WEDNESDAY, APRIL 6, 2022 11:21 A.M.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE HOUSE WILL COME

TO ORDER.

IN THE ABSENCE OF CLERGY, LET US PAUSE FOR A MOMENT OF

SILENCE.

(WHEREUPON, A MOMENT OF SILENCE WAS OBSERVED.)

VISITORS ARE INVITED TO JOIN THE MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE

OF ALLEGIANCE.

(WHEREUPON, ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY LED VISITORS AND

MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.)

A QUORUM BEING PRESENT, THE CLERK WILL READ THE

JOURNAL OF TUESDAY, APRIL 5TH.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, I MOVE TO

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

DISPENSE WITH THE FURTHER READING OF THE JOURNAL OF TUESDAY, APRIL THE

5TH AND ASK THAT THE SAME STAND APPROVED.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: WITHOUT OBJECTION, SO

ORDERED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR. IT'S A

PLEASURE TO BE HERE TODAY. HAPPY WEDNESDAY. I WAS KIND OF THINKING

IT WAS THURSDAY, BUT IT'S WEDNESDAY. I DO HAVE A QUOTE I WOULD LIKE TO

SHARE, MR. SPEAKER, WITH OUR COLLEAGUES AND GUESTS WHO ARE IN THE

CHAMBERS. THIS ONE IS FROM ALEXANDER GRAHAM BELL, MOST OF YOU

PROBABLY HAVE HEARD OF HIM, HE'S A SCOTTISH-BORN INVENTOR, A SCIENTIST,

AND AN ENGINEER WHO WAS CREDITED WITH PATENTING THE FIRST PRACTICAL

TELEPHONE A VERY, VERY LONG TIME AGO. AND HIS WORDS FOR US TODAY,

WHEN ONE DOOR CLOSES, ANOTHER ONE OPENS; BUT WE OFTEN LOOK SO LONG

AND SO REGRETFULLY UPON THE CLOSED DOOR THAT WE DO NOT SEE THE ONE THAT

HAS OPENED FOR US. AGAIN, THESE WORDS ARE FROM ALEXANDER GRAHAM

BELL.

MR. SPEAKER AND COLLEAGUES, ON YOUR DESKS YOU DO

HAVE A MAIN CALENDAR. YOU ALSO HAVE A DEBATE LIST. AFTER

HOUSEKEEPING, WE'RE GOING TO TAKE UP RESOLUTIONS ON PAGE 3 WHICH I

UNDERSTAND SOME OF OUR COLLEAGUES WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON. MR.

SPEAKER, AFTERWARDS WE'RE GOING TO BEGIN OUR DEBATE WITH CALENDAR

NO. 3 BY MS. PAULIN; FOLLOWED BY CALENDAR NO. 78 BY MR. DINOWITZ;

CALENDAR NO. 102 BY MR. AUBRY; CALENDAR NO. 182 BY MS. HYNDMAN;

AND CALENDAR NO. 358 BY MS. PAULIN. THERE IS A POSSIBILITY, MR.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

SPEAKER, THAT WE WILL ANNOUNCE ADDITIONAL FLOOR ACTIVITY, BUT FOR SURE

THERE WILL BE A NEED FOR A MINORITY CONFERENCE IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING

THE CLOSE OF SESSION -- MAJORITY CONFERENCE. MAYBE THE MINORITY, TOO,

BUT WE'LL CHECK WITH THEM LATER TO FIND OUT WHAT THEIR NEEDS WILL BE,

BUT FOR SURE IT'S GOING TO BE THE MAJORITY IN HEARING ROOM B AT THE

CONCLUSION OF OUR WORK TODAY, MR. SPEAKER.

THAT'S A GENERAL OUTLINE OF WHERE WE'RE GOING TODAY.

IF YOU HAVE ANY HOUSEKEEPING, NOW WOULD BE A GREAT TIME, SIR. THANK

YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: NO HOUSEKEEPING AT

THIS TIME.

ON PAGE 3, RESOLUTIONS.

ASSEMBLY NO. 730, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION NO. 730, MS.

WALSH.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM APRIL 10-16, 2022 AS PUBLIC SAFETY

TELECOMMUNICATORS WEEK IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. WALSH ON THE

RESOLUTION.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. PUBLIC

SAFETY TELECOMMUNICATIONS [SIC] WEEK, WHAT IS A PUBLIC SAFETY

TELECOMMUN -- OH, GOSH, I'M GOING TO SAY THIS WRONG, HOLD ON.

TELECOMMUNICATOR, OH, MY GOODNESS. THE SHORT THING IS IF YOU CALL

9-1-1, THESE ARE THE PEOPLE THAT TAKE YOUR CALL, ALL RIGHT. THEY'RE 9-1-1

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

OPERATORS AND IT'S EXTREMELY IMPORTANT THAT WE RECOGNIZE THE WORK THAT

THEY DO 24/7/365. I MEAN, THEY'RE THERE FOR US WHEN WE NEED HELP AND

WE CALL LOOKING FOR THAT HELP. THEY'RE TRAINED TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE ALL

DIFFERENT KINDS OF CALLS, WHETHER IT'S FOR POLICE, FIRE, MEDICAL PERSONNEL.

THEY CAN TALK SOMEBODY THROUGH IN AN EMERGENCY UNTIL HELP CAN

ARRIVE. THEY'RE VERY IMPORTANT PEOPLE IN OUR -- IN OUR COMMUNITIES

AND THAT'S WHY I'M SO GLAD TO BE CARRYING THIS RESOLUTION AND I WOULD

APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUES SUPPORT IN RECOGNIZING THE VERY, VERY

ESSENTIAL WORK THAT THESE -- THAT THESE FOLKS DO. SO THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING

AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION NO. 731, MS.

JEAN-PIERRE.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM APRIL 3-9, 2022 AS LIBRARY WEEK IN THE

STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. JENSEN ON THE

RESOLUTION.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I FIRST WANT

TO THANK THE SPONSOR, CHAIRWOMAN JEAN-PIERRE, FOR SPONSORING THIS

RESOLUTION AND FOR OUR COLLEAGUES IN SUPPORTING IT. CERTAINLY, LIBRARIES

PLAY A CRITICAL ROLE IN COMMUNITIES ACROSS OUR STATE, FROM LONG ISLAND

ALL THE WAY UP TO WESTERN NEW YORK, AND MORE AND MORE LIBRARIES ARE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MORE THAN JUST ROWS AND ROWS OF BOOKS, THEY ARE ESSENTIALLY DE FACTO

COMMUNITY CENTERS SERVING A VARIETY OF NEEDS TO THE COMMUNITIES THAT

THEY CALL HOME. AND WHILE IT'S IMPORTANT TO CELEBRATE OUR COMMUNITY

LIBRARIES, OUR SCHOOL LIBRARIES ALSO PLAY A CRITICAL ROLE IN ENHANCING THE

EDUCATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES FOR OUR SCHOOL CHILDREN THROUGHOUT THEIR --

THEIR GRADE LEVEL.

SO I'M PROUD THAT THIS BODY HAS CONTINUED TO SUPPORT

AND INVEST IN LIBRARIES AND HOPEFULLY WHEN WE DO HAVE A BUDGET THAT

WILL CONTINUE AND WE CAN ALL CELEBRATE AN INVESTMENT IN LIBRARIES

BECAUSE SUPPORT AND INVESTMENT IN LIBRARIES IS SUPPORT AND INVESTMENT

FOR OUR COMMUNITY. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MR.

JENSEN.

ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING

AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION NO. 732, MS.

RAJKUMAR.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM APRIL 2022 AS PUNJABI AWARENESS MONTH IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK, IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE OBSERVANCE OF

VAISAKHI TO BE CELEBRATED APRIL 14TH, 2022.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION,

MS. RAJKUMAR.

MS. RAJKUMAR: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. AS THE

FIRST PUNJABI-AMERICAN EVER ELECTED TO STATE OFFICE IN NEW YORK, IT IS

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

WITH ENORMOUS PRIDE THAT I INTRODUCE A FIRST OF ITS KIND RESOLUTION,

WHEREBY THIS BODY WILL RECOGNIZE THE MONTH OF APRIL AS PUNJABI

AWARENESS MONTH IN OUR GREAT STATE, AND COMMEMORATE APRIL 14TH,

2022 AS VAISAKHI DAY. HOW MAGNIFICENT OUR LEGISLATIVE BODY IS, EVER

GROWING IN ITS DIVERSITY. HOW MAGNIFICENT OUR STATE, WHERE ANYONE OF

ANY BACKGROUND CAN THRIVE IF THEY HAVE A DREAM THEY ARE WILLING TO

WORK FOR. IT'S TRUE THAT I AM A DAUGHTER OF THE PUNJAB, A STATE OF NORTH

INDIA. MY ANCESTORS ARE FROM AMRITSAR, FROM THE OLD CITY OF BHATTI.

THE REGION OF PUNJAB IS THE HEART OF THE SIKH COMMUNITY. LIKE MANY

PUNJABI FAMILIES ACROSS OUR GREAT COUNTRY, MY FAMILY IMMIGRATED TO

THE UNITED STATES FOR THE AMERICAN DREAM, SETTLING IN NEW YORK

WHERE I WAS BORN AND RAISED. I AM PROUD TO NOW BE THE

ASSEMBLYWOMAN FOR THE BEAUTIFUL QUEENS NEIGHBORHOOD OF RICHMOND

HILL, KNOWN BY MANY AS LITTLE PUNJAB. I'M PROUD TO SAY THAT THE 38TH

ASSEMBLY DISTRICT'S NEIGHBORHOOD OF RICHMOND HILL IS KNOWN AS THE

SIKH CAPITAL OF THE UNITED STATES. RICHMOND HILL IS HOME TO NEW

YORK CITY'S FIRST SIKH TEMPLE, KNOWN AS A GURDWARA, AND IT IS THE

CULTURAL CENTER OF THE SIKH COMMUNITY.

I WOULD LIKE TO TELL YOU A BIT ABOUT THE SIKH-AMERICAN

COMMUNITY. AT EVERY GURDWARA IN THIS COUNTRY, FOOD IS MADE AND

OFFERED FREE OF CHARGE TO ANYONE, NO MATTER THEIR RELIGION, GENDER,

ECONOMIC STATUS OR ETHNICITY. THIS IS THE SIKH PRACTICE OF LANGAR,

SERVING FREE FOOD TO ALL WITH NO DISCRIMINATION. AND THEY OFFER

EVERYONE FREE FOOD EVERY SINGLE DAY. SIKHS ARE REQUIRED TO DEFEND THE

FREEDOM OF WORSHIP OF OTHER RELIGIONS JUST AS THEY WOULD DEFEND THEIR

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

OWN. AS MY UNCLE ALWAYS TOLD ME, SIKHS ARE OUR PROTECTORS. SADLY,

SIKH-AMERICANS ARE AMONG OUR NATION'S MOST TARGETED RELIGIOUS GROUP

BECAUSE OF THEIR DISTINCT APPEARANCE, WEARING TURBANS ON THEIR HEAD.

THERE HAS BEEN A 200 PERCENT RISE IN HATE CRIMES AGAINST

SIKH-AMERICANS IN THE PAST COUPLE YEARS. RECENTLY, FOUR

SIKH-AMERICANS WERE FATALLY SHOT IN THE TRAGIC MASS SHOOTING IN

INDIANAPOLIS. AND JUST THIS VERY WEEK IN RICHMOND HILL, A 70-YEAR-OLD

SIKH MAN, MR. NIRMAL SINGH, WAS ASSAULTED IN QUEENS. BUT THE SIKH

COMMUNITY FORGES ON WITH JOY AND DETERMINATION, PROMOTING TOLERANCE

AND UNITY.

ON THIS PUNJABI AWARENESS MONTH, WE COMMIT TO

ENDING HATE CRIMES AGAINST ALL GROUPS. IN 1923, THE UNITED STATES

SUPREME COURT RULED IN THE UNITED STATES V. BHAGAT SINGH THAT

INDIANS COULD NOT BE AMERICAN CITIZENS, BUT NOW THERE ARE OVER HALF A

MILLION SIKHS ACROSS THE UNITED STATES, THRIVING IN ALL FIELDS. THE

FUTURE IS BRIGHT FOR THE SIKH-AMERICAN AND PUNJABI COMMUNITY IN OUR

GREAT STATE. THIS APRIL IS VAISAKHI, ONE OF THE MOST HISTORICALLY

SIGNIFICANT CELEBRATIONS OF THE YEAR FOR SIKHS, PUNJABIS, AND HINDUS. IT

CELEBRATES THE SPRING HARVEST. ON THIS VAISAKHI, TO ALL NEW YORKERS,

MAY YOUR HEART DANCE. MAY YOU BE SHOWERED WITH HAPPINESS. IN

RICHMOND HILL, THE DHOL DRUMS PLAY, THE GURDWARAS ARE ADORNED WITH

COLOR. ON BEHALF OF RICHMOND HILL AND PUNJABI-AMERICANS ACROSS THE

STATE, I PROUDLY SPONSOR THE HISTORIC RESOLUTION. THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. WEPRIN ON THE RESOLUTION.

