTBROKENNESS THAT WE DID NOT SEE THIS IN A POSITIVE LIGHT.  AND NOW,

                    I HAVE NOTHING TO SAY BUT THANK YOU.

                                 (LAUGHTER/APPLAUSE)

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    AUBRY, IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  PLEASE RECORD MR.

                    BARCLAY AND MR. DIPIETRO IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS LEGISLATION.  THANK

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  SO NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A04770-A, CALENDAR

                    NO. 183, HUNTER, STECK, ARROYO, QUART, WALLACE.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    REAL PROPERTY LAW, IN RELATION TO PROHIBITING MORTGAGEES FROM

                    REQUIRING MORTGAGORS OF CERTAIN REAL PROPERTY TO PURCHASE FLOOD

                                         146



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    INSURANCE EXCEEDING CERTAIN LIMITS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED, MS. HUNTER.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  THANK YOU.  THIS BILL WOULD LIMIT A

                    HOMEOWNER'S REQUIREMENTS WHEN PURCHASING COMPULSORY FLOOD

                    INSURANCE AND PROVIDE NOTICE OF THE MINIMUM INSURANCE LIABILITY THAT IS

                    REQUIRED.  I JUST WANT TO GO ON TO SAY THE HOMEOWNER IS NOT REQUIRED BY

                    LAW TO BUY FLOOD INSURANCE THAT EXCEEDS THE OUTSTANDING AMOUNTS OWED

                    TO THE BANK OR COVERS CONTENT WITHIN THE HOME.  THIS TRANSPARENCY

                    ENSURES HOMEOWNERS ARE NOT BURDENED BY ADDITIONAL COVERAGE BY

                    INSURANCE COMPANIES AND BANKS WHEN MANDATED TO PURCHASE FLOOD

                    INSURANCE.

                                 ADDITIONALLY, INSIDE THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION, IN

                    NOTIFYING THE HOMEOWNER OF MINIMUM FLOOD INSURANCE REQUIREMENTS,

                    THE NOTICE WOULD INCLUDE A STATEMENT INFORMING THE HOMEOWNER THAT

                    MINIMUM FLOOD INSURANCE ONLY COVERS THE BANK'S INTEREST AND MAY NOT

                    COVER THE FULL VALUE OF THE HOME OR THE BELONGINGS INSIDE.

                    HOMEOWNERS ARE ENCOURAGED TO PURCHASE ADDITIONAL INSURANCE IF THEY

                    DESIRE GREATER COVERAGE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  WOULD

                    THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANKS, MS. HUNTER.  SO, AS I

                                         147



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    UNDERSTAND IT, THIS HAS TWO COMPONENTS, ONE IS -- THE FIRST COMPONENT IS

                    TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT A BANK CAN ONLY REQUIRE YOU TO BUY FLOOD

                    INSURANCE IN AN AMOUNT SUFFICIENT TO COVER THE MORTGAGE, CORRECT?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  YES.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  AND THE OTHER IS A WARNING NOTICE,

                    IF YOU WILL, BY THE BANK THAT SAYS TO THE HOMEOWNER, YOU'RE NOT

                    COVERED, OR, YOU MIGHT NOT BE COVERED.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  YES, AND THIS BILL IS INTENDED TO MAKE

                    SURE THAT THE CONSUMERS ARE INFORMED ABOUT THEIR DECISIONS.  WE HAVE

                    SEEN IN CASES WHERE HOMEOWNERS HAVE BEEN PAYING TWO TIMES MORE THE

                    VALUE OF THEIR HOME BECAUSE IT'S EXPENSIVE, AND WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT

                    FLOOD INSURANCE, THAT THEY ARE INFORMED ABOUT THE MINIMUM AMOUNT

                    COVERED THE BALANCE, BE THE HOME, BUT THAT THEY ARE ALSO COMMUNICATED

                    WITH, WITH THE BANK, THAT -- IF THEY NEED ADDITIONAL INSURANCE TO COVER

                    HOUSEHOLD ITEMS AND/OR REPLACEMENT, THAT THEY ARE -- THAT'S

                    COMMUNICATED TO THEM, AS WELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THE QUESTION I HAVE IS MOST BANKS

                    ARE HOPEFUL THAT THE AMOUNT MORTGAGED GOES DOWN EVERY MONTH WITH A

                    REGULAR MONTHLY MORTGAGE PAYMENT.  SO, DO YOU ENVISION, THEN, THAT

                    THE FLOOD INSURANCE COVERAGE WOULD ALSO GO DOWN EVERY MONTH?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  NOT EVERY MONTH AND, YOU KNOW,

                    MOST POLICIES OBVIOUSLY HAVE RENEWALS EITHER OF SIX MONTHS OR

                    ANNUALLY.  YOU KNOW, I DON'T LIVE ON THE WATER, BUT I DO HAVE A

                    HOMEOWNER'S INSURANCE POLICY AND ANNUALLY THEY SEND ME NOTIFICATION

                    AND THEY TELL ME, YOU KNOW, HOW MUCH MY PREMIUM IS AND -- AND WHAT

                                         148



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THE REPLACEMENT COST WOULD BE.  THIS IS TALKING ABOUT SOMETHING VERY

                    SIMILAR.  JUST WANTING TO MAKE SURE CONSUMERS ARE INFORMED WHEN THEY

                    COME TO THE ANNUAL TIME FOR REINSTATEMENT, HAVING THOSE CONVERSATIONS

                    BECAUSE MAYBE THEY DON'T NEED THIS EXCESSIVE FLOOD INSURANCE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  SO, YOU ENVISION THAT A BANK WOULD

                    MEET ITS REQUIREMENTS UNDER THIS LAW MERELY BY ADVISING THE

                    HOMEOWNER THAT THEY ONLY NEED TO PURCHASE AN AMOUNT TO COVER THEIR

                    CURRENT OUTSTANDING BALANCE, THAT THE BANK WOULD NOT NEED TO

                    FOLLOW-UP, SAY, THE FOLLOWING YEAR AND SAY, OH, BY THE WAY, YOU

                    HAVEN'T ADJUSTED IT.  IT'S JUST A REQUIREMENT THAT THEY NOTIFY THE

                    CONSUMER THAT THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO REDUCE IT?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  RIGHT, THIS IS A WRITTEN STATEMENT ON

                    THE BILL AND, YOU KNOW, DURING THE COURSE OF A TRANSACTION, YOUR HOUSE,

                    THE COVERAGE OF YOUR HOME WHEN YOU PURCHASE YOUR POLICY EVERY YEAR,

                    YOU'RE GOING TO SIT DOWN AND HAVE THAT CONVERSATION WITH THE BANK.

                    YOU'RE GOING TO SAY, THIS IS THE MINIMUM AMOUNT THAT YOU'RE REQUIRED

                    TO -- TO COVER.  MY INTEREST, ME, THE BANK, THIS IS HOW MUCH IT'S GOING TO

                    COST IN ORDER FOR YOU TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU'RE PROTECTED, BUT LET ME JUST

                    TALK TO YOU ALSO ABOUT HOW MUCH IT WOULD COST IN ADDITION IF YOU WERE

                    TO WANT TO COVER THINGS IN EXCESS OF THAT.  AND IT'S, AGAIN, LEAVING UP TO

                    THE CONSUMER TO MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION.  THEY MAY HAVE OTHER

                    MEANS TO WANT TO PAY FOR A REPLACEMENT.  NATIONAL FLOOD INSURANCE IS

                    VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE, AS I STATED; SOMETIMES TWO TIMES MORE THAN THEIR

                    MORTGAGE.  AND SO, BEING IN A POSITION TO BE FULLY INFORMED ABOUT THE

                    COST, THE MINIMUM COST WHICH IS NEVER COMMUNICATED TO SOMEONE

                                         149



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WHEN THEY ARE PURCHASING FLOOD INSURANCE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, YOU'VE MADE IT CLEAR THAT THE

                    BANK DOES NOT HAVE A CONTINUING OBLIGATION TO NOTIFY THE HOMEOWNER

                    THAT THEY CAN REDUCE IT AS THE MORTGAGE GOES DOWN AS LONG AS THEY

                    MADE THAT NOTIFICATION RIGHT UP FRONT AND ARE CLEAR ABOUT THAT.  THE FLIP

                    SIDE OF THIS SAME COIN IS, AM I CORRECT THAT THERE'S NO OBLIGATION ON THE

                    BANK TO ACTUALLY REQUIRE FLOOD INSURANCE OR ANY PARTICULAR AMOUNT; IS

                    THAT CORRECT, AS WELL?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  THERE IS A FORMULA, AND I DON'T HAVE

                    THE MATHEMATICAL FORMULA, BUT IT'S ALWAYS EQUAL TO WHATEVER THE

                    MORTGAGE OR THE INVESTMENT AMOUNT IS FOR THE BANK.  SO, WHATEVER

                    MAKES THE BANK WHOLE WILL BE THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENT OF WHAT A

                    LENDER WOULD HAVE TO PURCHASE AS FAR AS INSURANCE IS CONCERNED.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  IT ACTUALLY WOULD BE THE MAXIMUM

                    AMOUNT, RIGHT, THE MAXIMUM AMOUNT THEY COULD PURCHASE WOULD BE

                    THAT VALUE?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  WELL, RIGHT, THEY COULD BUY MORE IF

                    THEY WANT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  RIGHT.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  THIS IS JUST TO COVER THE LENDER'S...

                                 MR. GOODELL:  WELL, HOPEFULLY ONE LAST QUESTION.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  YES.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  IF THE BANK, FOR WHATEVER REASON,

                    INADVERTENTLY PROVIDE FAILS, INADVERTENTLY FAILS TO PROVIDE THE NOTICE

                    THAT THE FLOOD INSURANCE ONLY COVERS THE BANK'S LIABILITY, WOULD THIS BILL

                                         150



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    MAKE THE BANK LIABLE IF THE FLOOD DAMAGE EXCEEDED THE AMOUNT OF THE

                    INSURANCE?

