THURSDAY, JUNE 8, 2023 12:57 P.M.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE HOUSE WILL COME

TO ORDER.

IN THE ABSENCE OF CLERGY, LET US PAUSE FOR A MOMENT OF

SILENCE.

(WHEREUPON, A MOMENT OF SILENCE WAS OBSERVED.)

VISITORS ARE INVITED TO JOIN THE MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE

OF ALLEGIANCE.

(WHEREUPON, ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY LED VISITORS AND

MEMBERS IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.)

A QUORUM BEING PRESENT, THE CLERK WILL READ THE

JOURNAL OF WEDNESDAY, JUNE THE 7TH.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, I MOVE TO

DISPENSE WITH THE FURTHER READING OF THE JOURNAL OF WEDNESDAY, JUNE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE 7TH AND THAT THE SAME STAND APPROVED.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: WITHOUT OBJECTION, SO

ORDERED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR.

WELCOME, FOLKS, TO OUR CHAMBERS, MEMBERS AND GUESTS, AS WE PROCEED

INTO OUR FOURTH DAY OF THE LAST WEEK OF OUR SESSION. I WANT TO SHARE

THIS QUOTE, I THINK I MAY HAVE SAID THIS ONE BEFORE, BUT I THINK IT'S REALLY

APPROPRIATE FOR TODAY AND PROBABLY TOMORROW, AS WELL. THIS ONE IS

COMING AGAIN FROM EDWARD EVERETT HALE, AN AMERICAN AUTHOR AND

HISTORIAN, AS WELL AS A UNITARIAN MINISTER. HIS WORDS FOR US TODAY,

COMING TOGETHER IS THE BEGINNING, KEEPING TOGETHER IS PROGRESS, AND

WORKING TOGETHER IS SUCCESS. LOOKING FORWARD TO A VERY SUCCESSFUL

DAY, MR. SPEAKER.

I WILL SAY MEMBERS HAVE ON THEIR DESKS A MAIN

CALENDAR AS WELL AS A DEBATE LIST. AFTER HOUSEKEEPING AND

INTRODUCTIONS, WE'RE GOING TO BE CALLING FOR CODES, WAYS AND MEANS

AND RULES. THESE COMMITTEES ARE GOING TO PRODUCE AN A-CALENDAR

FROM WHICH WE WILL TAKE UP TODAY ON CONSENT, HOPEFULLY. WE WILL

BEGIN OUR WORK WITH RULES REPORT NO. 629 BY MS. REYES. WE WILL

THEN WORK OFF OUR DEBATE LIST, BEGINNING WITH RULES REPORT NO. 332 BY

MR. EPSTEIN; RULES REPORT NO. 228 BY MR. MCDONALD; AND RULES

REPORT NO. 205 BY MS. SOLAGES. MEMBERS SHOULD ALSO NOTE THAT WE

WILL ALSO BE TAKING UP OUR CALENDAR RESOLUTIONS AT THE VERY END OF OUR

WORK TODAY. I WILL ANNOUNCE ANY FURTHER ACTIVITIES SHOULD THAT BE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

NECESSARY, MR. SPEAKER.

THAT'S A GENERAL OUTLINE OF WHERE WE'RE GOING TODAY.

IF YOU HAVE INTRODUCTIONS AND/OR HOUSEKEEPING, NOW WOULD BE A GREAT

TIME, SIR. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES.

FOR THE PURPOSES OF A INTRODUCTION, MR. SANTABARBARA.

MR. SANTABARBARA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

I RISE TODAY TO INTRODUCE YULIANO CAMARENA, WHO HAS BEEN AN INTERN IN

MY OFFICE THIS SESSION. HE'S GOING TO BE WITH US THROUGH -- HE'S GOING

TO BE WITH US THROUGH THE SUMMER. HE WAS HERE VISITING THE CHAMBER

TODAY WITH HIS GRANDFATHER, PASTOR ANTHONY NICHOLAS SOLOMON OF THE

DUANESBURG FLORIDA BAPTIST CHURCH. YULIANO IS AN EXCEPTIONAL YOUNG

INDIVIDUAL WHO HAS DISPLAYED IMMENSE DEDICATION AND COMMITMENT TO

THE PURSUIT OF KNOWLEDGE AND PERSONAL GROWTH. AS AN INTERN IN MY

OFFICE, HE BRINGS A WEALTH OF TALENT, ENTHUSIASM AND FRESH PERSPECTIVES.

HIS PASSION FOR PUBLIC SERVICE AND HIS EAGERNESS TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE

BETTERNESS OF OUR COMMUNITY MAKE HIM A VALUABLE ASSET TO MY TEAM.

I'M GLAD TO HAVE HIM HERE TODAY. AS I SAID, HE WAS JOINED EARLIER BY

HIS GRANDFATHER, PASTOR SOLOMON, WHO DEVOTED HIS LIFE TO SERVING HIS

CONGREGATION AND FOSTERING A SENSE OF UNITY IN MY COMMUNITY AND MY

ASSEMBLY DISTRICT BACK HOME. HE WAS ALSO A U.S. NAVY VETERAN WHO

SERVED DURING THE VIETNAM ERA. VERY PLEASED TO HAVE THEM -- TO HAVE

THEM IN THE CHAMBER TODAY, MR. SPEAKER. IF YOU WOULD WELCOME

THEM AND EXTEND TO THEM THE CORDIALITIES OF THE HOUSE.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. ON BEHALF

OF MR. SANTABARBARA, THE SPEAKER AND ALL THE MEMBERS, WELCOME, SIR,

TO THE NEW YORK STATE ASSEMBLY. WE EXTEND TO YOU THE PRIVILEGES OF

THE FLOOR. HOPE THAT YOU'VE HAD A GOOD INTERNSHIP, LEARNED A LOT AND

INSPIRED YOU TO COME BACK AND JOIN US IN SOME OTHER CAPACITY ONE DAY.

HOPEFULLY WE'LL SEE YOU THEN. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

(APPLAUSE)

FOR THE PURPOSES OF A INTRODUCTION, MR. ALVAREZ.

MR. ALVAREZ: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I AM

HONORED TO WELCOME THE HISPANIC MEDIA. AS YOU KNOW, THE HISPANIC

COMMUNITY IS THE FASTEST GROWING MINORITY GROUP IN THE UNITED STATES.

THEY'RE ALSO A DIVERSE COMMUNITY. WE HAVE GREAT RANGE OF

EXPERIENCE, CULTURES AND PERSPECTIVES. THE HISPANIC MEDIA IS HERE TO

REPRESENT OUR COMMUNITY AND TO TELL OUR STORY. WE ARE COMMITTED TO

PROVIDE ACCURATE, INFORMATIVE AND ENGAGING CONTENT THAT REFLECT THE

RICHNESS AND DIVERSITY OF OUR COMMUNITY. WE KNOW THAT THE MEDIA HAS

A POWERFUL ROLE TO PLAY IN SHAPING PUBLIC OPINION, AND INFLUENCE SOCIAL

CHANGES. THEY ARE COMMITTED TO USING THE PLATFORM TO PROMOTE

POSITIVE IMAGE OF HISPANIC, AND TO CHALLENGE NEGATIVE STEREOTYPES.

THEY ARE ALSO COMMITTED TO PROVIDING A VOICE FOR THE VOICELESS, AND TO

GIVE A PLATFORM TO THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN MARGINALIZED.

IT IS MY HONOR TO INTRODUCE OMAR RODRIGUEZ FROM

PERU; FROM COLOMBIA, CLARA WEBB AND LEANNA PEDROZA; RAFEL

RODRIGUEZ FROM ECUADOR; NEEDIA GALIANA FROM PARAGUAY; RAFEL

ASORIA, AMEEN CRUZ, ANDY SALAZ, ARICELLA ESPANIA, JOE CRUZ, RITA

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

LOPEZ AND JENNY GOMEZ FROM DOMINICAN REPUBLIC. PLEASE, MR.

SPEAKER, WELCOME THEM AND OFFER THEM THE CORDIALITY OF THE PEOPLE

[SIC] HOUSE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. ON BEHALF

OF MR. ALVAREZ, THE SPEAKER AND ALL THE MEMBERS, WE WELCOME THIS

DISTINGUISHED GROUP FROM THE MEDIA HERE TO THE NEW YORK STATE

ASSEMBLY. WE EXTEND TO YOU THE PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR. THANK YOU

FOR SHARING THIS DAY WITH US. THANK YOU FOR ALSO COVERING THE

EXCEPTIONAL MEMBERS OF THE HISPANIC COMMUNITY WHO SERVE HERE AND

THE REST OF US, ALSO. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH. PLEASE KNOW YOU'LL

ALWAYS HAVE FRIENDS HERE IN THE NEW YORK STATE ASSEMBLY. THANK

YOU.

(APPLAUSE)

MR. BEEPHAN.

MR. BEEPHAN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. JOINED

WITH ME HERE TODAY IS A GOOD FRIEND AND RESIDENT OF MY DISTRICT, MR.

KARL VOLLMER. I MET MR. VOLLMER BACK WHEN WE WERE BOTH VOLUNTEER

FIREFIGHTERS IN THE EAST FISHKILL FIRE DISTRICT, BUT SINCE THEN HIS PASSION

FOR PUBLIC SERVICE LED HIM TO PUT HIMSELF THROUGH THE LAW ENFORCEMENT

ACADEMY. AND SINCE THEN, HE'S HELD MULTIPLE POSITIONS AS A PART-TIME

POLICE OFFICER, DISPATCHER, WORKING HIS WAY UP UNTIL JUST TWO YEARS AGO

WHEN HE WAS HIRED FULL-TIME IN THE TOWN OF EAST FISHKILL. IT'S A

PLEASURE TO HAVE HIM HERE. IT'S A PLEASURE TO CALL HIM A FRIEND. I ASK

YOU IF YOU WOULD EXTEND THE CORDIALITIES OF THE HOUSE TO MR. VOLLMER.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. ON BEHALF

OF MR. BEEPHAN, THE SPEAKER AND ALL THE MEMBERS, WE WELCOME YOU

HERE, KARL, TO THE NEW YORK STATE ASSEMBLY, EXTEND TO YOU THE

PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR. OUR THANKS FOR THE PUBLIC SERVICE WORK THAT

YOU HAVE DONE AND ARE CONTINUING TO DO. PLEASE KNOW THAT WE

APPRECIATE THAT, AND YOU ARE ALWAYS WELCOME HERE IN THE PEOPLE'S

HOUSE. THANK YOU, SIR.

(APPLAUSE)

MR. TAGUE.

MR. TAGUE: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. IF YOU

WOULD PLEASE JOIN ME IN WELCOMING BRIANNE SLATER AND THE FUTURE

LEADERS OF OUR STATE AND OUR NATION, THE 4TH GRADE STUDENTS FROM THE

GILBOA-CONESVILLE CENTRAL SCHOOL. MR. SPEAKER, IF YOU COULD PLEASE

WELCOME THEM AND OFFER THEM ALL THE CORDIALITIES OF THE HOUSE. THANK

YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. ON BEHALF

OF MR. TAGUE, THE SPEAKER AND ALL THE MEMBERS, WE WELCOME THIS 4TH

GRADE CLASS HERE TO THE NEW YORK STATE ASSEMBLY, EXTEND TO YOU THE

PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR. THANK BOTH YOU, AS STUDENTS, AND THE

SUPERVISORS AND PARENTS THAT HAVE JOINED YOU TODAY. WE APPRECIATE

THAT YOU'VE TAKEN THE TIME OUT OF YOUR DAY TO SHARE THIS WITH US.

HOPEFULLY YOU WILL HAVE SOME PLEASANT EXPERIENCES HERE IN ALBANY

AND TRAVEL SAFELY HOME. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

(APPLAUSE)

MR. BROOK-KRASNY FOR THE PURPOSES OF A INTRODUCTION.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. BROOK-KRASNY: MR. SPEAKER, I RISE TO

INTRODUCE MY FRIEND FOR MORE THAN 25 YEARS, MR. RODNEY KNIGHT. WE

MADE THE HISTORY IN THE YEAR 2000 RUNNING TOGETHER FOR THE POLITICAL

OFFICES. THAT WAS 23 YEARS AGO. FOR THE FIRST TIME THAT

RUSSIAN-SPEAKING AMERICAN WAS RUNNING FOR THE STATE ASSEMBLY, AND

AFRICAN-AMERICAN, MR. RODNEY KNIGHT, WAS RUNNING FOR DEMOCRATIC

DISTRICT LEADERSHIP. IT WAS ALSO A FIRST, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE LAST TIME,

WHEN A SOCCER PLAYER AND FOOTBALL PLAYER WERE RUNNING TOGETHER FOR

POLITICAL OFFICES. WE HAD SOME FUN. SO HERE TODAY WITH US IS RODNEY

KNIGHT, A CONEY ISLAND NATIVE AND THE CO-FOUNDER OF THE CONEY ISLAND

SHARKS SPORTS AND EDUCATION PROGRAM, WHICH WAS FOUNDED MORE THAN

30 YEARS AGO. THE CONEY ISLAND SHARKS HAS BEEN A FREE

COMMUNITY-BASED SPORTS AND MENTORING PROGRAM FOR MORE THAN THREE

DECADES, ALLOWING DISADVANTAGED CHILDREN AND THOSE AFFECTED BY GANG

ACTIVITY, VIOLENCE AND POVERTY TO PLAY A SPORT THEY LOVE FREE OF CHARGE.

CHILDREN ENROLL NOT JUST TO BECOME BETTER FOOTBALL PLAYERS, BUT BETTER

COMMUNITY MEMBERS THROUGH ACADEMIC SUPPORT, COMMUNITY SERVICE,

AND YOUTH COUNCIL PARTICIPATION. RODNEY ATTENDED FORDHAM UNIVERSITY

WHERE HE PLAYED FOOTBALL UNDER SCHOLARSHIP AND GRADUATED WITH A

DEGREE IN URBAN ECONOMICS. HE HAS BEEN A CERTIFIED TEACHER FOR MORE

THAN TWO DECADES, A COMMUNITY ACTIVIST, FORMER DISTRICT LEADER,

CANDIDATE FOR STATE ASSEMBLY, CONEY ISLAND LIAISON TO THE NEW YORK

CITY COUNCIL AND COMMUNITY BOARD 13 MEMBER. RODNEY'S PROUDEST

ACCOMPLISHMENT IS HIS DEDICATION IN MENTORING, EDUCATING, AND PASSING

ON THE LOVE OF THE GAME TO THE YOUTH OF CONEY ISLAND.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. SPEAKER, WOULD YOU PLEASE WELCOME MY LONGTIME

FRIEND, COACH RODNEY KNIGHT TO THE CHAMBER?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. ON BEHALF

OF MR. BROOK-KRASNY, RODNEY, WELCOME TO THE NEW YORK STATE

ASSEMBLY. WE EXTEND TO YOU THE PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR.

CONGRATULATIONS ON SUCH A SUCCESSFUL ROLE THAT YOU HAVE CREATED FOR

YOURSELF. WELCOME ALSO TO THESE MARVELOUS YOUNG PEOPLE WHO HAVE

COME WITH YOU. WE ARE SURE THAT THEY WILL HAVE A GREAT ROLE MODEL TO

FOLLOW IN BOTH OF YOU GENTLEMEN, AND THAT YOUR FRIENDSHIP WILL TEACH

ALL OF THEM SOMETHING ABOUT RECOGNIZING THE HUMANITY THAT EXISTS IN ALL

OF US. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING. THANK YOU GENTLEMEN IN THE

BACK FOR BEING THE WONDERFUL CHILDREN THAT YOU ARE. THANK YOU.

(APPLAUSE)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, WILL YOU

PLEASE CALL THE CODES COMMITTEE TO THE SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CODES COMMITTEE,

SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM IMMEDIATELY, PLEASE. THANK YOU.

PAGE 19, RULES REPORT NO. 629, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: SENATE NO. S04887, RULES REPORT NO.

629, SENATOR GIANARIS (REYES, DINOWITZ, COLTON, CARROLL, CRUZ,

DICKENS, EPSTEIN, DURSO, GALLAGHER, GUNTHER, BURDICK, BRONSON,

MCMAHON, LAVINE, JOYNER, WALLACE, SEAWRIGHT, SIMON, DESTEFANO,

OTIS, L. ROSENTHAL, SILLITTI, STECK, STERN, BRABENEC, JACOBSON,

JEAN-PIERRE, THIELE, FORREST, GANDOLFO, BRAUNSTEIN, MAMDANI,

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MAGNARELLI, SEPTIMO, JACKSON, RIVERA, ZINERMAN, DARLING, KELLES,

MIKULIN, BENDETT, SLATER, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, SHIMSKY, SANTABARBARA,

CONRAD, TAPIA, AUBRY, SOLAGES, RAGA -- A05608). AN ACT TO AMEND

THE LABOR LAW, IN RELATION TO ENACTING THE "ROADWAY EXCAVATION

QUALITY ASSURANCE ACT."

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 30TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THIS BILL

REQUIRES THAT ANY EXCAVATION WORK DONE BY A PRIVATE CONTRACTOR UNDER A

CONTRACT WITH A PRIVATE UTILITY COMPANY MUST, NEVERTHELESS, PAY

PREVAILING WAGES. IN THE PAST, PREVAILING WAGES WERE ONLY REQUIRED ON

GOVERNMENTAL WORK. THIS IS A FIRST FOR ONE OF THE LARGEST EXPANSIONS OF

PREVAILING WAGE WHERE STATE GOVERNMENT IS STEPPING IN AND DICTATING

WHAT PRIVATE CONTRACTORS HAVE TO PAY THEIR OWN EMPLOYEES WHO ARE

DOING PRIVATE WORK UNDER CONTRACT WITH A PRIVATE UTILITY.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT STUDIES HAVE INDICATED THAT

PREVAILING WAGE TYPICALLY INCREASES THE COST ANYWHERE FROM 28 TO

75 PERCENT OVER NON-PREVAILING WAGES IN SOME AREAS. THE FIRST ISSUE,

IN ADDITION TO THE COST, IS WE'RE INTERFERING IN PRIVATE CONTRACTUAL

ARRANGEMENTS. WE'RE TELLING CONTRACTORS WHO ARE DOING PRIVATE WORK

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FOR PRIVATE COMPANIES WHAT THEY HAVE TO PAY THEIR EMPLOYEES. AND

THAT IS AN EXTRAORDINARY EXPANSION OF GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE INTO THE

PRIVATE SECTOR. SECOND, AS I MENTIONED, THIS WILL DRAMATICALLY INCREASE

THE COST OF THIS WORK. CON EDISON SAID THIS BILL WILL LEAD TO HIGHER

UTILITY RATES, EXTRA RECORDKEEPING, ADDITIONAL DELAYS. THAT SUBMIT WAS

ALSO REFLECTED BY NATIONAL FUEL, WHO SAID UTILITY COSTS FOR CONSUMERS

WILL GO UP SIGNIFICANTLY. THE ENERGY GROUP -- WHO'S ALSO OPPOSED BY

NYCOM SAYING THAT THIS A HUGE UNFUNDED MANDATE ON THEM, AS WELL.

WE WRESTLE HERE WITH COMPLAINTS FROM ALL OF OUR

CONSTITUENTS ABOUT THE HIGH COST OF UTILITIES AND, INDEED, OUR UTILITY

COSTS ARE AMONGST THE HIGHEST IN THE NATION. THIS BILL WILL MAKE THOSE

UTILITY COSTS GO UP WHILE INTERFERING WITH THE PRIVATE SECTOR. AND EVERY

UTILITY COMPANY HAS POINTED THAT OUT TO US. IT WILL RESULT IN A

SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN COST AND DELAY IN MAKING THESE TYPES OF REPAIRS.

FOR THAT REASON, I WILL NOT BE SUPPORTING IT. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. REYES TO EXPLAIN

HER VOTE.

MS. REYES: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I JUST WANTED

TO CLARIFY FOR THE RECORD THAT THIS BILL WILL NO LONGER ALLOW PRIVATE

COMPANIES TO CIRCUMVENT PAYING WORKERS WHO DO THE EXACT SAME JOB

BELOW PREVAILING WAGE, BELOW LIVING WAGE. WE HAVE PRIVATE UTILITY

COMPANIES THAT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS LOOPHOLE AND ALLOW FOR WORKERS

WHO SOMETIMES ARE LOWER SKILLED THAN ARE OUR UNION WORKERS WHO HAVE

THE EXPERIENCE AND THE CAPABILITY TO DO THIS WORK AND GET AWAY WITH

NOT PAYING THEM BENEFITS AND NOT PAYING THEM PREVAILING WAGE. THIS

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IS ABOUT PARITY. THIS IS ABOUT FAIRNESS AND ENSURING THAT ALL WORKERS

WHO DO THIS BACKBREAKING WORK GET PAID WHAT THEY DESERVE. THIS IS A

LONG TIME COMING AND I'M HAPPY TO SEE IT ON THE FLOOR AND OF COURSE, I

WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. REYES IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 10, RULES REPORT NO. 322, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01122, RULES REPORT

NO. 322, EPSTEIN, THIELE, KELLES, GIBBS, JACOBSON, CUNNINGHAM,

LEVENBERG, REYES, RAGA, COLTON, DICKENS, LUCAS, GLICK, SIMONE, L.

ROSENTHAL. AN ACT TO AMEND THE STATE FINANCE LAW, IN RELATION TO

REQUIRING COMMERCIAL CHARGING STATIONS TO ENSURE PUBLIC ACCESS TO SUCH

CHARGING STATIONS COMMERCIALLY REASONABLE RENTAL OR FEE RATES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. EPSTEIN, A

EXPLANATION HAS BEEN REQUESTED, SIR.

MR. EPSTEIN: SO THIS BILL APPLIES TO COMMERCIAL

GARAGES THAT RECEIVE FUNDING OR INCENTIVES FROM THE STATE TO INSTALL

CHARGING STATIONS AND TO SIMPLY REQUIRE THESE GARAGE OWNERS TO FOLLOW

THE GUISE OF PSC AND NYSERDA TO ENSURE THAT THOSE CHARGERS ARE

PUBLICALLY AVAILABLE AND ENSURE THAT THEY ARE AT A FAIR PRICE TO THE

PUBLIC.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. DURSO.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. EPSTEIN, WILL YOU

YIELD, SIR?

MR. EPSTEIN: HAPPY TO YIELD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. EPSTEIN YIELDS.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MR. EPSTEIN. SO JUST TO

GET SOME CLARIFICATION ON A COUPLE OF -- SOME OF THE LANGUAGE IN THIS

BILL. SO YOU WERE SAYING THAT IT'S ANYBODY WHO'S GETTING ASSISTANCE

FROM THE STATE THAT ARE INSTALLING THE EV CHARGING STATIONS IN THEIR

FACILITY, CORRECT? IT'S ONLY FOR THOSE THAT ARE RECEIVING THOSE FUNDS?

MR. EPSTEIN: YES.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. NOW, WE'RE SPECIFICALLY TALKING

ABOUT ONE -- ONE OF THE PLACES THAT COULD BE GETTING WOULD BE PARKING

GARAGES, CORRECT?

MR. EPSTEIN: YEAH, A GOOD EXAMPLE WOULD BE

PARKING GARAGES.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO IF WE TOOK PARKING GARAGES,

FOR EXAMPLE, IN THIS BILL, WOULD THERE HAVE TO BE A CERTAIN FINITE

NUMBER OF SPOTS THAT ARE SPECIFICALLY SET ASIDE FOR SOMEONE TO BE ABLE

TO COME AND CHARGE THEIR CAR WITHOUT, LET'S SAY, PAYING FOR THE SPOT FOR

A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF HOURS, OR THE DAY, OR HOWEVER LONG THEY'RE GOING TO

BE DOING IT?

MR. EPSTEIN: NO.

MR. DURSO: NO. SO IT JUST HAS TO BE THAT IT'S

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AVAILABLE FOR THEM TO COME IN, BUT THEY DO NOT -- THERE'S NO MANDATE

ESSENTIALLY FOR THEM TO HAVE SPOTS AVAILABLE. SO IF I OWN A PARKING

GARAGE AND ALL MY SPOTS ARE TAKEN UP, RIGHT, BY ANYBODY THAT'S PARKING

FOR WHETHER IT'S TWO HOURS OR TWO DAYS, YOU COME IN WITH A ELECTRIC CAR,

I SAY THERE'S NOTHING AVAILABLE FOR YOU, WHERE YOU COULD PARK; THAT IS

OKAY BY THIS?

MR. EPSTEIN: SO THIS IS FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE

CHARGERS IN THEIR GARAGE THAT WERE SUBSIDIZED BY THE GOVERNMENT UNDER

A PROGRAM THAT REQUIRES THOSE CHARGERS TO BE PUBLICALLY AVAILABLE. AND

IF YOU HAVE CHARGERS THAT AREN'T BEING USED BECAUSE THE CHARGERS ARE IN

A SPOT, THEN THE PERSON CAN COME IN AND PAY A COMMERCIALLY-

REASONABLE RATE TO CHARGE COMPARED TO HAVING TO PAY THE FULL RATE OF

PARKING AND CHARGING, WHICH -- WHICH THEY CURRENTLY ARE REQUIRED TO

DO.

MR. DURSO: SO YOU'RE NOT SAYING -- IT ESSENTIALLY

HAS TO BE ALMOST A, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM, LIKE A GAS STATION. SO IT

HAS TO -- THERE HAS TO BE A CHARGING AREA AVAILABLE, NOT PER SE A PARKING

SPOT, BUT AN AREA WHERE IF SOMEONE COULD -- IF I HAD AN ELECTRIC CAR,

COULD PULL INTO A PARKING GARAGE OR IN ONE OF THESE OTHER FACILITIES TO

CHARGE MY CAR, THAT WOULD NOT BE USED AS A SPOT THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU

COULD SELL, CORRECT?

MR. EPSTEIN: THAT IS RIGHT, EXACTLY. IT'S A CHARGING

SPOT WITH A PLUG AND A CHARGER WHERE SOMEONE CAN CHARGE INTO THEIR

VEHICLE THAT WAS SUBSIDIZED BY THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

MR. DURSO: RIGHT. SO AGAIN, THERE JUST NEEDS TO BE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AN AREA FOR THEM TO CHARGE, IT'S NOT A SPOT BECAUSE, AGAIN, YOU HAVE A

LOT OF SPOTS LET'S SAY IN A PARKING GARAGE THAT YOU'LL SPECIFY ARE FOR EV

CHARGING STATIONS, PEOPLE PARKING SPECIFICALLY. IF YOU GET THE MONEY

FROM THE STATE OR IT'S SUBSIDIZED BY THE STATE PROGRAMS SO THAT WE GET

MORE CHARGING STATIONS OUT THERE, YOU COULD PUT THEM IN A SPOT. IF I'M

A GARAGE OWNER, I SAY, OKAY, I'M GOING TO DESIGNATE THESE TEN SPOTS IN

MY GARAGE WITH EV CHARGING STATIONS, THAT'S FINE YOU'RE SAYING, BUT DO I

HAVE TO HAVE ANOTHER AVAILABLE AREA FOR SOMEONE TO COME IN TO BE ABLE

TO CHARGE THEIR CAR? IN OTHER WORDS, IF I HAVE ALL THOSE SPOTS TAKEN UP

AND THERE'S NOTHING AVAILABLE TO YOU TO COME IN AND CHARGE YOUR CAR, IS

THERE A PENALTY INVOLVED FOR THAT?

MR. EPSTEIN: NO. I MEAN, THIS IS FOR, ONES, AGAIN,

WHO ARE SUBSIDIZED BY THE STATE AND THEY WERE PUTTING THOSE CHARGERS

IN AND THOSE SHOULD BE AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC BECAUSE THEY'RE PUBLICLY

AVAILABLE. IF THEY'RE NOT AVAILABLE, THEY'RE NOT AVAILABLE. IT'S LIKE A

STREET CHARGER. IF SOMEONE'S USING IT, SOMEONE'S USING IT AND YOU CAN'T

HAVE ACCESS TO IT.

MR. DURSO: OKAY.

MR. EPSTEIN: IT'S TRYING TO TREAT A CHARGER THAT WE

PAID FOR IN THE LOT THE SAME AS WE PAY -- CHARGE FOR A CHARGER THAT WE

PUT ON IN THE STREET.

MR. DURSO: PERFECT. SO THAT -- THAT CLARIFIES THAT

POINT FOR ME. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE FOR THE RECORD THAT IT WASN'T

THAT IT HAD TO BE A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF DESIGNATED SPOTS FOR PEOPLE TO

COME IN OFF THE STREET AND USE IT, YOU KNOW, IF AGAIN, MY LOT WAS FULL,

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD.

MR. EPSTEIN: YEAH. WE DON'T WANT TO HOLD

BUSINESSES UP FOR FILLING UP THEIR LOT, THAT'S THEIR -- THAT'S THEIR BUSINESS.

WE WANT TO KNOW IF THEY'RE TAKING OUR DOLLARS UNDER THE AUSPICES OF

PUBLICLY AVAILABLE CHARGING THAT THEY ACTUALLY ARE PUBLICLY AVAILABLE AT

A COMMERCIALLY-REASONABLE RATE.

MR. DURSO: OKAY, THAT'S GREAT. THAT'S ACTUALLY

GOING TO CUT DOWN A BUNCH OF MY QUESTIONS, BUT I DO HAVE MORE.

MR. EPSTEIN: I WOULD ONLY EXPECT MORE.

MR. DURSO: OH, WELL THANK YOU. THERE'S A COUPLE

OF SHEETS HERE, IF YOU'D LIKE. I COULD SHOW IT TO YOU FIRST.

SO WHEN WOULD THIS LEGISLATION GO INTO EFFECT IF THIS

BILL IS PASSED TODAY?

MR. EPSTEIN: IT'S PROACTIVE. SO ONCE IT PASSES HERE

AND THE SENATE AND THE GOVERNOR SIGNS IT, IT WILL BE FOR FUTURE CONTRACTS

IN NYSERDA OR THE PSC ENTER IN WITH CONTRACTORS.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO IT'S ONLY FOR A FUTURE

CONTRACT. SO IN OTHER WORDS, IF SOMEBODY'S ALREADY GOTTEN MONIES FROM

THE STATE, OR THE PROCESS IS BEING DONE NOW, IT WOULDN'T AFFECT THEM, IT'S

ONLY FOR FUTURE CONTRACTS AFTER THIS BILL GOES INTO LAW?

MR. EPSTEIN: EXACTLY.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. JUST TO CLARIFY SOME OF THE

LANGUAGE ON IT. SO ON LINE 6, RIGHT, OBVIOUSLY -- PROBABLY LINE 5 SAYS

PRIVATELY-OWNED BUILDING OR FACILITY WHERE MOTOR VEHICLES, LINE 6

SPECIFICALLY STATES PARKED, STORED, SERVICED, REPAIR. SO NOW WOULD THIS

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

NOT ONLY APPLY TO LET'S SAY A PARKING GARAGE, RIGHT, BUT LET'S SAY A PRIVATE

PARKING FACILITY OR A STORAGE UNIT. SO LET'S JUST SAY IF I HAD A STORAGE

UNIT THAT WAS BIG ENOUGH TO STORE A CLASSIC CAR THAT I HAVE, RIGHT, BUT

THAT STORAGE UNIT THEN APPLIES FOR AN EV CHARGING STATION, THEY GET IT

FROM THE STATE, RIGHT, AND SOMETIMES THOSE AREAS ARE LOCKED UP, THEY

HAVE GATES IN THE FRONT. WOULD IT APPLY FOR THEM, ALSO? AGAIN, WHERE

YOU'RE STORING YOUR VEHICLE.

MR. EPSTEIN: THIS IS ONLY FOR THINGS THAT ARE

PUBLICLY AVAILABLE.

MR. DURSO: RIGHT. WELL, A -- A -- A -- LET'S SAY A

STORAGE FACILITY IS PUBLICALLY AVAILABLE, RIGHT?

MR. EPSTEIN: SO PEOPLE -- OTHER PEOPLE CAN DRIVE

IN AND PARK THERE?

MR. DURSO: RIGHT. IF YOU -- IF YOU WERE TO RENT THE

SPACE. IN OTHER WORDS, IF YOU WERE TO RENT THE STORAGE UNIT.

MR. EPSTEIN: A STORAGE UNIT. LIKE A --

MR. DURSO: RIGHT. I'M JUST -- I'M JUST USING IT AS

ONE EXAMPLE. I COULD SKIP TO ANOTHER IF YOU'D LIKE, BUT AGAIN, IF YOU

HAVE A STORAGE UNIT, A LARGE STORAGE UNIT AND I HAVE A CLASSIC CAR - I

DON'T, BUT IF I DID AND I WANTED TO BE ABLE TO STORE IT, BUT THAT STORAGE

UNIT OR FACILITY DECIDED TO TAKE STATE MONIES TO PUT IN EV CHARGING

STATIONS, WHETHER IT'S FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES, WHETHER IT'S FOR ANYBODY THAT

HAS THESE TYPES OF VEHICLES, WOULD THEY THEN HAVE TO HAVE THEIR GATES

OPEN ESSENTIALLY AND BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC 24 HOURS IF THEY HAVE THOSE

EV CHARGING STATIONS IN THEIR FACILITY?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. EPSTEIN: SO WE'RE NOT MAKING THEM BE OPEN

WHEN THEY'RE NOT OPEN.

MR. DURSO: OKAY, PERFECT. MY NEXT QUESTION IS

SERVICED OR REPAIRED. SO WOULD THIS APPLY TO SERVICE STATIONS OR REPAIR

SHOPS, LET'S SAY SOME OF THE BIGGER ONES LIKE A -- FOR INSTANCE LIKE A PEP

BOYS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT?

MR. EPSTEIN: THAT'S NOT A PARKING -- THAT'S NOT

WHERE YOU PARK YOUR CAR.

MR. DURSO: NO, I AGREE WITH YOU, BUT IN THE

SPECIFIC LANGUAGE IN IT, IT SAYS SERVICED OR REPAIRED. SO --

MR. EPSTEIN: RIGHT.

MR. DURSO: SO, AGAIN, THAT CONCERNS ME IN THE FACT

THAT ARE THESE FACILITIES, WHETHER IT'S A LARGE REPAIR SHOP OR AUTOMOTIVE

STORE, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, ARE THEY GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE THEM

AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE, ALSO?

MR. EPSTEIN: SO IF YOU KEEP READING THE SENTENCE,

IT'S AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC FOR A PARKING FEE WITHOUT REGARD TO

RESIDENCE. SO THESE ARE -- IT'S FOR A PLACE WHERE YOU'RE PARKING --

MR. DURSO: RIGHT.

MR. EPSTEIN: -- NORMALLY FOR A FEE, REGARDLESS OF

WHETHER YOU LIVE THERE OR NOT. SO IT'S A REALLY NARROW, LIKE, YOU KNOW,

PLACE WHETHER IT'S ON LONG ISLAND OR NEW YORK CITY. WE'RE ONLY

TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHERE YOU HAVE TO GO IN, YOU KNOW, TO PAY A FEE

AND THEY HAVE A PUBLICLY AVAILABLE CHARGER WHICH WE'VE PAID FOR TO

HAVE THEM INSTALLED.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. DURSO: RIGHT. AGAIN, I -- I WOULD AGREE WITH

YOU READING THE INITIAL BILL LANGUAGE, BUT JUST PICKING OUT THOSE SPECIFIC

WORDS.

MR. EPSTEIN: YEAH, BUT WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF THE

LARGER SENTENCE. I DON'T THINK IN THE LARGER SENTENCE IT'S CONTEXTUAL, IT

TALKS ABOUT WHAT THAT IS.

MR. DURSO: I'M AGREEING WITH YOU, BUT AT THE SAME

TIME I'M CONFUSED IN THE FACT THAT WHY THOSE WORDS WOULD BE IN THERE

THEN IF IT'S SERVICE OR REPAIR. YOU'RE NOT REPAIRING A CAR IN A PARKING

GARAGE.

MR. EPSTEIN: SOME FACILITIES ARE DIFFERENT. I

MEAN, I THINK THE REALITY IS THAT ALL GARAGES OPERATE IN DIFFERENT WAYS,

AND SOME PEOPLE CHARGE FOR A LONG-TERM RENTAL AND ALSO HAVE MULTIPLE

SERVICES IN THEIR FACILITY AND SO YOU MIGHT HAVE ONE SIDE WHERE YOU'RE,

YOU KNOW, YOU'RE USING JUST FOR A LONG-TERM PARKING RENTAL OR

SHORT-TERM PARKING RENTAL, AND THE OTHER SIDE YOU MIGHT HAVE OTHER

SERVICES THAT ARE OPERATING IN THAT SAME FACILITY.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. LET ME JUST SEE IF I HAVE ANY

OTHER QUESTIONS FOR YOU, SIR.

(PAUSE)

I THINK THAT WILL BE IT, MR. EPSTEIN. I APPRECIATE YOUR

TIME. THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. EPSTEIN: THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: A PARTY VOTE HAS

BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

PARTY IS -- OR CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THIS. THOSE WHO

WOULD LIKE TO SUPPORT IT CAN CERTAINLY VOTE YES ON THE FLOOR. THANK

YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MS. SOLAGES.

MS. SOLAGES: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THE

MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. THOSE WHO

WISH TO VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE CAN COME TO THE CHAMBER AND CAST THEIR

VOTE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

THE CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. EPSTEIN TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. EPSTEIN: MR. SPEAKER, I RISE TO EXPLAIN MY

VOTE. THIS IS JUST A SIMPLE ISSUE WHERE WE SET UP STANDARDS IN OUR --

WITH GOVERNMENT DOLLARS TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE PUBLICLY AVAILABLE

CHARGERS. AND THEN I LEARNED IN MY DISTRICT THAT PRIVATE GARAGES GOT

FREE CHARGERS -- 20 CHARGERS FOR FREE PUT IN INTO THEIR DEVELOPMENT AND

THEY WERE CHARGING, YOU KNOW, $50 FOR THE FIRST HOUR JUST TO COME IN TO

PARK AND THEN TO CHARGE, AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, NOT THE INTENT OF

NYSERDA'S PROGRAM OR THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION. IT'S REALLY TO

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MAKE CHARGERS AVAILABLE AT THE COST OF THE CHARGER. AND ALL THIS BILL IS

SAYING, HEY, IF YOU WANT OUR GOVERNMENT DOLLARS, OUR GOAL HERE IS TO

MAKE THESE CHARGERS AVAILABLE ACROSS THE STATE AT COMMERCIALLY-

REASONABLE RATES, AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GOING TO ASK THE OWNER OF THESE

GARAGES TO DO IF THEY TAKE GOVERNMENT DOLLARS, AS WELL AS THE PUBLIC

SERVICE COMMISSION AND NYSERDA. I ENCOURAGE ALL MY COLLEAGUES

TO VOTE IN FAVOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. EPSTEIN IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THIS BILL HAS AN

INTERESTING PROVISION WHICH (INAUDIBLE) AND STATES THAT SUCH A GARAGE,

QUOTE, "SHALL WAIVE ANY AND ALL PARKING FEES FOR ANY VEHICLE OWNER OR

OPERATOR UTILIZING THE COMMERCIAL GARAGE FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF

CHARGING THEIR VEHICLE," WHICH MEANS THAT IF YOU'RE IN NEW YORK CITY

WHERE THE PARKING IS EXTRAORDINARILY EXPENSIVE, YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO

PARK FOR FREE ALL DAY AS LONG AS YOUR CAR IS PLUGGED IN AND YOU PAY THE

NOMINAL ELECTRIC CHARGE AND WALK AWAY WITH THE REST OF THE MONEY IN

YOUR POCKET. IT'S FUNDAMENTALLY UNFAIR TO LET EVERYONE ELSE WHO WANTS

TO USE THE GARAGE, AS WELL AS THE GARAGE OWNER, AND FOR THAT REASON I

CANNOT SUPPORT IT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

NEGATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 9, RULES REPORT NO. 228, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04720, RULES REPORT

NO. 228, MCDONALD. AN ACT TO AMEND THE INFRASTRUCTURE INVESTMENT

ACT, IN RELATION TO PUBLIC EMPLOYEES' SUPERVISION, EXAMINATION, REVIEW,

AND DETERMINATION OF ACCEPTABILITY OF PUBLIC WORKS PROJECTS PERFORMED

BY CONTRACTORS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MCDONALD, A

EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED, SIR.

MR. MCDONALD: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THE

INTENT OF THIS BILL IS TO CLARIFY THAT CONTRACTS ORDERED PURSUANT TO THE

INFRASTRUCTURE INVESTMENT ACT SHALL REQUIRE A PUBLIC EMPLOYEE OR

PUBLIC EMPLOYEES TO BE ON SITE AND APPROVE OF THE WORK HAD DONE IN

ACCORDANCE WITH THE CONTRACT. THE INTENT IS TO MAKE SURE THAT PUBLIC

EMPLOYEES ARE INVOLVED IN THE PROCESS, NOT ONLY IN REGARDS TO SAFETY

BUT ALSO JUST AS IMPORTANTLY TO MAKE SURE IT'S MEETING THE COST-EFFECTIVE

GOALS TO THE STATE.

MS. WALSH: MR. SPEAKER, WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD

FOR A FEW QUESTIONS, PLEASE?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MCDONALD, WILL

YOU YIELD? EXCUSE ME.

MR. MCDONALD: FOR MRS. WALSH, I'D LOVE TO

YIELD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. WALSH, PROCEED.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YEAH, JUST A

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FEW CLARIFYING QUESTIONS. SO UNDER DESIGN-BUILD RIGHT NOW, WHAT --

WHAT KIND OF PROJECTS WOULD BE ENCOMPASSED BY THIS

(INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) --

MR. MCDONALD: YOU KNOW, THE CLASSIC ONE THAT

WE WOULD THINK OF IS LIKE BRIDGE PROJECTS, ROAD PROJECTS, THOSE ARE THE

CLASSICS, UM...

MS. WALSH: OKAY. AND IT REFERS TO AUTHORIZED

STATE ENTITIES. SO WHO ARE -- WHO WOULD THOSE -- THEY CALL THEM ASES,

OF COURSE, BECAUSE EVERYTHING'S GOT INITIALS BUT --

MR. MCDONALD: I HAVE A LONG LAUNDRY LIST. I'LL

GIVE YOU A COUPLE OF EXAMPLES.

MS. WALSH: OKAY.

MR. MCDONALD: THE NEW YORK STATE THRUWAY

AUTHORITY, DOT, OFFICE OF PARKS AND HISTORIC PRESERVATION, ENCON,

NEW YORK STATE BRIDGE AUTHORITY, OGS, AND THE LIST GOES ON

(INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK --)

MS. WALSH: OKAY. I THINK WE GET IT. SO MY

QUESTION IS, UNDER CURRENT LAW, HOW IS THE OVERSIGHT PIECE OF THE

PROJECT HANDLED?

MR. MCDONALD: YOU KNOW MOST PROJECTS ARE

HANDLED WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A DESIGN-BUILD CONTRACT WHERE THE

CONTRACT AWARDEE HAS DESIGNED THE BUILD AND ALSO THE OVERSIGHT. AS

YOU KNOW, IN MY FORMER LIFE BEFORE I ARRIVED HERE AT THE ASSEMBLY, I

WAS THE MAYOR OF THE CITY OF COHOES FOR 13 YEARS, AND WE DID A BRIDGE

PROJECT, THE BRIDGE AVENUE BRIDGE REBUILT REPLACEMENT WITH ERA

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FUNDS, SO 208, 209. AND WHAT WAS ALWAYS HELPFUL TO ME WAS WE HIRED

A GREAT FIRM TO DESIGN THE BRIDGE, TO BUILD THE BRIDGE, TO REVIEW

EVERYTHING, BUT DOT ACTUALLY HAD THEIR OWN STATE ENGINEER, I THINK IT

WAS A MEMBER -- IT WAS -- IT WAS A STATE ENGINEER WHO WAS ON SITE AND

KIND OF GAVE US THAT EXTRA SET OF EYES BECAUSE FOR A SMALL COMMUNITY

AND ACTUALLY FOR THE AGENCY, SOMETIMES YOU JUST DON'T HAVE THAT

EXPERTISE THERE. BUT TO HAVE A STATE WORKFORCE THERE WAS VERY HELPFUL.

MS. WALSH: SO -- AND I -- I KNOW THAT AS A -- AS A

FORMER MAYOR AND PERSON THAT'S BEEN INVOLVED IN GOVERNMENT FOR, YOU

KNOW, A NUMBER OF YEARS, WHAT -- WHAT IS THE OVERALL PURPOSE AND

OBJECTIVE OF DESIGN-BUILD? WHAT -- WHAT DOES IT GIVE YOU THAT A

REGULAR -- (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) --

MR. MCDONALD: WELL, DESIGN-BUILD, (INAUDIBLE)

ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, WHICH I'M NOT OPPOSED TO, I THINK IT'S -- I THINK IT

HAS ITS PLACE.

MS. WALSH: MM-HMM.

MR. MCDONALD: AND IT'S REALLY TO HELP MOVE THE

PROJECT FORWARD IN A MORE TIMELIER MANNER, BUT NOT RUSHED, AND THAT

SAME TOKEN, TO REALLY (INAUDIBLE) THOSE FIRMS TO USE DIFFERENT TYPE OF

METHODS TO - AS LONG AS THEY'RE LEGAL AND APPROPRIATE AND PEER

RECOGNIZED - TO HELP HOPEFULLY LOWER COSTS, HOPEFULLY LOWER COSTS, AND

TO ALSO HAVE IT BUILT WHATEVER IS BEING CONSTRUCTED IN A TIMELY MANNER.

MS. WALSH: IS THERE -- IS THERE ANYTHING UNDER OUR

CURRENT LAW THAT WOULD PROHIBIT SITE VISITS BY THE AUTHORIZED STATE

AGENCIES?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. MCDONALD: I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S ANYTHING

THAT PROHIBITS IT. I THINK WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO IS MAKE IT A REQUIREMENT.

AND, ONCE AGAIN, JUST FOR EVERYONE'S KNOWLEDGE, I KNOW YOU KNOW

THIS, BUT, YOU KNOW, THIS ISN'T A COST AT THE CONTRACTOR, WHOEVER IS THE

SUCCESSFUL CONTRACTOR, THERE'S NO COST INCURRED TO THEM. THIS IS, YOU

KNOW, TYPICALLY, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE PUBLIC EMPLOYEES

THAT'LL BE INVOLVED, IT WOULD EITHER BE, YOU KNOW, A DOT ENGINEER, A

LAND SURVEYOR, GEOLOGIST, MAYBE AN ARCHITECT OR A LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT.

SO SOMEBODY WHO IS ON THE STATE WORKFORCE.

MS. WALSH: SO WHAT THE BILL REQUIRES IS IT SAYS THAT

FOR ALL OF THESE DESIGN-BUILD CONTRACTS IT SHALL "SHALL" REQUIRE A PUBLIC

EMPLOYER OR EMPLOYEES TO BE ON THE SITE OF THE PROJECT FOR THE DURATION

OF SUCH PROJECT TO THE EXTENT DEEMED APPROPRIATE BY SUCH PUBLIC

EMPLOYER OR EMPLOYEES. SO I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT,

MR. MCDONALD: YEAH.

MS. WALSH: THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THAT PUBLIC

EMPLOYEE NEEDS TO BE THERE EVERY SINGLE DAY OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, DOES

IT?

MR. MCDONALD: NO. WHAT IT MEANS IS THAT

EMPLOYEE, BY A SUPERVISOR, IS ASSIGNED TO THAT SITE TO REALLY PLAY THAT

ROLE OF CONSTRUCTION INSPECTION. AND THEREFORE, THEY WILL WORK WITH

THE CONTRACTOR, NOT IMPEDE THE CONTRACTOR, BUT BASICALLY AS YOU KNOW

WITH THESE PROJECTS THEY HAVE A SCHEDULE AND HERE'S WHAT WE'RE GOING

TO BE DOING; WE'RE GOING TO BE LAYING PIPE THIS WEEK, WE'RE GOING TO BE

DIGGING HOLES THIS WEEK, WE'RE GOING TO BE FILLING GRADE. AND THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ENGINEER - ONCE AGAIN, IT'S A PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER - WILL USE THEIR

EXPERTISE TO MAKE SURE THEY'RE THERE WHEN THEY'RE GOING TO BE MOVING

FORWARD WITH WE'RE GOING TO BE FILLING A TRENCH TODAY. I WANT TO SEE

WHAT THE MATERIALS ARE; ARE YOU REALLY PUTTING IN SO MANY CUBIC YARDS,

THE WHOLE NINE YARDS. IN THAT SAME TOKEN, TO YOUR POINT, YOU KNOW,

THEY MAY BE THERE SEVEN IN THE MORNING UNTIL 11, THEN THEY'RE BACK IN

THE OFFICE DOING THEIR DOCUMENTATION AND FOLLOW-UP. IT'S NOT LIKE THEY

HAVE TO STAND THERE EIGHT HOURS TWIDDLING THEIR THUMBS WAITING FOR

SOMETHING TO HAPPEN.

MS. WALSH: GOOD. OKAY, GOOD. SO IT'S REALLY AT

THE DISCRETION OF THAT PUBLIC EMPLOYER, PUBLIC EMPLOYEE, AS FAR AS LIKE

HOW MUCH, IN THEIR PROFESSIONAL JUDGMENT --

MR. MCDONALD: RIGHT.

MS. WALSH: -- HOW MUCH TIME THEY NEED TO BE

THERE.

MR. MCDONALD: RIGHT.

MS. WALSH: ONE LAST QUESTION. SO WITH

DESIGN-BUILD UNDER THE CURRENT LAW, UNDER THE CURRENT SET-UP, DOES THAT

ASE HAVE FINAL APPROVAL THAT THE PROJECT HAS BEEN COMPLETED IN THE

WAY THAT IT WAS INTENDED TO BE COMPLETED? THERE IS A FINAL SIGN-OFF OR

SOMETHING, ISN'T THERE?

MR. MCDONALD: WELL, THE -- THE CONTRACTOR IS IN

TOTAL RESPONSIBLE FOR COMPLETING THE PROJECT AND SIGNING OFF. IT'S

HELPFUL TO HAVE THE STATE EMPLOYEE THERE AS AN EXTRA SET OF EYES TO RAISE

CONCERNS.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALSH: RIGHT.

MR. MCDONALD: AT THE END OF THE DAY, THEY CAN'T

STOP THE PROJECT; HOWEVER, AT THE SAME TOKEN, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT AS IF

WE AWARD A CONTRACT TO ABC CONTRACTOR TO GO OUT AND REPLACE, LET'S SAY

THE GLENVILLE BRIDGE. MAYBE SOME DAY THAT'LL HAPPEN, WOULDN'T THAT BE

NICE, RIGHT?

MS. WALSH: THAT'S A BRIDGE I'D LIKE TO SEE REPLACED.

MR. MCDONALD: WELL, AT THE RATE IT'S GOING --

MS. WALSH: OR RAISED, ANYWAY.

MR. MCDONALD: -- IT MIGHT BE REPLACED PRETTY

SOON IF IT KEEPS GETTING HIT THE WAY IT IS.

MS. WALSH: YEAH.

MR. MCDONALD: BUT ANYWAYS, SAY, YOU KNOW,

THAT'S A -- SAY IT'S A DOT PROJECT FOR ARGUMENT SAKE, DOT AT THE END OF

THE DAY ACCEPTS THAT PROJECT. THEY WILL RELY ON OBVIOUSLY WHAT THE

CONTRACTOR COMES BACK WITH AS FINALLY SAYING WE'RE READY FOR SIGN-OFF,

BUT THEY WILL ALSO, YOU KNOW, WORK WITH THEIR STAFF AND SAY, OKAY, WERE

THERE ANYTHING -- ANY OTHER PROBLEMS THAT YOU SAW, HOW DO YOU FEEL?

IT'S NOT LIKE THEY OFFICIALLY SIGN OFF ON THE CONTRACT. THE AGENCY WHO

AWARDED THE CONTRACT EVENTUALLY RECEIVES THAT PROJECT.

MS. WALSH: OKAY.

MR. MCDONALD: DOES THAT -- DOES THAT CLARIFY IT?

MS. WALSH: WELL, YES, BECAUSE -- SO I THINK WHAT

YOU'RE SAYING, IF I UNDERSTAND YOU CORRECTLY AND IF I DON'T, PLEASE LET ME

KNOW, BUT IS THAT THIS BILL DOESN'T REALLY CHANGE THE -- THE -- HOW THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PROJECT FINISHES UP AND THAT -- THAT FINAL APPROVAL PROCESS OR ANYTHING

LIKE THAT.

MR. MCDONALD: CORRECT, CORRECT.

MS. WALSH: IT'S MORE DURING THE PROJECT --

MR. MCDONALD: RIGHT.

MS. WALSH: -- HAVING THAT EXTRA SET OF EYES ON THE

SITE --

MR. MCDONALD: RIGHT.

MS. WALSH: -- TO MAKE SURE THAT THINGS ARE BEING

DONE.

MR. MCDONALD: CORRECT.

MS. WALSH: OKAY.

MR. MCDONALD: THAT BEING SAID, CERTAIN

OBSERVATIONS MAY COME UP WHERE THE ENGINEER SAYS TO THE SUPERVISOR,

YOU MAY WANT TO CHECK INTO THIS AND -- AND -- AND, YOU KNOW, HAVE A

CONVERSATION. BUT IT DOESN'T SLOW IT DOWN, DOESN'T STOP IT.

MS. WALSH: MM-HMM. SO THE -- THE ONE THING

THAT KIND OF STRUCK ME IS THAT, AS YOU SAID EARLIER, WITH A DESIGN-BUILD

PROCESS, THE IDEA IS THAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A GREATER EFFICIENCY, NOT

BE RUSHED, BUT YOU MAY COMPLETE A PROJECT MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE

QUICKLY, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT -- A LITTLE BIT MORE, YOU KNOW,

COST-EFFECTIVELY, SO MIGHT IT BE AN UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE OF THIS

LEGISLATION THAT BY ADDING THAT EXTRA PERSON ON THE SITE THAT IT MIGHT

MAKE THESE PROJECTS GO A LITTLE BIT MORE SLOWLY?

MR. MCDONALD: I --I -- I DON'T THINK SO. IN -- IN

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MY EXPERIENCE, ONCE AGAIN, WE'RE DEALING WITH PROFESSIONAL ENGINEERS,

THEY ALL TALK THE SAME WAY, WHICH I'VE HAD THE LUXURY, UNFORTUNATELY, OF

LOOKING AT HOW THESE PROJECTS ARE PLANNED AND IT'S IMPRESSIVE WHEN

YOU LOOK AT THAT 12-MONTH, 18-MONTH, 24-MONTH SCHEDULE. SO IT'S

GOING TO BE INCUMBENT UPON THE PUBLIC EMPLOYEE TO MAKE SURE THAT

THEY -- THEY POP IN AND POP OUT AT THE RIGHT TIMES TO NOT INTERRUPT THE

PROCESS. THAT IS NOT THE INTENTION. AS YOU KNOW WITH ANY KIND OF

PROJECT, JUST LIKE GETTING TO WORK SOME DAYS THERE'S ALWAYS GOING TO BE

UNINTENDED INTERRUPTIONS, BUT THAT'S NOT THE INTENTION.

MS. WALSH: VERY GOOD. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

MR. MCDONALD: THANK YOU.

MS. WALSH: MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MS.

WALSH.

MS. WALSH: SO I VERY MUCH APPRECIATE THE

ANSWERS THAT THE SPONSOR JUST GAVE TO THE REALLY CLARIFYING QUESTIONS

THAT I WANTED TO ASK. I THINK BASED ON HIS ANSWERS I THINK THAT,

ALTHOUGH IT IS ADDING ANOTHER INDIVIDUAL THAT IS GOING TO BE PERIODICALLY

CHECKING, I THINK THAT THAT IS PROBABLY GOOD STEWARDSHIP OF THE FUNDS

THAT ARE BEING USED, STATE FUNDS AND TAXPAYER FUNDS THAT ARE BEING USED

ON THESE PROJECTS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE BEING DONE IN THE WAY THAT

THEY SHOULD BE DONE, AND IT DOESN'T SOUND AS THOUGH HAVING THIS

INDIVIDUAL PERIODICALLY VISIT DURING A PROJECT AND ENSURE THAT THINGS ARE

BEING DONE AS THEY SHOULD BE, THAT IT'S GOING TO UNDULY DELAY A PROJECT'S

COMPLETION. SO FOR THOSE REASONS, I'LL BE SUPPORTING THIS BILL AND I'D

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MS.

WALSH.

READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, WILL YOU

PLEASE CALL THE WAYS AND MEANS COMMITTEE TO THE SPEAKER'S

CONFERENCE ROOM?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CERTAINLY. WAYS AND

MEANS COMMITTEE, SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM IMMEDIATELY, PLEASE.

PAGE 7, RULES REPORT NO. 205, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00124-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 205, SOLAGES, SILLITTI, TAYLOR, EPSTEIN, DICKENS,

GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, KELLES, ZINERMAN, JACKSON, LAVINE, LUNSFORD,

BUTTENSCHON. AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL MUNICIPAL LAW AND THE

PUBLIC BUILDINGS LAW, IN RELATION TO PROHIBITING MUNICIPAL OFFICERS OR

EMPLOYEES FROM DISPLAYING POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENTS ON OR WITHIN

PUBLIC BUILDINGS AND VARIOUS OTHER LOCATIONS.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

SOLAGES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED.

AN EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED.

MS. SOLAGES: YES. THIS BILL WOULD PROHIBIT

MUNICIPAL OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES FROM DISPLAYING POLITICAL

ADVERTISEMENTS ON OR WITHIN ANY PUBLIC BUILDING OCCUPIED IN THE

DISCHARGE IN THE OFFICIAL DUTIES BY THE MUNICIPAL OFFICERS OR EMPLOYEES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. WOULD THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: I'LL YIELD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE SPONSOR WILL

YIELD.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MS. SOLAGES. AS YOU

MENTIONED, THIS BILL WOULD PROHIBIT ANY POLITICAL ADVERTISING IN SUPPORT

OR AGAINST, PRESUMABLY, AN INDIVIDUAL WHO IS TRYING TO (INAUDIBLE)

POLITICAL OFFICE IN ANY MUNICIPAL PROPERTY, AND I FULLY SUPPORT THAT. I

DON'T THINK WHEN YOU GO TO PAY YOUR TAXES OR CONDUCT BUSINESS IN ANY

MUNICIPAL BUILDING THERE OUGHT TO BE LEGAL CAMPAIGN MATERIALS ON THE

WALLS OR -- OR ELSEWHERE. I'M WITH YOU.

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, THIS BILL, THOUGH, ALSO APPLIES

TO MUNICIPAL OFFICER OR EMPLOYEE WHO IS PAID OR UNPAID. SO THIS

WOULD APPLY TO VOLUNTEERS, AS WELL, CORRECT?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: SO YES. IT WOULD APPLY TO

INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE VOLUNTEERING, OR, ESSENTIALLY, YOU KNOW, WORKING

WITHIN A GOVERNMENT SPACE.

MR. GOODELL: AND IT APPLIES TO VOLUNTEERS IF

THEY'RE WITHIN A PUBLIC BUILDING OR -- WELL, EVEN IF THEY'RE JUST WITHIN

THE PUBLIC BUILDING, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: THE -- SO IF THEY'RE WITHIN A PUBLIC

BUILDING OCCUPIED IN A PUBLIC SPACE, THAT WOULD CONSTITUTE.

MR. GOODELL: SO YOU CAN HAVE A SITUATION OF A

VOLUNTEER, FOR EXAMPLE --

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: -- WHO HAS SAY A POLITICAL BUTTON ON

THEIR LAPEL AND THEY WOULD BE IN VIOLATION OF THIS IF THEY WALKED INSIDE

THE MUNICIPAL BUILDING EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE JUST A VOLUNTEER?

MS. SOLAGES: THEY ARE VOLUNTEERS WHO HAVE TO

FILE A CONFLICT OF INTEREST DOCUMENTATION. SO IF THEY'RE WITHIN THAT

FORMAL CONFINE, THEN THEY WOULD HAVE TO -- THEY WOULD BE PROHIBITED

FROM PUTTING PUBLIC -- POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENTS ON THEIR PERSONS.

MR. GOODELL: AND WHERE IN THIS BILL IS THERE A

REFERENCE TO HAVING TO FILE A CONFLICT OF INTEREST PROVISION?

MS. SOLAGES: YEAH. IT'S WITHIN -- IT'S NOT WITHIN

THE CONFINES OF THIS BILL LANGUAGE AS YOU'RE LOOKING, BUT IT'S WITHIN THE

PUBLIC OFFICERS LAW.

MR. GOODELL: WELL, VOLUNTEERS DON'T FILE CONFLICT

OF INTERESTS, RIGHT? NOT UNLESS YOU'RE A POLICYMAKING -- A

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

POLICYMAKING VOLUNTEER WHICH WOULD BE (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) --

MS. SOLAGES: IT'S THE REFERENCE TO SECTION 800.

MR. GOODELL: WHAT'S THAT?

MS. SOLAGES: IT'S THE REFERENCE TO SECTION 800 IN

THE PUBLIC OFFICERS LAW.

MR. GOODELL: RIGHT, AND THAT DOESN'T APPLY TO

VOLUNTEERS, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO IT -- SO WITHIN THIS PROVISION

RIGHT HERE, WE'RE SAYING A PUBLIC OFFICER EMPLOYEE WHETHER PAID OR

UNPAID SHALL BE PROHIBITED.

MR. GOODELL: RIGHT.

MS. SOLAGES: SO...

MR. GOODELL: AND IT -- IT SPECIFICALLY INCLUDES

MEMBERS OF A VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENT, RIGHT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO IT -- THAT'S --

MR. GOODELL: I'M LOOKING AT --

MS. SOLAGES: -- TO ME THAT CONSTITUTES AS A PUBLIC

BUILDING PAID BY THE TAXPAYERS.

MR. GOODELL: OKAY. SO LET ME JUST WALK THROUGH

THAT.

MS. SOLAGES: AND NOR WOULD I WANT, YOU KNOW, A

VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER, YOU KNOW, USING OR ADVERTISING OR CAMPAIGNING

WITHIN A PUBLIC BUILDING.

MR. GOODELL: OKAY. SO LET'S JUST WALK THROUGH

THIS A LITTLE BIT. FIRST OF ALL, PAGE 1, LINE 8, IT EXPRESSLY INCLUDES

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MEMBERS OF A VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENT, RIGHT?

MS. SOLAGES: COULD YOU JUST REPEAT THE SECTION?

MR. GOODELL: SURE. PAGE 1 --

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: -- LINE 8.

MS. SOLAGES: I'M WITH YOU.

MR. GOODELL: EXPRESSLY INCLUDES VOLUNTEER

FIREMEN WITHIN THE SCOPE OF THIS BILL, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

MR. GOODELL: AND PAGE 1, LINE 14, MAKES IT CLEAR

THAT IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER YOU'RE PAID OR UNPAID. SO YOU CAN HAVE

AN UNPAID VOLUNTEER FIREMAN CLEARLY WITHIN THE SCOPE OF THIS, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: YES, YES.

MR. GOODELL: AND THIS APPLIES TO WHATEVER IS

WORN ON THEIR CLOTHES, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

MR. GOODELL: SO IF A VOLUNTEER FIREMAN IS

WEARING A -- A HAT THAT SAYS, SAY, "BIDEN/HARRIS," VOLUNTEER FIREMAN,

WEARING A BASEBALL HAT THAT SAYS "BIDEN/HARRIS" AND THEY WALK INTO THE

MUNICIPALITY --

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: -- THEY'RE UNPAID, THEY'RE NOT ON

DUTY, THEY'RE A VOLUNTEER FIREMAN BUT THEY ARE CERTAINLY WEARING A HAT

THAT SAYS "BIDEN/HARRIS" AND --

MS. SOLAGES: SO THAT IS WITHIN THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(INAUDIBLE/CROSSTALK) --

MR. GOODELL: -- THEY'RE CERTAINLY WITHIN THE

BUILDING. THEY WOULD BE VIOLATING THIS LAW?

MS. SOLAGES: WOULD YOU FURTHER DESCRIBE THE HAT,

BECAUSE IF THE HAT HAS MAYBE --

MR. GOODELL: SURE. LET'S SAY IT'S A BASEBALL HAT

THAT SAYS "BIDEN/HARRIS."

MS. SOLAGES: ALL RIGHT. SO THOSE INDIVIDUALS --

SEE, WE WOULD HAVE TO -- SO WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IS IF -- IF THERE IS A -- A

COMPLAINT, THEN, YOU KNOW, THERE WOULD BE CONVERSATIONS. IT'S A GRAY

AREA IN THAT RESPECT AND, YOU KNOW, I ASK THAT QUESTION BECAUSE

BIDEN/HARRIS ARE ACTUALLY THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION. SO I ASK YOU TO

DESCRIBE THE HAT BECAUSE IT MIGHT NOT FALL UNDER A QUOTE OF

ADVERTISEMENT. SO IF IT SAID SOMETHING LIKE "VOTE BIDEN/HARRIS," OR IF

IT SAID SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT ISN'T POLITICAL AND CAMPAIGN IN

NATURE, IT WOULD FALL UNDER THIS PROVISION.

MR. GOODELL: OKAY. SO USING ANOTHER EXAMPLE,

THEY COULD WEAR A -- A RED HAT WITH WHITE LETTERS THAT SAYS "TRUMP," --

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: -- AND THAT WOULD BE OKAY AS LONG

AS TRUMP WAS PRESIDENT AND ILLEGAL THE DAY AFTER HE LEFT.

MS. SOLAGES: SO THERE ARE SOME OF THOSE HATS THAT

ARE DONE AND USED IN A POLITICAL SENSE, AND SO THAT WOULD BE A GRAY

AREA.

MR. GOODELL: I SEE. SO LET'S SAY YOU HAVE A

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VOLUNTEER SWINGING BY, STOPPING BY THE MUNICIPALITY, UNPAID

VOLUNTEER, HAS A "VOTE FOR BIDEN" HAT ON --

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM. MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: -- YOU CAN'T PUT IT ON THE COAT RACK,

RIGHT, BECAUSE THAT'S CLEARLY PROHIBITED, SO HE HAS TO TAKE IT OFF BEFORE

HE COMES IN AND, WHAT, STUFF IT IN HIS POCKET OR SOMETHING?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW WE'RE

GETTING IN -- IN -- IN LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO REMIND THAT THE

LANGUAGE OF THIS BILL IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE PROVISIONS OF THE FEDERAL

HATCH ACT, WHICH REGULATES THE POLITICAL ACTIVITIES OF FEDERAL

GOVERNMENT OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES. AND THAT INCLUDES THE DISPLAYING

OF POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENT WHILE ON DUTY OR IN A PUBLIC BUILDING, OR ON

GOVERNMENT UNIFORMS OR ON GOVERNMENT VEHICLES. AND SO, YOU KNOW,

WE WOULD HOPE THAT THE INDIVIDUALS WOULD USE THEIR DISCRETION AND

UNDERSTAND THAT THIS LAW IS, WHEN IT IS ENACTED, WOULD USE THAT

DISCRETION AND BE CAREFUL ABOUT, YOU KNOW, GETTING INTO THOSE -- THOSE

SITUATIONS AND GRAY AREAS.

MR. GOODELL: MS. SOLAGES, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS.

ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: ON THE BILL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU. I THINK EVERYONE HERE

IN THIS CHAMBER; REPUBLICAN, DEMOCRAT, INDEPENDENT, LIBERAL,

CONSERVATIVE AGREE THAT THERE SHOULDN'T BE ANY POLITICAL ADVERTISING OR

ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE IN A PUBLIC BUILDING, ON A PUBLIC SIGN, ON PUBLIC

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VEHICLES, ON OFFICIAL VEHICLES OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, BECAUSE WE ALWAYS

WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL PUBLIC OFFICIALS ARE OPERATING INDEPENDENT,

THAT IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOUR POLITICAL PERSUASION IS, WHEN YOU'RE

DEALING WITH THE GOVERNMENT, THEY'RE GOING TO DEAL WITH YOU IN A FAIR

AND EQUITABLE MANNER REGARDLESS OF POLITICS. ONE HUNDRED PERCENT IN

AGREEMENT WITH MY COLLEAGUE AND THE BILL SPONSOR.

THE CHALLENGE WITH THIS BILL IS IT GOES BEYOND THAT.

THIS BILL EXPRESSLY INCLUDES VOLUNTEER FIREMEN. AND IN UPSTATE, IN THE

RURAL SECTIONS IN OUR STATE, IT IS A HUGE CHALLENGE TO RECRUIT VOLUNTEER

FIREMEN. AND THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO, WITH NO COMPENSATION AT ALL, WILL

GET UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT, LEAVE THEIR FAMILIES, JUMP ON A FIRE

TRUCK OR MORE OFTEN AN AMBULANCE, RUSH OUT, SAVE SOMEBODY'S LIFE, AND

THEY DO IT DAY IN AND DAY OUT. IT'S A SELFLESS COMMITMENT TO COMMUNITY

SERVICE AND GOD BLESS THEM. THE PROBLEM WITH THIS IS IF THEY JUMP UP

IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT AND PUT ON A T-SHIRT THAT SAYS "VOTE FOR

BIDEN," AND THEY JOIN WITH A FEW COLLEAGUES OR EMTS AND THEY RUSH TO

A NEIGHBOR'S HOUSE TO SAVE THE NEIGHBOR, THEY'RE VIOLATING THIS LAW.

THAT'S NOT WHAT WE WANT TO HAPPEN, IS IT? AND SO BECAUSE IT EXPRESSLY

INCLUDES VOLUNTEER FIREMEN AND EXPRESSLY INCLUDES THEM JUST WEARING

CLOTHES WITHIN A MUNICIPAL VEHICLE OR -- OR A MUNICIPAL BUILDING, IT'S

JUST TOO BROAD. THESE PEOPLE SAVE LIVES EVERY SINGLE DAY. THE LAST

THING WE WANT TO DO IS CITE THEM BECAUSE OF A T-SHIRT OR A BASEBALL HAT

THAT THEY MIGHT WEAR WHEN THEY WOKE UP AT THREE IN THE MORNING AND

RESPONDED TO THAT FIRE ALARM TO SAVE THEIR NEIGHBOR'S LIFE. AND FOR THAT

REASON, WHILE I THOROUGHLY AND COMPLETELY AND ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CONCEPT AS IT APPLIES TO PAID EMPLOYEES, AND ANY BUILDINGS OR ANY

VEHICLES, THE SPECIFIC REFERENCE TO VOLUNTEER FIREMAN GOES TOO FAR AND

FOR THAT REASON, I WON'T BE ABLE TO SUPPORT IT. AGAIN, THANK YOU VERY

MUCH TO MY COLLEAGUE. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MR. DURSO.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD JUST FOR TWO QUICK QUESTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: WOULD THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: THE SPONSOR

YIELDS.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MS. SOLAGES. SO IN

REFERENCE TO WHAT MY COLLEAGUE WAS SAYING, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

SPECIFICALLY VOLUNTEER FIREMEN OR FIREWOMEN OR VOLUNTEERS IN GENERAL,

WOULD IT COUNT IF THERE ARE, AS MR. GOODELL SAID, PUT ON A T-SHIRT OR

WHATEVER WHEN THEY JUMP UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT AND THEN END

UP IN THE FIREHOUSE TO RESPOND TO A CALL. WOULD THAT ESSENTIALLY COUNT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, YOU KNOW, THE BILL -- THE BILL

WOULD PROHIBIT THESE INDIVIDUALS FROM WEARING POLITICAL

ADVERTISEMENTS. AND SO WE HOPE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE SOME

DISCRETION AND BE ABLE TO NOT WEAR POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENTS IN A PUBLIC

BUILDING. THIS IS ALSO JUST ENSURING THAT WE ARE JUST MAKING SURE THAT

THE WORKPLACE IS A FAIR AND BALANCED PLACE AND WE'RE NOT CAUSING ANY

SORT OF, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT DISTURBING WORKPLACE HARMONY.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. DURSO: OKAY, UNDERSTOOD. SO IN REGARDS TO

THAT, ALSO, VOLUNTEER FIRE PEOPLE GO TO CALLS IN THEIR OWN PERSONAL

VEHICLE.