MR. WEPRIN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I, TOO, AM

VERY PROUD TO REPRESENT ONE OF THE LARGEST SIKH POPULATIONS IN NEW

YORK, IF NOT THE UNITED STATES. THE SIKH CULTURAL SOCIETY AND THEIR

GURDWARA IS LOCATED IN MY DISTRICT IN SOUTH RICHMOND HILL, AND THAT IS

THE LARGEST SIKH TEMPLE IN THE ENTIRE NORTHEAST UNITED STATES. THEY

HAVE 9,000 MEMBERS AND THEY'RE HEADQUARTERED IN RICHMOND HILL.

AND I WANT TO CONGRATULATE MY NEW COLLEAGUE FOR SPONSORING THIS

RESOLUTION. I ALSO AM PROUD TO HAVE DONE THE FIRST VAISAKHI CELEBRATION

AT CITY HALL WHEN I WAS A MEMBER OF THE CITY COUNCIL IN 2002, AND

THAT POPULATION HAS GROWN SIGNIFICANTLY NOT ONLY IN RICHMOND HILL, BUT

IN THE ENTIRE STATE.

SO ONCE AGAIN, I'M SO PROUD TO REPRESENT THAT

POPULATION, AND ONE OF MY PROUDEST MOMENTS ON THIS FLOOR WAS WHEN I

PASSED THE -- WHEN WE PASSED THE RELIGIOUS GARB BILL WHICH PROHIBITED

DISCRIMINATION IN ALL EMPLOYMENT BASED ON RELIGIOUS GARB AND, OF

COURSE, AS ASSEMBLYWOMAN RAJKUMAR MENTIONED, THERE'S BEEN

TREMENDOUS DISCRIMINATION AGAINST THE SIKH COMMUNITY BECAUSE OF

WEARING TURBANS AND BEARDS, AND I'M HAPPY TO SAY THAT NEW YORK STATE

NOW PROHIBITS ANY DISCRIMINATION IN PUBLIC OR PRIVATE EMPLOYMENT

FROM WEARING BEARDS AND TURBANS.

SO ONCE AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO SPEAK ON

THIS VERY IMPORTANT RESOLUTION, AND HAPPY VAISAKHI TO ALL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS ADOPTED.

ON THE DEBATE LIST, CALENDAR NO. 3, BILL NO. 129-A,

PAGE 5, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00129-A, CALENDAR

NO. 3, PAULIN, DINOWITZ, GALEF, OTIS, SEAWRIGHT, COLTON, VANEL,

SAYEGH, ZINERMAN, GRIFFIN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SERVICE LAW,

IN RELATION TO FILING GAS SAFETY REPORTS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, AN

EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED.

MS. PAULIN: YES, THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THIS

BILL WOULD REQUIRE GAS CORPORATIONS TO FILE AN ANNUAL GAS SAFETY REPORT

WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SERVICE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. PALMESANO.

MR. PALMESANO: YES, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS, PLEASE?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS,

SIR.

MR. PALMESANO: THANK YOU, AMY. I KNOW

WE'VE DISCUSSED THIS BILL IN THE PAST SO I GUESS WE CAN DO IT AGAIN WHILE

WE WAIT FOR THE BUDGET TO COME THROUGH, HOPEFULLY. RIGHT NOW,

CURRENTLY, DOESN'T THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION REQUIRE GAS

CORPORATIONS TO PROVIDE SERVICE (INAUDIBLE) AND FACILITIES AS NECESSARY

FOR SAFE AND ADEQUATE SERVICE RIGHT NOW UNDER THE PUBLIC SERVICE LAW?

MS. PAULIN: YES. DPS CURRENTLY PROVIDES AN

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

ANNUAL SAFETY PERFORMANCE REPORT, BUT THERE'S NO PROVISION IN LAW THAT

REQUIRES GAS CORPORATIONS TO REPORT ON THE VARIETY OF SAFETY MEASURES,

UPDATES, AND PIPELINE OPERATIONS THAT THIS BILL STIPULATES.

MR. PALMESANO: AND DOESN'T EVERY GAS

CORPORATION TRANSMITTING NATURAL GAS, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO CONDUCT A LEAK

DETECTION INSPECTION ANNUALLY, OR EVEN MORE FREQUENTLY, AS ORDERED BY

THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. YOU AND I HAD ATTENDED A

HEARING A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO WHERE THERE WAS A GREAT DEAL OF

EXPLANATION ABOUT HOW THEY APPROACH THESE LEAKS AND, YOU KNOW, AS

WE LEARNED AT THAT HEARING, IT WASN'T AS COMPREHENSIVE AS WE MIGHT

THINK APPROPRIATE.

MR. PALMESANO: AND WHEN THEY DO THE -- WHEN

THEY DO THESE INSPECTIONS AND DETECTIONS, THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT A WRITTEN

REPORT TO THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION SO THEY KNOW WHAT WAS

COVERED OR NOT COVERED, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES, THEY DO. AND AS I SAID, IT DOESN'T

INCLUDE A LOT OF THE OTHER PROVISIONS THAT WE'RE REQUIRING IN THIS -- IN

THIS BILL.

MR. PALMESANO: OKAY. DOES EACH GAS

CORPORATION, THEY MUST FILE AN ANNUAL REPORT WITH THE PUBLIC SERVICE

COMMISSION DETAILING ALL THE FACTS PERTAINING TO THE OPERATION AND

MAINTENANCE OF ITS PLANT AND SYSTEMS AS REQUIRED BY THE PUBLIC SERVICE

COMMISSION; THAT'S ALSO A REQUIREMENT UNDER THE CURRENT LAW, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. AND I'LL JUST SAY THAT, YOU KNOW,

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

THIS YEAR I ASKED MY STAFF TO LOOK OUT FOR GAS EXPLOSIONS TO SEE IF THE

CURRENT WAY OF DOING BUSINESS WAS ADEQUATE AND JUST FOR THE RECORD,

BECAUSE I THINK YOU KNOW, THIS BILL CAME OUT OF --

MR. PALMESANO: RIGHT.

MS. PAULIN: -- A MANHATTAN PROBLEM THAT WAS A

NUMBER OF YEARS AGO WHERE THERE WAS A TERRIBLE GAS EXPLOSION AND

PEOPLE DIED, AND MANY WERE INJURED. SO I WILL JUST SAY IN JANUARY OF

THIS YEAR, THERE WAS A BRONX GAS EXPLOSION WHERE A 77-YEAR-OLD

WOMAN DIED AND THERE WERE EIGHT OTHERS INJURED, AND THEN IN FEBRUARY

THERE WAS A BROOKLYN GAS EXPLOSION WHERE THERE WERE TWO HOMES

DESTROYED AND A THIRD SEVERELY DAMAGED. AND THERE WAS NO LOSS OF LIFE,

THANK GOD, BUT -- BUT THERE WERE LOSS OF PROPERTY THAT IMPACTED

FAMILIES.

SO I JUST DON'T THINK WHAT'S HAPPENING IS ENOUGH, AND

CLEARLY THESE WERE AREAS WHERE THERE WERE TERRIBLE GAS LEAKS. PEOPLE

REPORTED IT AND, YET, NOTHING WAS DONE. SO YOU KNOW, NEW YORK CITY

IS A BIG PLACE. WE KNOW FROM THAT HEARING THAT, YOU KNOW, LEAKS ARE

DOCUMENTED, BUT NOT ALL OF THEM ARE RECORDED IN A -- IN A TIMELY WAY,

SO THIS WILL FORCE MUCH MORE DETAIL TO BE GIVEN TO DPS FOR THEM, IN

TURN, TO BE ABLE TO EVALUATE.

MR. PALMESANO: SURE, I UNDERSTAND THAT AND

RESPECT WHERE YOU'RE COMING FROM -- FROM THE -- FROM -- WITH THE

LEGISLATION, BUT THERE ARE SOME QUESTIONS I WANT TO GET TO, WHAT'S

REQUIRED NOW THAT'S NOT REQUIRED, BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, I MEAN, THE PUBLIC

SERVICE COMMISSION, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO ENACT ACTUALLY WHAT WE'RE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

DOING HERE UNDER THE CURRENT ORDER AND RULEMAKING PROCESS IF THEY

DETERMINE THAT'S A NECESSARY CHANGE THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE, THEY HAVE

THE ABILITY AS A REG -- THE MAIN REGULATORY AGENCY TO MAKE THESE

CHANGES AND REQUIREMENTS TO THE UTILITY COMPANIES TO PROVIDE THIS DATA

RIGHT NOW IF THEY SO CHOOSE, IF THEY THOUGHT IT WAS NECESSARY, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: I BELIEVE THAT THEY, UNDER THE CURRENT

LAW, COULD LIKELY BE ASKING FOR MORE INFORMATION, BUT THEY'RE NOT AND

WE'RE SEEING THESE GAS LEAKS.

MR. PALMESANO: AND AS PART OF THOSE

REQUIREMENTS, THESE -- EVERY GAS UTILITY IS REALLY REQUIRED TO ALSO SUBMIT

INFORMATION ON -- ON THE VARIOUS SAFETY METRICS, WHAT THE PSC

CONSIDERS AS KEY PERFORMANCE INCIDENTS ON (INAUDIBLE) WHETHER IT'S TO

-- HOW THESE PIPES ARE OPERATING, THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE THAT AS A

REQUIREMENT UNDER PUBLIC SERVICE LAW RIGHT NOW.

MS. PAULIN: I THINK IF REQUESTED, THAT'S WHAT I

REMEMBER FROM THE HEARING.

MR. PALMESANO: OKAY. AND IF A UTILITY FAILS TO

MEET THESE PERFORMANCE LEVELS AS ESTABLISHED IN THEIR RATE PROCEEDINGS,

THE UTILITY MUST SUBMIT AN ACTION PLAN ON IMPROVING THE PERFORMANCE,

THAT'S ALL PART OF THE REQUIREMENT UNDER THE EXISTING LAW THAT WE HAVE AS

FAR AS WHAT THEY HAVE TO REPORT, WHAT THEY HAVE TO PROVIDE FOR THE

PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION FROM A REGULATORY PROCESS, SO THAT'S

ALREADY THERE, THEY NEED TO DO THAT AS WELL, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. THIS IS TO HIGHLIGHT THE ISSUE

BECAUSE WE SEE PROBLEMS OUT THERE. I JUST THINK THAT THERE COULD BE A

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

BETTER JOB BEING DONE AND WITH THESE ADDED REQUIREMENTS, WHICH WE

ALWAYS USUALLY PUT IN THE LAW WHEN WE THINK THAT THERE'S A GAP, THAT,

YOU KNOW, THERE'LL BE MORE DUE DILIGENCE ON THE PART OF BOTH THE UTILITY

AND ON THE PART OF DPS TO REVIEW THIS SITUATION SO IT'S NOT -- SO IT'S NOT A

REACTION TO THE GAS LEAKS AND INSTEAD, PROACTIVELY, THEY'RE GOING TO BE

LOOKING AT COMPLAINTS AND OTHER THINGS BECAUSE THEY KNOW THEY HAVE

TO PUT IT IN A MORE DETAILED WAY IN THE REPORT.

MR. PALMESANO: THE GAS PIPE -- PIPELINE SAFETY

IS ALSO REGULATED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WITH MINIMUM SAFETY

STANDARDS UNDER THE U.S. CODE AND FEDERAL REGULATIONS, SO THERE'S ALSO

STATE REGULATION AND FEDERAL REGULATION INTO THIS PROCESS, AS WELL,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: I'M NOT -- YES. I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT

THE STANDARD BY WHICH THEY HAVE TO HAVE THE PIPES. I'M TALKING ABOUT

THE ACTIVITY IN WHICH THEY REPAIR THEM AND THEY LEARN ABOUT THE

PROBLEMS. WE KNOW FROM THAT HEARING THEY RATE THEM, BUT THOSE

RATINGS CAN CHANGE AND WE DON'T KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT THE PLAN THAT THEY

HAVE TO FIX SOME OF THESE AREAS, SO...

MR. PALMESANO: OKAY. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU,

AMY, FOR YOUR TIME.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. PALMESANO: YES. AS WE -- YOU KNOW, WE

HAVE DISCUSSED THIS BILL SEVERAL TIMES OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS. I

CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND AND RESPECT WHERE THE SPONSOR IS COMING FROM.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

WE CERTAINLY DON'T WANT TO SEE GAS EXPLOSIONS AND PEOPLE DYING OR

BEING HURT. I THINK, THOUGH, FROM MY PERSPECTIVE WHEN I LOOK AT THIS

LEGISLATION, WE ALREADY HAVE REQUIREMENTS IN PLACE THAT ARE ALREADY

THERE FOR GAS UTILITY CORPORATIONS TO COMPLY WITH, THE PUBLIC SERVICE

DETERMINES THAT ADDITIONAL INFORMATION IS NEEDED, THEY HAVE THE ABILITY

RIGHT NOW IF IT'S A PROBLEM TO ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES. THERE'S ALREADY

SUFFICIENT OVERSIGHT THROUGH THIS RATEMAKING PROCESS, REPORTING, THEY

HAVE REGULAR SCHEDULED MEETINGS, SAFETY AUDITS PERFORMED BY GAS

SAFETY STAFF. COMPANIES HAVE TO PARTICIPATE IN THESE RIGOROUS AUDITS,

BOTH OPERATIONAL AND STAFFING AS DETERMINED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF

PUBLIC SERVICE. THERE'S SIGNIFICANT FEDERAL AND STATE REVIEW OF THE

PROCESS, AS WELL.