                                 MS. HUNTER:  IT WOULD BE UP TO THE BOARD, IT'S NOT

                    STATED IN THE BILL DIRECTLY.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I APOLOGIZE, I COULDN'T HEAR.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  IT'S NOT -- IT'S UP TO THE COURTS.  IT'S

                    NOT STATED IN THE BILL DIRECTLY IF THE BANK WOULD BE LIABLE IF THEY DID NOT

                    COMMUNICATE TO THE MORTGAGEE THAT THEY WEREN'T REQUIRED TO HAVE THE

                    MINIMUM AMOUNT.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MS. HUNTER.

                    I APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS.

                                 ON THE BILL, SIR.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  YOU'RE WELCOME.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  MR. GOODELL, ON THE

                    BILL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I -- I APPRECIATE AND AGREE WITH MY

                    COLLEAGUE'S DESIRE TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT WHEN A BANK MAKES A MORTGAGE

                    OR ANYONE ELSE MAKES A MORTGAGE THAT THEIR INSURANCE REQUIREMENTS

                    SHOULD BE LIMITED TO THE VALUE OF THE MORTGAGE.  THAT'S THEIR

                    REQUIREMENTS.  OBVIOUSLY, IF THE HOMEOWNER WANTS TO HAVE MORE

                    COVERAGE, THAT SHOULD BE SOLELY UP TO THEM.  I WOULD WANT TO MAKE IT

                    CLEAR, HOWEVER, THAT THE FAILURE TO GIVE NOTICE SHOULD NOT CREATE A NEW

                    LEGAL LIABILITY FOR BANKS, AND THAT SHOULD ALMOST GO WITHOUT SAYING

                    SINCE THE FIRST NOTICE, WHICH SAYS YOU ONLY HAVE TO COVER US, CARRIES THE

                    OBVIOUS IMPLICATION THAT YOU'RE NOT COVERING MORE.

                                         151



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 BUT, I WOULD HOPE THAT WE'RE NOT IMPOSING NEW

                    LIABILITY ON BANKS, BUT I AGREE WITH THE BASIC PREMISE THAT THE BANKS

                    SHOULD ONLY REQUIRE INSURANCE THAT COVERS THE BANK'S INTEREST, AND I --

                    AND I THINK THAT'S A GOOD MOVE, AND SO, I SUPPORT THIS LEGISLATION.

                    THANK YOU, MS. HUNTER, AND THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 MS. HUNTER TO EXPLAIN HER.

                                 NO.  ON THE BILL.

                                 MS. HUNTER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS BILL

                    WOULD PROHIBIT CREDITORS FROM REQUIRING HOMEOWNERS TO PURCHASE FLOOD

                    INSURANCE IN AN AMOUNT THAT EXCEEDS THE OUTSTANDING BALANCE OF THE

                    MORTGAGE.  AND IT IS NECESSARY BECAUSE MORE THAN HALF OF SURVEYED

                    HOMEOWNERS INDICATED THAT THEIR INSURANCE RATE WERE ELECTED ON THEIR

                    BEHALF WITHOUT THEIR NOTIFICATION OR CONSENT BY INSURANCE FOR MORTGAGE

                    PROVIDERS.  SOME HOMEOWNERS WERE FOUND TO HAVE TO INSURANCE

                    POLICIES IN EXCESS OF TWO TIMES THE VALUE OF THEIR HOME.  LOW-INCOME

                    HOMEOWNERS IN NEW YORK AND MASSACHUSETTS PRESENTLY FACE

                    FORECLOSURE WHEN EXORBITANT INSURANCE POLICIES OUTPACE EVEN MORTGAGE

                    PAYMENTS.

                                 FLOOD INSURANCE IS ALREADY DIFFICULT TO AFFORD FOR 25

                    PERCENT OF OWNER-OCCUPIED HOUSEHOLDS, AND A FINANCIAL BURDEN FOR

                    NEARLY TWO-THIRDS OF VERY LOW INCOME HOUSEHOLDS.  AND THERE'S 525

                    MILES OF COASTLINE AND WATERFRONT DEVELOPMENT IN NEW YORK AND

                    HAVING MORE RESIDENTS LIVING IN HIGH FLOOD RISK ZONES THAN ANY OTHER

                                         152



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CITY IN THE COUNTRY.  HOMEOWNERS CAN STILL PURCHASE FULL REPLACEMENT

                    COVERAGE OF THEIR HOME.  THE CHANGES MADE BY THIS BILL TIES THE AMOUNT

                    OF REQUIRED COVERAGE TO THE OUTSTANDING MORTGAGE BALANCE INSTEAD OF AN

                    ARBITRARILY HIGHER AMOUNT.

                                 AND I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT THE WORK THAT WE DID ON

                    THE FLOOD INSURANCE BILL IN THE CITY OF SYRACUSE WITH THE LOW-INCOME

                    FOLKS LEAD TO A GRADUATE STUDENT AT SU'S MAXWELL SCHOOL OF CITIZENSHIP

                    TO COME AND HAVE THIS CONVERSATION WITH US.  AND SO, THIS BILL THAT SHE

                    WAS DOING FOR A GRADUATE SCHOOL PROJECT LANDED US HERE TODAY PUTTING

                    THIS BILL FORWARD.  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE CLERK WILL RECORD

                    THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 183.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY MEMBER

                    WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE

                    MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  PLEASE RECORD THE

                    FOLLOWING REPUBLICAN MEMBERS IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS BILL:  MR.

                    MONTESANO AND MR. DIPIETRO.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.  SO NOTED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, OUR

                                         153



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    COLLEAGUE, MR. BUCHWALD, WOULD LIKE TO CONFIRM IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS

                    ONE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  SO NOTED.  THANK YOU.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05045, CALENDAR NO.

                    192, DAVILA, AUBRY, GOTTFRIED, SIMON, BARRON, ARROYO, TAYLOR, LAVINE,

                    ORTIZ, CAHILL, O'DONNELL, SEAWRIGHT, PICHARDO, MOSLEY, PERRY, RIVERA,

                    JAFFEE, QUART, DICKENS, BLAKE, WALKER, WRIGHT.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    CRIMINAL PROCEDURE LAW, IN RELATION TO ALLOWING A COURT TO WAIVE

                    CERTAIN SURCHARGES AND FEES; AND TO REPEAL CERTAIN PROVISIONS OF THE

                    PENAL LAW RELATING THERETO.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  AN EXPLANATION IS

                    REQUESTED.

                                 MS. DAVILA:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  SO, THIS BILL

                    WOULD REMOVE CRIMINAL CHARGES FROM INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE ADJUDICATED,

                    YOUTHFUL OFFENDERS, AND PROVIDE THE COURTS WITH DISCRETION TO WAIVE

                    CERTAIN COURT FEES AND SURCHARGES FOR INDIVIDUALS UNDER THE AGE OF 21 IF

                    THE FEE WOULD CAUSE AN UNDUE HARDSHIP OR THE INTEREST OF JUSTICE

                    REQUIRES IT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  YES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU SO MUCH.  SO, I JUST HAVE A

                                         154



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FEW QUESTIONS.  IT -- IT -- IT APPEARED THAT UNDER OUR CURRENT LAW - LET ME

                    GET MY GLASSES ON - UNDER OUR CURRENT LAW THE COURT COULD WAIVE THESE

                    TYPES OF CHARGES, BUT ONLY THE CRIME VICTIM ASSISTANCE FEE.  SO THIS

                    BILL WOULD EXPAND THE CURRENT LAW IN A COUPLE OF RESPECTS.  IT WOULD

                    INCREASE THE AGE OF THE INDIVIDUAL ABLE TO HAVE THE SURCHARGE OR FEE

                    WAIVED TO NOW INCLUDE 19- AND 20-YEAR-OLDS, AND IT WOULD ALSO EXPAND

                    THE FEE WAIVED FROM (UNINTELLIGIBLE) THE CRIME VICTIM ASSISTANCE FEE

                    TO INCLUDE ALL OF THE SURCHARGES AND FEES DENOTED IN THE BILL; IS THAT

                    CORRECT?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  CORRECT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  AND -- YEAH.  SO, THAT COULD

                    RESULT IN SOME LOST REVENUE TO AFFECTED COURTS OR DATABANKS OR OTHER FEE

                    DESTINATIONS, RIGHT?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  CORRECT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  SO, I GUESS WHAT -- WHAT IS THE

                    RATIONALE BEHIND DOING THIS BILL?  I MEAN, IF YOU'VE GOT A 19- OR

                    20-YEAR-OLD, THEY ARE ADULTS IN MANY, YOU KNOW, SENSES OF THE LAW.

                    THEY CAN -- THEY CAN VOTE, THEY CAN SERVE IN THE MILITARY; THEY CAN DO A

                    LOT OF THINGS.  WHY SHOULDN'T THEY HAVE TO PAY A FINE?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  WELL, I -- I -- I BEG TO DIFFER.  WE

                    HAVE 21-YEAR-OLDS LIKE -- THAT ACT LIKE 15-YEAR-OLDS AT THIS POINT.