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. DURSO: THEY RESPOND TO CALLS IN THEIR OWN

PERSONAL VEHICLE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THEM PUT A BLUE LIGHT IN TO

RESPOND TO THOSE CALLS. IF THEY ARE DRIVING IN THEIR PERSONAL VEHICLE ON

THE WAY TO A FIRE CALL AND ACTING AS A VOLUNTEER AT THAT POINT, BUT THEY

HAVE A BUMPER STICKER ON THEIR CAR, OR THEY HAVE A MAGNET ON THEIR CAR,

OR THEY THEMSELVES ARE RUNNING FOR OFFICE, OR -- OR THERE'S ANY TYPE OF

POLI -- POLITI -- POLITICAL, EXCUSE ME, ADVERTISEMENT ON THEIR VEHICLE,

WOULD THAT FALL UNDER THIS?

MS. SOLAGES: PERSONAL CARS DO NOT FALL UNDER THIS

PROVISION.

MR. DURSO: SO EVEN IF THEY'RE PULLING INTO THE FIRE

DEPARTMENT LOT, THEY ARE --

MS. SOLAGES: IF IT IS A -- A CAR WHICH WAS

PROVIDED BY THE MUNICIPALITY, THEN IT WOULD FALL UNDER THE PROVISION.

MR. DURSO: BUT IF IT'S THEIR PERSONAL VEHICLE THAT

THEY'RE RESPONDING TO A CALL AND ACTING AS A -- AS A PERSON --

MS. SOLAGES: I BELIEVE IN PROPERTY RIGHTS, SIR.

MR. DURSO: WHAT'S THAT?

MS. SOLAGES: YES, SIR.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO MY LAST QUESTION IS, AND I

BELIEVE UNLESS I READ IT WRONG, IT SAYS PUBLIC BUILDING, CORRECT?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. DURSO: SO IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S -- IT'S -- IT'S A

BUILDING FOR THIS PURPOSE THAT IT'S OWNED BY A MUNICIPALITY OR A

GOVERNMENT BUILDING, OR IS IT ANY BUILDING?

MS. SOLAGES: NO, IT'S A GOVERNMENT BUILDING.

MR. DURSO: GOVERNMENT BUILDING. OKAY.

MS. SOLAGES: OCCUPIED BY A MUNICIPAL ENTITY.

MR. DURSO: ANY GOVERNMENT BUILDING OCCUPIED BY

A MUNICIPAL ENTITY, OKAY. THANK YOU, MS. SOLAGES. I APPRECIATE THE

CLARIFICATION.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MR. NOVAKHOV.

MR. NOVAKHOV: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL

THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR ONE QUICK QUESTION?

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD? IT WILL BE HER HONOR. PLEASE PROCEED.

MR. NOVAKHOV: THANK YOU. SO WOULD IT COUNT IF

A GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEE BEING INSIDE A GOVERNMENT BUILDING SPEAKS

OUT WITH HIS OR HER COLLEAGUES ABOUT HIS POLITICAL PREFERENCES?

MS. SOLAGES: I'D JUST ASK THE GENTLEMAN TO SPEAK A

LITTLE BIT LOUDER.

MR. NOVAKHOV: YEAH, SURE. I'LL JUST BE CLOSER TO

THE MICROPHONE. WOULD IT COUNT IF ANY GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEE BEING IN

A GOVERNMENT BUILDING SPEAKS OUT WITH HIS OR HER COLLEAGUES ABOUT HIS

POLITICAL PREFERENCES AND HOW THIS WILL CORRELATE WITH THE FREEDOM OF

SPEECH?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: THIS DOES NOT COVER SPEECH.

MR. NOVAKHOV: SO ONLY VISUALS, RIGHT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES STILL

HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPEAK AS A PRIVATE CITIZEN ON MATTERS OF PUBLIC

CONCERN, WHICH INCLUDES POLITICAL, BUT ONLY TO THE EXTENT THAT THE

EMPLOYEE HAS SPEECH THAT DOESN'T INTERFERE WITH THE INTEREST OF THE

GOVERNMENT AND THE HARMONY OF THE WORKPLACE.

MR. NOVAKHOV: SO AGAIN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

ONLY THE VISUAL ADVERTISING, RIGHT?

MS. SOLAGES: PARDON ME? YOUR QUESTION WAS

VISUAL ADVERTISEMENTS?

MR. NOVAKHOV: YEAH. ARE WE TALKING ABOUT

ONLY THE BILL IS ONLY RELATES TO VISUAL ADVERTISEMENTS?

MS. SOLAGES: THE BILL SPEAKS TO -- SO, WHAT I'LL

READ IN THE -- IN THE BILL FOR THE RECORD; POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENTS SHALL

MEAN ANY POSTER, SIGN, FLAG, BANNER, PICTURE, STICKER, PATCH, BUMPER

STICKER, ARTICLE OF CLOTHING, ACCESSORY, OR ANY OTHER ITEM MEANT TO

ADVERTISE OR PROMOTE A CERTAIN INDIVIDUAL FOR PUBLIC OFFICE.

MR. NOVAKHOV: OKAY. SO IN OTHER WORDS --

MS. SOLAGES: POLITICAL OFFICE.

MR. NOVAKHOV: ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU. SO IN OTHER

WORDS, IN A -- IN A CAFETERIA OF A GOVERNMENT BUILDING, IF AN INDIVIDUAL

AND EMPLOYEE OF THIS GOVERNMENT WILL SHOUT OUT LOUD, I'M GOING TO

VOTE FOR DEMOCRATIC PARTY, OR REPUBLICAN PARTY --

MS. SOLAGES: I LIKE THAT, I LIKE YOU SAYING THAT.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. NOVAKHOV: ALL RIGHT. WELL, I DON'T KNOW.

(LAUGHTER)

WOULD THAT BE OKAY? WILL THAT BE ANY VIOLATION OF THE

LAW?

MS. SOLAGES: GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES STILL HAVE

THE RIGHT TO SPEAK AS PRIVATE CITIZENS AND AS LONG AS IT DOESN'T VIOLATE

ANY OF THE GOVERNMENTAL INTEREST OF EFFICIENCY AND WORKPLACE

HARMONY, IT'S FINE.

MR. NOVAKHOV: OKAY. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

THANK YOU.

MS. SOLAGES: OH, NO PROBLEM.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MS. BYRNES.

MS. BYRNES: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: THE SPONSOR

YIELDS. PLEASE PROCEED.

MS. BYRNES: I GUESS ONE THING THAT HASN'T BEEN

ADDRESSED, AND I'M SURE EVERY FIRE DEPARTMENT, AND EVERY FIRE DISTRICT

CAN BE DIFFERENT, I MEAN THERE ARE SO MANY VARIATIONS ACROSS OUR GREAT

STATE, BUT NOT ALL OF THE FIRE DEPARTMENTS ARE -- HAVE -- ARE RUN OR HAVE

ANYTHING TO DO WITH OUR MUNICIPALITIES. THEY MAY HAVE THEIR OWN

BUILDING THAT IS -- AND THEY'RE NOT -- THEY DON'T GET ANY TAX MONEY. LIKE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IN MY VILLAGE, WE DON'T PAY ANY MONEY FOR -- FOR THE FIRE DEPARTMENT

AND THAT'S WHY THEY'RE OUT WITH THEIR BUCKETS COLLECTING ON THE STREET

CORNERS WHEN CARS DRIVE BY. THEY'RE NOT MUNICIPALLY-FUNDED, THEY'RE

NOT IN A BUILDING WHICH IS OWNED BY THE VILLAGE, IT'S NOT A GOVERNMENT

BUILDING, IT'S ONE THEY PUT UP THEMSELVES. I MEAN, I'M TRYING TO FIGURE

OUT HOW VOLUNTEER FIREMEN CAN BE CONSIDERED BASICALLY GOVERNMENT

EMPLOYEES WHEN THEY HAVE -- WHEN SOME OF THEM, AT LEAST, HAVE

ABSOLUTELY NO AFFILIATION WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT AT ALL.

MS. SOLAGES: SO LET ME CLARIFY, FOR THE PURPOSE OF

YOUR EXAMPLE. SO THESE -- THESE VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTERS ARE A PRIVATE

ENTITY AND THEY DO NOT RECEIVE TAXPAYER DOLLARS WHICH TENDS TO MAKE

THEM NOT MUNICIPAL OFFICERS OR EMPLOYEES, RIGHT?

MS. BYRNES: YES.

MS. SOLAGES: SO THEY DON'T QUALIFY IN THIS BILL.

MS. BYRNES: THEY CAN HAVE THEIR OWN

CORPORATIONS.

MS. SOLAGES: THEY'RE CORPORATIONS? SO THEY DON'T

QUALIFY IN THIS BILL. THIS BILL ONLY SPEAKS TO PROHIBITING MUNICIPAL

OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES FROM DISPLAYING, YOU KNOW, POLITICAL

ADVERTISEMENTS.

MS. BYRNES: ALL RIGHT. SO THEN ANY -- A LOT OF OUR

VOLUNTEER FIREMEN MAY FALL OUTSIDE OF THIS. SO YOU'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT

VOLUNTEER FIREMEN PER SE, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT VOLUNTEER FIREMEN BUT

WHO ARE DIRECTLY AFFILIATED WITH A MUNICIPALITY BY PAID OR VOLUNTEER FOR

THE MUNICIPALITY.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: YEAH. SO LIKE IF THE MUNICIPALITY IS

FUNDING IT, THEN HENCE IT WOULD BE UNDER THIS -- THIS BILL.

MS. BYRNES: ALL RIGHT. SO IF A VILLAGE IS GIVING NO

MONEY TO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT THEN --

MS. SOLAGES: THEN THAT'S NOT CONSIDERED A

MUNICIPAL ENTITY.

MS. BYRNES: ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU. THAT TAKES CARE

OF A LOT OF THE VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENTS.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: READ THE LAST

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: A PARTY VOTE HAS

BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED FOR THE REASONS I MENTIONED. THERE

MAY BE THOSE WHO WISH TO SUPPORT IT, AND IF SO THEY SHOULD VOTE YES ON

THE FLOOR. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF

THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE SOME THAT WOULD

DESIRE TO BE AN EXCEPTION, THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE TO DO SO BY VOTING ON

THE FLOOR.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR. I WOULD

LIKE TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE BECAUSE I REALIZE THAT ALL OF US IN THIS ROOM

ALREADY SERVE UNDER THESE CERTAIN REQUIREMENTS THAT WE'RE NOW ASKING

OTHER FOLKS ACROSS THE STATE OF NEW YORK TO ADHERE TO, AS WELL. I MEAN

I KNOW OUR SERGEANT-OF-ARMS DOESN'T ALLOW ANYBODY HERE WEARING

CAMPAIGN BUTTONS, WHETHER YOU'RE COMING TO WORK OR NOT. THEY COULD

BE VOLUNTEERS, BUT THEY STILL CAN'T WEAR THAT IN HERE. AND I KNOW EVEN

IN MY OFFICE WE HAVE TO BE VERY CLEAR AND VERY DISTINCT AND WE HAVE TO

SEPARATE NOT JUST THE POLITICS OF ME RUNNING FOR OFFICE BUT THE POLITICS

OF ANYONE THAT'S RUNNING FOR OFFICE CAN'T BE VISIBLE IN MY OFFICE AND

YOU CAN'T COME WEARING THAT INTO A GOVERNMENT OFFICE. AND SO I KIND

OF RESPECT THAT. I'VE LEARNED HOW TO FOLLOW IT. I'VE LEARNED HOW TO

ADHERE TO IT AND IN ALL HONESTY, AND I DON'T LIVE IN A DISTRICT WHERE

VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTERS ARE NECESSARILY REPRESENTED, BUT I LIVE VERY CLOSE

TO THEM AND I ACTUALLY KNOW SOME OF THEM. AND I ALSO KNOW THAT THEY

ARE MUCH LIKE WE ARE. THEY -- THEY WORK HARD, THEY VOLUNTEER THEIR

TIME, THEY DO THINGS THAT MOST PEOPLE DON'T DO HONESTLY, BUT ON THE

OTHER HAND, THEY ALSO ALWAYS LIKE TO FOLLOW RULES. THEY'RE NOT THE

PEOPLE WHO WANT TO VIOLATE THE RULES. AND SO I THINK ONCE IT'S

EXPLAINED TO THEM, THEY WILL UNDERSTAND THAT YEAH, YOU MIGHT HAVE TO

JUMP UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE MORNING AND RUN TO SAVE SOMEBODY'S LIFE,

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AND ONCE YOU DO THAT, YOU UNDERSTAND THAT IF I DO HAVE ON A SHIRT THAT

SAYS "PRESIDENT BIDEN," THAT I'M GOING TO NEED TO TAKE THAT OFF BEFORE I

HEAD INTO A BUILDING OR SOMEWHERE AFTER I'VE TAKEN CARE OF A JOB THAT I

WENT TO DO. SO -- AND I DON'T THINK THAT THERE'S ANY JUDGE, LAWYER OR

ANYONE WHO WOULD TRY TO PROSECUTE SOMEBODY WHO IS DOING THEIR JOB

AND INADVERTENTLY JUMPED UP AND PUT ON A BIDEN SHIRT TO GO DO IT.

SO I -- I ACTUALLY THINK THAT WE'RE ASSUMING THAT

SOMEHOW THESE VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTERS WON'T HAVE THE CAPACITY TO MAKE

A DETERMINATION ON THEIR ABILITY TO FOLLOW RULES OR THEIR INABILITY TO

FOLLOW RULES. THE ONES I KNOW ARE CLEARLY GOING TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO

FOLLOW RULES AND I DON'T THINK IT'S GOING TO PRESENT A PROBLEM FOR THEM

THAT HAS BEEN LAID OUT TO US HERE ON THE FLOOR. SO I DO WANT TO, YOU

KNOW, COMMEND THE SPONSOR OF THIS LEGISLATION AND ENCOURAGE PEOPLE

TO UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS A PLACE WHERE EVERYBODY HAS TO FOLLOW RULES.

THIS IS NOT A RULE THAT'S GOING TO JEOPARDIZE ANYBODY'S LIVELIHOOD. THIS

IS A RULE THAT'S GOING TO PROTECT THE INTEREST OF THE PUBLIC'S INTEREST AT ALL

TIMES, WHICH IS ONLY FAIR. SO I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND HOPE

EVERYBODY ELSE WILL AS WELL.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES FOR THE PURPOSE OF AN

ANNOUNCEMENT.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR. COULD

YOU PLEASE INVITE THE MEMBERS OF THE RULES COMMITTEE TO GO TO THE

SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM IMMEDIATELY?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: MEMBERS OF THE

RULES COMMITTEE, SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM, IMMEDIATELY.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL HAS PASSED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES FOR THE PURPOSE OF AN

INTRODUCTION.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. ON BEHALF OF OUR COLLEAGUE, MR. JONES, IF YOU WOULD PLEASE

WELCOME THE 5TH GRADERS FROM THE LAKE PLACID ELEMENTARY SCHOOL AND

THEIR TEACHERS, JON FREMANTE, ALEXA ANGELOPOULOS, TINA STUBBS, AND

SONJA FRANKLIN IS THE PRINCIPAL. AS YOU KNOW, MR. SPEAKER, THIS IS ONE

OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL AREAS IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, WE HAVE MANY,

BUT LAKE PLACID IS ONE OF THEM. THESE YOUNG PEOPLE HAPPEN TO LIVE

THERE, THEIR TEACHERS, EDUCATORS, AND THESE OTHER FOLKS ARE WITH THEM.

THEY LIVE IN A BEAUTIFUL PLACE, THEY'RE BEAUTIFUL STUDENTS, AND THEY ACT

AS JUST LIKE THEY DESERVE, THEY'RE WELL BEHAVED. WOULD YOU PLEASE

WELCOME THEM TO OUR CHAMBERS?

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: CERTAINLY. ON

BEHALF OF THE MAJORITY LEADER PEOPLES-STOKES, ON BEHALF OF MEMBER

BILLY JONES AND THE SPEAKER, WE WELCOME YOU TODAY TO THIS CHAMBER.

WE HOPE THAT YOU ENJOY THE PROCEEDINGS TODAY. WE EXTEND TO YOU THE

PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR AND HOPE THAT YOU HAVE AN AMAZING DAY HERE IN

ALBANY. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BLESSING US WITH YOUR PRESENCE.

(APPLAUSE)

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES FOR THE PURPOSE OF AN

INTRODUCTION.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, AGAIN, MR.

SPEAKER. ON BEHALF OF OUR COLLEAGUE MR. SANTABARBARA, I WOULD LIKE TO

WELCOME HIS GUESTS TO OUR CHAMBERS. JOLYNN [SIC] LAMPMAN IS THE

SCHOOL OF TRANSGRASS [SIC] IPM EXTENSION SUPPORT SPECIALIST AT THE

NEW YORK STATE IPM PROGRAM OF CORNELL UNIVERSITY. JOINING MS.

LAMPMAN IS JULIA SUAREZ, ASSOCIATE DEAN FOR LAND GRANT AFFAIRS,

COLLEGE OF AGRICULTURE AND LIFE SCIENCES AT CORNELL. MS. LAMPMAN'S

DEDICATION AND EXPERTISE HAS SIGNIFICANTLY IMPACTED THE LIVES OF

COUNTLESS INDIVIDUALS, PARTICULARLY OUR COLLEAGUE, ANGELO SANTABARBARA

AND THOSE THAT LIVE IN HIS DISTRICT, WHERE SHE HAS MADE SEVERAL

PRESENTATIONS ON LYME DISEASE PREVENTION. MR. SPEAKER, IF YOU WOULD

PLEASE JOIN ME AND MR. SANTABARBARA AND OTHERS IN WELCOMING MS.

LAMPMAN AND HER COLLEAGUE TO OUR CHAMBERS, IT WOULD BE MUCH

APPRECIATED. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER ZACCARO: CERTAINLY. ON

BEHALF OF MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES, MR. SANTABARBARA AND THE SPEAKER AND

THE MEMBERS HERE AT THE STATE ASSEMBLY, WE WELCOME YOU TO THIS

CHAMBER. WE EXTEND TO YOU THE PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR. WE THANK YOU

FOR THE WORK THAT YOU DO AND WE ASK THAT YOU WILL CONTINUE TO DO THAT

FOR THE PEOPLE OF MR. SANTABARBARA'S DISTRICT AND ALL NEW YORKERS

ACROSS THE STATE. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US TODAY. YOU'RE

MORE THAN WELCOME IN THIS PLACE.

(APPLAUSE)

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER: MR. GOODELL FOR THE PURPOSES

OF AN INTRODUCTION.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. IT IS

MY GREAT PLEASURE TO INTRODUCE ONE OF OUR FORMER COLLEAGUES WHO IS

BUSY TALKING WITH OTHER COLLEAGUES OF OURS, JANET DUPREY. JANET

DUPREY SERVED THE NORTH COUNTY AREA -- THE NORTH COUNTRY AREA,

ORIGINALLY FROM PLATTSBURGH, FIRST ELECTED I THINK IN 2006 OR 8. DID A

GREAT JOB AS A MEMBER OF THE REPUB -- WELL, I MEANT IN THE ASSEMBLY,

RIGHT? PREVIOUSLY SERVED I THINK AS A COUNTY CLERK, IS THAT CORRECT?

COUNTY TREASURER. I SHOULD KNOW THAT SINCE THE COUNTY TREASURER

CONTROLS ALL THE PURSE STRINGS. DID A GREAT JOB HERE IN -- IN THE

ASSEMBLY. TOOK SOME POSITIONS THAT WERE COURAGEOUS AT THE TIME,

INCLUDING SUPPORTING GAY MARRIAGE, GAY AND LESBIAN RIGHTS, EVEN SIGNED

AN AMICUS BRIEF ON THAT ISSUE. BROUGHT A WEALTH OF EXPERIENCE,

KNOWLEDGE AND, THANKFULLY, HUMOR, SO THAT ONCE SHE'S IMPROPERLY

INTRODUCED SHE SMILES AND CORRECTS ME. PLEASE WELCOME BACK TO THE

FLOOR OF THE ASSEMBLY JANET DUPREY, OUR FRIEND AND COLLEAGUE.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: WELCOME BACK, MS.

DUPREY. AND ON BEHALF OF MR. GOODELL AND OBVIOUSLY ALL THE MEMBERS

HERE, THE SPEAKER, WE'RE SO HAPPY TO HAVE YOU BACK IN THE CHAMBERS,

AND I HEAR ONCE A MEMBER, ALWAYS A MEMBER. I'M STILL NEW.

OBVIOUSLY, THE PRIVILEGES OF THE FLOOR ARE ALWAYS YOURS, AND ENJOY THE

PROCEEDINGS. IT'S GOING TO BE VERY LIVELY TODAY, AND THANK YOU SO MUCH

FOR JOINING US.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(APPLAUSE)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MADAM SPEAKER,

MEMBERS NOW HAVE ON THEIR DESKS AN A-CALENDAR. IF YOU WOULD -- I --

I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THAT A-CALENDAR, PLEASE.

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: ON A MOTION BY

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES, THE A-CALENDAR IS ADVANCED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

WE'RE NOW GOING TO TAKE UP THE FOLLOWING BILLS ON THAT A-CALENDAR.

MADAM SPEAKER, WE'RE GOING TO BEGIN WITH RULES REPORT NO. 744 BY

MS. SOLAGES, AND THEN RULES REPORT NO. 690 BY MS. PAULIN, FOLLOWED

BY RULES REPORT NO. 743, MR. HEASTIE, AND RULES REPORT NO. 681 BY

MS. ZINERMAN.

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: PAGE 19, RULES

REPORT NO. 744, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07691, RULES REPORT

NO. 744, SOLAGES, DARLING, PEOPLES-STOKES, TAPIA, JEAN-PIERRE, FALL,

DICKENS, TAYLOR, GIBBS, HUNTER, AUBRY, CUNNINGHAM, ZINERMAN,

ANDERSON, REYES, BURGOS, L. ROSENTHAL, BRONSON, CLARK, EPSTEIN. AN

ACT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE FUNDAMENTAL INJUSTICE, CRUELTY, BRUTALITY AND

INHUMANITY OF SLAVERY IN THE CITY OF NEW YORK AND THE STATE OF NEW

YORK; TO ESTABLISH THE NEW YORK STATE COMMUNITY COMMISSION ON

REPARATIONS REMEDIES, TO EXAMINE THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY,

SUBSEQUENTLY DE JURE AND DE FACTO RACIAL AND ECONOMIC DISCRIMINATION

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AGAINST PEOPLE OF AFRICAN DESCENT, AND THE IMPACT OF THESE FORCES ON

LIVING PEOPLE OF AFRICAN DESCENT AND TO MAKE DETERMINATIONS REGARDING

COMPENSATION; AND PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON

EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: AN EXPLANATION HAS

BEEN REQUESTED, MS. SOLAGES.

MS. SOLAGES: THANK YOU. THIS LEGISLATION WILL

ESTABLISH A NEW YORK STATE COMMISSION TO STUDY REPARATIONS AND

REMEDIES. THE COMMISSION WILL HOLD VARIOUS HEARINGS ACROSS NEW

YORK STATE AND WILL HEAR FROM VARIOUS STAKEHOLDERS AND WILL TAKE

RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE LEGISLATURE FOR ANY SUGGESTIONS ON REMEDIES IT

DEEMS PROPER FOR NEW YORK STATE TO IMPLEMENT TO RESPOND TO THE

INJUSTICE AND WEALTH TRANSFER CAUSED BY CHILD SLAVERY AND ITS LEGACIES.

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER.

WOULD THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER SILLITTI: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MS. SOLAGES. A COUPLE

OF QUESTIONS, IF I MAY, ON THIS BILL. THE APPOINTMENTS ON THE BILL FOR

THIS COMMISSION TO STUDY REPARATIONS FOR MINORITIES DON'T -- IT DOESN'T

APPEAR TO HAVE ANY APPOINTMENTS FROM THE MINORITY CAUCUS. IS THERE A

REASON FOR THAT?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: SO, IN THIS CONVERSATION -- AND, YOU

KNOW, I WANT TO PREFACE IT BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE MANY

MISNOMERS ABOUT REPARATIONS. SO THERE'S FIVE VARIOUS POINTS OF

REPARATIONS, AND I'LL BE QUICK: ACKNOWLEDGEMENT, APOLOGIES,

RESTITUTION, REHABILITATION AND INSTITUTIONAL REFORMS. THE IDEA OF THE

COMMISSION WAS FOR IT TO BE A COMMISSION IN WHICH EXPERTS,

INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE COGNIZANT ABOUT THE FIVE POINTS OF REPARATIONS ARE

SITTING UPON IT. SO WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE HAVING MINIMAL

QUALIFICATIONS WE PUT IN THE BILL, AND ALSO ENSURE THAT IT WAS A

COMMISSION THAT ONES -- THAT EXPERTS COULD SIT UPON.

MR. GOODELL: NO DOUBT, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR

DESCRIPTIONS OF THE QUALIFICATIONS. BUT IS THERE ANY REASON WHY THE

MINORITY CONFERENCE HAS NO APPOINTMENTS?

MS. SOLAGES: THIS ABOUT A HEARING FOR THE PEOPLE,

SO WE NEED TO FOCUS ON ENSURING THAT NEW YORKERS ARE HEARING ABOUT

THIS PROCESS. I UNDERSTAND AND PEOPLE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE

COMPOSITION OF THE COMMISSION, WHICH IS JUST A SMALL POINT, BUT REALLY

WE NEED TO BE FOCUSING ON HEALING AND HEARING FROM THE PEOPLE WHAT

REPARATIONS IN NEW YORK STATE WILL LOOK LIKE.

MR. GOODELL: MOST ASSUREDLY. AND OF COURSE, AS

YOU KNOW, THE MINORITY CONFERENCE REPRESENTS ABOUT A THIRD OF THE

PEOPLE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK. JUST TAKE IT UNDER ADVISEMENT IF WE

HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY AT SOME POINT THAT IT WOULD SEEM APPROPRIATE THAT

EVEN THE MINORITY CONFERENCE OUGHT TO BE INVOLVED IN THIS ANALYSIS.

MS. SOLAGES: AND JUST TO ADD ONE MORE POINT, IN

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE BILL WE ALSO INCLUDED GEOGRAPHICAL DIVERSITY AND ALSO REQUIRED THAT

THE HEARINGS BE DONE ALL ACROSS THE STATE. SO ANY NEW YORKER

INTERESTED IN GIVING TESTIMONY WILL BE ABLE TO DO SO.

MR. GOODELL: I NOTE THAT THIS LEGISLATION STARTS OUT

WITH FIVE PAGES OF A SUMMARY OF THE HISTORY OF SLAVERY IN NEW YORK

STATE AND THE SLOW, PAINFUL PROCESS THAT NEW YORK WENT THROUGH TO

ELIMINATE SLAVERY, ALTHOUGH WE WERE WELL AHEAD OF THE NATION AS A

WHOLE, OF COURSE. NOW, AS I UNDERSTAND IT FROM THIS RECITATION, SLAVERY

WAS FULLY ELIMINATED, I MEAN IT STARTED TO PHASE OUT IN 1799 BUT WAS

ALMOST FULLY ELIMINATED BY JULY 4, 1827 WITH SOME EXCEPTIONS. WHY IS

IT YOU THINK WE NEED A COMMISSION TO LOOK AT REPARATIONS 193 YEARS

AFTER NEW YORK BASICALLY ENDED SLAVERY?

MS. SOLAGES: SO THIS LEGISLATION IS ALSO ABOUT NOT

JUST CHATTEL SLAVERY, WHICH IS THE TYPE OF SLAVERY WHICH INDIVIDUALS

BOUGHT AND SOLD. EVEN THEIR CHILDREN WERE CONSIDERED PROPERTY. BUT

THIS IS ABOUT ITS LEGACY. IT'S MANY OTHER FACES AND HOW WE CAN ACHIEVE

REMEDIES. SO WHETHER IT'S CHATTEL SLAVERY, BLACK CODE, JIM CROW,

MASS INCARCERATION, HOUSING DISCRIMINATION, SCHOOL SEGREGATION,

INFRASTRUCTURE, THERE'S -- THERE'S A LOT THAT WE CAN SPEAK ABOUT, BUT, YOU

KNOW, WE FOCUSED ON CHATTEL SLAVERY AND ITS LEGACY. IT'S MANY DIFFERENT

FACES.

MR. GOODELL: OF COURSE, AS YOU KNOW, OVER THE

YEARS WE'VE IMPLEMENTED MULTIPLE PROGRAMS IN AN EFFORT TO ADDRESS

SOME OF THOSE ISSUES YOU MENTIONED, INCLUDING FAIRLY AGGRESSIVE

AFFIRMATIVE ACTION PROGRAMS IN CERTAIN AREAS. MORE RECENTLY, VERY, I

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THINK, ROBUST EFFORT TO EXPAND OPPORTUNITIES FOR MWBE, WHICH WOULD

BE MINORITY BUSINESS OWNED ENTERPRISES. IS IT YOUR VIEW THAT THOSE

EFFORTS HAVE BEEN INSUFFICIENT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, YOU KNOW, THIS COMMISSION

WOULD DECIDE WHETHER THE EFFORTS MADE AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE

GOING TO PROVIDE TESTIMONY, MADE -- IF THE EFFORTS MADE WERE

APPROPRIATE OR IF WE NEED TO DO ADDITIONAL RESTITUTIONS. BUT REMEMBER,

THERE ARE SOME OTHER ISSUES THAT WEREN'T MADE AMENDS. YOU KNOW, I'M

FROM LONG ISLAND, AND WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT LONG ISLAND YOU THINK

ABOUT LEVITTOWN, WHICH IS THE FIRST SUBURB, AND HOW THERE WERE

COVENANTS WITHIN THOSE DOCUMENTATIONS THAT SAY THAT BLACK INDIVIDUALS

COULD NOT OWN THOSE HOMES. MANY PEOPLE NOW ARE STRUGGLING ON LONG

ISLAND WITH HOUSING DISCRIMINATION AS WE SAW FROM A NEWSDAY REPORT

THAT SAID THAT, YOU KNOW, INDIVIDUALS, BLACK INDIVIDUALS WHO WERE

INTERESTED IN BUYING HOMES AND PROPERTIES WERE NOT ABLE TO DO SO

BECAUSE THEY WERE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST. AND SO, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE

MANY ASPECT OF REPARATIONS THAT WE NEED TO DISCUSS AND, YOU KNOW, THIS

-- YOU KNOW, THIS IS MORE OF AN EQUITY LEGISLATION THAT ALIGNS ITSELF WITH

REPARATIONS. AND THIS IS ABOUT CREATING A HEALING PROCESS, ALL OF US

TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE MANY DIFFERENT FACETS OF CHATTEL SLAVERY

AND ITS LEGACY AND ITS FACES AND SEEING WHAT WE CAN DO TO PROVIDE, YOU

KNOW, WHAT I SAID, THE FIVE POINTS OF REPARATIONS, THE INSTITUTIONAL

REFORMS SO THAT WE CAN EXAMINE REFORM OF SYSTEMS. THE REHABILITATION,

THE RESTITUTION, MAKING SURE THAT PEOPLE LIKE THE INDIVIDUALS IN SENECA

VILLAGE WHICH IS NOW KNOWN AS CENTRAL PARK, MANY OF THEM -- IT WAS A

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BLACK VIBRANT COMMUNITY OF -- OF SENECA VILLAGE -- WERE DISPLACED

AND, YOU KNOW, WE'VE NEVER MADE AMENDS FOR THAT. AND SO, YOU

KNOW, WE CAN FOCUS ON ONE SPOT IN THE TIMELINE, BUT WE NEED TO REALLY

HAVE A CONVERSATION ABOUT THE WHOLE CONDUIT.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, OF COURSE, AS YOU KNOW,

UNFORTUNATELY - AND I MEAN THAT IN THE BROADEST SENSE - UNFORTUNATELY,

AFRICAN-AMERICANS WEREN'T THE ONLY ONES THAT WERE DISCRIMINATED

AGAINST IN OUR NATION'S HISTORY. WE HAD THOUSANDS OF IRISH INDIVIDUALS

WHO CAME OVER AS INDENTURED SERVANTS AND THEY USED THAT INDENTURED

SERVITUDE PRIMARILY TO PAY FOR THEIR PASSAGE TO AMERICA. IN MY

COMMUNITY WE HAD A VERY PROMINENT AND AT ONE POINT SOMEWHAT

CONTENTIOUS RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN SWEDES, ITALIANS, POLISH AND OTHERS,

AND -- AND EVEN, YOU KNOW, IF I GO BACK 150 OR 200 YEARS AGO THERE

WERE EVEN, AS YOU MENTIONED, DEED RESTRICTIONS THAT WOULD BAR A

CERTAIN RACE, NOT AFRICAN-AMERICANS, BUT, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON

THEIR NATION OF ORIGIN. DOES THIS LEGISLATION ADDRESS REPARATIONS FOR

DESCENDANTS OF PEOPLE WHO CAME OVER AS INDENTURED SERVANTS OR WERE

THEY UNFORTUNATE VICTIMS OF DEED RESTRICTIONS THAT MIGHT BAR SWEDES OR

ITALIANS OR SOME OTHER NATIONALITY FROM --

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THERE ARE MANY --

MR. GOODELL: -- LIVING IN A PARTICULAR

NEIGHBORHOOD OR IS IT JUST RESTRICTED TO AFRICAN-AMERICANS?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THERE ARE MANY EXAMPLES OF

REPARATIONS BEING IMPLEMENTED OVER THE PAST CENTURY. FOR INSTANCE,

THE CIVIL LIBERTIES ACT OF 1888 GAVE SURVIVING JAPANESE-AMERICAN

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REPARATIONS, IN THE END ALSO A FORMAL APOLOGY FROM PRESIDENT REAGAN

FOR THE INJUST [SIC] AND INEXCUSABLE MASS INCARCERATION DURING WORLD

WAR II. YOU KNOW, THERE -- THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT TYPES OF

REPARATIONS THAT HAPPENED JUST FOR SINGULAR GROUPS.

MR. GOODELL: BUT THIS ONLY FOCUSES ON

AFRICAN-AMERICANS, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, WE'RE HEARING -- WE'RE GOING TO

BE HEARING FROM -- MANY STAKEHOLDERS WANT TO EXPRESS THEIR FEELINGS

AND CONCERNS, WE DEFINITELY URGE THEM TO DO SO. IT WOULD BE THE JOB OF

THE COMMISSION TO DETERMINE WHAT REPARATIONS LOOK LIKE. SO I DON'T

WANT TO SIT HERE AND DEFINE WHAT THE COMMISSION IS GOING TO ULTIMATELY

PRODUCE, BUT WE WANT TO HEAR FROM INDIVIDUALS, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE

CAN DO TO, YOU KNOW, TACKLE CHATTEL SLAVERY AND ITS -- AND ITS LEGACIES.

MR. GOODELL: I'M ACTUALLY VERY --

MS. SOLAGES: AND I REALLY BELIEVE THAT, YOU KNOW,

WHEN ONE GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS ARE UPLIFTED, WE ARE ALL UPLIFTED. WHEN

ONE GROUP OF -- IF WE TACKLE AN INJUSTICE WE PROVIDE JUSTICE.

MR. GOODELL: CERTAINLY. I AM VERY, VERY PROUD

TO REPRESENT A PORTION OF THE SENECA NATION OF INDIANS. AND IF THERE'S

ANY GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS THAT HAVE BEEN VICTIMIZED BY ALL NEW

YORKERS, IT WOULD MOST ASSUREDLY BE THE INDIANS. I MEAN, THE -- THE

SETTLERS CAME IN --

MS. SOLAGES: MR. GOODELL, I DON'T THINK IT'S

PROPER FOR US TO COMPARE THIS INJUSTICE TO THAT INJUSTICE AT THIS TIME ON

THIS DEBATE. IF WE HAVE SOMETHING MORE TO THE BILL I WOULD -- I WOULD

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REALLY APPRECIATE THAT. AND, YOU KNOW, WE CAN HAVE A WHOLE LIST OF

CONVERSATIONS ABOUT OTHER POTENTIAL BILL IDEAS IN THE FUTURE.

MR. GOODELL: BUT THIS BILL, AS -- I THINK WHAT

YOU'RE SAYING, AND I -- AND I WOULD AGREE, THIS BILL DOESN'T FOCUS ON THE

INJUSTICES THAT WERE DONE TO THE NATIVE AMERICANS HERE IN NEW YORK

STATE, IT'S JUST FOCUSED REALLY ON STUDYING THE IMPACT ON PEOPLE OF

AFRICAN DESCENT, RIGHT? I MEAN, THAT'S PAGE 6.

MS. SOLAGES: IF WE LOOK AT -- RIGHT NOW THERE ARE

SO MANY BLACK NEW YORKERS WHO ARE DISENFRANCHISED THAT THE -- THE

WEALTH GAP, IF YOU SEE, YOU KNOW, BLACK AMERICANS ARE IN THE BOTTOM

OF A TRENDING VERSUS THE OTHER GROUPS. AND SO, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE

TALK ABOUT REDLINING, FOR EXAMPLE, ANOTHER LEGACY OF CHATTEL SLAVERY

WHERE WE'VE PACKING AND STACKING COMMUNITIES AND DISENFRANCHISING

THEM. YOU KNOW, WE REALLY HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT A

GRANULAR LEVEL HOW WE CAN REFORM THAT AND HOW WE CAN ASSIST PEOPLE

AND UPLIFT PEOPLE. SO THIS IS JUST SIMPLY A -- A COMMISSION THAT WOULD

HAVE THESE CONVERSATIONS.

MR. GOODELL: WOULD YOU ENVISION THAT ANY

RECOMMENDATIONS FOR REPARATION WOULD BE LIMITED TO AFRICAN-

AMERICAN DESCENDENTS OF NEW YORKERS OR WOULD IT BE AVAILABLE TO

PEOPLE WHO PERHAPS MOVED INTO NEW YORK WELL AFTER SLAVERY WAS

ABOLISHED?

MS. SOLAGES: YOU KNOW, THE COMMISSION IS GOING

TO DETERMINE THAT. THAT'S WHY WE WANT TO HAVE A COMMISSION TO HAVE A

CONVERSATION OF WHAT REPARATIONS WILL LOOK LIKE, AND I'M CONFIDENT

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THEY'RE GOING TO COME UP WITH A -- A RESOLUTION THAT WOULD REALLY

ADDRESS, YOU KNOW, THE HARMS THAT WE STILL SEE TODAY.

MR. GOODELL: NOW OF COURSE AMERICA IS BLESSED

BY HAVING A LOT OF IMMIGRANTS THAT HAVE COME TO OUR COUNTRY OVER THE

-- OVER THE YEARS. AS I MENTIONED, IN MY COMMUNITY WE HAVE A LOT OF

FORMER IMMIGRANTS, IF YOU WILL, THAT CAME FROM ITALY OR SWEDEN OR

POLAND OR ELSEWHERE, AND THEY'VE BROUGHT A RICH HERITAGE WITH THEM.

BUT ALL OF THEM --

MS. SOLAGES: I JUST -- I JUST WANT TO CORRECT YOU

BECAUSE THOSE WHO WERE ENSLAVED DID NOT COME HERE WILLINGLY.

MR. GOODELL: NO, I UNDERSTAND. BUT MY POINT IS

MS. SOLAGES: I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT.

MR. GOODELL: MY POINT IS MY COUNTY WASN'T BORN

UNTIL THE EARLY 1800S, AND SO ALMOST EVERYONE THAT'S COME TO MY COUNTY

ARRIVED AFTER SLAVERY HAD BEEN ABOLISHED. SOME OF THEM 50, 100 YEARS

LATER. WOULD YOU ENVISION THAT THEY WOULD BE ASKED TO PAY

REPARATIONS?

MS. SOLAGES: AGAIN, THERE ARE FIVE POINTS OF

REPARATIONS THAT I WENT OVER BEFORE, AND WE WANT TO LOOK AT THE

CONTINUUM FROM CHATTEL SLAVERY TO ITS MANY DIFFERENT FACES AND -- AND

LEGACIES. AND SO IT'S IMPORTANT TO HAVE A HOLISTIC CONVERSATION AND

THAT'S WHAT THIS BILL DOES AND THAT'S WHAT NEW YORK IS DOING. WE -- WE

WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE DEFINING THAT REPARATIONS IS MANY

DIFFERENT POINTS. I KNOW PEOPLE GET STUCK ON ONE ASPECT, CHATTEL

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SLAVERY, WHICH IS VERY IMPORTANT BECAUSE AS A SOCIETY WE'VE NEVER

ATONED FOR THAT. WE -- WE -- I DON'T THINK THE US GOVERNMENT HAS EVER

SAID SORRY. AND SO THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY TO NOW BEGIN THE HEALING

PROCESS. AND THERE'S -- THERE'S OTHER ASPECTS, AS I SAID --

MR. GOODELL: MAY I INTERRUPT YOU A MINUTE? I

MEAN, THE MOST AMERICAN CASUALTIES IN THE HISTORY OF OUR COUNTRY

INCLUDED HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF UNION SOLDIERS WHO WERE FIGHTING

TO FREE THE SLAVES. AND IT -- IS IT YOUR EXPECTATION THAT THE DESCENDENTS

OF THOSE SOLDIERS WHO GAVE THEIR LIFE SHOULD ISSUE AN APOLOGY TO THE

SLAVES THAT THEY FREED?

MS. SOLAGES: THIS IS NOT TO THE BILL.

MR. GOODELL: BUT I MEAN --

MS. SOLAGES: THE BILL IS A COMMISSION --

MR. GOODELL: -- YOU JUST SAID THAT WE HAVEN'T HAD

AN --

MS. SOLAGES: -- THAT WOULD LOOK AT THIS.

MR. GOODELL: -- APOLOGY. I MEAN, HONEST TO GOD

MS. SOLAGES: SO THE OPINION THAT WE --

MR. GOODELL: -- THE WHOLE FREAKING COUNTRY WENT

TO THE WAR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: (CLEARING THROAT.)

MR. GOODELL: I APOLOGIZE. I APOLOGIZE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: YOU KNEW RIGHT

AWAY, RIGHT?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. GOODELL: YES.

MS. SOLAGES: THIS IS JUST --

MR. GOODELL: YES. I -- I -- FOR JUST A MOMENT I --

I CHANNELED MY TEENAGED KIDS. I APOLOGIZE TO THE ENTIRE ASSEMBLY.

MS. SOLAGES: THIS IS A VERY EMOTIONAL

CONVERSATION.

MR. GOODELL: BUT I MEAN, IT WAS A VERY DIFFICULT

TIME IN OUR HISTORY FOR SURE. THANK YOU FOR --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MS. --

MR. GOODELL: AND PLEASE, MS. SOLAGES, ACCEPT

MY APOLOGIES.

ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. GOODELL: THE BILL HAS A GREAT SUMMARY OF

NEW YORK STATE'S EFFORTS TO ABOLISH SLAVERY, AND -- AND THERE'S NO DOUBT

BASED ON THE SUMMARY THAT THERE'S A LOT OF FINANCIAL INTERESTS THAT WERE

INVOLVED IN THE SLAVE TRADE FOCUSED PRIMARILY IN NEW YORK CITY. AND

AS A RESULT, IN THE LATE 1700S AND EARLY 1800S A LOT OF THE ELECTED

OFFICIALS IN NEW YORK CITY WERE VERY RELUCTANT TO PUSH THAT ISSUE

FORWARD. THE SITUATION WAS VERY DIFFERENT UPSTATE. IN UPSTATE, THE

ABOLITIONIST MOVEMENT GAINED NATIONAL PROMINENCE. AND, INDEED, IN

MY COUNTY WE HAD ONE OF THE VERY, VERY FIRST PLATFORM COMMITTEE

MEETINGS OF THE NEWLY-FORMED REPUBLICAN PARTY FOCUSING ON THE

ABOLITION OF SLAVERY. AND EVEN THOUGH MY COUNTY WAS YOUNG AND WE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HAD RELATIVELY FEW RESIDENTS, MY COUNTY SENT OVER 4,000 YOUNG MEN TO

FIGHT IN THE CIVIL WAR TO FREE SLAVES. AND AN ESTIMATED 750 TO 1,000 OF

THEM NEVER CAME HOME. AND BACK THEN THERE WAS NO SOCIAL SECURITY,

THERE WAS NO GOVERNMENT PENSION, THERE WAS NO ASSISTANCE. AND SO IN

MY AREA OF THE STATE WE PUT OUR BLOOD, WE PUT OUR YOUNG PEOPLE, WE

PUT EVERYTHING WE OWNED IN MANY CASES IN AN EFFORT TO FREE THE SLAVES.

AND EVEN BEFORE THE CIVIL WAR, MY COUNTY WAS WELL-KNOWN FOR THE

UNDERGROUND RAILROAD. AND AT THAT TIME IT WAS ILLEGAL TO ASSIST SLAVES

IN THEIR EFFORTS TO GAIN FREEDOM IN CANADA, AND OUR RESIDENTS PUT

THEMSELVES IN HARM'S WAY FOR ARREST OR INCARCERATION BY DOING

EVERYTHING THEY COULD TO HELP. SO I THINK WE NEED TO BE SENSITIVE TO

THE FACT THAT THERE HAVE BEEN A LOT OF SOCIAL WRONGS THAT ARE

EXTRAORDINARILY SERIOUS THAT HAVE OCCURRED IN OUR HISTORY AND IN THE

HISTORY OF THE WORLD. AND IN MY NECK OF THE WOODS, IT USED TO BE ALL

OWNED BY THE SENECA NATION OF INDIANS. ALL OF IT. AND WHEN THE

SETTLERS CAME, THEY SEIZED IT. BUT WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THAT HERE.

WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE IRISH INDENTURED SERVANTS. WE'RE NOT

TALKING ABOUT ANY OTHER GROUP, WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE NATIVE

AMERICANS. AND I'M CONCERNED THAT WE'RE OPENING A DOOR THAT WAS

CLOSED IN NEW YORK STATE OVER ALMOST 200 YEARS AGO. THE OPEN

QUESTIONS OF WHO PAYS, WHO RECEIVES, HOW DO WE CALCULATE IT, HOW DO

WE BE FAIR AND EQUITABLE TO FAMILIES LIKE MINE THAT WEREN'T EVEN IN THE

COUNTRY UNTIL THE 1900S.

AND SO I APPRECIATE MY COLLEAGUE'S COMPASSION AND

THOUGHTFULNESS. I SUPPORT THE EFFORTS THAT WE HAVE ONGOING TO PROVIDE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FINANCIAL SUPPORT, ASSISTANCE, EDUCATION AND EVERYTHING ELSE WE CAN TO

HELP BRING EQUAL OPPORTUNITY TO EVERYONE IN NEW YORK STATE. AND I

HOPE THAT WE CAN CONTINUE ON THAT PATH RATHER THAN FOCUS ON

REPARATIONS FOR ACTIVITIES THAT HAPPENED A COUPLE OF HUNDRED YEARS AGO

TO BE PAID BY PEOPLE WHO PUT EVERYTHING ON THE LINE TO END IT OR

WEREN'T IN THIS COUNTRY AT THAT TIME.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. AND AGAIN, THANK YOU TO MY

COLLEAGUE, I APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. WALSH.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SO MY

QUESTION IS, HAS THIS BILL -- THIS BILL I BELIEVE CAME TO A VOTE IN 2021. IS

IT THE SAME BILL AS WE TOOK UP IN 2021 OR HAS THE BILL CHANGED AT ALL?

MS. SOLAGES: NO, THE BILL HAS CHANGED SINCE IT

WAS FIRST TAKEN UP BY OUR FORMER COLLEAGUE AND MYSELF AS WELL.

MS. WALSH: AND HAS IT IN ANY OTHER FORM EVER

BEEN INTRODUCED, YOU KNOW, LIKE MAYBE IN A PRIOR VERSION OR A

DIFFERENT -- A DIFFERENT VERSION OF THE BILL, HAS IT EVER COME BEFORE THE

ASSEMBLY FOR A VOTE?

MS. SOLAGES: FOR, LIKE, AS A BILL FOR A VOTE?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALSH: YES.

MS. SOLAGES: WELL, THERE -- THERE'S BEEN ABOUT --

WELL, TECHNICAL CHANGES, TWO ITERATIONS OF THIS BILL THAT WAS TAKEN UP FOR

A VOTE; THE ONE BY A FORMER COLLEAGUE, MYSELF AND THEN THIS VERSION

WHICH HAS FURTHER TECHNICAL CHANGES. WE -- WE REMOVED SOME OF THE

GROUPS -- REMOVED THE GROUPS, WE ADDED THE LANGUAGE ABOUT PUBLIC

HEARING, WE CHANGED THE EFFECTIVE DATE, SUCH AS THAT.

MS. WALSH: SO ALL THOSE CHANGES THAT YOU JUST

LISTED, JUST SO I'M CLEAR, THEY -- THEY WERE MADE TO THIS BILL THAT WE'RE

TAKING UP TODAY THAT ARE DIFFERENT THAN THE BILL THAT -- AND I HAVE IT -- I

-- I DON'T KNOW IF I'M SUPPOSED TO SAY HIS NAME BUT --

MS. SOLAGES: THIS IS A WORK PRODUCT FROM --

MS. WALSH: -- A FORMER MEMBER.

MS. SOLAGES: YEAH, THIS IS A WORK PRODUCT FROM

THE MEMBERS, AND I HAVE TO THANK MANY OF THE MEMBERS WHO HAVE PUT

INPUT IN, AND I ALSO THANK OUR GREAT SPEAKER WHO, YOU KNOW, PROVIDED

US AN AVENUE TO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION.

MS. WALSH: SO I'M CURIOUS, BECAUSE I -- I DON'T

KNOW MUCH -- THAT MUCH ABOUT THIS, BUT I'VE DONE A LITTLE BIT OF

RESEARCH AND IT LOOKS AS THOUGH THERE IS SOME PRECEDENT AROUND THE

COUNTRY FOR SIMILARLY TAKING A LOOK AT THE ISSUE OF REPARATIONS. HOW

MANY STATES AROUND THE COUNTRY PRIOR TO NEW YORK HAVE TAKEN UP THIS

-- THIS ISSUE?

MS. SOLAGES: SO IF -- WELL, IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT

REPARATIONS THERE HAVE BEEN MANY, MANY EXAMPLES OF REPARATIONS.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALSH: OKAY.

MS. SOLAGES: AND LET ME JUST JUMP BACK, BECAUSE

THERE ACTUALLY WAS THE HOMESTEAD ACT OF 1862 WHERE UNION SOLDIERS

WHO FOUGHT IN THE WAR WAS ABLE TO GET 160 FREE PARCELS OF FEDERAL

LAND. SO THOSE WHO FOUGHT IN THE CIVIL WAR RECEIVED SOME SORT OF

REPARATION. IN ADDITION, THERE ARE CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW IN THIS MODERN

DAY AND AGE, YOU KNOW, CALIFORNIA THAT HAS A REPARATIONS TASK FORCE

AND THEN THERE'S OTHER LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES THAT HAVE -- HAS PRESENTED

REPARATIONS BILLS. SO WE HAVE A MUNICIPALITY IN ILLINOIS THAT PROVIDED A

REPARATION BILL THAT TALKED ABOUT HOUSING AND PROVIDED HOUSING AND

SUPPORT FOR INDIVIDUALS, FOR -- FOR BLACKS ILLINOISANS WHO WERE LOOKING

FOR SUPPORT. NORTH CAROLINA HAD A HOUSING AND COMMUNITY PROGRAM,

MARYLAND HAD A PROPOSED BILL AS WELL, AND NEW JERSEY, OUR SISTER STATE,

IS ALSO LOOKING AT A TASK FORCE. AND IN ILLINOIS THE MODEL WAS THEY

GAVE A 3 -- A 3 PERCENT -- OR THERE WAS A 3 PERCENT TAX ON RECREATIONAL

CANNABIS. THERE WAS NO CASH PAYOUTS, BUT THERE WAS A $10 MILLION

DISTRIBUTION AND $25,000 PAYMENT, DOWN PAYMENTS FOR MORTGAGES, FOR

HOME REPAIRS, BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT MANY BLACK RESIDENTS WERE

AFFECTED BY HOUSING DISCRIMINATION BETWEEN 1990 AND 1969. AND SO IN

ILLINOIS THEY PROVIDED THAT FOR RESIDENTS TO MAKE AMENDS FOR THE -- THE

SINS OF CHATTEL SLAVERY AND ITS LEGACIES.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR -- FOR YOUR

ANSWER. YOU MENTIONED THE HOMESTEAD ACT THAT WAS JUST POST-CIVIL

WAR. DID -- DID THE HOMESTEAD ACT, THOUGH, GRANT TRACTS OF LAND TO ALL

SOLDIERS WHO HAD SERVED OR WAS IT SPECIFICALLY FOR AFRICAN-AMERICAN

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SOLDIERS?

MS. SOLAGES: IT WAS FOR EVERY -- EVERY WALKS OF

LIFE, EVERY CITIZEN, WHETHER YOU'RE -- YOU'RE ENSLAVED OR NOT. AND

REMEMBER, NOT ONLY, YOU KNOW, AMERICANS FOUGHT IN THE WAR, THERE

WAS ALSO -- ENSLAVED PEOPLE ALSO FOUGHT IN THE CIVIL WAR AS WELL.

MS. WALSH: YES, AND MANY FROM NEW YORK.

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

MS. WALSH: MANY FROM NEW YORK. THAT'S -- THAT'S

SO INTERESTING. SO YOU MENTIONED A COUPLE OF STATES; YOU MENTIONED

CALIFORNIA, ILLINOIS, NORTH CAROLINA, MARYLAND AND NEW JERSEY. SO I

JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR. I GUESS THE STATE THAT I WAS A LITTLE BIT FAMILIAR

ABOUT WHAT THEY WERE DOING WAS CALIFORNIA.

MS. SOLAGES: CORRECT.

MS. WALSH: BECAUSE THEY -- THEY ACTUALLY HAVE AN

ONGOING TASK FORCE OR COMMISSION, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY'RE CALLING IT.

BUT THEY -- DID -- DID THE -- THE PATH KIND OF THAT CALIFORNIA IS

FOLLOWING, IS THAT ENVISIONED AS WHAT WE'RE SHAPING THIS LEGISLATION

AROUND SIMILAR?

MS. SOLAGES: AND I JUST WANTED TO ALSO MENTION

THAT ALSO ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL, HR 40 IS ACTUALLY BEING DEBATED, WHICH

IS A FEDERAL REPARATION BILL AS WELL. BUT TO YOUR POINT, THEIR

COMMISSION -- YOU KNOW, YOU ALWAYS LOOK -- AND AS WE DO WITH EVERY

PIECE OF LEGISLATION, WE ALWAYS LOOK AT WHAT OTHER STATES ARE DOING AND

TAKE, YOU KNOW, THE BEST AND THE WORST AND, YOU KNOW, LEARN FROM THE

WORST AND, YOU KNOW, MAKE YOUR PIECE OF LEGISLATION BETTER AND I FEEL

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THAT WITHIN THIS DOCUMENT THAT WE ARE PRODUCING AND VOTING ON TODAY,

WE ARE DOING THAT.

MS. WALSH: NOW, CALIFORNIA STARTED BACK IN I

THINK 2020? IS THAT WHEN THEY FORMED THEIR COMMISSION?

MS. SOLAGES: UM, I -- I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT DATE,

BUT THEY HAVE ACTUALLY PRODUCED A REPORT. SO THEY -- THEY'VE WENT

THROUGH THE PUBLIC HEARINGS, THE COMMENTS AND ALL THAT.

MS. WALSH: AND -- AND COULD YOU JUST FOR OUR

KNOWLEDGE JUST KIND OF SUMMARIZE HOW THAT PROCESS WENT, SINCE --

SINCE THE PROCESS THAT NEW YORK IS FOLLOWING MIGHT IN SOME WAYS

PARALLEL IT.

MS. SOLAGES: YOU KNOW, THIS -- I BELIEVE, AS -- AS

I SAID, THIS PROCESS IS SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT BUT IT'S BASICALLY A

COMMISSION WAS PRODUCED, THEY HEAR FROM THE COMMUNITY AND THE

PUBLIC, THEY COME, THEY -- THE COMMISSION CONVENES AND THEN

PRODUCES A DOCUMENT, A NON-BINDING DOCUMENT WHICH GOES TO,

WHETHER IT'S A MUNICIPALITY OR THE STATE GOVERNMENT FOR THEM TO

DELIBERATE.

MS. WALSH: SO HOW LONG DID IT TAKE THE CALIFORNIA

TASK FORCE TO PRODUCE THEIR REPORT?

MS. SOLAGES: IT -- IT WAS PROBABLY -- YOU KNOW,

IT'S -- IT'S DIFFERENT AND SO, YOU KNOW, I -- I CAN'T SPEAK TO THE TIMELINE.

BUT AGAIN, IN NEW YORK OUR TIMELINE IS GOING TO BE OUR TIMELINE, AND

SO I -- I TOOK THAT FACTOR IN -- INTO THIS BILL. I ALSO REMEMBER, EVERY

SECOND THAT WE WAIT, INDIVIDUALS, BLACK NEW YORKERS, ARE -- ARE STILL

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BEING IMPACTED BY THE INJUSTICES OF CHATTEL SLAVERY AND ITS LEGACIES.

AND SO WE REALLY NEED TO START MOVING ON THIS SO THAT WE CAN BEGIN THE

HEALING PROCESS, WE CAN START HAVING AND WORKING TOGETHER AND

EMPOWER ALL NEW YORKERS.

MS. WALSH: IS IT -- IS IT -- AM I CORRECT THAT THE BILL

PROVIDES FOR A REPORT TO BE PRODUCED NO LATER THAN ONE YEAR AFTER THE

FIRST MEETING OF THE COMMISSION?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

MS. WALSH: HOW LONG DO YOU THINK IT WILL TAKE TO

-- TO FORM THE COMMISSION AND HAVE THE COMMISSION TO BEGIN ITS WORK?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THE -- ONCE THE INDIVIDUALS ARE

APPOINTED THEY -- THEY CAN BEGIN THE PROCESS OF MEETING.

MS. WALSH: OKAY.

MS. SOLAGES: I MEAN, THEY HAVE TO WAIT SIX

MONTHS.

MS. WALSH: SO ABOUT SIX MONTHS TO --

MS. SOLAGES: AND IN THE BILL LANGUAGE IT SPEAKS TO

THAT PROCESS OF CONVENING.

MS. WALSH: I'M SORRY, JUST SO I'M CLEAR, SO THE SIX

MONTHS THAT YOU REFERENCED IS ABOUT HOW LONG YOU THINK IT MIGHT TAKE

TO ACTUALLY FORM THE COMMISSION AND GET THE APPOINTMENTS AND THE --

EVERYBODY ON BOARD THAT'S GOING TO BE --

MS. SOLAGES: SO, AFTER THE BILL IS PASSED AND

SIGNED INTO LAW THERE IS SIX MONTHS FOR THE COMMISSION TO CONVENE.

MS. WALSH: OKAY. AND THEN YOU MENTIONED, I

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BELIEVE, IN RESPONSE TO EARLIER QUESTIONS THAT IT'S ENVISIONED THAT ONCE

THE COMMISSION IS CONVENED THAT THERE WILL BE, AMONG OTHER THINGS,

OTHER WORK THAT THE COMMISSION WILL BE DOING. THERE WILL BE A SERIES

OF PUBLIC HEARINGS HELD THROUGHOUT THE STATE?

MS. SOLAGES: AND WE ALSO HAVE EMPOWERED THE

COMMISSION TO CONSULT WITH, YOU KNOW, INSTITUTIONS AND OTHER ENTITIES

TO HELP THEM WITH -- WITH THIS WORK.

MS. WALSH: SO, I -- I WAS INTERESTED TO SEE -- I WAS

-- HOLD ON, I'VE GOT TO OPEN MY (INAUDIBLE) HERE, HOLD ON.

(PAUSE)

I WAS LOOKING AT A VERY SIMPLE SEARCH AS FAR AS THE --

THE FIVE -- THEY'VE LISTED FIVE DIFFERENT FORMS OF REPARATIONS. SO, ONE

WAS RESTITUTION, ONE WAS COMPENSATION, ONE WAS REHABILITATION, ONE

WAS SATISFACTION AND ONE WAS GUARANTEES OF NON-REPETITION.

MS. SOLAGES: YUP.

MS. WALSH: AND THAT WAS JUST ONE PLACE. BUT IS

THAT -- AM I GOING DOWN THE RIGHT PATH IN TERMS OF THOSE FIVE GENERAL

OUTLINES?

MS. SOLAGES: YES, WE'RE SAYING THE SAME THING IN

DIFFERENT WORDS.

MS. WALSH: OKAY. ALL RIGHT, VERY GOOD. AND I

WAS LOOKING AT WHAT THE NAACP HAD TO SAY ABOUT REPARATIONS, AND

WHAT THEY SAID IN ONE STATEMENT WAS, I BELIEVE IT'S FROM THEIR WEBSITE,

THAT REPARATIONS WOULD INVOLVE A NATIONAL APOLOGY, SO NATIONAL,

OBVIOUSLY, AND HERE WE ARE IN NEW YORK. BUT I UNDERSTAND YOU

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MENTIONED THAT H -- HR 40, WHICH IS BEING LOOKED AT AS WELL, BUT IT

WOULD INVOLVE APOLOGY, RIGHTS TO THE CANNABIS INDUSTRY, FINANCIAL

PAYMENT, SOCIAL SERVICE BENEFITS AND LAND GRANTS TO EVERY DESCENDENT

OF AN ENSLAVED AFRICAN-AMERICAN AND BLACK PERSON, A DESCENDENT OF

THOSE LIVING IN THE UNITED STATES INCLUDING DURING AMERICAN SLAVERY

UNTIL THE JIM CROW ERA. SO IT -- DO -- DO YOU, AS THE SPONSOR OF THIS --

THIS PIECE, AND UNDERSTANDING THAT I KNOW THE COMMISSION NEEDS TO

MEET AND DO THEIR WORK, BUT IS SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES WHAT YOU

WOULD EXPECT TO BE RECOMMENDATIONS COMING FROM THIS COMMISSION?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, YOU KNOW, AGAIN WE -- WE -- WE

ARE NOT DICTATING WHAT POINTS THAT THE COMMISSION SHOULD BE ANALYZING.

WE ARE JUST SAYING THAT A COMMISSION SHOULD BE FORMED. AND MY

OPINION AT THIS POINT IS THAT IT'S NONE OF A CONCERN, IT'S REALLY ABOUT WHAT

THE PEOPLE WANT TO -- TO HAVE. AND, YOU KNOW, I REALLY WANTED A

COMMUNITY COMMISSION, BUT AGAIN, WE ARE HERE AT THIS POINT AND I'M

GLAD THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION. BUT IT'S IMPORTANT THAT

THE PEOPLE OF NEW YORK, ESPECIALLY BLACK NEW YORKERS, HAVE -- HAVE

A SAY OF WHAT REPARATION LOOKS LIKE, AND THE COMMISSION PRODUCES A

DOCUMENT AND THEY PRESENT IT TO THE LEGISLATURE, A NON-BINDING

DOCUMENT.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR SAYING THAT.

NOW, YOU MENTIONED THAT CALIFORNIA, WHICH I -- I BELIEVE THAT THEY

STARTED IN AROUND 2020-'21 AND NOW THEY HAVE COME OUT WITH A REPORT.

WHAT -- COULD YOU SUMMARIZE, IF YOU KNOW, THE -- THE HIGHLIGHT OF THE

REPORT THAT CALIFORNIA PUT OUT IN THEIR COMMISSION WITH REGARD TO

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REPARATIONS? WHAT WERE THE RECOMMENDATIONS OVERALL?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY. YOU'RE

ASKING ME TO SUMMARIZE A REPORT FROM CALIFORNIA?

MS. WALSH: YES, I AM. IF YOU KNOW.

MS. SOLAGES: I DON'T HAVE THE REPORT BEFORE ME,

BUT I JUST RECOMMEND PEOPLE GOING ON LINE OR TO YOUR LOCAL LIBRARY AND

FINDING OUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT THAT REPORT HAS.

MS. WALSH: WELL, I -- I THOUGHT, JUST FROM THIS

QUICK SEARCH THAT I HAD, BECAUSE I -- I DIDN'T KNOW THAT THIS BILL WAS

COMING UP UNTIL JUST A SHORT TIME AGO. I DID THE BEST RESEARCH THAT I

COULD IN THE TIME THAT I HAD. I KNOW THAT YOU'RE MUCH MORE OF A

SUBJECT BETTER EXPERT THAN I AM ON THIS.

MS. SOLAGES: BUT I APPRECIATE YOUR EFFORTS.

MS. WALSH: YEAH, THANK YOU. AND I -- SO WHAT I

SAW WAS THAT -- THAT THERE WAS TO BE FINANCIAL, WOULD THAT BE

RESTITUTION? MAYBE THAT'S -- MAYBE THAT'S THE WRONG TERM, BUT I THINK

FINANCIAL RESTITUTION AND AN APOLOGY, AND THAT THOSE WERE MAYBE THE

TWO MAIN ASPECTS OF WHAT THEY WERE RECOMMENDING. AND MAYBE THERE

ARE OTHERS, BUT THAT'S WHAT I SAW. SO IF YOU'RE -- I COULD CERTAINLY GO TO

MY LIBRARY AND LOOK IT UP AND RESEARCH IT FURTHER, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR

COMMENT.

MS. SOLAGES: (INAUDIBLE)

MS. WALSH: I APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENT. BUT IN

TERMS OF THE AMOUNT OF REPARATIONS, MY-- JUST FROM HAVING LISTENED TO

THE NEWS, AND GOODNESS KNOWS WE'VE BEEN BUSY DOING OTHER THINGS

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HERE, TOO, PASSING OTHER BILLS, BUT I SEEM TO REMEMBER THAT THE NUMBER

COMING OUT OF CALIFORNIA WAS -- WAS A NUMBER THAT WAS VERY, VERY HIGH

TO -- TO ME. BUT DO YOU REMEMBER HOW MUCH MONEY THAT WAS THAT

THEY HAD PUT OUT THERE AS THE AMOUNT TO BE DONE AS REPARATIONS?

MS. SOLAGES: THE -- WHAT REPARATIONS IN

CALIFORNIA IS MAY -- MAY LOOK DIFFERENT FROM WHAT IS IN NEW YORK.

AND SO FOR US TO BE REPRESENTING OR THINKING OR DISCUSSING WHAT THEIR

EXACT NUMBER IS IS REALLY JUST A -- A DIFF -- IS -- IS REALLY INAPPROPRIATE

BECAUSE WE HAVE TO HEAR FROM NEW YORKERS WHAT THEY WANT TO DISCUSS.

YOU KNOW, THEY COULD BE TALK -- THEY COULD FOCUS ON REHABILITATION,

THEY COULD FOCUS ON RESTITUTION, APOLOGIES. THEY COULD FOCUS ON

COMPENSATION. BUT WE NEED TO HAVE THE CONVERSATION, AND THAT'S WHAT

THIS COMMISSION DOES RIGHT HERE. AND SO TO -- WE CAN COMPARE AND

CONTRAST CALIFORNIA TO NEW YORK, AND I WOULD SAY NEW YORK IS BETTER,

AND SO LET US GO THROUGH THE PROCESS SO WE CAN FIND OUT IF NEW YORK IS

BETTER.

MS. WALSH: ABSOLUTELY. I -- I AGREE WITH YOU THAT

NEW YORK IS WAY BETTER THAN CALIFORNIA. THAT'S WHY I ALWAYS HESITATE

WHEN WE TAKE ANY IDEAS FROM CALIFORNIA, I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE OUR

OWN. BUT I --

MS. SOLAGES: BUT THIS -- THIS IS ACTUALLY FROM HR

41.

MS. WALSH: YEAH, SO -- OH, HR 41, YEAH. AND I

SAID HR 40 EARLIER.

MS. SOLAGES: IT'S HR 40, EXCUSE ME.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALSH: HR 40.

MS. SOLAGES: HR 40.

MS. WALSH: SO -- SO THAT HR 40, THEN, LET'S TALK

ABOUT THAT FOR A SECOND BECAUSE I -- I DON'T KNOW A LOT ABOUT THAT. HR

40, THEN, WOULD THAT BE A -- A NATIONAL RESPONSE TO THE SAME ISSUES THAT

NEW YORK WOULD BE FOCUSING ON WITH THIS BILL?

MS. SOLAGES: YES, CORRECT. SO, YOU KNOW, AS

WITH, YOU KNOW, MANY THINGS WE TALK ABOUT, HR 40 WOULD BE THE

NATIONAL CONVERSATION OF WHAT REPARATIONS LOOKS LIKE. AND IT'S GREAT

THAT WE'RE HAVING AND BEGINNING THIS PROCESS. IF -- IF THE BILL-IN-CHIEF

GOES THROUGH, IT'S -- IT'S GOING TO PUT US IN A UNIQUE POSITION BECAUSE

ALREADY AS A STATE WE ARE -- WE ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO ARTICULATE OUR

NEEDS OR WHAT IS OUR EXPECTATION OF REPARATION IF HR 40 GOES THROUGH.

MS. WALSH: VERY GOOD. NOW I WANTED TO JUST

JUMP VERY QUICKLY OVER TO THE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE GOING TO BE -- THERE

WERE GOING TO BE THREE APPOINTMENTS -- AND I KNOW THAT THIS WAS

SLIGHTLY COVERED BEFORE, BUT I WANTED TO SPECIFICALLY ASK THIS, THREE

APPOINTMENTS BY THE GOVERNOR, THREE APPOINTMENTS BY THE SPEAKER OF

THE ASSEMBLY, THREE APPOINTMENTS BY THE TEMPORARY PRESIDENT OF THE

SENATE. AND I KNOW THAT MY -- THE PREVIOUS SPEAKER HAD TALKED ABOUT

THE ABSENCE OF MINORITY LEADERSHIP APPOINTMENTS AND WE'VE COVERED

THAT. BUT I WANTED TO SPECIFICALLY ASK, AS THAT -- AS THIS CONVERSATION

UNFOLDS THROUGH THE COMMISSION AND THE PUBLIC HEARINGS THAT ARE GOING

TO BE HELD, DO YOU -- DO YOU ENVISION OR -- OR CAN YOU COMMENT AT ALL

ABOUT THE SERVICES OR AN APPOINTMENT OF SOMEBODY WHO IS SOME KIND

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OF AN ECONOMIST OR SOMEBODY WHO CAN DO -- IT SEEMS TO ME LIKE IF

YOU'RE GOING TO POTENTIALLY COME UP WITH A RECOMMENDATION OF AN

AMOUNT THAT YOU WOULD NEED TO MAYBE ENGAGE --

(BUZZER SOUNDED)

MS. SOLAGES: MAY I ANSWER THE GENTLEWOMAN'S

QUESTION?

MS. WALSH: IT IS MY LAST QUESTION, MR. SPEAKER.

MS. SOLAGES: MAY I ANSWER HER QUESTION? I KNOW

SHE'S OUT OF TIME.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: YOU WANT --

MS. SOLAGES: WE HAVE QUALIFICATIONS WITHIN THE

BILL, THAT'S IT.

MS. WALSH: VERY GOOD. THAT -- I'M SATISFIED.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THANK YOU TO THE SPONSOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MS.

WALSH.

MR. RA.

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES YIELDS.