I THINK WHERE I GET CONCERNED WHEN I LOOK AT

LEGISLATION LIKE THIS IS IT BECOMES -- IS IT REALLY NECESSARY, IT'S

DUPLICATIVE OVER -- AND ALSO WITH THESE NUMEROUS REPORTING

REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE ALREADY IN PLACE, WHEN YOU PUT ADDITIONAL

REQUIREMENTS ON THE UTILITY WHAT THAT ULTIMATELY WILL DO IS IT'S GOING TO

REQUIRE ADDITIONAL COSTS AND THOSE COSTS ARE ULTIMATELY GOING TO BE

BORNE BY THE RATEPAYER. THAT'S SOMETHING WE -- WE CONTINUE TO TALK

ABOUT HERE WITH LEGISLATION, I'LL BRING UP ON PROPOSED LEGISLATION THAT

COMES THROUGH THIS HOUSE ON A REGULAR BASIS. YES, WE WANT TO MAKE

SURE THERE'S SAFETY IN PLACE, BUT THE AGENCY THAT IS IN CHARGE OF THAT

SAFETY, THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION, THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC

SERVICE ALREADY HAS SIGNIFICANT RULES, REGULATIONS, AND REQUIREMENTS IN

PLACE AND IF THEY DETERMINE MORE IS NEEDED TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, THEY

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

-- THE EXPERTS SHOULD BE IMPLEMENTING THAT THROUGH THEIR PROCESS, BUT IF

-- IF WE'RE JUST GOING TO HERE PUT THESE LEGIS -- LEGISLATION IN TO WHICH

PUTS MORE REQUIREMENT, MORE OF A BURDEN, MORE COST ON UTILITIES WHICH

ULTIMATELY, WHEN I TALK ABOUT A UTILITY, I TALK ABOUT A RATEPAYER. AND

WE SEE THE CONTINUING COST OF ENERGY BILLS, WHETHER IT'S ELECTRIC BILLS,

GAS BILLS THIS YEAR, OUR COLLEAGUES, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE

CLCPA, I MEAN, THAT'S GOING TO BE A SIGNIFICANT COST TO OUR PEOPLE

AROUND THE STATE WITH SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN THEIR UTILITY BILLS AND OTHER

COSTS, CONVERSION COSTS, HAVING TO TRANSFER -- CONVERT THEIR HOMES OVER

TO FULL ELECTRIC WITH SOME ESTIMATES SAY IT'S GOING TO COST FAMILIES

$35,000 TO COMPLY WITH COME 2030.

THIS IS ALL INTERWOVEN. THE REASON I'M MAKING THE

CORRELATION IS BECAUSE WE CONTINUE TO SEE LEGISLATION THAT COMES DOWN

THAT PUTS MORE AND MORE MANDATES, MORE AND MORE REQUIREMENTS, AND

IT'S DUPLICATIVE OF WHAT'S ALREADY ON THE BOOKS, WHAT'S REQUIRED, WHAT

CAN BE REQUIRED IF THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION, DEPARTMENT OF

PUBLIC SERVICE DEEMS IT IS NECESSARY. YES, SAFETY IS PARAMOUNT AND

ALWAYS NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED, AND THAT'S -- THAT'S THE JOB OF THE PUBLIC

SERVICE COMMISSION AND THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SERVICE TO MAKE

SURE THOSE RULES, THOSE REGULATIONS ARE IN PLACE, ADDRESS THESE ISSUES. IF

THERE WAS PROBLEMS, THEY NEED TO FIX IT, BUT I JUST THINK US AS THE

LEGISLATURE, JUST PUTTING MORE AND MORE MANDATES AND MORE AND MORE

REPORTING REQUIREMENTS, I DON'T THINK THAT REALLY GETS TO SOLVING THE

PROBLEM NECESSARILY.

I THINK WHAT THAT DOES, AGAIN, IS JUST GOING TO ADD

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

ADDITIONAL COSTS, ADDITIONAL BURDENS ONTO THOSE ORGANIZATIONS WHICH

ARE GOING TO PASS THAT ON TO THE RATEPAYER TIME AND TIME AGAIN. WE SEE

IT ALL THE TIME, OUR OFFICES GET CALLS WHENEVER THEY GO BACK TO THE

PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION FOR RATE INCREASES, PEOPLE DON'T WANT THAT

TO HAPPEN, BUT THEY HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT WHEN YOU PUT MORE

MANDATES ON, MORE REPORTING REQUIREMENTS, WHATEVER IT MAY BE, THERE'S

GOING TO BE RATE CASES THAT THEY'RE GOING TO ASK FOR HIGHER RATES. NO

ONE EVER WANTS TO TALK ABOUT THAT.

AGAIN, THIS GOES BACK TO THE CLCPA, AS WELL, TOTALLY

CHANGING OVER -- TOTALLY REVAMPING OUR WHOLE ENERGY SYSTEM IN THIS

STATE, WHEN WE'RE THE ONLY STATE IN THE COUNTRY DOING THIS. THE

CLCPA ONLY AFFECTS NEW YORK STATE, IT DOESN'T AFFECT CHINA, INDIA OR

RUSSIA, AND NEW YORK ONLY CONTRIBUTES .5 PERCENT OF THE TOTAL CARBON

EMISSIONS GLOBALLY IN THE WORLD BUT, YET, WE'RE DOING ALL THIS WITH THIS

PROCESS TO PUT THESE MANDATES ON OUR FAMILIES, ON OUR FARMERS, ON OUR

SMALL BUSINESSES, ON OUR MANUFACTURERS, AND IT'S A RUNAWAY FREIGHT

TRAIN THAT'S HEADING DOWN THE TRACK THAT THE PUBLIC DOES NOT KNOW

ABOUT BECAUSE NOW WE'VE GOT THESE HEARINGS GOING ON WHICH IS REALLY

UNDER THE RADAR SCREEN.

AND AGAIN, 2030, I MEAN, WHEN I TALKED TO SOME OF

MY COLLEAGUES, THEY SAY THE PUBLIC'S AWARE. I JUST ASK YOU, 2030, HOW

MANY OF YOU TOLD THE CONSTITUENTS YOU REPRESENT THAT BY 2030 IF THEIR

HOME IS POWERED BY NATURAL GAS, AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NATURAL GAS

HERE, IF THEY'RE HEATING WITH NATURAL GAS WHERE 60 PERCENT OF NEW

YORKERS IN THE STATE POWER THEIR HOMES AND HEAT THEIR HOMES WITH

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

NATURAL GAS, 40 PERCENT OF THE GENERATION IS COMING FROM NATURAL GAS,

BUT HAVE YOU TOLD YOUR CONSTITUENTS THAT COME 2030 IF THEIR NATURAL GAS

BOILER BREAKS DOWN, THEY CAN'T JUST GO OUT AND REPLACE IT WITH A NATURAL

GAS BOILER ANYMORE. NO. THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE FULLY ELECTRIFY THEIR

HOME. THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PAY COSTS TO UPDATE, UPGRADE THEIR

INSULATION, THEIR CIRCUIT BOARDS, THEIR PANELS, GET A GEOTHERMAL HEAT

PUMP AT A COST OF $35- TO $45,000 A YEAR. YES, MAYBE THERE'S

SUBSIDIES AND TAX CREDITS. WHEN WE BROUGHT THIS UP DURING THE BUDGET

HEARING, THE LADY FROM THE GEOTHERMAL INDUSTRY SAID, WELL, IT WILL BRING

IT DOWN TO ABOUT $20,000. TELL ME, HOW MANY OF YOUR CONSTITUENTS

CAN AFFORD TO PAY $20,000 OR $30,000 MORE TO CONVERT THEIR HOMES

FROM NATURAL GAS, WHICH IS A RELIABLE SOURCE OF ENERGY, TO FULL

ELECTRIFICATION? THE PUBLIC HAS NO IDEA. THAT'S WHAT COMING FROM THE

POLICIES COMING OUT OF THIS HOUSE.

AND I KNOW THIS BILL MIGHT SEEM LIKE IT'S HARMLESS

FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, BUT IT'S JUST MORE REPORTING REQUIREMENTS, IT'S

MORE MANDATES THAT ARE DUPLICATIVE AND NOT NECESSARY FROM WHAT I CAN

SEE, AND I THINK WE NEED TO BE A LITTLE MORE COGNIZANT OF THE LEGISLATION

WE'RE PASSING AND PUTTING IT ON THE RATEPAYER AND PUTTING IT ON THE

CONSUMERS OF THIS STATE.

SO THIS ALL KIND OF COMES PLACE INTO THE CLCPA FROM

MY PERSPECTIVE. THIS IS A RUNAWAY FREIGHT TRAIN THAT THE PUBLIC HAS NO

IDEA WHAT'S COMING DOWN THE TRACKS. 2030 IS NOT THAT FAR AWAY AND WE

SAY WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS ALL ON OUR OWN. IT'S NOT SAYING WE SHOULDN'T

INVEST IN RENEWABLE ENERGY, BUT WE'RE SAYING WE'RE GOING TO DO THIS ALL

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

ON OUR OWN WHEN CHINA CONTINUES TO BUILD COAL PLANTS AND ARE

CONTRIBUTING 29 PERCENT OF THE TOTAL CARBON EMISSIONS GLOBALLY.

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HELP US. BUT, YET, WE'RE GOING TO DECIMATE OUR

TOTAL ECONOMY AND BANKRUPT FAMILIES, FARMERS, AND BUSINESSES ALL FOR --

BECAUSE WE'RE GOING TO ADDRESS .5 PERCENT OF THE TOTAL CARBON

EMISSIONS, GLOBAL EMISSIONS IN THE WORLD. IT'S NOT GOING TO MAKE A

DIFFERENCE AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE AN IMPACT, AND I JUST DON'T

UNDERSTAND THE POLICY. WHEN I SEE BILLS, WHETHER IT'S PUTTING MORE

MANDATES OR REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE GOING TO IMPACT THE RATEPAYER, GOING

TO IMPACT THE CUSTOMER, I GET MORE AND MORE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT.

SO IT'S PROBABLY A COALITION OF ALL THESE ISSUES WHICH IS

GOING TO LEAD ME TO VOTE AGAINST THIS BILL. AGAIN, UNDERSTANDING WHAT

THE SPONSOR'S TRYING TO DO, SAFETY IS PARAMOUNT AND I CAN UNDERSTAND

PEOPLE SUPPORTING THIS LEGISLATION, BUT THESE ARE THE CONCERNS I HAVE

AND WILL CONTINUE TO RAISE ABOUT HOW WE PUT ADDITIONAL BURDENS AND

REGULATIONS ON THESE BUSINESSES OR THESE UTILITY COMPANIES WHICH IS

GOING TO PASS THAT BURDEN ON TO THE RATEPAYER. AND AGAIN, RISING UTILITY

BILLS, ELECTRIC BILLS, GAS BILLS, PEOPLE ARE SEEING RIGHT NOW. WE'RE ALL

GETTING CALLS IN OUR OFFICE. THIS IS JUST ONE MORE THING THAT'S GOING TO

BE ADDED TO THE PLATE THAT'S GOING TO BE AN ADDITIONAL COST, ADDITIONAL

COST, ADDITIONAL REGULATIONS EQUALS HIGHER COSTS FOR THE RATEPAYER, THE

TAXPAYER, THE FAMILY, THE FARMERS, THE SMALL BUSINESSES, THE

MANUFACTURERS.

AND THOSE ARE CONCERNS I WILL CONTINUE TO BRING UP ON

THIS FLOOR AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY THAT I HAVE BECAUSE I BELIEVE THE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MAJORITY IN THIS HOUSE AND THE EXECUTIVE ARE PUSHING A POLICY BASED

ON IDEOLOGY THAT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING TO AFFECT OR LOOK AT COST AND

AFFORDABILITY TO CONSUMERS. IT DOESN'T LOOK AT ANYTHING TO DEAL WITH

RELIABILITY WHEN WE KNOW NATURAL GAS IS A RELIABLE SOURCE OF ENERGY.

AGAIN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NATURAL GAS HERE. IT'S A RELIABLE SOURCE OF

ENERGY. BUT YOU'RE GOING TO TELL PEOPLE IN WESTERN NEW YORK OR THE

NORTH COUNTRY, COME 2030 YOU CAN'T REPLACE THAT NATURAL GAS BOILER OR

FURNACE, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT A GEOTHERMAL HEAT PUMP IN AND

YOUR PRICES ARE GOING TO SPIKE, BUT, OH YEAH, BY THE WAY, YOU'RE GOING

TO BE RELYING ON ELECTRIC, YOU'RE GOING TO BE RELYING ON SOLAR AND WIND

TO POWER YOUR HOME. I DON'T WANT TO RELY ON SOLAR AND WIND TO POWER

MY HOME, THAT'S NOT A RELIABLE SOURCE OF ENERGY BECAUSE IT'S

INTERMITTENT. SO YOU NEED BACKUP SOURCES OF ENERGY TO DO THAT WHICH

IS WHERE NATURAL GAS COMES IN.