                    THEY'RE NOT CONSIDERED ADULTS.  AND WE'RE LIVING IN STRANGE TIMES RIGHT

                    NOW.  WE -- I DON'T THINK THAT THESE CHARGES WOULD MAKE A GREAT

                    DIFFERENCE; HOWEVER, SOMEONE THAT IS BECOMING HOMELESS OR IS NOT

                    EATING BECAUSE OF THIS PANDEMIC, $25 CAN MAKE A VERY BIG DIFFERENCE

                                         155



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    AND IT CAN MAKE A MEAL FOR THE ENTIRE FAMILY.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  AND THIS WOULD, AGAIN, ONLY BE

                    IN THE DISCRETION OF THE JUDGE, SO IF THE JUDGE WANTED TO CONTINUE TO

                    IMPOSE THE FINE, HE OR SHE COULD STILL DO THAT, RIGHT?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  THAT IS CORRECT.  IT'S AT THE DISCRETION

                    OF THE JUDGE.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  AND WHAT WOULD THE -- THE, I'LL

                    JUST SAY "YOUTHFUL OFFENDER", WHAT WOULD THE PERSON NEED TO SHOW IN

                    ORDER TO TRY TO CONVINCE THE COURT TO WAIVE THESE -- THESE FEES AND

                    CHARGES?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  WELL, I'M SURE THEY -- THEY WOULD

                    HAVE TO SHOW SOME FINANCIAL DISCLOSURE AND OTHER MEANS OF HOW MANY

                    PEOPLE LIVE IN THE HOUSEHOLD JUST TO BE ABLE TO VERIFY WHETHER OR NOT

                    THEY QUALIFY.

                                 MS. WALSH:  SO, THEY WOULD HAVE TO SHOW FINANCIAL

                    HARDSHIP -- UNREASONABLE HARDSHIP --

                                 MS. DAVILA:  MM-HMM.

                                 MS. WALSH:  -- ON THE DEFENDANT, HIS OR HER

                    IMMEDIATE FAMILY OR ANY OTHER PERSON WHO IS DEPENDENT ON SUCH

                    DEFENDANT FOR FINANCIAL SUPPORT.  SO, THAT COULD INCLUDE SOMEBODY NOT

                    LIVING IN THE DEFENDANT'S HOUSEHOLD, BUT MAYBE THE DEFENDANT IS PAYING

                    CHILD SUPPORT FOR OR HAS GOT OTHER OBLIGATIONS FOR SOMEBODY ELSE?

                                 MS. DAVILA:  YES, THAT'S CORRECT.  IF THE DEFENDANT

                    IS 19 AND HE HAS A CHILD THAT HE'S SUPPORTING, OR SUPPORTING HIS FAMILY

                    OR WHATEVER THE CASE MIGHT BE VICE VERSA HIS FAMILY SUPPORTING HIM,

                                         156



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    YES, THAT WOULD BE CAUSE.

                                 MS. WALSH:  OKAY.  AND THEN THERE'S THE ONE

                    CATCHALL, TOO, AS FAR AS THE INTEREST OF JUSTICE IF THE COURT FEELS THAT IT

                    WOULD BE IN THE INTEREST OF JUSTICE TO NOT CHARGE THIS -- THIS FEE OR THESE

                    -- THIS AMOUNT OF MONEY THEN THAT --

                                 MS. DAVILA:  THAT IS CORRECT.

                                 MS. WALSH:  -- THAT'S ANOTHER CONSIDERATION.  OKAY.

                    THANK YOU SO MUCH.

                                 MS. DAVILA:  THANK YOU.

                                 MS. WALSH:  MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  ON THE BILL, MS.

                    WALSH.

                                 MS. WALSH:  THANK YOU.  SO I THINK WHAT'S REALLY AT

                    ISSUE HERE IS HOW DO WE -- HOW DO WE BALANCE AND HAVE A SENSE OF

                    FAIRNESS AND COMPASSION TOWARDS DEFENDANTS IN OUR CRIMINAL JUSTICE

                    SYSTEM AGAINST THE INTEREST THAT SOCIETY HAS IN SAFETY AND IN TRYING TO

                    PROMOTE DETERRENCE AND CURB RECIDIVISM OF A PARTICULAR DEFENDANT.

                                 SO, I APPRECIATE THE FACT THAT THIS WOULD BE

                    DISCRETIONARY WITH THE COURT; HOWEVER, I WOULD SAY THAT AN INDIVIDUAL

                    WHO IS UNDER THE AGE OF 21 COULD HAVE -- COULD POTENTIALLY HAVE A

                    PRETTY LONG CRIMINAL HISTORY AT THE TIME THAT THEY'RE APPEARING IN FRONT

                    OF THE COURT, AND I JUST THINK THAT TO MISQUOTE BARETTA, YOU KNOW, DON'T

                    DO THE CRIME IF YOU CAN'T PAY THE FINE -- THAT'S NOT EVEN FUNNY, BUT, NO, I

                    JUST THINK THAT IT'S - IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE HAVE DISCRETION OF THE COURT

                    SYSTEM, BUT I REALLY DO THINK THAT THIS BILL IS DIFFICULT TO SUPPORT BECAUSE

                                         157



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    IT'S REALLY TREATING INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE 19, 20 YEARS OLD IN A WAY THAT IS

                    NOT REALLY HOLDING THEM FULLY RESPONSIBILITY FOR WHAT THEY'VE DONE.  SO,

                    FOR THAT REASON, THERE'S BEEN A SIGNIFICANT OPPOSITION TO THIS BILL IN THE

                    PAST.  SO, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MS.

                    WALSH.

                                 MS. DAVILA.

                                 MS. DAVILA:  TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 SO, I THINK THIS -- WELL, I DON'T THINK.  THIS IS THE

                    SECOND TIME THIS BILL IS GOING TO PASS THE ASSEMBLY, AND I'M LOOKING

                    FORWARD TO IT, ESPECIALLY NOW.  IT'S PERFECT TIMING TO GET IT DONE.  WE

                    HAVE MANY FAMILIES THAT ARE STANDING IN LINE JUST TO GET FOOD ON A DAILY

                    BASIS.  SO, I DON'T THINK A $25 OR $50 FINE IS REALLY GOING TO BREAK THE

                    COURTS.  I REALLY DO NOT BELIEVE THAT.  BUT I REALLY DO BELIEVE THAT IT IS

                    IMPERATIVE THAT WE CONTINUE TO CHIP AT ALL OF THESE FINES THAT ARE

                    CAUSING HARM AND RECIDIVISM TO OUR CHILDREN.  AND SO, WE NEED TO GIVE,

                    ONCE AGAIN, SECOND CHANCES.  AND I TRULY BELIEVE IN SECOND CHANCES.

                    WE CANNOT HOLD OUR CHILDREN BACK BECAUSE THEY CANNOT AFFORD A $25

                    FINE.  SO, THANK YOU FOR YOUR LETTING ME EXPLAIN MY VOTE AND I

                    ENCOURAGE ALL MY COLLEAGUES TO PLEASE PUT THEIR VOTE IN.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MS.

                    DAVILA.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THE CLERK WILL RECORD

                                         158



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THE VOTE ON CALENDAR NO. 192.  THIS IS A PARTY VOTE.  ANY MEMBER

                    WISHING TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION IS

                    REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER

                    PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THE REPUBLICAN

                    CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS BILL, BUT IF THERE ARE MEMBERS

                    WHO WOULD LIKE TO SUPPORT IT, THEY ARE ENCOURAGED TO CALL THE MINORITY

                    LEADER'S OFFICE AND LET US KNOW SO WE CAN CORRECTLY RECORD THEIR VOTE.

                    THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  THIS WILL BE A PARTY VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS LEGISLATION.  WE ARE

                    HOPEFUL THAT ALL OF OUR COLLEAGUES WILL VOTE WITH US, BUT SHOULD THEY

                    NOT, PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND WE

                    WILL SO RECORD YOUR VOTE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MRS.

                    PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  THIS BILL

                    WOULD WAIVE THE CRIME VICTIM ASSISTANCE FEE, DNA DATABASE FEE,

                    WHICH IS ONLY COLLECTED ON SERIOUS CRIME, THE SEX OFFENDER

                    REGISTRATION FEE OR A SUPPLEMENTAL REGISTRATION FEE, AND OTHER

                                         159



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SURCHARGES.  AND WHEN WE WAIVE THOSE FEES FOR A DEFENDANT WHO HAS

                    BEEN CONVICTED OR HAS PLED GUILTY, BECAUSE THOSE FEES ONLY APPLY UPON

                    ENTRY OF A GUILTY VERDICT OR A GUILTY PLEA, THEN THOSE COSTS ARE PUT BACK

                    ON THE TAXPAYERS.  AND I THINK THAT'S ONE REASON WHY THE CONSERVATIVE

                    PARTY HAS OBJECTED TO THIS, BECAUSE THEY THINK THE COST OF DOING A DNA

                    TEST OR THE COST OF A CRIME VICTIM ASSISTANCE OR THE COST OF REGISTERING AS

                    A SEX OFFENDER SHOULD BE BORNE BY THE SEX OFFENDER AND NOT BY THE

                    TAXPAYERS.  AND THE COST OF THE DNA TEST FOR A SERIOUS CRIME SHOULD BE

                    BORNE BY THE OFFENDER AND NOT THE TAXPAYERS.  AND THAT PROBABLY

                    EXPLAINS WHY WE HAD 40 NO VOTES THE LAST TIME THIS CAME UP.  THANK

                    YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER JONES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    GOODELL.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  IF WE COULD RECORD OUR COLLEAGUES MR. STERN AND MS. GRIFFIN

                    IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS ONE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  THANK YOU, MR.