MR. RA: IF YOU'D LIKE TO, IF YOU HAVE A MORE DETAILED

EXPLANATION FOR MS. WALSH'S QUESTION, I'M HAPPY TO HAVE YOU

(INAUDIBLE).

MS. SOLAGES: THANK YOU FOR YIELDING YOUR TIME.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SO ALL MEMBERS APPOINTED TO THE COMMISSION SHALL HAVE QUALIFICATIONS

TO SERVE ON THE COMMISSION, SO WE ARE LOOKING FOR EXPERTISE. AND WE

-- WE WROTE THAT INTO THE BILL BECAUSE THIS -- THIS IS A VERY NUANCED

CONVERSATION THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. SO IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE

ACTUALLY HAVE, YOU KNOW, INDIVIDUAL EXPERTS WHO HAVE, YOU KNOW,

LIVED EXPERIENCE, TRAINING, EDUCATION, EXPERTISE IN, YOU KNOW, THE FIELD

OF AFRICAN -- AFRICAN AND AMERICAN STUDIES, CRIMINAL JUSTICE,

ECONOMICS, LAW, CIVIL RIGHTS, AND THOSE, YOU KNOW, WHO HAVE

HISTORICALLY CHAMPIONED THE CAUSE OF REPARATIONS, INJUSTICE, CLERGY AND

SUCH. SO, YOU KNOW, WE ARE -- WE WANT TO ENSURE THAT THOSE

INDIVIDUALS SITTING ON THE COMMISSION ARE QUALIFIED AND UNDERSTAND THE

NUANCES OF REPARATIONS.

MR. RA: OKAY. SO I -- I HAVE SOME -- SOME OTHER

QUESTIONS AND SOME -- SOME OF THE STUFF HAS COME UP ALREADY, AND

CERTAINLY I THANK YOU FOR YOUR -- YOUR RESPONSES TO ALL OF MY

COLLEAGUES. I -- I THINK REGARDLESS OF -- OF THIS VOTE I THINK WE ALL AGREE

THAT THIS IS OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, THE LARGEST STAIN ON OUR COUNTRY'S

HISTORY THAT -- THAT THIS WENT ON, AND CERTAINLY WE UNDERSTAND THE NEED

TO, YOU KNOW, ACCOUNT FOR THAT AND BE SERIOUS ABOUT RACISM THAT STILL

EXISTS IN OUR SOCIETY AND IN OUR -- IN OUR STATE. BUT I -- I KNOW MS.

WALSH MENTIONED THE -- MENTIONED CALIFORNIA, AND I THINK WHEN

PEOPLE -- OBVIOUSLY WHEN THEY SEE THIS IN THE NEWS THAT'S THE FIRST THING

THEY'RE GOING TO THINK OF. AND -- AND I KNOW AS YOU TALKED ABOUT

EARLIER THERE'S OTHER PIECES OF THIS, AND IF YOU CAN ELABORATE A LITTLE BIT

MORE ABOUT THAT BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S GOING TO THINK SOLELY ABOUT THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FINANCIAL REPARATIONS OF IT ASPECT, BUT I MEAN, I -- I SEE FROM THE

LANGUAGE OF THIS AND IN THIS DEBATE, OBVIOUSLY THERE'S MORE THAT YOU'RE

EXPECTING THAT IS GOING TO COME FROM THIS THAN JUST THAT, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: YES. AND SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHY

IT'S IMPORTANT TO HAVE INDIVIDUALS ON THE COMMISSION WHO UNDERSTAND

THE VARIOUS FORMS OF REPARATIONS, AND AS WE SAID, YOU KNOW, THE

VARIOUS FORMS INCLUDING JUST, YOU KNOW, RECOGNIZING AND

ACKNOWLEDGING PAST JUSTICES [SIC], ISSUING A FORMAL APOLOGY, PROVIDING,

YOU KNOW, OR IMPLEMENTING POLICIES AND INITIATIVES. ALSO MAKING SURE

THAT THERE'S NON-REPETITION, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES WE MAY FIX

A PROBLEM AND THEN GO BACK AND JUST CHANGE THE WAY IT'S FORMED AND

DO IT AGAIN. SO, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO ENSURE THAT WE ARE COMING UP

WITH A COMMISSION THAT -- OR FORMING A COMMISSION THAT CAN SPEAK TO

THAT.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND WOULD -- WOULD YOU ENVISION,

THEN -- WELL, ACTUALLY, FIRST LET ME ASK THIS. SO, WHAT -- WHAT THE

COMMISSION COMES UP WITH, DOES THE COMMISSION HAVE ANY POWERS TO

IMPLEMENT ANY OF THESE SOLUTIONS OR WILL THEY BE MAKING A

RECOMMENDATION, SAY, TO US AS THE LEGISLATURE OR --

MS. SOLAGES: YEAH, SO THEY'RE -- THE COMMISSION

WILL PRODUCE A DOCUMENT WITH THEIR FINDINGS AND THEY'RE GOING TO, YOU

KNOW, DELIVER IT TO THE LEGISLATURE AND WE WOULD HAVE TO ACT UPON

THEIR FINDINGS. BUT I WOULD HOPE THAT ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES WOULD READ

THE DOCUMENTATION.

MR. RA: OKAY, THANK YOU. AND SO IT WILL BE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PROVIDED -- I MEAN, I ASSUME IT WILL BE MADE PUBLIC FOR THE PUBLIC TO --

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

MR. RA: -- LOOK AT AND, OBVIOUSLY, FOR US TO EVALUATE

AND CONSIDER.

MS. SOLAGES: AND MY HOPES [SIC] IS THAT WE -- WE

MAYBE, YOU KNOW, LET'S SEE WHAT THE COMMISSION PRODUCES AND WE

TAKE UP SOME OF THEIR RECOMMENDATIONS. IF NOT, WE CAN ALWAYS REFORM

THE RECOMMENDATION AND IMPLEMENT POLICIES THAT WE SEE FIT. AS

ELECTED OFFICIALS WE HAVE THE OPTION AND WE HAVE THE COLLABORATION TO

WORK TOGETHER TO DO SO.

MR. RA: ABSOLUTELY. NOW, WOULD YOU ENVISION

SOMETHING AS DETAILED LIKE -- I'M -- I'M JUST THINKING OF OTHER ENTITIES

WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST THAT MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT IT COULD BE EVEN

SOMETHING AS DETAILED AS A PIECE OF LEGISLATION OR A MODEL BILL-TYPE

THING THAT THEY MIGHT RECOMMEND TO US AT THAT TIME.

MS. SOLAGES: YES. YOU KNOW, THE COMMISSION

HAS THE POWER TO PRODUCE A REPORT OR DOCUMENTATION, AND IT MAY LOOK

DIFFERENT FROM ANY OTHER STATE OR MODEL. BUT, YOU KNOW, THEY -- THEY

HAVE THE POWER TO DO SO.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND THEN WITH REGARD TO THE ACTUAL

FUNCTIONING HERE OF THIS COMMISSION, WHAT -- WHAT IS THE TIME FRAME IN

TERMS OF HAVING HEARINGS -- IT DOESN'T SPECIFY A PARTICULAR NUMBER OF

HEARINGS, CORRECT?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THE FIRST MEETING, THE FIRST

MEETING OF THE COMMISSION SHALL TAKE PLACE 180 DAYS AFTER THE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

EFFECTIVE DATE. THEN WE SPEAK TO QUORUM, WE SPEAK TO ELECTING A

CHAIR AND A VICE CHAIR. WE SAY THAT THEY RECEIVE NO COMPENSATION FOR

SITTING ON THE COMMISSION. AND WE ALSO OUTLINE THE POWERS OF THE

COMMISSION FOR HEARINGS AND SESSION. AND THE POWER OF

SUBCOMMITTEES AND MEMBERS AS WELL, WHICH IS STATED IN THE DOCUMENT.

MR. RA: OKAY, AND I ASSUME -- I MEAN --

MS. SOLAGES: AND THEY'RE -- THEY'RE ABLE TO ALSO

OBTAIN OFFICIAL DATA DIRECTLY FROM THE HEAD OF DEPARTMENTS, AGENCIES, TO

-- TO BE ABLE TO BE -- TO PRODUCE THEIR REPORT, AND WE ALSO ALLOW THEM TO

COORDINATE WITH HISTORICALLY BLACK COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES AND

RESEARCH CENTERS TO CONDUCT RESEARCH AND ACQUIRE ADDITIONAL

INFORMATION SO THAT THEY CAN PRODUCE A DOCUMENT WHICH WILL HIGHLIGHT

THE REPARATIONS AND REMEDIES, BECAUSE IT'S ALL ABOUT REMEDIES AT THE END

OF THE DAY.

MR. RA: I -- I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT THAT PIECE IN

TERMS OF DATA. SO, JUST WHAT ARE -- WHAT ARE THE, I GUESS, MECHANISMS

FOR THAT WHEN THEY'RE DEALING WITH -- HOW -- HOW DO WE MAKE SURE

THERE'S COOPERATION FROM THOSE ENTITIES THAT THEY WANT TO GET DATA FROM?

YOU KNOW, WE'RE SAYING THEY CAN ACCESS THIS, BUT JUST MECHANICALLY, DO

YOU KNOW HOW THAT WOULD OPERATE?

MS. SOLAGES: I'M SURE THEY COULD JUST PICK UP THE

PHONE OR SEND AN E-MAIL OR CALL.

MR. RA: WELL, WE'D HOPE THERE WOULD BE

COOPERATION. I'M SAYING WHAT IF THERE'S NOT?

MS. SOLAGES: WHAT IF THERE'S NOT COLLABORATION?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. RA: WHAT IF THERE'S NOT COOPERATION FROM, YOU

KNOW, IN TERMS OF MAKING SURE THEY HAVE ACCESS TO ALL THE DATA THEY

NEEDED?

MS. SOLAGES: WELL, I THINK WE IN THIS BODY HAVE

PASSED MANY COMMISSIONS AND MANY TASK FORCE, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE

BEEN ABLE TO ACQUIRE INFORMATION. SO IF THAT'S A CHALLENGE MAYBE THAT'S

ANOTHER BILL IDEA.

MR. RA: OKAY. THERE YOU GO. WE HAVEN'T -- WELL, I

THINK WE'RE -- WE'RE ALWAYS REVISITING THINGS, RIGHT, AND WE DO LOTS OF

CHAPTER AMENDMENTS. SO --

MS. SOLAGES: (INAUDIBLE)

MR. RA: IF IT CAME TO IT I WOULD THINK -- AND THEN

JUST IN TERMS OF THE SUBCOMMITTEES. ANY -- ANY DIRECTIVE IN THIS

REGARDING THE MAKEUP OF THOSE?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, IT STATES THAT ANY SUBCOMMITTEE

OR MEMBER OF THE COMMISSION IS AUTHOR -- IS AUTHORIZED BY THE

COMMISSION TO TAKE ANY ACTION WHICH THE COMMISSION HAS SAYS [SIC]

THEY CAN.

MR. RA: WOULD -- WOULD THE SUBCOMMITTEE SOLELY

HAVE TO BE MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION OR COULD THERE BE AN

OPPORTUNITY THAT -- YOU KNOW, I MEAN IT'S BEEN RAISED EARLIER ABOUT, YOU

KNOW, CERTAIN ENTITIES NOT HAVING APPOINTMENTS. IS -- IS THERE A

POTENTIAL THAT ON ONE OF THESE SUBCOMMITTEES THERE COULD BE A BROADER

SCOPE COMING IN OF OTHER INDIVIDUALS THAT AREN'T, YOU KNOW, ONE OF

THESE NINE MEMBERS?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: THEY WOULD HAVE TO BE MEMBERS OF

THE COMMISSION.

MR. RA: OKAY, THEY WOULD HAVE TO BE A MEMBER OF

THE COMMISSION. AND -- SORRY. SORRY TO BE SKIPPING AROUND, BUT SO

THAT -- BUT BACK TO THE PREVIOUS POINT ON -- ON THE REPORT IN THE END AND

ACTUALLY THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT ARE GOING TO COME OUT, SO WE DON'T

-- AM I CORRECT, THE BILL DOESN'T HAVE A DATE -- A CERTAIN DATE THAT IT HAS

TO BE OUT BY?

MS. SOLAGES: THE COMMISSION SHALL -- IT SHOULD

BE A YEAR WITHIN THE -- SINCE THE FIRST MEETING.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND THEN IT'S -- AND THEN IT -- THE

COMMISSION TERMINATES AFTER 90 DAYS OF -- OF THE -- THAT REPORT BEING

GIVEN?

MS. SOLAGES: MM-HMM.

MR. RA: OKAY.

MS. SOLAGES: IT SHALL EXPIRE AND DEEMED REPEALED

90 DAYS AFTER.

MR. RA: YES. EXPIRED AND REPEALED. ALL RIGHT.

HOLD ON ONE SECOND.

(PAUSE)

I THINK THAT IS ALL I HAVE IN TERMS OF QUESTIONS.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

(PAUSE)

ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. RA: SO, I THANK MY -- MY COLLEAGUE FOR -- FOR

ANSWERING MY QUESTIONS. OBVIOUSLY, THIS IS A VERY SERIOUS TOPIC. IT'S --

IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS OBVIOUSLY OR WAS A DISGRACEFUL PERIOD IN -- IN OUR

NATION'S HISTORY. I WILL, YOU KNOW, BE LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING THIS

PROCESS PLAY OUT, WHAT RECOMMENDATIONS COME ABOUT, AND CERTAINLY

ANY RECOMMENDATIONS THAT COME BACK TO US AS LEGISLATORS TO -- TO THINK

ABOUT AND CONTEMPLATE AND -- AND IMPLEMENT. BUT I -- I -- I DO HOPE

THAT WE MAKE SURE THESE CONVERSATIONS ARE -- ARE WIDE-RANGING AND --

AND INCLUSIVE AND -- AND WE FIND WAYS TO NOT JUST DEAL WITH THE PAST BUT

ADDRESS REAL PROBLEMS THAT CONTINUE TO EXIST IN THIS STATE.

SO AGAIN, THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUE FOR -- FOR

ANSWERING THE QUESTIONS, BUT I -- I CERTAINLY SEE A LOT OF CONCERNS WITH

-- WITH HOW THIS ULTIMATELY PLAYS OUT. BUT LIKE I SAID, WE'LL -- WE'LL

MONITOR IT AND -- AND HOPEFULLY HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY A YEAR FROM NOW

OR SO TO LOOK AT WHAT THIS COMMISSION HAS COME UP WITH. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. CHANG.

MR. CHANG: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES YIELDS,

SIR.

MR. CHANG: WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

YOU FOR THIS BILL. I THINK IT'S A VERY IMPORTANT BILL ITSELF. IT'S MEANINGFUL

AND IT HAS IMPACT FOR THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN WHO HAS BEEN ENSLAVED IN

THIS COUNTRY EVEN BEFORE THIS COUNTRY WAS BORN, SO MANY HUNDREDS OF

YEARS AND MANY GENERATIONS OF INJUSTICE AS WELL. AND WE NEED TO DO IT

RIGHT AND WE NEED TO GO FORWARD FOR THIS AND MAKE REPARATION AND --

AND SEE HOW WE CAN SOLVE THE CURRENT INJUSTICE IN THE

AFRICAN-AMERICAN [SIC]. BUT LOOKING AT -- AT THE BILL ITSELF, ON THE

COMMISSION ITSELF, A LIST OF VARIOUS EXPERTISE ARE THERE, AND YOU HAVE

ONLY NINE DESIGNATED COMMISSIONS. ARE THERE ENOUGH COMMISSIONS TO

REPRESENT ALL OF THOSE EXPERTISE --

MS. SOLAGES: I -- I FIRST --

MR. CHANG: -- TO BE (INAUDIBLE) OF THAT BOARD?

MS. SOLAGES: -- WANT TO THANK YOU FOR YOUR

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT. AND SECOND, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE MULTI-FACETED.

AND JUST FROM THE EXPERIENCE OF WORKING ON THIS BILL I HAVE MET IN

MANY INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE, YOU KNOW, KNOWLEDGE OF REPARATIONS BUT

ALSO HAS EXPERTISE IN VERY DIFFERENT OTHER FACENANCE [SIC] OF OTHER

INDUSTRIES. SO, YOU KNOW, I DO BELIEVE THAT WE COULD FIND INDIVIDUALS

THAT COULD SIT ON THIS COMMISSION THAT CAN, FOR, YOU KNOW, NORMAL

TERMS, WALK AND CHEW GUM.

MR. CHANG: BECAUSE I, YOU KNOW, I REPRESENT A

MINORITY CONFERENCE AS WELL AS A MINORITY ITSELF. YOU KNOW, I HAVE A

PERSONAL VESTED INTEREST TO SEE THIS THING THROUGH AS WELL, AND I HOPE

SOMEHOW BEHIND THE SCENE THAT WE CAN EXPAND THAT AS WELL TO INCLUDE

THE MINORITY CONFERENCES. BECAUSE IT'S TOO IMPORTANT NOT TO INCLUDE IT

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AND IT'S SO BROAD AS -- AS WELL. BECAUSE EVEN FOR -- FOR ME AS -- AS AN

ASIAN OR AS CHINESE, YOU KNOW, WE CAME -- CHINESE HAVE MIGRATED TO

CERTAIN CARIBBEAN ISLANDS AND THEY WERE -- MAYBE A PERSON NOT BE

ENSLAVED BUT THEY WERE INDENTURED SERVANTS AS WELL. A LOT OF THEM

WERE BIRACIALLY MARRIED INTO THAT, SO THERE'S SOME INTEREST IN THERE.

AND IN OUR COURSE OF AMERICAN HISTORY AND -- AND TERRIBLE AT THAT, THAT

CERTAIN GROUPS LIKE THE ITALIANS AND THE CHINESE, WE'VE BEEN UNFAIRLY

TARGETED OVER THE COURSE OF HUNDREDS OF YEARS. AND WE ALSO HAVE OUR

OWN PREJUDICE AND OUR OWN VIEWS, BUT I HOPE THIS WILL GIVE US A

MOMENT AND THE TIME THAT WE CAN -- THAT WE CAN BRIDGE THOSE PREJUDICE

ITSELF AND -- AND LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD OF OPPORTUNITIES. SO I HOPE,

MS. SOLAGES, YOU CAN BROADEN THE COMMISSION AS WELL TO MINORITY

CONFERENCE AS WELL BECAUSE THIS IS TOO IMPORTANT NOT TO INCLUDE THAT,

AND I HOPE THE WISDOM OF THIS ASSEMBLY WOULD THINK ABOUT THAT, TOO.

MS. SOLAGES: YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANT TO BE STUCK

IN THE CONFINES OF POLITICAL PERSUASION BECAUSE THIS IS NOT ABOUT

WHETHER WE ARE, YOU KNOW, LITTLE R OR LITTLE D OR WHATEVER. YOU KNOW,

THIS IS ABOUT CHATTEL SLAVERY, AND I -- I THINK FOR THE RECORD WE HAVE TO

PUT IN WHAT DOES CHATTEL SLAVERY MEAN. A CHATTEL SLAVE -- CHATTEL SLAVE

IS A -- AN ENSLAVED PERSON WHO IS PERMANENTLY OWNED AND WHOSE

CHILDREN AND CHILDREN WERE AUTOMATICALLY ENSLAVED. AND SO WHEN WE

ARE TALKING ABOUT CHATTEL SLAVERY, THIS IS VERY DIFFERENT FROM INDENTURED

SERVANT AND WHATNOT. SO I THINK WE NEED TO JUST BE COGNIZANT OF WHAT

WE ARE SPEAKING ABOUT. AND NO -- NO OFFENSE TO YOU, BUT WE'RE

SPEAKING ABOUT CHATTEL SLAVERY IN WHICH PEOPLE WHO WERE ENSLAVED,

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THEIR CHILDREN WERE ALSO ENSLAVED AND THEIR CHILDREN WERE ALSO

ENSLAVED. AND MANY OF THE -- THE -- THE PERSON THAT YOU DESCRIBED

WERE -- WERE NOT UNDER THE CONSTITUTES OF CHATTEL SLAVERY.

MR. CHANG: WELL, THAT'S TRUE, AND YOUR -- YOUR

DEFINITION AND -- AND, UNFORTUNATELY, THAT EXISTS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD.

BUT I JUST HOPE THAT WE CAN EXPAND THAT AND -- AND APPRECIATE WHAT THIS

BILL THAT PRESENTED TO US BECAUSE IT HAS, YOU KNOW, FUTURE HUGE

FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS AND OUR RESPONSIBILITY AS THE LEGISLATURE TO

MAKE SURE THAT -- THAT WE TAKING CARE OF -- OF THE AFRICAN-AMERICANS

HOW WE FINANCIALLY PREPARE FOR IT, HOW WE FINANCIALLY PAY FOR IT

BECAUSE THAT'S A HUGE RESPONSIBILITY IN THE FUTURE. HOW WOULD THIS

COMMISSION DECIDE THAT?

MS. SOLAGES: YOU KNOW, LOOKING JUST AT THE -- THE

SYSTEMATIC INEQUALITIES, YOU KNOW, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO BLACK

NEW YORKERS, WHETHER IT'S GUN VIOLENCE, YOU KNOW, CLIMATE CHANGE,

EDUCATION, HOUSING DISCRIMINATION, IT SEEMS THAT BLACK NEW YORKERS

ARE AT A DISADVANTAGE AND THE STATISTICS PROVE SO. SO ALL WE'RE SAYING IS

JUST TAKING A LOOK, A CONVERSATION, A DIALOGUE, A STUDY, A RESEARCH TO SEE

HOW WE CAN MAKE AMENDS.

MR. CHANG: WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THAT'S

ALL I HAVE.

AND ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. CHANG: THIS BILL IS OF -- IS OF GREAT

IMPORTANCE FOR US TO -- TO MEET, ESPECIALLY FOR THE INJUSTICE WAS DONE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HUNDREDS OF YEARS AGO AND STILL THERE IS SOME RACIAL DISCRIMINATION IN

ALL SORTS IN ALL FASHION AND ALL COLORS, AND I HOPE THIS IS ONE WAY THAT

WE CAN MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS. AND I JUST HOPE THAT WE CAN EXPAND

ON THE -- THE COMMISSION. IF WE CAN'T I HOPE THE -- THE COMMISSIONS

THAT SIT ON THOSE HAVE WISDOM AND IN-DEPTH EXPERIENCE AND FAIRNESS TO

-- TO APPLY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MS. LUCAS.

MS. LUCAS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. AMERICAN

FREEDMEN, THOSE PERSONS WHO HAVE AT LEAST ONE ANCESTOR THAT WAS

ENSLAVED IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WHO WAS EMANCIPATED IN

1863 BY WAY OF THE EMANCIPATION PROCLAMATION OR 1865 BY THE 13TH

AMENDMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION, AND HAVING DESPOILED THEIR RIGHTS AS

CITIZENS DUE TO THE BADGES, INCIDENTS AND VESTIGES OF SLAVERY. IT IS

CRUCIAL TO INCLUDE THE STUDY OF LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS AS THE

DETERMINING FACTOR FOR ELIGIBILITY WITHIN THE COMMUNITY. IT IS

IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT THE CURRENT VERSION OF THE BILL DOES NOT ALIGN

WITH THE PRINCIPLES OF REPARATIONS AND RAISES CONSTITUTIONAL CONCERNS

UNDER SECTIONS OF THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1964. FURTHERMORE, THE LACK

OF SUPPORT FROM PROMINENT GRASSROOTS REPARATIONS ORGANIZATIONS IN

NEW YORK AS WELL AS THE ABSENCE OF PUBLIC SUPPORT IS EVIDENT AND WILL

FURTHER DIVIDE THE COMMUNITY. ADDITIONALLY, THIS BILL DOES NOT PROPERLY

ADDRESS THE INTENDED RECIPIENTS OF THE BILL WHICH IS THE COMMUNITY OF

ELIGIBILITY, SPECIFICALLY THE AMERICAN FREEDMEN DESCENDANTS OF

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PERSONS ENSLAVED IN AMERICA. THE BILL FAILS TO RECOGNIZE THE UNIQUE

HISTORY AND SUFFERING OF THIS SPECIFIC GROUP WHO HAVE ENDURED SLAVERY,

RACIAL DISCRIMINATION AND VARIOUS FORMS OF OPPRESSION FOR OVER 400

YEARS IN THE UNITED STATES. THE FOUNDATION OF THE BILL, AS STATED IN

PARAGRAPH 1, IS FLAWED AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL. IT ACKNOWLEDGES THE

INJUSTICE OF SLAVERY AND DISCRIMINATION AGAINST PEOPLE OF AFRICAN

DESCENT, BUT DOES NOT ACCURATELY IDENTIFY THE TARGETED GROUP. THE

VAGUE AND INACCURATE IDENTIFICATION OF THE AFFECTED POPULATION IN THE

BILL LEADS TO THE INCLUSION OF INDIVIDUALS WHO DO NOT SHARE THE SAME

HISTORICAL EXPERIENCE OF SLAVERY AND ITS AFTERMATH. THE TOPIC OF

REPARATIONS IS A COMPLEX AND SENSITIVE ISSUE AIMING TO ADDRESS

HISTORICAL INJUSTICES AND PROVIDE REDRESS FOR THE DESCENDANTS OF THOSE

WHO SUFFERED. HOWEVER, IT IS CRUCIAL TO APPROACH THIS MATTER WITH

FAIRNESS AND A FOCUS ON RECTIFYING SPECIFIC HARMS ENDURED BY THE

AFFECTED COMMUNITIES. AS DISCUSSIONS CONTINUE, IT IS ESSENTIAL TO

ADVOCATE FOR LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS TO ENSURE JUSTICE AND EQUITY FOR

AMERICAN FREEDMEN WHO ARE DIRECT DESCENDANTS OF ENSLAVED

INDIVIDUALS IN THE UNITED STATES. REPARATIONS SHOULD BE TARGETED

TOWARDS THOSE WHO DIRECTLY EXPERIENCED HARM, AND THEIR DESCENDENTS,

DUE TO SLAVERY AND ITS ENDURING EFFECTS. AMERICAN FREEDMEN AS DEFEND

-- DESCENDANTS OF INDIVIDUALS WHO WERE ENSLAVED HAVE A UNIQUE, A

UNIQUE HISTORICAL CONNECTION TO THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY. THEY HAVE

INHERITED THE CONSEQUENCES OF CENTURIES OF OPPRESSION, DISCRIMINATION

AND ECONOMIC DISADVANTAGE. LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS ACKNOWLEDGE

THE SPECIFIC HARM AND AIMS TO ADDRESS IT IN A TARGETED AND JUST MANNER.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ONE OF THE CENTRAL TENETS OF OUR CONSTITUTION IS THE EQUAL PROTECTION

CLAUSE OF THE 14TH AMENDMENT WHICH ENSURES EQUAL TREATMENT UNDER

THE LAW. BY STUDYING LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS WE ALIGN WITH

CONSTITUTIONAL PRINCIPLES, OFFERING REDRESS TO THOSE WHO HAVE SUFFERED

FROM THE HISTORICAL INJUSTICES WITHOUT DISCRIMINATING, WITHOUT

DISCRIMINATING AGAINST OR EXCLUDING ANY RACIAL OR ETHNIC GROUP.

REPARATIONS SHOULD FOCUS ON PROVIDING MEANINGFUL AND IMPACTFUL

MEASURES THAT ADDRESS THE SYSTEMIC DISADVANTAGES FACED BY AMERICAN

FREEDMEN BY DIRECTING RESOURCES TOWARDS EDUCATION, HEALTHCARE,

ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITIES AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT. LINEAGE-BASED

REPARATIONS CAN HELP BREAK THE CYCLE OF INTERGENERATIONAL POVERTY AND

PROVIDE A FOUNDATION FOR UPWARD MOBILITY. SUCH TARGETED ASSISTANCE

ACKNOWLEDGES, SUCH TARGETED ASSISTANCE ACKNOWLEDGES THE HISTORICAL

AND ONGOING STRUGGLES FACED BY THIS COMMUNITY AND SEEKS TO RECTIFY

THEM. WHILE IT IS ESSENTIAL TO RECOGNIZE THE SHARED EXPERIENCES OF

DIVERSE COMMUNITIES, WHILE IT IS ESSENTIAL TO RECOGNIZE THE SHARED

EXPERIENCES OF DIVERSE COMMUNITIES, A BROAD APPROACH COULD

INADVERTENTLY DIVERT RESOURCES AND ATTENTION AWAY FROM THOSE WHO HAVE

BORNE THE DIRECT CONSEQUENCES OF SLAVERY AND ITS AFTERMATH. WHILE IT IS

ESSENTIAL TO RECOGNIZE THE SHARED EXPERIENCES OF DIVERSE COMMUNITIES,

A BROAD APPROACH COULD INADVERTENTLY DIVERT RESOURCES AND ATTENTION

AWAY FROM THOSE WHO HAVE BORNE THE DIRECT CONSEQUENCES OF SLAVERY

AND ITS AFTERMATH. BY FOCUSING ON THE STUDY OF LINEAGE-BASED

REPARATIONS FOR AMERICAN FREEDMEN, WE ENSURE THAT THOSE WHO HAVE

SUFFERED THE MOST RECEIVE THE NECESSARY SUPPORT AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THAT THEY DESERVE. RECEIVE THE NECESSARY SUPPORT AND

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT, AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT, AND ACKNOWLEDGEMENT THAT

THEY DESERVE. IN THE PURSUIT OF JUSTICE AND EQUITY, IT IS CRUCIAL TO

ADVOCATE FOR THE STUDY OF LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS. ENSURING THAT THE

HARMS ENDURED BY AMERICAN FREEDMEN ARE SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED,

SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED BY UPHOLDING CONSTITUTIONAL PRINCIPLES,

PROVIDING EFFECTIVE REPARATIVE MEASURES AND PRESERVING THE INTEGRITY OF

THE REPARATIONS PROCESS, WE CAN LAY THE FOUNDATION FOR HEALING, UNITY

AND A MORE EQUITABLE SOCIETY.

LET US WORK TOGETHER TO RECTIFY HISTORICAL INJUSTICES

AND FORGE A FUTURE THAT EMBRACES JUSTICE, EQUALITY AND THE DIGNITY OF ALL

INDIVIDUALS. A RUSHED REPARATIONS BILL FOR THE SAKE OF SIGNING A BILL IS

DOING AN INJUSTICE TO EVERYONE WHO HAS SUFFERED DUE TO THE HUNDREDS OF

YEARS OF SLAVERY. A RUSHED REPARATIONS BILL FOR THE SAKE OF SIGNING A

BILL IS DOING AN INJUSTICE TO EVERYONE WHO HAS SUFFERED DUE TO THE

HUNDREDS OF YEARS OF SLAVERY. WE MUST GET THIS RIGHT. I AM STRONGLY

SUGGESTING THAT WE INCLUDE THE STUDY OF LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS TO

THIS BILL, WE TAKE SOME TIME TO REVIEW AND GET IT RIGHT. WE DO NOT

PARTICIPATE IN A PROCESS THAT CONTINUES TO IGNORE THE HISTORY, THE PAIN

AND THE SUFFRAGE OF ENSLAVED AMERICANS, AND ENSURE ITS INTEGRITY AND

EFFECTIVENESS. AND UNTIL THAT IS DONE, I CANNOT IN GOOD CONSCIENCE, I

CANNOT RUSH A BILL, I CANNOT DO AN INJUSTICE FOR THOSE AND ALLOW OTHERS

TO BEAR THE PAIN, TO BEAR THE CONSE -- THE -- THE -- THE -- THE -- THE FRUITS

OF THOSE WHO HAVE SUFFERED. DO I WANT EQUITY? ABSOLUTELY. DO I

RECOGNIZE THE PERSECUTION OF A PEOPLE WITHIN THE AMERICAS? YES, I DO.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT

REPARATIONS FOR AN ENSLAVED PEOPLE WHO WERE ROBBED, BEATEN, RAPED.

THEY DON'T HAVE A FLAG TO WAVE AND GO BACK TO ANOTHER COUNTRY. THEIR

HISTORY STOPS AT A CERTAIN POINT WHERE THEY CAN'T EVEN TRACE IT. AT SOME

POINT THEY DIDN'T EVEN HAVE RECORDS OF DEATH. THAT HAPPENED HERE IN

AMERICA. AND WE WANT TO DENY JUST A TARGETED FOCUS ON A STUDY THAT

POTENTIALLY REPAIRS THIS DAMAGE? SO IF I COME TO THIS COUNTRY AND I

CAME HERE FIVE YEARS AGO, YOU'RE STUDYING ME, TOO? ELON MUSK IS OF

AFRICAN DESCENT. ARE WE STUDYING HIM, TOO?

I AM IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. ARI BROWN.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. SOLAGES: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES YIELDS,

SIR.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MADAM SPONSOR. I'M

CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO BE AS ELOQUENT AS MY COLLEAGUE

ASSEMBLYWOMAN LUCAS, BUT ALONG THE SAME LINES, I JUST WANTED -- AS A

DAD OF SEVEN, I ALWAYS TRY TO GET TO THE HEART OF THE PROBLEM OR ELSE

WE'RE GOING NOWHERE. SO I WANT TO FOCUS ON SOME OF THE WORDING.

THE SLAVERY AND THE IMPACT OF THESE FORCES ON LIVING PEOPLE OF AFRICAN

DESCENT, WILL THE STUDY DEFINE AND ANALYZE WHO IS OF AFRICAN DESCENT?

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HOW WILL WE KNOW WHO THAT IS?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THAT'S WHY THE DUTIES OF THE

COMMISSION ARE LISTED HERE. AND, YOU KNOW, I JUST WANT TO SAY IT

EXAMINES THE INSTITUTION AS SLAVERY WHICH EXISTED, AND THE

COMMISSION'S EXAMINATION SHALL INCLUDE AND NOT BE LIMITED TO THE

CAPTURE AND PROCUREMENT OF AFRICANS, THE TRANSPORTATION OF AFRICANS,

THE SALE AND ACQUISITION AND THEN, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THIS IS LISTED. SO

WE LIST THEM. WE'RE NOT TRYING TO LIMIT THE COMMISSION. THE

COMMISSION HAS THE ABILITY TO ANALYZE CHATTEL SLAVERY, LINEAGE-BASED

REPARATIONS, HARM-BASED REPARATIONS. WE DON'T DEFINE, AND NOR SHOULD

WE DEFINE, WHAT THE COMMISSION SHOULD BE LOOKING AT.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU. I ASK THAT, YOU KNOW,

THAT QUESTION ON MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS. YOU KNOW, WE LIVE AN ERA,

UNFORTUNATELY, OF IDENTITY POLITICS. WHEN MY MOM AND GRANDMOTHER

CAME FROM ITALY, EVERYBODY JUST SIMPLY WANTED TO BE AMERICAN. IF

YOU WERE IRISH, IF YOU WERE BLACK, DIFFERENT GENERATIONS, WE ALL JUST

WANTED TO BE AMERICAN AND SERVE. NOW EVERYBODY HAS TO BE

PIGEON-HOLED IN A CERTAIN AREA. BUT IN TRUTH, AT THE END OF THE DAY, HOW

WOULD ANYBODY BE ABLE TO DEFINE WHO IS OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN DESCENT?

AND FOR A MOMENT, IF I MAY, I DON'T KNOW IF EVERYBODY RECALLS, BUT LAST

YEAR SEVEN OR MAYBE FIVE OR SEVEN OF MY CHILDREN WERE HERE AND MY

GRANDCHILDREN AS WELL. MY CHILDREN ARE OF A BIG PERCENTAGE OF

AFRICAN-AMERICAN DESCENT THROUGH THEIR BEAUTIFUL AND AGELESS MOTHER,

PROBABLY MORE THAN A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM. WOULD MY

BLONDE-HAIRED, BLUE-EYED SON JAKE POSSIBLY GET REPARATIONS? HE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CERTAINLY IS OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN DESCENT. AND I DON'T MEAN THE WHITE

AFRICAN-AMERICAN DESCENT. HOW WOULD WE DEFINE THAT TODAY?

MS. SOLAGES: SO, THE COMMISSION WOULD BE

CHARGED WITH ANALYZING THAT, BUT JUST FOR THE SAKE OF THE ARGUMENT, YOU

KNOW, WITH CHATTEL SLAVERY THESE PEOPLE WERE -- IT WAS DE --

DEHUMANIZING, SO THESE PEOPLE WERE DEEMED PROPERTY. SO AS PROPERTY

THEY WERE QUANTIFIED ON SHEETS AND DOCUMENTATION. AND SO THERE'S

ACTUALLY RECORDS. I JUST MET AN INDIVIDUAL THE OTHER DAY WHO ACTUALLY

SHOWED ME HIS FAMILY SLAVE RECORDS. HE SHOWED WHERE HIS FAMILY WAS

CONSIDERED, YOU KNOW, PROPERTY AND THAT WAS QUANTIFIED; HOW MUCH

HIS FAMILY WAS, YOU KNOW, WHERE -- WHERE HE COME FROM, ALMOST AS IF

HE WAS SOME SORT OF CATTLE. AND SO THERE ARE POSSIBILITIES TO ANALYZE

YOUR LINEAGE AND, YOU KNOW, THE COMMISSION WILL FURTHER DEFINE THAT.

BUT JUST FOR THE SAKE OF THIS ARGUMENT AND FOR THIS DEBATE, THIS -- THIS

BILL-IN-CHIEF JUST CREATES A COMMISSION AND ORGANIZES INDIVIDUALS TO

TALK ABOUT THAT.

MR. A. BROWN: I JUST -- WE DON'T WANT THIS TO BE AN

ENDLESS CYCLE - AND I THANK YOU FOR THAT ANSWER - AN ENDLESS CYCLE OF

SOMETHING GOING NOWHERE, GETTING PEOPLE'S HOPES UP AND NEXT YEAR

WE'LL BE HERE EXPANDING THIS THING TO SOMETHING THAT MAY GO NOWHERE.

AND AGAIN, I SAY MY CHILDREN CAN TRACE THEIR HISTORY EXACTLY AS THE WAY

YOU DESCRIBED. MY -- TWO OF MY BLONDE-HAIRED, BLUE-EYED SONS CAN

TRACE IT EXACTLY AS YOU. I WONDER IN YOUR OPINION, WOULD THEY BE

ENTITLED TO REPARATIONS? THEY PROBABLY HAVE AS MUCH AFRICAN-

AMERICAN AS -- AS YOU DO.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. SOLAGES: I'LL -- I'LL REPEAT IT. THE COMMISSION

WILL BE CHARGED, EXCUSE ME, THE COMMISSION WILL BE CHARGED WITH

COMING UP WITH THE -- THE -- THE PARAMETERS AROUND WHO MAY QUALIFY

FOR LINEAGE-BASED REPARATIONS, AND THAT LINEAGE-BASED MEANS THAT YOU

CAN TRACE YOUR -- YOUR-- YOUR DESCENDENTS WHO WERE ENSLAVED.

MR. A. BROWN: I -- I RESPECT THAT TREMENDOUSLY.

PERHAPS WE SHOULD TAKE SOME SUGGESTIONS FROM MY COLLEAGUES WHO

HAD SUGGESTED THAT MAYBE THIS SHOULDN'T BE LIMITED ON WHO SHOULD BE

ON THE COMMISSION. MAYBE IT NEEDS -- WE TALK DIVERSITY. LET'S SEE

SOME DIVERSITY IN THIS SPECIFIC BILL. OF ALL THE BILLS, LET'S TRY TO GET SOME

DIVERSITY IN THE BILL. LET'S GET SOME MEMBERS OF THE MAJORITY. I

CERTAINLY, PROBABLY MORE THAN MOST -- HECK, MY MOTHER WAS IN A

BARBED-WIRED INTERNMENT CAMP RIGHT HERE IN OSWEGO, NEW YORK, FROM

OUR FORMER GOVERNOR FRANKLIN DELANO ROOSEVELT, THEN PRESIDENT

ROOSEVELT, RIGHT HERE AN HOUR AWAY.

MS. SOLAGES: I'M A STUDENT OF HISTORY AND I KNOW

-- I KNOW VERY WELL DURING THE NUREMBERG TRIALS IN WHICH THEY

DISCUSSED REPARATIONS FOR INDIVIDUALS.

MR. A. BROWN: SO I ASK, WOULD YOU BE INTERESTED,

WOULD YOU EVEN POSSIBLY SUGGEST AMENDING THE BILL TO INCLUDE A WIDER

POPULACE, SOME PEOPLE MAYBE FROM THE MAJORITY WHO MAY HAVE SOME

INPUT THAT COULD HELP BENEFIT THIS GREAT CAUSE?

MS. SOLAGES: YOU KNOW, I -- I BELIEVE THE -- THE

BILL-IN-CHIEF RIGHT HERE THAT WE ARE DEBATING IS A WORK PRODUCT OF ALL OF

US COLLEAGUES GETTING TOGETHER AND HAVING A DISCUSSION, PRIOR DEBATES.

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AND SO, YOU KNOW, I BELIEVE AND I ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE IN

THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION AND FOR IT TO GO TO THE

SENATE, PASS AND BE SIGNED BY THE GOVERNOR AND THEN WE CAN BEGIN THE

PROCESS OF HEALING AND MOVING FORWARD AND TALKING ABOUT HOW WE CAN

UPLIFT NEW YORKERS, ALL NEW YORKERS, ESPECIALLY BLACK NEW YORKERS.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MADAM SPONSOR.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. A. BROWN: IT'S -- IT'S JUST REALLY MORE -- MORE

MY PERSPECTIVE, MR. SPEAKER. YOU KNOW, I AM -- WE ALWAYS SEEM LIKE

WE'RE SO DIVIDED TODAY, AND BILLS LIKE THIS MAY HELP, THEY MAY NOT HELP.

BUT I'M REALLY PROUD TO SAY I STAND IN THIS ASSEMBLY CHAMBER WHERE

ONE OF MY FAVORITE COLLEAGUES SITS AS THE MAJORITY LEADER, WHERE YOU

SIT AS OUR SPEAK -- AS OUR SPEAKER PRO TEM, WE HAVE A SPEAKER OF

AFRICAN-AMERICAN DESCENT, THE MAJORITY LEADER ON THE OTHER SIDE. WE

REALLY HAVE COME A LONG WAY AND I'M PROUD OF THAT. AND IF WE COULD

JUST WORK TOGETHER, MAYBE THIS BILL COULD BE SOMETHING BETTER.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MS. ZINERMAN.

MS. ZINERMAN: GOOD AFTERNOON, MR. SPEAKER. I

STAND TODAY NOT ONLY TO SPEAK ON THIS -- TO SPEAK ON THIS BILL IN HONOR OF

MY ANCESTORS AND MY CHILDREN AND THOSE YET TO BE -- BE BORN. I STAND

BEFORE YOU TO EMPHASIZE THE IMPORTANCE OF PASSING THE NEW YORK

STATE COMMISSION -- COMMUNITY COMMISSION ON REPARATIONS

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REMEDIES BILL IN OUR ESTEEMED STATE ASSEMBLY. THIS LEGISLATION HOLDS

IMMENSE SIGNIFICANCE AND IT ADDRESSES A CRUCIAL ASPECT OF OUR HISTORY

THAT HAS SHAPED OUR GREAT STATE. I WILL SAY TO YOU TODAY THAT AS

LISTENING TO THE PREVIOUS SPEAKERS, IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT WE LOOK AT

ANOTHER BILL THAT I SPONSORED THIS YEAR, 1939, THE AMISTAD ACT, BECAUSE

APPARENTLY WE ALL NEED TO UNDERSTAND OUR HISTORY, AND ESPECIALLY BLACK

HISTORY. NEW YORK'S STATUS AS AN ECONOMIC AND CULTURAL HUB HAS BEEN

BUILT UPON THE CONTRIBUTIONS, THE BACKS, THE BLOOD, SWEAT AND TEARS OF

ENSLAVED AFRICANS. NOT THOSE WHO CHOSE TO COME HERE, BUT THOSE WHO

WERE IN ON THEIR CONTINENT AND THEIR COUNTRY, MINDING THEIR BUSINESS

WHEN THEY WERE ENSLAVED, CHAINED AND BROUGHT TO THIS COUNTRY.

SLAVERY WAS NOT CONFINED TO THE SOUTH. NEW YORK CITY ONCE HAD MORE

ENSLAVED AFRICANS THAN ANY OTHER CITY EXCEPT FOR CHARLESTON. WE WERE

THEN AND WE REMAIN NOW AN INTEGRAL PART OF THE POPULATION, THE RE --

THE SETTLING, THE BUILDING OF EVERYTHING THAT YOU ALL ENJOY TODAY. THIS

BILL IS A NECESSARY STEP TOWARDS RECTIFYING THE INJUSTICES SUFFERED BY

ENSLAVED AFRICANS. IT SEEKS TO EXAMINE THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY IN

NEW YORK, IT'S EFFECT ON PRESENT-DAY SOCIETY AND THE ROLE THE FEDERAL,

STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT IN SUPPORTING ON OPPOSING IT. THE

COMMISSION ESTABLISHED BY THIS BILL WOULD CONDUCT A COMPREHENSIVE

INQUIRY SOLICITING PUBLIC INPUT AND HOLDING HEARINGS TO SHED LIGHT ON

OUR HISTORY. THE COMMISSION -- THE COMMISSION'S FINDINGS WILL GUIDE

US IN RECOMMENDING APPROPRIATE REMEDIES AND REPARATIONS.

COMPENSATION BE -- MAY BE ONE SUCH REMEDY, BUT THE COMMISSION WILL

DETERMINE THE SPECIFICS, INCLUDING ELIGIBILITY. EDUCATION OF THE PUBLIC

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ABOUT THE COMMISSION'S FINDINGS IS CRUCIAL FOSTERING AWARENESS AND

UNDERSTANDING OF OUR SHARED PAST AND OUR ANCESTORS' ROLES IN IT. PASSING

THIS BILL IS NOT JUST ABOUT ACKNOWLEDGING THE PAST, IT IS ABOUT SHAPING A

MORE EQUITABLE FUTURE. BY ADDRESSING THE LINGERING NEGATIVE EFFECTS OF

SLAVERY AND DISCRIMINATION, WE CAN STRIVE FOR TRUE JUSTICE AND EQUALITY.

WE MUST REMEMBER THAT PROGRESS DOES NOT COME WITHOUT

ACKNOWLEDGING AND HEALING THE WOUNDS OF THE PAST. I IMPLORE EACH

AND EVERY ONE OF YOU AS MEMBERS OF THE STATE ASSEMBLY TO SUPPORT THE

PASSAGE OF THIS BILL. LET US DEMONSTRATE OUR COMMITMENT TO A MORE

INCLUSIVE AND JUST SOCIETY BY ESTABLISHING THE NEW YORK STATE

COMMUNITY COMMISSION ON REPARATIONS REMEDY [SIC]. TOGETHER, WE

CAN CREATE A LEGACY OF RECONCILIATION AND PAVE A WAY TO A BRIGHTER

FUTURE FOR ALL NEW YORKERS.

I'M SERIOUS ABOUT THE HISTORY. SOME OF THE QUESTIONS

THAT WERE ASKED TODAY WERE SO OFFENSIVE I DIDN'T KNOW IF I WAS GOING TO

BE ABLE TO GET UP AND SPEAK. UNDERSTAND THE HISTORY. AND MAYBE I CAN

JUST GIVE YOU A LITTLE HISTORY LESSON RIGHT NOW. OR MAYBE -- NO, THIS

MIGHT BE AN ANALOGY. IF THOSE OF US WHO ARE OF AFRICAN DESCENT WOULD

STAND UP TODAY AND ENSLAVE EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU AND TAKE YOU,

LET'S JUST PICK GHANA RIGHT NOW, JUST PUT YOU ON A BOAT, FEED YOU GRUEL,

CHAIN YOU TO THE WALL, NOT ALLOW YOU TO GO TO THE BATHROOM, AND BRING

YOU TO GHANA AND THEN SET YOU ON THOSE SHORES AND TELL YOU THAT YOU

COULD NO LONGER SPEAK YOUR LANGUAGE, YOU COULD NO LONGER EXCHANGE

CULTURAL REFERENCES WITH ONE ANOTHER, THAT YOU COULD NO LONGER BE

CALLED BY YOUR NAME, THAT YOUR HISTORY IS ERASED, AND THEN PUT YOU TO

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WORK TO BUILD A COUNTRY THAT WAS NOT YOUR SOVEREIGN LAND. AND THEN

LOOK AT YOU GENERATION AFTER GENERATION AFTER GENERATION AND SAY THAT

YOU WERE STUPID AND THAT YOU WERE IGNORANT AND THAT YOU WERE LAZY,

WHILE THEY BENEFITTED FROM THE TEAR FROM YOUR WHOLE BEING. WE ARE

ASKING FOR A COMMISSION TO STUDY THE REPAIR THAT IS NECESSARY. WE'RE

NOT SUING YOU AND TELLING YOU THAT YOU OWE US 400 YEARS OF WAGES AND

CALCULATING THAT AND SAYING, PAY UP TODAY. WE'RE SAYING ACKNOWLEDGE

WHAT HAS HAPPENED, AND LET A GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPERTS -- AND

I'M SORRY TO SAY, THE PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM AREN'T EXPERTS. WE'RE SAYING

LET THE EXPERTS DECIDE AND THEN WE WILL TAKE UNDER CONSIDERATION THEIR

RECOMMENDATIONS. THAT'S ALL WE'RE SAYING TODAY. WE COULD TAKE AN

ENTIRELY DIFFERENT PATH. BUT WE'RE NOT DOING THAT BECAUSE WE ARE

HUMANS. AND DESPITE THE BEGINNINGS, THOSE OF US WHO CHOSE TO STAY

HERE -- RANDALL ROBINSON AND SOME OTHER PEOPLE LEFT BECAUSE THEY ARE

SICK OF AMERICA, RIGHT? BUT THOSE OF US WHO CHOSE TO STAY HERE AND

CONTINUE TO BUILD THIS COUNTRY, CONTRIBUTE TO THIS COUNTRY, ARE JUST

SAYING IT IS TIME, IT IS TIME, IT IS -- IT'S TIME TO GET THIS STUDY DONE SO THAT

WE CAN DEAL WITH THE OTHER -- WE CALL THEM LINGERING EFFECTS, BUT LET'S

BE CLEAR. EVERY SINGLE DAY PEOPLE ARE BREAKING THE LAW AGAINST

AFRICAN-AMERICANS BECAUSE OF OUR SKIN COLOR. WHETHER IT IS IN

EDUCATION, WHETHER IT IS IF YOU TRY TO GO TO A HOSPITAL AND BIRTH YOUR

CHILD, WHETHER IT IS THAT YOU'RE TRYING TO BUY A HOUSE, RENT A HOUSE OR AS

A TENANT, RENT A PLACE. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE MUST DO. THIS IS THE

MOST EQUITABLE WAY TO DO IT. AND EXPANDING A COMMISSION TO HAVE

PEOPLE ON IT WHO DON'T HAVE THE BASIC KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT WE'VE GONE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THROUGH AND WHAT WE CONTINUE TO GO THROUGH IS NOT WHAT WE'RE HERE TO

DECIDE TODAY. TODAY WE'RE JUST SAYING WE HAVE NINE EXPERTS THAT CAN

COME TO THE TABLE AND DELIVER TO THIS BODY, DELIVER TO THIS BODY,

RECOMMENDATIONS ON HOW WE DEAL WITH THIS SCOURGE ON AMERICAN

HISTORY.

I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GIBBS.

MR. GIBBS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I RISE TODAY

IN DISGUST. BUT FIRST LET ME SAY I WHOLEHEARTEDLY SUPPORT MY CHAIR, THE

SPONSOR OF THIS BILL AND THIS BILL, AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

I HEARD A COLLEAGUE QUESTION MY CHAIR AND ASKED SIMPLY IF MY

BLUE-EYED CHILDREN WOULD BE ENTITLED TO REPARATIONS BECAUSE WE HAVE

SOME SORT OF SIMILARITIES. AND I SAT HERE AND I THOUGHT, I WONDER IF THIS

MEMBER'S BLUE-EYED CHILDREN WOULD GET AFRAID WHEN THEY'RE PULLED

OVER BY THE POLICE, IF THEY'RE EVER PULLED OVER BY THE POLICE. I WONDER

IF THE BLUE-EYED CHILDREN COULD GET A JOB BECAUSE OF THE COLOR OF THEIR

SKIN OR COULD GET AN APARTMENT OR HOUSING OR... IT'S -- IT'S -- IT'S A ROUGH

CONVERSATION TO HAVE, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE EVERY TIME WE HAVE A

CONVERSATION ABOUT BETTERMENT OF AFRICAN-AMERICANS OR ADVANCEMENT

OF PEOPLE OF COLOR, THERE'S ALWAYS SOME SIDE RESERVATIONS. I EVEN HEARD

SOME PEOPLE SAY, OH, SOME OF MY BEST FRIENDS ARE BLACK. HOW

CONVENIENT. THIS IS A SERIOUS TOPIC. I ASKED A MEMBER IN THE LOUNGE

ABOUT 30 MINUTES AGO, HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF THE ROLES WERE SIMPLY

REVERSED? YEAH, LET'S THINK ABOUT THAT FOR A MINUTE. IF AFRICAN-

AMERICANS WERE THE ONES ENSLAVING OTHER FOLKS. WHAT WOULD THAT

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CONVERSATION BE LIKE? WE SIT UP HERE AND WE VOTE ON LEGISLATION THAT

WE NOT REALLY FAMILIAR WITH. AND I CAN SEGUE INTO THE PRISON LEGISLATION

THAT MANY OF YOU PROFESSIONAL MEMBERS LEGISLATE ON. I SEE THE BILLS

THAT YOU PUT OUT HERE AND I SIT HERE QUIETLY AND I SAY, HUH, THEY DON'T

KNOW. SO HERE WE ARE NOW ON THE REPARATIONS AND WE HAVING THESE

CONVERSATIONS AND, YOU KNOW, AND PEOPLE ARE FEELING A LITTLE BIT

UNCOMFORTABLE. I WAS IN THE LOUNGE WITH ANOTHER MEMBER WHO WE SAT

OUT HERE, WE DEBATED TWO, THREE HOURS TO SAVE THE LIVES OF ANIMALS, BUT

YET YOU CAN'T SIT OUT HERE FIVE MINUTES AND LISTEN TO REPARATIONS. YOU'D

RATHER SIT IN THE LOUNGE AND LOOK AT THE TV AND TALK ABOUT TRUMP. IT'S

UNFAIR. IT'S NEVER GOING TO BE FAIR, FIRST OF ALL. IT'S NEVER GOING TO BE

FAIR. BUT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU PUT YOURSELVES IN OUR SHOES AND ASK

YOURSELVES, WOULD YOU MAYBE DO IT? WOULD YOU ALL BE ABLE TO GO

THROUGH IT? IT'S TOUGH TIMES IN AMERICA, BUT WE ALL HUMAN. WE ALL

HUMAN. I DON'T SEE WHITE OVER THERE. I DON'T SEE BLACK OVER HERE. IN

FACT, I'M OVER THERE MORE THAN I'M OVER HERE. I SEE PEOPLE. I DON'T SEE

POLITICIANS, I DON'T SEE COLOR. BUT I KNOW WE HAVE A POCKET OF FOLK

WHO SUFFERED, MURDERED, RAPED OVER AND OVER AGAIN, CASTRATED, HUNG,

JUST BECAUSE OF THE COLOR OF THEIR SKIN. EMMETT TILL WAS KILLED BECAUSE

OF AN ACCUSATION HE SAID SOMETHING TO A WHITE WOMAN. CAN YOUR

BLUE-EYED CHILD COME AND SAY SOMETHING TO A BLACK WOMAN AND GET

HUNG? NO. NO. IT'S TIME TO MAKE COMMON SENSE COMMON AGAIN,

GUYS. DAMN COLOR, DAMN PRINCIPLES AND DAMN THIS VOTING BACK AND

FORTH, FIGHTING OVER WHO SHOULD -- WHAT BILL SHOULD GO WHAT -- LISTEN,

THE BOTTOM LINE IS WE ALL ARE HUMAN. I TREAT YOU ALL LIKE HUMAN, I

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SMILE, I DANCE AND JOKE WITH YOU GUYS. YOU KNOW WHY? BECAUSE WE

ALL HUMAN. IF YOU BLEED, I BLEED, WE ALL BLEED RED. DIFFERENT

PRINCIPLES, DIFFERENT IDEAS, I GET IT. THAT'S WHY I'M NOT A POLITICIAN, I'M

A PEOPLETICIAN. I LOVE PEOPLE. AND IF WE COULD JUST DO THAT, PUT TEN

PERCENT IN THAT BELIEF IN YOUR, I THINK WE ARE ON OUR WAY. BUT TO SIT

HERE AT A TIME AND SAY, HEY, SOME OF MY BLACK FRIENDS OR NEIGHBORS OR

THIS AND THAT AND THE THIRD, WE'RE NOT LOOKING FOR SYMPATHY, WE'RE JUST

LOOKING FOR SIMPLE LEGISLATION THAT SAYS, HEY, LET'S BUILD THIS

COMMISSION. LET'S START A CONVERSATION WITH PROFESSIONALS, NOT

LEGISLATORS. I CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT HAPPENED IN THE 1800S, I WASN'T THERE,

I DIDN'T STUDY IT. SO THIS -- THE PARTICULAR LEGISLATION SAYS, HEY, WE WANT

TO BRING A COMMISSION AND LET'S STUDY WHAT SLAVERY HAS DONE TO US.

AND I'M GOING TO END ON A STORY WHY IT'S IMPORTANT TO

HAVE THIS COMMISSION AND OTHER BILLS RELATED TO REPARATIONS. I HAD A

MUSLIM FRIEND IN HARLEM, AND MY BROTHER, HE HAD A BAD DISPOSITION

ABOUT WOMEN. AND HIS IMAM CAME TO THE APARTMENT ONE DAY AND HE

ASKED MY BROTHER, WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU PUT A BLACK MAN -- EXCUSE ME

-- WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU PUT A BLACK MAN IN THE ROOM WITH ANOTHER

BLACK WOMAN? WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU DO THIS FOR 300 YEARS? YOU

PRODUCE AN IRRESPONSIBLE MAN WHO'S ONLY THOUGHT OF A WOMAN AS

PLEASURE AND WHEN HE'S DONE WITH THAT PLEASURE HE'S DONE WITH THAT

WOMAN. AND YOU WALK OFF THE PLANTATION AND LET MASTER TAKE CARE OF

HER. WE STILL LIVE IN THAT ENSLAVED MENTALITY TODAY. BLACK MEN

WALKING OFF, LEAVING THE FAMILY AND LETTING THE STATE AND WELFARE TAKE

CARE OF HER. SEE, THIS IS THE PART OF THE COMMISSION THAT WE HAVE TO

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

STUDY. IT'S SLAVE MENTALITY. THERE'S OTHER THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON THAT

AFFECT US DIRECTLY THIS DAY. I DON'T EXPECT YOU GUYS TO UNDERSTAND

OVERNIGHT. I DON'T EXPECT YOU GUYS TO SYMPATHIZE WITH US. BUT WHAT I

AM ASKING IS THAT YOU GUYS JUST PUT YOURSELVES IN OUR SHOES AND ASK

YOURSELVES WHAT WOULD Y'ALL DO.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. DARLING -- THANK

YOU.

MS. DARLING.

MS. DARLING: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I WOULD

LIKE TO THANK THE SPONSOR AND ALL INVOLVED, INCLUDING MYSELF, FOR THE

INTRODUCTION OF THIS BILL. OVER 400 YEARS AGO AFRICANS WERE SOLD AND

KIDNAPPED FROM THE SHORES OF AFRICA FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF

ENSLAVEMENT. MANY WERE BROUGHT TO THE VERY LAND WE CURRENTLY STAND

ON, TO BUILD A NEW WORLD. A NEW WORLD THAT BECAME A SUPERPOWER, A

SUPERPOWER THAT WAS CALLED AMERICA. THESE BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE BUILT

MUCH OF THIS COUNTRY'S WEALTH WHILE THEY RECEIVED NOTHING. ONLY

BLACK PEOPLE IN AMERICA HAVE HAD TO FIGHT TO BE CONSIDERED HUMAN

BEINGS, THEN BLACK PEOPLE HAD TO FIGHT TO COME FREE, THEN BLACK PEOPLE

HAD TO FIGHT TO BECOME CITIZENS, AND BLACK PEOPLE ARE STILL TO THIS DAY

FIGHTING TO HAVE SOME SEMBLANCE OF EQUAL RIGHTS. THIS HISTORY, ALONG

WITH FEDERAL, STATE AND LOCAL POLICY DECISIONS HELPED CREATE PRESENT-

DAY ECONOMIC, EDUCATION, HOUSING AND EMPLOYMENT AND HEALTH

INEQUITIES IN THE BLACK COMMUNITY. THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO PASS THIS

BILL TODAY TO FORM A COMMUNITY COMMISSION ON REPARATIONS [SIC] IN

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE STATE OF NEW YORK. THIS BILL RELATES TO ACKNOWLEDGING THE

FUNDAMENTAL INJUSTICE, CRUELTY, BRUTALITY AND INHUMANITY OF SLAVERY IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK. IT ESTABLISHES THE NEW YORK STATE COMMUNITY

COMMISSION ON REPARATION REMEDIES TO EXAMINE THE INSTITUTION OF

SLAVERY, SUBSEQUENTLY THE RACIAL AND ECONOMIC DISCRIMINATION AGAINST

AMERICANS OF AFRICAN DESCENT, THE IMPACT OF THESE FORCES ON LIVING

AMERICANS OF AFRICAN DESCENT, AND TO MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS ON

APPROPRIATE REMEDIES. THIS BILL IS INCREDIBLY OVERDUE, AND IT IS MY

GREAT PRAYER THAT IT BECOMES LAW THIS YEAR.

AS AN AMERICAN DESCENDANT OF ENSLAVED PEOPLE, I

KNOW WE DESERVE JUSTICE AND COMPENSATION FOR THE CRIME OF SLAVERY.

ONLY WHEN THIS HAPPENS WILL WE BE BETTER ABLE TO CLOSE THE INCREDIBLE

WEALTH GAP HERE IN AMERICA. THE PASSAGE OF THIS BILL STARTS THE PROCESS

THAT WILL EVENTUALLY ALLOW US TO ANSWER, ANSWER THE HARD QUESTIONS AND

DETERMINE SOLUTIONS IN AN ATTEMPT TO REMEDY THE DAMAGE AND THE HARM

THAT BLACK PEOPLE LIVE WITH EVERY DAY IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK. UNTIL

WE FULLY ACKNOWLEDGE AND PAY FOR THE TRAVESTY OF THE ENSLAVEMENT OF

BLACK PEOPLE AND ITS AFTERMATH, THEN NOTHING ELSE WE DO IN THIS COUNTRY

OR THIS STATE WILL BE EFFECTIVE.

I ABSOLUTELY AND ASSERTIVELY WILL BE VOTING IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. FIRST OF ALL, I WANT TO HONOR THE SPONSOR AND ALL OF THOSE

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MEMBERS OF THE CAUCUS THAT WORKED ON THIS LEGISLATION TO PUT IT

TOGETHER. I WANT TO HONOR THE PREVIOUS SPONSOR WHO'S NO LONGER

SERVING US IN THIS CHAMBER AS WELL. BUT I WANT TO, YOU KNOW, JUST

REMIND PEOPLE BECAUSE I KNOW I'VE SAID THIS BEFORE THAT I'M LITERALLY,

LITERALLY FOUR GENERATIONS AWAY FROM AN ENSLAVED WOMAN WHO CAME

HERE UNDER THE BOTTOM OF A SHIP. SHE HAD NO IDEA WHERE SHE WAS

COMING [SIC]. SHE WAS RAPED, ABUSED. IF SHE HAD CHILDREN WITH HER AT

THE TIME, THEY WERE TAKEN. IF SHE HAD A MAN WITH HER AT THE TIME, THEY

WERE SEPARATED. AND I KNOW WHERE SHE CAME FROM BECAUSE I HAVE

SINCE -- MY FAMILY HAS SINCE DONE THE RESEARCH. SHE CAME FROM THE

WEST COAST OF AFRICA. NOBODY ASKED HER TO COME HERE, THEY STOLED

HER, LITERALLY STOLED HER AND BROUGHT HER HERE. AND THEN ONCE THEY GOT

HER HERE THEY CONTINUED TO ABUSE HER, ALL OF HER CHILDREN AND ANYONE

SHE EVER HAD A RELATIONSHIP WITH. WHILE WE WERE STILL ENSLAVED PEOPLE,

THEY DENIED THEM AN OPPORTUNITY TO READ. YOU CAN'T READ. DON'T LET

THEM SEE A BOOK. WE WOULDN'T EVEN LET THEM SEE A BIBLE. FOR GOD

SAKES, WE WOULDN'T EVEN LET THEM SEE A BIBLE. CLEARLY, I'VE READ THE

HISTORY, YOU ALL HAVE READ THE HISTORY AS WELL, WE KNOW THAT FORMER

PRESIDENT LINCOLN, HE MADE A VALIANT EFFORT TO TRY AND WIN THE CIVIL

WAR AGAINST SLAVERY. HE ACTUALLY EVEN TALKED TO PEOPLE WHO WERE

ENSLAVED, ENCOURAGED THEM TO BECOME A PART OF THE CIVIL WAR TO FIGHT

ON THE SIDE OF THE CONFEDERATES, EVEN THOUGH SOME ENSLAVED PEOPLE

WERE ALREADY FIGHTING ON THE SIDE OF THE CONFEDERACY. UNWILLINGLY,

BUT THAT'S WHAT THEY WERE DOING. AND HE TOLD THEM, IF YOU DO THIS AND

WE WIN THE WAR, YOU WILL GET 20 ACRES AND A MULE. THAT'S WHAT HE SAID

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

TO THE PEOPLE WHO WENT TO WAR AS -- ON THE NORTH SIDE. THAT NEVER

HAPPENED. IT NEVER HAPPENED, BECAUSE THE LAND THAT HE INTENDED TO

USE, LAND THAT WAS HELD BY THE CONFEDERACY THAT WAS TAKEN FROM THEM

BECAUSE THEY WERE FIGHTING AGAINST AMERICA, AFTER THE WAR WAS OVER

THEY JUST RECOUPED IT. THEY SAID THE LAND WAS NO LONGER AVAILABLE FOR

THAT 20 ACRES AND A MULE. AND I WANT TO SAY THAT THE WAY HISTORY

DEFINES IT IT WAS MOSTLY IN GEORGIA AND IN FLORIDA. WELL, WE'RE IN NEW

YORK, BUT THE SAME ATTITUDE THAT WE'RE ONLY HERE TO BE ENSLAVED

WORKERS HAS PERMEATED ITSELF THROUGH SOCIETY YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR.

EVEN WHEN WE GET -- GET WAY PAST SLAVERY, WAY PAST CIVIL RIGHTS, WE

COME UP WITH A WELFARE SYSTEM, PEOPLE MOVED FROM THE SOUTH WHERE

THEY WERE FARMERS AND SHARECROPPERS. THEY MOVED TO THE NORTH,

MAYBE THE HUSBAND FINDS A JOB, MAYBE HE DOESN'T. SO MAYBE THEY

NEED SOMETHING TO EAT. SO THEY GO AND ASK THE SERVICES THAT PROVIDE

SERVICES TO RURAL PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN A RURAL COMMUNITY WITH NO

PROBLEM. THEY SAID, OH, YEAH, YOU CAN GET THIS BUT YOU CAN'T HAVE A

MAN LIVING IN YOUR HOUSE. SO NOW YOU WANT TO WONDER WHY THERE ARE

SO MANY FAMILIES, AND PARTICULARLY IN THE BLACK COMMUNITY, THAT

THEY'RE NOT TWO-FAMILY HOUSEHOLDS. BECAUSE THIS AMERICAN SOCIETY HAS

SUGGESTED THAT THERE NEVER SHOULD BE. YOU SEPARATE THEM FROM THE

TIME THEY GOT ON THE SHIP TO THE TIME THEY GOT OFF, TO THE TIME THEY

CAME FOR AN OPPORTUNITY TO ASK FOR A FOOD STAMP, YOU SAY YOU CAN'T LIVE

WITH A MAN. NOW WE WANT TO FIGURE OUT HOW YOU PUT FAMILY VALUES

BACK IN, AND YOU STILL KEEP TAKING AWAY, NEEDLING AWAY, FINDING WAYS

TO ARREST PEOPLE, FIND WAYS TO INCARCERATE PEOPLE. FINDING A WAY TO

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

DIMINISH A YOUNG KINDERGARTENER, FIRST GRADER, SECOND GRADER, TO THINK

THAT, YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO LEARN AT THE SAME LEVEL AS MY CHILDREN ARE SO

I'M NOT GOING TO TEACH YOU AT THAT LEVEL. THERE'S SOME PUBLIC SCHOOLS

THAT DON'T EVEN OFFER ADVANCED PLACEMENT CLASSES WHERE MOSTLY YOUR

BLACK STUDENTS ARE. THAT'S NOT BECAUSE THEY NOT CAPABLE, THAT'S BECAUSE

YOU'RE DETERMINED THAT THEY NOT CAPABLE. AND YOU DETERMINED THAT

FROM YOUR HISTORY, IT'S NOT MINE. AND I'M NOT WILLING TO KEEP TOLERATING

IT. AND SO IF WE WANT TO PUT TOGETHER A COMMISSION THAT SIMPLY LOOKS

AT WHAT HAPPENED, NOT WHY IT HAPPENED BECAUSE YOU CAN'T -- THERE'S NO

WAY YOU CAN ARTICULATE WHY SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD HAPPEN. YOU --

YOU CAN'T EVEN TRY TO EXPLAIN THAT TO YOURSELF OR YOUR CHILDREN OR MY

CHILDREN. I'M NOT GOING TO TRY TO EXPLAIN IT TO MINE, EITHER. BUT YOU

WANT TO KNOW IF THIS HAPPENED FOR ECONOMIC REASONS, ECONOMIC THINGS

HAVE HAPPENED AS A RESULT OF IT, WHERE IS THE BENEFIT FOR THE PEOPLE WHO

HELPED DO THAT? NOW, MY COLLEAGUE MENTIONED EARLIER AND I WAS REALLY

HAPPY THAT HE SAID THAT. HERE WE ARE, SOME 200 YEARS LATER WHEN THIS

STATE'S CONSTITUTION WAS WRITTEN, AND I'M SURE WHEN IT WAS WRITTEN THE

PEOPLE WHO WROTE IT, OUR FOUNDING FATHERS, THEY NEVER IMAGINED THAT

SPEAKER HEASTIE WOULD BE THE SPEAKER OF THIS CHAMBER. THEY NEVER

IMAGINED THAT I WOULD BE THE MAJORITY LEADER. THEY NEVER IMAGINED

THAT JEFF WOULD BE THE PRO TEM. THEY NEVER IMAGINED THAT, BUT IT

HAPPENED. BECAUSE IN SPITE OF THE WHAT -- HOW WE WERE TREATED AS A

PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY, SOME OF US HAVE LEARNED TO GET BY THAT. BUT YOU

KNOW WHAT? MANY OF US HAVE NOT. WE HAVE NOT, AND THEY STILL

STRUGGLE. SO IT WOULD BEHOOVE ALL OF US TO WANT TO HELP THEM FIGURE OUT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HOW DO YOU GET PAST ALL THIS HATE, SEPARATION AND DEGRADATION THAT YOU

HAVE EXPERIENCED. IT WEIGHS ON YOU SO HEAVY THAT YOU SOMEHOW THINK

YOU -- YOU'RE YOUR OWN ENEMY. AND SO YOU'RE SHOOTING YOUR BROTHERS

IN THE STREET ABOUT SOME TURF AREA THAT YOU DON'T EVEN OWN. BECAUSE

YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND. YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR HISTORY, YOU DON'T

KNOW -- UNDERSTAND HOW IT'S IMPACTED YOU. HERE WE WANT TO PUT

TOGETHER SOME TOP OF THE LINE PROFESSORS, EXPERTISE, HISTORIANS WHO WILL

HELP ARTICULATE, HERE ARE THE THINGS WE CAN DO TO SHIFT THIS NARRATIVE, TO

SHIFT THIS PARADIGM TO ONE OF A HISTORY WHERE BLACK PEOPLE WHO WERE

BROUGHT HERE FROM AFRICA HAVE BEEN NEGATIVELY IMPACTED. WHY DON'T

WE TRY THESE THINGS TO SEE IF WE CAN MAKE -- TURN THAT AROUND AND MAKE

SOMETHING POSITIVE OUT OF IT SO THAT THE CHILDREN WHO ARE COMING

BEHIND US WON'T HAVE TO EVER THINK THAT IT WAS EVEN NOT POSSIBLE THAT

THERE WOULD BE A BLACK SPEAKER, BUT TO ASSUME THAT THEY'RE ALWAYS WILL

BE? AS OPPOSED TO, AS SOME PEOPLE WOULD HAVE SAID, WHY WOULD YOU

BE DOING A BLACK MAJORITY LEADER, YOU ALREADY GOT A BLACK SPEAKER?