SO THIS HOUSE CONTINUES TO IGNORE THAT, THEY CONTINUE

TO TALK ABOUT HOW GREAT THE CLCPA IS AND HOW WE'RE GOING TO LEAD,

BUT THEY DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE NEGATIVE ASPECTS OF IT AND THE

IMPACTS WHETHER IT COMES TO COST, AFFORDABILITY, AND RELIABILITY. THOSE

ARE KEY ISSUES THAT NEED TO BE ADDRESSED THAT'S NOT BEING ADDRESSED. I

CERTAINLY HOPE THE CLIMATE ACTION COUNCIL LOOKS AT THIS A LITTLE FURTHER

AS WE MOVE FORWARD AND RECOGNIZE THAT NATURAL GAS IS AN IMPORTANT

PART OF OUR ENERGY PORTFOLIO FROM -- FROM AN AFFORDABILITY PERSPECTIVE

AND FROM A RELIABILITY PERSPECTIVE.

SO I THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER AND MY COLLEAGUES, AND I

THANK THE SPONSOR FOR THE DEBATE ON THE BILL. I UNDERSTAND HER INTENTION

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

IS WELL INTENDED, BUT BASED ON THE REASONS I'VE LAID OUT HERE OVER THE

PAST 14-AND-A-HALF MINUTES, I AM GOING TO BE VOTING NO ON THIS

LEGISLATION. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE ON ASSEMBLY PRINT 129-A. THIS IS A PARTY VOTE. ANY MEMBER

WHO WISHES TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION

IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBERS

PREVIOUSLY REPORTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS BILL FOR THE REASONS ARTICULATED

BY MY COLLEAGUE, BUT CERTAINLY THOSE WHO SUPPORT IT CAN VOTE IN FAVOR

ON THE FLOOR OF THE ASSEMBLY HERE, OR BY CALLING THE MINORITY LEADER'S

OFFICE. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF

THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE A FEW THAT WOULD LIKE

TO BE AN EXCEPTION. IF SO, THEY SHOULD PLEASE FEEL FREE TO CONTACT THE

MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND WE WILL ENSURE THEIR VOTE IS PROPERLY

RECORDED.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MA'AM.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ARE THERE ANY OTHER

VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 10, CALENDAR NO. 78, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01514, CALENDAR NO.

78, DINOWITZ, REYES, SAYEGH, GOTTFRIED, GALEF, SIMON, STIRPE, STECK,

GLICK, ZEBROWSKI, WEPRIN, CRUZ, FERNANDEZ, KELLES, JACKSON. AN ACT

TO AMEND THE GENERAL OBLIGATIONS LAW, IN RELATION TO PROHIBITING

EMPLOYERS FROM REQUIRING CERTAIN CONDITIONS OR PRECONDITIONS OF

EMPLOYMENT.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: AN EXPLANATION IS

REQUESTED.

MR. DINOWITZ: THE BILL AMENDS THE GENERAL

OBLIGATIONS LAW BY PROHIBITING ANY EMPLOYER FROM REQUIRING AN

EMPLOYEE OR PERSON SEEKING EMPLOYMENT TO WAIVE, ARBITRATE OR

OTHERWISE DIMINISH ANY EXISTING OR FUTURE CLAIM RIGHT OR BENEFIT TO

WHICH THE EMPLOYEE OR PERSON SEEKING EMPLOYMENT WOULD OTHERWISE

BE ENTITLED TO UNDER ANY PROVISION OF NEW YORK OR FEDERAL LAW. AND

THE SECTION HERE WOULD ALSO SPECIFICALLY EXEMPT CONTRACTS OR

AGREEMENTS NEGOTIATED WITH ANY LABOR UNION THROUGH COLLECTIVE

BARGAINING.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MR. GOODELL.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

WOULD THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MR. DINOWITZ, WILL

YOU YIELD?

MR. DINOWITZ: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. DINOWITZ. AS I

UNDERSTAND IT, THIS BILL WOULD PROHIBIT AN EMPLOYER OR EMPLOYEES

OUTSIDE OF A COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT FROM AGREEING TO

ARBITRATION TO RESOLVE ANY EMPLOYMENT DISPUTES; IS THAT CORRECT?

MR. DINOWITZ: IT WOULD PROHIBIT AN EMPLOYER

FROM MANDATING OR MAKING IT AS A CONDITION THAT THE EMPLOYEE AGREED

TO THAT UNWILLINGLY.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, AS YOU KNOW IN 2017 THERE

WAS A KENTUCKY STATE COURT CASE, NORTHERN KENTUCKY AREA

DEVELOPMENT V. SNYDER, AND I BELIEVE THAT WENT UP AS WELL ON THE

FEDERAL COURT, DEALING WITH THE EXCLUSIVITY OF THE FEDERAL ARBITRATION

ACT. AND IN THAT CASE, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, THE COURT RULED THAT THE

FEDERAL ARBITRATION ACT PREEMPTS STATE LAW IN THIS AREA AND WOULD

PROHIBIT THIS TYPE OF LEGISLATION. IS THIS LEGISLATION IN ANY WAY DIFFERENT

THAN THE LEGISLATION THAT WAS STRUCK DOWN IN THAT CASE?

MR. DINOWITZ: YES. WELL, FIRST OF ALL, IT'S NEW

YORK AND, SECONDLY, IT'S NOT EXACTLY THE SAME.

MR. GOODELL: AND WHAT -- WHY WOULD THIS NOT BE

PREEMPTED BY A FEDERAL ARBITRATION -- THE FEDERAL ARBITRATION ACT?

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. DINOWITZ: I DON'T BELIEVE IT IS. I THINK THE

PURPOSE OF THIS IS BECAUSE WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT -- THAT EMPLOYEES

OR POTENTIAL EMPLOYEES AREN'T COERCED INTO SIGNING AGREEMENTS THAT

THEY DON'T WANT TO SIGN, BUT FEEL THEY HAVE NO CHOICE IN SIGNING AND

THAT'S THE PURPOSE OF THIS. AND THESE RESTRICTIVE OR FORCE OF

EMPLOYMENT CONTRACTS I BELIEVE SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED IN THE STATE OF

NEW YORK.

MR. GOODELL: AS YOU KNOW, THIS WAS ALSO DEALT

WITH IN THE U.S. SUPREME COURT CIRCUIT CITY STORES V. ADAMS WHICH

HELD THAT CONTRACTS OF EMPLOYMENT WERE NOT EXCLUDED FROM THE FEDERAL

ARBITRATION ACT AND, THUS, MANY EMPLOYEES ARE SUBJECT FOR MANDATORY

ARBITRATION AND THAT WAS PREEMPTED BY FEDERAL LAW. IS THERE ANY

DISTINCTION BETWEEN THAT LEGISLATION AND THIS LEGISLATION?

MR. DINOWITZ: WELL, I MEAN, NEITHER YOU NOR I ARE

JUDGES SO WE'RE NOT IN A POSITION TO INTERPRET OTHER RULINGS, BUT I WOULD

SAY THAT THIS -- THAT THOSE CASES ARE NOT ON POINT IN TERMS OF WHAT THIS

LEGISLATION DEALS WITH. THE LEGISLATION IS ONLY SIX LINES LONG IN TERMS OF

THE HEART OF THE LEGISLATION, AND I THINK IT'S PRETTY CLEAR WHAT IT TRIES TO

DO, AND I'M SURE THAT DEEP DOWN, YOU REALLY WOULD SUPPORT THAT

BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT WORKERS IN YOUR DISTRICT COERCED INTO SIGNING

SOMETHING THAT THEY FEEL THAT THEY SHOULDN'T SIGN, AS I -- AND I WOULDN'T

WANT THAT EITHER.

MR. GOODELL: BUT THERE IS NO QUESTION

WHATSOEVER THAT THE PURPOSE OF THIS LEGISLATION IS TO BAR MANDATORY

ARBITRATION CLAUSES AND EMPLOYMENT AGREEMENTS. I MEAN, THAT'S THE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

WHOLE PURPOSE OF THIS, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF COLLECTIVE BARGAINING

AGREEMENTS, CORRECT?

MR. DINOWITZ: WELL, NO, I WOULD PUT IT A LITTLE

DIFFERENTLY. I WOULD SAY THAT THE MAIN PURPOSE IS TO PREVENT EMPLOYEES

OR POTENTIAL EMPLOYEES FROM BEING COERCED INTO SIGNING AGREEMENTS.

MR. GOODELL: OKAY. JUST MORE RECENTLY, CHIEF

JUDGE DIFIORE STATED IN FEBRUARY OF 2020, SO JUST A COUPLE YEARS AGO,

IN HER STATE OF THE JUDICIARY THAT, QUOTE, "ARBITRATION AND MEDIATION

SHOULD BE UTILIZED MORE FREQUENTLY IN CIVIL CASES," AND SHE CITED THAT

PIECE, ALTERNATIVE DISPUTE PROCESSES ARE, ONE, THAT STREAMLINE

LITIGATION, MAKE NEW YORK COURTS MORE AFFORDABLE. WOULD YOU

DISAGREE WITH HER ANALYSIS AS IT RELATES TO EMPLOYMENT ARBITRATION?

MR. DINOWITZ: WELL, I DON'T BELIEVE HER WORDS IN

THE STATE OF THE JUDICIARY ARE PART OF A COURT RULING, AND WHILE IN SOME

CASES ARBITRATION MAY ACTUALLY MAKE SENSE, BUT THE ISSUE HERE IS NOT

NECESSARILY WHETHER ARBITRATION IS GOOD OR BAD, IT'S WHETHER AN

EMPLOYEE SHOULD BE COERCED INTO SIGNING AN AGREEMENT THAT WOULD

ALLOW FOR ARBITRATION. SO I'M NOT GOING TO AGREE WITH JUDGE DIFIORE

BECAUSE SHE COULD BE RIGHT SOMETIMES, BUT NOT NECESSARILY ALL THE TIME

ON THIS. SOMETIMES IT'S GOOD, SOMETIMES IT'S BAD, BUT IT SHOULDN'T BE --

IT SHOULDN'T BE THAT AN INDIVIDUAL IS SUBJECT TO COERCION.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, YOU USED THE WORD COERCION,

BUT THIS BILL BARS ANY ARBITRATION AGREEMENT IN A CONTRACT AS A

PRECONDITION FOR EMPLOYMENT. ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT EMPLOYEES ARE

BEING COERCED TO ACCEPT THE JOB ON THOSE TERMS AND CONDITIONS?

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. DINOWITZ: NO. I'M SUGGESTING THAT THEY

WOULD BE COERCED INTO ACCEPTING REQUIREMENTS OF ARBITRATION TO GET THE

JOB.

MR. GOODELL: WELL, YOU'RE USING THE WORD

COERCED IN A VERY INTERESTING WAY BECAUSE CLEARLY ANY EMPLOYEE WHO

ACCEPTS A JOB AGREES TO ACCEPT A JOB ON THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS THAT

THE EMPLOYER SET FORTH. AND THE EMPLOYER MIGHT SAY, THESE ARE YOUR

HOURS THAT YOU HAVE TO WORK, RIGHT? ARE YOU SAYING THE EMPLOYEE IS

THEN COERCED INTO WORKING THOSE HOURS? AND THE EMPLOYER MIGHT SAY,

THIS IS A DRESS CODE, ARE YOU SAYING EMPLOYEES ARE NOW COERCED INTO

WEARING THAT DRESS CODE OR COMPLYING WITH IT? I MEAN, THESE ARE ALL

TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF EMPLOYMENT, THERE'S NO COERCION ANY MORE

THAN THERE IS IN ANY OTHER TERM AND CONDITION. THEY CAN EITHER ACCEPT

THE JOB WITH THOSE TERMS AND CONDITIONS, WEAR THE UNIFORM REQUIRED BY

THE EMPLOYER, WORK THE HOURS REQUIRED BY THE EMPLOYER, COMPLY WITH

ALL THE OTHER TERMS AND CONDITIONS SET (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) OR NOT.