                    SPEAKER.  COLLEAGUES, THERE'S GOING TO BE JUST A BIT OF A SHIFT HERE, BUT

                                         160



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    WE'RE GOING TO KEEP MOVING.  SO WE'RE GOING TO SHIFT TO THE A-CALENDAR

                    THAT WAS MOVED EARLIER TODAY AND GOING TO PAGE 3 AND START RIGHT WITH

                    RULES REPORT NO. 152 AND JUST KEEP GOING, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON THE A-CALENDAR,

                    THE CLERK WILL READ.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A00619-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 152, JOYNER, BARRON, D'URSO, GLICK, GOTTFRIED, COLTON,

                    PERRY, COOK, WALLACE, MOSLEY, SIMOTAS, TAYLOR, JAFFEE, BLAKE, CRUZ,

                    REYES.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HOUSING LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    ESTABLISHING THE LEASE AND LANDLORD FRAUD PUBLIC AWARENESS PROGRAM

                    TO PROMOTE PUBLIC AWARENESS OF THE POTENTIAL RISKS OF SIGNING A

                    FRAUDULENT LEASE WITH AN INDIVIDUAL MISREPRESENTING THEMSELVES AS A

                    LANDLORD.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON CALENDAR -- RULES REPORT NO. 152.  THIS IS A FAST

                    ROLL CALL.  ANY MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS

                    REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER

                    PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  WE ARE NOW ON

                    WHAT WE AFFECTIONATELY CALL THE CONSENT CALENDAR, AND SO WE WILL BE

                                         161



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    REVIEWING UPWARDS OF 60 BILLS THAT MOST OF US, IF NOT ALL OF US, BELIEVE

                    ARE GOOD BILLS OR ROUTINE BILLS.  AND SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE ALL OF OUR

                    MEMBERS TO PAY CLOSE ATTENTION BECAUSE THE TIME FRAME BETWEEN VOTES

                    WILL LIKELY SHORTEN AS WE TRY TO COVER AS MUCH GROUND AS POSSIBLE TODAY

                    SO WE DON'T HAVE TO GO PAST MIDNIGHT.  WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO WRAP UP

                    THIS SESSION IN A REASONABLE TIME, BUT IN ORDER TO DO THAT WE WILL BE

                    MOVING QUICKLY.

                                 THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THANK YOU.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A01193-C, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 153, PAULIN, COOK, CYMBROWITZ, ABINANTI, GUNTHER,

                    WEPRIN, HEVESI, RYAN, STIRPE, BUCHWALD, DIPIETRO, BRABENEC, BLAKE,

                    FAHY, ORTIZ, COLTON, NORRIS, BARRETT, PHEFFER AMATO, DINOWITZ, LALOR,

                    ZEBROWSKI, STECK, HUNTER, BRONSON, SOLAGES, PEOPLES-STOKES,

                    DE LA ROSA, B. MILLER, GARBARINO, MORINELLO, FITZPATRICK, DICKENS,

                    MAGNARELLI, PICHARDO, SANTABARBARA, GIGLIO, D. ROSENTHAL, KIM,

                    RODRIGUEZ, ABBATE, JONES, ARROYO, VANEL, MCDONOUGH, AUBRY,

                    L. ROSENTHAL, ENGLEBRIGHT, LAVINE, D'URSO, JAFFEE, JOYNER, SEAWRIGHT,

                    M.L. MILLER, FERNANDEZ, FALL, BURKE, REILLY, REYES, SALKA, WALLACE,

                    JACOBSON, JEAN-PIERRE, MOSLEY, MANKTELOW, TAYLOR, BENEDETTO, STERN,

                    GRIFFIN, BUTTENSCHON, MALLIOTAKIS, EICHENSTEIN, LUPARDO.  AN ACT TO

                    AMEND THE EDUCATION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE USE OF ORAL MEDICATIONS BY

                                         162



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    OPTOMETRISTS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02277, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 154, PICHARDO, SAYEGH, ARROYO, REYES.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    WORKERS' COMPENSATION LAW, IN RELATION TO EXTENDING PAID FAMILY

                    LEAVE BENEFITS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A02770-C, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 155, BICHOTTE, SOLAGES, JEAN-PIERRE, BARRON, WALKER,

                    THIELE.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO ENACTING

                    THE JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN LAW RELATING TO PRE-TERM LABOR CARE AND

                    DIRECTING THE COMMISSIONER OF HEALTH TO REQUIRE HOSPITALS TO PROVIDE

                    PRE-TERM LABOR PATIENTS WITH INFORMATION REGARDING THE POTENTIAL HEALTH

                    EFFECTS OF PRE-TERM LABOR AND PRE-TERM DELIVERY ON AN EXPECTANT MOTHER

                    AND ON HER FETUS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. BICHOTTE ON THE

                    BILL.

                                 MS. BICHOTTE:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  ON THE

                    BILL.  TODAY'S A BITTERSWEET DAY AS I INTRODUCE THE JONAH BICHOTTE

                    COWAN BILL, NAMED AFTER MY LATE SON IN 2018.  THIS BILL REQUIRES

                    HOSPITALS AND BIRTHING CENTERS TO PROVIDE PATIENTS EXPERIENCING

                    PRE-TERM LABOR WITH INFORMATION REGARDING THE POTENTIAL HEALTH EFFECTS

                    OF PRE-TERM LABOR AND PRE-TERM DELIVERY ON AN EXPECTANT MOTHER AND

                    HER FETUS, AS WELL AS CARE FOR A MOTHER WHO IS EXPERIENCING PRE-TERM

                    LABOR.  THIS BILL IS NOT ONLY DEDICATED TO ALL EXPECTANT MOTHERS WITH

                                         163



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    COMPLICATIONS, BUT IT ALSO INCLUDES, BUT IS NOT LIMITED TO, HIGHLIGHTING

                    THE OBVIOUS HEALTH DISPARITIES REGARDING BLACK MORTALITY MATERNITY AND

                    BLACK INFANT MORTALITY RATES.  FOR YEARS BLACK WOMEN HAVE BEEN

                    EXPERIENCING THESE DISPARITIES FIRSTHAND.  THE CARE WE RECEIVE -- OR

                    RATHER, THE CARE WE DO NOT RECEIVE DURING PREGNANCY AND CHILDBIRTH CAN

                    LEAD TO THE DEATH OF A MOTHER AND CHILD.  IN NEW YORK CITY, BLACK

                    WOMEN ARE ESTIMATED TO BE UP TO 12 TIMES MORE LIKELY TO DIE DURING

                    PREGNANCY AND CHILDBIRTH THAN WHITE WOMEN, AND ARE THREE TIMES MORE

                    LIKELY TO SUFFER FROM LIFE-THREATENING COMPLICATIONS.  IT IS ALSO FOUND

                    THAT COLLEGE-EDUCATED BLACK MOTHERS EXPERIENCE SEVERE COMPLICATIONS

                    AT HIGHER RATES THAN WHITE WOMEN WHO LACK A HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA.  A

                    STUDY PUBLISHED BY BLACK WOMEN BIRTHING JUSTICE WHICH SURVEYED

                    BLACK MOTHERS IN CALIFORNIA FROM 2011 TO 2015 FOUND THAT BLACK

                    MOTHERS TENDED TO HAVE BETTER HEALTH OUTCOMES WHEN THEY HAD A GOOD

                    RELATIONSHIP WITH THEIR CAREGIVERS.  OFTENTIMES, THIS MEANT THAT BLACK

                    WOMEN WHO UTILIZED DOULAS OR OTHER NON-TRADITIONAL MEDICAL

                    PROFESSIONALS TENDED TO HAVE BETTER HEALTH OUTCOMES FOR THEMSELVES

                    AND THEIR CHILDREN.  THE IMPACT OF THE STRESS OF RACISM CAN BE SEEN IN A

                    REPORT WHICH REVEALED THAT BLACK WOMEN FACE HIGHER INFANT DEATH RATES

                    WHEN IN THEIR 20'S RATHER THAN THEIR TEENS.  FOR WHITE WOMEN THE RATES

                    ARE OPPOSITE, WITH LOWER INFANT DEATH RATES IN THEIR 20'S VERSUS THEIR

                    TEENS.  EVEN MORE ALARMING THAN STATISTICS ON PRE-TERM LABOR IS THE FACT

                    THAT DESPITE THE AVAILABILITY OF NEW MEDICAL TECHNOLOGIES AND MODERN

                    TECHNIQUES, RACIAL DISPARITIES ARE WIDER NOW THAN IN 1850 BEFORE THE

                    END OF SLAVERY.  BLACK INFANTS IN AMERICA ARE NOW MORE THAN TWICE AS

                                         164



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    LIKELY TO DIE AS WHITE INFANTS.  UNFORTUNATELY, MR. SPEAKER, MY BABY,

                    JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN, IS ONE OF THOSE STATISTICS.

                                 IN OCTOBER 2016 I WAS FIVE-AND-A-HALF MONTHS

                    PREGNANT, AND WHEN I WENT TO MY DOCTOR AT COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY

                    MEDICAL CENTER, THEY TOLD ME I WAS 3.5 MILLIMETERS -- CENTIMETERS

                    DILATED.  I HAD SOMETHING CALLED INCOMPETENT CERVIX.  I HAD TO RUSH TO

                    NEW YORK PRESBYTERIAN COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL WITH MY DOCTOR

                    AND HER TEAM.  WHEN I GOT THERE IT WAS INFORMED TO ME THAT MY BABY

                    WAS BULGING OUT.  THEY GAVE ME TWO OPTIONS:  TO EITHER TERMINATE MY

                    PREGNANCY OR TO LEAVE THE HOSPITAL AND GO ELSEWHERE.  THE DOCTOR AND

                    THE RESIDENT AT COLUMBIA MEDICAL CENTER SAID THAT BECAUSE OF HOSPITAL

                    POLICIES THERE WAS NO ROOM FOR ME IF I WISH NOT TO TERMINATE MY CHILD.