YOU GOT TO GET US OUT OF THAT LITTLE SQUARE BOX AND LET US JOIN THE REST OF

THE WORLD AND SHOW YOU WHAT WE HAVE TO OFFER. BUT THERE'S SO MANY

OPPORTUNITIES THAT KEEP BEING STIFLED BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO DO WHAT

IT TAKES TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THE PROBLEM BETTER. I AM WILLING TO

TAKE THE TIME TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THE PROBLEM BETTER, AND I

KNOW THAT MOST OF THE MEMBERS OF THIS HOUSE, BECAUSE I KNOW YOU,

OKAY, I KNOW YOU PERSONALLY, ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE, I KNOW THAT

YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE A BETTER WORLD, A BETTER NEW YORK FOR ALL OF US AS

WELL. DON'T PROHIBIT US WITH NEGATIVE CONVERSATION. DON'T PROHIBIT US

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WITH NEGATIVE CONVERSATION. NEGATIVE CONVERSATION GROWS NEGATIVE

CONVERSATION. WE HEAR ENOUGH AT -- AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL, WE DON'T

NEED THAT HERE IN NEW YORK. LET'S MOVE FORWARD, BE THE GREAT STATE

THAT WE THINK WE ARE NOW. BUT LET'S SHOW THE REST OF THE WORLD HOW

GREAT WE ARE. LET'S DO A STUDY AND LET IT BENEFIT THE LIVES OF NEW

YORKERS AND THEN HAVE OTHER PEOPLE DUPLICATE IT. BECAUSE WE'VE DONE

SOME STUFF IN NEW YORK BEFORE THAT'S BEEN DUPLICATED IN OTHER PLACES.

LET'S DO THIS RIGHT. I'M HONORED TO HAVE THIS OPPORTUNITY, AND I HOPE

YOU ALL WILL JOIN ME. AND LET'S -- LET'S JUST BE MINDFUL. WE DON'T WANT

TO TAKE ANYTHING AWAY FROM ANY IMMIGRANT THAT EVER WALKED IN THIS

COUNTRY ON THEIR OWN FREE WILL. YOU ARE WELCOME HERE, OKAY? YOU'RE

WELCOME. AND IN FACT, IF WE HAD NOT PUT IN AS A PEOPLE WHAT WE DID,

YOU WOULDN'T EVEN WANT TO COME HERE. WE BUILT A COUNTRY THAT OTHER

PEOPLE DESIRE TO BE IN. AND IT'S IMPORTANT THAT YOU UNDERSTAND HOW

IMPORTANT YOU ARE TO US. BUT WE GOT TO BE IMPORTANT TO YOU, TOO. YOU

CANNOT KEEP LISTENING TO THE RACIAL INNUENDOS THAT YOU HEAR ON THE

NATIONAL NEWS, EITHER IN THE COUNTRY WHERE YOU CAME FROM OR THE

COUNTRY WHERE YOU'RE AT NOW AND BELIEVE THIS -- THAT THERE'S SOMETHING

WRONG WITH US. THERE'S NOT. IF THERE WAS SOMETHING WRONG WITH US WE

WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN STOLEN FROM OUR COUNTRY AND BUILT THE COUNTRY THAT

YOU ALL DESIRE TO BE IN NOW. BUT I'M JUST TELLING YOU THAT YOU'RE

WELCOME. I JUST NEED TO BE WELCOME, TOO. NOT JUST SOME OF THE TIME,

BUT ALL OF THE TIME.

I LOOK FORWARD TO VOTING FOR THIS.

(APPLAUSE)

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ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. WALKER.

MS. WALKER: YOU KNOW -- THANK YOU.

ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL.

MS. WALKER: I WAS -- I HAPPENED TO RUN ACROSS A

SCRIPTURE, IT SAYS, IF THY BROTHER, A HEBREW MAN OR A HEBREW WOMAN,

BE SOLD UNTO THEE AND SERVE THEE SIX YEARS, THEN IN THE SEVENTH YEAR,

THOU SHALL LET HIM LET GO FREE FROM THEE. AND WHEN THOU SENDEST HIM

FREE FROM THEE, THOU SHALL NOT LET HIM GO AWAY EMPTY. THOU SHALL

FURNISH HIM LIBERALLY OUT OF THY FLOCK AND OUT OF THY FLOOR AND OUT OF THY

WINE PRESS OF THAT WHEREWITH THE LORD, THY GOD, HAVE BLESSED THEE,

THOU SHALL GIVE UNTO HIM. AND SO IT SAYS TO ME THAT THIS IDEA OF

REPARATIONS ISN'T A NEW IDEA, IT ISN'T ONE THAT WAS CREATED BY THIS BODY,

IT ISN'T ONE THAT WAS BORN JUST RECENTLY, BUT IT IS SOMETHING THAT IS

INDOCTRINATED WITHIN THE HISTORY OF OUR VERY EXISTENCE. IT'S RIGHT, IT'S

RIGHTEOUS. WE HAVE LABOR LAWS BECAUSE OF THIS. IF I WORK FOR YOU, YOU

PAY ME. ALLOW ME TO INVEST THOSE RESOURCES INTO THE SOIL. ALLOW ME

TO INVEST THOSE RESOURCES INTO BUSINESSES. ALLOW ME TO DREAM ABOUT

GENERATIONAL WEALTH BUILDING FOR MY FUTURE, FOR MY LEGACY. ALLOW ME

TO CREATE A SYSTEM THAT IS NOT BARRED AND MARRED BY INSTITUTIONALIZED

AND LEGALIZED DISCRIMINATION. ALLOW ME TO HAVE ACCESS TO A WORLD THAT

IS FREE FROM STATE-SANCTIONED BRUTALITY. ALLOW ME TO SEE A WORLD WHERE

MURDER AND DISPOSSESSION AND DISFRANCHISEMENT AND GENTRIFICATION ISN'T

THE LEGACY THAT I LEAVE MY CHILDREN. WHY? BECAUSE YOU OWE ME,

BECAUSE YOU OWE ME.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

GERMANY, FOR INSTANCE, WAS ABLE TO GIVE OVER

$70 BILLION TO JEWISH VICTIMS OF THE NAZI REGIME. IN 1988, HERE IN THIS

COUNTRY, PRESIDENT RONALD REAGAN APOLOGIZED, GO FIGURE, I'M SORRY, FOR

JAPANESE INTERNMENT, AND ESTABLISHED A $1.2 BILLION TRUST TO PAY

REPARATIONS, AND EACH INDIVIDUAL RECEIVED $20,000. BUT HE APOLOGIZED,

AND HE WASN'T ABOVE THAT BECAUSE WE RECOGNIZE THAT ATONEMENT AND

FORGIVENESS ARE IMPORTANT STEPS IN RIGHTING WRONGS THAT PEOPLE HAVE

CARRIED YEAR, AFTER YEAR, AFTER YEAR. DON'T CRIPPLE OUR ABILITIES TO GAIN

ACCESS TO HOUSING, EDUCATION, PUBLIC SAFETY AND HEALTH CARE. LET'S

CREATE A SYSTEM FOR OUR FAMILIES THAT GIVES US ACCESS TO THE SAME

CAPITAL THAT EACH AND EVERY AMERICAN ENJOYS. BUT YEAH, WE'RE TALKING

ABOUT SLAVERY, BUT ON MANY OCCASIONS I'VE STOOD BEHIND THIS DESK AND

I'VE SUBMITTED THAT SLAVERY IS STILL RIPE, IT IS STILL ALIVE, IT IS STILL IN

EXISTENCE BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT THE VERY FOUNDING DOCUMENT INDICATES

THAT SLAVERY WAS ABOLISHED, EXCEPT IN THE CASE OF CRIMINAL PUNISHMENT.

AND SO WHEN SOMEONE IS SUBJECTED TO A CRIME, IT GIVES YOU THE OKAY TO

TAKE AWAY THEIR FREEDOMS, IT GIVES YOU THE OKAY TO TAKE AWAY THEIR

CITIZENSHIP, IT GIVES YOU THE OKAY TO TAKE AWAY THEIR RIGHT TO VOTE, IT

GIVES YOU THE OKAY TO TAKE AWAY THEIR ACCESS TO PELL AND OTHER GRANTS IN

ORDER TO GO TO COLLEGE. IT GIVES YOU THE OKAY IN ORDER TO TAKE AWAY

THEIR ABILITY TO APPLY FOR HOUSING. IT GIVES YOU THE OKAY TO BE

DISCRIMINATORY AGAINST THEM WHEN THEY DO.

AND SO YES, AS A BLACK WOMAN I AM STANDING HERE

TODAY TO SAY YOU OWE ME. YOU DON'T JUST OWE ME, YOU OWE MY

GREAT-GREAT-GREAT-GRANDFATHER GUINEA CHARLES WHO CAME HERE AS A

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SLAVE. YES, WE HAVE DOCUMENTATION OF THAT, WHERE HE WAS FROM. AND

YES, HE EVEN FOUGHT IN THE CIVIL WAR WHEN THE REGIME OF THE PERSON

AND THE FAMILY WHO OWNED HIM IN SLAVERY WAS IN MANASSAS AND HE WAS

IN THEIR REGIME WAS OVERTAKEN AND (INAUDIBLE) CHARLES WAS WALKING

GOODS, SUCH AS WATER AND FOOD AND CLOTHING AND LETTERS FROM BACK

HOME TO WHERE THEY WERE. HE APPROACHED THEM AND THEY HAD HIM

GUNNED DOWN, AND HE PUT THEM BACK INTO GOOD HEALTH AND HE WAS THE

PERSON WHO ACTUALLY FOUGHT OFF THE ENEMY WHO WAS AGAINST THIS

PARTICULAR GROUP. BUT YOU KNOW HOW YOU PAY ME BACK FOR WHATEVER IT

IS THAT THE VESTIGES OF SLAVERY THAT EXISTED THAT I HAVE TO WALK WITH AND

LIVE WITH FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE? YOU GAVE ME A DREAM THAT MAYBE

ONE DAY I COULD SERVE IN A BODY THAT WOULD NEVER EVEN HAVE EXPECTED

ME TO SERVE IN. YOU GAVE ME AN OPPORTUNITY TO SEE THE FIRST BLACK

WOMAN TO BE APPOINTED MAJORITY LEADER IN THE ASSEMBLY WHEN IN

1847 WE SAW THE FIRST BLACK WOMAN TO EARN A MEDICAL DEGREE. IT TOOK

OVER 170 YEARS FOR ME TO SEE THAT. IT TOOK OVER 170 YEARS TO SEE THE

FIRST BLACK SPEAKER, AND SENATE MAJORITY LEADER, AND CITY COUNCIL

SPEAKER, AND AS WELL AS CITY COUNCIL MAJORITY LEADER. BUT HERE I AM

WITH THIS BOLD VISION THAT I DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THAT ANYMORE.

SO I HAVE THIS GREAT OPPORTUNITY WHERE WHENEVER IT IS

THAT WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO PROTEST AND STAND UP FOR WHAT'S RIGHT, I

GO DOWNSTAIRS, I WALK TO THE ELEVATOR, I GO DOWN TO THE WAR ROOM ON

THE SECOND FLOOR AND I LOOK UP IN THE SKY AND WHAT DO I SEE? THE

CONFEDERATE FLAG, BLARING AT ME, RIDICULING ME, WATCHING ME.

WATCHING OVER THE LEGACY THAT I HAVE TO LIVE WITH EACH AND EVERY DAY,

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THE PAIN THAT GETS ENDURED. AND SO IN ADDITION, SO EVERYTHING IT IS THAT

WE ARE DOING HERE TODAY, IF WE CAN SAY TO SOUTH CAROLINA THAT YOU NO

LONGER SHOULD BE FLYING THE CONFEDERATE FLAG OVER YOUR STATE HOUSE, I

WOULD ALSO SUBMIT THAT THE CONFEDERATE FLAG BE REMOVED IMMEDIATELY

FROM THE SECOND FLOOR WAR ROOM OF THE NEW YORK STATE CAPITOL.

YOU DON'T JUST OWE US IN A DOCUMENT, YOU OWE US IN YOUR DEEDS

BECAUSE SLAVERY IS CRUEL, IT'S UNUSUAL. IT LEADS TO VOTER SUPPRESSION,

RACIST DRUG LAWS, MASS INCARCERATION. AND I BELIEVE THAT ITS REVIEW IS

WARRANTED, IS WARRANTED.

AND SO NOW I'M NOT ASKING, I'M DEMANDING THAT YOU

ACKNOWLEDGE THE OBVIOUS TODAY. I'M DEMANDING THAT YOU COMMIT FOR

JUST ASKING FOR A STUDY OF THE IMPACT OF SLAVERY SO THAT THE STATE OF

NEW YORK CAN CONSIDER WHAT THE PROPER REPARATIONS FOR THE DECENDENTS

OF ENSLAVED AFRICANS WHOSE CONTRIBUTIONS HAVE BEEN IGNORED AND

CERTAINLY UNDERVALUED WITHIN THE STATE OF NEW YORK. JUST A MONTH

AGO, IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, OF COURSE, BECAME ONE OF THE FIRST

STATES, AS WE'VE HEARD, TO ACKNOWLEDGE AND UNDERGO SUCH AN EFFORT; AND

ALSO, SIMILAR LEGISLATION HAS BEEN INTRODUCED AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL. WE

HAVE TO CONTINUE TO BE THE VANGUARD IN NEW YORK STATE, TO SET THE TONE

FOR THE REST OF THE COUNTRY, BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT AMERICANS ARE

EXPECTING NEW YORKERS TO DO. REPARATIONS ARE MEANT TO ADDRESS

EGREGIOUS INJUSTICES PERPETUATED AND PERPETRATED AGAINST A GROUP OF

PEOPLE GENERALLY BASED ON THEIR RACE AND/OR RELIGION. AGAIN, NOT A

FOREIGN CONCEPT.

AND SO JUST LIKE ALL OF THE OTHER INDIVIDUALS WHO

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EARNED THEIR JUST DO, WE ARE SAYING THAT OUR 40 ACRES AND A MULE, WHICH

SOME WERE REALIZED, SOME WERE JUST HOPEFUL ABOUT, WE KNOW THAT WE'RE

IN JUNE, AND JUNETEENTH IS AMONG US AND WHEN PEOPLE WERE DENYING

THE OPPORTUNITY TO EVEN KNOW THAT SLAVERY ACTUALLY DOESN'T EXIST

ANYMORE THEORETICALLY, WERE NEVER NOTIFIED. WE'RE ASKING FOR THAT

APOLOGY TO BE THAT NOTIFICATION TODAY, IN THIS BODY AND IN THIS ROOM. IT

IS TIME FOR ACCOUNTABILITY. IT IS TIME FOR THAT ACCOUNTABILITY NOT TO JUST

REST ON THE -- ON THE LAURELS OF SUCCESS HERE, BUT ALSO SUPPORT PRESIDENT

BIDEN AS HE SUPPORTS REPARATIONS FOR DECENDENTS OF ENSLAVED AFRICANS.

AND CONTINUE TO SUPPORT THE WORK THAT CONGRESS IS DOING SO THAT THIS

SITUATION CAN BE ACKNOWLEDGED NOT JUST HERE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK

BUT ACROSS AMERICA, BECAUSE REPARATIONS GO JUST THAT FAR.

SO I WILL LEAVE YOU WITH THE WORDS OF REVEREND DR.

MARTIN LUTHER KING: "I CAME TO ALBANY TO CASH A CHECK. PAY ME WHAT

YOU OWE ME." THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. BICHOTTE

HERMELYN.

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN: ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MA'AM.

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN: SORRY, MR. SPEAKER.

I LOST MY -- CAN YOU COME BACK TO ME, MR. SPEAKER? OKAY, I LOST MY...

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. BICHOTTE

HERMELYN?

(PAUSE)

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN: I LOST MY -- SORRY,

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. SPEAKER. HOLD ON.

(PAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. TAYLOR.

MR. TAYLOR: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. TAYLOR: THANK YOU SO MUCH. THERE'S BEEN

SO MUCH SPIRITED DEBATE HERE, SO MUCH HAS BEEN SAID, AND ONE OF MY

COLLEAGUES THE LATE SENATOR BILL PERKINS WAS SAYING, YES, BUT NOT BY

ME. SO I JUST WANT TO SHARE JUST A LITTLE BIT, THE PREVIOUS MEMBER

MENTIONED SOMETHING THAT WAS SAID I BELIEVE IN '64 IN WASHINGTON

D.C. DR. KING USED THIS VERBIAGE: AMERICA HAS GIVEN ITS COLORED

PEOPLE A BAD CHECK, A CHECK THAT HAS BEEN MARKED 'INSUFFICIENT FUNDS'.

AND WHEN WE THINK ABOUT WHAT THIS CONVERSATION IS

ABOUT, DO WE HAVE THE PERFECT PIECE OF LEGISLATION? PROBABLY NOT. BUT

IF WE'RE BEING HONEST WITH OURSELVES, WE WILL NEVER ARRIVE AT THAT

PERFECT PIECE OF LEGISLATION IN THIS PLACE BECAUSE OUT OF 150 OF US, WE

ALL EACH HAVE AN IDEA THAT WAS NOT OR WILL NOT BE ON THAT DOCUMENT;

HOWEVER, IT IS IMPORTANT TO ADDRESS WHAT IS THERE AND THE MEAT AND

BONES OF WHAT IT'S ASKING US TO DO IN THIS SPACE. AND WHEN WE THINK

ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THIS COUNTRY, OUTSIDE OF CHARLESTON, NEW YORK

STATE HAD OVER 42 PERCENT OF SLAVES. THEY WERE NOT SUGARCANE, COTTON

PLANTATIONS, THEY WERE HOUSEHOLDS IN SMALLER NUMBERS, BUT OVER 42

PERCENT OF THE SLAVES, THE LARGEST POPULATION OF SLAVES OUTSIDE OF

CHARLESTON, SOUTH CAROLINA EXISTED IN THE COLONY OF THE STATE OF NEW

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

YORK, IF THAT IS SUCH A THING. AND IN DOING SO, WE RECOGNIZED THAT

PEOPLE DID NOT AND WERE NOT AND STILL ARE NOT TREATED ADEQUATELY. AND

ALL WE'RE ASKING FOR IN THIS SPACE -- AND I JUST DIVERT JUST A MOMENT.

THERE WAS THIS POPULAR SINGER, WENT BY THE NAME OF JAMES BROWN.

AND HE WAS A MAJOR, POPULAR SONGWRITER AND DANCER AND PERFORMER.

AND HE SAYS, I DON'T WANT YOU TO GIVE ME ANYTHING, JUST OPEN UP THE

DOOR AND I'LL GET IT MYSELF. AND THEY THOUGHT THAT HE WAS SO

RAMBUNCTIOUS TO SAY THAT BECAUSE HE WAS AT THE TOP OF THE CHARTS ACROSS

THE BOARD, AND NEVER AGAIN TO REACH THAT LEVEL OF PERFORMANCE BECAUSE

THE PEOPLE THAT HE SAID IT TO WERE INDIGNIFIED THAT HE WOULD SAY, I DON'T

WANT YOU TO GIVE ME ANYTHING, OPEN THE DOOR AND I'LL GET IT MYSELF.

WE'RE NOT ASKING FOR ANYTHING, WE'RE DEMANDING JUSTICE IN THIS SPACE

TODAY. WE FOUGHT FOR SO MUCH. YOU NAME IT, WE'VE DONE IT. THE

NATIONALITY, THE ISSUE, THE PEOPLE, WE HAVE BLEEDING HEARTS IN THIS SPACE

COLLECTIVELY AS 150 MEMBERS HAVE FOUGHT FOR THE RIGHTS OF SO MANY

PEOPLE AND GIVEN BILLIONS OF DOLLARS. AND ALL WE'RE SAYING IN THIS

SPACE, CONSIDER THE OPPORTUNITY TO ALLOW US TO LOOK AT THIS AND THEN

COME HOME AND SAY, WHAT DOES YOU ALL SAY? I CAN'T BELIEVE THE

NONSENSE IN THIS SPACE, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO MY COLLEAGUES. WE

DIDN'T SAY THIS IS A DOLLAR, THIS IS A BLANK CHECK, GIVE IT UP. WE'RE

SAYING WILL YOU SUPPORT THE IDEA OF CONSIDERATION, AND WE GOT A SONG

AND A DANCE AND A SHUFFLE. RIDICULOUS. I'M GONNA KEEP IT A BUCK,

THAT'S 100.

WE CAN DO BETTER, AND I KNOW WE CAN. LET US NOT

ALLOW OUR FEARS TO OVERRULE OUR GOOD SENSE IN CONSCIOUS. AND WHEN

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WE LOOK ABOUT IT -- LOOK AT THIS, DR. KING SHARED THIS, I DON'T THINK IT

WAS HIS ORIGINALLY, IT'S NOT WHAT THE ENEMY IS SAYING OR DOING, IT'S THE

SILENCE OF OUR FRIENDS THAT'S LOUDER THAN WHAT IS ACTUALLY TAKING PLACE.

LET US DO THE RIGHT THING AND SUPPORT THIS LEGISLATION. THANK YOU SO

MUCH, MR. SPEAKER. I'LL BE VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. JACKSON.

MS. JACKSON: MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MS.

JACKSON.

MS. JACKSON: MR. SPEAKER, THEY WANT OUR RHYTHM,

BUT NOT OUR BLUES. THANK YOU TO THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL AND THE

PREVIOUS SPONSOR. THANK YOU TO EVERYONE, INCLUDING OUR SPEAKER FOR

BEING COURAGEOUS AND DOING THE RIGHT THING AND BRINGING THIS BILL TO THE

FLOOR. EVERY TIME BLACK PEOPLE ADVOCATE FOR EQUITY, WE ARE FACED WITH

THE WHAT ABOUT ME-ISMS. PEOPLE BRINGING UP INDENTURED SERVANTS AND

THEIR STRUGGLES HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH AFRICANS STOLEN FROM THEIR

HOME, STRIPPED OF THEIR NATIVE TONGUES, STRIPPED OF THEIR NATIVE GARB,

STRIPPED OF THEIR CHILDREN, STRIPPED OF THEIR RELIGION AND THEIR CULTURE.

SLAVERY WAS DIVISIVE FOR AFRICAN FAMILIES AND PEOPLE. YOU WATCHED IT

HAPPEN RIGHT HERE ON THE FLOOR, MR. SPEAKER. WHEN ONE ENSLAVED

PERSON WANTED TO ESCAPE, OTHERS WILL TELL MASTER BECAUSE THEY FEARED

EVERYONE WOULD BE LYNCHED FOR THE BEHAVIOR OF ONE PERSON ESCAPING TO

FREEDOM.

THIS BILL WAS NOT DEBATED WITH THE PREVIOUS SPONSOR,

AND I WONDER WHY. AND THIS SPONSOR DID A WAY BETTER JOB AT

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RESPONDING TO OUTRIGHT OFFENSE TO MY ANCESTORS. THERE ISN'T EVEN A

BLACK PERSON ON THE OTHER SIDE, BUT YOU WANT A SPOT ON THE

COMMISSION. OFFENSIVE. OUTRIGHT OFFENSIVE. THIS BILL, LIKE MANY

OTHERS HAVE SAID, IS TO CREATE A COMMISSION TO LOOK AT THE HARMS DONE

TO AFRICAN ENSLAVED PEOPLE AND THEIR DECENDENTS. NEW YORK STATE

NEEDS TO EXAMINE THE EFFECTS OF SLAVERY ON BLACK MATERNAL MORTALITY,

REDLINING, POVERTY, MASS INCARCERATION, BLACK CODES, JIM CROW, THE

SYS -- THE SYSTEMIC OPPRESSION THAT IS IN OUR COURTHOUSES AND OUR

SCHOOLHOUSES. REMEMBER, SLAVERY WAS ONLY ABOLISHED IN 1827 HERE IN

THIS STATE. WE AREN'T THAT FAR REMOVED FROM THE PHYSICAL CHAINS OF

SLAVERY, AND NOW WE ARE LIVING UNDER ITS EFFECTS. THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. NOVAKHOV.

(PAUSE)

MS. DICKENS.

MS. DICKENS: ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MS.

DICKENS.

MS. DICKENS: TODAY, I SERVE IN THESE HALLOWED

HALLS, THE PEOPLE'S HOUSE, OR SO THEY SAY, AS THE GRANDDAUGHTER OF A

MAN BORN INTO SLAVERY, FATHERED BY A MOTHER'S SLAVEHOLDER, SAMUEL

DICKENS. TODAY, WE DISCUSS FOR HOURS THE VALUE OF REPARATIONS FOR

BLACK PEOPLE WHO HELPED BUILD THIS GREAT COUNTRY. THIS COUNTRY WOULD

NOT BE WHERE IT IS, WOULD NOT BE THE GIANT THAT IT STANDS IN THE WORLD

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

STANDING IF IT WERE NOT FOR THE BLACK PEOPLE WHO BUILT THIS COUNTRY

FROM THE FIELDS OF COTTON TO THE HOMES OF PEOPLE.

WE VOTE TODAY FOR A COMMISSION TO RESEARCH THE

EFFECTS AND CONDUCT, THE OUTREACH THAT HAS IMPACTED UPON BLACK PEOPLE

THAT WERE BROUGHT HERE NOT TO ELLIS ISLAND, BUT INSTEAD BROUGHT TO THE

SHORES IN CHAINS AND SHACKLES TO NEW YORK, NORTH AND SOUTH CAROLINA,

GEORGIA AND PLACED NAKED UPON WOODEN STANDS SHOWN AS CHATTEL TO BE

PURCHASED, TO BE SOLD, TO BE BOUGHT, NOT AS HUMANS, BUT AS ANIMALS

WITH NO WORDS OF DEFENSE, NO OPPORTUNITIES, NO CHANCE TO ESCAPE,

SLAVERY OR DEATH. OTHER GROUPS HAVE BEEN HERE AND HAVE BEEN

ENSLAVED, BUT MOSTLY IN THEIR OWN SURROUNDINGS AND THEIR OWN

COUNTRIES, NOT AS HORRENDOUSLY AS THE BLACKS WERE, KIDNAPPED FROM

AFRICA AND BROUGHT TO NORTH AND SOUTH AMERICA, AND TO THE CARIBBEAN

TO BUILD A COUNTRY FOR FREE WITHOUT ANY REMUNERATION, WITHOUT GIVING

US ANY SOURCE OF SURVIVAL. WE WERE BROUGHT SO FAR AWAY THERE WAS NO

OPPORTUNITY, NONE WHATSOEVER TO ESCAPE SLAVERY, NOR WERE WE ABLE TO

FIND OUR WAY BACK TO OUR OWN COUNTRIES FROM WHICH WE WERE BORN.

JUST YESTERDAY, I WENT TO A RESTAURANT. AND WHEN I

ASKED TO BE SEATED IN A ROOM WHERE THERE WERE FEW PEOPLE SEATED, I

WAS TOLD NO, AND INSTEAD RIGHT HERE IN ALBANY, I WAS ESCORTED TO A TABLE

NEXT TO THE BATHROOM, WHERE I COULD SMELL THE ODORS. AND WHEN I WAS

OBJECTING TO BEING SEATED THERE AND WHEN I SAW WHITE PEOPLE BEING

SEATED WHERE I ASKED TO BE SEATED I WAS TOLD, OH, I'M SO SORRY. WELL,

I'M SORRY, TOO, BECAUSE I'M TIRED OF BEING TIRED.

WE'VE HAD NO WORDS OF DEFENSE, WE'VE HAD NO

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OPPORTUNITIES FOR FAIRNESS. IN 1959, MY FATHER SERVED IN THIS SAME

ASSEMBLY AND PUT FORTH A BILL THAT DEMANDED THAT ON STATE PROPERTIES,

ON ANY STATE BUILDINGS, NO FLAGS OF THE CONFEDERATE FLAG COULD BE

FLOWN. AND YOU KNOW WHAT? WE WERE SENT LETTERS, WE GOT PHONE

CALLS, PEOPLE CAME TO OUR HOME AND THREATENED OUR LIVES. THIS IS WHAT

I LIVED THROUGH, NOT WHAT I READ ABOUT, NOT WHAT I HEARD ABOUT, NOT

WHAT I SAW ON TELEVISION, BUT INSTEAD WHAT I ACTUALLY LIVED THROUGH.

AND UNLESS YOU'VE BEEN THREATENED WITH BEING BURNED AT THE STAKE IN

YOUR OWN HOME, YOU HAVE NO IDEA OF THE FEAR YOU HAVE IN YOUR BODY,

IN YOUR MIND, AND IN YOUR HEART. I REFUSE TODAY, I REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT

MY COLLEAGUES TODAY WOULD NOT SUPPORT SUCH A BILL. I COMMEND MY

COLLEAGUE FOR HAVING THE STRENGTH TO STAND UP AND PRESENT IT. I

COMMEND ALL THAT HAVE SPOKEN BEFORE ME AND THOSE WHO HAVE NOT BUT

DO SUPPORT THIS, TO SAY THANK YOU. AND MY COLLEAGUES ACROSS THE AISLE,

I KNOW THAT IN YOUR HEARTS YOU ARE FAIR, I BELIEVE IN MY MIND THAT YOU

WILL SUPPORT THIS. I BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL NOT LET US DOWN BECAUSE YOU

RECOGNIZE WHAT THIS COUNTRY OWES BLACK PEOPLE FOR WHAT WE HAVE

CONTRIBUTED OVER THE YEARS. I BELIEVE IN YOU AND GOD KNOWS I HOPE

YOU DON'T DISAPPOINT ME. I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MORINELLO.

MR. MORINELLO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

BEFORE I -- ON THE BILL, I'M SORRY, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. MORINELLO: I WANT TO REMIND THOSE THAT MAY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HAVE BEEN HERE LAST YEAR, I DID VOTE TO SUPPORT THIS CONCEPT WITH THE

PRIOR SPONSOR, AND I'M BRINGING THAT OUT SO THAT YOU KNOW I WILL

SUPPORT THIS. BUT WHAT I FIND, AND I'VE LISTENED TO EVERYONE VERY

INTENTLY, AND I DO NOT DISAGREE WITH THE COMMENTS, IT'S NOT FOR ME

BECAUSE I DIDN'T LIVE THAT LIFE. THERE'S ONLY ONE THING IN THE BILL THAT I

FIND A LITTLE DISINGENUOUS, AND IF WE WANT TO BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER TO

UNDERSTAND, AS I LOOK AT THE BILL THERE IS NO REPRESENTATION OR ABILITY FOR

REPRESENTATION FROM WHAT THAT SIDE OF THE AISLE REFERS TO AS "OUR SIDE OF

THE AISLE." AND MY FEELING IS THIS, IF YOU ARE SINCERE AND IF YOU'RE

SINCERE IN MOVING FORWARD AND SINCERE IN THIS STUDY, THEN I THINK THERE

SHOULD BE SOME MEMBERS, OR WE SHOULD HAVE SOME ABILITY TO HAVE

MEMBERS ON THAT COMMISSION SO THAT WE EXCHANGE IDEAS. AND IF YOU

WANT US -- AND I DON'T MEAN "US" AS FAR AS THIS GROUP HERE, BUT THOSE

THAT MAY NOT AGREE WITH YOU TO UNDERSTAND BETTER, THEN I FEEL THAT THE

TOTAL VOICE SHOULD BE SOMETHING THAT IS NEEDED. AND I WOULD ASK THAT

THE POSSIBILITY THAT WE GET SOME REPRESENTATION FROM THE MINORITY

CONFERENCE FOR THE ABILITY TO APPOINT SOME INDIVIDUALS TO THAT

COMMISSION, BECAUSE WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MAKEUP, IT'S STILL ONE-SIDED

SO THERE'S GOING TO BE ALWAYS SOME QUESTIONS AS TO WHAT OCCURRED.

SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, I DID SAY I WILL CONTINUE TO

SUPPORT, BUT I WHOLEHEARTEDLY BEG THAT THE SPONSOR CONSIDER SOME

REPRESENTATION SO THAT THE CONCEPT AND THE DISCUSSIONS COULD CONTINUE

AND GO FURTHER. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. ANDERSON.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. ANDERSON: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. ANDERSON: MR. SPEAKER, TODAY IS A HISTORIC

MOMENT FOR BLACK NEW YORKERS AND NEW YORKERS ACROSS THIS GREAT

STATE. WE CAN NO LONGER TURN A BLIND EYE TO THE HISTORY OF ANTI-BLACK

RACISM IN OUR GREAT STATE. WE CAN NO LONGER SAY THAT BLACK NEW

YORKERS ARE STATE PROPERTY. I'M NO LONGER GOING TO ACCEPT THE CONCEPT

THAT BLACK NEW YORKERS ARE STATE PROPERTY. FROM SENECA VILLAGE,

MODERN DAY CENTRAL PARK, TO THE AFRICAN BURIAL GROUND IN LOWER

MANHATTAN, TO TIMBUKTU, MR. SPEAKER, IN THE ADIRONDACKS, WE MUST

CONFRONT OUR HISTORY HEAD ON BECAUSE IF WE FAIL TO DO SO WE ARE

DOOMED TO REPEAT IT.

SLAVERY, MR. SPEAKER, IS NO MORE THAN JUST AMERICA'S

ORIGINAL SIN. SLAVERY IS THE CRUEL, UNUSUAL AND FOUNDATIONAL SYSTEM

UPON WHICH OUR COUNTRY WAS BUILT ON. THE CHAIRS THAT WE SIT IN, THE

DESKS THAT WE EAT ON, THE FILE CABINETS THAT WE PUT OUR FILES IN, EVEN THIS

VERY SPACE THAT WE STAND IN HERE TODAY WAS BUILT ON SLAVE LABOR. THE

REPARATIONS COMMISSION THAT WE ARE PLACING TOGETHER TODAY, WHILE NOT

PERFECT, WHILE IT DOES NOT CONSIDER MANY OF ITS ASPECTS, IT IS OUR BEST

CHANCE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE CAN BEGIN THE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT

REPAIRING THE HARM. IT WILL LOOK AT MORE THAN JUST SLAVERY, IT WILL ALSO

EXAMINE THE LINGERING EFFECTS OF INSTITUTIONAL SLAVERY AND

DISCRIMINATION ON LIVING PEOPLE OF AFRICAN DESCENT. THIS WOULD

INCLUDE HOUSING DISCRIMINATION, THIS WOULD INCLUDE UNEQUAL PAY, THIS

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WOULD INCLUDE DISCRIMINATION, VOTER SUPPRESSION, AND POLICE BRUTALITY.

IT'S IMPORTANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE, MR. SPEAKER, THAT

DURING THE PERIOD OF CHATTEL SLAVERY HERE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, AND

A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT THIS, BUT PEOPLE WERE BEATEN AND

HAD THEIR NAMES CHANGED, AND HAD TO LIVE SEPARATE AND APART FROM THEIR

FAMILIES. MR. SPEAKER, MY LAST NAME IS NOT ANDERSON. FOR EVERY

SINGLE LASH THAT MY ANCESTORS HAD TO TAKE ON THEIR BACKS AND WERE TOLD

TO CHANGE THEIR NAMES, ANDERSON IS NOT MY LAST NAME, MR. SPEAKER.

ALL THE ACCOUNTS OF PAIN AND SUFFERING FOR THE SHOULDERS OF THOSE

ANCESTORS WHO I STAND ON WHOSE NAME I NOW HAVE TO CARRY BECAUSE IT

WAS ASSIGNED TO ME THROUGH BEATINGS. TODAY IS THE FIRST STEP IN THAT

CONVERSATION BEING MANDATORY HERE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

A COMMUNITY OF BLACK LANDOWNERS WHOSE LAND AND

LIVELIHOOD WAS STRIPPED AWAY FROM THEM FOR PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR,

SENECA VILLAGE, THIS COMMISSION, MR. SPEAKER, WOULD ENSURE THAT WE

STUDY HOW THAT HAPPENED AND HOW WE CAN MAKE THOSE FAMILIES WHOLE.

ONE OF A FEW AFRICAN-AMERICAN ENCLAVES AT THE TIME, WHICH AND WAS

INCLUDING SENECA VILLAGE, ALLOWED RESIDENTS TO BE ABLE TO REBUILD THEIR

LIVES IN THEIR THEN CHATTEL SLAVERY, AND IT WAS RUTHLESSLY BUILT OVER AND

BULLDOZED FOR THE BENEFIT OF A FEW. IN THE 1850S, MR. SPEAKER, SENECA

VILLAGE COMPRISED OF 50 HOMES, THREE CHURCHES, AS WELL AS BURIAL

GROUNDS AND SCHOOLS FOR AFRICAN AMERICAN STUDENTS. THIS VILLAGE

MEANT SO MUCH TO OUR PEOPLE. THIS VILLAGE IS EMBLEMATIC OF THE

HISTORY OF WHAT IT IS TO BE A NEW YORKER, A BLACK NEW YORKER, HAVING

THE LITTLE BIT OF WHAT YOU HAVE STRIPPED AWAY FOR THE BENEFIT OF A FEW.

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SENECA VILLAGE ALSO, MR. SPEAKER, PROVIDED AN ESCAPE FROM UNHEALTHY

AND CROWDED CONDITIONS OF THE CITY AND ACCESS TO MORE SPACE INSIDE

AND OUTSIDE THE HOME. THIS LEGISLATURE, MR. SPEAKER, IN 1953 --1853,

EXCUSE ME, ENACTED A LAW THAT WOULD SET ASIDE 775 ACRES OF LAND IN

MANHATTAN FROM 59TH STREET TO 106TH STREET, BETWEEN 5TH AND 8TH

AVENUES TO CREATE THE COUNTRY'S FIRST MAJOR LANDSCAPE PUBLIC PARK. THE

CITY ACQUIRED THE LAND THROUGH EMINENT DOMAIN, TAKING IT AWAY, THE

LAW THAT ALLOWS GOVERNMENT TO TAKE PRIVATE LAND. THERE WERE 1,600

PEOPLE LIVING THERE. AND ALTHOUGH LANDOWNERS WERE COMPENSATED, AS I

SAID, PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR. AND AS ALTHOUGH THERE'S MUCH TO BE DONE,

MR. SPEAKER, AND I USE SENECA VILLAGE AS AN EXAMPLE AS TO WHY WE

NEED TO DO THIS HERE TODAY, THE COMMISSION IS DESIGNED TO MOVE THE

NEEDLE FORWARD, AS NEW YORK SEEKS TO REPAIR THE SYSTEMIC HARMS THAT

HAVE CONTINUED TO THIS DAY.

IN CLOSING, MR. SPEAKER, REPARATIONS IS NOT A DIRTY

WORD, AND I'M SORRY FOR THOSE WHO BELIEVE THAT REPARATIONS AND

REPAIRING HARM IS A DIRTY WORD. REPARATIONS, MR. SPEAKER, SYMBOLIZES

ATONEMENT, RESTORATION AND JUSTICE. NO MORE GASLIGHTING, NO MORE

WHAT ABOUT-ISMS. WHEN YOU HAVE FACED THE LASHES, THE NAME CHANGE,

THE TEARING UP OF YOUR VILLAGE, THE DESTRUCTION OF PROPERTY, THE SPLITTING

OF YOUR FAMILY, WHEN YOU HAVE EXPERIENCED THAT, COME SPEAK TO ME

ABOUT REPARATIONS. BUT THIS IS OUR TIME AND THIS IS OUR MOMENT TO

REPAIR THE HARM THAT HAS BEEN DONE TO OUR PEOPLE FOR GENERATIONS, MR.

SPEAKER. AND FOR THE ANCESTORS WHOSE SHOULDERS I STAND ON TODAY, THAT

ALLOWED ME TO BE THE YOUNGEST, LOUDEST, BLACK VOICE IN THIS CHAMBER,

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IT IS CRITICAL AND IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE DO NOT STAND IN THE WAY OF

HEALING THE HARM OF OUR PEOPLE. MR. SPEAKER, I PROUDLY, PROUDLY, VOTE

IN THE AFFIRMATIVE ON THIS BILL.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER MITAYNES: MR. ANDERSON IN

THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN.

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN: THANK YOU, MR.

[SIC] SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER MITAYNES: ON THE BILL.

MS. BICHOTTE HERMELYN: REPARATIONS IS NOT

ABOUT A PAYCHECK, IT'S ABOUT ATONEMENT AND ACKNOWLEDGING AND

CORRECTING THE HISTORICAL DISENFRANCHISEMENT AND DISCRIMINATION THAT

AFFECTS AFRICAN-AMERICAN WHO ARE DESCENDENTS OF SLAVERY TO THIS DAY.

AS MANY AS 20 PERCENT OF COLONIAL NEW YORKERS WERE ENSLAVED

AFRICANS. NEW YORK ABOLISHED CHATTEL SLAVERY, TREATING PEOPLE AS LEGAL

PROPERTY IN 1799, BUT EVEN AS THE STATUTE REPEALED ENSLAVERS' PROPERTY'S

RIGHT, IT ALSO CALLED THE GRADUAL EMANCIPATION OF THE ENSLAVED, A VERY

LONG PROCESS, THAT ALLOWED ENSLAVEMENT TO CONTINUE IN NEW YORK.

SLAVERY REMAINED LEGAL IN NEW YORK UNTIL 1827. AND EVEN AFTER THAT,

IT REMAINED CLOSELY TIED TO THE INSTITUTION WHEN IT CONTINUED TO EXIST IN

SOUTHERN STATES. MANY WILL SAY THAT THE DOOR CLOSED HUNDREDS OF YEARS

AGO, BUT OUR STATE'S INCOME DISPARITY, WHICH IS THE LARGEST IN THE

COUNTRY, IS IN LARGE PART THAT THE LEGACY OF THE SLAVE SYSTEM WHICH BUILT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AND SHAPED THE STATE.

NOW, THIS ISN'T JUST ABOUT LOOKING IN THE PAST. IT'S

ABOUT THE BALANCING SCALES FOR OUR FUTURE. WE CAN'T DENY THE MASSIVE

DISPARITIES THAT EXISTS WITH BLACK COMMUNITIES TO THIS DAY. CHATTEL

SLAVERY WAS EVENTUALLY ABOLISHED IN VARIOUS COUNTRIES THROUGH THE

EFFORTS OF ABOLITIONISTS AND SOCIAL MOVEMENTS. SIGNIFICANT MILESTONES

IN THE ABOLITION OF CHATTEL SLAVERY INCLUDE IN THE HAITIAN REVOLUTION,

1791 TO 1804; THE BRITISH SLAVERY OF ABOLITION ACT IN 1883, AND THE

AMERICAN EMANCIPATION PROCLAMATION IN 1863. HOWEVER, THE LEGACY

OF SLAVERY CONTINUES TO IMPACT SOCIETIES TODAY AS THEY CONTINUE TO BE

SYSTEMATICALLY RACIST INEQUITIES AND ONGOING SOCIAL DISPARITIES. THIS

COMMISSION WILL STUDY HOW TO UPLIFT AND EMPOWER BLACK NEW

YORKERS, WHOSE EXISTING DISPARITIES INCLUDE HOUSING DISCRIMINATION,

UNEQUAL PAY, VOTER SUPPRESSION, POLICE BRUTALITY AND DISPROPORTIONATE

RATES OF INCARCERATION. SLAVERY, BY THE WAY, STILL EXISTS AND IMPACTS OUR

COMMUNITY.

NOW, AS WE TALK ABOUT REPARATIONS, I OFTEN THINK OF

WHAT HAPPENED TO OUR 40 ACRES AND A MULE. AND AS A DAUGHTER OF

HAITIAN IMMIGRANTS, I DO THINK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED IN HAITI, AND TO

THE MANY HAITIANS THAT CAME HERE WHO WERE ENSLAVED, FOUGHT IN A

PIVOTAL AND COURAGEOUS ROLE IN THE AMERICAN REVOLUTION. THE BATTLE

OF SAVANNAH, GEORGIA, BECAME ONE OF THE BLOODIEST AND SIGNIFICANT

BATTLES DURING THE AMERICAN REVOLUTIONARY WAR. AMERICAN

CONTINENTALS WERE OUTNUMBERED AND SUPPORTED BY FRENCH TROOPS,

INCLUDING 800 FROM SANTA DOMINGO, LATER HAITI, AND OTHER

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FRENCH-CARIBBEAN COLONIES. AND WHEN WE BRING UP REPARATION ABOUT

WELL, WAS THERE REPARATIONS FOR THE BLACKS AND AFRICANS IN HAITI, YOU

THINK ABOUT IT. WHAT WAS IT? IT WAS THE OTHER WAY AROUND. AFTER HAITI

GAINED ITS INDEPENDENCE FROM FRANCE IN 1804 THROUGH A SUCCESSFUL

SLAVE REVOLT, FRANCE DEMANDED REPARATIONS FROM HAITI, YES. THESE

REPARATIONS WERE INTENDED TO COMPENSATE THE FRENCH SLAVEHOLDERS FOR

THEIR LOSS OF PROPERTY, INCLUDING LAND ENSLAVED PEOPLE; 100 MILLION

FRANCS, THE DEBT IMPOSED BY FRANCE SEVERELY HINDERED HAITI'S

DEVELOPMENT AND LEFT THE COUNTRY IN A STATE OF ECONOMIC INSTABILITY.

THE FRENCH GOT THEIR REPARATIONS, BUT WHERE'S OUR 40 ACRES AND A MULE?

THERE'S NO MONEY TOO HIGH TO PRICE -- TO PAY FOR THE

PRICE TO PAY FOR THE MILLIONS OF BLACK PEOPLE, AFRICAN PEOPLE WHO DIED

AND WERE SLAVES. FROM 1501 UNTIL 1866, AN ESTIMATED 12.5 MILLION

AFRICANS WERE PUT ON A SLAVE SHIP -- ON SLAVE SHIPS DURING THE

TRANS-ATLANTIC SLAVE TRADE. MORE THAN ONE IN 12 WOULD DIE DURING

THE MIDDLE PASSAGE. DURING THE RECONSTRUCTION PERIOD, A 12-YEAR

PERIOD AFTER THE END OF THE CIVIL WAR, THOUSANDS OF BLACK MEN, WOMEN

AND CHILDREN WERE LYNCHED. CHATTEL SLAVERY ALLOWED PEOPLE CONSIDERED

LEGAL PROPERTY TO BE BOUGHT, SOLD AND OWNED FOREVER AND WAS LAWFUL

AND SUPPORTED BY THE UNITED STATES. BUT THE GOVERNMENT DIDN'T KEEP

ITS PROMISE OF 40 ACRES AND A MULE. FOLLOWING PRESIDENT ABRAHAM

LINCOLN'S ASSASSINATION ON APRIL 15TH IN 1865, PRESIDENT ANDREW

JOHNSON RESCINDED FIELD ORDER 15 AND RETURNED TO CONFEDERATE OWNERS

THE 400,000 ACRES OF LAND. WHERE IS OUR 40 ACRES AND A MULE?

THE CONTROL AND EXPORTATION OF ONE HUMAN BEING BY

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ANOTHER STILL REMAINS. JUST LOOK AT THE BILLS THAT WE'RE STILL FIGHTING FOR,

BILLS THAT WE ARE FIGHTING TO PASS TODAY, SOME OF WHICH WE HAVE TO

CONTINUE TO FIGHT FOR. WE'RE FIGHTING FOR BILLS TO RECTIFY HOUSING

DISCRIMINATION, HEALTH DISPARITIES, AGAIN, UNEQUAL PAY, VOTER

SUPPRESSION, POLICE BRUTALITY, DISPROPORTIONATE RATES OF INCARCERATION.

WE ARE FIGHTING EVERY DAY. AND VERY OFTEN, WE HAVE TO GO TO COURT.

WE GOT TO GO TO COURT JUST TO GAIN ACCESS TO BASIC FUNDAMENTAL HUMAN

RIGHTS. AND YET, WHERE ARE THOSE REMEDIES THAT COMES WITH THESE BASIC

FUNDAMENTAL HUMAN RIGHTS? WE'RE ALWAYS ARGUING THE 14TH

AMENDMENT, EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE, OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

ONE OF THE BIGGEST BATTLES I'VE BEEN FIGHTING FOR SOME

TIME, SINCE I JOINED THE ASSEMBLY, IS FOR MINORITY- AND

WOMEN-OWNED BUSINESSES TO GET THEIR FAIR SHARE OF RESOURCES. AND

ITS RESOURCES THAT HAS BEEN STRIPPED AWAY FROM US, AND IT'S BEEN MIND-

BOGGLING BECAUSE WE'RE FIGHTING OUR OWN RESOURCES HERE IN THE COURTS.

PROPERTY AND RESOURCES THAT WERE OWNED AND STRIPPED FROM US, WE'VE

BEEN RAPED ECONOMICALLY. AND WE CONTINUE TO BE RAPED ECONOMICALLY.

A NATION THAT FORGETS ITS PAST HAS NO FUTURE. WHERE IS MY 40 ACRES AND

A MULE?

MR. SPEAKER, THIS COMMISSION IS MUCH NEEDED,

REPARATIONS WERE OFFERED TO SO MANY OTHER GROUPS WHILE BLACK PEOPLE

WHO WERE ENSLAVED, PEOPLE WHO ENDURED EXTREME PHYSICAL AND

PSYCHOLOGICAL ABUSE, FORCED LABOR AND DENIAL OF BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS,

PEOPLE WHO ARE OFTEN SUBJECTED AND CONTINUE TO BE SUBJECTED TO BRUTAL

PUNISHMENTS, RESTRICTED FROM EDUCATION AND LIVE IN SQUALOR CONDITIONS,

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NEVER GOT THOSE REPARATIONS, THOSE RIGHTS. SLAVERY WAS AN OPPRESSIVE

AND EXPLOITIVE SYSTEM THAT AMEND THE LABOR OF ENSLAVED PEOPLE FOR

ECONOMIC GAIN. WE NEED RESTITUTION, WE NEED REPARATION. WE NEED

COMPENSATION. YES, WE NEED LAND GRANT, WE NEED SOCIAL SERVICES, WE

NEED OUR 40 ACRES AND A MULE, AND WE NEED AN APOLOGY. IN THE NAME

OF OUR ANCESTORS, I WANT TO THANK THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL, AND I SUPPORT

THIS BILL, MR. SPEAKER. THIS BILL WILL ACKNOWLEDGE THE FUNDAMENTAL

INJUSTICE, CRUELTY, BRUTALITY AND INHUMANITY OF SLAVERY IN THE CITY OF

NEW YORK AND THE STATE OF NEW YORK, AND THIS BILL WILL ESTABLISH THAT

NEW YORK STATE WILL HAVE A COMMUNITY COMMISSION ON REPARATIONS TO

REMEDY AND TO EXAMINE THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY AS IT IMPACTS TODAY ON

BLACKS AND TO MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS ON APPROPRIATE REMEDIES TO

FINALLY LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD OF 400 YEARS LATER. THOSE THAT FAIL TO

LEARN FROM HISTORY, ARE DOOMED TO REPEAT IT. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. GLICK.

MS. GLICK: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

I KNOW THAT WE'VE SPENT A GREAT DEAL OF TIME ON THIS

ISSUE AND PEOPLE MIGHT SAY WE'RE NEAR THE END OF SESSION AND WHY,

WHY ARE WE GOING ON ABOUT THIS ISSUE, AND I HAVE TO SAY, WE'VE

DISCUSSED THIS IN THE PAST AND WE SHOULD BE BEYOND THIS AT -- AT THIS

POINT. WE SHOULD HAVE A TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION, WE

SHOULD BE ABLE TO HEAR THE TRUTH AND UNDERSTAND OUR OWN HISTORY AND

THE PAIN THAT HAS BEEN EXPERIENCED BY A SIGNIFICANT PART OF OUR

POPULATION. AND IT -- THE CIVIL WAR, IF YOU FOLLOW HISTORY, THE CIVIL

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WAR WAS JUST UNBELIEVABLY BRUTAL, BUT IT WAS FOUGHT BECAUSE SLAVERY

WAS IMMORAL AND EVIL. AND AFTER THE WAR AND MAYBE THINGS MIGHT

HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT IF THE LOSERS WOULD HAVE ACCEPTED THAT LOSS, BUT

THEY DIDN'T. AND SO INSTANTLY, WE WOUND UP WITH AN ATTEMPT TO REBUILD

THE SAME SYSTEM OF OPPRESSION. AND AS A FEMINIST, WE LOOK BACK AT

WHEN WOMEN GOT THE VOTE AND WE CELEBRATE THAT, IT WAS IN 1919 AND IT

WAS WONDERFUL. WELL, IN 1921 THE TULSA GREENWOOD MASSACRE

OCCURRED. THAT'S NOT ANCIENT HISTORY. THAT WAS WHITE PEOPLE IN

OKLAHOMA DECIDING THAT BLACK PEOPLE HAD TOO MUCH AND THEY DECIDED

THEY WERE GOING TO DESTROY THEIR COMMUNITY AND KILL A BUNCH OF BLACK

PEOPLE. THAT IS NOT ANCIENT HISTORY.

AFTER WORLD WAR II, PEOPLE -- VETERANS, WERE GIVEN AN

OPPORTUNITY THROUGH THE GI BILL AND THROUGH MORTGAGE, ACCESS TO

MORTGAGE SUPPORT. THAT REALLY ONLY WENT, PRETTY MUCH, THE MORTGAGE

SUPPORT AND THE HOUSING SUPPORT PRETTY MUCH WENT TO WHITE VETERANS.

AND I REMEMBER LISTENING TO CHARLIE WRANGLE SAY, HE WENT UP TO THE --

AFTER HE SERVED IN THE KOREAN WAR, HE WENT UP TO GET SOME SUPPORT

FROM THE VETERANS' ADMINISTRATION AND THEY SUGGESTED HE COULD BE A

TAXI DRIVER. AND HE SAID I WANT TO GO -- I WANT TO GO TO COLLEGE AND I

WANT TO GO TO LAW SCHOOL, AND I WANT TO BE A LAWYER. BUT THEY WERE

LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT? BEING A TAXI DRIVER IS A GOOD JOB AND A SOLID

MIDDLE-CLASS JOB. AND HE SAID, YOU KNOW, I ACTUALLY THINK I'D LIKE TO

GO TO COLLEGE AND I'D THINK I'D LIKE TO GO TO LAW SCHOOL, AND HE

PERSEVERED AND OF COURSE HE BECAME A MEMBER OF CONGRESS. BUT I

DON'T KNOW THAT SOMEONE SIMILARLY SITUATED WHO HAD SAID, YOU KNOW

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

I'D LIKE TO GO TO COLLEGE, WOULD HAVE BEEN TOLD, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE BETTER

OFF BEING A CAB DRIVER.

AND I THINK THE OPERATIVE WORD THAT I KEPT HEARING

THROUGH THE -- THE AFTERNOON WAS WHEN MY PEOPLE CAME HERE, CAME.

THEY CHOSE. THEY MAY HAVE COME, THEY MAY HAVE FELT BETTER, I WALK

ACROSS RUSSIA AND WALK ACROSS EUROPE AND GET IN A REALLY DIRTY, CRAPPY

BOAT SOMEHOW AND COME OVER HERE AND BE TREATED PRETTY CRAPPILY,

WHETHER THEY WERE IRISH OR JEWISH OR WHATEVER. AND THEY HAVE FACED

DISCRIMINATION OF A SORT FOR AWHILE. BUT THEY WEREN'T, AS OTHER

COLLEAGUES HAVE POINTED OUT, CHAINED IN THE BASE OF THE BOAT AND

STRIPPED OF THEIR HUMANITY. SO -- AND, AND IN FACT, YOU KNOW, IN THE

LAST CENTURY, YES, PEOPLE WERE STRIPPED OF THEIR HUMANITY IN THE

HOLOCAUST, AND GERMANY HAS SPENT A LONG TIME TRYING TO MAKE UP FOR

THAT. AND, THEY HAVE SOUGHT TO PROVIDE FAMILIES WITH THE STOLEN GOODS

THAT WERE TAKEN BY THE NAZIS. AND THAT HAS BEEN -- THAT REPARATION HAS

BEEN ONGOING. AND I DON'T THINK ANYBODY OBJECTS TO THAT. AND I DON'T

WANT US TO OBJECT TO A TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION CONVERSATION SO THAT WE

CAN FIGURE OUT HOW FINALLY THIS COUNTRY CAN MOVE FORWARD, CAN MOVE

PAST AND CAN PURGE ITSELF OF THE SIN OF SLAVERY THAT WE SEE REPEATED

THROUGH OUR NOT THAT DISTANT HISTORY. AND FRANKLY, I'M OFFENDED WHEN I

SEE CONFEDERATE FLAGS, I'M OUTRAGED. AND PEOPLE WHO -- YOU KNOW I

SAID THE OTHER DAY IN RELATION TO THE LGBTQ COMMUNITY, THAT WE

SHOULDN'T BE THE ONLY ONES TO STAND UP AND SAY THAT ATTACKS ON MY

COMMUNITY IS WRONG. SO I FEEL THAT OBLIGATION TO STAND UP FOR OTHER

COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE BEEN WRONGED, AND CONTINUE TO BE WRONGED.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AND I DON'T UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, I'M A NEW YORKER, THE NORTH FOUGHT

AGAINST SLAVERY, WE HAD STOPPED SLAVERY, ALREADY, SORT OF, BUT IN EVERY

LITTLE TOWN UPSTATE, THERE'S A -- THERE'S A MONUMENT TO PEOPLE WHO

FOUGHT IN THE CIVIL WAR, SOMETIMES AND SOME OF THE OLDER, IT MAY BE A

REVOLUTIONARY WAR, BUT THERE IS A MONUMENT TO PEOPLE WHO SERVED IN

THE WAR, THE CIVIL WAR, THE FIRST WORLD WAR, THE SECOND WORLD WAR. I

DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW PEOPLE WHO GO TO THE TOWN SQUARE AREN'T

OFFENDED BY THEIR NEIGHBORS WHO FLY A CONFEDERATE FLAG WHEN THEIR

ANTECEDENTS DIED FIGHTING AGAINST SLAVERY. I DON'T GET THAT.

SO I BELIEVE IN MY HEART THAT THIS IS A MODEST

APPROACH, A REASONABLE AND A MODEST APPROACH FOR EVERYONE TO HAVE

THEIR SAY. I DON'T NEED TO PICK WHO'S ON THE COMMISSION. I BELIEVE IT'S

AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE COMMISSION TO HEAR FROM EVERYBODY REGARDLESS

OF WHETHER THEY'RE LEFT, RIGHT, GAY, STRAIGHT, BLACK, WHITE, OR ANY OTHER

SHADE. PEOPLE WILL BE ABLE TO HAVE THEIR SAY, BUT IN THE END, WE MUST

MOVE PAST THIS BECAUSE WE CAN'T LEAVE THIS FOR THE NEXT GENERATION TO

CONTINUE WHAT HAS GONE BEFORE BECAUSE IT IS A MORAL IMPERATIVE THAT

WE CHANGE THE COURSE OF OUR SOCIETY ONCE AND FOR ALL. OTHER COUNTRIES

HAVE DONE THIS, IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE. IT JUST REQUIRES PEOPLE TO

UNDERSTAND THAT IT DOESN'T TAKE ANYTHING AWAY FROM YOU, DOESN'T TAKE

ANYTHING AWAY FROM YOU TO FACE TRUTH AND TO HEAL FROM THE EVIL OF OUR

HISTORY. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

READ THE LAST SECTION.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: A PARTY VOTE HAS

BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED, BUT WE DO HAVE MEMBERS THAT WILL BE

SUPPORTING IT AND WILL BE VOTING HERE ON THE FLOOR IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL.

THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF THIS VERY,

VERY POSITIVE PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE SOME

EXCEPTIONS. IF THEY CHOOSE TO DO SO, THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE TO DO SO AT

THEIR SEAT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. BROOK-KRASNY TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. BROOK-KRASNY: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I

KNOW IT'S GOING TO BE 2 O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ONE MINUTE. PLEASE,

GENTLEMEN.

MR. BROOK-KRASNY: ONE MINUTE, YES. ONE

MINUTE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: GENTLEMEN.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. BROOK-KRASNY: I'M GOING TO BE VERY

CONCISE. I CAME HERE 35 YEARS AGO FROM THE OTHER SIDE OF THE GLOBE.

SO I CANNOT BE A PART OF THE PROBLEM THAT WE'RE DISCUSSING HERE ALL DAY

LONG. BUT I WANT TO BE A PART OF THE SOLUTION, BUT I CAN'T BE BECAUSE I'M

A MEMBER OF THE MINORITY AND THIS IS A PARTISAN BILL. MR. SPEAKER, I

STRONGLY BELIEVE THAT PARTISAN BILLS WON'T BE ABLE TO MOVE OUR STATE

FORWARD. I WILL VOTE FOR THIS COMMISSION BUT THIS COMMISSION WILL

BECOME A BIPARTISAN COMMISSION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. BROOK-KRASNY IN

THE NEGATIVE.

MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. FIRST AND

FOREMOST, I WANT TO THANK MY COLLEAGUES ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE FOR

THIS DEBATE, WHICH HAS BEEN RESPECTFUL, EVEN THOUGH WE SOMETIMES

HAVE VERY, VERY STRONG FEELINGS. AND IT IS A TRIBUTE TO THIS LEGISLATURE

THAT WE CAN HAVE A THOUGHTFUL AND RESPECTFUL DISCUSSION AND DEBATE ON

A DIFFICULT ISSUE. FOR THAT, I AM VERY THANKFUL.

SECOND, I WANTED TO FOCUS ON WHERE WE HAVE, I THINK,

CERTAINLY BIPARTISAN AND I THINK UNANIMOUS AGREEMENT. EVERYONE IN

THIS CHAMBER ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE, AT LEAST I THINK, ARE FULLY

COMMITTED TO ENSURING THAT EVERY NEW YORKER HAS A FAIR AND EQUAL

OPPORTUNITY TO SUCCEED IN LIFE, TO MAXIMIZE THEIR HUMAN POTENTIAL.

AND I KNOW THAT ALL OF US ARE COMMITTED TO ENSURING THAT AS WE MOVE

FORWARD THAT WE ADDRESS IN A STRONG AND COMPASSIONATE WAY ANY

IMPEDIMENTS TO ANYONE ACHIEVING THEIR MAXIMUM POTENTIAL. THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CONCERN THAT I AND SOME OTHERS HAVE IS THAT THIS BILL FOCUSES IN PART ON

WHAT WE CAN DO MOVING FORWARD, FOR WHICH I HAVE COMPLETE SUPPORT.

BUT IN PART, IN LOOKING BACKWARDS. AND I SUPPORT LOOKING BACKWARDS

TO THE EXTENT IT HELPS US UNDERSTAND HOW WE NEED TO MOVE FORWARD, BUT

OUR FOCUS SHOULD ALWAYS BE FORWARD. AND THE CALL FOR REPARATIONS

CREATES THAT CHALLENGE FOR SEVERAL OF US.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, AND AGAIN, THANK YOU TO ALL

MY COLLEAGUES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

NEGATIVE.

MR. STECK TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. STECK: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

AS A CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY, I MUST STATE THAT THE CONCEPT OF REPARATIONS

IS WELL ESTABLISHED IN INTERNATIONAL LAW. GERMANY PAYS REPARATIONS TO

JEWISH VICTIMS OF THE HOLOCAUST. IN ARGENTINA, REPARATIONS ARE PAID TO

VICTIMS OF THE MILITARY DICTATORSHIP. THOSE ARE JUST TWO EXAMPLES. IT IS

IMPORTANT NOT TO BLOW THIS BILL OUT OF PROPORTION FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES.

THIS SHOULD BE A STUDY OF REPARATIONS FOR VICTIMS OF NEW YORK SLAVERY,

NOT A STUDY OF REPARATIONS FOR ALL VICTIMS OF SLAVERY EVERYWHERE IN THE

UNITED STATES OR THE WESTERN HEMISPHERE. WE ALSO HAVE TO EXAMINE

HOW WE ARE TREATING NATIVE AMERICANS WHO ARE VICTIMS OF GENOCIDE

AND INTENSE DISCRIMINATION.

HISTORY UNFORTUNATELY IS UGLY. WE ONLY HAVE TO LOOK

AT UKRAINE TO KNOW THAT. PERSONALLY, I BELIEVE THE BEST WAY TO DEAL

WITH THESE ISSUES IS NEW DEAL-TYPE SOCIAL DEMOCRATIC PROGRAMS THAT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BENEFIT ALL OUR CITIZENS NOW AND IN THE FUTURE. I VERY MUCH LOOK

FORWARD TO THAT DAY BECAUSE AS MARTIN LUTHER KING SAID, EQUAL

OPPORTUNITY IS NOT ENOUGH. INTERNATIONAL LAW FAVORS THIS BILL, AND I

VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. STECK IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. SHIMSKY TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. SHIMSKY: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. AS A PHD

IN HISTORY I'D BE GUILTY OF PROFESSIONAL MALPRACTICE IF I DID NOT STAND UP

ON THIS ONE. CULTURES AND ASPECTS THEREOF SURVIVE THROUGH GENERATIONS.

BLACK CHATTEL SLAVERY CREATED AN UNPARALLEL LEVEL OF INSTITUTIONAL

DEHUMANIZATION OVER MULTI-GENERATIONAL PERIODS OF TIME. BUT JUST AS

MONSTROUS WAS THE METASTIZATION OF THOSE ATTITUDES INTO THE WHITE

SUPREMACY THAT HAS SURVIVED TODAY. EVEN IF OUR ANCESTORS WERE NOT

HERE FOR SLAVERY, OUR ANCESTORS WERE HERE FOR THIS, AND MANY OF OUR

ANCESTORS TOOK PART AND BENEFITTED FROM IT. AND IF MY COLLEAGUES WHO

TESTIFIED FIRSTHAND OF THE MANY, MANY, DIFFERENT WAYS THAT RACISM STILL

EFFECTS INDIVIDUALS AND THE SOCIETY TODAY, PEOPLE SHOULD GO BACK AND

LOOK AT THE BLACK MATERNAL HEALTH RESOLUTION DISCUSSION FROM SEVERAL

WEEKS AGO, IF THEY HAVE THE STOMACH TO DO IT. IF I'M NOT COMPETENT TO

TALK FIRSTHAND ABOUT THOSE THINGS, I CAN REFER TO TODAY'S EFFORTS TO CREATE

NEW GENERATIONS OF RACISTS BY ATTEMPTING TO CONCEAL THE HISTORY AND THE

CURRENT EVENTS WE TALKED ABOUT TODAY. AND TO TALK ABOUT A RECENT

PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES WHO TRIED HIS DAMNDEST AND SUCCEEDED

TO A LARGE EXTENT TO MAKE RACISM AND OTHER FORMS OF BIGOTRY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FASHIONABLE. WE HAVE A LOT TO UNRAVEL IN THIS COUNTRY BUT UNRAVEL IT WE

MUST TO MAKE THE LIVES OF MILLIONS OF OUR NEIGHBORS BETTER AND TO OUR

MAKE OUR SOCIETY BETTER. THIS LEGISLATION AS IT'S BEEN SAID, EVERYBODY

CAN NITPICK, BUT THIS LEGISLATION IS A GOOD START AND I AM PROUD OF THIS

STATE FOR MOVING FORWARD WITH IT. I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SHIMSKY IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. MAHER.

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I RISE TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I AM NOT BLACK, BUT I HAVE A PERSPECTIVE AND I HAVE A

STORY. I AM THE SON OF AN AMAZING MOTHER WHO AT THE AGE OF FIVE CAME

TO THE BRONX FROM PUERTO RICO WITH MY GRANDMOTHER WHO REALLY COULD

BARELY SPEAK ENGLISH AND STILL HAS A TOUGH TIME. MY MOTHER MOVED US

AND MY FIVE BROTHERS AND SISTERS UP WHEN I WAS SIX MONTHS OLD TO

BALDWIN, TOWN OF MONTGOMERY, UPSTATE NEW YORK. SHE WAS ONE OF

THE FIRST HISPANICS, PEOPLE OF COLOR TO -- TO MOVE UP THERE. AND AS A

YOUNG PERSON, I REMEMBER MY MOTHER BEING TREATED A CERTAIN WAY FOR

THE WAY THAT SHE LOOKED AND THE WAY THAT SHE TALKED. AND I

SPECIFICALLY REMEMBER THE LOOK ON A PERSON'S FACE; IT WAS A SMIRK, IT

WAS A TREATMENT AND MY MOTHER HAD SUCH AN EMBARRASSED LOOK ON HER

FACE, AND AS A YOUNG PERSON YOU DON'T REALLY GET IT. WHEN YOU GET

OLDER, YOU START TO. BUT THE ONE THING I NEVER FORGOT WAS HOW ANGRY

THAT MADE ME, AND THAT ANGER IS SOMETHING THAT ALWAYS OVERCAME ME

AND THAT WAS MY PERSPECTIVE. I BELIEVE THAT THIS ABSOLUTELY SHOULD

HAVE BIPARTISAN REPRESENTATION WHETHER WE HAVE A REPRESENTATIVE ON

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OUR SIDE OF THE AISLE THAT IS A PERSON OF COLOR OR NOT. I THINK THAT

PERSPECTIVE IS IMPORTANT IN TERMS OF THE INFORMATION THAT WE NEED TO

COLLECT AS PART OF THIS COMMISSION. MY VOTE TODAY ISN'T SPECIFICALLY

BECAUSE I BELIEVE EVERY SINGLE THING HERE IN THIS BILL, BUT REALLY IT'S AN

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT. THE SPONSOR OF THE BILL USED THAT WORD, SO THANK

YOU FOR YOUR ACKNOWLEDGEMENT TO ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES. AND ONE

THING THAT I HAVE LEARNED FROM THE BLACK COMMUNITY THAT I REPRESENT

HERE IN THE NEW YORK STATE ASSEMBLY IS THAT THEY APPRECIATE THAT.

AND I JUST WANT TO END BY SAYING OUR MAJORITY LEADER SAID SOMETHING

THAT REALLY STRUCK ME, AND I REALLY APPRECIATE IT SO MUCH ON WHAT ONE OF

MY COLLEAGUES HAD TO SAY, SHE SAID OUR FOUNDING FATHERS MAYBE

COULDN'T HAVE IMAGINED THAT SHE'D BE HERE TODAY, BUT I'D LIKE TO BELIEVE

THAT SOME OF THEM VERY MUCH DID AND THAT'S HOW GREAT OUR COUNTRY HAS

THE POTENTIAL OF BEING. SO MY VOTE TODAY IS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE AND I

WILL SUPPORT THIS NOT BECAUSE IT'S PERFECT, BUT BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT WE

NEED TO CONFRONT THIS PROBLEM AND NOT LEAD WITH FEAR --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. -- MR. MAHER --

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER: MR. MAHER IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

THANK YOU.