MR. DINOWITZ: EXCEPT FOR THE LACK OF MINIMUM

WAGES OR EXCEPT THE LACK OF HEALTH COVERAGE. YEAH, A LOT OF PEOPLE

DESPITE THE FACT THAT WE DO HAVE A BOOMING ECONOMY WITH AMAZINGLY

LOW UNEMPLOYMENT RATE IN THIS COUNTRY AT THE MOMENT, UNLIKE A YEAR OR

TWO AGO, THE FACT IS THERE ARE MANY PEOPLE WHO VERY MUCH NEED A JOB

AND WOULD FEEL THAT THEY HAVE TO ACCEPT EVEN UNJUST TERMS TO GET THE

JOB. I MEAN, THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS AND I WOULD HOPE THAT YOU MIGHT

BE A LITTLE MORE SYMPATHETIC TO THE PLIGHT THAT MANY PEOPLE FACE RIGHT

NOW. PEOPLE -- THERE ARE STILL MANY PEOPLE WHO NEED JOBS AND MOST

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

PEOPLE, WHEN FACED WITH A CHOICE OF BEING OUT OF WORK OR TAKING THE

JOB EVEN THOUGH THERE ARE SOME REALLY BAD CONDITIONS, WILL STILL TAKE

THE JOB BECAUSE THEY FEEL THEY HAVE NO OTHER CHOICE. THEY WANT TO

PROVIDE FOR THEMSELVES AND FOR THEIR FAMILY, AND THAT'S WHAT I MEAN BY

COERCION. AND THERE ARE MANY THINGS THAT PEOPLE DO AGREE TO WHEN

YOU TAKE A JOB. YOU KNOW WHAT THE SALARY IS GOING TO BE, OR YOU

SHOULD KNOW WHAT THE SALARY IS GOING TO BE, BUT IN TERMS OF SIGNING

UNJUST CONDITIONS TO GET THE JOB, NO, I DO BELIEVE THAT'S COERCION. I

BELIEVE THAT THE TWO SIDES ARE NOT EQUAL IN TERMS OF THE POWER THAT THEY

HAVE, AND WE DON'T WANT THAT TO BE THE CASE. WE DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO

ACCEPT A JOB WITH CONDITIONS THAT ARE JUST INAPPROPRIATE, UNJUST, AND

COERCIVE.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, AS I MENTIONED BEFORE, I'VE

REPRESENTED MANAGEMENT AND I'VE REPRESENTED UNIONS, AND MY

EXPERIENCE IS THAT UNIONS OFTEN NEGOTIATE FOR ARBITRATION. AND I SEE THAT

IF A UNION WANTS ARBITRATION AND NEGOTIATES FOR IT, THAT WOULD BE

ALLOWED UNDER THIS BILL, CORRECT?

MR. DINOWITZ: IF IT'S THE SUBJECT OF NEGOTIATION

BETWEEN TWO PARTIES, BOTH OF WHOM ARE SORT OF ON THE SAME LEVEL IN

TERMS OF THE POWER THAT THEY HAVE, THAT'S A DIFFERENT SITUATION THAN

WHEN ONE INDIVIDUAL ACTING ALONE WITHOUT THE BACKING OF A UNION HAS

TO SIGN A CONTRACT WITH AN EMPLOYER.

MR. GOODELL: SO I GO BACK TO THE EARLIER PREMISE,

IF UNIONS ARE NEGOTIATING FOR ARBITRATION AND THIS BILL ALLOWS THAT

ARBITRATION, WHY ARE WE EXCLUDING NONUNIONIZED EMPLOYEES FROM

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

SEEKING THAT SAME TYPE OF PROTECTION?

MR. DINOWITZ: I DON'T THINK THIS BILL SO MUCH

EXCLUDES THAT AS IT PROVIDES THAT THEY SHOULDN'T BE FORCED TO ACCEPT IT.

THERE'S A BIG DIFFERENCE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS, AS

ALWAYS.

MADAM SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ON THE BILL.

MR. GOODELL: OBVIOUSLY THIS BILL REFLECTS A

CONTINUING EFFORT BY THIS BODY TO PROHIBIT ARBITRATION, NOTWITHSTANDING

THE FACT THAT ALMOST EVERYONE OUTSIDE OF THIS BODY BELIEVES THAT

ARBITRATION IS A FASTER, MORE EFFICIENT AND, IN MANY WAYS, A MUCH BETTER

WAY OF RESOLVING DISPUTES, ESPECIALLY IN THE EMPLOYMENT CONTEXT. AND

IT'S BETTER FOR THE EMPLOYEE BECAUSE IT'S FASTER, SO THEY GET THE

EMPLOYMENT ISSUE RESOLVED QUICKER; IT'S LESS EXPENSIVE, WHICH IS GREAT

FOR AN EMPLOYEE WHO DOESN'T WANT TO HAVE TO INVEST A LOT OF MONEY IN

LEGAL FEES; AND IN ADDITION TO BEING FASTER AND LESS EXPENSIVE, IT'S MORE

ACCESSIBLE FOR AN EMPLOYEE. AND FOR THESE REASONS, UNIONS TYPICALLY

NEGOTIATE FOR ARBITRATION CLAUSES BECAUSE IT HELP EMPLOYEES.

AND, OF COURSE, WE HAVE OUR OWN CHIEF JUDGE ONCE

AGAIN SAYING THAT ARBITRATION AND MEDIATION SHOULD BE UTILIZED MORE

FREQUENTLY. WHY? BECAUSE THE COURT SYSTEM IS ALL BACKED UP,

ESPECIALLY WITH COVID. AND AS A PRACTICING ATTORNEY, I CAN TELL YOU

THE COURT SYSTEM IS EXPENSIVE, TIME-CONSUMING, AND SLOW. AND FOR AN

EMPLOYMENT DISPUTE TO BE RESOLVED IN THE COURTS, YOU'RE LOOKING AT

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MONTHS IF NOT YEARS BEFORE IT GETS RESOLVED. THESE BINDING ARBITRATIONS

ARE A TREMENDOUS BENEFIT FOR EMPLOYEES AND THAT'S WHY, FOR EXAMPLE,

THE CAPITAL REGION CHAMBER WROTE AND SAID, THE ASSOCIATED COSTS FOR

EMPLOYEES ARE LOWER, AND ARBITRATION ALLOWS FOR A FASTER RESOLUTION IN

COMPARISON TO WHAT'S AVAILABLE THROUGH THE COURT SYSTEM. THE RULES

GOVERNING ARBITRATION, AS WELL AS THE OVERSIGHT BY THE COURTS, ENSURE A

FAIR PROCESS FOR ALL PARTIES INVOLVED.

SO IN ADDITION TO CONFLICTING WITH THE FEDERAL

ARBITRATION ACT, WHICH PREEMPTS THIS FIELD AS THE U.S. SUPREME COURT

HAS HELD, THIS LEGISLATION INADVERTENTLY HURTS EMPLOYEES BY MAKING IT

EXTRAORDINARILY SLOW, DIFFICULT, AND EXPENSIVE FOR THEM TO RESOLVE

EMPLOYMENT DISPUTES BY BANNING THIS AS A TERM AND CONDITION OF

EMPLOYMENT EXCEPT WHEN NEGOTIATED BY A UNION. FOR THAT REASON, I

WOULD RECOMMEND MY COLLEAGUES VOTE AGAINST THIS. AGAIN, THANK YOU

TO MY COLLEAGUE, I ALWAYS APPRECIATE HIS INSIGHTS. THANK YOU, MADAM

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 90TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE ON A1514. THIS IS A PARTY VOTE. ANY MEMBER WHO WISHES TO

BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION IS REMINDED TO

CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBERS PREVIOUSLY

PROVIDED.

MR. GOODELL.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. THE

REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE WILL GENERALLY BE OPPOSED TO THIS, BECAUSE WE

FAVOR QUICK AND CHEAP RESOLUTION OF EMPLOYMENT ISSUES BY EMPLOYEES,

BUT THOSE WHO SUPPORT THE BILL ARE CERTAINLY FREE TO VOTE HERE ON THE

FLOOR IN FAVOR OF IT, OR CONTACT THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE. THANK

YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MS. HYNDMAN.

MS. HYNDMAN: I WOULD LIKE TO -- THANK YOU,

MADAM SPEAKER. I WOULD LIKE TO REMIND MY COLLEAGUES THAT THIS IS A

PARTY VOTE. MAJORITY MEMBERS WILL BE RECORDED IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. IF

THERE ARE ANY EXCEPTIONS, PLEASE CALL -- IF THERE ARE ANY EXCEPTIONS FOR

MAJORITY MEMBERS, PLEASE CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AT THE

NUMBER PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED AND YOUR NAME WILL BE ANNOUNCED.

THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MR. WALCZYK TO

EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. WALCZYK: THANK YOU, MADAM

SPEAKER, TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. THIS IS NOT A BUDGET BILL, IT HAS NOTHING

TO DO WITH THE MOST PRESSING OF ISSUES IN FRONT OF NEW YORK STATE RIGHT

KNOW AND I VOTE NO.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ARE THERE ANY OTHER

VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

PAGE 11, CALENDAR NO. 102, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A02266, CALENDAR NO.

102, AUBRY, ZEBROWSKI, EPSTEIN, SAYEGH. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PENAL

LAW, IN RELATION TO CRIMINAL MISCHIEF IN THE THIRD DEGREE AND CRIMINAL

MISCHIEF IN THE SECOND DEGREE.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: AN EXPLANATION IS

REQUESTED.

MR. AUBRY: CERTAINLY, MADAM SPEAKER. THIS BILL

RAISES THE MONETARY THRESHOLD OF PROPERTY THAT IS CONSIDERED

INTENTIONALLY DAMAGED FOR CRIMINAL MISCHIEF IN THE THIRD DEGREE, AN E

FELONY, FROM $250 TO $1,000. IT ALSO RAISES THE MONETARY THRESHOLD OF

PROPERTY THAT IS CONSIDERED INTENTIONALLY DAMAGED FOR CRIMINAL

MISCHIEF IN THE SECOND DEGREE, A D FELONY, FROM $1,500 TO $3,000.

UNDER STATE LAW, DAMAGING PROPERTY IN EXCESS OF $250 IS A FELONY,

WHILE ACTUALLY STEALING THE SAME AMOUNT OF PROPERTY IS A MISDEMEANOR.

THIS CORRECTS AN OVERSIGHT BY THE LEGISLATURE THAT HAS BEEN AROUND FOR

AWHILE. I THINK THE ORIGINAL DATE OF ESTABLISHING THIS WAS 1915, WHICH

IS WHEN BABE RUTH HIT HIS FIRST HOME RUN, WHICH IS WHEN THE LUSITANIA

WAS SUNK, WHEN WOODROW WILSON WAS PRESIDENT, AND WHEN SINGERS

BILLIE HOLIDAY AND FRANK SINATRA WERE BORN. UNFORTUNATELY, BILLIE

HOLIDAY DIED IN A NEW YORK CITY HOSPITAL WITH $70 IN HER ACCOUNT,

AND FRANK SINATRA DIED A BILLIONAIRE. INEQUITIES OF THE WORLD CONTINUE.

SO THAT'S THE PURPOSE OF THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MS. WALSH.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. WILL THE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

SPONSOR YIELD FOR JUST A COUPLE QUESTIONS?

MR. AUBRY: CERTAINLY, MS. WALSH.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU SO MUCH. SO I THINK THAT

ALL OF US UNDERSTAND THE IDEA THAT OVER THE LAST 100 YEARS THERE HAVE

BEEN INFLATIONARY CHANGES, SO CHANGING THE THRESHOLD I UNDERSTAND THAT

THAT'S THE REASON FOR THE -- FOR THE BILL IS TO KIND OF ADJUST THOSE UP AFTER

BEING SO LONG AT THE -- THE SAME LEVEL. MY QUESTION HAS TO DO WITH SO

AS YOU MENTIONED, THE CHANGES THAT THIS BILL MAKES ARE TO CRIMINAL

MISCHIEF THE THIRD AND CRIMINAL MISCHIEF SECOND. ARE THERE ANY

CHANGES IN THIS BILL TO CRIMINAL MISCHIEF FOURTH?

MR. AUBRY: NO.

MS. WALSH: OKAY. SO WHAT IF -- SAY THAT THIS

LEGISLATION IS PASSED AND BECOMES LAW, WHAT HAPPENS IN THE FUTURE IF

THERE'S DAMAGED PROPERTY THAT IS WORTH MORE THAN $250 BUT LESS THAN

$1,000. WHAT IS THE CHARGE GOING TO BE FOR THAT?

MR. AUBRY: WELL, IF CRIMINAL MISCHIEF HAPPENS

UNDER THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES, IT WOULD BE DEALT WITH UNDER THE PROVISIONS

OF THE LAW AS IT STANDS AT THAT TIME FOR CRIMINAL MISCHIEF IN THE FOURTH.

RIGHT. SO WE DON'T CHANGE THAT. THAT WOULD BE SUBJECT AND CERTAINLY

MAY CONSIDER THAT, BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT THIS BILL CONSIDERS.

MS. WALSH: OKAY. BECAUSE RIGHT NOW UNDER

CURRENT LAW, CRIMINAL MISCHIEF IN THE FOURTH IS FOR DAMAGE IN ANY

AMOUNT BELOW $250 AND SO IF WE DON'T CHANGE THAT THRESHOLD THEN, ISN'T

THERE A GAP THEN BETWEEN SAY $251 OF VALUE UP TO $999? ISN'T THAT JUST

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AN AMBIGUITY THEN THAT GETS CREATED IN THE LAW?

MR. AUBRY: THERE CERTAINLY IS THE OPPORTUNITY FOR

YOU AND I TO JOIN TOGETHER AND SPONSOR ANOTHER BILL TO CORRECT THAT. IT

TOOK ONLY 107 YEARS TO GET TO THIS, I'M SURE IT WILL TAKE US A SHORTER

PERIOD OF TIME.

MS. WALSH: VERY GOOD. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

MADAM SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ON THE BILL.