                    THEY ALSO INDICATED THAT I NEEDED TO LEAVE BECAUSE THEY NEEDED THE

                    ROOM FOR ANOTHER PATIENT.  I DIDN'T WANT TO LEAVE.  WHY?  BECAUSE MY

                    UNBORN SON AND I WERE IN INCREDIBLE, FATAL AND HIGH-RISK SITUATION, BUT

                    WERE NOT ALLOWED THE SAFE CARE OF MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS BECAUSE OF A

                    HOSPITAL POLICY.  A POLICY WHICH CLAIMED THAT THEY COULD NOT INTERVENE

                    BEFORE 23 WEEKS BECAUSE INSURANCE WOULD NOT COVER MY PRE-TERM LABOR

                    CARE.  I WAS ONE WEEK AWAY FROM RECEIVING THE CARE WE DESPERATELY

                    NEEDED.  JUST IMAGINE WHAT I WAS GOING THROUGH, AND WHAT THE OTHER

                    BLACK PREGNANT WOMAN DOWN THE HALL WHO WAS CRYING IMMENSELY WAS

                    GOING THROUGH BECAUSE SHE, TOO, WAS LOSING HER BABY.  SO AFTER CRYING

                    LIKE CRAZY AND NOT HAVING CONTROL, I HAD MY FRIENDS, HAITIAN DOCTORS

                    FROM THE AMERICAN MEDICAL HAITIAN ASSOCIATION PHYSICIAN, WHO CALLED

                    THE DOCTORS AND INFORMED THEM THAT IT WAS ILLEGAL TO KICK ME OUT AND

                                         165



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THAT THEY SHOULD ADMIT ME AND MONITOR ME.  THEY REFUSED.  SO AT THAT

                    POINT WE HAD NO CHOICE.  WE LEFT BECAUSE THEY PUSHED US OUT.  IT WAS

                    ARRANGED BY THESE HAITIAN DOCTORS FOR ME TO GO TO WYCKOFF HOSPITAL IN

                    BROOKLYN WHERE IMMEDIATELY THE DOCTORS THERE DID EVERYTHING THEY CAN

                    DO TO SAVE MY BABY AND SAVE ME FROM DYING.  AFTER SEVEN DAYS I

                    DELIVERED MY SON, JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN, BUT HE DIDN'T SURVIVE MORE

                    THAN TWO HOURS.  HE WAS DEEMED A STILLBIRTH.  BECAUSE OF WHAT

                    HAPPENED -- WHAT HAPPENED TO ME AND SO MANY WOMEN, I DECIDED TO

                    INTRODUCE THE JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN LAW AFTER MY DECEASED SON,

                    WHICH ENSURES THAT PATIENTS EXPERIENCING PRE-TERM LABOR ARE INFORMED

                    OF PRE-TERM LABOR RISKS AND REQUIRES HOSPITALS TO TAKE CARE OF A WOMAN

                    WITH HIGH RISK PREGNANCIES.  NOT BLACKS ONLY, NOT WHITES ONLY, NOT

                    HISPANICS ONLY, NOT ASIANS ONLY.  ALL WOMEN WITH EQUITY.  AND IN

                    APRIL, PRE-TERM LABOR ACCOUNTS FOR 17 PERCENT OF ALL INFANT DEATHS IN

                    AMERICA.  NO PREGNANT WOMAN SHOULD BE TURNED AWAY FROM A HOSPITAL

                    DURING PRE-TERM LABOR.  EARLIER THIS MONTH IN MY BOROUGH OF BROOKLYN,

                    SHA-ASIA WASHINGTON BECAME THE THIRD BLACK WOMAN IN NEW YORK

                    CITY TO DIE FROM BIRTH- RELATED COMPLICATIONS SO FAR THIS YEAR.  FAMILY

                    MEMBERS EAGER TO MEET THE NEWEST MEMBER OF THEIR FAMILY TEXTED

                    SHA-ASIA TO CALL THEM WHEN THE BABY WAS BORN.  UNFORTUNATELY, THAT

                    CALL NEVER CAME.  SHA-ASIA DIED SHORTLY AFTER THE BIRTH OF HER BABY.  SHE

                    WAS ONLY 26 YEARS OLD.  AND IN APRIL ANOTHER 26-YEAR-OLD PREGNANT

                    BLACK WOMAN, AMBER ROSE ISAAC, DIED AT MONTEFIORE HOSPITAL AFTER

                    TWEETING ABOUT DEALING WITH INCOMPETENT DOCTORS.  SHE DIED ALONE AS

                    NEW YORK CITY BATTLED THE CORONAVIRUS.

                                         166



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. SPEAKER, THIS IS WHY I HAVE CREATED THIS

                    SUPPORTING LEGISLATION WHICH WOULD FINALLY LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD SO

                    THAT ALL MOTHERS CAN ENJOY THE EXPERIENCE OF PREGNANCY AND BIRTH OF

                    THEIR CHILDREN.  I WANT TO FIRST THANK THE MEMBERS OF THE

                    HAITIAN-AMERICAN PHYSICIAN, AMHE.  DR. LESLY KERNISANT, WHO CALLED

                    THE DOCTORS AT COLUMBIA AND GAVE THEM A PIECE OF HIS MIND AND

                    COORDINATED A RESCUE PLAN FOR ME.  I WANT TO THANK DR. DANIEL FAUSTIN,

                    WHO HIMSELF AND ALL THE DOCTORS AND THE NURSES AT WYCKOFF HELPED ME,

                    WHO HELPED DELIVERED MY CHILD, JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN.  I ALSO WANT TO

                    THANK THE ADVOCATES LIKE BABY RESOURCE CENTER, STAR LEGACY

                    FOUNDATION, MARCH OF DIMES AND OTHER INSTITUTIONS IN NEW YORK CITY

                    HEALTH AND HOSPITALS AND SUNY DOWNSTATE WHO ARE TRYING VERY HARD

                    TO CHANGE THEIR APPROACH TO -- FOR BETTER OUTCOMES IN OUR COMMUNITY.

                                 TODAY, MR. SPEAKER, I STAND WITH THIS BILL, JONAH

                    BICHOTTE COWAN, FOR ALL THE BLACK MATERNAL WOMEN WHO LOST THEIR LIVES

                    AND FOR ALL THOSE BLACK INFANTS WHO LOST THEIR LIFE DUE TO DISCRIMINATION,

                    INJUSTICE AND NEGLIGENCE.  I CALL ON ALL THEIR NAMES.  AND LASTLY, MR.

                    SPEAKER, I ASK MY COLLEAGUES TO JOIN ME IN PASSING THIS LEGISLATION IN

                    MEMORY OF MY SON JONAH.  JONAH BICHOTTE COWAN, I'M THINKING ABOUT

                    YOU EVERY DAY, AND I THANK YOU FOR GIVING ME THE STRENGTH TO DO THIS.

                    TO DO THIS FOR ALL WOMEN SO THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH WHAT I

                    WENT THROUGH AND WHAT YOU WENT THROUGH.  SO I THANK YOU.  I THANK

                    YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND I ENCOURAGE

                    ALL MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME.  THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL.

                                         167



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  AND I

                    THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE FOR THE COURAGE TO SHARE THAT VERY DIFFICULT

                    STORY, AND THE REPUBLICAN CAUCUS WILL BE SUPPORTING HER LEGISLATION

                    ALONG WITH OUR DEMOCRATIC COLLEAGUES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 60TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 155.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MELISSA MILLER TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MS. MILLER:  THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.  I JUST -- I

                    WANT TO THANK THE SPONSOR.  I HAVE WORKED VERY CLOSELY WITH THE

                    STARLIGHT FOUNDATION.  I'VE STOOD BESIDE MANY OF THESE MOMS AND THESE

                    PARENTS, AND NO MOM SHOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH WHAT YOU EXPERIENCED.

                    IT'S HARD ENOUGH.  IT'S HARD ENOUGH.  AND I THANK YOU FOR DOING THIS, FOR

                    SPEAKING UP AND FOR SHARING YOUR HEARTACHE TO HELP OTHERS.

                                 THANK YOU.  I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. MILLER IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, THANK YOU

                    FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE.  I HAVE NEVER HAD THE SITUATION

                                         168



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THAT OUR COLLEAGUE JUST DESCRIBED, BUT I FEEL HER PAIN.  I FELT IT AT THE

                    TIME WHEN SHE FIRST CAME BACK AFTER LOSING HER SON.  AND I'M GLAD THAT

                    WE ARE AT A POINT WHERE WE CAN SEE WHERE THE PROBLEMS ARE AND LAY OUT

                    A PLAN TO SOLVE THEM.  AND I HOPE THAT ONCE THIS LEGISLATION IS PASSED

                    AND CERTAINLY SIGNED INTO LAW THAT THERE WILL BE SOME MECHANISMS TO

                    FOLLOW IT AND WATCH CLOSELY THAT PEOPLE ARE IMPLEMENTING IN -- IN THE

                    MANNER IN WHICH IT WAS INTENDED.  BECAUSE SOMETIMES WE PASS THESE

                    REALLY GREAT LAWS AND THEY NEVER GET IMPACTED IN THE RIGHT WAY.  IT

                    DOESN'T HAVE A DIFFERENCE IN PEOPLE'S LIVES.  WE NEED TO SEE THIS HAVE A

                    DIFFERENCE IN PEOPLE'S LIVES SO THAT MOTHERS LIKE OUR COLLEAGUE WILL

                    NEVER, EVER HAVE TO EXPERIENCE THIS TYPE OF THING AGAIN.

                                 SO WITH THAT I WITHDRAW MY REQUEST AND VOTE IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES

                    IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03057-C, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 156, BARRETT, BUCHWALD, SEAWRIGHT, DE LA ROSA, WEPRIN,

                    REYES, LAVINE, QUART, BRONSON, GOTTFRIED, GLICK, DINOWITZ, SIMOTAS.

                    AN ACT TO AMEND -- AN ACT TO ESTABLISH A TASK FORCE TO EXPLORE THE EFFECTS

                    OF CYBER-BULLYING IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK (SIC) AND POTENTIAL

                    MEASURES TO ADDRESS SUCH EFFECTS; AND PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH

                    PROVISIONS UPON THE EXPIRATION THEREOF.