MR. ANGELINO TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. ANGELINO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. AND IF EVER A VOTE NEEDED AN EXPLANATION THIS IS THE

ONE. THE -- THE REASON THAT I CAN'T SUPPORT THIS IS BECAUSE IT DOESN'T

INCLUDE A MINORITY APPOINTMENT FROM THIS SIDE OF THE AISLE. THE WORD

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COMMUNITY IS RIGHT IN THE TITLE OF THE -- THE -- THE ACT THAT WE'RE VOTING

ON TODAY, AND THE -- THE COMMUNITY AS A WHOLE SHOULD BE INCLUDED IN

THIS. AND WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COMMUNITIES, THE COMMUNITY I

LIVE IN HAS A PARTICULARLY NICE BLACK FAMILY, A BEAUTIFUL BLACK FAMILY;

IT'S A MOM, IT'S TWO DAUGHTERS AND A SON. THERE IS NO DAD BECAUSE MY

BROTHER DIED. AND IF YOU DON'T THINK BEING A POLICE OFFICER IN A SMALL

TOWN WITH BLACK RELATIVES DIDN'T CROSS PATHS, YOU GOT ANOTHER THING

COMING, BECAUSE I KNOW OFFICERS WERE OUT THERE AND MY NIECES AND

NEPHEWS WOULD TELL ME. AND I THINK THERE WAS A FEW SHOCKED FACES ON

A POLICE OFFICER WHEN WE LOOKED AT SOMEBODY'S ID AND IT MATCHED THEIR

BOSS'S NAME. I THINK IT'S A MISTAKE TO NOT HAVE SOMEBODY FROM THE

MINORITY PARTY REPRESENTED OR AN APPOINTMENT TO THIS COMMISSION.

YOU DON'T KNOW WHO YOU'RE GOING TO GET, YOU MIGHT GET SOMEBODY

VERY OPEN-MINDED AND I WOULD ASK THAT BEFORE THE COMMISSION IS

APPOINTED TO CONSIDER THIS. BUT FOR RIGHT NOW, I WOULD LIKE TO SUPPORT

THIS, BUT I DON'T THINK YOU'RE GETTING THE WHOLE COMMUNITY'S INPUT INTO

THIS. SO I'LL BE VOTING NO. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. ANGELINO IN THE

NEGATIVE.

MR. LAVINE.

MR. LAVINE: SO LET ME -- LET ME CORRECT THE RECORD

WITH RESPECT TO TWO IMPORTANT FACTORS. THE BILL DOES NOT PRECLUDE THE

APPOINTMENT OF PEOPLE TO THE COMMISSION WHO ARE NOT DEMOCRATS. IT

DOES NOT. SECONDLY, SEVERAL HAVE REFERENCED THE CIVIL WAR, THAT THE

CIVIL WAR WAS FOUGHT TO END SLAVERY. THAT'S NOT THE WAY THE CIVIL WAR

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BEGAN. THE CIVIL WAR BEGAN BECAUSE SOUTH CAROLINIANS HAD FIRED ON

FORT SUMPTER AND BECAUSE SOUTHERN STATES DECIDED TO SECEDE. WHEN

LINCOLN WAS FIRST INAUGURATED, HE SPOKE OF THE MYSTIC CHORDS OF

MEMORY, MEANING EMOTIONAL RESPONSES THAT PEOPLE HAVE. THE WAR

WAS ALREADY RAGING AT THAT TIME. I'VE HEARD A LOT OF DEBATES ON THIS

FLOOR. I DON'T THINK I HAVE EVER HEARD PEOPLE ADVOCATE FOR A BILL.

PEOPLE WHOSE FAMILIES HAD SUFFERED. I HAVE NEVER HEARD PEOPLE

ADVOCATE WITH A GREATER SENSE OF GRACE. I'M GOING TO BE VERY HONORED

TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL, ESPECIALLY AT A TIME WHEN SOME OF OUR

SISTER STATES, WHEN IT'S TEXAS, WHEN IT'S FLORIDA, CAN'T EVEN TEACH

RECONSTRUCTION IN THOSE STATES ANYMORE AND THERE ARE MORE AND MORE

BILLS BEING OFFERED IN STATE LEGISLATURES THAT ROB US NOT SIMPLY, NOT ONLY

OF WHAT WE WOULD CONSIDER BLACK HISTORY, THIS IS AMERICAN HISTORY, IT

IS THE HISTORY OF ALL OF US.

(APPLAUSE)

AND WE BETTER STAND UP AND THAT'S WHY I AM HAPPY

AND HONORED TO VOTE FOR THIS BILL. AND AGAIN, TO ALL THE ADVOCATES, I

HAVE NEVER EVER HEARD MORE GRACE EXHIBITED IN THIS ROOM. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. LAVINE IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. CHANDLER-WATERMAN.

MS. CHANDLER-WATERMAN: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER, FOR ALLOWING ME TO SPEAK ON THIS BILL TODAY. THANK YOU TO THE

SPONSOR ON THIS BILL. WE ARE OUR ANCESTORS WILDEST DREAMS. OUR

ANCESTORS ARE WATCHING DOWN AND THEIR BLESSINGS GUIDE US AS WE DO THE

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PEOPLE'S WORK. I AM SO HONORED TO STAND HERE WITH MY COLLEAGUES THAT

ARTICULATED VERY WELL THE SENTIMENTS OF OUR PEOPLE'S STRUGGLE AND

CONTINUED STRUGGLE. I STAND WITH MY FELLOW COLLEAGUES TO ACKNOWLEDGE

A CONVERSATION THAT'S TOUGH TO THOSE ONLY THAT DO NOT WANT TO HAVE THE

CONVERSATION. THE FUNDAMENTAL INJUSTICE, CRUELTY, BRUTALITY IN

HUMANITY OF SLAVERY IN THE CITY OF NEW YORK AND THE STATE OF NEW

YORK HAS HAD A GENERATIONAL LEGACY WHICH HAVE HAD A DEVASTATING

IMPACT ON OUR HOUSING, EDUCATION, FOOD DISPARITIES, CRIMINAL JUSTICE

SYSTEM AND OUR EVERYDAY LIVES. WE HAVE A CHANCE TO ACQUIRE WHAT'S

RIGHTFULLY OURS. AS LEGISLATORS WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO CREATE A

DISCOURSE OF CHANGE FOR THE BETTER. THIS BILL IS TO FORM A COMMISSION

OF REPARATION TO EXAMINE THE INSTITUTION OF SLAVERY AND THE INJUSTICE AND

HUMANITY OF OUR PEOPLE. THIS BILL I AGREE IS NOT PERFECT, BUT WE NEED TO

START SOMEWHERE. HAD IT NOT BEEN FOR THE STRENGTH OF OUR ANCESTORS, I

WOULD NOT BE SITTING HERE TODAY IN THE PEOPLE'S HOUSE AS THE FIRST BLACK

WOMAN TO REPRESENT DISTRICT 58. I STAND IN THE AFFIRMATIVE NOT ONLY FOR

THE SAKE OF THOSE HERE, BUT FOR MY CHILDREN AND MY CHILDREN'S CHILDREN.

I END WITH THIS, SANKOFA: IN ORDER TO MOVE FORWARD, WE HAVE TO

ADDRESS THE PAST. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU. MS.

CHANDLER-WATERMAN IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. EPSTEIN.

MR. EPSTEIN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I RISE TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. YOU KNOW, I'M PROUD TO COSPONSOR THIS BILL AND TO

UNDERSTAND OUR HISTORY AND THE WORLD WE HAVE TO REALLY REVIEW IT,

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

UNDERSTAND IT AND HOLD -- HOLD OURSELVES ACCOUNTABLE, AND THAT'S ALL THIS

BILL IS DOING. NOW OBVIOUSLY THE HISTORY OF SLAVERY IS SOMETHING THAT

WE ALL KNOW. THE ISSUES OF SLAVERY AND JIM CROW CONTINUE TO EXIST IN

OUR SOCIETY TODAY AND IT'S OUR OBLIGATION AS NEW YORKERS TO REALLY

DELVE INTO THIS AND FIGURE OUT WHAT OUR RESPONSIBILITY IS GOING FORWARD.

I WANT TO APPLAUD THE SPONSOR FOR HER LEADERSHIP AND EXCITED TO VOTE IN

FAVOR OF THIS BILL AND LOOK FORWARD TO THE REPORT THAT COMES BACK FROM

THE COMMISSION TO FORCE NEW YORK TO DO WHAT'S RIGHT TO DEAL WITH THE

HISTORY AND THE ABOMINATION OF SLAVERY IN OUR STATE AND IN OUR COUNTRY.

I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. EPSTEIN IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. HYNDMAN.

MS. HYNDMAN: MR. SPEAKER, THANK YOU FOR

ALLOWING ME TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. WITH ALL THE REASONS THAT HAVE BEEN

SAID IN THIS CHAMBER TODAY, I JUST WANT TO BE MINDFUL THAT WE ARE

DEALING WITH ATTACKS ON COLLEGE ADMISSION, BANNING OF BOOKS, BANNING

OF CURRICULAR ACROSS THIS COUNTRY AND SO I REALLY HOPE THAT MY

COLLEAGUES WHO ARE OPPOSED TO THIS ARE THE SAME ONES WHO WILL STAND

UP IN ROOMS ALL OVER THIS STATE AND PUSH BACK AGAINST NARRATIVES THAT DO

NOT EDIFY THIS BODY AS THEY CLAIM.

SO TO THE SPONSOR, I THANK YOU FOR THIS COMMISSION

BECAUSE HISTORY WILL ONLY WILL REPEAT ITSELF IF WE DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT

REAL HISTORY LOOKS LIKE IN THIS COUNTRY, IN THIS STATE. SO WITH THAT, I

WITHDRAW MY REQUEST AND VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. HYNDMAN IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. NOVAKHOV.

MR. NOVAKHOV: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. TODAY

IS MY 60TH DAY IN THIS ASSEMBLY AND IT HAS BEEN THE MOST DIFFICULT AND

THE MOST EMOTIONAL ONE. FIRST OF ALL, I WOULD LIKE TO THANK EVERYONE

WHO SPOKE TODAY ON THIS BILL. AGAIN, IT WAS VERY EMOTIONAL AND, YOU

KNOW ONCE I -- I'M A JEWISH AND JEWISH PEOPLE WAS IN SLAVERY FOR 210

YEARS IN EGYPT, FOR 210 YEARS. I JUST WOULD LIKE TO ASK MY COLLEAGUES

WHEN YOU WILL BE FORMING THE COMMISSION, I THINK THERE'S SOME PEOPLE

FROM THIS SIDE OF THE AISLE WHO DESERVE TO BE IN THIS COMMISSION

BECAUSE SLAVERY AND HATE AND IT DOESN'T HAVE A COLOR, IT DOESN'T HAVE A

COLOR, REALLY. THANK YOU SO MUCH. I'M IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SEPTIMO TO

EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. SEPTIMO: THANK YOU. FIRST, I WOULD LIKE TO

COMMEND THE SPONSOR AND THE SPEAKER FOR THE HERCULEAN EFFORT THAT HAS

GONE INTO BRINGING THIS BILL TO THE FLOOR AND TO A VOTE AND TO PASSING

THIS INCREDIBLE PIECE OF LEGISLATION THAT IS REALLY ABOUT THE FUTURE OF

NEW YORK. WE'VE HEARD SO MUCH ABOUT THE PAST AND WHY THIS BILL IS

IMPORTANT AND SO MANY OF THE WRONGS THAT WE ARE LOOKING TO CORRECT BY

STUDYING THE EFFECTS OF SLAVERY. BUT WE HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT THE

IMPORTANCE OF THIS LEGISLATION IS THAT IT IS CHARTING THE FUTURE OF NEW

YORK IN THAT IT IS SAYING WE WILL NOT BE A PLACE WHERE WE RUN FROM

RESPONSIBILITY, INSTEAD WE WILL RUN TOWARDS IT. WE WILL ACKNOWLEDGE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HARM CAUSED TO THE BLACK COMMUNITY HISTORICALLY AND WE WILL SEEK TO

RECTIFY IT BECAUSE NEW YORK IS A STATE MADE UP OF LEADERS. AND THE

PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM ARE COMMITTED TO LEADING OUR COMMUNITIES

FORWARD IN A WAY THAT IS GENUINELY COMMITTED TO LEVELING THE PLAYING

FIELD FOR ALL COMMUNITIES. IN A WAY THAT RECOGNIZES THAT YOU WILL NEVER

LEVEL A PLAYING FIELD IF YOU DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE THE HARM THAT HAS BEEN

INFLICTED ON THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND CONTINUES TO BE INFLICTED

THROUGH THE VESTIGES OF SLAVERY LIKE MASS INCARCERATION, LIKE POLICE

BRUTALITY, LIKE REDLINING AND SO MANY OTHER THINGS THAT WE'VE HEARD

ABOUT TODAY. SO I WANT TO THANK EVERY SINGLE ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES FOR

PARTICIPATING IN THIS INCREDIBLY SPECIAL MOMENT AND I HOPE THAT THE REST

OF OUR COLLEAGUES WILL JOIN US ON WHAT WILL BE A LONG JOURNEY IN

MAKING SURE THAT WE ENSURE THAT NEW YORK IS STANDING FOR JUSTICE AND

FOR RESTORATION OF DIGNITY AND RESPECT TO A COMMUNITY THAT HAS BEEN

DENIED IT FOR SO LONG. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SEPTIMO IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. GALLAHAN.

MR. GALLAHAN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR

ALLOWING ME TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUES BEHIND

ME ABOUT THE REPRESENTATION ON THIS COMMISSION. AND SINCE I'VE BEEN

IN THIS CHAMBER, EVERY TIME THAT SOMETHING COMES UP FOR A VOTE, A BILL

AND IT DOES NOT INCLUDE AN APPOINTMENT FROM THE MINORITY, I AM ALWAYS

IN THE NEGATIVE, BUT I'VE TALKED TO SEVERAL OF MY COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER

SIDE OF THE AISLE ABOUT THIS AND A COUPLE TIMES IT'S BEEN CHANGED AND I

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VOTED IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. AND WE COULD STOP ALL THIS IF YOU WOULD BRING

MY BILL TO THE FLOOR. BILL 3207 REQUIRES APPOINTEES OF THE MINORITY

LEADER OF THE SENATE AND THE MINORITY LEADER OF THE ASSEMBLY TO BE

INCLUDED IN ALL LEGISLATIVELY-ENACTED WORKGROUPS, TASK FORCES,

COMMISSIONS AND COMMITTEES. I HAVE TO DISAGREE WITH ONE OF MY

COLLEAGUES. THERE ARE NO APPOINTMENTS AVAILABLE HERE FROM -- FROM THE

MINORITY. THERE'S THREE APPOINTMENTS BY THE GOVERNOR, THERE'S THREE

APPOINTMENTS BY THE SPEAKER OF THE ASSEMBLY AND THREE APPOINTMENTS

BY THE TEMPORARY PRESIDENT OF THE SENATE. I'M NOT SAYING YOU HAVE TO

PUT A REPUBLICAN IN, BUT LET OUR SIDE DETERMINE WHO SHOULD BE THERE

AND GIVE US THAT OPPORTUNITY, GIVE THE MINORITY THAT OPPORTUNITY.

THEREFORE, I WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. MEEKS TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. MEEKS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR THE

OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. EVERY SO OFTEN I FIND MYSELF REACHING

BACK IN HISTORY AND LOOKING FOR A SENSE OF MOTIVATION, SOMETIMES THAT

COMES BY WAY OF CARTER G. WOODSON AND READING THE MIS-EDUCATION

OF THE NEGRO. AND JUST HERE EARLIER THIS WEEK I DECIDED TO PICK UP A

BOOK, THE NARRATIVE OF FREDERICK DOUGLASS [SIC]. AND IN THIS BOOK, IT

SAYS, FAMILIES TRAPPED IN POVERTY AND SYSTEMIC INJUSTICES. CHILDREN

DENIED CIVIL RIGHTS BECAUSE OF RACE. A NATION WITH IMMENSE POTENTIAL

FOR FREEDOM SPIRALING INTO PREJUDICE, VIOLENCE AND HATE. THE COUNTRY

FREDERICK DOUGLASS KNEW OVER ONE HUNDRED YEARS AGO IS STRIKINGLY

SIMILAR TO THE ONE WE LIVE IN TODAY. THE TRUTH LESSONS AND HOPE HE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OFFERED DURING HIS REMARKABLE LIFETIME NOT ONLY HELPED SHAPE ABRAHAM

LINCOLN'S PRESIDENCY AND THE AMERICAN CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT, THEY

CAN GUIDE AND INSPIRE US IN OUR OWN CULTURAL MOVEMENT. BORN INTO

SLAVERY IN 1818, DOUGLASS ESCAPED TO NEW YORK CITY AT THE AGE OF 20

DETERMINED TO TELL HIS STORY AND FIGHT FOR THE RIGHTS OF ALL MEN AND

WOMEN TO BE FREE.

MR. SPEAKER, I STAND HERE TODAY AS A MODERN DAY

ABOLITIONIST, CONTINUE, COMMITTED TO THE FIGHT AGAINST SLAVERY. MR.

SPEAKER, I STAND HERE TODAY AS AN ASYLUM SEEKER, SIMILAR TO MY

ANCESTORS WHO FLED THE SOUTH FROM TERRORISM, FIGHTING, FLEEING FOR THEIR

LIVES AND FOR THE FUTURE OF FUTURE GENERATIONS. AND WHY I SAY I STAND AS

AN ASYLUM SEEKER, BECAUSE I'M STILL SEEKING THAT SENSE OF SANCTUARY IN

MY COMMUNITY AND THE STATE OF NEW YORK. I FEEL THIS LEGISLATION IS A

START FOR US TO TAKE A REAL LOOK AT THE CHALLENGES THAT PRESENT THEMSELVES

FROM THE PAST AS WELL AS THE FUTURE AND, MR. SPEAKER, I VOTE IN FAVOR OF

THIS LEGISLATION. AGAIN, THANK YOU TO THE SPONSOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MR.

MEEKS.

MS. LEVENBERG.

MS. LEVENBERG: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I RISE

TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I KNOW I'VE SPOKEN ON THIS FLOOR BEFORE TO SPEAK

ABOUT THAT I AM THE CHILD OF HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS. AND IN FACT, MY

GRANDPARENTS WERE GERMAN AND THEY DID RECEIVE REPARATIONS. THEY

RECEIVED REPARATIONS FROM GERMANY. AND I, ACTUALLY, NOW HAVE THE

BENEFIT OF GERMAN CITIZENSHIP BECAUSE THEY ACKNOWLEDGED

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WRONGDOING AND THEY ACKNOWLEDGED THAT THEY HAD STOLEN THE BASE OF

LIFE OUT FROM UNDER THE JEWISH PEOPLE AND OTHERS DURING THE HOLOCAUST.

AND AS A RESULT, THEY WERE WILLING TO MAKE RIGHT BY WHAT THEY HAD DONE

WRONG. AND JUST AS THAT WAS THE TRUTH, I BELIEVE THAT WE NEED TO DO THE

SAME FOR THOSE THAT WE HAVE WRONGED HERE IN THIS COUNTRY AND I'M SO

PROUD TO STAND WITH SO MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES WHO WERE EITHER

DESCENDENTS OF SLAVES OR HAVE BEEN UNFORTUNATELY SUFFERED THE

CONSEQUENCES OF SLAVERY, BIGOTRY, RACISM IN THIS COUNTRY. AND WE NEED

TO DO EVERYTHING THAT WE CAN TO CORRECT THE WRONGS, TO GIVE BACK THE

BASE THAT WASN'T ABLE TO BE BUILT ON FOR THOSE WHO WERE TAKEN FROM

THEIR HOMES, RIPPED FROM THEIR BELONGINGS, BROUGHT TO THIS COUNTRY AND

FORCED TO WORK. WE HAVE A LOT MORE WORK TO DO. THIS IS ONLY THE

BEGINNING. I'M PROUD TO STAND WITH MY COLLEAGUES AND VOTING IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MA'AM.

(APPLAUSE)

MS. GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR AND THE SPEAKER AND ALL THOSE WHO

SUPPORT THIS BILL. AS A NON-BLACK LATINA OF THIS BODY, I UNDERSTAND

THAT ANTI-BLACK RACISM HARMS US ALL. AND IT IS INCUMBENT UPON US, AS

LEADERS, TO ADDRESS THE SCOURGE OF CHATTEL SLAVERY AND ITS IMPACT ON OUR

BLACK NEW YORKERS. WE MUST ACKNOWLEDGE AND ADDRESS THE

FUNDAMENTAL INJUSTICE, BRUTALITY AND INEQUITIES THAT THE STAIN OF SLAVERY

HAS LEFT ON OUR GREAT STATE OF NEW YORK. THIS BILL WILL SIMPLY CREATE A

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REPARATIONS COMMISSION THAT WILL PROVIDE THOUGHTFUL DETERMINATIONS

AND RECOMMENDATIONS AS HOW WE CAN RIGHT THESE WRONGS AND MAKE OUR

BLACK NEW YORKERS WHOLE AGAIN. I AM PROUD TO STAND IN SOLIDARITY

WITH OUR BLACK COLLEAGUES AND VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MS.

GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS.

MS. SIMON TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. SIMON: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I WANT TO

COMMEND THE SPONSOR AND ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES WHO HAVE SPOKEN SO

POWERFULLY. WE SAW AN INCREDIBLE DEMONSTRATION OF THE POWER OF

WOMEN FIGHTING ON THIS FLOOR TODAY AND I WANT TO COMMEND EVERYBODY

WHO HAVE SPOKEN IN FAVOR OF THIS LEGISLATION.

AMERICA WAS FOUNDED ON CHATTEL SLAVERY. IT IS THE

UNIQUE THING ABOUT INVOLUNTARY SERVITUDE AND INDENTURED SERVITUDE AND

VARIOUS OTHER KINDS OF SERVITUDE THAT EXIST AROUND THE WORLD AND EVEN

IN THIS COUNTRY, BUT CHATTEL SLAVERY IS UNIQUE TO AMERICA. IT WAS VERY

MUCH A PART OF NEW YORK. IT IS SOMETHING WE MUST ALL ACKNOWLEDGE,

MUST ALL RESPECT AND WE MUST ALL WORK TOGETHER TO ENSURE THAT THERE IS

IN FACT REPARATIONS. SO I'M VERY HONORED TO VOTE IN SUPPORT OF THIS BILL.

THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SIMON IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. MAMDANI.

MR. MAMDANI: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR THE

OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I DIDN'T PLAN ON SPEAKING TODAY, BUT I

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

RISE TO RESPOND TO SOME OF THE QUESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN BROUGHT UP BY

OUR COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE AISLE. I HAVE HEARD CONCERNS

ABOUT THE QUESTION OF WHETHER AFRICAN DESCENT IS TOO BROAD AND WHAT IF

SOMEONE LIKE ELON MUSK COULD QUALIFY FOR SUCH REPARATIONS. WE NEED

NOT LOOK FURTHER THAN THIS OWN HOUSE. MY GRANDFATHER'S FAMILY CAME

TO LAMU IN KENYA IN 1890. MY GRANDMOTHER'S FAMILY CAME TO

ZANZIBAR IN 1890. I WAS BORN A SON OF THE UGANDAN SOIL IN NSAMBYA

HOSPITAL IN KAMPALA IN 1991. I AM OF AFRICAN DESCENT AND I AM NOT

BLACK. AND THAT IS NOT A SURPRISE TO ANYONE OF US HERE. AND I AM NOT

ELIGIBLE FOR ANY KIND OF REPARATIONS TIED TO THE HARMS OF SLAVERY. AND I

TRUST THAT THE COMMISSION WOULD FIND THAT SAME DETERMINATION BECAUSE

WHO IS BETTER AT DETERMINING BLACKNESS THAN THE UNITED STATES

GOVERNMENT, BECAUSE IT IS THAT GOVERNMENT THAT DETERMINED IT FROM THE

INCEPTION OF THIS COUNTRY THROUGH JIM CROW, UP UNTIL THIS POINT TO DENY

POLITICAL, SOCIAL AND ECONOMIC RIGHTS TO BLACK AMERICANS AT EVERY

SINGLE JUNCTURE. THERE WAS NO PROBLEM WITH IT FOR MANY THROUGHOUT

THE DURATION OF THAT TIME AND YET NOW WHEN IT COMES TO THE QUESTION OF

REPARATIONS, EVERYONE IS CONCERNED. I HAVE ALSO HEARD THE QUESTION OF

WHY SHOULDN'T THE MINORITY, WHICH HAS NEVER SOUNDED LIKE ANY

MINORITY I'VE MET IN MY LIFE, BE GIVEN THE ABILITY TO APPOINT MEMBERS

TO THIS COMMISSION? THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS IN FULL EMBRACE OF

DONALD TRUMP. A MAN WHO REFERRED TO MANY OF THE PLACES -- A MAN

WHO REFERRED TO MANY OF THE PLACES THAT ENSLAVED NEW YORKERS CAME

FROM AS SHIT HOLE COUNTRIES. SO WHY SHOULD THAT SAME PARTY BE ABLE TO

DETERMINE --

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: LADIES AND

GENTLEMEN, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN.

MR. MAMDANI: I DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY THAT IS SO

OBJECTIONABLE. DO YOU NOT SUPPORT THAT MAN WHO HAS SAID THESE

THINGS?

MR. GOODELL: MR. SPEAKER?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL, WHY DO

YOU RISE?

MR. GOODELL: WOULD YOU REMIND THE SPEAKER IF

HE WOULD PLEASE TO FOCUS HIS DISCUSSION ON THE BILL THAT'S IN FRONT OF US

AS OPPOSED TO UNRELATED POLITICAL COMMENTS THAT ARE INACCURATE OR

DEROGATORY. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: STAYING ON THE

BILL-IN-CHIEF, THANK YOU.

MR. MAMDANI: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. ALL THAT

I HAVE LEFT TO SAY IS MY SINCERE EXPRESSION OF GRATITUDE FOR THE SPONSOR

TODAY FOR FIGHTING TO BRING THIS LEGISLATION TO THIS POINT, FOR THE SPONSOR

THAT PRECEDED HER FOR ORIGINATING THIS LEGISLATION AND FOR ALL THOSE OF

MY COLLEAGUES WHO HAVE SUFFERED THROUGH THE INDIGNITIES OF SLAVERY

AND ITS HISTORY IN THIS COUNTRY AND WHO ARE HERE TODAY TO LEAD US TO A

FUTURE WHERE WE RECKON WITH IT, RECTIFY THOSE SAME INJUSTICES AND WE

MOVE FORWARD TO A NEW YORK FOR EVERY SINGLE PERSON HERE. THANK YOU

VERY MUCH.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MAMDANI IN THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AFFIRMATIVE.

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, IT'S A LONG DAY, IT'S A TOUGH DAY,

LET US MAINTAIN SOME DIGNITY.

MR. OTIS TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. OTIS: THANK YOU. YOU KNOW, WE COULD HAVE

DONE THIS BILL TEN YEARS AGO, 20 YEARS AGO, 50 YEARS AGO, 150 YEARS AGO.

BUT WE'RE IN A SPECIAL MOMENT IN TIME RIGHT NOW BECAUSE SOMETHING

THAT I NEVER WOULD HAVE THOUGHT WOULD BE IMAGINABLE IS GOING ON

ACROSS THIS COUNTRY TODAY WHICH IS IN OTHER STATES THE HISTORY OF SLAVERY

AS PART OF AMERICAN HISTORY, THE TRUTH OF IT, IS BEING STRIPPED FROM

HISTORY BOOKS, IS BEING STRIPPED FROM CURRICULUMS. TEACHERS ARE GOING

TO BE PUNISHED IF THEY TEACH THE TRUE HISTORY OF THIS COUNTRY. AND SO

ONE OF THE POSITIVES OF THIS COMMISSION WOULD BE NOT JUST TO TALK ABOUT

REPARATIONS IN THE GENERAL SENSE, BUT TO EDUCATE EVERYBODY ABOUT THE

CONTINUING LEGACY OF SLAVERY AND WHAT IT MEANS TODAY, HOW IT IMPACTS

PEOPLE TODAY. THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT LESSON, A VERY IMPORTANT

OPPORTUNITY.

I'D ALSO SAY THAT WHEN WE HERE IN THIS HOUSE

THROUGHOUT THE YEAR, WE WORK ON EDUCATION ISSUES, WE WORK ON

HOUSING ISSUES, WE WORK ON ISSUES RELATED TO HEALTH CARE AND SO MANY

OTHER ISSUES AND WE DO THE BEST WE CAN BUT WE'RE NOT DOING A GOOD

ENOUGH JOB IN A LOT OF AREAS THAT AFFECT PEOPLE'S LIVES. AND ONE OF THE

THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO RECOMMIT OURSELVES TO DO IS QUALITY IN TERMS OF

THE POLICIES THAT COME OUT OF HERE SO THAT WE CAN REALLY MAKE A

DIFFERENCE FOR EVERYBODY, BUT WE CERTAINLY HAVE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN SUFFERED FOR THE LEGACY OF SLAVERY AND

BIGOTRY IN THIS COUNTRY AND IN THIS STATE. SO LET'S GET THIS WORK DONE

AND I PROUDLY VOTE AYE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. OTIS IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. LUCAS TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. LUCAS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. MY

COLLEAGUES THROUGHOUT THIS DISCUSSION HAS ALREADY STARTED TALKING ABOUT

CIRCUMVENTING THE SYSTEM BY INCLUDING THEMSELVES IN THE IDEA OF

REPARATIONS. FOR THEIR BLUE-EYED CHILDREN, NO SHADE, AND THEIR

ANCESTORS WHO WERE INDENTURED SERVANTS. THAT IS THE POINT I WAS

MAKING. WE ALSO HAD SOMEONE MENTION ABOUT THEIR AFRICAN DESCENT

WHO BELIEVES THAT THEY WOULDN'T BE INCLUDED IN THE CONVERSATIONS

BECAUSE WE KNOW WHO'S BLACK. BUT IF IT'S NOT REFLECTED IN THE

LANGUAGE, THAT'S WHEN IT CAN BECOME COMPLICATED AND CONFUSING, BUT I

FEEL STRONGLY ABOUT ENSURING THAT THOSE PEOPLE WHO WERE ACTUALLY

ENSLAVED IN AMERICA WERE REPAIRED. THAT WAS MY POINT. THAT THE

ELON MUSKS OF THE WORLD DON'T CIRCUMVENT THE SYSTEM AS WE'VE SEEN

HAPPEN ON OTHER INSTANCES. BUT I AM HAPPY THAT THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL

HAS FINALLY RECOGNIZED, TODAY, ON RECORD, AND EVERYONE HAS SPOKEN

ABOUT CHATTEL SLAVERY, THAT LINEAGE-BASED HAS TO BE ALSO A FOCUS IN THIS

PARTICULAR STUDY. AND BECAUSE IT'S ON RECORD, BECAUSE IT ALLOWS US TO

SEE THE INTENTION OF THE SPONSOR, I AM GOING TO CHANGE MY NO VOTE TO A

YES. THANK YOU, SPONSOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. LUCAS IN THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. ARI BROWN TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I THINK

THIS IS LIKE A WATERSHED MOMENT FOR ALL OF US. YOU TALKED ABOUT A LOT OF

THINGS, FAIRNESS AND LOOKING AT OUR PAST, CONFRONTING OUR PAST, BUT LET'S

LOOK AT OURSELVES FOR WHAT WE ARE RIGHT NOW, RIGHT HERE. I EXPLAINED

HOW MY KIDS HAVE BLACK AFRICAN-AMERICAN IN THEM AND I HEARD

THEY'RE NOT THE SAME BECAUSE THEY HAVE BLUE EYES. WHEN MY DAUGHTER

USED TO SAY, HOW COME MY HAIR'S NOT LIKE MY SISTER? AND I SAID, BUT

YOU'RE BEAUTIFUL JUST EXACTLY THE WAY YOU ARE, THAT WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH.

THERE'S GOING TO BE DEGREES OF WHO'S BLACK AND WHO'S NOT BLACK. MY

WIFE'S ANCESTRY -- EX-WIFE'S ANCESTRY CAN LOOK BACK AT THE ZULU TRIBE,

THAT'S NOT GOOD ENOUGH. YOU KNOW, PEOPLE TALK ABOUT CONFRONTING OUR

PAST. LET'S LOOK AT OUR PRESENT. I'M ONE OF THE OLDER MEMBERS HERE.

I'VE LIVED A LIFE WHEN MY GRANDMOTHER WAS IN THE ROOM WITH US AND I

HEARD ABOUT HOW BABIES WERE RIPPED FROM HER ARMS AND STAMPED UNDER

THE FOOT OF A BOOT, NOT 200 YEARS AGO. HOW HER SISTER WAS MADE INTO A

LAMPSHADE. I HAVE NO FAMILY, ZERO ON MY MOTHER'S SIDE. I DON'T HAVE

TO LOOK BACK. I LITERALLY TURN AROUND AND THE HOLOCAUST WAS THERE. I DO

UNDERSTAND. PEOPLE SAID IF ONLY YOU COULD HAVE LIVED THIS. MY FAMILY,

MY IMMEDIATE FAMILY LIVED THIS. I HAVE NOBODY ON ONE SIDE, THEY WERE

ALL PUT INTO OVENS. THEY DIDN'T GET REPARATIONS. AND THE ONLY REASON

THE GERMANS GAVE REPARATIONS IS BECAUSE THEY WERE FORCED TO GIVE

REPARATIONS. GOLD RIPPED OUT OF THEIR TEETH, BABIES STAMPED UNDER THEIR

FOOT, PEOPLE MADE -- MY IMMEDIATE FAMILY MADE INTO ASHES. I DO

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

UNDERSTAND AND THAT'S THE EXACT REASON WHY, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ASKING

JUST TO BE PART OF THE CONVERSATION BECAUSE WE CAN CONTRIBUTE TO

EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE BECAUSE WE DO UNDERSTAND AND MAYBE

SOMETHING GOOD WILL COME OF THAT. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. ALVAREZ.

MR. ALVAREZ: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I IDENTIFY

MYSELF AS AN AFRICAN CARIBBEAN PERSON AND I JUST WANT TO THANK THE

SPONSOR FOR BRINGING THIS OVER TO THE FLOOR. I'M SO, SO PROUD TO VOTE YES

ON THIS BILL AND I COULDN'T STAY QUIETE BECAUSE IT IMPACT ME DIRECTLY,

IMPACT MY FAMILY AND IMPACT MY ANCESTOR. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. ALVAREZ IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. SOLAGES TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE AND CLOSE.

MS. SOLAGES: JUST OVER A YEAR AGO, A MONSTER

DROVE HUNDREDS OF MILES TO KILL NEW YORKERS, BLACK NEW YORKERS AND

ON HIS WEAPON WAS A PHRASE, ON HIS GUN WAS A PHRASE AND IT SAID THIS IS

YOUR REPARATIONS. SOME MAY ARGUE THAT THE PAST IS THE PAST AND THAT

WE SHOULD MOVE ON, BUT HOW CAN WE MOVE ON WHEN THE ECHOES OF

HISTORY STILL REVERBERATE IN THE LIVES OF MILLIONS, EXCUSE ME. HOW CAN

WE BUILD A FUTURE ON A FOUNDATION STAINED WITH INJUSTICE. I WANT TO TAKE

A MOMENT TO THANK THE COALITION OF ALL THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE HELPED ME

IN THE MANY GROUPS TOO NUMEROUS TO - TO EXPLAIN. OUR FORMER

COLLEAGUE BARRON FOR SPEAKING ALWAYS TRUTH TO POWER AND ADVANCING

THE TOPIC OF REPARATIONS, PROGRAM AND COUNSEL, MY STAFF, THE CAUCUS

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

STAFF WHO HELPED PUSHED THIS INITIATIVE, ESPECIALLY MY COLLEAGUES, ALL OF

YOU, WHETHER YOU VOTE FOR IT OR NOT I THANK YOU FOR THIS ROBUST

DISCUSSION, SPEAKER HEASTIE AND ALSO OUR COLLEAGUE TAYLOR DARLING

WHO REALLY WORKED WITH ME SIDE-BY-SIDE ON THIS INITIATIVE. I THANK HER

FOR ALWAYS BEING THERE AND COLLABORATING WITH ME.

TODAY NEW YORK WILL TAKE A STEP FORWARD IN

DISMANTLING THE SYSTEMATIC BARRIERS THAT CONTINUE TO HOLD BACK SO MANY

NEW YORKERS. TOGETHER WE'RE ONE DAY, ONE TIME, CLOSER TO HEALING.

I'M VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE BECAUSE TOGETHER WE CAN MAKE NEW YORK

BETTER. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. SOLAGES IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

TIME IS NOT OUR FRIEND. MR. RAMOS TO EXPLAIN HIS

VOTE. QUICKLY, PLEASE, THANK YOU.

MR. RAMOS: MR. SPEAKER, I PROUDLY SUPPORT THIS

BILL AND I WANT TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR. AND, YOU KNOW, IT SADDENED

ME, SOMETHING AS LOGICAL AS WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO PASS HERE,

SOMETHING THAT WE COULD CLEARLY, EVERYONE KNOWS ABOUT THE ATROCITIES

AND THE -- THE -- THE NEED FOR SOME KIND OF STUDY TO BE ABLE TO REPAIR

SOME OF THE DAMAGE DONE, REPAIR SOME OF THE -- THE WRONGS THAT WE SEE

NOW. IT -- IT SADDENS ME WHEN -- WHEN SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES ON THE

OTHER SIDE, MOST OF WHICH I CONSIDER FRIENDS, AND I HEAR SOME OF THE

THINGS THAT ARE SAID HERE. WE SEE NATIONWIDE EFFORTS TO ERASE BLACK

HISTORY SAYING THAT, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD MAKE WHITE PEOPLE FEEL GUILTY,

WHEN WHITE PEOPLE WERE ABOLITIONISTS AS WELL, THEY WERE PART OF

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FREEING SLAVES. WHEN I SEE MY COLLEAGUES ALMOST AS A BLOCK VOTE NO,

BECAUSE THEY DON'T BELIEVE THE EXISTENCE OF THIS BILL, THEY DON'T BELIEVE

THE EXISTENCE OF THIS COMMISSION, THEY DON'T FEEL THERE SHOULD BE A

STUDY, THEY DON'T FEEL THERE SHOULD BE REPARATIONS, BUT THEY STAND UP,

THEY SAY --

MR. GOODELL: MR. SPEAKER, POINT OF ORDER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: I'M HAPPY TO HEAR MY COLLEAGUE'S

COMMENTS ON THIS BILL. IT'S INAPPROPRIATE FOR HIM TO SUGGEST THAT HE

KNOWS WHAT WE'RE THINKING AND WE'RE DOING AND WHY WE'RE DOING IT.

HE IS WELCOME TO TALK ABOUT THE MERITS OF THE BILL, BUT HE DOES NOT

MEET OUR RULES OF DECORUM WHEN HE ATTACKS OTHER MEMBERS ON THIS

FLOOR WITH SUPPOSITIONS.

MR. RAMOS: MR. SPEAKER --

MR. GOODELL: AND MY GOOD COLLEAGUE, THE

MAJORITY LEADER, HAS MADE THAT CLEAR IN THE PAST AND I WOULD ASK THAT

YOU MAKE THAT CLEAR TODAY. THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. RAMOS: I THINK I'M REFERRING TO SOME OF THE

COMMENTS MADE HERE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: LET --

MR. RAMOS: AND I'M ABOUT TO FINISH. SO THE IRONY

OF ALL THIS --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: FOLKS, WE NEED TO TRY

AND GET THROUGH THIS.

MR. RAMOS: SURE.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: NOTHING THAT ANYONE

SAYS NOW IS GOING TO CHANGE ANYBODY'S VOTE, SO LET US PROCEED. THE

VOTE WILL GO, DEMOCRACY STANDS WITH THE NUMBERS WHO WIN AND THE

NUMBERS WHO LOSE. SO PLEASE, LET'S PROCEED. MR. RAMOS, FINISH UP,

PLEASE.

MR. RAMOS: THE LAST THING I'D LIKE TO SAY. THE

IRONY OF -- OF THIS IS THAT AFTER NOT BELIEVING THIS BILL AND THE EXISTENCE

AND VOTING AGAINST IT, WHETHER YOU VOTE AGAINST IT AND YOU DON'T FEEL

THAT THIS COMMISSION SHOULD -- SHOULD EXIST, THEN THE REASON GIVEN IS

THAT THE NO VOTES ARE BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT INCLUDED. THEY WANT TO BE

PART OF IT. SO IT'S VERY IRONIC.

MR. SPEAKER, AS A HISPANIC MALE WHO HAS AN ANCESTRY,

HAS ANCESTORS WHO WERE SLAVES, I PROUDLY VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR. MR.

RAMOS IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MS. TAPIA TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. TAPIA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, FOR GIVING ME

THE OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I AM AN IMMIGRANT THAT WAS BORN

IN THE DOMINICAN REPUBLIC. AND THE DOMINICAN REPUBLIC, MY

ANCESTORS, ARE ALSO SLAVERY [SIC] THAT WERE BROUGHT TO THE DOMINICAN

REPUBLIC BY OUR COLONIZERS. SO I FEEL TODAY AND I COMMEND, COMMEND

THE SPONSORS AND ALL MY COLLEAGUES FOR PUTTING OUT ALL THE FEELINGS THAT

HAD TO DO WITH WHAT HAPPENED WITH BLACK AMERICA IN ALL THESE YEARS

OF SLAVERY THAT WE CONTINUE TO HAVE TODAY. I'M SO PROUD TO RISE TODAY

AND EXPLAIN MY VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL THAT IS GOING TO START CHANGING

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE FUTURE OF AMERICA. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. TAPIA --

MS. TAPIA: I VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: -- IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

(APPLAUSE)

PAGE 6, RULES REPORT NO -- PAGE 8, RULES REPORT NO.

690, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 04282-B, RULES REPORT

NO. 690, PAULIN, SILLITTI, WALKER, DARLING, DICKENS, RAMOS, BURGOS.

AN ACT TO AMEND THE TOWN LAW, THE VILLAGE LAW, THE COUNTY LAW,

AND THE MUNICIPAL HOME RULE LAW, IN RELATION TO MOVING CERTAIN

ELECTIONS TO EVEN-NUMBERED YEARS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THERE'S AN

AMENDMENT BY -- AT THE DESK BY MR. RA TO BRIEFLY EXPLAIN THE

AMENDMENT WHILE THE CHAIR EXAMINES IT.

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THIS AMENDMENT

WOULD MAKE THIS LAW APPLICABLE ONLY TO COUNTIES WITH A POPULATION IN

EXCESS OF THREE MILLION.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CHAIR HAS FOUND

YOUR AMENDMENT, MR. RA, AND HAS EXAMINED YOUR AMENDMENT AND

FOUND IT GERMANE TO THE BILL BEFORE THE HOUSE.

ON THE AMENDMENT, SIR.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. YOU KNOW, THIS

BILL THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE DEBATING IN A FEW MINUTES IS COMING ABOUT

AT THE END OF SESSION HERE. IT'S A BILL THAT FIRST CAME UP LAST YEAR AND

THERE WAS TALK OF HEARINGS BEING HELD. TO MY KNOWLEDGE NONE OF THAT

EVER HAPPENED. HERE WE ARE IN THE WEANING DAYS OF SESSION TALKING

ABOUT A BILL THAT MANDATES - AND I WANT TO BE CLEAR - ON SOME LOCAL

GOVERNMENTS, NOT ALL OF THEM. AND ONE OF THE THINGS I'M SURE WE'LL TALK

ABOUT IS, YOU KNOW, NEW YORK CITY BEING EXCLUDED. I KNOW THERE'S

CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISIONS AND TALK ABOUT MAYBE DOING THAT IN THE

FUTURE. WELL, I DON'T SEE ANY BILL MOVING FORWARD NOW TO DO THAT, TO

MAKE SURE NEW YORK CITY'S ELECTIONS ARE HELD IN -- IN EVEN NUMBER OF

YEARS. AND IN FACT, NONE OF THE CITIES IN THIS STATE ARE INCLUDED IN THIS

BILL. NONE OF THEM HAVE TO MOVE THEIR ELECTIONS.

NOW OUTSIDE OF THAT, WE'RE GOING TO I'M SURE HEAR A LOT

ABOUT HOW THIS IS GOING TO INCREASE TURNOUT BECAUSE THERE'S MORE

TURNOUT IN EVEN NUMBERED YEARS. AND LOOK, WE'VE DONE A LOT IN THIS

HOUSE TO INCREASE TURNOUT IN ELECTIONS, NO QUESTION, BUT LOCAL ELECTIONS

HAPPEN ON LOCAL ISSUES. I'VE SEEN THINGS LIKE, YOU KNOW, IN NASSAU

COUNTY, ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUES IN OUR COUNTY, LAST COUNTYWIDE

ELECTION WAS OUR ASSESSMENT SYSTEM. TOWN ELECTIONS WHEN YOU TALK

ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHEN THERE'S BEEN CORRUPTION ISSUES OR THERE'S BEEN

ISSUES WITH A BUILDING DEPARTMENT. THOSE ISSUES WILL GET SWEPT AWAY IF

THESE -- IF THESE ELECTIONS ARE ALL HELD ON -- ON EVEN YEARS SO THAT YOU'RE

GOING TO BASICALLY HAVE WHAT'S GOING ON NATIONALLY DICTATING A LOCAL

ELECTION AND -- AND THOSE LOCAL ISSUES ARE NOT GOING TO GET HERE.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE OTHER ISSUE IS THAT I DON'T KNOW WHAT AND WE --

SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES RAISED THIS IN COMMITTEE EARLIER, I DON'T KNOW

WHAT THE BALLOT IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE TO HAVE THIS MANY OFFICES ON IT AND

WHETHER WE HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN PLACE TO -- TO HANDLE THAT

BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW, YOU'RE EITHER GOING TO HAVE VERY, VERY SMALL

PRINT OR YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO HAVE A LARGER BALLOT, ARE THE CURRENT

MACHINES GOING TO WORK? THERE'S A LOT THAT GOES INTO THIS, WHICH IS,

AGAIN, WHY I THINK HEARINGS NEEDED TO BE HELD AND -- AND WHY WE NEED

TO GET TO A PLACE WHERE WE ACTUALLY HAVE A DISCUSSION AS TO HOW THIS

WOULD ALL WORK. AND WE DEAL WITH THE FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS OF THIS

AND THERE WILL BE FINANCIAL IMPLICATIONS. AND IT WAS SUGGESTED EARLIER

THAT THE COST WOULD BE MORE THAN MADE UP BY THE FACT THAT WE WOULDN'T

HAVE TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, OTHER ELECTIONS, BUT THEY'RE STILL GOING TO BE

OTHER OFFICES ON THE BALLOTS. SO THEY'RE STILL GOING TO HAVE TO RUN THE

ELECTIONS, THEY'RE STILL GOING TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH STAFFING, EARLY VOTING

AND ELECTION DAY AND EVERYTHING THAT -- THAT -- THAT GOES WITH IT. IF WE

NEED NEW MACHINES AND ALL KINDS OF THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT'S GOING TO

COST A LOT MORE THAN -- THAN ANY SAVINGS THAT'S GOING TO COME FROM

MAYBE PRINTING A SMALLER BALLOT IN THE -- IN THE NEXT YEAR.

SO, THIS IS A SIMPLE AMENDMENT THAT SUGGESTS THAT IF

WE'RE GOING TO FOR WHATEVER REASON EXCLUDE EVERY CITY IN THIS STATE

FROM THIS BILL, THAT -- THAT WE SHOULD REALLY ONLY MAKE IT APPLICABLE TO

COUNTIES WITH -- WITH A VERY, VERY LARGE POPULATION SO THAT THEY CAN --

THEY CAN DEAL WITH ALL OF THE COSTS THAT ARE -- THAT ARE COMING WITH THIS

BILL. SO I URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO SUPPORT AND -- AND ADOPT THIS

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AMENDMENT. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. BROWN.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. MADAM

SPONSOR, WILL YOU YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: NO, WE'RE --

MR. A. BROWN: OH, I'M SORRY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: WE'RE ON THE

AMENDMENT AT THE MOMENT.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. I WOULD JUST STAND TO URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO REJECT THIS

OPPORTUNITY TO ADD AN AMENDMENT TO MS. PAULIN'S LEGISLATION.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: A PARTY VOTE HAS

BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS SUPPORTIVE OF THIS AMENDMENT. IF THERE'S ANYONE THAT

WISHES TO VOTE AGAINST IT, THEY CAN CERTAINLY DO SO HERE ON THE FLOOR.

THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. I URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO VOTE NO ON ANY AMENDMENT THAT WILL

BE ADDED TO MS. PAULIN'S BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, BOTH.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE AMENDMENT IS DEFEATED.

WE HAVE ANOTHER AMENDMENT. THIS AMENDMENT IS AT

THE DESK BY MR. SLATER. PLEASE, MR. SLATER, BRIEFLY EXPLAIN THE

AMENDMENT WHILE THE CHAIR EXAMINES IT, SIR.

MR. SLATER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I'VE

OFFERED AN AMENDMENT THAT ADDS TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF BY APPLYING THE

CHANGES PROPOSED BY THE BILL-IN-CHIEF TO COUNTIES AND TOWNS WITH A

POPULATION UNDER 5,000.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CHAIR HAS

EXAMINED YOUR AMENDMENT, MR. SLATER, AND FOUND IT GERMANE TO THE

BILL BEFORE THE HOUSE.

ON THE AMENDMENT, SIR.

MR. SLATER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. ON THE

AMENDMENT. IT CAN BE ARGUED THAT THE CONSOLIDATION OF COUNTY AND

TOWN ELECTIONS INTO EVEN NUMBERED YEARS PRESENTS A SIGNIFICANT FLOW.

NAMELY, THE POTENTIAL DILUTION OF THE IMPORTANCE OF LOCAL ISSUES.

MANDATING A SYNCHRONIZATION OF LOCAL ELECTIONS WITH STATE OR NATIONAL

ELECTIONS CARRIES AN INHERIT RISK, AN INHERIT RISK OF OVERSHADOWING

GLOBAL CONCERNS WITH LARGER POLITICAL CAMPAIGNS. THIS WOULD DIMINISH

THE VOICES ADVOCATING FOR THOSE LOCAL CONCERNS. LOCAL ELECTION

AUTONOMY IS CRUCIAL TO ALLOW LOCAL ISSUES THE IMPORTANCE THAT THEY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

DESERVE. IN ADDITION, THE ACT OF MERGING LOCAL ELECTIONS WITH

HIGH-PROFILE ELECTIONS MAY MUDDY THE WATERS WHEN IT COMES TO MAKING

INFORMED DECISIONS. WITH EACH ELECTION YEAR, RESPONSIBLE VOTERS EQUIP

THEMSELVES TO MAKE THE BEST DECISION ON ELECTION DAY, PROBABLY OUR

FAVORITE DAY OF THE YEAR; HOWEVER, THIS REQUIREMENT PLACED ON

LOCALITIES, PLACING AN UNREALISTIC BURDEN ON VOTERS DEMANDING DOUBLE

THE RESEARCH TYPICALLY REQUIRED TO MAKE A RESPONSIBLE DECISION ON

ELECTION DAY. THE ISOLATION OF LOCAL ELECTIONS PRIORITIZES A CULTIVATION

OF A VOTER THAT MAKES DISCERNING CHOICES BASED ON TRUE UNDERSTANDING

OF THE CANDIDATES AND THE LOCAL ISSUES AT STAKE.

THIS AMENDMENT WOULD APPLY THE CHANGES PROPOSED

BY THE BILL-IN-CHIEF TO COUNTIES AND TOWNS WITH POPULATION OF UNDER

5,000. AND, MR. SPEAKER, I WOULD JUST ADD, IN ADDITION TO THAT, HAVING

RUN IN LOCAL ELECTIONS MYSELF, AND MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES IN THIS

CHAMBER HAVE DONE THE SAME. WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE SIGNIFICANT

DIFFERENCES IN THE ISSUES WHEN VOTERS ARE PAYING ATTENTION TO THOSE

LOCAL MATTERS. IN MY PREVIOUS ELECTIONS ON LOCAL ISSUES, WE FOCUSED

THINGS ON -- WE FOCUSED ON THINGS SUCH AS OUR LAKES, SUCH AS OUR

INDIVIDUAL PARKS, THE OPERATIONS OF OUR PARKS AND RECREATION

DEPARTMENT, SPECIFIC ZONING IDEAS AND ZONING UPGRADES. THOSE ARE ALL

IMPORTANT ISSUES TO COMMUNITIES INDIVIDUALLY, AND THEY WOULD ALL, I

FEEL, WOULD BE DROWNED OUT IF THEY WERE MERGED ON A LARGER SCALE AS

THE BILL-IN-CHIEF PROPOSES. AND SO WE PROPOSE THIS AMENDMENT, MR.

SPEAKER, AND I APPRECIATE THE TIME.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. I URGE ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES IN THE MAJORITY TO REJECT THIS

OPPORTUNITY TO PUT AN AMENDMENT TO MS. PAULIN'S BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

A PARTY VOTE HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE IS IN FAVOR OF THIS AMENDMENT. THOSE WHO DO NOT SUPPORT

IT CAN CERTAINLY VOTE AGAINST IT HERE ON THE FLOOR. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL REJECT THIS ATTEMPT TO ADD AN

AMENDMENT TO MS. PAULIN'S BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

THE CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE AMENDMENT IS DEFEATED.

WE HAVE AN AMENDMENT AT THE DESK FROM MR. JENSEN.

MR. JENSEN TO BRIEFLY EXPLAIN THE AMENDMENT WHILE

THE CHAIR EXAMINES IT.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

I RISE TO OFFER THE FOLLOWING AMENDMENT, WAIVE ITS READING AND MOVE

FOR ITS IMMEDIATE ADOPTION. THIS AMENDMENT ADDS TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF

THE EMPOWERMENT OF COUNTIES, TOWNS AND VILLAGES THE DISCRETION TO

DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT TO HOLD THEIR ELECTIONS IN EVEN NUMBERED

YEARS OR ON ODD NUMBERED YEARS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. JENSEN, WE HAVE

EXAMINED YOUR AMENDMENT AND FOUND IT GERMANE TO THE BILL BEFORE THE

HOUSE.

ON THE AMENDMENT, SIR.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

SIMILARLY TO MY PRIOR COLLEAGUES WHO SPOKE ON THEIR AMENDMENTS,

MOVING LOCAL ELECTIONS INTO EVEN NUMBERED YEARS WILL DILUTE THE

IMPACT AND THE INFLUENCE THAT LOCAL ELECTIONS, LOCAL ISSUES HAVE WHEN

DETERMINING WHO REPRESENTS US ON THE LOCAL LEVEL. I'VE HAD THE GREAT

HONOR BEFORE BEING ELECTED TO THIS ESTEEMED BODY TO BE A LOCAL ELECTED

OFFICIAL. BETWEEN THAT SERVICE AND MY CURRENT SERVICE, I'VE WALKED

DOOR TO DOOR AND TALKED TO VOTERS ON ELECTIONS WHERE THERE'S A PRESIDENT

UP FOR VOTE, A GOVERNOR, A COUNTY EXECUTIVE, AND THE TOP OF THE TICKET

BEING A TOWN SUPERVISOR. AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE CONVERSATION I

HAD WITH VOTERS CHANGED EVERY ONE OF THOSE ELECTIONS BASED ON WHO

WAS ON THE TOP OF THE TICKET.

BY RETAINING A LOCAL MUNICIPALITY'S ABILITY TO

DETERMINE ON THEIR OWN WHETHER OR NOT TO MOVE THEIR ELECTIONS TO AN

EVEN YEAR OR KEEP IT ON A ODD NUMBER YEAR, WILL RESPECT THE AUTONOMY

OF THAT LOCAL MUNICIPALITY, THE INFLUENCE THAT THOSE ELECTIONS HAVE ON

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HELPING VOTERS DETERMINE THE ISSUES THAT ARE TRULY IMPORTANT TO THE

VOTERS IN THAT COMMUNITY.

ARTICLE IX OF THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION

PROTECTS THE HOME RULE ASPECTS OF LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES IN DECIDING ON

HOW TO OVERSEE THEIR LAWS AND THEIR ABILITY TO GOVERN THEIR TOWN AND

COUNTY AND VILLAGE. THIS AMENDMENT WOULD ENSURE THAT ARTICLE IX OF

THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION IS ABIDED BY RESPECTING HOME RULE,

RESPECTING LOCAL AUTONOMY, AND ENSURING THAT VOTERS HAVE THE

INFORMATION THEY NEED WHEN THEY FULFILL THE MOST IMPORTANT ASPECT OF

THEIR DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS ELECTING THEIR VOICE TO REPRESENT THEM IN

GOVERNMENT, WHETHER THAT GOVERNMENT REPRESENTATION IS AT THE VILLAGE,

TOWN, COUNTY, STATE OR FEDERAL LEVEL. THIS IS A COMMONSENSE

AMENDMENT THAT YOU HAVE THE SUPPORT OF EVERY SINGLE MEMBER OF THIS

BODY TO RESPECT OUR COMMUNITIES THAT WE REPRESENT, AND I APPRECIATE

THE SPEAKER ALLOWING ME TO EXPLAIN MY AMENDMENT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MS. WALSH ON THE AMENDMENT.

MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. SO MY

FRIENDS AND COLLEAGUES, I CAME UP THROUGH LOCAL GOVERNMENT. I STARTED

ON THE TOWN BOARD, I AM A REPUBLICAN AND AS A REPUBLICAN, I BELIEVE

VERY, VERY, STRONGLY THAT THE BEST GOVERNMENT IS THE GOVERNMENT THAT IS

CLOSEST TO THE PEOPLE AND THAT THAT'S WHERE THOSE DECISIONS NEED TO BE

MADE. I BELIEVE THAT AT THE TOWN LEVEL, AT THE VILLAGE LEVEL AND AT SOME

EXTENT, AT THE CITY AND COUNTY LEVEL, THAT'S WHERE THE RUBBER REALLY HITS

THE ROAD AS FAR AS WHAT'S GOOD AND WHAT'S NOT GOOD FOR THAT PARTICULAR

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COMMUNITY. THAT'S WHY I SUPPORT THIS AMENDMENT TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF.

I THINK THAT THERE ARE ARGUMENTS MADE THAT THE BILL-IN-CHIEF IS GOING TO

PRODUCE EFFICIENCIES. IT'S GOING TO ENGAGE THE VOTERS MORE. THAT MIGHT

BE TRUE. LET THE LOCALITIES DECIDE IF THEY WANT TO DO THAT OR NOT. SOME

MAY DECIDE TO DO IT, GREAT. SOME MIGHT NOT DECIDE TO DO IT AND THAT'S

FINE, TOO. LET THEM DECIDE. THAT'S THE WAY THAT THIS OUGHT TO BE DONE,

THAT'S WHY I THINK THAT THIS AMENDMENT IS NOT ONLY GERMANE BUT IS WISE.

AND I THINK THAT AS HAS BEEN SAID, I THINK THAT WHEN IT COMES TO LOCAL

ISSUES, THOSE LOCAL ISSUES THAT ARE CLOSEST TO THE COMMUNITY NEED TO BE

GIVEN THE FULL CONSIDERATION AND ENGAGEMENT OF THE VOTERS. IF YOU START

LUMPING EVERYBODY IN TOGETHER, EVERYBODY FROM PRESIDENT, TO

GOVERNOR, TO CONGRESSPERSON ALL THE WAY DOWN THAT LONG, LONG LINE, WE

KNOW WHERE ALL THE OXYGEN IN THE ROOM IS GOING TO GO, AND A LOT OF

THOSE LOCAL ISSUES ARE GOING TO GET LOST. SO, IF THIS BILL IS GOING TO BE

ADVANCED, AND IT APPEARS THAT IT IS GOING TO BE, PLEASE CONSIDER THIS

AMENDMENT TO JUST GIVE SOME LOCAL DECISION-MAKING AND LOCAL CONTROL

AND A LOCAL OPTION. I THINK THAT THAT IS THE RIGHT WAY TO GO. SO, MR.

SPEAKER, I'M IN FAVOR OF THIS AMENDMENT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. GOODELL ON THE AMENDMENT.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THE NEW YORK

STATE CONSTITUTION HAS AN INTERESTING PROVISION IN IT. IT'S ARTICLE IX, IT'S

CALLED LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, AND IT STARTS OUT WITH A BILL OF RIGHTS FOR

LOCAL GOVERNMENTS. IT'S IN OUR CONSTITUTION. AND THE FIRST SECTION

TALKS ABOUT HOW LOCAL GOVERNMENTS SHALL HAVE THE RIGHT TO DECIDE THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

METHOD OF REMOVING AN ELECTED OFFICER DURING HIS OR HER TERM OF OFFICE,

ABOLISHING OR CURTAILING OR TRANSFERRING POWER, OR CHANGING THE

COMPOSITION. AND IT ALSO GOES ON TO SAY THAT IN ADDITION TO THE POWERS

GRANTED IN STATUTE TO THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT, LOCAL GOVERNMENT SHALL

HAVE THE POWER, DUTY, QUALIFICATIONS, NUMBER, MODE OF SELECTION,

REMOVAL, TERMS OF OFFICE OF ITS OFFICERS AND EMPLOYEES. THE

BILL-IN-CHIEF, IF ENACTED, WOULD ACTUALLY CHANGE THE TERM OF OFFICE FOR

SOME OF OUR LOCAL OFFICIALS, IN MY OPINION, IN VIOLATION OF THE SPIRIT AND

INTENT OF THESE CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISIONS.

HOW'S IT DO THAT? WELL, IF YOU'RE ELECTED FOR A

TWO-YEAR TERM UNDER THIS PROPOSED LOCAL LAW AT SOME POINT, YOU'LL HAVE

TO RUN TWO YEARS IN A ROW. YOUR TERM WILL BE ARTIFICIALLY REDUCED TO

ONE YEAR. AND DEPENDING ON HOW YOU READ THIS PROPOSED STATUTORY

CHANGE, IT'S POSSIBLE THAT YOU COULD BE ELECTED FOR A FOUR-YEAR TERM AND

ONLY BE ALLOWED TO SERVE THREE YEARS. MY COUNTY, LIKE SEVERAL OTHERS

ACROSS THE STATE, WE HAVE A CHARTER. OUR CHARTER WAS APPROVED BY THE

VOTERS IN A REFERENDUM. OUR COUNTY CHARTER SPECIFIES THE TERM OF OFFICE

FOR THE LEGISLATURE. OUR CHARTER SPECIFIES A NUMBER OF LEGISLATORS AND

WHEN THEY RUN. OUR CHARTER SPECIFIES THE TERM OF OFFICE FOR THE COUNTY

CLERK, AND THE SHERIFF, AND THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY. THIS LEGISLATURE

SHOULD NOT BE PASSING LAWS THAT OVERRIDE EVERY SINGLE CHARTER GRANTED

ACROSS THE STATE OF NEW YORK. THAT'S JUST INAPPROPRIATE.

NOW, IN MY COUNTY, I HAVE 27 TOWNS, 14 VILLAGES, TWO

CITIES. AND THIS BILL SAYS THAT ALL OF THEM, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF CITIES,

HAVE TO RUN IN THE SAME YEAR. TWENTY-SEVEN TOWNS AND 14 VILLAGES.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

RATHER THAN HAVING THEM THOUGHTFULLY SPACED OUT AS THE CURRENT LAW

PROVIDES. SO WE'RE BEING ASKED TODAY TO PASS A LAW THAT OVERRIDES THE

THOUGHTFUL DECISION OF THOUSANDS OF LOCAL GOVERNMENTS. SHAMEFUL.

WE SHOULD NOT TAKE THE ARROGANCE UPON OURSELF TO THINK THAT WE KNOW

BETTER THAN EVERY SINGLE LOCAL GOVERNMENT ACROSS THE STATE OF NEW

YORK. THAT'S INAPPROPRIATE.

SO WHAT THIS AMENDMENT DOES IS VERY SIMPLE. IT SAYS

WE RESPECT THE FACT THAT YOU, THE VILLAGE TRUSTEES, YOU, THE TOWN BOARD

MEMBERS, YOU, THE DULY-ELECTED COUNTY REPRESENTATIVES OPERATING

UNDER THE IMPORTANCE FOR YOUR OWN CHARTER THAT'S BEEN APPROVED BY A

COUNTY-WIDE REFERENDUM, YOU KNOW BETTER HOW TO OPERATE YOUR LOCAL

GOVERNMENT THAN WE DO. THAT'S THIS AMENDMENT AND IT SHOULD BE

ADOPTED. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, I WOULD

URGE THE MAJORITY CONFERENCE TO REJECT THIS OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE AN

AMENDMENT TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF, 4282.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

A PARTY VOTE HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

(PAUSE)

A SLOW ROLL CALL HAS BEEN REQUESTED. MEMBERS SHOULD

COME TO THE CHAMBER TO CAST THEIR BALLOT ON THE AMENDMENT.

(PAUSE)

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MADAM CLERK, WOULD

YOU PLEASE RECOGNIZE THE MEMBERS VOTING VIRTUALLY ON THIS AMENDMENT,

ON THIS HOSTILE AMENDMENT.

THE CLERK: MR. GANDOLFO, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME

FOR THE RECORD AND HOW YOU WISH TO VOTE.

MR. GANDOLFO: JARETT GANDOLFO, I VOTE IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

THE CLERK: MR. GANDOLFO IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. MCDONOUGH, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE

RECORD AND HOW YOU WISH TO VOTE.

MR. MCDONOUGH, CAN YOU PLEASE TURN ON YOUR MIC?

MR. MCDONOUGH: DAVE MCDONOUGH AND I'M

VOTING IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW?

THE CLERK: MR. MCDONOUGH IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. MCDONOUGH: THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO:

ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE AMENDMENT IS DEFEATED.

THERE IS ANOTHER AMENDMENT AT THE DESK. MR. DURSO

TO BRIEFLY EXPLAIN THE AMENDMENT WHILE THE CHAIR EXAMINES IT.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. THIS

AMENDMENT ADDS TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF BY ENSURING ADDITIONAL VOTER

PROTECTION MEASURES, NAMELY REQUIRING VOTERS TO PRESENT A VALID PROOF

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OF IDENTIFICATION WHEN CASTING A BALLOT.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO: THE

CHAIR HAS EXAMINED YOUR AMENDMENT AND HAS FOUND IT NOT GERMANE TO

THE BILL BEFORE THE HOUSE.

MR. DURSO, YOU MAY APPEAL THE RULING OF THE CHAIR

AND SPEAK ON THE ISSUE OF GERMANENESS.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER, TO

APPEAL TO THE RULING OF THE CHAIR. THE BILL-IN-CHIEF AMENDS THE TOWN

LAW, VILLAGE LAW, COUNTY LAW, AND MUNICIPAL HOME RULE LAW TO

REQUIRE CERTAIN LOCAL ELECTIONS HELD OUTSIDE OF NEW YORK CITY TO BE

HELD ON ELECTION DAY IN NOVEMBER IN EVEN NUMBERED YEARS. THIS

AMENDMENT DIRECTLY RELATES TO THE BILL-IN-CHIEF BECAUSE IT ADDS VOTER

PROTECTION MEASURES TO ENSURE THAT THE ELECTION CHANGES BEING

PROPOSED BY THE BILL-IN-CHIEF ARE DONE SO WITH THE UTMOST SECURITY AND

INTEGRITY. FURTHERMORE, MADAM SPEAKER, IT IS ESSENTIAL TO PROTECT OUR

ELECTION INTEGRITY, ESPECIALLY WITH A NEW BILL AS SUCH WHICH WILL IN TURN

OBVIOUSLY BRING OUT MORE VOTER TURNOUT. WITH MORE VOTER TURNOUT

BRINGS THE POSSIBILITY OF MORE FRAUD. IT'S ESSENTIAL TO PROTECT OUR

ELECTIONS, ARM THE INTEGRITY OF THE ELECTIONS AND JUST AS IMPORTANT TO

PROTECT THE ESSENTIAL THAT THE VOTING PUBLIC BELIEVES THAT GOVERNMENT IS

DOING ITS JOB IN PROTECTING THE ELECTIONS. MADAM -- MADAM SPEAKER, I

ASK EVERYBODY TO CONSIDER THIS AMENDMENT FOR ADOPTION. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO: MR.

DURSO APPEALS THE DECISION OF THE CHAIR. THE QUESTION BEFORE THE

HOUSE IS SHALL THE DECISION OF THE CHAIR STAND AS THE JUDGMENT OF THE

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HOUSE. THOSE VOTING YES, VOTE TO SUSTAIN THE RULING OF THE CHAIR.

THOSE VOTING NO, VOTE TO OVERRIDE THE DECISION OF THE CHAIR.

A PARTY VOTE HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. WITH

ALL DUE RESPECT, WE THINK YOU MAY HAVE BEEN MISTAKEN AND FOR THAT

REASON WE WILL BE VOTING TO OVERRIDE THE DECISION OF THE CHAIR SO THE

REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE WILL GENERALLY BE VOTING NO. THOSE WHO

SUPPORT THE DECISION OF THE CHAIR SHOULD VOTE YES. THANK YOU, MADAM

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO: MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MADAM SPEAKER, THE

MAJORITY CONFERENCE WILL BE HONORED TO TAKE YOUR RECOMMENDATION

AND REJECT THIS HOSTILE AMENDMENT AS NOT BEING GERMANE, SO WE WILL BE

VOTING YES.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO: THE

CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE).

AND AS THE RESULT -- I'M SORRY. WITHDRAW.

ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE RULING OF THE CHAIR IS SUSTAINED.

ON THE BILL.

AN EXPLANATION HAS BEEN REQUESTED, MS. PAULIN.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: THANK YOU SO MUCH. THE BILL WOULD

SHIFT MOST COUNTY AND TOWN ELECTIONS FROM ODD NUMBERED YEARS TO

EVEN NUMBERED YEARS.

ACTING SPEAKER PHEFFER AMATO: MR.

NORRIS.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. WOULD

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: I WOULD BE HAPPY TO.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MS. PAULIN. I HAVE

SEVERAL QUESTIONS REGARDING THIS BILL. FIRST, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE

I'M CLEAR. DOES THIS APPLY TO THE CITY OF NEW YORK OR ANY OTHER CITY IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK?

MS. PAULIN: NO, IT DOES NOT.

MR. NORRIS: AND WHY NOT?

MS. PAULIN: BECAUSE THERE'S A CONSTITUTIONAL

PROVISION THAT WOULD PRECLUDE THAT FROM HAPPENING.

MR. NORRIS: AND WILL THERE BE FUTURE LEGISLATION TO

CONTEMPLATE PRECLUDING THAT?

MS. PAULIN: THAT IS THE INTENT.

MR. NORRIS: THAT IS THE INTENT --

MS. PAULIN: THAT IS MY INTENT.

MR, NORRIS: THAT IS YOUR INTENT, GREAT. OKAY.

NOW, WHAT ABOUT THE COUNTY OFFICES? ARE THERE ANY EXEMPTIONS FOR

COUNTY OFFICES?

MS. PAULIN: YES. DA, COUNTY CLERK, SHERIFF AND

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NOT A COUNTY OFFICE BUT TOWN JUSTICE ARE ALSO - BECAUSE OF THE

CONSTITUTION - PRECLUDED FROM BEING, OR PRECLUDED BECAUSE OF THE

CONSTITUTION FROM BEING INCLUDED.

MR. NORRIS: ALSO INCLUDE JUDGES AS WELL --

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. NORRIS: -- THAT PROTECT THE CONSTITUTION.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. NORRIS: GREAT. OKAY. NOW I JUST WANT TO

FOCUS IN ON THIS BECAUSE I WOULD IMAGINE THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE PAYING

ATTENTION TO THIS. SO, MY QUESTION FOR YOU IS, BASED UPON THE LANGUAGE

PARTICULARLY IN SECTION 5 OF THE BILL, WILL ANY ELECTED OFFICIAL WHO HAS

BEEN ELECTED TO A FIXED TERM ALREADY LOSE A YEAR OF THEIR TERM BY THE

OPERATION OF THIS BILL?