MS. WALSH: SO REALLY, MY THOUGHT, AS I SAID, I

PERSONALLY DON'T HAVE ANY ISSUE WITH CHANGING THRESHOLDS, ESPECIALLY

WHEN IT'S BEEN, YOU KNOW, A CENTURY SINCE IT HAD BEEN CHANGED. I

UNDERSTAND THAT. MY CONCERN HAS TO DO MORE WITH THE RIPPLE EFFECT THAT

HAPPENS WHEN YOU ADDRESS A PORTION OF THE CRIMINAL STATUTE AND NOT ALL

OF IT. SO -- AND I APPRECIATE THE SPONSOR'S ANSWERS TO MY QUESTION.

SO WHAT THIS BILL DOES, AS FAR AS I CAN TELL, IS THAT IF

THERE'S DAMAGED PROPERTY THAT'S UNDER $1,000 IN VALUE, I THINK THAT

WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN IS THAT THERE WOULD BE A MISDEMEANOR CHARGE AND

AN AUTOMATIC DESK APPEARANCE TICKET FOR DAMAGE TO ITEMS THAT ARE

WORTH UNDER $1,000, BUT IT'S NOT REALLY CLEAR BECAUSE THERE WEREN'T ANY

CHANGES IN THIS BILL MADE TO CRIMINAL MISCHIEF IN THE FOURTH.

SO AGAIN, PICKING UP ON THAT IDEA OF THE RIPPLE EFFECT

AND MAYBE THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES SHOULD THIS BILL BE ENACTED,

STEALING AN ITEM VALUED AT UNDER 1,000 WOULD BE PUNISHABLE AS A CLASS

A MISDEMEANOR, BUT RECKLESS DESTROYING THE SAME ITEM WOULD NOT BE

AN OFFENSE, NOTWITHSTANDING THAT RECKLESSLY ENDANGERING PROPERTY

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

VALUED AT OVER $250 WOULD BE A CLASS B MISDEMEANOR. SO THE ISSUE IS

THAT AS YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO DESTROY PROPERTY WITHOUT ENDANGERING

PROPERTY, YOU KNOW, IT'S ARGUABLE THAT THOSE WHO RECKLESSLY DESTROY THE

PROPERTY COULD BE CHARGED WITH A LESSER ENDANGERING OFFENSE AS A CLASS

B MISDEMEANOR.

SO ALTHOUGH THE NEW YORK STATE DEFENDERS

ASSOCIATION DOES SUPPORT THIS LEGISLATION, IN THE PAST WE'VE HAD -- THE

MOST RECENT VOTE THAT WE HAD IN 2019 DID HAVE I THINK 22 NO VOTES, AND

THIS BILL ITSELF HAS BEEN UNDER CONSIDERATION IN THIS HOUSE SINCE 2009.

SO I JUST THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WHEN WE DO CREATE LEGISLATION, I

UNDERSTAND I THINK THE REASON FOR WANTING TO DO IT, BUT I THINK WE HAVE

TO BE CAREFUL THAT WE DON'T HAVE AN UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE OR

CONFUSION FROM THE RIPPLE EFFECT OF CHANGING THESE DIFFERENT THRESHOLDS.

SO FOR THAT REASON, I'M NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT

THE LEGISLATION AS IT'S CURRENTLY DRAFTED. PERHAPS THIS COULD BE CORRECTED

IN, AS THE SPONSOR INDICATED, MAYBE SUBSEQUENT LEGISLATION OR A CHAPTER

AMENDMENT, BUT AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW I WON'T BE IN SUPPORT. THANK

YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MR. TANNOUSIS.

MR. TANNOUSIS: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ON THE BILL.

MR. TANNOUSIS: MADAM SPEAKER, AT A TIME WHEN

VIOLENCE HAS INCREASED DRASTICALLY IN OUR STATE AND IN OUR GREAT CITY OF

NEW YORK, I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THIS IS THE RIGHT TIME TO TIE THE HANDS

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

OF OUR DISTRICT ATTORNEYS' OFFICES AND OF OUR LAW ENFORCEMENT. AS A

PROSECUTOR, I SAW THIS CHARGE MORE PREVALENT IN DOMESTIC VIOLENCE

CASES, FOR EXAMPLE, WHERE TWO PARTIES WOULD GET INTO A DOMESTIC

ARGUMENT. ONE OF THEM WOULD BREAK THE OTHER'S IPHONE AND, OF COURSE,

A USED IPHONE EVEN SO WOULD HAVE A VALUE OF OVER $250. AND IF WE

PASS THIS BILL, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT THE AMOUNT HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED

IN OVER 100 YEARS, IF WE PASS THIS BILL I THINK THAT THIS GOES INTO A

CONTINUED PROCESS OF THIS BODY TO TIE THE HANDS OF OUR LAW ENFORCEMENT

TO NOT GIVE THEM THE PROPER TOOLS TO KEEP US SAFE. FOR THAT REASON, I'M

IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MR. REILLY.

MR. REILLY: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: ON THE BILL.

MR. REILLY: SO MY COLLEAGUES HAVE POINTED OUT

SOME SPECIFIC ISSUES THAT ARISE FROM US TAKING UP THIS LEGISLATION. ONE

OF THE ISSUES WAS THE DEFICIENCY IN THE NUMERIC VALUE OF THE CRIME

WHERE THERE'S A GAP IN THIS CURRENT LEGISLATION. AND YES, I UNDERSTAND

THE SPONSOR AND OUR COLLEAGUE THAT WAS ON DEBATE SAID THAT THEY WOULD

WORK TOGETHER, AND I'M SURE ALL OF US IN THIS CHAMBER WOULD WORK

TOGETHER TO FIX THOSE CHANGES; UNFORTUNATELY, WE SEE HOW SLOW THINGS

TURN HERE. AND WE WAIT, AND WE WAIT, AND WE WAIT, ESPECIALLY ON THE

CRIMINAL JUSTICE FRONT. THESE CHANGES, IN FACT, ARE HOLDING UP BUDGET

NEGOTIATIONS TODAY. WE'RE A NUMBER OF DAYS LATE ON THE STATE BUDGET,

AND THAT'S THE PROBLEM I HAVE, THAT WE'RE ALWAYS RUSHING TO BE THE FIRST,

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

THAT WE DON'T GET IT RIGHT. AND YES, I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S A GAP HERE

AND IT HASN'T BEEN RAISED IN A CENTURY, AND YES, IS THERE A WAY TO FIX THIS

AND TO CORRECT IT. THERE IS, BUT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DO THINGS

THE RIGHT WAY BECAUSE ONCE WE PASS THIS AND ONCE THE SENATE PASSES IT

AND THE GOVERNOR SIGNS IT INTO LAW, WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT THIS TWO,

THREE, MAYBE FOUR BUDGET SEASONS FROM NOW, LOOKING TO CHANGE

SOMETHING. WE SHOULD HAVE GOT THIS CORRECT, WE COULD HAVE GOTTEN THIS

CORRECT, BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT'S ALBANY AND THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

WE NEED TO BE MORE INTENTIONAL WITH THE WORK THAT WE

DO, AND TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO GO BACK AND HAVE FIXES.

JUST LIKE EVERY YEAR WE COME BACK AND WE GET AMENDMENTS TO THE

LEGISLATION THAT ARE BEING CORRECTED. WE CAN AVOID THAT BY MAKING SURE

THAT WE FIX THAT GAP NOW BEFORE WE ACTUALLY PASS IT AND HAVE TO WAIT

FOR THOSE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. FOR THAT REASON, I WILL

UNFORTUNATELY BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT NOVEMBER

1ST.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE ON A2266. THIS IS A PARTY VOTE. ANY MEMBER WHO WISHES TO

BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION IS REMINDED TO

CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBERS PREVIOUSLY

PROVIDED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. THE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE WILL BE GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS LEGISLATION,

BUT CERTAINLY ANY MEMBER THAT WANTS TO VOTE IN FAVOR IS ENCOURAGED TO

DO SO ON THE FLOOR OR BY CALLING THE MINORITY LEADER. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MADAM

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF

THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE A FEW THAT DESIRE TO BE

AN EXCEPTION. THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE TO REACH OUT TO THE MAJORITY

LEADER'S OFFICE AND WE WILL MAKE SURE THEIR VOTE IS PROPERLY RECORDED.

THANK YOU, MA'AM.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MADAM SPEAKER, IF YOU

COULD RECORD OUR COLLEAGUES MR. ENGLEBRIGHT, MRS. GUNTHER, AND MR.

COLTON IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: THANK YOU.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 18, CALENDAR NO. 182, CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05618, CALENDAR NO.

182, HYNDMAN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL OBLIGATIONS LAW, IN

RELATION TO THE PROVISIONS OF CONSUMER AND EMPLOYMENT CONTRACTS.

ACTING SPEAKER ROZIC: AN EXPLANATION IS

REQUESTED.

MS. HYNDMAN: THIS BILL WOULD GIVE CONSUMERS

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AND EMPLOYEES THE RIGHT TO REFORM CONTRACTS THAT ARE NOT WRITTEN IN

PLAIN LANGUAGE, OR WHICH ARE NOT WHOLLY ENCOMPASSED WITHIN A SINGLE

DOCUMENT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. WALSH.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. HYNDMAN: YES, I WILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU SO MUCH. THERE WE GO.

THANK YOU. I JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR YOU ABOUT THE BILL.

SO UNDER GENERAL OBLIGATIONS LAW SECTION 5-702, THAT PROVISION

ALREADY REQUIRES THE USE OF PLAIN LANGUAGE IN CONSUMER TRANSACTIONS SO

WHY, THEN, IS THIS BILL NECESSARY?

MS. HYNDMAN: WELL, THIS BILL IS NECESSARY

BECAUSE IT APPLIES TO CONSUMER AND EMPLOYMENT CONTRACTS, AND THAT --

THE SECTION OF THE GENERAL LAW THAT YOU CITED I BELIEVE IS -- ELUDES TO

PERSONAL PROPERTY.

MS. WALSH: BUT DOESN'T THIS BILL DO MORE THAN JUST

SIMPLY REQUIRE PLAIN LANGUAGE?

MS. HYNDMAN: WELL, AS YOU KNOW, A LOT OF TIMES

PEOPLE COME TO US IF THEY HAVE CONTRACTS THAT THEY'RE NOT REALLY ABLE TO

DECIPHER, THEY THINK AS LEGISLATORS WE WILL BE ABLE TO HELP THEM WITH IT.

SO THIS ALLOWS IT TO BE REFORMED IN A PLAIN LANGUAGE FOR CONSUMERS AND

EMPLOYEES WITHOUT HAVING TO LOOK FOR OTHER SOURCES TO REFUTE THEIR

DOCUMENTS THAT -- THE CONTRACTS.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MS. WALSH: ALL RIGHT. SO -- AND I THINK ALL OF US

WANT TO BE SURE THAT CONTRACTS ARE CLEAR AND THAT PEOPLE UNDERSTAND

THEM BEFORE SIGNING THEM, I THINK WE ALL WANT THAT. BUT DOESN'T THIS

BILL ALSO ALLOW A CONSUMER OR AN EMPLOYEE IN THE CASE OF AN

EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT TO ACTUALLY SEEK A COURT ORDER TO -- WELL, THE TERM

IN THE BILL SAYS REFORMING ANY CONTRACT, AND THAT WAS THE POINT OF MY

QUESTIONS IS WHAT DOES IT MEAN BY REFORMING THE CONTRACT? IT ALLOWS --

IT ALLOWS THE CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE TO ACTUALLY GO TO COURT TO, I GUESS,

GET ADVICE OR AN ADVISORY OPINION ABOUT WHAT THE -- WHAT THE CONTRACT

MEANS; CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT PART OF THE BILL?

MS. HYNDMAN: SO IT SAYS MAY SEEK A COURT ORDER

SO A CONSUMER DOESN'T HAVE TO GO TO COURT. THEY MAY IF THEY CHOOSE TO

SEEK THE COURT -- COURT ORDER. IT DOESN'T REQUIRE THAT THEY DO SO.

MS. WALSH: AND THAT'S A -- THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S

NOT CURRENTLY FOUND IN OUR LAW. THAT'S A NEW PROVISION OR A NEW

AVENUE FOR THE CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE; ISN'T THAT CORRECT?

MS. HYNDMAN: YES, IT IS NEW.

MS. WALSH: OKAY. AND THAT'S -- I GUESS THAT'S

REALLY THE ONLY QUESTION -- BILL QUESTIONS THAT I HAD FOR YOU. I THINK AT

THIS POINT, THANK YOU TO THE SPONSOR AND I'LL JUST GO ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU. SO I THINK WE ALREADY

HAVE, AS I SAID, UNDER THE GENERAL OBLIGATIONS LAW, PLAIN LANGUAGE

REQUIREMENTS. WE WANT CONTRACTS TO BE CLEARLY UNDERSTOOD BY ALL

PARTIES TO A CONTRACT, OR AN EMPLOYMENT AGREEMENT FOR THAT MATTER.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AND SO WE ALREADY HAVE THAT PROVISION IN THE LAW, BUT WHAT THIS BILL

DOES THAT'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT AND GOES MUCH FURTHER THAN WHAT OUR

CURRENT LAW REQUIRES IS IT GIVES THIS CONSUMER OR EMPLOYEE THE ABILITY

TO SEEK A COURT ORDER REFORMING ANY CONTRACT COVERED BY THIS SECTION,

AND IT SAYS, AND I'M QUOTING FROM THE BILL, "SUCH REFORMED AGREEMENT

SHALL REFLECT THE UNDERSTANDING OF THE PARTIES, AND THE COURT MAY

EXCLUDE TERMS NOT WRITTEN IN PLAIN ENGLISH OR FOUND IN A SEPARATE

DOCUMENT."

SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK IT'S -- EVERYONE

ALWAYS JOKES ABOUT THE COLLEAGUE TO MY RIGHT WHO LIKES TO TALK ABOUT

THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION, BUT TRULY THIS BILL DOES IMPLICATE THE

CONTRACTS CLAUSE OF THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION -- THE U.S.

CONSTITUTION, IN ARTICLE I, SECTION 10, CLAUSE 1 WHICH STATES THAT NO

STATE SHALL PASS A LAW THAT IMPAIRS THE OBLIGATION OF CONTRACTS. AND THE

LEADING CASE ON THIS IS AN OLDIE BUT A GOODIE, 1924, TIDAL OIL V.

FLANAGAN. SO THIS PROVISION IN THE UNITED STATES CONTRACTS CLAUSE

SAYS IT APPLIES TO ALL STATE LEGISLATION AND PREVENTS SUBSTANTIVE

IMPAIRMENTS OF CONTRACTS.

SO MY CONCERN IS, NUMBER ONE, THAT THE UNITED STATES

CONSTITUTION SAYS THAT NO STATE, I.E. NEW YORK, CAN CREATE LEGISLATION

THAT IMPAIRS CONTRACTS IN THIS WAY. SO I THINK THAT THIS BILL PROBABLY IS

UNCONSTITUTIONAL. ALSO, I THINK THAT IT KIND OF TIES IN WITH AN EARLIER

ARGUMENT FROM THIS AFTERNOON -- OR THIS - ARE WE IN THE AFTERNOON, YEAH,

WE ARE - IN THIS AFTERNOON SAYING THAT KIND OF LIKE ARBITRATION IS A BAD

THING, BUT IT'S NOT REALLY A BAD THING. IT REALLY IS A GREAT TOOL AND THIS IS

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AN INSTANCE WHERE ARBITRATION COULD BE USED WHETHER WITH A CONSUMER

OR AN EMPLOYEE IN ORDER TO RESOLVE A CONTRACTUAL DISPUTE. BUT INSTEAD

WHAT THIS BILL DOES IS IT'S DIVERTING THE CONSUMER OR THE EMPLOYEE TO --

AWAY FROM ARBITRATION AND INTO THE ALREADY BELEAGUERED AND VERY

BACKLOGGED COURT SYSTEM TO TRY TO RENDER SOME KIND OF AN ADVISORY

OPINION ABOUT WHAT THE CONTRACT MEANS, IF THERE ARE TERMS THAT NEED TO

BE CHANGED, AND I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S AN APPROPRIATE USE OF THE COURT

SYSTEM AND IT'S A VERY INSUFFICIENT ONE AND, CERTAINLY, A

TIME-CONSUMING AND EXPENSIVE ONE.

SO FOR ALL OF THOSE REASONS, I AM NOT IN SUPPORT OF THIS

PARTICULAR PIECE OF LEGISLATION AND I'D ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO ALSO

VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS ONE. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MS.

WALSH.

READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE ON ASSEMBLY PRINT 5618. THIS IS A PARTY VOTE. ANY MEMBER

WHO WISHES TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION

IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBERS

PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS LEGISLATION, BUT THOSE WHO

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

SUPPORT IT CAN CERTAINLY VOTE IN FAVOR OF IT HERE ON THE FLOOR OF THE

ASSEMBLY OR BY NOTIFYING THE MINORITY LEADER'S OFFICE. THANK YOU,

SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF THIS

CONSUMER-FRIENDLY PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE SOME

THAT WOULD LIKE TO BE AN EXCEPTION. THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE TO CONTACT

THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND THEIR VOTE WILL BE PROPERLY RECORDED.

THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MA'AM.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. I WILL BE VOTING IN

THE NEGATIVE ON THIS BILL. IN ADDITION TO THE COMMENTS FROM MY

COLLEAGUE, MS. WALSH, WHO BROUGHT UP SOME GREAT POINTS, I WOULD

POINT OUT THAT THIS BILL IS KIND OF STRANGE IN THE SENSE THAT IT PURPORTS TO

REQUIRE PLAIN ENGLISH IN ALL CONTRACTS UNLESS IT'S A UNION CONTRACT. SO

DOES THIS BILL SAY THEN -- MEANING THAT IF YOU HAVE A UNION CONTRACT,

YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE PLAIN LANGUAGE, YOU CAN BE AS COMPLEX AS YOU

WANT TO? IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO ME. I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY WE

WOULD CARVE OUT THAT KIND OF EXCEPTION.

THE SECOND POINT I WOULD MAKE IS THAT AS A PRACTICING

ATTORNEY, I HAVE HELPED NEGOTIATE AND DRAFT EMPLOYMENT CONTRACTS, AND

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

IF YOU'RE DEALING WITH A SPECIALIZED EMPLOYEE, MAYBE AN ENGINEER OR A

SCIENTIST OR LEGAL COUNSEL OR UPPER MANAGEMENT, THOSE CONTRACTS CAN BE

EXTRAORDINARILY COMPLICATED. THEY CAN DEAL WITH ISSUES LIKE DEFERRED

COMP, THEY CAN HAVE COMPLEX COMPENSATION PROVISIONS RELATING TO,

YOU KNOW, THE PROFITABILITY OF THE COMPANY, DEBT/EQUITY RATIOS, A WHOLE

NUMBER OF FINANCIAL TERMS THAT MOST OF US WOULD PREFER NOT TO KNOW

WHAT THEY MEAN. AND SO WE DON'T WANT TO SAY THAT AN EMPLOYEE CAN'T

NEGOTIATE A CONTRACT THAT'S COMPLEX, THAT'S VERY BENEFICIAL TO THE

EMPLOYEE BECAUSE IT CAN'T BE WRITTEN IN PLAIN ENGLISH.

AND LAST, THIS BANS THE USE OF MULTIPLE AGREEMENTS.

SO IF WE HAVE AN EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT, ARE WE SUPPOSED TO ATTACH THE

ENTIRE BENEFITS PACKAGE TO EVERY CONTRACT, THE ENTIRE COPY OF WHAT'S

COVERED UNDER YOUR INSURANCE AND NOT COVERED UNDER YOUR INSURANCE?

I MEAN, IT'S STANDARD PRACTICE, RIGHT? YOU REFER TO THOSE OTHER

DOCUMENTS. SO IF YOU WANT TO KNOW IF YOU'RE AN EMPLOYEE HERE OF THE

STATE, THEY DON'T ATTACH OUR HEALTH PLAN TO YOUR CONTRACT. THEY SAY,

HERE'S THE LINK, LOOK IT UP.

SO IN NEW YORK STATE, WE WANT TO BE AS HELPFUL AS WE

CAN TO EMPLOYEES. WE WANT EMPLOYEES TO BE ABLE TO NEGOTIATE

COMPLICATED AGREEMENTS WHERE IT'S TO THEIR BEST INTEREST. WE CERTAINLY

WANT THEM TO BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND, AND THIS GOES TOO FAR. THANK YOU

VERY MUCH, SIR AND, AGAIN, THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE FOR HER

COMMENTS, AND MS. WALSH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

NEGATIVE.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 27, CALENDAR NO. 358, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00940-B, CALENDAR

NO. 358, PAULIN, VANEL. AN ACT TO AMEND THE EXECUTIVE LAW, IN

RELATION TO THE USE OF AUTOMATIC LICENSE PLATE READER SYSTEMS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, AN

EXPLANATION HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

MS. PAULIN: YES, OF COURSE. THE BILL

(INAUDIBLE/MIC NOT ON) -- AUTOMATIC LICENSE PLATE READER TECHNOLOGY BY

LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES AND REQUIRE THOSE SAME AGENCIES TO POST IT

ON A WEBSITE IF THEY HAVE ONE AND, IF NOT, IN THE MAIN OFFICE. AND IT

WOULD ALSO REQUIRE TRAINING FOR POLICE OFFICERS ON THAT SAME SAID -- THE

MUNICIPAL TRAINING COUNCIL'S REPORT AND -- AND STANDARDS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MORINELLO.

MR. MORINELLO: ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MR.

MORINELLO.

MR. MORINELLO: ON THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE, I'M

GOING TO READ FROM THE MUNICIPAL POLICE TRAINING COUNCIL, LICENSE

PLATE READER MODEL POLICY, MARCH 2021. IN THAT, IT DOES GIVE VARIOUS

CONDITIONS. THEY HAVE ADDRESSED THIS ISSUE. AND THE PURPOSE IS TO

PROVIDE GUIDANCE TO LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES IN DEVELOPING THEIR

WRITTEN POLICIES AND PROCEDURES REGARDING THE USE OF LICENSE PLATE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

READER TECHNOLOGY. THE POLICY PROMOTES PUBLIC SAFETY AND EFFICIENCY

OF LAW ENFORCEMENT, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATORY ACTIVITIES THROUGHOUT THE

USE OF LICENSE PLATE READER TECHNOLOGIES AND PROTOCOLS WHILE DOING THE

APPROPRIATE SAFEGUARDS IN PLACE TO PROTECT THE PRIVACY, CIVIL RIGHTS, CIVIL

LIBERTIES OF INDIVIDUALS. THIS POLICY IS INTENDED TO ALLOW THE INDIVIDUAL

NEEDS OF POLICE AGENCIES IN NEW YORK STATE, REGARDLESS OF SIZE OR

RESOURCE LIMITATIONS.

AS WE GO FORWARD, THIS BODY SEEMS TO INCORPORATE

MANY BILLS THAT ARE EITHER NOT NECESSARY OR IGNORE THE FACT OF THEY'RE

ALREADY IN PLACE. THE ONE ISSUE THAT COMES UP MANY TIMES IS PRIVATE --

PRIVACY. WHEN YOU ARE ON A PUBLIC STREET, YOU HAVE NO EXPECTATION OF

PRIVACY. THIS POLICY MANUAL PROTECTS THAT AND IT SAYS, ONLY IN PUBLIC

PLACES. EACH INDIVIDUAL POLICE DEPARTMENT, BECAUSE OF THIS POLICY, CAN

ADOPT IT EXACTLY OR MOVE IT TOWARDS WHAT THEY FEEL IS NECESSARY FOR

THEIR OWN. IT'S PART OF THE OVERALL TRAINING OF POLICE AGENCIES, AND THESE

POLICIES ARE WRITTEN. THE MANUAL IS THERE.

SO ON THAT BASIS, I FEEL THAT THIS IS AN UNNECESSARY,

OVERBURDENSOME POLICY THAT ALREADY IS IN EXISTENCE IN A MORE

SIMPLIFIED FORM BY THE AGENCY THAT WAS -- MEMBERS WERE SELECTED BY

THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE, BY THE MAJORITY, AND THIS HAS BEEN REVISED, AS I

SAID IN 1921 [SIC]. SO BASED UPON THAT AND NOT BURDENING THE

TAXPAYERS WITH UNNECESSARY LEGISLATION, I URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE

NO ON THIS PARTICULAR LEGISLATION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. ANGELINO.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. ANGELINO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. ANGELINO: MANY YEARS AGO, LAW ENFORCEMENT

OFFICERS WOULD GO OUT ON PAROLE, PARTICULARLY THOSE ON NIGHT SHIFT, WITH

A NOTEPAD IN THEIR HAND AND THEY WOULD PATROL THE HOTELS, MOTEL

PARKING LOTS AND IF THEY WERE GOOD, CURIOUS OFFICERS THEY WOULD WRITE

DOWN ALL THE LICENSE PLATES THAT WERE PARKED THERE, KNOWING THAT FOR

EVERY CAR THAT WAS IN A HOTEL/MOTEL PARKING LOT, THERE HAD TO BE A

REASON AND THAT MIGHT BE A NEFARIOUS REASON. SO THEY WOULD WRITE

DOWN ALL THESE PLATE NUMBERS AND GET THE STATE OF THE VEHICLE AND

MAYBE A GENERAL DESCRIPTION, THEY'D GO BACK TO THE STATION AND IF THEY

HAD AN AMICABLE DESK SERGEANT THEY WOULD ASK THAT SERGEANT TO RUN ALL

THE LICENSE PLATES. AND ABOUT ONCE OR TWICE A NIGHT SHIFT, YOU WOULD

COME UP WITH A STOLEN CAR FROM MISSOURI OR A WANTED PERSON FROM

FLORIDA, AND THE TRAFFIC VIOLATIONS THE CAR WASN'T MOVING SO THOSE

WOULD BE IGNORED. THE REASON WE DID THAT WAS BECAUSE THERE WAS NO

EXCEPTION OF PRIVACY, THE CAR WAS PARKED IN A PUBLIC AREA, AND THIS IS

WHAT WE WANTED OUR LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS TO DO AT THAT TIME.