                                         169



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 156.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A03429-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 157, DILAN, COOK, M.G. MILLER, MCDONOUGH, BARRON,

                    PICHARDO, SAYEGH, TAYLOR, DICKENS, LAWRENCE, NORRIS, MONTESANO,

                    D'URSO, ABINANTI.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE NOT-FOR-PROFIT CORPORATION

                    LAW, IN RELATION TO CREATING A CEMETERY DISCLOSURE FORM.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    DILAN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 157.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                         170



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A04921, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 158, BLAKE, VANEL, ARROYO, EPSTEIN, D'URSO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING THE

                    COMMISSIONER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT TO PUBLICIZE CERTAIN

                    INFORMATION RELATED TO PROGRAMS FOR SMALL BUSINESS ENTERPRISES AND

                    MINORITY- AND WOMEN-OWNED BUSINESS ENTERPRISES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    BLAKE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 158.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A04962-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 159, O'DONNELL, BRONSON, DE LA ROSA, CRUZ, FERNANDEZ,

                                         171



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    D. ROSENTHAL, JACOBSON.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE INSURANCE LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO REQUIRING INSURANCE COVERAGE FOR PRE-EXPOSURE PROPHYLAXIS

                    AND POST-EXPOSURE PROPHYLAXIS TO PREVENT HIV INFECTION.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 159.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL:  MR. SPEAKER, MY APOLOGIES.  PLEASE

                    LAY THIS BILL ASIDE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  I WILL CHARGE YOU FOR

                    EVERY WORD I HAD TO SAY.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 MR. GOODELL:  I WAS AFRAID OF THAT.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE ROLL CALL IS

                    WITHDRAWN AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05108, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 160, DAVILA, MOSLEY, ORTIZ, L. ROSENTHAL, OTIS, WEPRIN, REYES.

                    AN ACT TO AMEND THE CORRECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE HOUSING OF

                    TRANSGENDER OR INTERSEX INMATES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05169-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 161, RAMOS.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE ENVIRONMENTAL

                                         172



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    CONSERVATION LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING CERTAIN SIGNS AND NOTICES

                    RELATING TO PESTICIDES FOR COMMERCIAL OR RESIDENTIAL LAWN APPLICATION TO

                    BE PRINTED IN BOTH THE ENGLISH AND SPANISH LANGUAGES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 161.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05819-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 162, ABBATE, JEAN-PIERRE, CYMBROWITZ.  AN ACT TO AMEND

                    THE AGRICULTURE AND MARKETS LAW AND THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO AUTOMOBILE TIRE INFLATION MACHINES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    ABBATE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A05952-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 163, L. ROSENTHAL, REYES, MCDONALD.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    INSURANCE LAW, IN RELATION TO UNFAIR DISCRIMINATION BY INSURERS FOR THE

                    USE OF PRESCRIPTIONS TO BLOCK THE EFFECTS OF OPIOIDS.

                                         173



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MS.

                    ROSENTHAL, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 163.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A06070-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 164, SEAWRIGHT, GALEF, REYES, SAYEGH.  AN ACT TO DIRECT THE

                    NEW YORK STATE DEPARTMENT OF FINANCIAL SERVICES AND THE NEW YORK

                    STATE DEPARTMENT OF STATE'S CONSUMER PROTECTION DIVISION TO CONDUCT

                    A STUDY ON CONSUMER AWARENESS AND FINANCIAL EDUCATION IN NEW YORK

                    STATE AND TO MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR A CONSUMER AWARENESS AND

                    FINANCIAL EDUCATION PROGRAM.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 164.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                                         174



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A06393, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 165, WILLIAMS, ARROYO, D'URSO, SAYEGH, RIVERA, MAGNARELLI, M.G.

                    MILLER, BLAKE, CRUZ.  AN ACT REQUIRING THE DEPARTMENT OF LABOR TO

                    PRODUCE A REPORT REGARDING SUMMER YOUTH EMPLOYMENT PROGRAMS

                    FUNDED BY STATE, FEDERAL AND LOCAL APPROPRIATIONS; AND PROVIDING FOR

                    THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON EXPIRATION THEREOF.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MS.

                    WILLIAMS, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 165.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A06662-B, RULES

                                         175



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    REPORT NO. 166, WALLACE, SIMOTAS, D'URSO, BURKE, SIMON, STIRPE,

                    BUTTENSCHON, JAFFEE, FAHY.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW,

                    IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING THE "CHILD ABUSE REPORTING EXPANSION ACT."

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 166.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:  THANK YOU, SIR.  THIS BILL EXPANDS

                    REPORTING REQUIREMENTS FOR INDIVIDUALS THAT MAY BE SUSPECTED OF CHILD

                    ABUSE.  THERE WAS SOME CONCERN THAT IT DIDN'T PROVIDE ADEQUATE

                    PROTECTION TO CLERGY WHO MAY HEAR A CONFESSION OR WERE PROVIDING

                    COUNSELING IN THEIR PROFESSIONAL CONTEXT, AND I WANTED TO REASSURE MY

                    COLLEAGUES THAT A CLOSE READING OF THE BILL INDICATES THAT THIS WOULD NOT

                    APPLY IN A SITUATION WHERE A CLERGYMAN IS HEARING A CONFESSION OR IS

                    PROVIDING COUNSELING.

                                 AND FOR THOSE REASONS, I WILL BE SUPPORTING IT AND

                    RECOMMEND THE SAME TO MY COLLEAGUES.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MR. GOODELL IN THE

                    AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                         176



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A06679-C, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 167, RYAN, BURKE, WALLACE, SMITH, D'URSO, PHEFFER

                    AMATO, FRONTUS, LAVINE, BRAUNSTEIN, M.G. MILLER, SIMOTAS, WEPRIN,

                    RAMOS, JEAN-PIERRE, REYES, SOLAGES, STERN, OTIS, STECK, ORTIZ, SAYEGH,

                    DESTEFANO, GARBARINO, MOSLEY, L. ROSENTHAL, DINOWITZ, BLAKE,

                    GOTTFRIED, ROZIC, CARROLL, KIM, CRUZ, RICHARDSON, EPSTEIN, QUART,

                    BUCHWALD, STIRPE, NIOU, LENTOL, SANTABARBARA, MCMAHON, TAYLOR,

                    GLICK, BARNWELL, SEAWRIGHT, DIPIETRO, DE LA ROSA, BENEDETTO, B.

                    MILLER, NORRIS, JOYNER, JACOBSON, ABINANTI, FERNANDEZ, PICHARDO,

                    RIVERA, MORINELLO, SIMON, STEC.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SERVICE

                    LAW, IN RELATION TO THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION REVIEWING

                    BROADBAND AND FIBER OPTIC SERVICES WITHIN THE STATE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 60TH

                    DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 167.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. PALMESANO TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. PALMESANO:  YES, THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER

                    AND MY COLLEAGUES.  I'M HAPPY TO SUPPORT THIS LEGISLATION, BUT LET'S BE

                    HONEST.  THIS BILL, A STUDY IS NOT ENOUGH.  IF WE REALLY WANT TO BE

                                         177



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SERIOUS ABOUT EXPANDING HIGH-SPEED INTERNET SERVICES FOR OUR FAMILIES

                    AND KIDS IN OUR RURAL AREAS AND OUR LOW-INCOME AREAS, THEN WHY DON'T

                    WE START WITH REPEALING THE RIDICULOUS ONEROUS STATE RIGHT-OF-WAY TAX

                    THAT WAS ADOPTED IN LAST YEAR'S BUDGET?  THE STATE DOT RIGHT NOW IS

                    CHARGING FEES PLACED ON FIBER OPTIC LINE INSTALLERS WHO BUILD LINES IN THE

                    STATE RIGHT-OF-WAY, COSTING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.  MILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT

                    COULD BE USED TO EXPAND INTERNET AND HIGH-SPEED INTERNET SERVICE FOR

                    OUR FAMILIES AND KIDS.  EXPLAIN TO ME HOW THIS MAKES SENSE.  THE STATE

                    WANTS TO PROMOTE HIGH-SPEED INTERNET SERVICE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME

                    WE'RE TAXING THE VERY PEOPLE WHO WE WANT TO INVEST AND DEVELOP AND

                    BUILD ACCESS TO IT, TO HIGH-SPEED INTERNET ACCESS.  I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT.

                    IT'S COUNTERPRODUCTIVE.  IT'S CERTAINLY A DISINCENTIVE TO INVESTMENT AND

                    WILL JUST MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT AND CHALLENGING TO DEVELOP AND BUILD

                    THE INTERNET SERVICE AND HIGH-SPEED ACCESS THAT WE WANT FOR OUR

                    FAMILIES AND OUR CHILDREN, ESPECIALLY AFTER WHAT OUR FAMILIES AND OUR

                    CHILDREN WENT THROUGH THIS YEAR WITH REMOTE LEARNING EXPERIENCES THAT

                    DID NOT WORK.  RIGHT NOW WE KNOW MANY FAMILIES AND KIDS, ESPECIALLY

                    IN OUR LOWER-INCOME AREAS -- LOW-INCOME AREAS AND OUR RURAL AREAS DO

                    NOT HAVE ACCESS TO INTERNET -- RELIABLE INTERNET SERVICES AND TECHNOLOGY.