MS. PAULIN: SO, THE WAY IT WOULD WORK IS THAT

ANYBODY RUNNING NOW WOULD FINISH THEIR TERM WHETHER IT'S TWO YEARS,

OR FOUR YEARS, BECAUSE THIS IS AN ODD YEAR WE'RE IN. SO THEY WOULD --

YOU KNOW, WE WOULDN'T BE CHANGING THAT. THE NEXT YEAR THOSE SAME

INDIVIDUALS OR THE SAME OFFICES WERE HELD FOR -- THEY WOULD -- IT WOULD

BE TRUNCATED. SO FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM, IT WOULD BE ONE YEAR AND FOR A

FOUR-YEAR TERM IT WOULD BE THREE YEARS TAKING THEM TO AN EVEN YEAR.

MR. NORRIS: ALL RIGHT. I WANT TO REALLY BREAK THIS

DOWN. MY JOB HERE IS GOING TO BE MORE LIKE LOGICAL, I'M SURE MANY OF

MY COLLEAGUES WILL HAVE A LOT OF OTHER STATEMENTS TO MAKE. SO, IF

YOU'RE RUNNING THIS YEAR FOR TOWN SUPERVISOR AND YOUR NAME IS ON THE

BALLOT --

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: -- ARE YOU GOING TO RUN FOR A ONE-YEAR

TERM OR A TWO-YEAR TERM IF THE OFFICE ITSELF WAS SUPPOSED TO BE TWO

YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: TWO YEARS.

MR. NORRIS: TWO YEARS, OKAY. SO, WHAT IF YOU

WERE A MEMBER OF THE TOWN BOARD, ALREADY SERVING, YOU WERE ELECTED

IN 2021, YOU BEGAN ON JANUARY 1ST, 2022, WHEN DOES YOUR TERM EXPIRE?

MS. PAULIN: WAIT. SAY THAT ONE MORE TIME.

MR. NORRIS: SO, I WANT TO GO BACK, BECAUSE THIS IS

IMPORTANT.

MS. PAULIN: OKAY.

MR. NORRIS: WHEN SOMEONE WAS ELECTED IN 2021

MS. PAULIN: FOR A FOUR-YEAR TERM?

MR. NORRIS: -- FOR A FOUR-YEAR TERM.

MS. PAULIN: FOR A FOUR-YEAR TERM, OKAY.

MR. NORRIS: THEY TOOK OFFICE JANUARY 1ST, 2022,

DOES THEIR TERM EXPIRE AT THE END OF DECEMBER OF 2025?

MS. PAULIN: THEY FINISH THEIR TERM.

MR. NORRIS: THEY FINISH THEIR TERM.

MS. PAULIN: YUP.

MR. NORRIS: WHEN DOES THE ONE YEAR TAKE PLACE

THEN?

MS. PAULIN: SO, IT WOULD ONLY BE ONE YEAR FOR

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SOMEONE WHO'S RUNNING FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM. IF SOMEBODY WAS RUNNING

FOR A FOUR-YEAR TERM, IT WOULD BE THREE YEARS, THAT'S HOW WE'RE

TRUNCATING IT. AND IT WOULD BE AFTER THEY -- THIS -- AS YOU SAID, IT WOULD

BE AFTER THE PERSON WHO HAD A FOUR-YEAR TERM IS UP AT THE COMPLETION OF

THEIR TERM, THEN IT WOULD BE A THREE-YEAR TERM GOING FORWARD AND THE

PERSON WHO IS RUNNING THIS YEAR FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM IT WOULD BE THE

FOLLOWING TIME THEY RAN FOR A ONE-YEAR TERM.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. SO, IF IT WAS THEY'RE RUNNING

FOR 2025, FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM, IS IT AT THAT POINT THAT THEY'RE GOING TO

RUN FOR THE ONE-YEAR TERM?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. CAN YOU -- SO, I WANT TO BE

CRYSTAL CLEAR ON THIS BECAUSE I THINK THE COURTS ARE GOING TO LOOK AT THIS

LANGUAGE VERY CAREFULLY AND THE INTERPRETATION OF WHAT YOU SAY AS A

SPONSOR. DOES ANYBODY LOSE ANY PORTION OF THEIR TERM THAT THEY HAVE

BEEN ELECTED TO?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. NOW WHEN I LOOK AT THE

NOTWITHSTANDING CLAUSE IN SECTION 5, IT TALKS ABOUT THE LAW, ANY LAW,

CHARTER, CODE, ORDINANCE, RESOLUTION, RULE OR REGULATION OF ANY LOCAL

BODY. DOES THIS LEGISLATION TRUMP ALL OF IT INCLUDING COUNTY CHARTERS

AND ANY LOCAL RULE?

MS. PAULIN: YES. THAT'S THE INTENT.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. NOW, I JUST WANT TO ZONE IN ON

ONE PARTICULAR DATE IN SECTION 7. THAT IS WHEN THE ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. NORRIS: NOW, IT SAYS THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT

IMMEDIATELY, PROVIDED HOWEVER, THAT SECTIONS 1, 2, 3 AND 4 SHALL TAKE

EFFECT ON JANUARY 1ST, 2025. A LOT OF THOSE WILL ACTUALLY CHANGE IT FROM

ODD TO EVEN.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: SO, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT

SECTION 5 DOES TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

MS. PAULIN: SECTION 5 -- I MEAN, I KNOW YOU'RE

GOING TO MAKE ANOTHER POINT SO MAYBE YOU CAN MAKE THE POINT AND

THEN I'LL KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING.

MR. NORRIS: SURE. I JUST WANT TO READ THE SECTION.

MS. PAULIN: OKAY.

MR. NORRIS: IT SAYS, SUBJECT TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF

SECTION 1, 2, 3 OR 4 OF THIS ACT, I'M READING SECTION 5 NOW, ELECTED AND

SERVING THEIR TERM AS OF JANUARY 1ST, 2025 SHALL COMPLETE THEIR FULL

TERM AS ESTABLISHED BY LAW. NOW, IT ALSO SAYS HERE, PROVIDED HOWEVER,

THAT IF THE COMPLETION OF SUCH TERM RESULTS IN THE NEED FOR AN ELECTION

IN AN ODD NUMBERED YEAR AFTER JANUARY 1ST, 2025, THE COUNTY OR TOWN

OFFICIAL EFFECTED AT SUCH ELECTION SHALL HAVE THEIR TERM EXPIRED, AS IF

SUCH OFFICIAL WERE ELECTED AT THE PREVIOUS GENERAL ELECTION HELD IN AN

EVEN NUMBERED YEAR.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: SO, I'M READING THAT AND THAT'S WHY I

ASKED YOUR PREVIOUS QUESTIONS --

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MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: -- BECAUSE IT SEEMED, BASED UPON THE

LANGUAGE, THAT IF SOMEONE WAS RUNNING THIS YEAR BECAUSE OF THE

PROVIDED HOWEVER CLAUSE, THAT ACTUALLY THEY'D ONLY BE RUNNING FOR ONE

YEAR.

MS. PAULIN: NO, BECAUSE IT TAKES EFFECT IN 2025,

RIGHT? SO, BECAUSE OF THAT, ALL OF THAT LANGUAGE PERTAINS TO ELECTIONS

TAKING PLACE AT THAT POINT.

MR. NORRIS: MS. PAULIN, WITH ALL DUE RESPECT,

THOUGH, THAT SECTION, PARAGRAPH 5, WILL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

SECTIONS 1, 2, 3, AND 4 WILL TAKE EFFECT ON JANUARY 1ST, 2025.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT, RIGHT. BUT IT'S REFERRING TO

PEOPLE WHO ARE ELECTED POST.

MR. NORRIS: YEAH. IT SAYS ELECTED IN SERVING THEIR

TERM AS OF JANUARY 1ST, 2025. AND SO, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE

CRYSTAL CLEAR BECAUSE I THINK A COURT WILL LOOK AT THIS, THAT YOU'RE SAYING

THAT PEOPLE WHO ARE RUNNING FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM, THIS YEAR --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: -- WILL RUN FOR THE FULL TWO-YEAR TERM.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. NORRIS: AND THEN IN 2026, THEY WILL RUN FOR

THE ONE-YEAR TERM AND THEN GET BACK ON THE CYCLE.

MS. PAULIN: SO, THE REASON THIS LANGUAGE IS THERE IS

BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO RUN IN ANOTHER ODD YEAR FOR ONE YEAR.

MR. NORRIS: IN 2025.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: YEAH. AND THEN THEY RUN AGAIN IN

2026 FOR AN EVEN YEAR, IN THE EVEN YEAR FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE

CLEAR ON THAT BECAUSE I THINK PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE LOOKING AT THAT

LANGUAGE.

NOW, IN TERMS OF BOARD OF ELECTIONS AND

ADMINISTRATION OF THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS --

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. NORRIS: HAVE WE GOTTEN ANY COST ESTIMATES

FOR ADDITIONAL POLLING LOCATIONS IN THE EVEN YEARS SINCE WE'RE SHIFTING

THESE TOWN AND COUNTY ELECTIONS THERE?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, WE DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT THE

TURNOUT -- WHETHER THE TURNOUT WILL BE GREATER THAN THE CURRENT EVEN

YEARS. WHAT WE DO KNOW IS THAT THE TURNOUT IN THE EVEN YEARS IS

GREATER CURRENTLY THAN IN THE ODD YEARS. SO, IF WE THINK OR SEE THAT

THERE'S GOING TO BE AN INCREASE IN TURN OUT, WE WOULD HAVE TO ADJUST,

JUST LIKE WE HAD TO FOR COVID. YOU KNOW, WE DIDN'T ANTICIPATE DURING

COVID THAT WE WOULD SEE SO MANY MORE PEOPLE VOTING, BUT WE DID. I

DON'T KNOW THAT WE ADJUSTED WELL EVERY PLACE BUT WE TRIED TO ADJUST,

AND THE SAME WOULD HAPPEN HERE.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. IN TERMS OF THE BALLOT ITSELF --

MS. PAULIN: THE WHAT? I'M SORRY.

MR. NORRIS: THE BALLOT, THE ACTUAL BALLOT ON AN

EVEN YEAR. I MEAN RIGHT NOW WE HAVE THE PRESIDENT ON THE BALLOT, YOU

HAVE THE U.S. SENATOR POTENTIALLY, IT'S VERY LONG AS IT ALREADY IS. WE'RE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ON THE BALLOT ON AN EVEN YEAR AND NOW WITH (INAUDIBLE) LOCAL RACES ON

THEM, HOW WILL THE BALLOT ACTUALLY BE FUNCTIONAL TO MAKE SURE THAT

THERE'S ENOUGH SPACE ON THERE?

MS. PAULIN: SO, IF YOU LOOK IN ELECTION LAW, I CAN

GET YOU THE -- SECTION 7.105, SECTION 7.106 AND 110, IT ACCOMMODATES

THAT BY ALLOWING FOR A PERFORATED BALLOT OR IN THE OTHER SECTION

ESSENTIALLY ALLOWING FOR A BALLOT THAT WOULD BE LIKE AN A AND A B BALLOT

AND WE'VE DONE THAT BEFORE IN THIS STATE, PARTICULARLY NEW YORK CITY.

SO THAT -- BECAUSE I KNOW ONE OF THE QUESTIONS, I WENT TO THE CODES

MEETING, IS WHETHER OR NOT WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE CALIBRATIONS OF THE

MACHINE. WE WOULD NOT HAVE TO BECAUSE THE ELECTION LAW DOES

ACCOMMODATE THE BALLOT TO BE PERFORATED AND/OR HAVING TWO OF THEM.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. NOW, I OFTEN HEAR FROM

CONSTITUENTS THAT THE LINES ARE TOO LONG, THAT IT TAKES TOO MUCH TIME TO

ALREADY VOTE ON THE CURRENT BALLOT, PARTICULARLY IN A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR.

SO, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO IF THIS PASSES TO ACCOMMODATE THOSE

VOTERS WITH PROPER FUNDING TO MAKE SURE PEOPLE CAN ACTUALLY TAKE THE

TIME TO FILL OUT THE BALLOT, DON'T FEEL RUSHED, AND DON'T GET FRUSTRATED TO

LEAVE THE POLLING SITE?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK THAT WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW,

YES, IT'S TRUE THAT IN STATES AND CITIES THAT HAVE GONE TO AN EVEN YEAR

THERE HAS BEEN AN INCREASE IN THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE

PARTICIPATED, THAT'S THE GOAL. THAT'S THE REASON WE'RE DOING THE BILL. SO,

IF WE SEE THAT IS GOING TO BE HAPPENING IN NEW YORK, AGAIN, WE'LL HAVE

TO ADJUST. THE WORST CASE SCENARIO IS THAT WE SEE A LOT MORE PEOPLE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VOTING AND THAT WE HAVE TO ADJUST THEREFOR.

MR. NORRIS: BUT YOU MAY SEE THE SAME AMOUNT OF

PEOPLE IN A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR AS YOU WOULD IN A REGULAR PRESIDENTIAL

YEAR, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: WE MIGHT.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. WILL THERE STILL BE ELECTIONS IN

ODD YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: YES, THERE WOULD FOR NOW, UNTIL WE DO

THE SECOND ROUND OF THIS TO TRY TO CLEAN UP THE REST OF THE OFFICES THAT

WE CAN INCLUDE HERE BECAUSE OF CONSTITUTIONAL PROBLEMS.

MR. NORRIS: WILL THERE BE ELECTIONS IN ODD YEARS

TO FILL IN EXPIRED TERMS THEN?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, THERE'S A PROVISION AS I'M SURE

YOU'RE FAMILIAR IN THE CONSTITUTION THAT REQUIRES VACANCIES TO BE FILLED IN

AN ORDERLY MANNER, WHICH HAS BEEN INTERPRETED BY THE COURTS TO MEAN

THREE MONTHS. IF THERE'S -- YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S NO GENERAL ELECTION

WITHIN THAT TIME FRAME. SO WE WOULD -- THAT'S THE PROVISION THAT WE

WOULD HAVE TO CHANGE IN ORDER TO ALLOW VACANCIES TO BE LONGER

PARTICULARLY FOR JUDGES, AND WE ALREADY HAVE APPOINTMENTS FOR THOSE

POSITIONS SO THE APPOINTMENTS WOULD HAVE TO BE A LITTLE LONGER TO MAKE

IT POSSIBLE FOR THEM TO VOTE ON EVEN YEARS. SO, THAT'S SOME OF THE

PROVISIONS THAT WE WOULD NEED TO LOOK AT.

MR. NORRIS: I SEE, OKAY.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL, PLEASE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THANK YOU

TO THE SPONSOR FOR ANSWERING MY QUESTIONS.

THIS IS A DRAMATIC SHIFT IN HOW ELECTIONS ARE GOING TO

OPERATE IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK. AND I HAVE TO SAY THAT I REMEMBER

WHEN I WAS A COMMISSIONER OF ELECTIONS DURING A PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTION YEAR, AND IT TRULY IS UTTER CHAOS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE

ACCOMMODATE THE INCREASE IN VOTERS WHO CAN ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, GO TO

THE SITES, FILL OUT THEIR BALLOT, THEY ASK FOR THAT BALLOT APPLICATION, THE

TURNOUT IS VERY DRAMATIC. NOW, WITH THAT BEING SAID, I'M VERY

CONCERNED ABOUT THE SIZE OF THE BALLOT AND THE CONFUSION AMONGST

VOTERS WHEN THEY ACTUALLY GO TO THE POLLING SITE AND THEY TRY TO

COMPLETE A BALLOT WITH UP TO 25, 20 OR 25 DIFFERENT OFFICES. ALSO, WHEN

YOU TAKE A LOOK AT CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS THAT MIGHT BE ON THERE AS

WELL OR A LOCAL REFERENDUM THAT MIGHT BE ON THERE. IT MAY TAKE THEM

15 MINUTES OR LONGER TO FILL OUT A BALLOT. AND THAT ACTUALLY I THINK IS

GOING TO HAVE A CHILLING EFFECT ON INDIVIDUALS WHO WANT TO GO OUT AND

PARTICIPATE IN THE PROCESS. AND I THINK WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR

FOREFATHERS, MOTHERS, WHEN THEY LOOKED AT DESIGNING THE CONSTITUTION,

THEY SAID WE'RE GOING TO HAVE THE CITY ELECTIONS, LOCAL ELECTIONS, IN A

LOCAL YEAR. IT'S ALREADY EMBODIED WITHIN THE CONSTITUTION. I WISH THEY

WOULD HAVE SAID THAT FOR THE COUNTIES AND THE TOWNS, BUT THAT IS ALSO AN

ELECTION LOCAL YEAR.

I CAN TELL YOU AS A FORMER TOWN ATTORNEY, SOMEONE

WHO HAS PARTICIPATED IN TOWN ELECTIONS, THEY ARE -- NOT MYSELF AS A

CANDIDATE BUT AS COUNTY CHAIRMAN I WAS -- THERE WAS MANY ISSUES FOR

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LOCAL GOVERNMENTS THAT WERE DEALT WITH. NOW, TAKE A LOOK AT YOUR

MAILBOX, ALREADY IN A PRESIDENTIAL OR GUBERNATORIAL YEAR, YOU GET STACKS

OF MAIL. I CAN'T IMAGINE THROWING MAIL IN FOR THE TOWN SUPERVISOR, THE

TOWN HIGHWAY SUPERINTENDANT, THE COUNTY LEGISLATOR, THE --

POTENTIALLY THE COUNTY CLERK IF WE MAKE THIS AMENDMENT OR MAYBE

THEY'RE RUNNING ON THERE AND THE TOWN BOARD MEMBERS AND ON AND ON

AND ON. THIS IS GOING TO FRUSTRATE THE VOTERS. IT'S GOING TO HAVE A

CHILLING EFFECT ON OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES. I AM, YOU KNOW, VERY MUCH

FOR LOCAL CONTROL, LOCAL AUTONOMY AT THE LOCAL LEVEL. WE'VE HAD MAJOR

ISSUES. I CAN TELL YOU, ON ZONING, ON WIND AND SOLAR, FOR EXAMPLE.

THAT'S THE BIGGEST ONE IN MY NECK OF THE WOODS. AND PEOPLE COME

OUT, THEY CAN FOCUS ON IT DURING THE DEBATE OF A LOCAL ELECTION YEAR AND

NOT BE DISTRACTED BY THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, THE GUBERNATORIAL

ELECTION, THE CONGRESSIONAL ELECTION, THE SENATE AND ASSEMBLY

ELECTIONS, THEY CAN FOCUS ON THEIR LOCAL CONTROL. MY TIME IS UP, BUT I

WILL TELL YOU I'M OPPOSED TO THIS BILL. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. RA.

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MS. PAULIN. SO, I WANT TO START

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WITH JUST SOME GENERAL QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PROCESS THAT CAME UP ABOUT

THIS BILL AND A COUPLE OF THEM I RAISED ON THE AMENDMENT EARLIER. LET

ME START WITH ONE OF THE THINGS I MENTIONED. I -- I RECALL AROUND THIS

TIME LAST YEAR WHEN YOU DECIDED THAT THE BILL WAS NOT READY TO BE

MOVED FORWARD AND YOU TALKING ABOUT HOLDING HEARINGS AND

DISCUSSIONS REGARDING THIS BILL. WERE ANY HEARINGS HELD REGARDING THIS

BILL?

MS. PAULIN: NO, THEY WERE NOT. I'M -- I'M NOT ON

THE COMMITTEE AND I'M NOT THE CHAIR AND I HAD THIS BILL AND WE ACTUALLY

GOT IT IN MUCH BETTER FORM.

MR. RA: OKAY. DID YOU HAVE CONVERSATIONS WITH

THE, YOU KNOW, WITH TOWN SUPERVISORS AND COUNTY EXECUTIVES AND

YOU KNOW, THE STATEWIDE ASSOCIATIONS THAT REPRESENT THEM?

MS. PAULIN: I WOULD SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THE BILL

HAS BEEN OUT THERE. WE HAVE MEMOS OF OPPOSITION AND SUPPORT AND,

YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN NOW FLOATING FOR A WHOLE YEAR PAST THAT POINT SO

LOTS OF PEOPLE COULD HAVE WAITED IF THEY WANTED TO JUST LIKE ON ALL THE

BILLS WE DO.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND IN TERMS OF HOW WERE BRINGING

THIS FORWARD AND YOU MENTIONED WITH MR. NORRIS THAT THERE ARE THINGS

THAT YOU'LL BE LOOKING TO CLEAN UP LATER ON, BUT DOES -- DOES THAT INCLUDE

ADVANCING A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT -- (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) -- CITY

ELECTIONS?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I -- I WOULD THINK IN ORDER TO

REALLY -, I MEAN THERE'S TWO GOALS HERE, RIGHT? SO, THERE'S ONE THAT

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INCREASES VOTER PARTICIPATION, AND THEN THE SECOND GOAL IS TO MAKE IT

LESS EXPENSIVE FOR THE TAXPAYERS. WE DO NOT ACCOMPLISH THE SECOND

GOAL UNTIL WE MAKE SOME OF THOSE CHANGES TO THE CONSTITUTION. SO YES,

THAT WOULD BE THE INTENT, MY INTENT.

MR. RA: ALL RIGHT, BECAUSE I'M SURE YOU CAN

IMAGINE, YOU KNOW, FOR MANY IN THIS CHAMBER WE KNOW THAT THIS IS -

LET'S BE FRANK - THIS IS NO SURPRISE TO ANYBODY. THIS HAS BEEN A LARGELY

NEW YORK CITY DOMINATED CHAMBER FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND

OBVIOUSLY THAT'S THE BIG, YOU KNOW, POPULATION CENTER OF OUR STATE AND

THAT'S -- THAT'S WHERE A LOT OF MEMBERS COME FROM. AND WE'RE LOOKING

AT THIS AND AT LEAST TODAY THERE'S NO BILL BEFORE US TO MAKE THAT CHANGE

SO IT'S NOT GOING TO APPLY THERE, IT'S NOT GOING TO APPLY TO ANY OF THE

OTHER CITIES IN THE STATE, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: THAT'S -- THAT'S CORRECT. BUT AS, YOU

KNOW, YOU KNOW, THE CONSTITUTIONAL CHANGE NEEDS TO BE PASSED IN BY

TWO DIFFERENT LEGISLATURES AND SO WE HAVE ONE WHOLE MORE YEAR TO -- TO

GET THAT DONE.

MR. RA: OKAY. SO, IN TERMS OF THE -- THE BILL

LANGUAGE ITSELF.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. RA: CAN YOU EXPLAIN THE PIECE REGARDING -- IT'S

RIGHT ON THE FIRST PAGE ABOUT THE --

MS. PAULIN: THE COTERMINOUS?

MR. RA: WELL, THE THREE-YEAR TERM PRIOR TO JANUARY

1ST, 2025. CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN THAT IN CONTEXT OF -- OF THE BILL?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: OH, LET'S SEE. BY ANNUAL TOWN

ELECTION -- OTHER THAN TOWN JUSTICE OR ANY TOWN WITH A THREE-YEAR TERM.

SO, I THINK WE EXCLUDE THREE-YEAR TERM, RIGHT? YEAH. WE EXCLUDE

ANYBODY WHO CURRENTLY HAS A THREE-YEAR TERM FOR NOW.

MR. RA: SO, BUT IF -- IF THIS BECOMES LAW, SO THEN

ANY OFFICE THAT HAS A -- CURRENTLY HAS A THREE-YEAR TERM IS -- IT'S NOT,

YOU KNOW, JUST UP TO THAT TIME AND THEN THEY GET PUT IN LATER LIKE SOME

OF THE OTHER ONES WITH THE SHORTER TERM THAT THOSE OFFICES ARE JUST

EXCLUDED.

MS. PAULIN: FOR NOW. YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT JUST

LIKE VILLAGES ARE EXCLUDED, THEY WERE VERY COMPLICATED, WE HAD

VILLAGES IN MARCH, IN NOVEMBER, IN JUNE. YOU KNOW, WE JUST CHOSE TO

GO -- TO GO THIS SLOW SO THAT WE DON'T MESS ANYTHING UP.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND THEN THIS WAS ASKED AT THE

CODES COMMITTEE MEETING BUT I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT FOR THE RECORD

ABOUT WHY THERE IS AN AMENDMENT TO THE VILLAGE LAW, EVEN THOUGH THIS

DOES NOT APPLY TO VILLAGES, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. THERE ARE SIX COTERMINOUS TOWN

VILLAGES. THE -- WHAT WE TRIED TO DO IS TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT IF YOU'RE

OPERATING AS A VILLAGE, YOU'RE STILL A VILLAGE. BUT IF YOU'RE OPERATING AS

A TOWN, YOU'RE CONSIDERED UNDER THE -- UNDER THE LAW, UNDER THE BILL.

YOU ALSO HAVE ONE UNIQUE SITUATION ACTUALLY NEAR HERE, WHERE THEY

ELECT BOTH TOWN AND VILLAGE AT THE SAME TIME. SO WE EXEMPTED THEM

BECAUSE OF THEIR UNIQUENESS. SO, SO, HAD TO DEAL WITH THOSE SIX

COTERMINOUS VILLAGE TOWNS OR TOWN VILLAGES.

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MR. RA: THANK YOU. AND I'LL BE HONEST, THAT WAS

SOMETHING I -- I LEARNED TODAY. I WAS NOT AWARE OF THOSE TOWNS SO IT'S

AN INTERESTING PIECE OF --

MS. PAULIN: I -- I LIVE IN ONE.

MR. RA: OKAY, THERE YOU GO. IN TERMS OF THIS

APPLICATION TO COUNTIES, ALL RIGHT, WE HAVE CERTAIN COUNTY OFFICERS, I

KNOW THIS WAS MENTIONED EARLIER, BUT JUST FOR CLARIFICATION. SO, THAT

WOULD BE WHAT? THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY THAT WOULD NOT BE APPLICABLE --

MS. PAULIN: COUNTY CLERK.

MR. RA: AND THE COUNTY CLERK?

MS. PAULIN: YEP, AND THE SHERIFF. THOSE ARE THE

THREE COUNTY ONES.

MR. RA: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: AND THE REASON IS THAT THEY HAVE TERMS

OUTLINED IN THE CONSTITUTION. SO BECAUSE THEY HAVE TERMS OUTLINED YOU

WOULD SAY TO YOURSELF OKAY, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN STILL DO THIS, RIGHT?

AND MY -- MY COUNTY -- BECAUSE THE DA WAS (INAUDIBLE) APPOINTED TO

THE COURT OF APPEALS IT ISN'T AN EVEN YEAR. SO, BUT BECAUSE OF THE OTHER

PROVISION THAT I MENTIONED EARLIER IN THE CONSTITUTION WHICH SAYS

ESSENTIALLY AS SOON AS THERE'S A VACANCY YOU HAVE TO FILL IT IN AN ORDERLY

WAY, WHICH IS AGAIN DEEMED BY THE COURTS TO MEAN, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S --

YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE THREE MONTHS PRIOR, YOU HAVE TO HAVE A SPECIAL

ELECTION. THEN, BECAUSE OF THAT PROVISION, IT PREVENTS US FROM -- IT GOT

MUCH MORE COMPLICATED TO DEAL WITH THEM. WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH THE

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.

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MR. RA: AND AS YOU MENTIONED, I KNOW WE HAVE THE

SAME THING IN NASSAU A FEW -- A FEW YEARS BACK WHEN THE -- THE DA

WAS ELECTED TO CONGRESS. WHENEVER THE SPECIAL ELECTIONS ARE --

HAPPENS THEY SERVE A FULL TERM --

MS. PAULIN: BECAUSE OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL

PROVISION FOR THE TERMS.

(INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK)

MR. RA: AND IT'S THE SAME WITH COUNTY CLERKS.

MS. PAULIN: YEP.

MR. RA: OKAY. SO AT THE TOWN LEVEL, THOUGH, THIS

WOULD BE -- BECAUSE I KNOW LIKE ON LONG ISLAND, WE HAVE ACTUALLY

TOWNS THAT I REPRESENT. I REPRESENT PARTS OF TWO OF THEM AND -- AND ONE

HAS A FOUR-YEAR TERM FOR THE TOWN CLERK AND ONE HAS A TWO-YEAR TERM

FOR THE TOWN CLERK. SO, I BELIEVE THEY'RE ACTUALLY BOTH UP FOR ELECTION

THIS YEAR AND ONE WILL BE ELECTED FOR A TWO-YEAR -- NO, I'M SORRY. ONE

OF THEM IS NOT UP FOR ELECTION. IT STILL HAS TWO YEARS LEFT ON THE TERM.

SO, LET ME LOOK AT IT FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE.

SO, THIS IS A TOWNWIDE ELECTED OFFICIAL, A TOWN CLERK

WHO IS UP FOR ELECTION THIS YEAR, THEY GET ELECTED TO A TWO-YEAR TERM.

WHEN DO THEY GO BEFORE THE VOTERS AGAIN?

MS. PAULIN: SO, THEN THEY WOULD GO WHEN THEIR

TERM EXPIRED, BUT THEY WOULD GO FOR A TRUNCATED ONE-YEAR TERM TO BRING

THEM TO THE EVEN YEAR POINT.

MR. RA: SO, IN 2025 THEY WOULD RUN -- HAVE TO RUN

FOR A ONE-YEAR TERM.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT. THAT'S WHY THERE'S A

COMPLICATED PROVISION IN THE STAFF -- IN THE -- IN THE BILL THAT ESSENTIALLY

ALLOWS FOR THAT ODD YEAR, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE SAYING IT TAKES EFFECT IN

2025.

MR. RA: AND THEN THAT TOWN CLERK SAY WHO --

WHOSE TERM EXPIRES IN 2025, THEY WOULD ALSO RUN FOR A ONE-YEAR TERM

AT THAT POINT?

MS. PAULIN: THREE YEARS.

MR. RA: OH, THEY WOULD RUN FOR THREE YEARS, OKAY,

TO '28.

MS. PAULIN: BECAUSE WE'RE ONLY TRUNCATING ONE

YEAR.

MR. RA: OKAY, INTERESTING. OKAY. SO, I'M TRYING TO

-- I'M TRYING TO WRAP MY HEAD AROUND THIS BECAUSE IT'S SEEMS A LITTLE

TRICKY.

MS. PAULIN: BELIEVE ME, IT WAS HARDER TO WRITE.

MR. RA: THEY'D BOTH BE EXPIRING AT THE SAME TIME,

BUT -- SO, I -- I GUESS THAT -- THAT LEADS ME TO THIS QUESTION SINCE, YOU

KNOW, THOSE ARE THE SAME OFFICES BUT DIFFERENT TOWNS, (INAUDIBLE) AND I

KNOW, YOU KNOW. I BELIEVE ONE OF OUR FORMER COLLEAGUES WHO WAS THE

TOWN CLERK IN ONE OF THOSE TOWNS HAD A TWO-YEAR TERM AT THE TIME AND

EVENTUALLY THEY MADE IT FOUR. SO, HOW DOES -- HOW DO WE DEAL WITH

THAT PIECE OF IT, THOUGH, THAT THESE TOWNS AND I BELIEVE THE STATE -- I

BELIEVE THE STATE NEEDED TO LEGISLATE TO ALLOW THAT CHANGE IN TERMS AT

THE TIME. I DON'T KNOW, ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THAT?

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MS. PAULIN: I DON'T REMEMBER.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND IN TERMS OF OTHER TOWN OFFICERS,

IT WOULD BE -- IT APPLIES THE SAME WHETHER IT'S A TOWN-WIDE OR

SOMEBODY IN A DISTRICT, A COUNCILMEMBER OR --

MS. PAULIN: THE ONLY THING THAT IT DOESN'T APPLY TO

IS TOWN JUSTICES BECAUSE THE COURTS HAVE INTERPRETED THE CONSTITUTION

SIMILARLY AS THEY -- AS THEY DID WITH THE OTHER JUSTICES. SO, BECAUSE OF

THE -- BECAUSE OF THAT, TOWN JUSTICES ARE EXCLUDED FROM THIS.

MR. RA: OKAY. AND SAME ON THE COUNTY LEVEL --

MS. PAULIN: ALL THE JUSTICES; COUNTIES, SUPREME,

(INAUDIBLE) IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT BUT COUNTY, FAMILY, WHAT'S THE OTHER ONE?

BUT -- SURROGATE.

MR. RA: AND SO LASTLY, WITH REGARD TO COUNTY

LEGISLATORS, WHICH, YOU KNOW, I KNOW SOME COUNTIES HAVE SOME, SOME

DON'T. THOSE WOULD ALSO BE RUNNING WHEN? IF -- IF THEY'RE UP THIS YEAR

AND THEY HAVE SAY A TWO-YEAR TERM, THEY'RE ALSO WHAT? UP FOR A ONE-

YEAR TERM IN TWO YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: NO. THIS TIME THEY'RE RUNNING, IT'S --

THEY -- THEY DO WHAT THE PETITION AND THE ELECTOR BELIEVED THEY WERE

GOING TO BE DOING, WHICH IS TWO YEARS. OR IF IT'S A COUNTY EXECUTIVE

AND IT'S FOUR YEARS, FOUR YEARS. WHATEVER THEY'RE RUNNING FOR IN THIS ODD

YEAR, THEY FILL THEIR WHOLE TERM. IT'S ONLY THE NEXT TIME THERE'S AN

ELECTION THAT IT'S TRUNCATED TO BRING IT TO THE EVEN YEAR.

MR. RA: SO, THEY WOULD BE A ONE-YEAR --

MS. PAULIN: A ONE-YEAR FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PERSON.

MR. RA: OKAY, THANK YOU.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. RA: SO, I -- I JUST WANT TO, AGAIN, POINT OUT A

COUPLE OF THINGS ABOUT THIS BILL. YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND THE

CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISIONS. I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF TRUST BEING ASKED ON

US TO SAY WE'RE GOING AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE SUBJECT THE CITIES OF

THIS STATE. THIS CAN BE A PLACE VERY OFTEN THAT PARTICULARLY SUBURBAN

LAWMAKERS CAN FEEL LIKE THEY'RE BEING DOMINATED BY THE CITIES. AND I

KNOW PEOPLE THAT I'VE TALKED TO BACK HOME FEEL THAT WAY TODAY WITH

THIS BILL BEFORE US AND I FEEL THAT WAY BECAUSE WE'RE NOT MOVING

FORWARD THE SAME TYPE OF BILL DOING FIRST PASSAGE OF A CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT, WHICH WE COULD BE DOING TODAY TO SHOW THAT WE'RE SERIOUS

ABOUT DOING THIS FOR EVERYBODY. SO, IT'S VERY HARD FOR ME TO BELIEVE

THAT THERE'S NOT A REASON WHY WE'RE DOING ONE AND NOT THE OTHER. AND

LET'S BE HONEST, IT COULD BE COLLEAGUES WHO REPRESENT THE CITIES WHO

VOTE FOR THIS THAT APPLIES TO NONE OF THEM AND APPLIES TO ALL OF OUR

TOWNS AND COUNTIES HAVING THE STATE COME IN AND MANDATE THEM TO

CHANGE THEIR ELECTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN HELD AT A CERTAIN TIME FOR, I DON'T

KNOW, A HUNDRED YEARS, HUNDREDS OF YEARS, I BELIEVE.

NOW, I SAID ON THE DEBATE EARLIER, YOU KNOW, WE'VE

DONE A LOT TO INCREASE VOTER TURNOUT IN THIS STATE, BUT PART OF THAT IS

ENGAGING THE VOTERS. THEY NEED TO BE INTERESTED IN WHAT'S GOING ON.

AND WE'RE PUTTING OUR COUNTIES AND TOWNS IN A SITUATION NOW THAT THOSE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

LOCAL ISSUES, THE COUNTY ASSESSMENT, THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IN A TOWN,

OR EVEN THOSE EVERYDAY QUALITY OF LIFE THINGS LIKE -- LIKE THE CONDITION

OF ROADS AND PARKS THAT PEOPLE CARE A LOT ABOUT ARE GOING TO BE PLAYING

NOT SECOND FIDDLE BUT THIRD, FOURTH, FIFTH FIDDLE TO WHAT'S GOING IN A

PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION RACE OR WHAT'S GOING ON IN A GOVERNOR'S RACE OR

WHAT'S GOING ON IN A CONGRESSIONAL RACE ABOVE THEM. AND THOSE

CANDIDATES AREN'T -- AREN'T EVEN GOING TO REALLY BE ABLE TO MAKE THAT

CASE TO THE VOTERS ABOUT A LOCAL TOWN BEING BROKEN THAT THEY -- THAT

THEY ARE COMING IN TO FIX AFTER MAYBE ONE PARTY RULE FOR -- FOR YEARS OR

-- OR SOMETHING (INAUDIBLE). SO, THEY'RE LOSING THAT ABILITY. THEY'RE

GOING -- THE MAILBOXES WILL BE FULL OF -- OF THOSE CONGRESSIONAL FLYERS

AND THOSE -- THOSE LEGISLATIVE RACES ABOVE THEM, THE STATE LEGISLATIVE

RACES. THAT'S GOING TO BE WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO SEE ON TV AND

COMMERCIALS AND THE VOTERS ARE GOING TO BE IN MANY WAYS MAKING THEIR

DECISION BASED ON THAT AND NOT THOSE LOCAL ISSUES THAT NEED AN AIRING

AND AGAIN, VOTER TURNOUT, VOTER ENGAGEMENT. ENGAGING THOSE FOLKS IN

THEIR LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

NOW, THE ONE OTHER THING I DO WANT TO MENTION IS THE

OVERALL LENGTH OF THE BALLOT. LAST YEAR WE HAD A PRESS CONFERENCE AND I

SAID AND I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW, THIS IS WHAT IT SEEMED LIKE TO ME, THE

BALLOT WILL LOOK LIKE A CVS RECEIPT, BECAUSE HOW DO YOU FIT ALL OF THE

THESE OFFICES ON A SINGLE BALLOT? I KNOW THERE'S OPPORTUNITIES WITHIN

THE LAW TO DO THINGS, BUT IT'S GOING TO BE HUGE AND AGAIN, I WONDER -- I

WONDER AGAIN HOW MUCH OF AN IMPACT THAT HAS ON THAT LOCAL RACE IF

PEOPLE GET TIRED. WE KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE, RIGHT, IN THE PRESIDENTIAL

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ELECTION, THEY MAY GO IN AND JUST VOTE FOR PRESIDENT AND NOT VOTE DOWN

THE BALLOT. THEY MAY NEVER MAKE IT TO THESE LOCAL -- LOCAL RACES. AND

THEN THIS DOESN'T HAVE ANYWHERE OF THE IMPACT THAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR.

SO, I WOULD URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO REJECT THIS. THIS

BILL IS NOT READY FOR IT TO BE PASSED AND WE NEED TO INCLUDE EVERYBODY

(INAUDIBLE) IN PARTICULAR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MS. HYNDMAN.

MS. HYNDMAN: MR. SPEAKER, PLEASE CALL WAYS

AND MEANS TO THE SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MS.

HYNDMAN.

WAYS AND MEANS SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM

IMMEDIATELY, PLEASE.

AND MR. CURRAN, YOU'RE UP.

MR. CURRAN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR A COUPLE QUESTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: SPONSOR YIELDS.

MR. CURRAN: THANK YOU, MS. PAULIN.

SO, I KNOW THAT YOU WERE IN CODES COMMITTEE AND

YOU HEARD A LOT OF MY QUESTIONS BUT I'M GOING TO REPEAT SOME OF THEM

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: SURE.

MR. CURRAN: -- JUST TO GET SOME ANSWERS IF YOU

DON'T MIND. SO, FIRST OFF, THE FOLLOWING ELECTIONS AREN'T INCLUDED IN THIS

BILL, RIGHT? VILLAGE ELECTIONS, SCHOOL BOARD ELECTIONS AND FIRE DISTRICT

ELECTIONS, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: TRUE.

MR. CURRAN: ALL RIGHT. IN YOUR MEMO, THE

JUSTIFICATION FOR THIS BILL IS TO CLEAN UP VOTER CONFUSION AND COST-

SAVINGS. I GUESS MY FIRST QUESTION IS, IF VILLAGE ELECTIONS, WHICH ARE BY

FAR THE MOST FRAGMENTED ELECTIONS THROUGHOUT THE STATE, SOME ARE HELD

IN MARCH, SOME ARE HELD IN JUNE, WHY ARE THEY NOT INCLUDED IN THIS

BILL?

MS. PAULIN: IT WAS JUST ENORMOUSLY COMPLICATED.

YOU KNOW, WE NEEDED TO NARROW IT, YOU KNOW, GET THROUGH THIS AND

THEN TACKLE THAT. IT WAS JUST ENORMOUSLY COMPLICATED BECAUSE OF ALL OF

THE REASONS THAT YOU MENTIONED.

MR. CURRAN: ALL RIGHT. AND --

MS. PAULIN: SOME OF THEM ARE RUN BY VILLAGES,

SOME OF THEM ARE RUN BY THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS, YOU KNOW, WE NEEDED

TO GRAPPLE WITH THAT WHOLE THING.

MR. CURRAN: AND IS THERE -- IS THERE A PLAN OR AN

INTENTION GOING FORWARD TO INCLUDE VILLAGE ELECTIONS INTO THIS EVEN YEAR

DATE?

MS. PAULIN: MY -- PLAN IS TO LOOK AT THE WHOLE

PIECE, YES.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. CURRAN: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: I CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR MYSELF.

MR. CURRAN: SURE, I UNDERSTAND. SCHOOL BOARD

ELECTIONS, SCHOOL BOARD ELECTIONS BY FAR ARE THE LOWEST OUTSIDE OF CITIES

VOTER PARTICIPATED ELECTIONS IN THE STATE. WHY ARE THEY NOT INCLUDED IN

THIS BILL?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, LET ME SAY TWO THINGS. FIRST,

SCHOOL BOARD ELECTIONS ARE RUN BY THE SCHOOL SO NOT BY THE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS SO IT GETS COMPLICATED IN THAT REGARD. AND ALSO, THE VOTE FOR

THE SCHOOL BUDGET. SO, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'RE READY AS A STATE TO

MAKE THAT BUDGET VOTE EVERY TWO YEARS. THAT COULD BE -- THAT'S A

PROBLEM.

MR. CURRAN: OKAY. NOW, THE OTHER JUSTIFICATION

IS COST-SAVINGS TO OUR LOCALITIES.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. CURRAN: DO WE HAVE A SPECIFIC NUMBER IN

WHICH LOCALITIES WILL SAVE IF WE MOVE SOME OF THESE ELECTIONS FROM

ODD TO EVEN?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THAT CERTAINLY WE WON'T SAVE AS

MUCH AS WE WILL, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE CONSOLIDATE MORE INTO THE EVEN

YEARS BECAUSE THEN PERHAPS WE WON'T HAVE ODD YEAR ELECTIONS, NOW WE

ARE LIKELY TO HAVE SOME. WE MAY HAVE SOME AREAS THAT WON'T HAVE,

YOU KNOW, WHERE YOU HAVE COUNTY CLERK EVERY FOUR YEARS MAYBE IN

THE TWO-YEAR. IF YOU HAPPEN NOT TO HAVE A JUDGE, YOU KNOW, YOU

WOULDN'T HAVE AN ELECTION. SO IT'S VERY HARD TO GAUGE. I WILL SAY,

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THOUGH, BECAUSE YOU WOULD HAVE FEWER ELECTIONS OF BIG RACES DURING

THAT TIME PERIOD THAT WE PROBABLY WOULD SAVE ON PRIMARIES.

MR. CURRAN: OKAY. BUT LET ME -- LET ME JUST FOR

THE RECORD AND LET ME JUST MAKE SURE THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS. SO,

UNDER THIS BILL, EVEN IF IT'S PASSED AND SIGNED INTO LAW THEY'LL STILL BE

ELECTIONS FOR LOCALITIES IN ODD NUMBER YEARS FOR SHERIFF, COUNTY CLERK,

DISTRICT ATTORNEYS AND NUMEROUS JUDGES. SO UNTIL -- AND I THINK YOU

STATED YOUR INTENT TO TRY TO CONSOLIDATE SOME OF THOSE AND MOVE THEM

TO EVEN YEARS BUT THAT'S GOING TO BE IN THE FUTURE. WOULD IT BE FAIR TO

SAY THAT UNTIL THAT CONSOLIDATION HAPPENS, THAT LOCALITIES WILL SEE VERY

LITTLE SAVINGS BECAUSE THEY'RE STILL HOLDING THE VERY SAME ELECTION WITH

THE SAME INSPECTION SITES, WITH THE SAME INSPECTORS, WITH THE SAME COST

ASSOCIATED WITH IT WITH BALLOTS, WITH VOTING MACHINES? SO UNTIL THAT

CONSOLIDATION HAPPENS IT REALLY ISN'T GOING TO SEE ANY COST-SAVINGS

OTHER THAN WHAT YOU SAID, MAYBE POSSIBILITY OF LESS PRIMARIES, BUT THAT'S

KIND OF OUT THERE.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I'LL TELL YOU ONE COST-SAVING.

MR. CURRAN: SURE.

MS. PAULIN: ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE KNOW THAT

HAPPENS DURING THE EVEN YEARS NOW, WHEN THERE'S MORE PEOPLE ON THE

BALLOT, WE SEE A LOT OF OVERTIME AT THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS BECAUSE

THEY'RE DEALING WITH CONTESTED RACES, THEY'RE DEALING WITH QUITE A LOT OF

STUFF.

MR. CURRAN: SURE.

MS. PAULIN: SO, I THINK THAT ON THOSE ODD YEARS

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WHEN THERE'S VERY FEW RACES WE'RE GOING TO SEE VERY LITTLE OVERTIME, SO

THAT WILL BE A SAVINGS THAT WE CAN ANTICIPATE RIGHT AWAY.

MR. CURRAN: BUT CLEARLY, LIKE YOU JUST SAID, IF

WE'RE GOING TO SEE THE SAVINGS IN THE EVEN YEARS -- WELL, THE ODD YEARS

BECAUSE WE'RE MOVING SOME OF THE RACES TO THE EVEN YEARS, THEN

OBVIOUSLY WE'RE GOING TO SEE MORE OVERTIME IN THE ODD YEARS BASED

UPON THE MORE CANDIDATES AND RACES THAT WE HAVE; IS THAT FAIR?

MS. PAULIN: PERHAPS. I WOULD -- I WOULD SAY

THAT -- THAT COULD DEFINITELY HAPPEN BUT THERE'S STATUTORY REQUIREMENTS

TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S DONE WITHIN A CERTAIN TIME FRAME. SO, YOU KNOW,

PEOPLE CAN JUST WORK SO MANY HOURS IN THE DAY AND, YOU KNOW, WE

MAY SEE MORE EFFICIENCIES.

MR. CURRAN: LET ME ASK YOU. A QUESTION THAT I

BROUGHT UP IN THE CODES COMMITTEE WAS, IF WE ARE GOING TO ELIMINATE

THE MAJORITY, AT LEAST HALF OF THE ELECTIONS IN ODD YEARS, DID YOU

ANTICIPATE A CUT IN STAFF FOR THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS BECAUSE OF THE

REDUCED WORKLOAD IN THOSE ODD YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: THOSE ARE COUNTY DECISIONS, THAT'S NOT

OURS.

MR. CURRAN: BUT DID YOU TAKE THAT INTO

CONSIDERATION?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I DID NOT. I THINK EACH COUNTY WILL

HAVE TO MAKE A DETERMINATION ABOUT WHAT THEY THINK IS APPROPRIATE

STAFF.

MR. CURRAN: NOW, JUST STAYING ON THE COST, AND I

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KNOW THAT YOU SPOKE TO MR. RA ABOUT THE BALLOT AND MR. NORRIS ABOUT

THE BALLOTS. AND I'M STILL TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THIS. YOU TALKED ABOUT

UNDER THE ELECTION LAW ALL THE CANDIDATES HAVE TO APPEAR ON ONE BALLOT

OR AT LEAST THAT'S HOW IT'S CURRENTLY WRITTEN.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. CURRAN: BUT YOU HAD STATED THAT THERE IS A

POSSIBILITY FOR A PERFORATED BALLOT AND I THINK THE SECOND OPTION, WHAT

WAS THAT?

MS. PAULIN: SO THE SECOND OPTION IS TO HAVE TWO

BALLOTS.

MR. CURRAN: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: YOU KNOW, TWO FULL-FACED BALLOTS

BECAUSE THAT'S THE REQUIREMENT, RIGHT? SO, YOU CAN EITHER HAVE IT

PERFORATED BY SECTION, I DON'T KNOW, 105, I THINK AND THEN SECTION 106

ALLOWS FOR THE SEVERING OF THAT. MAYBE IT'S THE OPPOSITE IN THE SECTIONS.

MR. CURRAN: ALL RIGHT. BUT THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT

TYPES OR NEWER BALLOTS THAN WHAT ARE CURRENTLY EXISTING, IF I UNDERSTAND

YOU CORRECTLY?

MS. PAULIN: NO, IT WOULD BE THE SAME BALLOT.

MR. CURRAN: WE CURRENTLY USE --

MS. PAULIN: YEAH --

MR. CURRAN: -- I DIDN'T MEAN TO INTERRUPT YOU BUT

WE CURRENTLY USE PERFORATED BALLOTS?

MS. PAULIN: YES. WE HAVE USED BOTH, THAT'S WHY

THEY'RE IN THE LAW. THEY'VE BEEN THERE BECAUSE IN NEW YORK CITY, FOR

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

EXAMPLE, WHEN THEY HAVE -- THINK THAT WAS BROUGHT UP AT THE MEETING

MR. CURRAN: RIGHT.

MS. PAULIN: -- YOU KNOW, THEY'VE HAD VERY LONG OR

A LOT OF CANDIDATES RUNNING AND THEY'VE HAD TO USE THOSE BALLOTS.

MR. CURRAN: AND I KNOW THAT IT WAS ASKED

BEFORE, BUT I'M JUST GOING TO ASK AGAIN JUST BECAUSE I WANT TO MAKE

SURE THAT I UNDERSTOOD IT. THERE WOULD BE NO NEED TO RECALIBRATE ANY OF

THE MACHINES BASED UPON THE USE OF THESE PERFORATED BALLOTS --

MS. PAULIN: THAT'S CORRECT.

MR. CURRAN: -- OR USE TWO BALLOTS BECAUSE I

THOUGHT MY UNDERSTANDING WAS NOW THE MACHINE WOULD ONLY ACCEPT

ONE BALLOT AT A TIME.

MS. PAULIN: THAT'S -- THAT'S NOT CORRECT. YOU KNOW

MR. CURRAN: OKAY. THANK YOU.

MS. PAULIN: I MEAN IT'S ONE BALLOT AT A TIME BUT

YOU CAN PUT TWO IN.

MR. CURRAN: OH, I DIDN'T KNOW THAT. I WAS SIMPLY

TOLD THAT IT WOULD ONLY ACCEPT ONE PER --

MS. PAULIN: PER PERSON --

MR. CURRAN: -- YEAH, AND THAT WOULD CAUSE A

RECALIBRATION IF IT WAS THROUGH THE --

MS. PAULIN: NOT ACCORDING TO THE STATE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS.

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MR. CURRAN: OKAY, THANK YOU. ALSO, YOU

INDICATED, AGAIN, AS PART OF THE JUSTIFICATION THAT WHAT LED TO THIS BILL

WAS VOTER CONFUSION.

MS. PAULIN: AND TURNOUT.

MR. CURRAN: AND TURNOUT, BUT ALSO VOTER

CONFUSION. WAS THERE ANY STUDY OR ANY EVIDENCE TO DEMONSTRATE THAT

THERE WAS VOTER CONFUSION IN THE ODD NUMBER OF YEARS THAT YOU HAVE TO

SUPPORT THIS BILL?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK WE JUST SEE A VERY LOW TURNOUT

IN THE ODD YEARS COMPARED TO THE EVEN YEARS. SO, IF VOTERS ARE NOT

REALIZING THAT THERE'S, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE MEAN BY CONFUSION IS THEY'RE

NOT EVEN REALIZING THAT THERE'S AN ELECTION OR ONE THAT MATTERS TO THEM.

YOU KNOW, WE SEE THIS AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO REV UP THE VOTERS, SO THE

VOTERS WILL PAY MORE ATTENTION, YOU KNOW, TO ALL OF THE RACES.

MR. CURRAN: SO, WHEN YOU SAY "VOTER CONFUSION,"

YOU'RE JUST BASING THAT UPON THE DROP IN NUMBERS FROM THE EVEN TO THE

ODD YEARS.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. CURRAN: ALL RIGHT. ALSO, WOULD IT BE FAIR TO

ASSUME THAT IF WE'RE REDUCING THE NUMBER OF RACES IN ODD YEARS, EVEN

THOUGH THEY'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO GO FORWARD WITH LESS CANDIDATES,

THAT'S GOING TO ACTUALLY RESULT IN A LOWER VOTER TURNOUT IN THOSE ODD

YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I AM CONCERNED ABOUT THAT WHICH

IS WHY WE INTEND TO HAVE A PARALLEL CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT TO MAKE

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THAT CHANGE.

MR. CURRAN: OKAY. ALSO, A LOT OF THE LOCAL

OFFICIALS, AT LEAST IN MY AREA, HAVE VOICED THEIR CONCERNS OVER THEIR FEAR

THAT LOCAL ISSUES AND -- AND CANDIDATES, LOCAL CANDIDATES, ARE GOING TO

BE OVERSHADOWED WHEN THEY'RE PUT ON THE BALLOT WITH STATE AND

FEDERAL.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. CURRAN: AND THAT RANGES FROM MONEY, THE

AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT IS DEDICATED TO STATE AND FEDERAL ELECTIONS

COMPARED TO LOCAL ELECTIONS, ALSO MEDIA AND THE OPPORTUNITY TO REACH

OTHER RESIDENTS WITHIN THEIR DISTRICT. DID THAT CONCERN EVER GET FACTORED

INTO YOUR DECISION FOR THIS?

MS. PAULIN: SO, I WOULD SAY THAT PEOPLE PAY MUCH

MORE ATTENTION TO THEIR LOCAL COMMUNITY. FOR EXAMPLE, I WAS ON THE

VILLAGE BOARD WHEN I WAS -- PRIOR TO RUNNING FOR THIS. AND THERE WAS A

BIG, HOT ISSUE IN MY VILLAGE ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WHEN WE INCLUDED

RECYCLING, WE WERE GOING TO DO IT TO BE PICKED UP IN THE BACK OR THE

FRONT, THAT WAS A BIG ISSUE. THE WHOLE VILLAGE GOT INVOLVED IN THAT

ISSUE. LET ME TELL YOU. A LOT MORE TURNOUT FOR THAT ISSUE THAN FOR ANY

STATE OR PRESIDENTIAL THAT I'VE EVER SEEN BECAUSE PEOPLE REALLY CARE.

SO, I THINK PEOPLE CARE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS IN THEIR OWN BACKYARD A LOT

MORE, YOU KNOW, THAN THEY CARE ABOUT THE OTHER STUFF. SO, I DON'T THINK

THAT -- I THINK THE OPPOSITE COULD HAPPEN. I THINK THAT A LOCAL BIG ISSUE

COULD DRIVE TURNOUT TO OUR RACES, FOR EXAMPLE.

MR. CURRAN: RESPECTFULLY DISAGREE JUST BASED

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

UPON THE LAST TWO PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS, BUT LET ME JUST ASK YOU THIS

BECAUSE YOU BRING UP A GREAT POINT. YOU'VE -- YOU'VE HEARD OF AND I'M

SURE IN TALKING TO ELECTION COMMISSIONERS, A BALLOT DROP-OFF WHEN IT

GETS TO THE END OF THE -- END OF THE BALLOT AND THAT THERE IS A CERTAIN

PERCENTAGE IN EVERY ELECTION WITH REGARDS TO BALLOT DROP-OFFS. AND I'VE

BEEN TOLD ANYWHERE FROM FIVE TO TEN PERCENT, DEPENDING ON THE YEAR

AND ANYTHING AND YOU'VE HEARD THE SAME, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: AND WE ALL LOOK FOR IT BECAUSE WE'RE

AT THE END OF THE BALLOT.

MR. CURRAN: YES, YES. SO, I GUESS MY QUESTION IS

THIS. SO, IF EVERYBODY ACKNOWLEDGES THAT THERE IS A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE

OF BALLOT DROP-OFF AT THE END OF THE BALLOT --

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. CURRAN: -- AND AT THE VERY RACES THAT WE'RE

MOVING FROM A ODD YEAR TO AN EVEN YEAR, ARE THE VERY RACES THAT ARE

GOING TO BE DROPPED OFF BY VOTERS. WOULD IT BE SAFE TO ASSUME THAT

WHATEVER PERCENTAGE THAT WE PICK UP IN VOTER TURNOUT, BY MOVING THAT

RACE TO AN EVEN NUMBERED YEAR, WE'RE GOING TO LOSE ON BALLOT DROP-OFF.

MS. PAULIN: SO, I WOULD SAY THAT, YOU KNOW,

AGAIN, IN PLACES THAT HAVE CHANGED THIS, THE TURNOUTS GONE UP A LOT.

ADDITIONALLY, TURNOUT OR -- OR BALLOT DROP-OFF IS NOT THAT SEVERE, IT'S --

IT'S MINISCULE. SO YES. WE WOULD LOSE SOME PEOPLE WITH THE LONG

BALLOT POTENTIALLY, BUT IT WOULD BE STILL SO MUCH GREATER THAN THE WAY

THE OFF-YEARS GO THAT WE WOULD STILL HAVE AN INCREASE TURNOUT, NOT A

DECREASE TURNOUT FOR THOSE -- FOR THOSE RACES.

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MR. CURRAN: LET ME ASK YOU ONE LAST QUESTION,

AND I'M ASKING THIS OUT OF PURE RESPECT FOR YOU AND KNOWING WHAT

YOU'VE DONE IN THIS HOUSE. THE COMMON BELIEF BY LOCAL OFFICIALS,

PARTICULARLY PEOPLE ON MY SIDE, IS THAT SINCE THE CITY OF NEW -- SINCE

ALL OF THE CITIES ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THIS, IN THIS BILL AND THAT BASED UPON

WHAT YOU SAID THERE'S A REPRESENTATION OR A HOPE THAT LATER ON WE WILL

DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT IN THE LOWEST AREAS WHERE WE HAVE VOTER

TURNOUT, WE'RE IGNORING THAT, BUT WE'RE CHOOSING TO ACTUALLY CHANGE THE

LOCAL OF ELECTIONS IN AREAS WHERE THE CHANGE WOULD BENEFIT WITH

INCREASED TURNOUT, ONE PARTY OVER THE OTHER. WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO

THAT?

MS. PAULIN: I'LL SAY TWO THINGS.

MR. CURRAN: SURE.

MS. PAULIN: ONE, I -- I HAVE TWO CITIES THAT I

REPRESENT, SMALL CITIES, AND I WOULD HAVE LOVED TO BE ABLE TO INCLUDE

THEM EXCEPT FOR THE CONSTITUTIONAL CHANGE. SO, I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT

I'M GOING TO BE PICKING UP THAT MANTLE. TWO, I -- I WOULD ARGUE THAT,

YOU KNOW, ALL OF YOU ON THAT SIDE OF THE AISLE GET ELECTED IN AN EVEN

YEAR. SO, YOU KNOW, THE FEAR OF NOT ELECTING YOUR SIDE OF THE AISLE IN AN

EVEN YEAR IS MAYBE NOT AS SIGNIFICANT AS OTHER PEOPLE WORRY.

MR. CURRAN: WELL, AS A PERSON THAT WON BY A 138

VOTES, I MIGHT TEND TO DISAGREE WITH YOU ON VOTER TURNOUT, BUT THANK

YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR ANSWERS AND I APPRECIATE THE TIME. MR.[SIC]

SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANDLER-WATERMAN:

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OKAY, ON THE BILL.

MR. CURRAN: THANK YOU. HERE'S -- HERE'S -- IN

LOOKING AT THIS BILL, I HAVE TO RESPECTFULLY DISAGREE WITH THE SPONSOR IN

THAT THIS BILL HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH EITHER INCREASING VOTER TURN OUT OR

SAVING LOCALITIES FOR ANY MONEY. AND I SAY THAT FOR A -- A VARIETY OF

REASONS. ONE, THIS BILL SPECIFICALLY AS IT IS HERE TONIGHT WITH ONLY

PROMISES THAT WE'RE GOING TO DO SOMETHING IN THE FUTURE, EXCLUDES

EVERY CITY WITHIN THE STATE, WHICH IS ONE-THIRD OF THE VOTERS EVERY TIME

THAT THEY GO TO THE POLLING. SECOND, IT WOULDN'T INCLUDE SCHOOL DISTRICT

ELECTIONS AND FIRE DISTRICTS THAT HAVE THE LOWER VOTER TURNOUT OF

EVERYWHERE EXCEPT FOR THE CITIES. THEN, IT WILL DECREASE VOTER TURNOUT

IN THE ELECTIONS THAT REMAIN IN ODD NUMBERED YEARS AND THERE'S A

PERCENTAGE, AS WE SPOKE ABOUT, OF BALLOTS DROP-OFF IN EVERY ELECTION

THAT WILL OFFSET ANY VOTER INCREASE IN THE LOCAL ELECTIONS THAT WE'RE

ACTUALLY MOVING TO THE EVEN NUMBERED YEARS. IT'S ALSO NOT ABOUT COST-

SAVINGS IN THE MONEY. BOARD OF ELECTIONS ARE WILLING TO INCUR

INCREASED COSTS FOR -- I BELIEVE FOR NEW BALLOTS FOR THE WAY THAT THEY

HAVE TO ACTUALLY DEAL WITH IT. AND -- I'M SORRY. IS MY TIME UP? YOU

KNOW WHAT? MR. SPEAKER, BASED UPON THIS AND THE SKEPTIC IN ME SAYS

THAT THIS BILL IS PURELY ABOUT POLITICS. IT'S ABOUT RESHUFFLING CERTAIN

ELECTIONS TO EVEN YEARS SO THAT ONE PARTY HAS MORE OF A CHANCE TO WIN

THOSE ELECTIONS. AND FOR THAT REASON, MR. [SIC]SPEAKER, I'M VOTING IN

THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANDLER-WATERMAN:

MR. ARI BROWN.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. WILL

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANDLER-WATERMAN:

WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MR. A. BROWN: TWO EASY QUESTIONS, RESPECTFULLY.

WE WILL BE CARRYING MORE PETITIONS, MILLION OF MORE PIECES OF MAIL,

WE'LL HAVE THIS CRAZY LONG BALLOT, CRAZY LONG LINES TO VOTE, 24/ MEDIA, I

MEAN IT'S EVERYBODY'S CAMPAIGN ON THERE IF WE CAN'T TAKE IT NOW.

BOARDS OF ELECTIONS THAT CAN'T POSSIBLY HANDLE DOUBLE THE AMOUNT OF

ELECTORATES AND I ASK, WHY? I KNOW YOU'VE ANSWERED THAT IN SEVERAL

DIFFERENT WAYS. WHY, WHAT IS THE BENEFIT OF THIS IN A VERY SIMPLE TERM?

MS. PAULIN: MORE PEOPLE VOTING IS GOOD FOR

DEMOCRACY.

MR. A. BROWN: GOOD ANSWER. SO THEN I ASK, WHY

NOT TAKE THIS GREAT EXPERIMENT, LET'S TAKE IT ON THE CITY FIRST AND SEE

HOW IT GOES, BECAUSE IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS DO AS I

SAY, NOT AS I DO. EVERYBODY WHO WANTS IT ON THE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ARE

PUTTING IT ON THE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, THEY LIVE IN THE CITY. LET'S TRY IT

OUT ON THE CITY FIRST.

MS. PAULIN: I AGREE THAT WE SHOULD MOVE THE CITY

TO THE SAME PLACE.

MR. A. BROWN: WELL, LET'S DO IT FIRST. LET'S SEE

HOW THAT GOES FIRST, SEE HOW IT GOES AND THEN WE'LL DEAL -- DEAL WITH THE

VILLAGES. WE'LL DEAL WITH THE TOWNS, WE'LL DEAL WITH THE COUNTIES

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BECAUSE WE SIMPLY DON'T WANT IT.

MS. PAULIN: I HEAR YOU, BUT I LIVE IN AN AREA THAT

I'M NOT -- YOU KNOW, I LIVE IN A SUBURB. I LIVE IN AN AREA THAT HAS

VILLAGE, TOWNS AND COUNTIES AND SO I WAS LOOKING AT THAT THROUGH THAT --

THROUGH -- I WAS LOOKING AT IT THROUGH THAT LENS.

MR. A. BROWN: THANK YOU, MADAM SPONSOR.

MADAM SPEAKER, ON THE BILL, PLEASE.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANLDER-WATERMAN:

ON THE BILL.

MR. A. BROWN: YES. AS I'VE SAID MANY TIMES IN

THIS CHAMBER, THERE'S NO BETTER GOVERNMENT THAN LOCAL GOVERNMENT.

WHY MESS WITH THIS? I HAVE DEEP CONCERNS ABOUT THE PROPOSAL TO

CHANGE THE FREQUENCY OF ELECTIONS FROM ODD TO EVEN YEARS. I FIRMLY

BELIEVE THAT IT POSES SIGNIFICANT DRAWBACKS AND UNDERMINES THE

PRINCIPALS OF DEMOCRATIC GOVERNANCE THAT WE HOLD SO DEAR. IT CERTAINLY

WAS DESIGNED TO PUNISH LONG ISLAND AND ALL SUBURBAN NEIGHBORHOODS.

THE LANGUAGE CLEARLY SAYS SO.

FIRST AND FOREMOST, ALTERING THE ELECTION STYLE FROM

ODD TO EVEN YEARS WOULD DISRUPT THE BALLOTS AND STABILITY OF OUR

DEMOCRATIC SYSTEM. REGULAR ELECTIONS ARE A CRUCIAL COMPONENT TO THE

HEALTHY DEMOCRACY AS THEY PROVIDE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR CITIZENS TO

EXERCISE THEIR RIGHT TO VOTE AND HOLD THEIR ELECTED OFFICIALS ACCOUNTABLE.

CHANGING THIS FREQUENCY OF ELECTIONS WOULD INTRODUCE UNNECESSARY

COMPLEXITY AND CONFUSION AMONG VOTERS MAKING IT HARDER FOR THEM TO

STAY INFORMED AND ENGAGED IN THE POLITICAL PROCESS. IT WOULD CERTAINLY

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LEAD TO VOTER FATIGUE AS INDIVIDUALS WOULD FACE -- BE FACED WITH AN

OVERWHELMING NUMBER OF ELECTIONS TO PARTICIPATE IN WITH A SHORT SPAN

OF TIME. FATIGUE WOULD CERTAINLY SET IN WITH A NEW 20 MILE LONG

MAGILLA STYLE VOTING SHEET. MOREOVER, ALTERING THE ELECTION STYLE

WOULD LIKELY RESULT IN LOWER VOTER TURNOUT, WHICH IS ALREADY A

SIGNIFICANT CONCERN IN MANY DEMOCRACIES AROUND THE WORLD, CERTAINLY

IN THE UNITED STATES. THE PROPOSED CHANGE WOULD DILUTE THE

SIGNIFICANCE OF EACH ELECTION AS VOTERS WILL NOT RECEIVE THE SAME LEVEL

OF URGENCY OR IMPORTANCE IN CHANGING FROM ODD TO EVEN YEAR ELECTIONS

COMPARED TO THE TRADITIONAL ELECTION STYLE. THIS WILL CERTAINLY LEAD TO

APATHY AND DECREASE IN CIVIC PARTICIPATION, ULTIMATELY WEAKENING THE

DEMOCRATIC FABRIC OF OUR SOCIETY. ADDITIONALLY, IMPLEMENTING ODD TO

EVEN YEAR ELECTIONS WOULD PLACE AN UNDUE BURDEN ON POLITICAL

CANDIDATES AND PARTIES. CAMPAIGNS REQUIRE SUBSTANTIAL RESOURCES, TIME

AND EFFORTS TO MOBILIZE VOTERS, DEVELOP PLATFORMS AND COMMUNICATE

THEIR MESSAGE EFFECTIVELY. BY INCREASING THE FREQUENCY OF ELECTIONS,

CANDIDATES AND PARTIES WOULD FACE HEIGHTENED FINANCIAL STRAIN AND

LOGISTICAL CHALLENGES. SMALL OR LESSER-KNOWN PARTIES MIGHT EVEN

STRUGGLE TO COMPETE IN THE NEW ELECTION LANDSCAPE FURTHER DIMINISHING

POLITICAL DIVERSITY AND REPRESENTATION OF MINORITY VIEWPOINTS.

FURTHERMORE, THIS CHANGE OF THIS ELECTION STYLE FROM ODD TO EVEN YEARS

WILL LEAD TO AN IMBALANCED DISTRIBUTION OF POWERS SIMPLY BECAUSE IT

WAS DESIGNED TO PUNISH LONG ISLAND AND SUBURBIA. THIS BILL LITERALLY

EXCLUDES THE CITY. IT ACTUALLY SAYS REQUIRES CERTAIN LOCAL ELECTIONS HELD

OUTSIDE OF NEW YORK CITY. IN FACT, IT EXCLUDES EVERY SINGLE CITY.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THESE BILLS -- THIS BILL USES A VERY SUBTLE -- BILLS USED TO USE VERY SUBTLE

AND NUANCE TERMS. THIS ONE IS JUST BLATANT AND OBVIOUS. CERTAIN

GROUPS OR REGIONS WILL FIND THEMSELVES DISPROPORTIONALLY ADVANTAGED

AND DISADVANTAGED BY THIS CHANGE DEPENDING ON THE COMPOSITION OF THE

ELECTORAL CALENDER. IT WILL LEAD TO FURTHER POLITICAL POLARIZATION AND

NEGLECT OF CRITICAL ISSUES DURING PERIODS WITHOUT ELECTIONS AS

POLICYMAKERS MIGHT BE TEMPTED TO FOCUS SOLELY ON THEIR ELECTORAL

PROSPECTS RATHER THAN GOVERNING EFFECTIVELY.

COLLEAGUES, WHEN WILL THESE TAXES ON SUBURBIA END?

IT'S ONE THING AFTER THE NEXT. AFTER ALL, WE ON LONG ISLAND LITERALLY KEEP

THE STATE FINANCIALLY AFLOAT. FOR THESE REASONS, MADAM SPEAKER, I'LL BE

VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANDLER-WATERMAN:

MR. DURSO.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. WOULD

THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS, PLEASE?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER CHANDLER-WATERMAN:

SPONSORS [SIC] YIELD.

MR. DURSO: THANK YOU, THANK YOU, MS. PAULIN.

SO, OBVIOUSLY I'M SURE WE'LL GO OVER A COUPLE OF THE SAME QUESTIONS

THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN ASKED BY MY COLLEAGUES, BUT I JUST WANTED TO GET

THEM ON THE RECORD AND MAYBE JUST CLARIFY A COUPLE OF THINGS.

SO, NOW HOW LONG HAS THIS EITHER BILL BEEN PRESENT,

WRITTEN OR BEEN WORKED ON TO TRY AND GET IT ACROSS THE FINISH LINE HERE?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: AT LEAST TWO OR THREE YEARS. I DON'T

REMEMBER EXACTLY.

MR. DURSO: SO, OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH.