SO FAST FORWARD MANY YEARS AND TECHNOLOGY GAVE US

THE LICENSE PLATE READER. THE FIRST LICENSE PLATE READER IN MY AGENCY

WAS IN 2005, 17 YEARS AGO. AND OVER THE COURSE OF THAT -- AND IN 2005

WHEN WE DID GET OUR FIRST PLATE READER, WE WERE BY FAR NOT THE FIRST

AGENCY TO HAVE THAT EQUIPMENT. THE FIRST KNOWLEDGE THAT I HAVE OF A

POLICY ON THAT WAS IN 2011. SO NOW WE'RE TALKING, YOU KNOW, 11 YEARS

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

AGO. AND A LOT OF IT HAD TO DEAL WITH DATA STORAGE USE, DISSEMINATION,

IS IT FOILABLE, BUT 11 YEARS AGO WE WERE DEALING WITH THAT. I BELIEVE IT

WAS IN MARCH OF 2021, DCJS, WHO OVERSEES MUNICIPAL POLICE TRAINING

COUNCIL, GAVE US THEIR MODEL POLICY AND RECENTLY, THE FORMER GOVERNOR

WANTED TO REINVENT POLICING IN NEW YORK AND HAVE EVERY AGENCY

ACCREDITED. PART OF THAT ACCREDITATION PROCESS IS THE USE OF TECHNOLOGY,

PRIVACY, AND SPECIFICALLY, LICENSE PLATE READERS.

SO ALL OF THIS IS ALREADY BEING DONE. I DON'T KNOW

WHAT THIS BURDENSOME BILL IS GOING TO DO THAT ISN'T ALREADY BEING DONE.

IF THIS IS SIGNED INTO LAW, I THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE EMPLOYEES AT

DCJS THAT ARE GOING TO SEE THIS, THEY'RE GOING TO LOOK AT THIS AND SAY,

OKAY, AND SET IT ASIDE BECAUSE IT'S STUFF THAT THEY'RE ALREADY DOING. AND

THIS -- THIS -- THIS IS SORT OF LIKE THE EQUIVALENT OF THIS LEGISLATIVE BODY

COMING OUT WITH POLICY ON HOW WE SHOULD OPERATE A ROTARY TELEPHONE.

WE HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR ALMOST 20 YEARS AND THERE'S REALLY NO NEED

FOR THIS. I WOULD URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE NO ON THIS. IT'S NOT

NEEDED, IT'S REDUNDANT, AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S JUST GOING TO BE

BURDENSOME FOR A STATE AGENCY. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. LAWLER.

MR. LAWLER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES, OF COURSE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. LAWLER: THANK YOU. WHAT IS THE IMPETUS FOR

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

THIS BILL?

MS. PAULIN: THERE WAS A LOCAL POLICE DEPARTMENT

IN WESTCHESTER COUNTY THAT -- THEY HAD A PROBLEM BECAUSE ONE OF THE

POLICE OFFICERS THAT WAS MONITORING THE LICENSE PLATE READERS WAS ALSO

USING IT TO STALK HIS GIRLFRIEND AND THEY REALIZED THAT THERE WERE NO

POLICIES IN PLACE TO -- BACK COUPLE OF MANY -- YOU KNOW, BEFORE THIS,

THE LICENSE PLATE READER MODEL POLICY WAS INSTITUTED. SO THAT DEPUTY

MAYOR CALLED ME AND SAID, YOU SHOULD BE AWARE THAT THERE SHOULD BE A

STATEWIDE POLICY. SINCE THAT TIME, THERE HAS BEEN A STATEWIDE POLICY

THAT WAS DEVELOPED BY THE VERY BODY THAT WE WERE SAYING IN THE LAW.

SO THERE DOESN'T NEED TO BE A NEW STATEWIDE POLICY, BUT WE DID PUT

ADDITIONALLY IN THE LAW THAT THAT SAME POLICY, WHICH I HAVE RIGHT HERE

AND I THINK ONE OF, YOU KNOW, ONE OF YOUR COLLEAGUES HAD ALREADY

POINTED OUT, THAT THAT POLICY SHOULD BE AVAILABLE ON THE WEBSITE AND/OR

IN THE MAIN BUILDING OF THE POLICE ORGANIZATION SO THAT POLICE OFFICERS

ARE VERY AWARE OF THE POLICY AND -- AND, THEREFORE, KNOW THAT THEY

WOULD BE VIOLATING SOMETHING IF THEY -- IF THEY DID SOMETHING

INAPPROPRIATE. SO IT WAS ON A SUGGESTION OF THE AGENCY ITSELF.

AND, YOU KNOW, AND THEN THIS BILL ALSO REQUIRES

TRAINING NOT TO BE IN ADDITION, BUT TO BE INCORPORATED INTO THE TRAINING

SYSTEM RIGHT NOW THAT'S USED SO THAT IF THERE IS A LICENSE PLATE READER,

AND I'M NOT OBJECTING TO LICENSE PLATE READERS, I'M JUST SAYING THAT IF THE

POLICE ORGANIZATION IS USING THAT, THEN THOSE POLICE OFFICERS ARE

EDUCATED ON WHAT THEY CAN AND CANNOT DO SO THAT THEY DON'T VIOLATE OR

HARM UNSUSPECTING VICTIMS.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MR. LAWLER: OKAY. SO THE -- THE LEGISLATION IS

ALMOST BASICALLY LOOKING TO CODIFY WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE INTO

LAW, TO A DEGREE?

MS. PAULIN: YES. THE LICENSE PLATE READER MODEL

POLICY DOES NOT NEED TO BE REDONE. WE'RE CALLING FOR IT TO BE DEVELOPED

BY THE EXACT SAME POLICE MUNICIPAL -- POLICE TRAINING COUNCIL THAT DID

DEVELOP IT AND SO, THEREFORE, IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE REDONE. THE ONLY

THING THAT THIS BILL ACTUALLY WOULD BE REQUIRING IS THAT IT THEN GETS PUT

UP ON WEBSITES AND/OR INTO THE POLICE MAIN OFFICE AND THAT POLICE

OFFICERS ARE TRAINED, WHICH WE WOULD EXPECT THAT TO BE HAPPENING

BECAUSE IT IS BEING PUT INTO THIS MANUAL, BUT WE'RE JUST SAYING,

ESSENTIALLY, REMINDER, YOU KNOW, PLEASE MAKE SURE THIS IS NOW

INCORPORATED INTO TRAINING WITH POLICE OFFICERS.

MR. LAWLER: WHEN YOU SAY THEY SHOULD BE

TRAINED, ARE YOU LOOKING FOR IT TO BE PART OF, LIKE, THE POLICE ACADEMY

TRAINING THAT THEY GO THROUGH?

MS. PAULIN: THEIR EXISTING TRAINING, WE'RE NOT

LOOKING FOR ADDITIONAL TRAINING.

MR. LAWLER: OKAY. SO ARE WE PROVIDING ANY

FUNDING TO HELP ENSURE THAT THE TRAINING IS AVAILABLE?

MS. PAULIN: THERE --

MR. LAWLER: AND THEN -- AND WHO WOULD BE --

SORRY. WHO WOULD BE THE PERSON TASKED WITH TRAINING?

MS. PAULIN: THE SAME TRAINERS. THE SAME TRAINERS

NOW. WE'RE NOT SAYING THAT THERE HAS TO BE ANYTHING ADDITIONAL. WE'RE

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

JUST SAYING THAT AS PART OF THE CURRICULUM, PLEASE DON'T FORGET THAT YOU

DEVELOPED THESE POLICIES SO THAT YOU'RE TRAINING OFFICERS TO BE AWARE OF

THEM. KIND OF LIKE OUR ETHICS TRAINING, YOU KNOW, IT GETS UPDATED, YOU

KNOW, NOTHING NEW ABOUT IT, BUT THERE MIGHT BE A FEW MORE QUESTIONS

THAT WE GET EDUCATED ON.

MR. LAWLER: OKAY. AND IN NO WAY DOES THIS BILL

LIMIT THE USE OF LICENSE PLATE READERS, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: NO. THERE'S NO -- AT ALL. WE DON'T

SPEAK TO THAT IN THE BILL.

MR. LAWLER: OKAY. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 365TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE ON ASSEMBLY PRINT 940-B. THIS IS A PARTY VOTE. ANY MEMBER

WHO WISHES TO BE RECORDED AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE CONFERENCE POSITION

IS REMINDED TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY OR MINORITY LEADER AT THE NUMBERS

PREVIOUSLY PROVIDED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. FOR THE

REASONS MENTIONED BY MY COLLEAGUES, THE REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE IS

GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS LEGISLATION. THOSE WHO SUPPORT IT CAN

CERTAINLY VOTE IN FAVOR HERE ON THE FLOOR OR BY CALLING THE MINORITY

LEADER'S OFFICE. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: SO NOTED, THANK YOU.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF

THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE SOME OF OUR

COLLEAGUES WHO WOULD LIKE TO BE AN EXCEPTION. THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE

TO CONTACT THE MAJORITY LEADER'S OFFICE AND THEIR VOTE WILL BE PROPERLY

RECORDED. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MA'AM.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. I VERY MUCH

APPRECIATE THE QUESTIONS AND DISCUSSIONS FROM OUR COLLEAGUES. IT'S

ALWAYS REFRESHING TO HAVE ALL OF OUR COLLEAGUES BE KNOWLEDGEABLE ON

THE BACKGROUND AND WHAT'S GOING ON. AND AS NOTED BY ONE OF MY

COLLEAGUES, THIS POLICY HAS ALREADY BEEN IN PLACE NOW NOT FOR A LONG

TIME, BUT SINCE 2021, AND BOTH PARTIES ACKNOWLEDGE THAT AND I

APPRECIATE THAT. AND SOMETIMES WE THINK, WELL, WHAT'S THE HARM OF

PASSING A LAW THAT CODIFIES, IF YOU WILL, WHAT WE'RE ALREADY DOING. AND

I WOULD JUST POINT OUT THAT I HAVE A CONFERENCE ROOM AND ALL OF YOU ARE

WELCOME TO VISIT ANY TIME YOU WANT. I HAVE ABOUT 100 FEET, LINEAR FEET

OF MCKINNEY'S, ABOUT 100 LINEAR FEET OF NEW YORK STATE STATUTE. NOW,

MCKINNEY'S ALSO HAS IN MICRO PRINT SOME OF THE CASES TALKING ABOUT

THOSE, BUT EVERY TIME WE ADD MORE AND MORE, IT INCREASES THE COST TO

EVERYONE ELSE AND MAKES IT MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT TO FIND WHAT'S

REALLY IMPORTANT.

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

SO I WOULD URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO JUST KEEP IN MIND

THAT AS THE LAWS AND REGULATIONS IN NEW YORK BLOSSOM, IT CREATES MORE

AND MORE COST, AND IT MAKES IT MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO

FIND WHAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT. FOR THAT REASON, I'LL BE OPPOSING IT.

THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

NEGATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. I WOULD LIKE TO REMIND MY COLLEAGUES THAT THERE IS A NEED FOR

A MAJORITY CONFERENCE TODAY, AND THE MEMBERS WILL BE CONTACTED AS TO

THE DETAILS OF THAT CONFERENCE, THE TIME OF THAT CONFERENCE, THE LOCATION

WE ALREADY KNOW WILL BE HEARING ROOM B, BUT MEMBERS WILL BE

CONTACTED PERSONALLY TO KNOW WHAT TIME THAT CONFERENCE IS. SO MR.

SPEAKER, I NOW MOVE THAT THE ASSEMBLY STAND AT EASE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE ASSEMBLY STANDS

AT EASE.

(WHEREUPON, THE ASSEMBLY STOOD AT EASE.)

* * * * *

ACTING SPEAKER MCDONALD: THE HOUSE WILL

COME BACK TO ORDER.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: DO YOU HAVE ANY FURTHER

NYS ASSEMBLY APRIL 6, 2022

HOUSEKEEPING OR RESOLUTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER MCDONALD: WE HAVE NO

RESOLUTIONS, BUT WE HAVE ONE BIT OF HOUSEKEEPING.

ON BEHALF OF MS. GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, ASSEMBLY BILL.

NO. 8 -- A8339, ASSEMBLY BILL IS RECALLED FROM THE SENATE. THE CLERK

WILL READ THE TITLE OF THE BILL.

THE CLERK: AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW.

ACTING SPEAKER MCDONALD: THERE IS A

MOTION TO RECONSIDER THE VOTE BY WHICH THE BILL PASSED THE HOUSE. THE

CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

THE CLERK WILL ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE AND THE AMENDMENTS ARE

RECEIVED AND ADOPTED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, I NOW

MOVE THAT THE ASSEMBLY STAND ADJOURNED AND THAT WE WILL RECONVENE AT

THE CALL OF THE SPEAKER. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER MCDONALD: THE HOUSE

STANDS ADJOURNED.

(WHEREUPON, AT 7:01 P.M., THE ASSEMBLY STOOD

ADJOURNED AND WILL RECONVENE AT THE CALL OF THE SPEAKER.)