                    THIS WAS A PROBLEM BEFORE COVID CAME.  IT JUST BECAME MORE CLEARLY

                    EVIDENT AFTERWARD.  SO IF YOU REALLY WANT TO BE SERIOUS ABOUT THIS

                    INVESTMENT TO EXPAND HIGH-SPEED INTERNET SERVICES TO OUR FAMILIES AND

                    OUR CHILDREN ACROSS THIS STATE FOR ECONOMIC PURPOSES, FOR EDUCATIONAL

                    PURPOSES, THEN LET'S GET RID OF THIS ONEROUS COSTLY MANDATED OF A TAX THAT

                    IS PLACED ON THE VERY PEOPLE, BUSINESSES WE WANT TO EXPAND AND

                                         178



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    DEVELOP HIGH-SPEED INTERNET AROUND THE STATE.  THAT'S WHEN WE CAN BE

                    SERIOUS ABOUT THIS.  THAT WILL BE A SERIOUS EXAMPLE.  THIS BILL DOES NOT

                    DO ENOUGH.  WE CAN DO ALL THE STUDIES WE WANT, BUT LET'S GET SERIOUS

                    ABOUT IT.  LET'S ELIMINATE THIS TAX NOW.

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ARE THERE ANY OTHER

                    VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A06989, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 168, JEAN-PIERRE, BLAKE, COOK, D'URSO, SALKA, HYNDMAN,

                    FERNANDEZ, DICKENS, SAYEGH, MONTESANO, NORRIS, MORINELLO.  AN ACT TO

                    AMEND THE ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE CONTROL LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING

                    CERTAIN LICENSES TO BREW OR SELL BEER TO INCLUDE THE CERTIFICATE OF

                    AUTHORITY NUMBER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MS.

                    JEAN-PIERRE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 168.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                         179



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A07104-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 169, BUTTENSCHON, LUPARDO, WOERNER, MCDONALD, D'URSO,

                    GOTTFRIED, ROZIC, JEAN-PIERRE, SAYEGH, OTIS, JONES, COOK, L. ROSENTHAL,

                    PICHARDO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE EDUCATION LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    AUTHORIZING AND DIRECTING THE BOARDS OF COOPERATIVE EDUCATIONAL

                    SERVICES TO ESTABLISH AN AGRICULTURE PROGRAM FOR STUDENTS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MS.

                    BUTTENSCHON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 169.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MS. BUTTENSCHON TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

                                 MS. BUTTENSCHON:  TIMES LIKE THESE REMIND US

                    OF THE IMPORTANCE OF ENSURING OUR NATION'S FOOD SECURITY BY SUPPORTING

                    AND PROTECT OUR AGRICULTURAL PRODUCERS.  DURING THIS COVID-19

                    PANDEMIC, I AM CONSTANTLY REMINDED OF AND AM GRATEFUL FOR THE TIRELESS

                    HOURS FARMERS PROVIDE WITHIN THEIR FIELDS, IN THEIR WORKPLACES, TO

                                         180



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    SUPPLY HEALTHY, AFFORDABLE FOOD TO BE PROCESSED AND PACKAGED.

                    AGRICULTURE IS THE LEADING INDUSTRY IN NEW YORK, YET OUR FARMERS

                    CONTINUE TO AGE.  THE AVERAGE AGE OF A U.S. FARMER PRODUCER IN 2017

                    WAS 57.5 YEARS, CONTINUING IN A LONG-TERM TREND OF THE AGING

                    PROFESSION.  OVER TIME IT BECOMES INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT TO ATTRACT

                    YOUNG INDIVIDUALS INTO THE FARMING INDUSTRY.  TAKING STEPS TO RECRUIT

                    YOUNG NEW FARMERS TO THE AGRICULTURAL PROFESSION AGRICULTURAL

                    PROFESSION IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT TO THE FINE STATE OF NEW YORK, AND

                    WE NEED TO PROTECT OUR FOOD SUPPLY AS WELL AS TO ENSURE THE HEALTH AND

                    SAFETY OF AFFORDABLE OPTIONS TO ALL OF OUR RESIDENTS.  PROVIDING A YOUNG

                    FARMERS APPRENTICE PROGRAM THROUGH OUR BOCES WILL ENCOURAGE AND

                    CREATE VARIOUS PROGRAMS.  THIS LEGISLATION WILL AFFORD LOCAL BOCES THE

                    OPPORTUNITY TO ESTABLISH AGRICULTURAL PROGRAMS UPON THE LOCAL INTEREST

                    FROM ONE OR MORE SCHOOL DISTRICTS THROUGH THEIR APPROVAL OF THEIR

                    BOARDS.  THESE AGRICULTURAL PROGRAMS WILL -- WILL BE DESIGNED TO

                    PROVIDE STUDENTS WITH NECESSARY SKILLS TO WORK IN AND HELP SUSTAIN OUR

                    STATE AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY.  THESE PROGRAMS COULD INCLUDE PARTNERSHIPS

                    WITH FARMS AND OTHER AGRICULTURAL ENTITIES THROUGHOUT THE STATE.

                    FARMING IS A DIFFICULT AND HARD INDUSTRY.  I COMMEND ALL THOSE WHO ARE

                    PART OF IT, AND I COMMEND THOSE (UNINTELLIGIBLE) INTEREST FOR THE FUTURE.

                                 I ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO SUPPORT THIS.  THANK

                    YOU.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MS. BUTTENSCHON IN

                    THE AFFIRMATIVE.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                         181



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A07463-B, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 170, HUNTER, SAYEGH, DARLING, D'URSO, CRUZ, TAYLOR,

                    GOTTFRIED, SIMON, EPSTEIN, NIOU, JEAN-PIERRE, BLAKE, BARRON, JAFFEE,

                    SEAWRIGHT, GLICK, FRONTUS, WEPRIN, BRONSON, MAGNARELLI, ZEBROWSKI,

                    STECK, FAHY, PERRY, MOSLEY, O'DONNELL, EICHENSTEIN, DICKENS,

                    RODRIGUEZ, WILLIAMS, PICHARDO, L. ROSENTHAL, REYES, LAVINE, ORTIZ,

                    QUART, LUPARDO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE VEHICLE AND TRAFFIC LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO THE SUSPENSION OF A LICENSE TO DRIVE A MOTOR VEHICLE OR

                    MOTORCYCLE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A07646-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 171, BRONSON, JOHNS, KOLB.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL

                    MUNICIPAL LAW, IN RELATION TO ENSURING PAID EMPLOYEES OF A COUNTY

                    AIRPORT OR COUNTY AVIATION DEPARTMENT WHICH PERFORM FIRE RESPONSE OR

                    FIRE RESCUE DUTIES ARE ELIGIBLE FOR EQUAL BENEFITS AS OTHER PAID

                    FIREFIGHTERS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A07767-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 172, GALEF.  AN ACT AUTHORIZING THE COMMISSIONER OF

                    GENERAL SERVICES TO TRANSFER AND CONVEY CERTAIN UNAPPROPRIATED STATE

                    LAND TO THE VILLAGE OF OSSINING, COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER; AND PROVIDING

                    FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON EXPIRATION THEREOF.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  HOME RULE MESSAGE

                                         182



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    IS AT THE DESK.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 172.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A07820-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 173, FALL, RICHARDSON, SAYEGH, WALKER, REYES, DICKENS,

                    DARLING, CUSICK, TAYLOR.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE ADMINISTRATIVE CODE OF

                    THE CITY OF NEW YORK, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING NEW HOMELESS SHELTERS

                    CONDUCT A PUBLIC HEARING IN THE COMMUNITY WHERE THE PROPOSED SHELTER

                    IS TO BE LOCATED BEFORE BEING SITED.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

                    MR. HEVESI TO LAY IT ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08142-E, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 174, HYNDMAN, CARROLL, TAYLOR, REYES, GRIFFIN, GOTTFRIED,

                    PAULIN, DINOWITZ, NIOU, BLAKE, WEPRIN, DE LA ROSA, SIMON, SIMOTAS,

                    D. ROSENTHAL, AUBRY, PERRY, BARNWELL, MOSLEY, ORTIZ, SEAWRIGHT,

                    JEAN-PIERRE, WALKER, QUART, DENDEKKER, RYAN, NOLAN, BENEDETTO,

                    SOLAGES, BRAUNSTEIN, ABBATE, KIM, JACOBSON, HEVESI, FERNANDEZ,

                                         183



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    COLTON, ARROYO, FRONTUS, L. ROSENTHAL, WILLIAMS, EPSTEIN, BUCHWALD,

                    JOYNER, O'DONNELL, PHEFFER AMATO, M.G. MILLER, WRIGHT, RIVERA,

                    PICHARDO, SAYEGH, CRUZ, RAMOS, DICKENS, D'URSO, BICHOTTE, ROZIC,

                    ABINANTI.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE LABOR LAW, IN RELATION TO ENACTING THE

                    "HEALTHY TERMINALS ACT."

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08149-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 175, O'DONNELL, EPSTEIN, SIMON.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    EXECUTIVE LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING THE DISCLOSURE OF DISABLED

                    TENANTS' RIGHTS TO REASONABLE ACCOMMODATIONS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 175.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

                                 MR. GOODELL:.  THANK YOU VERY MUCH, SIR.  THIS

                    LAW REQUIRES THAT TENANTS BE DISCLOSED -- THAT DISABLED TENANTS HAVE

                    NOTICE ADVISING THEM OF THEIR RIGHT FOR REASONABLE ACCOMMODATIONS.

                    THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF CONFUSION ON THE LANGUAGE OF THE BILL, BUT I THINK

                    WE'VE COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THAT NOTICE REQUIREMENT ONLY APPLIES

                    TO DISABLED TENANTS WHO ARE IN PUBLICLY-ASSISTED HOUSING AND WOULD NOT

                    APPLY TO TENANTS IN PRIVATELY-OWNED HOUSING UNITS THAT DO NOT RECEIVE

                                         184



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    ANY PUBLIC ASSISTANCE TO MAKE THAT ACCOMMODATION.  SO IF YOU ARE A

                    PRIVATE LANDLORD THIS BILL WOULD NOT REQUIRE YOU TO PUT IN A NEW

                    ELEVATOR TO THE SECOND FLOOR OF YOUR DUPLEX, BUT IT WOULD APPLY IN THE

                    CONTEXT OF PUBLIC HOUSING.