MR. DURSO: SO, TWO TO THREE YEARS, OKAY. SO, ONE

OF THE ISSUES I MAY HAVE WITH THIS IS - AND MY COLLEAGUE HAD BROUGHT IT

UP - SO, OVER TWO OR THREE YEARS, THERE IS NO COST-ANALYSIS DONE OR -- OR

AN IDEA OF SAVINGS THAT WE'RE CLAIMING THAT THIS BILL IS GOING TO DO,

WHICH IS SAVE THE TAXPAYERS MONEY, BUT OVER A TWO TO THREE YEAR TIME

PERIOD WE HAVE NO IDEA OR ANY IDEA ACTUALLY, ABOUT HOW MUCH THIS IS

GOING TO SAVE THE TAXPAYERS.

MS. PAULIN: SO, WE HAVE TO -- PART OF IT IS YOU CAN'T

KNOW BECAUSE, ONE, WE DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S GOING TO BE PRIMARIES IN

THOSE ODD YEARS. WE BELIEVE THEY'LL BE FEWER OF THEM, BUT WE DON'T

KNOW HOW MANY FEWER. WE ALSO KNOW THAT IN ORDER TO HAVE REAL COST-

SAVINGS THAT WE HAVE TO CONSOLIDATE MORE OF THE ELECTIONS. AND SO, IT

-- IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE TO REALLY DO THAT KIND OF ESTIMATE.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO, WITH THAT BEING SAID AND

MAYBE I MISSED IT AND THAT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE. WHY NOT CONSOLIDATE

MORE AS IN THE 534 VILLAGES THROUGHOUT NEW YORK STATE AND THE 62

CITIES THAT, FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, AND TELL ME IF I'M WRONG, THEY DON'T

QUALIFY FOR THIS, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT, BECAUSE THE CONSTITUTION

ACTUALLY SAYS CITIES ARE -- I MEAN I COULD READ YOU THE CONSTITUTION --

MR. DURSO: IT'S THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OR IS IT --

MS. PAULIN: NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION.

MR. DURSO: NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION.

MS. PAULIN: SO, WE HAVE TO CHANGE THAT IN ORDER TO

INCLUDE THE CITIES, ALL CITIES, YOU KNOW, ALL 62 CITIES OR WHATEVER NOW.

MR. DURSO: SO, WHY NOT OVER THE PAST TWO OR THREE

YEARS CHANGE THAT FIRST SO THIS CAN ALL BE DONE AT ONCE IN A MANNER THAT

WOULD ACTUALLY MAKE SENSE THAT THE LEGISLATURE COULD VOTE ON THIS ONE

TIME AND HAVE A REAL COST-SAVINGS. WHY HAVEN'T WE DONE THAT OVER THE

PAST TWO TO THREE YEARS INSTEAD OF RUSHING TO GET AN INCOMPLETE BILL

DONE?

MS. PAULIN: SO, EITHER WAY IT WOULD BE

INCOMPLETE, RIGHT, BECAUSE EITHER WAY YOU NEED SOME LEAD TIME TO GET

THERE. SO, THIS IS THE -- WE HAD THIS BILL. IN FACT, IT INCLUDED EVERYTHING

WHEN WE FIRST STARTED AND SLOWLY WE REALIZED THAT WE COULDN'T INCLUDE

CITIES BECAUSE OF THE CONSTITUTION. AND THEN WE DIDN'T INCLUDE VILLAGES,

WHICH WE'RE IN THE ORIGINAL BILL BECAUSE THEY GOT SO COMPLICATED. SO,

WE ACKNOWLEDGED THAT -- THAT ALL OF THEM HAVE TO BE INCLUDED IN ORDER

TO HAVE REAL COST-SAVINGS. WE'RE GOING TO HAVE MINIMAL COST-SAVINGS

AT BEST, BUT WE NEEDED TO TAKE A STAB AT IT, ONE STAB AT A TIME AND THIS IS

THE FIRST STAB.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT THAT

IT'S OBVIOUSLY YOU'RE TRYING TO BEGIN THE PROCESS OF IT, BUT AGAIN, AS MY

COLLEAGUE HAD SAID, YOU'RE -- IN THE SPONSOR'S MEMO, IT SPECIFICALLY

STATES OBVIOUSLY VOTER CONFUSION, WHICH WE'LL GET TO IN A SECOND BUT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

COST-SAVINGS. I JUST FEEL THAT OVER A TWO-YEAR OR THREE-YEAR PERIOD WE

COULD HAVE EITHER DONE, YOU KNOW, A -- A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT TO

ACTUALLY GET THIS ALL DONE AT ONCE, OR MY NEXT QUESTION WOULD BE, WHY

NOT INSTEAD OF DOING THIS YEAR, ACTUALLY PUTTING IT TO A VOTER REFERENDUM

AND LETTING THE VOTERS OF NEW YORK STATE DECIDE IF THEY EVEN HAVE AN

APPETITE FOR SOMETHING LIKE THIS?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I ACTUALLY THINK THAT BY DOING

THIS FIRST WE WILL INCREASE THAT APPETITE.

MR. DURSO: SO, WE'RE GOING TO INCREASE THE

APPETITE OF THE PEOPLE OF NEW YORK BY --

MS. PAULIN: YES, BECAUSE I THINK THE PEOPLE IN

NEW YORK WILL BE SO HAPPY AND SO EXCITED AROUND THE ELECTIONS NOW

AS OPPOSED TO THE ODD YEARS NOT KNOWING WHO'S RUNNING, WHAT'S GOING

ON, YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE DON'T EVEN KNOW THERE'S ELECTIONS IN THE

ODD YEAR. SO -- SO, THIS WILL, YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE IT'S GOING TO ENCOURAGE

THE VOTERS TO REALLY PAY ATTENTION.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO, I'M -- I'M GOING TO MOVE

ON SO WITH SOME OTHER QUESTIONS I HAVE FOR YOU. SO, OBVIOUSLY IT'S TO --

VOTER TURNOUT, RIGHT, IS ONE OF THE BIG PORTIONS OF THIS, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: THE BIGGEST.

MR. DURSO: OF COURSE. SO, IS THERE A PLAN IN PLACE

BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY A LOT OF OUR SCHOOLS ARE WHERE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO

VOTE, RIGHT? AND NOW THE INFLUX OF EVEN MORE PEOPLE COMING TO THE

SCHOOLS TO VOTE, WHICH AGAIN, WE WANT EVERYBODY TO VOTE, I'M NOT

AFRAID OF IT. BUT THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THEY ARE A SCHOOL, THEY ARE

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VULNERABLE SITES. I KNOW THERE ARE BILLS IN PLACE TO MAKE SCHOOLS NOT

POLLING SITES, BUT DO WE HAVE ANY TYPE OF MONEYS, FUNDINGS OR ANY TYPE

OF RULES WITHIN THIS LEGISLATION TO HAVE SAY MORE SECURITY ON SCHOOL

SITES? SINCE THEIR VOTER TURNOUT IS GOING TO BE SO MUCH LARGER, IS THERE

ANYTHING IN THIS BILL OR HAS IT BEEN DISCUSSED AT ALL TO PROTECT SOME OF

OUR VULNERABLE?

MS. PAULIN: SO, ONE, WE DON'T KNOW IF IT'S GOING TO

BE LARGER THAN THE PRESIDENTIAL YEAR, IT COULD BE THE SAME. ALL THAT

WOULD MEAN IS THAT THE PRESIDENTIAL YEAR VOTERS WOULD BE VOTING IN

THESE OTHER ELECTIONS SO IT INCREASES FOR THE OTHER ELECTIONS. IF WE

ACTUALLY SEE THAT THE COMPOSITE OF THE ELECTION INCREASES IT TO SUCH A

POINT, THEN, YOU KNOW, WE CAN CONSIDER ADDITIONAL FUNDING, WE CAN

CONSIDER CLOSING THE SCHOOL ON ELECTION DAY, WE CAN CONSIDER MOVING

THE ELECTIONS TO DIFFERENT FACILITIES, WE CAN CONSIDER ALL THOSE THINGS.

BUT CURRENTLY THE PRESIDENTIAL YEAR THERE'S A LOT OF TURNOUT. SO, WE

ALREADY DEAL WITH THAT AND WE JUST DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S GOING TO BE ANY

MORE.

MR. DURSO: WELL, AGAIN, TO YOUR POINT, I -- I

ACTUALLY BELIEVE THERE MIGHT BE BECAUSE NOT ONLY ARE THERE PEOPLE THAT

DON'T CARE ABOUT THEIR LOCAL ELECTIONS, WHICH OBVIOUSLY WE ALWAYS TELL

EVERYBODY LOCAL ELECTIONS MATTER, RIGHT? BUT THERE'S ALSO PEOPLE THAT

DON'T THINK THEIR VOTE COUNTS WHEN IT COMES TO PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION OR

VICE VERSA. SO, YOU MAY ACTUALLY HAVE MORE PEOPLE GOING TO THE POLLS

BECAUSE NOT ONLY IS THE PRESIDENT OR THE GOVERNOR ON THE BALLOT, BUT IT'S

ALSO YOUR LOCAL ELECTIVES AND ALL OF US. (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK)

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MS. PAULIN: SO, THEN I WOULD SAY THIS IS GREAT THAT

WE'RE DOING IT, THEREFORE. I HOPE YOU'RE RIGHT.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO, IN THAT CASE, IN THAT VEIN,

THERE'S ACTUALLY GOING TO BE A MUCH LARGER TURNOUT IN THOSE SITES AND I'M

JUST CONCERNED OBVIOUSLY AGAIN -- LISTEN, WE UNDERSTAND WITH SOCIAL

MEDIA, WITH ANYTHING LIKE THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES THAT GET

EVERYBODY RILED UP AND CRAZY. I AM CONCERNED SPECIFICALLY ABOUT WHEN

THERE'S JUST THAT MANY MORE PEOPLE, AND ESPECIALLY IF IT'S A CONTENTIOUS

ELECTION, AND YOU HAVE THAT MANY MORE PEOPLE NEAR A SCHOOL, THERE IS A

-- A CONCERN, CAN WE AT LEAST SAY THAT? AND I'M JUST HOPING THAT THERE

COULD BE SOME TYPE OF AMENDMENT TO THIS BILL, FUNDING INVOLVED WITH IT

TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DO HAVE MORE SECURITY FOR, AGAIN, THOSE SCHOOLS

AND THE VOTERS THAT ARE COMING.

MS. PAULIN: SO, I THINK WE -- YOU KNOW, FIRSTLY,

YOU KNOW WE DO BUDGETS YEAR TO YEAR, SO THIS DOESN'T TAKE EFFECT FOR A

WHILE. WE CERTAINLY CAN CONSIDER THAT AS WE GO FORWARD TO SEE WHAT

KIND OF TURNOUT MAYBE IN THE FIRST EVEN YEAR AND SEE IF IT -- IT WARRANTS

ADDITIONAL FUNDING OR FUNDING FOR SPECIFIC AREAS OR FUNDING FOR SPECIFIC

SCHOOLS.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. SO, AGAIN, WITH THAT BEING SAID,

WITH SUCH A LARGER TURNOUT POSSIBLY, AS WE SAID, LONGER LINES, THE

INEVITABLE, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, POLL WORKERS THAT COME IN TO WORK THE

VOTING SITES ARE USUALLY, NOT ALL THE TIME BUT A LOT OF TIMES ARE RETIREES

OR SOME ARE SENIOR CITIZENS, THEY REALLY DO ENJOY IT. PRIOR TO BEING

ELECTED I WORKED IN A POLLING PLACE. ARE WE PAYING THEM MORE BY ANY

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CHANCE OR ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE BECAUSE, AGAIN, THERE'S GOING TO BE

SUCH A HIGHER TURNOUT ON THOSE YEARS THAT AGAIN, LISTEN, IF YOU'VE BEEN

IN THEM IT GETS CONFUSING, IT GET'S HOT IN THERE, THEY DON'T GET ENOUGH

BREAKS, THEY DON'T EAT ENOUGH. I MEAN ARE WE PAYING THEM MORE BY

ANY CHANCE? IS THERE GOING TO BE MORE POLL WORKERS? IS THERE FUNDING

FOR MORE POLL WORKERS IN THIS BILL?

MS. PAULIN: SO, I WOULD SAY A LOT OF TIMES WHEN

I'VE GONE TO THE POLL THEY'RE SITTING AROUND AND THEY'RE JUST HOPING MORE

PEOPLE WILL COME, YOU KNOW, SO MAYBE THIS WILL PREVENT THAT FROM

HAPPENING AND THEY WILL BE MORE ENGAGED, YOU KNOW, DURING THE

WHOLE DAY. YOU KNOW, AGAIN, OUR -- THE BIGGEST CONCERN WE SHOULD

HAVE IS THAT WE HAVE SO MANY PEOPLE VOTING, HOW WONDERFUL WOULD

THAT BE? AND THAT WE HAVE TO THEN DEAL WITH IT. SO, I AM OPEN TO ALL OF

THE THINGS YOU'RE SAYING IN TERMS OF ADVOCATING FOR THEM TO ENSURE THAT

-- THAT VOTERS PARTICIPATE IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE, THAT WE HAVE THE

RIGHT AMOUNT OF WORKERS AT THE POLLING PLACES TO ACCOMMODATE THEM SO

THAT THERE AREN'T LONG LINES, SO THAT THEY CAN USE THEIR -- THEIR -- THEIR --

THEIR VOTE TO THE MAXIMUM POSSIBLE, SO THAT THEY HAVE PRIVACY WHEN

THEY'RE FILLING OUT THAT LONG BALLOT, ALL OF THOSE THINGS. BUT WE HAVE TO

SEE WHAT HAPPENS AND HOPE THAT YOU AND I ARE RIGHT THAT ONE ELECTION IS

GOING TO FEED ON THE OTHER AND DRAW TURNOUT LARGER.

MR. DURSO: BUT -- BUT UNTIL THAT SUCH TIME,

WHETHER IT'S BUDGET TIME OR WE SEE HOW THIS WORKS OUT, IF -- IF THERE'S

LONG LINES THAT ARE WRAPPED AROUND THE BUILDING, WHICH DISENFRANCHISES

VOTERS, LET'S BE HONEST, BECAUSE THEY GET THERE, THEY GO TO WANT TO GO

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VOTE AND THEY COULD BE SITTING THERE ALL DAY. AGAIN, THERE'S GOING TO BE

BROKEN MACHINES, THERE'S GOING TO BE PAPER JAMS, ESPECIALLY WITH THE

BALLOT THAT'S AS LONG AS THESE THREE DESKS. I MEAN, IT'S GOING TO BE

CONFUSION AND POSSIBLY AN ISSUE AND WE DON'T WANT TO DISENFRANCHISE

VOTERS. I'M JUST UPSET THAT AGAIN WE DON'T HAVE THESE THINGS IN PLACE

PRIOR TO THE PASSAGE OF THIS BILL, WHICH WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON FOR THREE

YEARS BUT WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING REALLY IN PLACE TO PROTECT THE VOTERS.

MS. PAULIN: SO, I'D SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THE FIRST

TIME WE'RE GONNA SEE THE EVEN YEAR ELECTION IS 2026, IT HAPPENS TO BE A

GUBERNATORIAL YEAR, SO IT'S NOT A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR. SO, IF WE SEE THAT IT

-- IT WAS A MUCH HIGHER TURNOUT THAN A USUAL GUBERNATORIAL YEAR, THEN

WE HAVE TIME TWO MORE YEARS TO PLAN FOR THAT PRESIDENTIAL YEAR WHICH

THEN COULD GROW IN ADDITION. SO, I THINK THAT THE WAY WE'VE DONE THIS

IS VERY SMART AND, YOU KNOW, WE'LL HAVE TIME TO GAUGE, YOU KNOW,

WHETHER OR NOT WE NEED ADDITIONAL FUNDS OR ADDITIONAL WAYS TO DEAL.

MR. DURSO: OKAY. THANK YOU, MS. PAULIN, FOR

YOUR ANSWERS, I APPRECIATE IT.

MADAM -- MR. SPEAKER, EXCUSE ME, ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL.

MR. DURSO: SO, AGAIN, I -- I UNDERSTAND THE

SPONSOR'S INTENT OF THIS BILL, I -- I DO. I THINK IT'S A SHAME THAT THIS BILL

HAS BEEN WORKED ON FOR THE PAST TWO TO THREE YEARS THAT HAS NO COST-

ANALYSIS WHEN THE BILL IS ACTUALLY SAYING IT'S BEING PUT IN PLACE TO SAVE

MONEY. IT'S A LOSS OF LOCAL CONTROL FOR LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES AND

GOVERNMENTS. IT COULD DISENFRANCHISE VOTERS WHO ARE GOING TO HAVE

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LONG LINES AROUND THE BLOCK, WE'RE GONNA HAVE BALLOTS THAT ARE AS LONG

AS THESE THREE DESKS, THEY'RE GOING TO JAM THE NEW MACHINES. WE DON'T

HAVE EXTRA MONEY FOR POLLING WORKERS. I'M SURE THAT THE PEOPLE THAT

WORK ON THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS ARE GOING TO BE PSYCHED THAT

EVERYBODY HERE WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW THEIR OVERTIME IS GOING TO BE

CUT, I CAN'T AGREE WITH THAT.

SO, FOR THOSE REASONS THIS IS OBVIOUSLY, LISTEN, AS -- AS

ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES WHO WAS SITTING HERE EARLIER ALWAYS SAYS EVERY

YEAR, YOU CAN'T TAKE THE POLITICS OUT OF POLITICS, BUT THIS IS A VERY

POLITICAL BILL. AND SO FOR THOSE REASONS I'LL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.

THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. FLOOD.

MR. FLOOD: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. FLOOD: MS. PAULIN, I KNOW WE WENT OVER KIND

OF AT LENGTH THIS BILL FOR THE CITIES TO -- TO BE ON THE SAME SCHEDULE

WOULD TAKE A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT. AT THIS TIME, HAS THIS

AMENDMENT BEEN DRAFTED AT ALL?

MS. PAULIN: IT WAS HARD ENOUGH TO DRAFT THIS, SO IT'S

THE NEXT -- IT'S THE NEXT THING.

MR. FLOOD: THE NEXT THING, OKAY. AND SO IS THERE

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A TIME FRAME OF ONE POTENTIALLY THAT COULD HAPPEN?

MS. PAULIN: NEXT SESSION.

MR. FLOOD: NEXT SESSION, OKAY. SO, LET'S SUPPOSE

THAT NEXT SESSION THIS DOESN'T HAPPEN, JUST -- JUST THROWING IT OUT THERE.

IF A MUNICIPALITY HAD DECIDED TO TRY AND CONVERT FROM SAY A TOWN TO A

CITY, WOULD THEY THEN FALL UNDER THE SAME EXEMPTIONS?

MS. PAULIN: SO, IN ORDER TO CONVERT FROM A TOWN TO

A CITY THEY WOULD NEED TO GET APPROVAL FROM US.

MR. FLOOD: OH, I'M VERY AWARE BECAUSE THE TOWN I

LIVE IN, I DID SUBSTANTIAL RESEARCH INTO ACTUALLY TURNING TO A CITY A

COUPLE YEARS AGO AT THE REQUEST OF THE SUPERVISOR BECAUSE OF THERE'S A

BUNCH OF ACTUAL, YOU KNOW, BENEFITS TO BEING A CITY.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. FLOOD: SO, THAT'S WHAT I WAS ASKING. SO, YOU

KNOW, I'M ASSUMING THIS LEGISLATION ISN'T TO TRY AND KEEP THE VOTE --

MS. PAULIN: NO, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH

INCORPORATED --

MR. FLOOD: I DON'T THINK IT WOULD HAVE ANYTHING TO

INCORPORATE AS A CITY OR NOT.

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. FLOOD: SO WOULD THAT -- BUT SAY THERE WAS,

WOULD THEY FALL INTO THAT EXEMPTION?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. FLOOD: OKAY, ALL RIGHT. SO, NOW I UNDERSTAND

-- I GET YOU SAID THIS WAS SLOW AND THIS IS A SLOW PROCESS WE WANT TO

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GET IT RIGHT. THERE SEEMS TO BE A LOT THAT COULD GO WRONG WITH THIS SO

WHY ARE WE PUSHING SO HARD TO GET THIS AMENDMENT DONE? AGAIN, I

KNOW THIS WASN'T ASKED, BUT WHY WON'T -- WHY CAN'T WE TRY AND DO THIS

OR WHY WON'T WE LET THE CITIES GO FIRST BEFORE WE HIT SUBURBIA?

MS. PAULIN: SOMEBODY HAD TO GO FIRST.

MR. FLOOD: OKAY. NOW, HERE'S IS MY OTHER

QUESTION. SO, WE DID A LITTLE RESEARCH AND OUR RESEARCH TEAM DID A

PHENOMENAL JOB. OF THE 102 MEMBERS ON THE MAJORITY HERE, 90 OF

THEM HAVE SOME TYPE OF -- OR EITHER HAVE -- ARE FULLY CONTROLLED WITHIN

A CITY OR PARTIALLY HAVE A CITY INSIDE OF THEM. SO, THIS BILL ESSENTIALLY

SEEMS TO TARGET MAJORITY -- IT TARGETS IT SEEMS LIKE AREAS THAT ARE

REPRESENTED BY THE MINORITY HERE.

MS. PAULIN: IT ALSO IS ME.

MR. FLOOD: WELL, I UNDERSTAND BUT LIKE I JUST SAID,

90 OF THE 102, WHICH PUTS YOU RIGHT ABOUT 90 PERCENT OF YOUR MEMBERS

MS. PAULIN: WELL, ARE YOU COUNTING THE (INAUDIBLE)

BECAUSE I DO REPRESENT TWO CITIES.

MR. FLOOD: WELL, THAT'S WHAT I SAID, EITHER FULLY

REPRESENT A CITY OR HAVE CITIES WITHIN THEIR DISTRICTS WHERE I BELIEVE THAT

NUMBER IS SUBSTANTIALLY LOWER ON OUR SIDE.

MS. PAULIN: I THINK IT WOULD BE FAIR TO SEE HOW

MANY MEMBERS ACTUALLY HAVE TOWNS AND WE ALL HAVE COUNTIES. SO, ANY

MEMBER OUTSIDE OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK HAS A COUNTY. THIS IS GOING

TO HAVE A BIG IMPACT ON THE COUNTY ELECTIONS. SO, THERE'S MANY MORE OF

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US THAN JUST THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 102 AND 90.

MR. FLOOD: I'M NOT QUITE SURE I UNDERSTAND. SO,

WHAT THIS IS SAYING IS THAT IT'S ABOUT 90 PERCENT OF YOUR DISTRICT REMAINS

SOMEWHAT UNAFFECTED BY THIS.

MS. PAULIN: NOT -- NOT BECAUSE I'M HAPPY ABOUT IT.

MR. FLOOD: BUT THAT'S WHY I SAID IF IT APPEARS AND

IT WOULD IT BE FAIR TO SAY THAT THIS -- WOULD IT BE FAIR TO SAY THAT THIS

LEGISLATION WILL HAVE A GREATER EFFECT ON AREAS THAT ARE REPRESENTED BY

THE MINORITY OF THIS BODY?

MS. PAULIN: I DIDN'T DO A POLL, I DIDN'T DO A COUNT.

MR. FLOOD: WELL, I'M TELLING YOU WE DID DO IT AND

IT IS. YOU GUYS HAVE 90 OF YOUR MEMBERS OF WHERE IT'S SUBSTANTIALLY

LOWER, IT'S ABOUT MAYBE 15 OF OUR MEMBERS THAT HAVE SOME TYPE OF -- I

BELIEVE IT'S ONLY 6 THAT ARE FULLY WITHIN A CITY AND ABOUT 15 MORE THAT

HAVE SOME TYPE OF CITY WITHIN THEIR DISTRICT.

MS. PAULIN: HOW MANY ARE YOU THAT ARE IN THAT

CATEGORY?

MR. FLOOD: AND WE HAVE 48.

MS. PAULIN: WHAT IS IT?

MR. FLOOD: WE HAVE 48 MEMBERS.

MS. PAULIN: FORTY-EIGHT. SO, YOU'RE SAYING 15

FROM 48 IS 33, RIGHT? AND THEN YOU SAID THERE WAS SOME THAT WERE

COMPLETELY (INAUDIBLE).

MR. FLOOD: SIX.

MS. PAULIN: SIX. SO, THAT'S 20 -- WHAT IS IT?

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MR. FLOOD: TWENTY-TWO, I BELIEVE.

MS. PAULIN: TWENTY-SEVEN, RIGHT?

MR. FLOOD: I BELIEVE IT'S -- I BELIEVE THE NUMBER I

WAS GIVEN WAS 22 SO I WAS NEVER GOOD AT MATH.

MS. PAULIN: ALL RIGHT, 22. SO, WE'RE KIND OF CLOSE,

YOU KNOW.

MR. FLOOD: BUT HERE'S THE THING IS THAT 74 OF YOUR

MEMBERS ARE 100 PERCENT WITHIN A CITY SO THEY ABSOLUTELY DON'T EFFECT

ANY OF THEM, SO THAT'S -- THAT'S, YOU KNOW, ABOUT 75 PERCENT OF YOUR

DISTRICT IS FULLY WITHIN --

MS. PAULIN: WELL, IN THIS HOUSE WE DO A LOT OF

BILLS THAT IMPACT ONE AREA. WE DO SOMETIMES BILLS THAT IMPACT ONE AREA

WITH HOME RULES, SO BUT WE ALL VOTE ON IT. SO, YOU KNOW, WE ALL VOTE,

WE ALL SAY OKAY, WE'RE GOING TO ALIENATE PARKLAND IN THIS COUNTY OR THAT

PLACE AND, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE WE KNOW IT'S FOR REPLACEMENT OF COUNTY

LAND OR WHATEVER AND WE'RE -- WE'RE RELYING ON THOSE THAT LIVE THERE AND

REPRESENT THERE TO MAKE THAT JUDGMENT. AND WE ARE ALL COLLECTIVELY

MAKING A JUDGMENT THAT IT'S OKAY TO DO. SO, WE'RE DOING THAT HERE AS

WELL.

MR. FLOOD: BUT THAT'S -- THAT'S WHAT YOU JUST SAID,

YOU'RE RELYING ON THE MEMBERS TO REPRESENT THE DISTRICTS THAT THEY'RE IN.

MS. PAULIN: (INAUDIBLE)

MR. FLOOD: HOWEVER, 75 MEMBERS OF THIS BODY

ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO VOTE ON THAT THEY ARE 100 PERCENT EXEMPT.

THEIR -- THEIR CITIES ARE 100 PERCENT EXEMPT FROM THIS AND TELL OUR

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LOCALITIES WHAT IT IS THAT THEY NEED TO DO.

MS. PAULIN: WE'VE -- WE'VE NEVER SEVERED OR

WE'VE ALWAYS ALLOWED EVERYONE TO VOTE ON EVERYTHING. I THINK THAT'S

PROBABLY NOT CONSTITUTIONAL. WE'D HAVE TO MAKE A CHANGE THERE, TOO.

MR. FLOOD: NO, I UNDERSTAND BUT 74 OF THE

MEMBERS HERE WHO ARE EXEMPTED FROM THIS BILL ARE STILL GOING TO VOTE

ON THE DISTRICTS OF OUR MEMBERS THAT ARE, YOU KNOW --

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. FLOOD: -- THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, THAT ARE -- THAT

ARE EFFECTED BY THIS. AND THEN ANOTHER 16 MEMBERS ARE SOMEWHAT

EFFECTED BY IT SLIGHTLY OR, YOU KNOW, A MAJORITY OF THEM.

MS. PAULIN: I -- I HEAR YOU, I'M NOT GOING TO

CONTEST YOUR MATH.

MR. FLOOD: WELL, THAT'S NOT A GOOD IDEA BECAUSE

MY MATH IS NOT (INAUDIBLE). I'LL BE THE FIRST ONE TO ADMIT THAT.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH. BUT YES, THAT'S TRUE. SOME

MEMBERS HERE WILL NOT HAVE ANY IMPACT FROM THIS.

MR. FLOOD: SPEAKER, ON THE BILL, PLEASE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. FLOOD: SO, SOME -- SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES

HAD SOME PRETTY ELOQUENT WORDS TO SAY ON THIS. MINE WILL NOT BE AS --

AS ELOQUENT. IT APPEARS THAT THE MEMBERS OF THIS BODY WANT TO CONTROL

MOST OF THE DISTRICTS THAT ARE NOT IN THEIR CONTROL AT THIS POINT. AND

WHAT I MEAN IS IF WE WERE TO TAKE ALL THE CITIES FROM NEW YORK STATE

AND JUST KIND OF GET RID OF THEM AND WE LOOK AT THE LAST GOVERNOR, THE

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LAST PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, WITHOUT THOSE CITIES, NEW YORK STATE IS A

VERY RED STATE. RIGHT NOW, THE MEMBERS OF THIS BODY ARE TRYING TO TAKE

AWAY THE LOCAL CONTROL OF THE -- OF THOSE RED CITIES NOW AND REPLACE

THEM WITH THE ELECTION LAWS THAT MEMBERS OF THE CITIES WANT THEM TO

HAVE. THIS IS BY ALL MEANS A POWER GRAB OF THE MAJORITY IN THIS BODY

TRYING TO TELL LOCAL REPUBLICAN-RUN MUNICIPALITIES HOW THEY'RE GOING TO

DO THEIR ELECTIONS. FOR THAT MATTER, I'M GOING TO VOTE NO. I'M SURE THIS

IS GOING TO BE A PARTY VOTE, BUT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT INCLUSIVITY AND

EQUITY AND MAKING SURE THAT EVERY PERSON'S VOTE COUNTS, I BELIEVE THAT

THIS BODY LOOKS AT IT AS LONG AS IT'S COMING FROM THE MAJORITY. THANK

YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. SLATER.

MR. SLATER.

MR. SLATER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: ABSOLUTELY.

MR. SLATER: NOT A QUESTION, BUT JUST -- YOU'LL BE

HAPPY TO HEAR THE METS JUST PULLED AHEAD, SO THERE YOU GO.

(LAUGHTER)

JUST A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS FOR YOU, AND I'M GOING TO

DO MY BEST NOT TO REPEAT SOME THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN ASKED. YOU SAID

THAT THE BILL'S BEEN AROUND FOR, YOU SAID I BELIEVE TWO YEARS, ROUGHLY?

MS. PAULIN: YOU KNOW, I THINK LONGER, I JUST DON'T

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REMEMBER WHEN I FILED IT.

MR. SLATER: AND SO THAT'S OBVIOUSLY AMPLE TIME

FOR PEOPLE TO FILE MEMOS OF OPPOSITION OR SUPPORT. I'M JUST CURIOUS IF

YOU'VE RECEIVED ANY MEMOS OF SUPPORT FROM ANY OF THE TOWNS, COUNTIES

OR VILLAGES AT THIS IMPASSE?

MS. PAULIN: I HAVEN'T. I MEAN, I'VE DONE A LOT OF

BILLS. MOST COMMONLY, I DON'T GET ANY SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION MEMOS

ON MOST OF THEM, AND I DIDN'T GET VERY MUCH OF ANYTHING ON THIS.

MR. SLATER: BECAUSE I KNOW THAT SOMETIMES OR

OFTENTIMES, MUNICIPALITIES AND COUNTIES WILL PASS RESOLUTIONS IN

SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION TO SOME MEASURES THAT ARE BEING DELIBERATED ON

HERE, SO I WASN'T SURE IF YOU RECEIVED ANY.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T -- I DON'T HAVE ANY INDIVIDUAL

MEMOS FROM MUNICIPALITIES THAT I'M AWARE OF.

MR. SLATER: OKAY. AND ONE OF THE OTHER

QUESTIONS THAT I HAD KIND OF GOES OFF THE SAME LINE OF THOUGHT BECAUSE

WHEN I REACHED OUT TO MY MUNICIPALITIES DURING THIS WEEK ABOUT THIS

VERY ISSUE, THEY HAD NO IDEA THAT IT WAS BEING DISCUSSED. AND ONE OF

THE QUESTIONS THAT WAS ASKED TO ME, WHEN IT TALKS TO CHANGING THE

TERMS TO CATCH EVERYONE UP SO THAT THEY'RE ON EVEN YEARS, AND I KNOW

WE TALKED ABOUT CHANGING SOME OF THE TERMS THAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO

BE RUNNING ON, DOES THAT IMPACT THEIR RETIREMENT OR PENSION AT ALL?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. SLATER: IT DOES NOT.

MS. PAULIN: NO. I MEAN, BECAUSE IT'S -- THAT'S

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CUMULATIVE, RIGHT, SO NO.

MR. SLATER: OKAY, GREAT. I KNOW THAT WE TALK A

LOT ABOUT THE COST-SAVINGS. THAT IS ONE OF THE MOTIVATING FACTORS FROM

YOUR STANDPOINT ON THE BILL. YOU'VE ALSO SAID THAT WE MAY HAVE TO

ADJUST BASED ON WHAT WE SEE WHEN THIS GETS IMPLEMENTED. WHO IS

GOING TO BEAR THE COST TO IMPLEMENT THOSE ADJUSTMENTS?

MS. PAULIN: SO, I GUESS WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT,

YOU KNOW, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT AN INCREASED VOTER TURNOUT, YOU

KNOW, AS POTENTIALLY INCREASING COSTS. ONE OTHER OPTION WE WOULD

HAVE TO DECIDE CUMULATIVELY IS IF WE THEN CHANGED TO A NO EXCUSE

ABSENTEE BALLOT, BECAUSE THEN THE LINES WOULD BE REDUCED, VOTERS WOULD

HAVE MORE TIME TO FILL OUT THE BALLOT AND, YOU KNOW, IT WOULD BE GREAT

TO HAVE EVERYONE'S SUPPORT TO DO THAT SO THAT WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO BEAR

THAT COST.

MR. SLATER: BUT THAT'S PREDICATED OFF OF A MEASURE

THAT HASN'T BEEN APPROVED, AND SECONDLY, THAT MEASURE, WOULD IT NOT

CREATE MORE WORK AT THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS IF YOU'RE INCREASING THE

VOLUME OF ABSENTEES?

MS. PAULIN: IT -- IT'S -- IT WOULD -- SIMILAR TO

COVID WHEN WE SAW THAT HAPPEN, THE -- THE -- IT -- IT WAS A MORE

STEADY WAY AS OPPOSED TO THE, YOU KNOW, UNTIL THE END, YOU KNOW,

WHERE THE, YOU KNOW, WHERE EARLY VOTING AND THEN, OF COURSE THE

ELECTION WAS, YOU KNOW, WHERE WE SAW THE INCREASE TO SUCH A DEGREE.

BUT BECAUSE OF THE ABSENTEE BALLOT, YOU KNOW, IT SPREAD OUT THE

WORKLOAD, SO-TO-SPEAK. SO I THINK THIS WOULD DO THAT, TOO. YOU KNOW,

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YOU STILL HAVE TO HAVE THE EMPLOYEES THERE. SO INSTEAD OF THEM NOT

BEING BUSY DURING A CERTAIN POINT OF TIME AND THEN BEING VERY BUSY AT

THE END, THIS WOULD SPREAD IT OUT IF WE HAD AN ABILITY TO DO MORE

ABSENTEES. BUT IT'S ALL SUBJECTIVE BECAUSE WE CAN'T DO THAT, AS YOU POINT

OUT. WE DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT THE INCREASE IS GOING TO BE. WE KNOW

WHAT THE PRESIDENTIAL LOOKS LIKE, WE'LL SEE WHAT THE GUBERNATORIAL FOR

THE FIRST TIME WHETHER THIS WILL INCREASE IT IN TERMS OF A TURNOUT IN

ADDITION TO WHAT WE'RE USUALLY SEEING. SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'LL BE OUR

FIRST TIME TO LOOK AT IT AND SAY, OKAY, DO WE HAVE TO MAKE AN

ADJUSTMENT AND WHAT SHOULD THAT LOOK LIKE, BECAUSE WE WANT TO

ENFRANCHISE EVERYONE.

MR. SLATER: BUT GOING BACK TO THE MECHANICS OF

AN ELECTION, IF YOU'RE GONNA INCREASE THE NUMBER OF CANDIDATES, THE

NUMBER OF RACES IN EACH YEAR, AREN'T YOU GOING TO POTENTIALLY INCREASE,

AGAIN, THAT WORKLOAD FOR THAT SPECIFIC YEAR, WHETHER IT'S, AGAIN, THE

ABSENTEES, VOTER REGISTRATION. EVEN AFTER THE ELECTION'S OVER, RIGHT,

YOU'RE COUNTING THE ABSENTEES, YOU'RE DOING YOUR AUDITS, POSSIBLE

RECOUNTS, LEGAL CHALLENGES THAT WE ALL LOVE AND ENDEAR HERE IN THIS

BODY. SO WON'T THAT, AGAIN, JUST INCREASE ON THOSE EVEN YEARS? SO

YOU'RE -- YOU'RE GONNA CANCEL OUT ANY TYPE OF COST-SAVINGS, POTENTIALLY,

FROM THOSE ODD YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: AGAIN, WE'LL HAVE TO SEE. YOU KNOW,

I DON'T -- I DON'T THINK THAT WE CAN PREJUDGE WHAT THAT'S GOING TO LOOK

LIKE.

MR. SLATER: AND AGAIN, WE STILL AREN'T CLEAR IF WE

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ARE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE ADJUSTMENTS ON THE FLY, WHETHER THAT COST IS

GOING TO BE FUNDED BY THE STATE OR THAT'S GOING TO BECOME AN UNFUNDED

MANDATE FOR OUR COUNTIES.

MS. PAULIN: AGAIN, YOU KNOW, WE'LL HAVE TO SEE AS

WE GO FORWARD.

MR. SLATER: OKAY. SO WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE

JUST YET.

MS. PAULIN: WE DON'T.

MR. SLATER: OKAY. I WANT TO, IF WE CAN, JUST PIVOT

TO THE LOCAL RACES. AND I KNOW THAT YOU HELD LOCAL OFFICE IN SCARSDALE.

DO YOU THINK THAT THIS CHANGE WILL ALLOW VOTERS -- AND I KNOW YOU

TALKED ABOUT ONE SPECIFIC ISSUE, BUT DO YOU THINK IT'LL CHANGE AND ALLOW

VOTERS TO FOCUS ON THOSE LOCAL ISSUES WHEN YOU HAVE SO MUCH OTHER,

FRANKLY, NOISE ON THE BALLOT WITH THEM?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK MY VILLAGE IS A BAD EXAMPLE

BECAUSE ALMOST EVERY TIME THEY RUN UNOPPOSED AND IT'S A NONPARTISAN

SYSTEM AND IT'S NOT SIMILAR, RIGHT? BUT THERE'S NO FOCUS NOW ON THOSE

LITTLE LOCAL ELECTIONS, SO THIS -- IT CAN'T GET WORSE, IS MY OPINION.

MR. SLATER: WELL, ON A -- ON A -- ON AN ELECTION

YEAR THAT YOU'RE TRYING TO ORCHESTRATE, DO YOU THINK THAT THOSE LOCAL

ISSUES ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO EMERGE FROM THE SURFACE?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK LOCAL ISSUES EMERGE FROM THE

SURFACE ALL THE TIME, MUCH GREATER THAN OTHER ISSUES. YOU KNOW, SO

YOU KNOW, IF SOMEONE IS WORRIED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, GARBAGE COLLECTION

OR THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT POLICE PROTECTION OR FIRE PROTECTION, THOSE ARE

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BASIC TO PEOPLE. YOU KNOW, I HAVE A VILLAGE NOW THAT'S WORRIED ABOUT

EMS AND HOW QUICK THE RESPONSE TIME IS. YOU KNOW, THAT IS

CONSUMING THE TOWN, IT'S A TOWN ISSUE, VERY MUCH MORE SO THAN IF THERE

WAS A COUNTY OR STATE OF EVEN PRESIDENTIAL YEAR, IT'S CONSUMING THAT

TOWN. SO I DO -- I THINK THAT THE LOCAL -- IF THERE'S A LOCAL ISSUE, THAT

WILL BE WHAT EVERYONE FOCUSES ON AND IF THERE'S NONE, THEN IT'S NOT

GONNA BE WORSE THAN WHAT WE'RE SEEING RIGHT NOW.

MR. SLATER: WELL, I -- I THINK I WOULD RESPECTFULLY

DISAGREE, ONLY BECAUSE WHILE I UNDERSTAND THE POINT YOU'RE TRYING TO

MAKE, WE'RE ALL CONSUMED BY POLITICAL ADS, EITHER THEY'RE ON TV, ON THE

RADIO, DIGITAL ADS IN THE MAIL, RIGHT? SO IT SEEMS LIKE WE GET CONSUMED

BY THE POLITICAL RHETORIC OF THESE EVEN-YEAR ELECTIONS. AND AGAIN, I GO

BACK TO HOW DOES THAT ALLOW LOCAL ISSUES AND LOCAL CANDIDATES WITH

GOOD IDEAS, BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE, HOW DOES THAT ALLOW THEM TO BE

ABLE TO RAISE THEIR VOICES AND THEIR IDEAS TO THE SURFACE ABOVE ALL THE

NOISE THAT WE SEE EVERY EVEN YEAR?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK IT'S UP TO AN INDIVIDUAL

CANDIDATE TO MAKE THE VOTERS EXCITED. YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE WILLING TO

GO DOOR-TO-DOOR YOU MAKE THEM A LOT MORE EXCITED THAN IF YOU'RE

SIMPLY GONNA SEND OUT A MAILER.

MR. SLATER: WELL, AND -- AND I APPRECIATE YOU

BRINGING THAT UP BECAUSE ONE OF THE OTHER ISSUES THAT I'M CONCERNED

ABOUT, THOUGH, IS CANDIDATE RECRUITMENT, IN A SENSE, BECAUSE NOW WHAT

WE'RE TELLING CANDIDATES IS, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO COMPETE WITH EVERY

OTHER CAMPAIGN THAT'S GOING ON THAT YEAR. SO YOU'RE GOING TO BE

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COMPETING AGAINST YOUR STATE LEGISLATIVE RACES, YOU'RE GOING TO BE

COMPETING AGAINST YOUR COUNTY LEGISLATIVE RACES, YOUR COUNTY

EXECUTIVE RACES. YOU'RE GOING TO BE ALSO COMPETING, THOUGH, AGAINST

GUBERNATORIAL AND POTENTIALLY CONGRESSIONAL AND PRESIDENTIAL, RIGHT?

SO IS THAT GOING -- THAT COST TO BE A CANDIDATE. DO YOU THINK THAT'S

GOING TO MAKE IT MORE OR LESS EXPENSIVE?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK IF SOMEONE HAS THE FIRE AND

ABILITY TO RUN, THEY'RE NOT LOOKING AT THE OTHER THINGS, THEY'RE GONNA RUN.

AND THEY'RE GONNA DEAL WITH THE EXPENSE OF THE CAMPAIGN AND THE

WALKING. YOU KNOW, WE'VE SEEN ELECTIONS TURN AROUND NOT BECAUSE

PEOPLE SPENT MONEY, IN FACT, THE OPPOSITE BECAUSE THEY PUT THEIR HEART

AND SOUL INTO THE -- INTO THAT -- INTO THAT ELECTION BECAUSE WE'VE LIVED --

A LOT OF US LIVE IN SMALL PLACES. SO -- SO, YOU KNOW, COULD IT POTENTIALLY

HARM SOMEONE? I GUESS. ANYTHING WE DO, YOU KNOW, ANY POLICY WE

IMPLEMENT COULD HARM SOMEONE. BUT I DO THINK THE GREATER BENEFIT IS

INCREASED VOTER PARTICIPATION AND INCREASED -- BECAUSE IT LEADS TO A

DEMOCRACY THAT WE BE PROUDER OF, YOU KNOW, THAT -- THAT WHERE MORE

PEOPLE ARE PARTICIPATING, WHERE MORE PEOPLE ARE ENGAGED. I THINK

THAT'S A REAL IMPORTANT BENEFIT, AND THAT'S --

MR. SLATER: I'M NOT DISAGREEING WITH YOU, BUT I

JUST ALSO WORRY THAT WE'RE ALSO GOING TO BE DISSUADING REALLY QUALIFIED

CANDIDATES FROM PARTICIPATING AT THE SAME TIME. AND I JUST --

MS. PAULIN: I THINK IT'S HARD NOW.

MR. SLATER: -- WANT TO MAKE SURE I -- I'M CORRECT

ON THIS -- I'M SORRY?

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MS. PAULIN: I THINK IT'S HARD NOW TO RECRUIT.

MR. SLATER: OH, THERE'S NO DOUBT, THERE'S NO

DOUBT. I -- I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND ALSO, WE'RE NOW

LOOKING AT A NEW PUBLIC FINANCING OF CAMPAIGNS. WOULD THE LOCAL

ELECTIONS THAT WE'RE IMPACTING, DO THEY QUALIFY?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK WE'LL SEE THAT BILL TOMORROW. I

DON'T -- I DON'T -- IT'S NOT -- I DON'T THINK IT'S ANTICIPATED THAT, YOU KNOW,

THAT WE'RE GOING TO SEE THESE LOCAL ELECTIONS PART OF IT, IT'S A STATE BILL.

MR. SLATER: THANK YOU, THANK YOU. I'M JUST

MAKING SURE THAT I WAS ABLE TO GET THROUGH ALL OF MY OTHER QUESTIONS,

AND I BELIEVE I DID, AND I -- ASSEMBLYWOMAN, I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR

TIME AND YOUR ANSWERS.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL.

MR. SLATER: YOU KNOW, I ATTENDED A PRESS

CONFERENCE LAST YEAR ABOUT THIS VERY ISSUE, AND I THOUGHT IT WAS ACTUALLY

A JOKE BECAUSE I JUST FIND THAT WE CONTINUE TO IMPEDE ON LOCAL CONTROL,

AS MY COLLEAGUE, ASSEMBLYMAN FLOOD, HAD PREVIOUSLY STATE -- STATED.

WHETHER IT'S ON ZONING ISSUES, WHETHER IT'S ON ELECTION ISSUES, I JUST FEEL

LIKE THIS BODY, THIS LEGISLATIVE BODY, CONTINUES TO OVERSTEP ITS BOUNDS

AND TAKE AWAY LOCAL CONTROL. IT CONTINUES TO IMPEDE ON LOCAL OFFICIALS,

ON OUR LOCAL ELECTED COLLEAGUES. AND I'M -- AS A PREVIOUSLY ELECTED

LOCAL OFFICIAL, THAT'S WHERE THE RUBBER MEETS THE ROAD. AS I SAID EARLIER

DURING THIS SESSION, DURING MY CAMPAIGN WE FOCUSED ON ZONING, WE

FOCUSED ON OUR PLAYGROUNDS, WE FOCUSED ON OUR PARKS AND OUR LAKES.

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THOSE ARE NOT THINGS THAT ARE REALLY DISCUSSED DURING STATE RACES,

DURING GUBERNATORIAL RACES, DURING CONGRESSIONAL OR PRESIDENTIAL RACES.

THOSE ARE LOCAL ISSUES, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT MATTERED TO MY COMMUNITY.

AND I HAVE GRAVE CONCERN THAT BY BRINGING THESE ELECTIONS OVER INTO AN

EVEN YEAR, WE'RE GONNA SILENCE THAT DEBATE, WE'RE GONNA SILENCE THOSE

IDEAS. AND THAT'S REALLY GONNA BE TO THE DETRIMENT OF EVERY ONE OF OUR

COMMUNITIES.

LOCAL CONTROL IS CRUCIAL. THE LOCAL ISSUES THAT WE'RE

DEALING WITH BACK HOME ARE CRUCIAL. AND I JUST THINK THAT WE'RE DOING

OURSELVES AND WE'RE DOING OUR NEIGHBORS AND OUR COMMUNITIES A GREAT

DISSERVICE BY TRYING TO SHIFT THESE ELECTIONS THE WAY THAT'S BEING

PROPOSED. FOR THOSE REASONS, MR. SPEAKER, I'LL BE VOTING AGAINST THIS

MEASURE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. TAGUE.

MR. TAGUE: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THROUGH

YOU, MR. SPEAKER, WOULD THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN, WILL YOU

YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. TAGUE: MS. PAULIN, IT'S ALWAYS AN HONOR AND A

PLEASURE TO HAVE THIS DISCUSSION WITH YOU. THE GOOD NEWS IS IS WE

WON'T BE TALKING ABOUT AGRICULTURE TIRES AND WE WON'T BE TALKING ABOUT

ATVS. JUST A COUPLE OF QUICK QUESTIONS HERE. DO -- DO YOU HAVE ANY

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IDEA HOW MANY COUNTIES OR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS EXIST IN NEW YORK

STATE?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THERE'S 62 COUNTIES, RIGHT?

SIXTY-TWO COUNTIES.

MR. TAGUE: WELL, THERE'S 62 COUNTIES, YES.

MS. PAULIN: AND HOW MANY -- WHAT WAS THE OTHER

QUESTION?

MR. TAGUE: HAVE ANY -- ANY OF THOSE COUNTIES

ASKED FOR A CHANGE OR TAKEN A POSITION FOR OR AGAINST THIS LAW?

MS. PAULIN: NO. NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE.

MR. TAGUE: WELL, I HAVE -- I DO HAVE A COUPLE --

COUPLE OF COUNTIES AND ORGANIZATIONS THAT HAVE SENT OUT THEIR

DISPLEASURE WITH THIS LAW. FIRST OF ALL, THE CLERKS OF THE COUNTY

LEGISLATIVE BOARDS ASSOCIATION SENT A NOTICE TODAY THAT THEY ARE

VEHEMENTLY AGAINST THIS BILL.

MS. PAULIN: SO THE COUNTY CLERK (INAUDIBLE)?

MR. TAGUE: NO. THE CLERKS OF THE COUNTY BOARDS

OF LEGISLATURES. WE HAVE -- IT'S SOMEWHERES IN UP -- UPSTATE NEW

YORK, WE HAVE COUNTY LEGISLATORS.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH.

MR. TAGUE: SO THE CLERKS OF THE COUNTY LEGISLATIVE

BOARDS.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH, I HAVE -- I THINK I HAVE THAT

MEMO. YEAH.

MR. TAGUE: AND ALSO, BOTH THE REPUBLICAN AND

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DEMOCRATIC COMMISSIONERS OF ELECTIONS IN GREENE COUNTY HAVE ALSO

CAME OUT IN OPPOSITION TO THIS BILL. AND ONE OF THE REASONS, AND I THINK

WE WOULD HAVE SAW MANY, MANY, MORE COUNTY ORGANIZATIONS AND

ASSOCIATIONS COME OUT HAD THEY KNEW ABOUT THIS. BECAUSE ONE OF THE

PROBLEMS THAT I HAVE, AND I WANT TO ASK THIS QUESTION, IS WHY DIDN'T THIS

LEGISLATION GO THROUGH ELECTION LAW COMMITTEE?

MS. PAULIN: IT WASN'T READY YET.

MR. TAGUE: WELL, THEN MAYBE WE SHOULDN'T BRING

IT TO THE FLOOR IF IT'S NOT READY.

MS. PAULIN: WE WERE STILL MAKING CHANGES TO

MAKE THE BILL BETTER.

MR. TAGUE: BUT I THINK THAT WHAT WE DID IS WE

DISENFRANCHISED THE MEMBERS OF THE ELECTION LAW COMMITTEE THAT ARE

EXPERIENCED WITH ELECTION LAW ISSUES, DIDN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO

DEBATE OR DISCUSS THIS IN COMMITTEE AND WE JUST RUSHED IT TO CODES AND

NOW WE'VE GOT IT ON THE FLOOR WITHOUT BEING ABLE TO GET THE INFORMATION

OUT TO THE PEOPLE THAT THIS IS GOING TO AFFECT.

MS. PAULIN: WE -- WE WERE NOT PREPARED YET, AND

WE HAD TO MAKE AMENDMENTS BASED ON INPUT WE GOT FROM THE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS AND SO FORTH. SO THE BILL WASN'T -- WAS JUST RECENTLY

AMENDED.

MR. TAGUE: ALSO, WHAT EXACTLY IS THE SUPPOSED

COST-SAVINGS TO THIS MEASURE?

MS. PAULIN: AS I'VE STATED BEFORE, WE'RE -- WE HAVE

NOT BEEN -- WE ARE NOT ABLE TO ASSESS COST-SAVINGS UNTIL THIS PROCESS

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BEGINS.

MR. TAGUE: SO COUNTY BOES, BOARD OF ELECTIONS,

MUST STILL RUN SPECIAL ELECTIONS AND ELECTIONS TO FILL VACANCIES. SO

THOSE COULD STILL -- THOSE COULD STILL HAPPEN AS IT APPEARS UNDER THIS BILL,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. WE DON'T CHANGE THAT.

MR. TAGUE: AND THOSE COULD OCCUR ON ODD YEARS.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. TAGUE: SO HOW WOULD THAT BE A COST-SAVINGS

TO COUNTY BOES IF YOU STILL HAVE TO RUN, FOR INSTANCE, ELECTIONS FOR

COUNTY COURT OR SUPREME COURT JUDGES?

MS. PAULIN: AS I SAID, THOSE ARE -- THOSE WOULD

REQUIRE A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT AND THE, YOU KNOW, MY PLAN --

BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, I'M VERY MUCH IN FAVOR OF THE COUNTIES BEING ABLE

TO SAVE MONEY AS A RESULT OF CONSOLIDATING THE ELECTIONS -- WOULD BE TO

PUT FORWARD ADDITIONAL LEGISLATION AND RESOLUTIONS THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR

THAT.

MR. TAGUE: AND I KNOW THIS QUESTION HAS BEEN

ASKED IN DIFFERENT WAYS TONIGHT AND I'M GOING TO ASK IT, TOO, JUST TO BE

ON THE RECORD. WITH EVERY OFFICE APPEARING ON THE BALLOT IN AN EVEN

YEAR, HOW MANY INCHES OR FEET WOULD THE AVERAGE BALLOT BE, AND ARE

OUR MACHINES EVEN CAPABLE OF HANDLING SUCH LONG BALLOTS?

MS. PAULIN: SO, THE ANSWER TO THAT IS THE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS TELLS ME THAT THE VAST MAJORITY ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO FIT ON

ONE PAGE DESPITE THE ADDITION OF -- ELECTIONS -- OR THE ADDITIONAL RACES.

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THOSE THAT DO NOT FIT, THE PRECEDENT HAS BEEN SET IN OTHER PLACES,

PRIMARILY NEW YORK CITY, WHERE YOU USE A PERFORATED BALLOT AND/OR

BALLOT A, BALLOT B, SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO CHANGE THE ABILITY -- YOU DON'T

CHANGE THE MACHINE AT ALL AND, YOU KNOW, EVERYONE WILL HAVE THE FULL

FACE BALLOT AS THE LAW REQUIRES.

MR. TAGUE: SO IN OTHER WORDS, VOTERS MAY HAVE

TWO OR THREE BALLOTS?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, THEY'RE NEVER GONNA HAVE THREE,

BUT THEY COULD HAVE TWO.

MR. TAGUE: WELL, HOW DO YOU KNOW? HOW DO

YOU -- HOW DO YOU KNOW? IF YOU HAVE A FULL SLATE OF TOWN CANDIDATES,

COUNTY CANDIDATES, STATE, EXECUTIVE LEVEL AND PRESIDENTIAL, UNITED

STATES SENATE, CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATES, UNITED STATES -- NEW YORK

STATE SUPREME COURT CANDIDATES, HOW DO YOU KNOW?

MS. PAULIN: SO YOU'RE MAKING AN ARGUMENT NOT TO

INCLUDE THE JUDGES?

MR. TAGUE: NO, I'M NOT MAKING -- I'M MAKING AN

ARGUMENT TO COMPLETELY DO AWAY WITH THIS LEGISLATION BECAUSE I THINK

IT'S CRAZY.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, AGAIN, IT'S ALL ABOUT VOTER

TURNOUT AND THIS WOULD INCREASE IT, AND WE -- OR I BELIEVE THAT THAT'S OF

VALUE.

MR. TAGUE: AND FINALLY, HOW DOES THIS BILL NOT

VIOLATE SECTION 8 OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT ARTICLE OF THE STATE

CONSTITUTION SINCE THAT SECTION MANDATES COUNTY OFFICES APPEAR ON THE

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ODD-YEAR BALLOT?

MS. PAULIN: SO IT REQUIRES SOME, WHICH ARE THE

ONES THAT WE EXCLUDED FROM THIS BILL.

MR. TAGUE: OKAY.

MR. SPEAKER, THROUGH YOU, ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. TAGUE: LISTEN, THIS COMES DOWN TO, VERY

SIMPLE, HEALTHY TURNOUT COMES FROM CON -- CONSISTENCY OF PEOPLE

VOTING MORE REGULARLY, NOT MAKING IT AN EVERY-OTHER-YEAR THING.

TURNOUT, ESPECIALLY ON THE DOWN BALLOT LOCALS, WILL ACTUALLY GET

NEGATIVELY AFFECTED BY LONGER LINES, LONGER BALLOTS, AND MOST

IMPORTANTLY, CONFUSED VOTERS. LOCAL CAMPAIGNS WILL BE MADE MORE

EXPENSIVE AS ADVERTISING RATES ARE HIGHER IN EVEN YEARS, MAILBOXES ARE

FULLER, AND EVERYTHING IN GENERAL IS MORE CROWDED. THIS IS NOTHING

MORE THAN A POLITICAL POWER GRAB BY A DESPERATE POLITICAL PARTY WHO

KNOWS THEY CAN'T WIN IN UPSTATE COUNTIES BECAUSE OF THEIR EXTREME OUT-

OF-TOUCH POSITIONS THAT ARE CONSTANTLY BEATEN BACK. THE ONLY WAY THEY

CAN WIN IS TO LITERALLY STEAL THE ELECTIONS BY CANCELLING OUR LOCAL

ELECTIONS.

LASTLY, MR. SPEAKER, THIS AGAIN IS MORE EVIDENCE OF A

ONE-PARTY RULE THAT HAS CORRUPTED NEW YORK STATE GOVERNMENT. JUST

LIKE LAST YEAR WHEN THE MAJORITY WENT AROUND THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE ON

A UNANIMOUS VOTE AND THEY OPPOSED THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE. MY

FRIENDS, THE ONLY THING TO DO IN THIS MATTER IS VOTE NO. IF YOU WANT TO

DO SOMETHING, THEN BRING IT TO THE PEOPLE, LET THEM MAKE THE DECISION

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ON HOW THEY WANT TO VOTE. IT SHOULDN'T BE MADE HERE. THIS BODY

SHOULD NOT BE MAKING THE DECISION FOR EVERY SINGLE NEW YORKER WHEN

IT COMES TO THEIR VOTING RIGHT.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I VOTE NO.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. JENSEN.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MR. SPEAKER.

WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD --

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. JENSEN: -- FOR A FEW QUESTIONS? THANK YOU

VERY MUCH --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. JENSEN: -- MS. PAULIN. I WANT TO GO BACK TO A

STORY THAT YOU TOLD MR. CURRAN ABOUT THREE DAYS AGO, IT FEELS LIKE, THAT

YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT IN YOUR COMMUNITY THAT YOU LIVE IN THAT THERE

WAS A WASTE MANAGEMENT ISSUE THAT LOCAL RESIDENTS GOT VERY INVESTED

IN, WERE PASSIONATE ABOUT, IT -- IT WAS THE MAIN ISSUE FOR THE LOCAL

ELECTION THAT YEAR. MY QUESTION IS, WAS THAT AN ODD-NUMBERED ELECTION

YEAR OR AN EVEN-NUMBERED ELECTION?

MS. PAULIN: IT WAS MARCH.

MR. JENSEN: OH. WELL, THAT DOESN'T REALLY WORK FOR

MY QUESTION, MY POINT THAT I'M TRYING TO MAKE. BUT I THINK YOUR STORY

THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT FOR THAT, THE EXAMPLE YOU USED WITH MR. FLOOD

FOR EMS, THAT JUST SHOWS THAT WHEN THERE IS A COMPELLING REASON THAT

VOTERS DO CARE, THEY DO GIVE A DAMN, THEY WILL COME OUT AND HAVE THEIR

VOICE HEARD REGARDLESS OF WHEN THAT ELECTION IS HELD.

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MS. PAULIN: I -- I DON'T KNOW THAT IT IMPACTED THE

ELECTION. WHAT IT DOES IS IT BRINGS PEOPLE'S ATTENTION TO THE LOCAL

GOVERNMENT. WE'LL HAVE TO SEE WHETHER IT IMPACTS THE TOWN ELECTION

COMING IN NOVEMBER.

MR. JENSEN: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THEY'RE ALL RUNNING UNOPPOSED,

THOUGH, SO I'M NOT (INAUDIBLE).

MR. JENSEN: SO IF -- WOULD YOU SAY THAT -- I'M NOT

GOING TO GO DOWN THAT -- SO LAST WEEK, THE MONROE COUNTY BOARD OF

ELECTIONS HOSTED A DEMONSTRATION WITH -- FOR ONE OF THE PROPOSED NEW

BALLOT MACHINES THAT IS BEFORE THE STATE BOARD OF ELECTIONS FOR

APPROVAL RIGHT NOW. THE REP FROM THAT COMPANY WHICH WAS BASED

SOMEWHERE IN THE MIDWEST, ENTIRELY BUILT WITHIN THE UNITED STATES,

WHAT SHE SAID WAS THAT THIS MACHINE HAD TO BE PRECISELY DESIGNED

OUTSIDE THE REST OF THE OTHER MACHINES THEY OFFER, FOR NEW YORK'S

ELECTIONS AND OUR STATE'S ELECTION LAWS AS THEY ARE AT THIS MOMENT, NOT

WHAT THEY WILL BE AFTER THIS LEGISLATION IS PASSED AND SIGNED INTO LAW.

THAT MACHINE IS UP FOR APPROVAL BY THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS RIGHT NOW

AND COMPLIES WITH STATE AND FEDERAL LAW. IS THERE A CONCERN THAT WITH

THE APPROVAL OF THIS LEGISLATION AND THE ADDITION OF MORE ELECTED OFFICES

ONTO THE BALLOT THAT NEW MACHINES THAT ARE BEING BROUGHT TO REVIEW AT

THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS WILL NOW BE OUT OF COMPLIANCE WITH THE LAW

AND WHAT THESE MACHINES WERE DESIGNED FOR?

MS. PAULIN: SO I WILL SAY WE COMPLETELY ENGAGED

THE STATE BOARD OF ELECTIONS AND SO MANY OF THE -- IN THE BILL LANGUAGE

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TO BE SURE THAT IT WAS CORRECT. AND TODAY AFTER THE CODES MEETING, I

WAS CONCERNED I DIDN'T HAVE THE ANSWER TO ONE OF THE QUESTIONS, AND

NOT ONLY WAS THE ELECTION LAWYER AT THE BOARD ABLE TO ANSWER THE

QUESTION, HE WAS WATCHING THE CODES MEETING. SO I CAN TELL YOU THAT

THEY'RE VERY ENGAGED, KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON, AND WILL MAKE DECISIONS

BASED ON WHAT WE DO HERE.

MR. JENSEN: OKAY. ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT YOU

TALKED ABOUT, AND I THINK ONE OF MY OTHER COLLEAGUES WILL TALK ABOUT

THIS COMING UP, WAS THAT FOR A TERM THAT ENDS AFTER 2025 THEY GET TO

FINISH -- THAT ELECTED REPRESENTATIVE GETS TO FINISH THEIR TERM. THEIR

SUBSEQUENT TERM IS A TRUNCATED TERM THAT WILL RESET ON AN EVEN YEAR.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. JENSEN: IF SOMEBODY IS COMPLETING A TERM

LIMIT THAT WON'T AFFECT THEM, BUT IF THEY'RE MIDTERMS, WHICH OFTEN OUR

LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES HAVE TERM LIMITS BASED ON AMOUNT OF TERMS SERVED

AND/OR TOTAL CONSECUTIVE TERMS SERVED. HOW WILL THAT TRUNCATED TERM, IF

IT'S IN THE MIDDLE OF THEIR CYCLE, IF YOU WILL --

MS. PAULIN: IT WON'T COUNT.

MR. JENSEN: IT WON'T COUNT. SO IF SOMEBODY -- IF A

MUNICIPALITY HAS A 10-YEAR TERM LIMIT, FIVE-TERM LIMIT FOR A TOWN

COUNCIL MEMBER, THEY'LL ESSENTIALLY GET TO SERVE SIX TERMS AND 11 YEARS

DUE TO THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

MS. PAULIN: THAT'S CORRECT.

MR. JENSEN: HOW IS THAT NOT IN CONFLICT WITH WHAT

THE TOWN CODE SAYS?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE SUPERSEDING

THAT WITH STATE LAW.

MR. JENSEN: BUT HOW DOES -- SO IN THE SUPERSEDING

OF -- WITH STATE LAW, HOW DOES THAT NOT RAISE CONCERNS THAT I THINK A

FEW OF MY COLLEAGUES HAVE RAISED, MR. GOODELL ON THE AMENDMENT

DEBATE AND MR. TAGUE PREVIOUSLY, HOW DOES THAT NOT PUT THIS BILL IN

COMPLETE CONFLICT WITH ARTICLE IX OF THE STATE CONSTITUTION?

MS. PAULIN: DO YOU WANT TO REMIND ME WHAT THAT

IS?

MR. JENSEN: MY MEMORY'S NOT TOO GOOD AFTER 19

DEBATES IN THREE DAYS, SO I'M GONNA TAKE -- HOME RULE, WHAT MR.

GOODELL SAID.

MS. PAULIN: I SEE.

MR. JENSEN: BUT I THINK IT IS SOMETHING THAT WE

SHOULD BE CONCERNED ABOUT, AND I THINK A WAY THAT COULD BE REMEDIED

WOULD HAVE BEEN APPROVING AN EXCEPTIONAL AMENDMENT THAT WAS

OFFERED A FEW HOURS AGO. WAS THERE ANY CONSIDERATION BY YOU WHEN

DRAFTING THIS BILL TO MAKE IT AN OPT-IN OR PUT IT TO A REFERENDUM AT THE

COUNTY LEVEL, LOCAL LEVEL, OR AS PART OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT

PROCESS FOR (INAUDIBLE)?

MS. PAULIN: I WOULD SAY THE COUNTIES NOW HAVE

THAT ABILITY AND THEY HAVEN'T DONE IT, RIGHT, THEY HAVEN'T MOVED TO EVEN

YEARS. SO IN -- IN DESIROUS OF HAVING VOTER PARTICIPATION INCREASE

STATEWIDE, YOU KNOW, WE ARE THE STATE LEGISLATURE AND WE'RE MAKING

THE JUDGMENT, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WANT TO DO IT STATEWIDE.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. JENSEN: SO NO COUNTIES HAVE MOVED TO DO THIS

ON THEIR OWN IS WHAT YOU JUST SAID?

MS. PAULIN: MOST COUNTIES HAVE VERY OLD CHARTERS,

THEY'RE USED TO DOING IT ON ODD YEARS, THEY DIDN'T THINK ABOUT CHANGING

IT. THEY COULD HAVE, BUT THEY DIDN'T.

MR. JENSEN: BUT -- SO DOESN'T THAT SHOW THAT

THERE'S AN UNWILLINGNESS OF THE COUNTIES FOR THIS TYPE OF CHANGE? IF

THEY COULD HAVE -- AND THERE -- WE HAVE COUNTIES THAT ARE

DEMOCRATICALLY-CONTROLLED, REPUBLICAN-CONTROLLED, COUNTY EXECUTIVE

OF ONE PARTY AND COUNTY LEGISLATURE OF A SEPARATE PARTY, AN ARRAY OF

BOARDS OF SUPERVISORS. SO IT'S NOT JUST ONE PARTY SAYING, NO, NO, NO, WE

DON'T WANT TO DO THIS. EVERY SINGLE COUNTY IN THE STATE HAS NOT TAKEN A

STEP TO DO THIS. SO DOESN'T THIS SHOW THAT THERE IS NOT A LOCAL APPETITE

FOR THIS TO HAPPEN AND THAT WE ARE OVERSTEPPING OUR BOUNDS AS THE STATE

LEGISLATURE, FORCING THIS CHANGE WHEN THE COUNTIES HAVE SIGNIFIED NO

DESIRE TO DO THIS?

MS. PAULIN: SO, YOU KNOW, THIS WON'T BE THE FIRST

THAT I'VE DONE THAT, RIGHT? SO THE FIRST TIME THAT I LEARNED HOW TO DRAFT A

BILL TO SUPERSEDE THE COUNTY CHARTERS WAS WITH REDISTRICTING. AND SO

WE DID THAT, WE SET STANDARDS BECAUSE SOME COUNTIES HAD STANDARDS,

SOME COUNTIES DIDN'T. WE WANTED TO MAKE THEM CONSISTENT WITH THE

LAW, CONSISTENT WITH THE COURT STANDARDS, YOU KNOW, AND WE WANTED TO

MAKE THEM BETTER FOR EVERYBODY. SO WE ADJUSTED THE ELECTION LAW

AND MADE IT UNIFORM. NOW, SOME COUNTIES WEREN'T HAPPY, MOST

COUNTIES HAVE ADJUSTED AND WE HAVE FAIRER LINES THEREFORE. SO I WOULD

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SAY THE SAME THING IS HERE. YOU KNOW, WE ARE NOW GONNA HAVE A

STATEWIDE SYSTEM, A TIME FOR EVERYBODY TO GET EXCITED ABOUT THE

ELECTIONS DURING AN EVEN YEAR, TO PARTICIPATE. SO IF YOU LIVE IN PUTNAM

OR YOU LIVE IN WESTCHESTER AND YOU'RE NEIGHBORS BECAUSE YOU SHARE THE

SAME GROCERY STORE, EVERYBODY'S GONNA BE TALKING, THEY ARE GOING TO

VOTE.

MR. JENSEN: BUT RESPECTFULLY, WE'RE NOT GOING TO

HAVE A STATEWIDE SYSTEM. THERE ARE FIVE COUNTIES THAT DO NOT HAVE TO

ABIDE BY THE TERMS OF THIS LEGISLATION.

MS. PAULIN: I UNDERSTAND.

MR. JENSEN: SO IT'S -- IT IS NOT A STATEWIDE SYSTEM

THAT WE STILL AN IN -- INEQUITABLE --

MS. PAULIN: UNTIL WE EVEN IT OUT.

MR. JENSEN: BUT -- BUT IF THAT'S THE CASE, WHY

DIDN'T WE JUST WAIT UNTIL --

MS. PAULIN: THEN WHY DON'T WE DO THEM FIRST.

MR. JENSEN: OR WHY DIDN'T WE ENSURE THAT WE

IRONED OUT ALL OF THE POTENTIAL ISSUES WITH THIS TYPE OF LEGISLATION IF IT

HAS TO BE DONE BY A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT, AND ALLOW THAT TO

HAPPEN? WHICH WOULD ALSO SOLVE THE QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT

THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE ACTUALLY TRULY WANT IT. WE'VE SEEN

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS PASSED BY THIS LEGISLATURE FAIL WHEN THEY

GO TO THE VOTERS, SENDING A VERY CLEAR MESSAGE THAT OUR ACTIONS DID NOT

REFLECT THE WILL OF NEW YORKERS. WHY WOULD WE NOT PUT THE ENTIRE

PACKAGE, SOLVING 100 PERCENT OF THE PROBLEM THAT YOU -- YOU'RE TRYING

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TO SEEK, AND ACTUALLY LEAVE IT TO THE WILL OF THE VOTERS BY ENSURING THAT

20 MILLION NEW YORKERS ARE ALL OPERATING UNDER THE SAME PLAYBOOK

INSTEAD OF TRYING TO PIECEMEAL IT WHERE YOU HAVE AN INEQUITABLE SYSTEM

POTENTIALLY CONTINUING INTO THE FUTURE.

MS. PAULIN: SO I WOULD SAY BY PUTTING THIS

LEGISLATION FORWARD -- REMEMBER, I'M NOT FROM THE CITY, EITHER, SO IF I

WAS FROM THE CITY MAYBE I WOULD HAVE DONE THE CITY FIRST, BUT I'M NOT.