                                 WITH THAT CLARIFICATION, I AND MY COLLEAGUES WILL BE

                    SUPPORTING THIS BILL.  THANK YOU, SIR.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ARE THERE ANY OTHER

                    VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08186-B, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 176, DARLING.  AN ACT AUTHORIZING THE COUNTY OF NASSAU TO

                    ALIENATE AND SELL PARKLANDS TO THE COLEMAN COUNTRY DAY CAMP AND

                    COLESON PROPERTIES, LLC.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  HOME RULE MESSAGE

                    IS AT THE DESK.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 176.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, WE HAVE A

                                         185



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    FEW COLLEAGUES THAT WOULD LIKE TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS

                    ONE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  CERTAINLY.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MS. GLICK, MR. BARRON,

                    MS. WALKER, MR. CAHILL, MRS. BARRETT AND MR. DILAN.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  SO NOTED.

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08257, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 177, JACOBSON.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    CHANGES TO THE ENTRANCE AND EXIT OF POLLING PLACES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    JACOBSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 177.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                         186



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08283-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 178, DARLING.  AN ACT IN RELATION TO PERMITTING ROOSEVELT

                    FIRE DISTRICT TO FILE AN APPLICATION FOR A RETROACTIVE REAL PROPERTY TAX

                    EXEMPTION.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 178.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08337-B, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 179, WALKER, WEPRIN.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE MENTAL

                    HYGIENE LAW AND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO ACCESS TO

                    MEDICAL AND PSYCHIATRIC RECORDS OF DECEASED INMATES BY THE BOARD OF

                    CORRECTION OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 179.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                         187



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08482, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 180, OTIS.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE REAL PROPERTY LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    REQUIRING LANDLORDS TO MITIGATE DAMAGES WHEN COMMERCIAL TENANTS

                    VACATE PREMISES IN VIOLATION OF THE TERMS OF THE LEASE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08511-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 181, EPSTEIN, D'URSO, REYES, MOSLEY, GOTTFRIED,

                    SEAWRIGHT.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE COUNTY LAW AND THE NEW YORK CITY

                    CHARTER, IN RELATION TO THE DOCKETING OF ADJUDICATIONS OF CERTAIN

                    VIOLATIONS OF LAWS ENFORCED BY THE NEW YORK CITY DEPARTMENT OF

                    CONSUMER AFFAIRS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08517-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 182, COLTON.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SERVICE LAW, IN

                    RELATION TO DIRECTING THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION TO CONDUCT A STUDY

                    AND REPORT ON TIME-OF-USE PLANS OFFERED BY GAS AND ELECTRIC UTILITIES.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 182.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                                         188



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08540, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 183, JAFFEE, D'URSO, GOTTFRIED, SEAWRIGHT, MCDONOUGH, RA,

                    DESTEFANO, SIMOTAS, MOSLEY, BUTTENSCHON, LAVINE, L. ROSENTHAL,

                    SIMON, GALEF, GRIFFIN, MORINELLO.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL

                    BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO CHILD RESTRAINT ALARMS.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08767-A, RULES

                    REPORT NO. 184, JONES, WOERNER, GOTTFRIED, OTIS, THIELE, GLICK, STEC,

                    SIMON, SMULLEN, QUART, BURKE, ORTIZ, JAFFEE, WALCZYK, RYAN, D'URSO,

                    MCDONALD, LUPARDO.  AN ACT TO ESTABLISH THE ADIRONDACK ROAD SALT

                    REDUCTION TASK FORCE, PILOT PLAN AND TEST PROGRAM; AND PROVIDING FOR

                    THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON EXPIRATION THEREOF.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 184.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                         189



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A08821, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 185, PAULIN, SIMON, GALEF, GOTTFRIED, JACOBSON, SEAWRIGHT, CRUZ,

                    MOSLEY.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO

                    DENIAL OF ACCESS TO AN EMPLOYEE TOILET FACILITY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A09070, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 186, GOTTFRIED, DICKENS, MCDONOUGH.  AN ACT TO AMEND CHAPTER

                    557 OF THE LAWS OF 2001 AMENDING THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, THE

                    PUBLIC HEALTH LAW AND THE INSURANCE LAW RELATING TO CLARIFYING

                    PROVISIONS PERTAINING TO PRE-NEED FUNERAL SERVICES, IN RELATION TO THE

                    EFFECTIVENESS THEREOF.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    GOTTFRIED, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 186.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                         190



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY NO. A09076, RULES REPORT

                    NO. 187, THIELE, D'URSO, BUTTENSCHON, OTIS.  AN ACT TO AMEND THE

                    EDUCATION LAW, IN RELATION TO REDEFINING MILITARY SERVICE.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    THIELE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.  THE SENATE BILL IS

                    ADVANCED.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 187.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.


                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY -- ASSEMBLY NO.

                    A09154-A, RULES REPORT NO. 188, JACOBSON, D'URSO.  AN ACT TO

                    AMEND THE TOWN LAW, IN RELATION TO AUTHORIZING THE TOWN OF

                    NEWBURGH, ORANGE COUNTY, TO ESTABLISH A ROAD IMPROVEMENT DISTRICT IN

                    THE RIDGE HUDSON VALLEY DEVELOPMENT AREA.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  HOME RULE MESSAGE

                    IS AT THE DESK.

                                 READ THE LAST SECTION.

                                         191



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 THE CLERK:  THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE CLERK WILL

                    RECORD THE VOTE ON RULES REPORT NO. 188.  THIS IS A FAST ROLL CALL.  ANY

                    MEMBER WISHING TO BE RECORDED IN THE NEGATIVE IS REMINDED TO CONTACT

                    THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES?  ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS PASSED.

                                 ON THE A-CALENDAR, A MOTION BY MS. WALLACE, PAGE

                    10, RULES REPORT NO. 189, BILL NO. A.9542, AMENDMENTS ARE RECEIVED

                    AND ADOPTED.

                                 THE CLERK:  ASSEMBLY --

                                 (PAUSE)

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  SORRY, MR. SPEAKER.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES,

                    NO MATTER WHAT THAT GUY SAYS NEXT TO YOU.

                                 (LAUGHTER)

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, DO WE

                    HAVE ANY HOUSEKEEPING OR RESOLUTIONS TO TAKE UP?

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  WE GOT -- WE

                    CERTAINLY HAVE.  I SHOULDN'T SAY WE GOT.  WE CERTAINLY HAVE A NUMBER OF

                    PIECES OF HOUSEKEEPING, WHICH I WILL TRY TO DO WITHOUT LOSING MY

                    VOICE.

                                         192



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                                 ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY MS. FAHY,

                    PAGE 29, CALENDAR NO. 179, BILL NO. A.4739-B, AMENDMENTS ARE

                    RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY MR. PERRY,

                    PAGE 13, CALENDAR NO. 63, BILL NO. A.1267-C, AMENDMENTS ARE

                    RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY MS. WEINSTEIN,

                    PAGE 32, CALENDAR NO. 210, BILL NO. A.5605-B, AMENDMENTS ARE

                    RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON A MOTION -- ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY

                    MS. WEINSTEIN, PAGE 38, CALENDAR NO. 248, BILL NO. A.6909-C,

                    AMENDMENTS ARE RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY MRS. BARRETT,

                    PAGE 51, CALENDAR NO. 421, BILL NO. A.2756-A, AMENDMENTS ARE

                    RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON THE MAIN CALENDAR, ON A MOTION BY MR.

                    BRAUNSTEIN, PAGE 54, CALENDAR NO. 457, BILL NO. A.9837, AMENDMENTS

                    ARE RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 ON BEHALF OF MR. THIELE, BILL NO. A.5211 -- HOLD UP --

                    5415, ASSEMBLY BILL RECALLED FROM THE SENATE.

                                 THE CLERK WILL READ THE TITLE OF THE BILL.

                                 THE CLERK:  AN ACT TO AMEND THE NAVIGATION LAW

                    AND THE INSURANCE LAW.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  ON A MOTION TO

                    RECONSIDER THE VOTE BY WHICH THE BILL PASSED THE HOUSE.  THE CLERK WILL

                                         193



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    RECORD THE VOTE.

                                 (THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

                                 THE CLERK WILL ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

                                 (THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

                                 THE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE AND THE AMENDMENTS ARE

                    RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

                                 WE HAVE A NUMBER OF FINE RESOLUTIONS.  WE WILL TAKE

                    THEM UP WITH ONE VOTE.

                                 ON THE RESOLUTIONS, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING

                    AYE -- OH, WHAT A NOISE -- THE RESOLUTIONS ARE ADOPTED.

                                 THANK YOU.

                                 (WHEREUPON, ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION NOS. 952-958

                    WERE UNANIMOUSLY ADOPTED.)

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, I NOW

                    MOVE THAT THE ASSEMBLY STAND ADJOURNED UNTIL 10:00 A.M. TUESDAY,

                    JULY THE 21ST, TOMORROW BEING A SESSION DAY.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  THE ASSEMBLY --

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  MR. SPEAKER, THAT'S

                    10:00 A.M.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  DID YOU SAY 10:00

                    A.M.?

                                 MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES:  10:00 A.M. TUESDAY,

                    JULY THE 21ST.

                                 ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY:  IT'S EVERYBODY 10:00

                                         194



                    NYS ASSEMBLY                                                          JULY 20, 2020

                    A.M.  IF THEY'RE HOME, IF YOU'RE HERE.

                                 THE ASSEMBLY STANDS ADJOURNED.

                                 (WHEREUPON, AT 9:10 P.M., THE HOUSE STOOD ADJOURNED

                    UNTIL TUESDAY, JULY 21ST AT 10:00 A.M., THAT BEING A SESSION DAY.)











































                                         195