AND JUST BECAUSE WE PUT THIS FORWARD, THE CITY COUNCIL, THE NEW YORK

CITY COUNCIL MEETING YESTERDAY AND THEIR COMMITTEE ACTUALLY IS

RECOMMENDING THAT WE DO THAT FOR THEM. SO -- SO IT'S -- THIS IS THE FIRST

NEXT STEP IN INCLUDING THE CITY OF NEW YORK.

MR. JENSEN: BUT THAT WOULD -- THAT WOULD TAKE A

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. JENSEN: AND SO WHAT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE IS

YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THE ENTIRE STATE OF NEW YORK VOTING ON A

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT THAT AFFECTS THE FIVE BOROUGHS OF NEW YORK

CITY. WOULDN'T IT HAVE MADE MORE SENSE --

MS. PAULIN: AND MY CITIES.

MR. JENSEN: AND ALL CITIES. WOULDN'T IT HAVE BEEN

MORE RESPECTFUL TO EVERY SINGLE NEW YORKER IN EVERY SINGLE PART OF THE

STATE TO SAY, LISTEN, WE'RE NOT JUST GONNA ASK YOU TO VOTE ON THIS THING

THAT AFFECTS A FRACTION OF NEW YORKERS, BUT WE'RE GOING TO ENSURE THAT

THERE'S NO CONSTITUTIONAL QUESTIONS, THAT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT OUR

COMMUNITIES WANT, IT'S SOMETHING THAT THE VOTERS WANT, THAT ALL THE

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THINGS THAT MYSELF AND MY COLLEAGUES HAVE BEEN STANDING UP HERE FOR

HOURS SAYING THAT WE'RE HEARING FROM OUR CONSTITUENTS ABOUT WHY THIS IS

NOT A BILL THAT WE SHOULD BE MOVING FORWARD WITH. PUTTING IT TO THE

VOTERS WOULD COMPLETELY UNDERCUT OUR ENTIRE ARGUMENT. WHY WOULDN'T

WE GO ABOUT IT THAT WAY?

MS. PAULIN: WE DON'T -- WE DON'T -- WE DON'T RULE

IN NEW YORK BY REFERENDUM. YOU KNOW, WE -- WE'RE DIFFERENT THAN

CALIFORNIA. THIS IS HOW WE DO IT, WE'RE A REPRESENTATIVE GOVERNMENT.

WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO ASSESS, YOU KNOW, WHAT OUR VOTERS CARE ABOUT

AND DON'T CARE ABOUT, WE ALL REFLECT THAT. SO WE'LL SEE RED AND GREEN UP

THERE AS A RESULT OF THAT. BUT WE ARE A REPRESENTATIVE GOVERNMENT, SO

PUTTING IT OUT FOR REFERENDUM IS NOT SOMETHING THAT I WOULD SUPPORT.

MR. JENSEN: OKAY. SO, I KNOW A COUPLE OF MY --

OTHER MEMBERS OF MY COLLEAGUES BROUGHT THIS UP, SO OFTENTIMES IN

LOCAL ELECTIONS IT IS THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE, IT IS THE TOWN SUPERVISOR WHO

IS THE MAIN DRIVER IN ODD-YEAR ELECTIONS AND IT'S WHAT WE SEE WITH THE

PRESIDENT AND THE GOVERNOR IN EVEN YEARS. IF WE'RE TAKING THOSE

ELECTED OFFICES OFF THE ODD-NUMBERED ELECTIONS FOR THE TIME BEING, PER

YOUR COMMENTS, AND WE'RE MAKING ONLY JUDGESHIPS POTENTIALLY ON THE

BALLOT, IS THERE A CONCERN THAT IF SOMEBODY DOESN'T EVER FORESEE THE

IMPACT THAT THE JUDICIARY MAY HAVE ON THAT? I CERTAINLY VOTE FOR THOSE

SEATS EVERY TIME THEY'RE UP, I DON'T -- I'M SURE YOU DON'T EITHER. BUT

ISN'T THERE A CONCERN THAT IF WE HAVE THE SURROGATE COURT JUDGE IN A

COUNTY BEING THE TOP OF THE TICKET, THAT A LOT OF VOTERS ARE GOING TO SAY,

YOU KNOW WHAT? I REALLY DON'T CARE THIS YEAR, AND NOT COMING OUT TO

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VOTE AND FURTHER DEPRESSING TURNOUT FROM A 25 OR 20 PERCENT LEVEL TO A

5 PERCENT LEVEL?

MS. PAULIN: WE'LL HAVE TO SEE HOW THAT WORKS OUT.

YOU KNOW, I DO THINK THAT PEOPLE ARE MOTIVATED BY CERTAIN ELECTIONS.

THEY'LL -- SOME WILL BE MOTIVATED, CERTAINLY THE FAMILIES OF ALL THOSE

JUDGES WILL BE MOTIVATED. AND -- BUT I AGREE THAT THERE COULD BE A

DROP-OFF BECAUSE WE WOULD HAVE FEWER RACES, I AGREE, WHICH IS WHY I

THINK WE HAVE TO MAKE THE CHANGES GO FORWARD LONG-TERM.

MR. JENSEN: SO WE TALK ABOUT SOLVING A LOWER

TURNOUT ELECTION CYCLE, WHY WASN'T -- AND WE'RE DOING THIS AS PART OF A

CHANGE TO TOWN LAW, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT WHY -- IF WE'RE WORRIED

ABOUT LOW TURNOUT ELECTIONS AND THE OUTSIDE'S IMPACT THAT OFFICES HAVE

ON OUR CONSTITUENTS, WHY WOULDN'T WE ALSO TRY TO MAKE A CHANGE TO FIRE

DISTRICT ELECTIONS OR SCHOOL BOARD ELECTIONS OR LIBRARY TRUSTEE ELECTIONS?

OR MOVE VILLAGE ELECTIONS FROM THE SPRING TO ELECTION DAY. WHY

WOULDN'T WE ADDRESS EVERY LOW TURNOUT ELECTION THAT EXISTS?

MS. PAULIN: THOSE ARE HARDER. I CAN TELL YOU,

BECAUSE I TRIED TO DO A LAW THAT WOULD CHANGE THE FIRE DISTRICT IN -- IN

EASTCHESTER, AND IT PASSED AND IT WAS SIGNED AND IT'S STILL NOT

IMPLEMENTED BECAUSE OF HOW HARD IT IS TO DO THAT. SO I AGREE, WE NEED

TO DO SOME OF THOSE. YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY FIRE DISTRICTS AND ALL, THEY --

THEY VOTE AT ODD TIMES, YOU KNOW, THERE'S PROBABLY NO REASON NOT TO

FOLD THEM IN. BUT THAT WAS A MUCH LARGER PROJECT, YOU KNOW, THAN --

THAN THIS. BUT I DON'T DISAGREE THAT WE SHOULD BE DOING SOME OF THAT.

MR. JENSEN: SO -- SO CHANGING A FIRE DISTRICT

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ELECTION WAS A TOUGHER MOUNTAIN TO CLIMB --

MS. PAULIN: THAN THIS.

MR. JENSEN: -- THAN CHANGING THE NATURE --

MS. PAULIN: TOTALLY.

MR. JENSEN: -- OF DEMOCRACY IN NEW YORK?

MS. PAULIN: TOTALLY.

MR. JENSEN: OKAY. VERY INTERESTING. THANK YOU

VERY MUCH, MS. PAULIN, I APPRECIATE YOUR ANSWERS.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I

APPRECIATE MS. PAULIN'S ANSWERS, BUT I SHARE THE CONCERNS THAT WERE

RAISED BY A NUMBER OF MY COLLEAGUES, AS WELL AS MY LOCAL BOARD OF

ELECTIONS AND MY CONSTITUENTS IN MY DISTRICT THAT THIS CHANGE WILL

DRAMATICALLY IN -- DECREASE THE IMPORTANCE OF LOCAL ISSUES AND WILL ONLY

FURTHER ENCOURAGE MORE TOXICITY IN OUR ELECTIONS AND OUR DEMOCRATIC

PROCESS BY INJECTING NATIONAL POLITICS INTO ELECTIONS FOR LOCAL OFFICES.

CERTAINLY, IF THIS CHAMBER WOULD HAVE EMBRACED A VERY COMMONSENSE

AMENDMENT THAT WAS PROPOSED EARLIER TODAY, IT WOUND HAVE PUT THE

ONUS ON OUR CONSTITUENTS TO MAKE THE DECISION FOR THEMSELVES. IF THE

SPONSOR WOULD HAVE SOUGHT TO ENSURE THAT EVERY NEW YORKER WOULD BE

PLAYING UNDER THE SAME RULES AND PUT THIS TO A CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT, THAT WOULD HAVE ENSURED THAT THE PEOPLE WE REPRESENT ARE

HAVING THEIR VOICE HEARD AND ENSURE THAT WE'RE ACTING RESPONSIBLY FOR

THEIR INTERESTS.

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WITH THAT, I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME, MR. SPEAKER, THANK

YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, MR.

JENSEN.

MS. WALSH.

MS. WALSH: ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MS.

WALSH.

MS. WALSH: I THOUGHT I'D GIVE THE SPONSOR A BREAK.

SHE'S BEEN ANSWERING QUESTIONS FOR A LONG TIME, AND -- AND I THINK THAT

MY COMMENTS COULD BE MADE REALLY WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF -- OF

ENGAGING IN QUESTION-AND-ANSWER WITH THE SPONSOR.

YOU KNOW, I'VE BEEN LISTENING TO A LOT OF THIS DEBATE.

I'VE ALSO BEEN SERVING FOR SEVERAL YEARS NOW, AND JUST AS I WAS

REFLECTING UPON ALL THE CHANGES THAT WE'VE SEEN IN THE ELECTION LAW

AND IN OUR -- IN OUR ELECTION LAW OVER THE LAST -- JUST SINCE I'VE STARTED.

YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD -- WE CHANGED THE PRIMARY FROM SEPTEMBER TO

JUNE, WE'VE GOT EARLY VOTING NOW, WE HAVE EXPANDED ACCESS TO

ABSENTEE VOTING, AND DURING COVID IT WAS ESSENTIALLY NO EXCUSE

ABSENTEE VOTING. WE HAD THAT BALLOT PROPOSITION THAT WAS VOTED DOWN,

WHICH I THINK SURPRISED A LOT OF MY COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE

AISLE. THEY DIDN'T LIKE THAT, BUT THE VOTERS REJECTED IT. WE HAVE

PREREGISTRATION OF 16 YEAR-OLDS FOR -- WE'RE DOING A LOT OF THINGS, AND I

THINK -- YOU KNOW, MY DAD USED TO SAY, IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT. I --

I DON'T SEE WHY WE NEED THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

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LET'S EXAMINE FOR A MOMENT WHAT THE -- WHAT THE

BASICALLY THE TWO REASONS ARE THAT THE SPONSOR HAS PUT OUT FOR THIS

LEGISLATION. THE FIRST ONE IS BECAUSE WE WANT TO INCREASE VOTER

PARTICIPATION. WELL, LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING. WHEN I GO AROUND,

WHEN I'M CANVASSING, WHEN I'M RUNNING FOR OFFICE AND I'M KNOCKING ON

DOORS, I WISH I HAD A DOLLAR FOR EVERY PERSON THAT CALLS ME CONGRESS

MEMBER OR SENATOR. PEOPLE DON'T KNOW. PEOPLE ARE OUT LIVING THEIR

LIVES, WORKING AT THEIR JOBS, TAKING CARE OF THEIR FAMILIES AND, QUITE

HONESTLY, WE LIVE IN A FISHBOWL HERE. WE WORK IN A FISHBOWL WHERE

POLITICS AND -- AND PUBLIC SERVICE IN THIS CHAMBER IS PRIMARY FOR US AND

LITERALLY NO ONE ELSE REALLY CARES, RIGHT? SO I THINK THAT WHEN WE START

MONKEYING AROUND AND CHANGING A BUNCH OF THINGS LIKE THE PRIMARY

DATE, BOY, THAT WAS TOUGH TO TRY TO GET THAT ACROSS TO PEOPLE. NO, MR.

AND MRS. JONES, YOU DON'T GO IN SEPTEMBER, NOW YOU GO IN JUNE. NO, I

KNOW I USUALLY HAVE SOMEBODY PRESENT MY PETITION FOR SIGNATURE IN THIS

MONTH, BUT NOW IT'S A LOT EARLIER. YES, IT IS SLIPPERY OUTSIDE. YOU

KNOW, WE'RE TRYING TO EXPLAIN ALL OF THESE CHANGES, AND THE -- I THINK, IF

ANYTHING, THIS LAW IS GOING TO CREATE EVEN MORE CONFUSION. I'VE SAID,

EVERY TIME WE'VE TAKEN UP A BILL -- A BILL THAT'S MAKING A CHANGE IN THE

ELECTION LAW, I ALWAYS GET UP AND WHETHER IT'S -- EARLY VOTING, FOR

EXAMPLE, I WAS PRETTY SKEPTICAL ABOUT THAT BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT -- AND

MAYBE -- MAYBE I'M VERY OLD SCHOOL, BUT I BELIEVE THAT PEOPLE WHO

BELIEVE IN A CIVIC RESPONSIBILITY AND THEIR ROLE IN IT WILL SHOW UP ON

ELECTION DAY AND CAST THEIR BALLOT. AND THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE

THAT I'VE TALKED TO ARE HAVING A VERY LONG TIME OF COMING AROUND TO THE

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IDEA OF, HEY, I COULD GO OUT A LITTLE BIT EARLIER, AND I THINK THAT THEY'RE

DIPPING THEIR TOE IN THAT. MAYBE THAT'S -- MAYBE THAT'S BEEN A HELPFUL

THING.

NOW, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE -- WE -- WE'RE STILL GOING TO

HAVE ODD -- ODD-YEAR ELECTIONS. THAT'S WHAT REALLY KILLS ME, BECAUSE

THE SECOND REASON THAT'S BEEN GIVEN IS THAT WE'RE GONNA SAVE MONEY,

IT'S GONNA BE EASIER. WE'RE STILL GONNA HAVE ODD-NUMBER ELECTIONS

BECAUSE OF ALL THE CARVE-OUTS IN THIS BILL. SO I WOULD SAY ALL WE'RE

REALLY DOING IS WE'RE GONNA HAVE A BIG, BIG, LONG BALLOT. IF WE CARE SO

MUCH ABOUT ENCOURAGING VOTER PARTICIP -- GREATER PARTICIPATION IN THESE

TOWN AND COUNTY AND LOCAL RACES, WHY ARE WE GONNA STICK THEM AT THE

END OF A REALLY LONG BALLOT WHERE WE'RE PROBABLY GONNA HAVE A HUGE

UNDER VOTE. YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE GONNA VOTE FOR THE FIRST COUPLE OF

RACES, THE ONES THAT ARE SWALLOWING UP ALL THE AIRTIME AND ALL THE DIGITAL

ADS AND ALL THE ROBO CALLS, IF THEY'RE STILL ALLOWED BY THEN, AND ALL -- YOU

KNOW, ALL OF THAT AND THEN THEY'RE GONNA JUST FALL OFF WHEN THEY COME

TO THOSE LOCAL RACES. I THINK IT'S GONNA HAVE THE OPPOSITE EFFECT OF WHAT

THE SPONSOR'S STATED INTENT IS.

SO PEOPLE TALK ABOUT VOTER FATIGUE, RIGHT? SO, THERE

ARE PEOPLE, AND IT'S BEEN DISCUSSED HERE ALREADY, THERE ARE A LOT OF

PEOPLE I TALK TO WHO SAY, YOU KNOW, GOD, YOU KNOW, I -- I JUST -- I JUST

DON'T REALLY CARE ABOUT THIS, THAT AND THE OTHER THING. YOU KNOW,

THEY'LL COME OUT MAYBE AND THEY'LL VOTE, BUT IT'S HARD TO GET THEM OUT TO

THE POLLS. I DON'T SEE HOW MAKING THIS CHANGE GETS AMBIVALENT OR

APATHETIC VOTERS OUT ANY MORE THAN THEY ALREADY DO. AND I'D BE VERY

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CURIOUS TO KNOW -- I KNOW LAST YEAR WE HAD A PRETTY DECENT SPIKE, I

THINK, I THINK, IN VOTER TURNOUT IN THE GOVERNOR'S ELECTION YEAR. BUT

WITH ALL OF THESE CHANGES THAT WE'VE MADE, ARE WE SEEING, LIKE, THAT

MANY MORE PEOPLE COMING OUT? BECAUSE IT SEEMS TO ME LIKE IT'S THE

SAME -- I'M SEEING THE SAME PEOPLE COMING OUT TO THE POLLS THAT ALWAYS

COME OUT TO THE POLLS. I DON'T THINK THAT WE'RE REALLY NECESSARILY

ENGAGING THAT MANY MORE PEOPLE AND I DON'T THINK THAT THIS BILL IS

GOING TO DO THAT, EITHER.

I THINK THAT ANOTHER POINT I'D LIKE TO MAKE IS THAT WE

ALREADY ARE -- I THINK WE CAN ARGUE THAT WE'RE BECOMING -- POLITICAL

SCIENTISTS WILL HAVE FUN TALKING ABOUT HOW POLARIZED WE ARE AS A

SOCIETY. BUT WE KNOW, EVEN WITHIN THIS CHAMBER, THAT WE'VE HAD SOME

VERY, VERY CLOSE ELECTIONS IN RECENT YEARS. I -- WHEN I RAN FOR TOWN

BOARD A MILLION YEARS AGO, I WON BY SEVEN VOTES, AND WE HAVE

MEMBERS IN THIS CHAMBER THAT WON BY LESS THAN 20 AND ARE HERE FOR

THOSE REASONS. AND THINK ABOUT, REFLECT UPON, HOW LONG IT TOOK TO GET

THOSE VOTER RESULTS IN. IT TOOK WEEKS, IT TOOK A LONG TIME. AND I'M ALL

FOR COUNTING EVERY LEGITIMATE VOTE, WE HAD TO DO THE WORK TO DO THAT,

BUT AS WE ADD MORE AND MORE AND MORE IN AN ELECTION CYCLE, AREN'T WE

JUST GOING TO BE DELAYING GETTING OUR VOTING RESULTS EVEN THAT MUCH

MORE?

I'D LIKE TO MAKE THE POINT ABOUT THE POTENTIAL IMPACT

ON THE SCHOOLS. THE SPONSOR NOTED EARLIER THAT IT WAS A POSSIBILITY THAT

SCHOOLS MAY HAVE TO GET CLOSED FOR ELECTION DAY OR -- OR SOMETHING

ALONG THOSE LINES. I WASN'T ACTUALLY IN THE ROOM, I HEARD ABOUT THAT

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AFTER THE FACT, I WAS OUT AT THE WAM MEETING. BUT WE KNOW THAT THERE

ARE A COUPLE OF BILLS THAT WERE ON THE COMMITTEE CALENDAR TODAY TO ADD

ADDITIONAL HOLIDAYS, STATE HOLIDAY -- I DON'T KNOW IF THEY'RE GONNA BE

OPTIONAL OR IF THEY'RE GONNA BE MANDATORY -- AND I'VE GOTTEN A LOT OF

FEEDBACK FROM BOCES SCHOOL ADMINISTRATORS, SUPERINTENDENTS,

CONCERNED ABOUT THE 180-DAY RULE FOR SCHOOL AND HOW ADDING THESE

HOLIDAYS IS MAKING IT REALLY, REALLY TIGHT FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO HIT THAT

180 DAYS. IF WE START TALKING ABOUT HAVING THIS BILL CREATE AN IMPACT ON

SCHOOLS WHERE THEY COULD BE POTENTIALLY CLOSING DOWN THE SCHOOL FOR

ELECTION DAY OR DAYS LEADING UP TO ELECTION DAY, I DON'T KNOW WHAT

THE RESULT WOULD BE, AREN'T WE MAYBE IN AN UN -- AN UN -- AN UNINTENDED

CONSEQUENCE MAYBE TO HAVE AN IMPACT LIKE THAT ON THE SCHOOL AND

SCHOOL CALENDARS?

I THINK THAT -- WE ALSO HAVE BALLOT PROPOSITIONS ON THE

BACK OF THE BALLOT. SO LET'S NOT FORGET THAT AS WE'RE CREATING A LONGER

BALLOT, WE'RE ALSO -- THIS CHAMBER HAS VOTED ON PUTTING ON A NUMBER OF

BALLOT PROPOSITIONS IN RECENT YEARS, AND -- AND COMING UP, ON THE BACK

OF THE BALLOT. THINK ABOUT HOW HARD IT'S BEEN TO TRY TO EDUCATE OUR

VOTERS TO FLIP THAT BALLOT OVER. SO NOT ONLY ARE THEY GOING TO HAVE TO GO

THROUGH ALL OF THE FEDERAL, STATE, COUNTY AND LOCAL RACES -- AND I KNOW

THAT THERE ARE CARVE-OUTS AND EXCEPTIONS -- THEY'RE GONNA HAVE THIS BIG

LONG BALLOT, BUT THEN THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO FLIP THAT BALLOT OVER AND

VOTE ON THINGS LIKE MENTAL HEALTH AND THE OTHER THINGS THAT WE'RE

AGREEING TO PUT ON THE BACK OF THE BALLOT.

I DON'T THINK THAT THERE'S ENOUGH GOOD REASON FOR THIS

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BILL, AND THAT'S WHY I'M OPPOSING IT. I THINK THAT THE SYSTEM IS FINE THE

WAY IT WORKS. IF WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE GREATER VOTER PARTICIPATION,

GREAT. BUT MONKEYING AROUND WITH THIS STUFF IS NOT THE WAY TO GO. AND

I THINK THAT IT'S -- IT'S REALLY -- THE RATIONALE THAT'S BEING GIVEN FOR THE

BILL IS REALLY JUST -- JUST FALSE. AND I KNOW THAT ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES

USED THE EXACT TERM, THE EXACT PHRASE THAT I WAS GOING TO USE, SO I'LL SAY

IT AGAIN: POLITICAL POWER GRAB; THAT'S WHAT IT REALLY IS. IT REALLY IS. I

THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE A LESSON SHOULD HAVE BEEN TAKEN WHEN

THE -- WHEN THE LINES WERE GERRYMANDERED, OVERRIDING THE WILL OF THE

LOCALITIES AND THE VOTERS. THAT DIDN'T GO SO WELL. THAT ALL GOT TURNED

AROUND AND THAT ALL CREATED A BIG MESS. DO WE REALLY WANT TO DO THAT

AGAIN?

I THINK THAT -- I -- I JUST -- I JUST THINK THAT THERE'S NOT A

GOOD ENOUGH REASON FOR THIS BILL. I THINK THAT THE BILL HAS GOT A LOT OF

PROBLEMS. I THINK THAT THEY'VE BEEN VERY WELL CALLED OUT. I ALSO FEEL AS

THOUGH I'M LARGELY DEBATING TO AN EMPTY SIDE OF THE ROOM, SO I DON'T

KNOW HOW MANY -- HOW MUCH OF AN IMPACT MY COMMENTS ARE GOING TO

HAVE ON MY COLLEAGUES. BUT, YOU KNOW, I JUST -- I THINK IT'S LIKE -- I

THINK WE SEE WHAT THIS REALLY IS. WE CAN DRESS IT UP, WE CAN -- WE CAN

SAY WE'RE OUT TO DRIVE GREATER VOTER PARTICIPATION. IT'S CLEARLY NOT WHAT

THE REAL REASON IS WHY THIS IS BEING OFFERED. IT'S NOT GONNA SAVE ANY

MONEY, IT'S GOING TO CONFUSE THE VOTERS. AND OBVIOUSLY, I'M GOING TO

BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE. I THINK IT'S A REALLY, REALLY POOR IDEA AND I

THINK WE CAN REALLY SEE IT FOR WHAT IT IS. SO THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER OTIS: MR. MIKULIN.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. MIKULIN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MIKULIN: I JUST WANT TO GO OVER A FEW

QUESTIONS. I KNOW WE'VE HAD A LARGE TALK TODAY ABOUT THE MACHINES

AND EVERYTHING ELSE, BUT I WANTED TO GO OVER, JUST, YOU KNOW, REPEAT A

LITTLE BIT BUT ASK A FEW QUESTIONS. NOW, WHAT YOU SAID BEFORE IS THAT

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE -- THE PAPER'S GOING TO BE PERFORATED IF THE

OBVIOUSLY THE CANDIDATES --

MS. PAULIN: I'M SORRY?

MR. MIKULIN: THE BALLOT WILL BE PERFORATED IF THE

BALLOT CAN'T FIT ON ONE PAGE; WOULD THAT BE CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, THE LAW ALLOWS FOR A PERFORATED

BALLOT, BUT THE LAW ALSO ALLOWS FOR TWO BALLOTS.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. AND THOSE TWO BALLOTS WOULD

GO IN AT THE SAME TIME, OR YOU PUT ONE IN --

MS. PAULIN: ONE AT A TIME.

MR. MIKULIN: ONE AT A TIME. SO THEY'D BE LIKE AN

-- THERE WOULD BE AN A AND A B BALLOT.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO NOW WE HAVE POTENTIALLY

TWO SEPARATE BALLOTS. NOW, IF THE -- LET'S -- LET'S SAY THE PAPER IS

PERFORATED SO THAT THERE'S A LONGER SHEET GOING INTO THE BALLOT. NOW,

THE SCANNERS HAVE THE ABILITY TO --

MS. PAULIN: IT WOULDN'T BE LONGER. IT WOULD BE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PERFORATED IN THE MIDDLE, SO IT WOULD BE THE SAME SIZE.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO WOULD THE -- AND THE

SCANNER WOULD BE ABLE TO PROPERLY READ THAT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MIKULIN: NOW, GOING BACK TO THERE BEING TWO

BALLOTS, WILL THE PRINT BE ANY SMALLER ON THE -- THE BALLOT?

MS. PAULIN: UM, I DON'T THINK THAT -- I MEAN, I

GUESS POTENTIALLY IT COULD BE SMALLER, BUT POTENTIALLY IT COULD BE LARGER.

MR. MIKULIN: NOW, WE'RE ADDING LOCAL ELECTIONS

TO EVEN YEARS, SO WHERE DO WE BELIEVE THAT WOULD BE PLACED ON THE

BALLOT?

MS. PAULIN: WHERE WHAT?

MR. MIKULIN: WILL IT BE PLACED AT THE END, WILL IT

BE PLACED NEXT TO US, WILL IT BY THE JUDGES? HOW?

MS. PAULIN: SO -- THERE'S A SEPARATE BILL ON THAT

THAT'S NOT BEFORE US YET.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO WE'RE GONNA BE CREATING A

BILL TO KNOW WHERE THE PLACEMENT WILL BE?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. BECAUSE I WOULD THINK THAT

ANYBODY WHO'S GOING TO BE NOMINATED AT THE END OF THIS REALLY LONG

BALLOT OBVIOUSLY IS GOING TO RECEIVE A CONSIDERABLE DROP-OFF, AS WE DO,

BECAUSE WE'RE AT THE END OF THE BALLOT.

MS. PAULIN: SO AGAIN, THE DROP-OFF WOULD BE A

GREATER PARTICIPATION THAN WE CURRENTLY SEE IN THOSE OFF-YEAR RACES.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. MIKULIN: BUT WE DON'T ACTUALLY KNOW THE

ANSWER TO THAT, OF COURSE, BECAUSE IT HASN'T HAPPENED YET.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, WE DO KNOW FROM OTHER PLACES

THAT HAVE DONE THIS THAT THE PARTICIPATION WAS GREATER IN THE EVEN YEARS

THAN THE ODD YEARS, EVEN FOR THE CANDIDATES THAT WERE AT THE BOTTOM OF

THE BALLOT.

MR. MIKULIN: AND -- AND WHAT OTHER PLACES ARE WE

REFERRING TO?

MS. PAULIN: SO THERE'S OTHER STATES AND CITIES. I

CAN NAME A COUPLE THAT I HAVE HERE IN FRONT OF ME IF I CAN FIND THEM. I

THINK IT'S IN HERE. WE HAVE PHOENIX, ARIZONA; AUSTIN, TEXAS; EL PASO;

BALTIMORE AND LOS ANGELES.

MR. MIKULIN: SO PHOENIX, ARIZONA; BALTIMORE

AND LOS ANGELES.

MS. PAULIN: THESE WERE THE CITIES THAT DID IT. YOU

KNOW, IN FACT --

MR. MIKULIN: RIGHT, AND -- AND THEY HAVEN'T

REPORTED ANY PROBLEMS?

MS. PAULIN: NO. BECAUSE REMEMBER, WE'VE HAD

PRESIDENTIAL YEARS THAT HAVE BEEN LIKE 2020, RIGHT? IF WE ARE SO LUCKY

TO HAVE THAT HAPPEN AGAIN, WE'VE ALREADY BEEN THROUGH IT, WE KNOW

WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. WHAT WE WOULD HAVE AS AN ADVANTAGE IS THAT IN THAT

SAME YEAR WHERE MANY, MANY MORE VOTERS WERE GOING TO THE POLLS,

THEY'D ALSO BE CONSIDERING THE OTHER RACES. PACK 8.

MR. MIKULIN: NOW, LET'S SAY, LET'S GO BACK TO THIS

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PERFORATED BALLOT. SO WE HAVE -- WE CAN VOTE EARLY NOW. SO IS THE

PRINTER NOW DIFFERENT TO PRINT OUT A PERFORATED BALLOT THAN --

MS. PAULIN: WE USE THE SAME MACHINES IN EARLY

VOTING SO IT'S THE SAME SYSTEM.

MR. MIKULIN: YES, BUT WHEN I GO TO THE, TO EARLY

VOTE, SOMEBODY HAS TO PRINT A BALLOT FOR ME. SO COULD THOSE PRINTERS

THAT ARE IN THE EARLY VOTING, COULD THEY PRINT OUT THE PERFORATED BALLOT?

MS. PAULIN: IF NOT, THEY CAN USE TWO BALLOTS.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO THEN WE WOULD HAVE --

MS. PAULIN: (INAUDIBLE) THEIR VOTE.

MR. MIKULIN: SO THEN WE WOULD HAVE TWO BALLOTS

THAT GO IN SIMULTANEOUSLY OR ONE AFTER THE OTHER?

MS PAULIN: ONE AT A TIME.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. NEXT QUESTION, NOW WE

SPEAK ABOUT THESE TERM LIMITS. SO NOW IN 2025, IF YOU HAVE A FOUR YEAR

TERM LIMIT IT'S GOING TO GO FOR THREE YEARS; IS THAT CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: SAY THAT ONE MORE TIME.

MR. MIKULIN: SO IN 2025 --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MIKULIN: SO IF SOMEBODY IS GETTING -- SO

SOMEBODY WAS ELECTED IN 2021, THEY ARE ELECTED TO A FOUR-YEAR TERM,

THEY WOULD RUN FOR REELECTION IN 2025.

MS PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR MIKULIN: THAT WOULD SIT BACK TO 2024 TO BE A

FOUR-YEAR TERM LIMIT; WOULD THAT BE CORRECT?

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MS. PAULIN: SO IT WOULD BE THREE YEARS, RIGHT?

MR. MIKULIN: SO, IT WOULD BE THREE YEARS --

MS. PAULIN: AND -- AND WHAT WE'VE SAID HERE IS

THAT THREE YEAR TRUNCATED DOESN'T COUNT TOWARD TERM LIMITS.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO IF --

MS. PAULIN: SO THEY WOULD GET 11 YEARS.

MR. MIKULIN: SO THEY -- SO THEY WOULD GET 11

YEARS, SO IT DOESN'T COUNT. SO IF THERE'S -- SO IF THERE'S ALREADY A TERM

LIMIT, SO LET'S SAY IF YOU'RE ALLOWED TO RUN IN A SEAT FOR FOUR YEARS, FOR

LET'S SAY THREE CONSECUTIVE TERMS, AND IT COMES OUT TO 11 YEARS, THAT

DOESN'T RESET THE CLOCK TO RUN FOR ANOTHER 12 YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. MIKULIN: NO, OKAY. SO BASICALLY THEY WOULD

BE CUT A YEAR SHORT.

MS. PAULIN: I'M SORRY?

MR. MIKULIN: SO THEY WOULD BE CUT A YEAR SHORT IF

YOU WERE TERM LIMITED OUT.

MS. PAULIN: NO. THE TRUNCATED YEAR DOESN'T COUNT.

MR. MIKULIN: SO THE TRUNCATED YEAR --

MS. PAULIN: THE TRUNCATED TERM DOESN'T COUNT.

MR. MIKULIN: THE TRUNCATED TERM DOESN'T COUNT SO

IT WOULD BE THE TERMS AND NOT THE YEARS ASSOCIATED. SO WHEN THEY USED

TO BE THREE TERMS OR FOUR YEARS, IT WOULD BE TWO TERMS AND FOUR YEARS

AND ONE THREE-YEAR TERM AND THEN THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO RUN FOR

REELECTION IF THEY WERE TERM LIMITED, IF THERE WERE TERM LIMITS.

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MS. PAULIN: RIGHT. SO IF THEY'RE ALREADY TERM

LIMITED - LIKE THIS WILL BE IN MY COUNTY - IF THEY'RE ALREADY TERM LIMITED

AND THEIR -- THEIR TERM IS OVER, THEY CAN'T RUN FOR THE TRUNCATED TERMS. IF

THE TRUNCATED TERM IS INCLUDED IN THE TERM LIMIT, THEN IT DOESN'T COUNT

TOWARD THAT TERM LIMIT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO RUN

THEN. SO IF THE TRUNCATED TERM, IF THAT WAS SET TO EXPIRE, THEN THEY CAN

RUN FOR ONE MORE FOUR-YEAR TERM.

MS. PAULIN: YES, BECAUSE ONLY THE NON-TRUNCATED

TERM WOULD COUNT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO IF SOMEBODY WAS ELECTED

FOR A THREE -- SO IF 12 YEARS USUALLY AND NOW YOU GO TO 11 YEARS BUT

THEY WOULD BE ALLOWED TO RUN FOR ONE MORE YEAR --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MIKULIN: -- MAKING THEIR TERM 15 YEARS.

MS. PAULIN: FIFTEEN, RIGHT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. SO WE ARE EXTENDING THAT.

ALL RIGHT. SO THANK YOU FOR THAT. ANOTHER QUESTION.

MS. PAULIN: AND I WAS JUST REMINDED THAT NOTHING

PREVENTS LOCALITIES FROM AMENDING THE TERM LIMITS. THEY COULD CHANGE

IT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. LET'S GO BACK TO -- NOW YOU

SAY THIS IS GOING TO END VOTER CONFUSION. SO --

MS. PAULIN: I'M SORRY I EVER USED THAT WORD, GO

AHEAD.

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MR. MIKULIN: WILL WE NOW HAVE PUBLIC FINANCING

RULES? SO ALL OF US IN STATE GOVERNMENT, WE COULD POTENTIALLY BE ABLE

TO RECEIVE PUBLIC FUNDS. NOW WOULDN'T WE SAY, GOING BACK TO THE LOCAL

ISSUES SINCE WE ARE GOING TO OBVIOUSLY BE RECEIVING MONEY FROM THE

STATE, IT WOULD BE EASIER FOR US TO RAISE MONEY THEN OF COURSE OUR LOCAL

COUNTERPARTS. WOULDN'T THAT DROWN THE LOCAL ISSUES OUT, BECAUSE IF LET'S

SAY A STATE CANDIDATE IS MAILING ALL THIS MAIL OR DOING ALL THE

COMMERCIALS, RADIO SHOWS, WOULDN'T IT BE MORE LIKELY THAT THE LOCAL

ISSUES THAT MIGHT BE IMPORTANT AND COMPLETELY DIFFERENT WHEN THEY'RE

DEALING WITH A VERY LOCAL ISSUE, WHETHER IT'S YOUR GARBAGE, YOUR

RECYCLING, YOUR ROADS, COULDN'T THAT BE JUST OVERSHADOWED BY WHAT WAS

GOING ON BECAUSE OF THE COMPETITION TO -- TO GET THE ATTENTION?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE

PROBABLY ALL UNIQUE IN THIS ROOM. WHEN WE GET MAIL, ELECTION MAIL, WE

READ IT. WE LIKE TO READ IT, WE KEEP IT, WE ACCUMULATE IT, WE SAVE IT AS

EXAMPLES. MOST PEOPLE DON'T DO THAT. SO I WOULD SAY THAT IN FACT IF

THEY GOT A LOT OF MAIL, THEY'RE PROBABLY GOING TO DO THIS

(DEMONSTRATING) INTO RECYCLING. AND THEN THOSE LOCAL ISSUES THAT ARE IN

THE LOCAL PAPERS, THAT ARE BEING TALKED ABOUT BY LOCAL CANDIDATES THAT

WHERE CANDIDATES ARE KNOCKING ON THEIR DOORS, THEY'RE GOING TO GET A

LOT MORE ATTENTION BECAUSE OF THE OVERLOAD.

MR. MIKULIN: WELL, I WOULD ALSO SAY THOUGH IN

RESPONSE TO THAT, WOULDN'T STATE CANDIDATES BEING MORE ABLE TO BUY ADS

THAN IN NEWSPAPERS TO ALSO DROWN UP THOSE NEWSPAPERS WHETHER OR NOT,

YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE A -- A LOCAL ISSUE THAT'S PUT OUT BY ONE NEWSPAPER

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WRITER.

MS. PAULIN: I THINK YOU'RE SUGGESTING THAT EVERY

SINGLE RACE ON THE BALLOT IS GOING TO BE A CONTESTED HOT RACE. WE JUST

KNOW FROM EXPERIENCE THAT THAT'S NOT TRUE. SOME ARE GOING TO BE HOT

RACES, SOME ARE GOING TO BE UNCONTESTED RACES. SO YOU'RE GOING TO

HAVE A COMPOSITIVE DIFFERENT KINDS OF RACES THAT VOTERS ARE GOING TO BE

PAYING ATTENTION TO. AND SO IF YOU HAPPEN TO BE IN AN AREA WHERE YOU

HAVE A COUPLE OF THOSE, I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE VOTERS ARE GOING TO BE

PAYING ATTENTION TO AND IT'S GOING TO DRIVE THEM TO MAYBE MAKE

DECISIONS IN THE OTHER RACES AS WELL. BUT I DON'T THINK WE'VE EVER SEEN

AN EXAMPLE WHERE ALL THE RACES ON THE BALLOT ARE HOTLY CONTESTED SO THAT

THE VOTER'S SO MIXED UP LET'S SAY, SO I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, I TRUST THE

VOTERS, I BELIEVE THE VOTERS ARE ALL SMART, THEY WANT TO PARTICIPATE. THIS

IS GOING TO BE -- THIS IS GOING TO ENABLE THEM TO DO IT MORE EFFICIENTLY

AND THEY'RE GOING TO KNOW WHEN THE ELECTIONS ARE AND BECAUSE I HAVE

THAT FAITH AND CONFIDENCE IN THE VOTERS, I THINK THEY ARE WELL ABLE TO

DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THE RACES AMONG THE CANDIDATES AND WE'RE GOING

TO HAVE A MORE EDUCATED ELECTORATE AND ONE THAT'S GOING TO PARTICIPATE

TO A MUCH GREATER DEGREE.

MR. MIKULIN: BUT THERE ARE CERTAIN OFFICES THAT ARE

GOING TO BE EXEMPTED FROM THIS. SO LET'S SAY --

MS. PAULIN: THAT'S RIGHT. THAT'S WHERE (INAUDIBLE).

MR. MIKULIN: -- WE HAVE THE COUNTY CLERK AND THE

DAS OFFICE. SO RIGHT NOW AS IT STANDS HERE WITHOUT PASSING A

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT AND WITHOUT THAT GOING TO THE VOTERS THAT WE

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DON'T EVEN KNOW IF IT WILL PASS, WOULDN'T THE OPPOSITE TAKE PLACE FOR THE

COUNTY CLERK AND THE DISTRICT ATTORNEYS THAT ARE UP IN ODD YEARS SUCH

THAT THEIR VOTER TURNOUT AND THOSE ELECTIONS WILL BE DRIVEN SO LOW

BECAUSE ALL OF THE RACES WILL BE DONE ON THE EVEN YEAR THAT

PARTICIPATION IN THOSE ODD YEARS NOW FOR THOSE RACES WOULD BE

EXTREMELY LOW AND THAT WOULDN'T DRIVE ANYBODY OUT TO VOTE FOR THEM SO

WHY ARE WE VIEWING THEM THEN AS --

MS. PAULIN: IT'S A VERY SHORT TIME FRAME BETWEEN

INCLUDING THEM. REMEMBER THIS DOESN'T START UNTIL 2026.

MR. MIKULIN: THIS -- THIS DOESN'T START UNTIL 2026

SO WE HAVE TO ANTICIPATE NOW THAT WE PASSED A CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT BEFORE 2026 AND IT GETS APPROVED BY THE VOTERS. IF THAT

DIDN'T OCCUR, THEN THIS WOULD BE --

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I THINK IF WE ALL COLLECTIVELY,

BOTH PARTIES, ALL THE PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM ARE ADVOCATING FOR THE CHANGE,

I THINK THAT WE WOULD HAVE A GOOD SHOT AT IT.

MR. MIKULIN: WOULDN'T IT BE MORE ADVANTAGEOUS

TO HAVE PUT THIS UP ONE AFTER THE OTHER SO ALL CITIES AND EVERYBODY IN

NEW YORK STATE BE EQUAL?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, THEN THEY WILL BE EQUAL OVER

TIME.

MR. MIKULIN: OVER TIME, BUT RIGHT NOW WE HAVE

EVERYBODY IN THE CITY AND PEOPLE THAT ARE, OF COURSE, RUNNING FOR

WHETHER IT'S COUNTY CLERK OR DISTRICT ATTORNEY THAT ARE NOT GOING TO BE

EQUAL. AND AS WE KNOW, VOTER PARTICIPATION RATE IN THE CITY, LET'S SAY,

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IS MUCH LOWER THAN RIGHT NOW HERE IN MY COUNTY WHICH IS NASSAU

COUNTY. SO THE VOTER PARTICIPATION RATE WILL NOT INCREASE AND IF THIS

DOESN'T HAPPEN THEN THERE IS GOING TO BE A GREAT INEQUALITY IN --

MS. PAULIN: SO LET'S FIGURE IT OUT, RIGHT. SO, IT'S

2023 NOW. IN 2024 AND 2025 WE DO THE -- WE PASS THE AMENDMENT. IF

WE WANT TO WAIT FOR MORE VOTER PARTICIPATION WE WAIT TO PUT IT ON THE

BALLOT UNTIL 2026. IF WE DON'T, WE CAN DO IT IN THE ODD YEARS SINCE IT'S A

LOT OF THE ODD ELECTIONS THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERING IT. WE CAN MAKE

THAT DECISION COLLECTIVELY LATER. BUT SO, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT MAKING THE

CHANGE AROUND THE SAME TIME THAT THIS WOULD TAKE EFFECT.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY. AND GOING BACK TO THE

BOARDS OF ELECTIONS. HAVE WE DONE ANY ANALYSIS INTO THE BURDEN TO THE

BOARDS OF ELECTIONS TO MOVE ALL THE ELECTIONS INTO EVEN YEARS EXCEPT

FOR ODD YEARS?

MS. PAULIN: HAVE WE DONE WHAT?

MR. MIKULIN: HAVE WE DONE AN ANALYSIS ON THIS?

MS. PAULIN: AN ANALYSIS ON WHAT?

MR. MIKULIN: AN ANALYSIS ON WHAT THE BURDEN'S

GOING TO BE NOW THAT THE LAW IS GOING TO CHANGE --

MS. PAULIN: I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE STATE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS WAS VERY COOPERATIVE IN TRYING TO GET US THE INFORMATION AND

DIDN'T RAISE ANY ALERTS.

MR. MIKULIN: BUT WE HAVE HEARD THAT LOCAL BOARDS

OF ELECTIONS AND OTHER PEOPLE HAVE RAISED ALERTS TO THIS. SO HAVE WE

TAKEN ANY --

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MS. PAULIN: NONE OF THAT HAVE COMMUNICATED TO

ME.

MR. MIKULIN: WELL -- AND BUT WE HAVEN'T HAD ANY

HEARINGS ABOUT THIS, IS THAT CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: WE DON'T HAVE HEARINGS ON MOST OF

THE STUFF WE DO.

MR. MIKULIN: WELL, I -- I WOULD THINK, THOUGH,

THAT IF WE WERE GOING TO PUT THIS ON OUT, WE SHOULD TAKE HEARINGS INTO

CONSIDERATION --

MS. PAULIN: WHY HEARINGS ON THIS AND NOT ON MY

LAST OTHER 15 BILLS?

MR. MIKULIN: WELL, THIS OBVIOUSLY HAS A GREAT

EFFECT ON THE LOCALITIES AND HAS A GREAT EFFECT ON THE LOCAL TERMS AND THE

BOARD OF ELECTIONS. I HIGHLY THINK THAT WE WOULD HAVE WANTED TO BRING

IN THEIR INPUT AND AT LEAST ASK THEM FOR A CONSIDERATION ON THIS. I MEAN

WE'VE HAD -- THIS HAS BEEN IN THE WORKS FOR THREE YEARS AND YOU'RE

SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO FIX THE CITIES. HAS THERE BEEN ANY WORK ON

DOING THAT WITHIN THE SAME TIME PERIOD?

MS. PAULIN: WE'VE LEARNED SO MUCH BY DOING THIS

BILL THAT DOING A RESOLUTION FOR THE CITIES WILL BE VERY MUCH EASIER.

MR. MIKULIN: AND WE ANTICIPATE DOING THAT

SHORTLY.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I DON'T REPRESENT, YOU KNOW, I

REPRESENT TWO SMALL CITIES. I DON'T REPRESENT THE CITY, SO I DON'T KNOW IF

I WOULD BE THE APPROPRIATE SPONSOR FOR THAT BILL, BUT I CERTAINLY AM

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MOTIVATED TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE ELECTIONS HAPPEN IN THE EVEN YEARS.

MR. MIKULIN: WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS YOU ARE NOT

GOING TO BE BRINGING THAT BILL TO CONSIDERATION.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T -- I DON'T KNOW YET. I DON'T,

YOU KNOW, I -- I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, WE WILL FIGURE OUT THAT, BUT I

CERTAINLY WILL BE HELPING SOMEONE IF THEY'RE MORE INTERESTED AND

THEY'RE FROM THE CITY. WE SEE THE CITY OF NEW YORK INTERESTED IN

DOING THAT. I'M INTERESTED IN DOING THAT, REPRESENTING TWO SMALL CITIES

AND, YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY IF WE'RE DOING ONE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT

WE WOULD WANT TO INCLUDE THE CLERK, SHERIFF, TOWN JUSTICES AND DAS.

MR. MIKULIN: JUST ONE MORE QUESTION. I JUST WANT

TO GO BACK TO THE -- TO THE MACHINES FOR ONE SECOND NOW. I MEAN THE

BINS ARE GOING TO BE CHANGING SIZE, SO IF WE PUT --

MS. PAULIN: WHAT?

MR. MIKULIN: THE BINS. SO WHEN I PUT THE BALLOT

WITHIN THE MACHINE AND IT COMES ON OUT IN THE BIN, OF COURSE THE BINS

ARE GOING TO BE CHANGING SIZE SO WE'RE GOING TO BE PUTTING EITHER MORE

PAPER IN THAT BIN OR WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A DIFFERENT SIZE BALLOT. HAS

THERE EVER BEEN THOUGHT PROCESS ON THAT? COULD THAT CAUSE MORE PAPER

JAMS, CREATING LONGER LINES AT THE --

MS. PAULIN: SO, HMM. I'M JUST TRYING TO PICTURE

THE BIN. I THINK THAT WHAT LIKELY HAPPENS IS, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU HAVE

A BIG TURNOUT, RIGHT, THE BIN PROBABLY GETS FULL AND THEY TAKE THAT PAPER

AND THEY PUT IT SOMEWHERE. SO THAT WOULD HAPPEN HERE MAYBE MORE

QUICKLY, BUT THERE -- YOU KNOW, BUT BY AGAIN, CHANGING THE SIZE OF THE

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BALLOT, THEN -- THEN WE WOULD HAVE PROBLEMS. SO I DON'T THINK WE

ANTICIPATE DOING THAT BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE A TREMENDOUS EXPENSE TO

THE COUNTIES AND FOR THE TAXPAYERS.

MR. MIKULIN: OKAY, THANK YOU.

ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER OTIS: ON THE BILL.

MR. MIKULIN: I THINK IT'S VERY APPARENT WHY WE'RE

DOING THIS. THIS OBVIOUSLY HAS A VERY POLITICAL TONE TO IT. BUT I'M

GOING TO GET BACK TO ONE THING THAT MY COLLEAGUES HAVE BEEN SAYING

OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN. LOCAL ELECTIONS MATTER, LOCAL CONTROL

MATTERS, LOCAL ISSUES MATTER. AND WHAT WE DO KNOW IS THAT WHEN THE

RACE FOR THE PRESIDENT COMES UP, OR THE RACE FOR THE GOVERNOR COMES

UP, PEOPLE ARE OF COURSE ATTRACTED TO THOSE RACES. THOSE RACES THAT ARE

ON TOP OF THE TICKET. THOSE RACES THAT THEY SEE ON THE LOCAL NEWS. NOT

NECESSARILY THOSE LOCAL RACES THAT WE SEE HERE TODAY. I HONESTLY BELIEVE

THAT IT IS BEST TO KEEP LOCAL RACES APART FROM THESE FEDERAL AND STATE

RACES BECAUSE OF LOCAL ISSUES, BECAUSE OF WHAT IT IS THAT THEY'RE TRYING

TO COMMUNICATE. ALSO, WE HAVEN'T HAD MUCH STUDIES DONE ON THIS

MATTER. WE DON'T REALLY KNOW THE FULL EFFECT TO THE MACHINES. THEY

SAY IT'S GOING TO BE OKAY, WE DON'T NECESSARILY KNOW IF THAT'S TRUE OR

NOT. I HONESTLY THINK THAT SOME RESEARCH SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE WITH

THIS BEFORE PROPOSING THIS BILL HERE TODAY. SO ON THAT, I'M GOING TO VOTE

IN THE NEGATIVE. AND I ENCOURAGE ALL MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME.

THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER OTIS: MR. PIROZZOLO.

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MR. PIROZZOLO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD

THE SPONSOR YIELD FOR A FEW QUESTIONS, PLEASE?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER OTIS: WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MR. PIROZZOLO: GOOD MORNING, MS. PAULIN.

HOW ARE YOU?

MS. PAULIN: I WISH.

MR. PIROZZOLO: CERTAINLY FEELS LIKE IT, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. PIROZZOLO: I KNOW THAT MANY OF MY

COLLEAGUES HAVE ASKED MANY OF THE QUESTIONS THAT I'M GOING TO ASK YOU,

BUT I'M GOING TO RE-ASK THEM FOR SOME REASONS. ONE, BECAUSE I JUST

THOUGHT SOME OF YOUR ANSWERS WERE PLATITUDES AND OTHER TIMES I

THOUGHT THEY WERE SORELY INSUFFICIENT TO THE IMPORTANCE OF THIS BILL. SO

THE QUESTION -- AND ACTUALLY I" VE GOTTEN SO MANY REQUESTS FROM

CONSTITUENTS TO SAY THAT THIS BILL IS PRETTY MUCH ABOUT SOONER OR LATER

MAKING EVERY ELECTION HAPPEN ON AN EVEN YEAR, NO MATTER IF IT'S A

COUNTY, YOU KNOW, A STATE ELECTION, A CITY ELECTION, A LOCAL ELECTION.

AND SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES HAVE FRAMED IT AS A POWER GRAB AND I

WOULD PROBABLY HAVE TO AGREE. MY STATEMENT ACTUALLY WOULD BE THAT

GERRYMANDERING DIDN'T WORK SO NOW WE FIND OURSELVES HERE. BUT I'M

GOING TO ASK YOU, WHY AGAIN ARE WE DOING THIS? WHAT ARE THE

IMPORTANT REASONS TO YOU?

MS. PAULIN: TO INCREASE VOTER PARTICIPATION AND

ULTIMATELY SAVE TAXPAYER MONEY.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY, THAT'S WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN

DOWN IN MY NOTES, THAT'S GOOD. YOU'VE SAID YOU DON'T KNOW THE COST-

SAVINGS, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: THEY'RE HARD TO ESTIMATE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: NO ANTICIPATION AT ALL IN THE

COST-SAVINGS. CAN YOU TELL ME HOW MUCH AN ELECTION IN A PRESIDENTIAL

YEAR HAPPENS TO COST ANYWAY?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I ABSOLUTELY CAN'T.

MR. PIROZZOLO: WELL, IF COSTS ARE SO IMPORTANT

WHY DON'T WE KNOW THAT?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I DON'T KNOW THAT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: CAN YOU TELL ME HOW MUCH AN

ELECTION IN AN OFFSITE YEAR COSTS?

MS. PAULIN: DO YOU MEAN -- DO YOU MEAN ALSO FOR

THE WHOLE STATE OR ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT FOR A SPECIFIC SIZE COUNTY?

MR. PIROZZOLO: WHICHEVER ONE YOU HAVE THE

ANSWER TO.

MS. PAULIN: GOT IT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: DO YOU HAVE AN ANSWER TO ANY OF

THOSE THAT YOU JUST BROUGHT UP?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY, BECAUSE YOU BROUGHT IT UP,

I'M SORRY.

MS PAULIN: YEAH (INAUDIBLE).

MR. PIROZZOLO: ALL RIGHT. THAT'S OKAY.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: IF I CAN FIND IT I'LL GET IT TO YOU AT SOME

POINT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: NO, I DON'T REALLY NEED IT. I'M

JUST REALLY HERE TO POINT OUT THE FACT THAT YOU DON'T KNOW THAT, BUT YET

WE HAVE THIS BILL AS A COST-SAVING MEASURE AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT

WE'RE SPENDING SO WE REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE SAVING AND MAYBE

WE'LL GET TO THAT LATER.

CAN YOU TELL ME HOW MUCH AN ELECTION COSTS ON AN

ODD CYCLE YEAR?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO YOU DON'T KNOW THAT EITHER?

MS PAULIN: NO.

MR. PIROZZOLO: BUT WE'RE DEFINITELY GOING TO BE

SAVING MONEY YOU'RE SURE OF THAT?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I'M ONLY SURE THAT WE -- WHEN

WE ELIMINATE SOME ELECTIONS DURING ODD YEARS, ULTIMATELY, WE WON'T

HAVE A COST.

MR. PIROZZOLO: THAT'S YOUR OPINION. IT'S NOT A

FACT, THAT'S YOUR OPINION.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I CAN TELL YOU WE WON'T HAVE TO

HAVE POLL WORKERS, WE WON'T HAVE TO PRINT BALLOTS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. I GOT IT SO.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO, THE NEXT THING WAS

PARTICIPATION. BEFORE I GET THERE, HOW IMPORTANT IS COST TO YOU LIKE ON

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A SCALE OF 1 TO 10, HOW IMPORTANT IS SAVING MONEY TO YOU?

MS. PAULIN: I LOVE SAVING MONEY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO WOULD YOU SAY A TEN? I DON'T

WANT TO SAY IT FOR YOU, I WANT YOU TO SAY IT.

MS. PAULIN: I WOULD SAY SAVING MONEY IS A GOOD

THING.

MR. PIROZZOLO: IS IT A TEN?

MS PAULIN: ON A SCALE OF 1 TO 10?

MR. PIROZZOLO: YES.

MS PAULIN: WHAT AM I SAVING MONEY ON?

MR. PIROZZOLO: ON ELECTIONS, IT'S YOUR BILL.

MS. PAULIN: I SEE. SO SAVING MONEY GENERALLY I

WOULD SAY IS A GOOD THING, WHICH IS WHY I'M PUTTING FORWARD THIS BILL

BECAUSE I BELIEVE ULTIMATELY IT WILL.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO IT'S A 10.

MS. PAULIN: IT'S A 10.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY, GREAT. HOW ABOUT

PARTICIPATION? YOU REALLY WANT TO INCREASE PARTICIPATION. HOW

IMPORTANT IS INCREASING PARTICIPATION?

MS. PAULIN: IT'S A 10+.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. SO THEN WHY DON'T WE JUST

MAKE ELECTION DAY A HOLIDAY AND LET EVERYBODY ELSE VOTE AND NOT HAVE

TO GO THROUGH ANY OF THIS?

MS. PAULIN: WHY DON'T WE MAKE ELECTION DAY A

HOLIDAY?

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MR. PIROZZOLO: YES. WHY --

MS. PAULIN: (INAUDIBLE) ALL ELECTIONS, SCHOOL, FIRE

DISTRICT, YOU KNOW, UNLESS YOU CONDENSE THEM, YOU KNOW, YOU'D HAVE A

LOT OF HOLIDAYS. TALK ABOUT THE TWO HOLIDAYS THAT, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS

ENTIRE BODY IS GOING TO REPRESENT OR VOTE FOR BECAUSE THEY'RE WORRIED

ABOUT THE 180 DAYS. SO IF YOU HAD FIRE DISTRICT ELECTION, TOWN ELECTION,

VILLAGE ELECTION, SCHOOL ELECTION, COUNTY ELECTION, STATE ELECTION,

PRESIDENTIAL, YOU'D HAVE A LOT OF HOLIDAYS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO THEN PARTICIPATION SUDDENLY IS

NOT SO IMPORTANT.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE CAN GET

OUR KIDS OUT OF SCHOOL THAT MANY TIMES.

MR. PIROZZOLO: WELL, WE HAVE VIRTUAL LEARNING.

OF COURSE WE CAN, BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT WE'RE GOING TO USE IT FOR AN

EXCUSE FOR SOMETHING ELSE, RIGHT? SO DON'T YOU THINK THAT THE

PARTICIPATION OF THE ELECTORATE IS THAT IMPORTANT THAT WE CAN NOW SAY

WE'RE GOING TO CLOSE THE SCHOOLS OR GIVE EVERYBODY THE DAY OFF, A

HOLIDAY SO THEY CAN FULFILL THEIR CONSTITUTIONAL OBLIGATION TO GO AND

VOTE? ISN'T THAT THE PURPOSE OF --

MS. PAULIN: MOST SCHOOLS ARE CLOSED DURING EVEN

YEARS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: I'M SORRY?

MS. PAULIN: MOST SCHOOLS ARE CLOSED ON EVEN

YEARS. SO WE ARE ALREADY DOING THE HOLIDAY, BUT WE HAVE TO GET THE

ELECTIONS TO WHEN THE HOLIDAY IS.

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MR. PIROZZOLO: WHEN YOU SAY "MOST" THAT MEANS

SOME AREN'T.

MS. PAULIN: SOME AREN'T.

MR. PIROZZOLO: WHY DON'T WE MAKE IT ALL AND

JUST LET EVERYBODY --

MS. PAULIN: I THINK WHEN ALL THE ELECTIONS ARE IN

ONE DAY, YEAH, THEN WE CAN DO A HOLIDAY. I THINK THAT'S GREAT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. SO I LOOK FORWARD TO

SEEING THAT FROM YOU. SO NOW, ARE WE PURCHASING MORE MACHINES OR

ARE WE GOING WITH WHAT WE GOT?

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO. WE JUST

WENT THROUGH ONE OF THE HIGHEST VOTER TURNOUT THAT WE'VE EVER SEEN AND

WE HAD ENOUGH. SO I DON'T THINK THAT WE HAVE TO, CERTAINLY NOT FOR

2026 WHEN IT'S A GUBERNATORIAL YEAR AND WE KNOW THE TURNOUT'S GOING

TO BE LESS, SO WE CERTAINLY DON'T NEED MORE MACHINES.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO WHAT IS THE ESTIMATED INCREASE

IN VOTER PARTICIPATION THAT YOU THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE FROM THIS?

MS. PAULIN: I CAN ONLY TELL YOU WHAT'S -- WHAT'S

BEEN DIFFERENT IN OTHER PLACES. AND WE'VE SEEN DOUBLING AND

REMEMBER, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE LOCAL ELECTIONS TO -- TO INCLUDING

THEM IN AN EVEN YEAR, RIGHT? SO WE'RE DOUBLING THAT, BUT NOT

NECESSARILY VOTING THE NUMBER -- DOUBLING THE AMOUNT OF VOTERS THAT

ARE GOING TO THE POLLS IN THAT GIVEN YEAR.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. SO I'LL TAKE THAT AS I'M NOT

REALLY SURE, BUT SOME PLACES IT'S DOUBLE BUT WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING

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TO HAPPEN HERE.

MS. PAULIN: HOW COULD WE KNOW? WE JUST KNOW?

WE DON'T ANTICIPATE, YOU KNOW, THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE MORE VOTERS IN

A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR THAT'S BEEN UNPRECEDENTED.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO YOU DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY IDEA

OF THE --

MS. PAULIN: NO, I JUST TOLD YOU. WE DON'T KNOW

THAT -- WE DON'T BELIEVE, HOW COULD WE, THAT WE'RE GOING TO SEE A HIGHER

NUMBER OF VOTERS IN A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR THAN WE SAW IN 2020. WHAT

WE'RE GOING TO SEE IS MORE -- MORE VOTING FOR THOSE RACES THAT ARE BEING

INCLUDED IN THAT YEAR.

MR. PIROZZOLO: GOTCHA. ARE WE HIRING MORE POLL

WORKERS?

MS. PAULIN: WHY WOULD WE HAVE TO IF WE'RE NOT

GOING TO SEE MORE VOTERS?

MR. PIROZZOLO: I'M -- I'M GETTING THERE, I'M

GETTING THERE. ARE WE PRINTING MORE PAPER BALLOTS?

MS. PAULIN: WHY WOULD WE HAVE TO IF WE CAN PUT

THEM ALL ON THE ONE BALLOT?

MR. PIROZZOLO: WELL, IF THE -- NO, NO. I MEAN IF

THE ANTICIPATION OF AN INCREASED VOTER TURNOUT IS THERE, WON'T WE NEED

MORE BALLOTS TO HAND OUT?

MS. PAULIN: NO, BECAUSE THEY'RE ALREADY VOTING FOR

PRESIDENT AND FOR GOVERNOR IN THOSE YEARS. WE'RE PUTTING THE LOCAL ON

THE SAME BALLOT.

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MR. PIROZZOLO: THAT'S NOT WHAT I'M SAYING, I'LL

JUST BREAK DOWN IN SMALLER NUMBERS. IF WHERE USUALLY 100 PEOPLE VOTE

ON A GIVEN PRESIDENTIAL YEAR, NOW WE'RE BRINGING EVERYTHING TOGETHER

TO BRING OUT -- INCREASE THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE THAT COME, WON'T WE NEED

150 BALLOTS?

MS. PAULIN: NO, WE'RE -- WE'RE NOT DOING THAT.

WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE VOTING IN THE PRESIDENTIAL

YEAR, THAT SAME 100, ARE NOW GOING BE VOTING FOR LOCAL. SO THAT WE'RE

NOT INCREASING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT GO TO THE POLLS. WE'RE

INCREASING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT VOTE FOR THE LOCAL ELECTIONS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO THEN WE'RE NOT INCREASING THE

PARTICIPATION.

MS. PAULIN: WE ARE GREATLY FOR THE LOCAL ELECTIONS

WHEN THERE'S 10 PEOPLE THAT VOTE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: CAN YOU DEFINE WHAT LOW TURNOUT

IS?

MS. PAULIN: I MEAN I THINK IT'S VARIABLE IN A CERTAIN

AREA, RIGHT? SO, YOU KNOW, IN MY AREA I HAVE A VERY HIGH TURNOUT, SO

YOU KNOW, HIGHER OBVIOUSLY IN A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR, A GUBERNATORIAL YEAR

THAN IN A COUNTY YEAR, BUT A VERY HIGH TURNOUT. OTHER DISTRICTS, NOT SO

HIGH. SO I THINK THAT IT'S ALL RELATIVE. AND IF -- SO WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO

DO IS GET EVERYONE TO VOTE IN THE HIGHEST TURNOUT THAT YOU COULD

POSSIBLY GET IN THE DISTRICT RELATIVE TO WHAT THEY DO NOW.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. SO WE DON'T REALLY KNOW

WHAT LOW TURNOUT IS, THAT JUST MIGHT BE THE TURNOUT FOR THAT ELECTION AND

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AGAIN YOUR (INAUDIBLE) --

MS. PAULIN: NO, I'M NOT SAYING THAT. I'M SAYING

THAT WE SEE THE HIGHEST TURNOUT IN AN AREA IN A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR. THAT'S

WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO MAXIMIZE FOR THE LOCAL RACES.

MR. PIROZZOLO: I HEARD SOME COMMENTS AND I

JUST WANT CLARITY ON THIS ABOUT ABSENTEE BALLOTS. ARE THERE GOING TO BE

ANY CHANGES TO ABSENTEE BALLOTS OR ABSENTEE BALLOT LAWS THAT COME

ALONG WITH THIS --

MS. PAULIN: NO, BECAUSE UNFORTUNATELY WE

DEFEATED THAT, RIGHT? I MEAN WE -- THERE WAS -- I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW

WHAT YOUR POSITION WAS. I CERTAINLY WAS IN FAVOR OF, YOU KNOW,

ABSENTEE BALLOTS THAT WOULD GO OUT WITHOUT AN EXCUSE, BUT THAT WAS NOT

THE CONSENSUS OF THE -- PROBABLY OF EVERYONE IN THIS ROOM. ANYONE,

FRANKLY, WHO DIDN'T ADVOCATE FOR THAT IS CAUSING A COMPLICATION FOR

MANY PEOPLE. BUT I WOULD SAY THAT HOPEFULLY OVER TIME THAT WILL COME

BACK AND WE WILL SEE NO EXCUSE ABSENTEE BALLOTS AND THE PROBLEMS THAT

YOU'RE SUGGESTING WILL ALL BE STOPPED.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. AND WE GAVE COST A 10 IN

THE SCALE BEFORE. SO WHY ARE WE GOING TO CUT A YEAR FROM SOMEONE'S

ELECTION CYCLE INSTEAD OF JUST ADDING A YEAR AND ELIMINATING AN ENTIRE

ELECTION?

MS. PAULIN: BUT WE WOULDN'T BE. THERE STILL

WOULD NEED TO BE AN ELECTED PERSON AS COUNTY EXECUTIVE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: WELL, YOU WANT TO GO FROM A

TWO-YEAR CYCLE TO A ONE-YEAR CYCLE, RIGHT? WHY NOT JUST GIVE THAT

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PERSON A THIRD YEAR, ELIMINATE THAT ONE-YEAR ELECTION AND THEN JUST

MOVE ON FROM THERE?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THERE WAS A REASON WE COULDN'T

DO THAT. YOU KNOW, AND THEN FIVE YEARS YOU'RE SAYING, GIVE THEM THREE

AND FIVE?

MR. PIROZZOLO: NO, NO, VERY SIMPLE. YOU'RE

SAYING TO REDUCE A TERM BY ONE YEAR.

MS PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: THEN HOLD AN ELECTION A YEAR

LATER FOR THAT SAME TERM.

MS. PAULIN: WE WOULD STILL HAVE AN ELECTION THAT

YEAR.

MR. PIROZZOLO: BUT YOU'D BE REDUCING THAT

ONE-YEAR CYCLE, WOULDN'T YOU?

MS. PAULIN: I UNDERSTAND BUT WE'D STILL BE HAVING

AN ELECTION THAT YEAR SO THERE'S NO SAVINGS DIFFERENCE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO THEN IF WE'RE ADDING A THIRD

YEAR --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR PIROZZOLO: -- WE'RE NOT HAVING A ONE-YEAR

ELECTION. THAT THIRD YEAR, THAT ELECTION WOULD NOW BE GOING TO THE NEXT

TWO YEARS --

MS. PAULIN: YOU CHANGE EVERYONE'S TERMS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: YOU'RE CHANGING EVERYONE'S

TERMS NOW.

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MS. PAULIN: SO I MEAN, IT'S A THOUGHT. YOU KNOW,

I DON'T KNOW THAT IT CHANGES THE COST BECAUSE YOU STILL HAVE TO HAVE AN

ELECTION AND THAT'S WHAT GOING TO DRIVE, YOU KNOW, THE -- THE -- THE COST

BECAUSE YOU'RE STILL GOING TO NEED THE POLL WORKERS AND ALL THAT STUFF.

BUT, YOU KNOW, I MEAN MAYBE YOU COULD TELL ME WHY YOU THINK IT

WOULD BE COST SAVINGS. DO YOU THINK IT WOULD ELIMINATE SOME

ELECTIONS?

MR. PIROZZOLO: I -- I THINK THAT INSTEAD OF

REDUCING SOMEONE'S TERM AND THEN THROWING IN AN EXTRA ELECTION JUST

INCREASING SOMEONE'S TERM AND NOT HAVING THAT ELECTION WOULD SAVE

MONEY.

MS. PAULIN: WHY? I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: BECAUSE WE'RE ELIMINATING THE

ENTIRE ELECTION YEAR.

MS. PAULIN: BUT WE WOULD STILL HAVE ELECTIONS THAT

YEAR.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. I THINK REALLY WHAT WE'RE

DOING IS REALLY GOING TO PISS OFF A LOT OF OUR VOTERS BECAUSE OF JUST ALL

THIS INCREASE THAT WE HAVE GOING ON. THE INCREASE IN THE COMMERCIALS.

I WAS IN THE PRIMARY ONE TIME AND SOMEONE CALLED, IT WAS PRIMARY

DAY, ELECTION DAY, AND I HAPPENED TO KNOW THE PERSON THAT WAS

SCREAMING ON THE OTHER END OF THE PHONE, IT WAS A PERSONAL FRIEND OF

MINE, WAS GIVING ONE OF MY VOLUNTEERS HELL BECAUSE THIS IS LIKE THE

18TH CALL I'VE GOTTEN TODAY, NOT NECESSARILY FOR YOU, AND IF I GET ANOTHER

CALL I'M NOT VOTING FOR ANYBODY. BUT THAT BRINGS ME INTO CAMPAIGN

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FINANCE. WITH SO MANY PEOPLE RUNNING AT THE SAME TIME AND SO MANY

VOTERS POTENTIALLY BEING UPSET, IS THAT THE REASON FOR CAMPAIGN FINANCE?

BECAUSE I CAN'T IMAGINE THAT PEOPLE'S POCKETS WOULD BE SO DEEP THAT

THEY CAN START CONTRIBUTING TO EVERYBODY. SO IS CAMPAIGN FINANCE AN

ANTICIPATION OF THIS BECAUSE IT WORKS PERFECT.

MS. PAULIN: NO. I DON'T THINK WE WERE THINKING OF

IT BEING RELATED.

MR. PIROZZOLO: ALL RIGHT. WELL, I MEAN MAYBE

IT'S A GOOD THING THAT IT'S THERE, BUT BASICALLY --

IF I MAY ON THE BILL, PLEASE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: YOU CERTAINLY MAY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: ALL RIGHT. SO, YOU KNOW, AS I

SAID BEFORE, I'M GOING TO AGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUES, MAYBE I'LL PUT IT IN

MORE SIMPLE TERMS. I THINK THAT THIS BILL IS TO REPLACE THE FAILED

GERRYMANDERING THAT HAPPENED. WE ARE GOING TO HAVE SOME PROBLEMS

AND I WOULD REALLY, REALLY LIKE TO KNOW THAT IF THIS BILL PASSES, IF THE

GOVERNOR IS GOING TO WITHDRAW HER LAWSUIT AS FAR AS CONTINUING THE

CASE OF GERRYMANDERING ALLOWING THAT TO GO FORWARD IN THE FUTURE.

I WOULD NORMALLY ASK MY COLLEAGUES AT THIS POINT TO

PLEASE CONSIDER NOT VOTING FOR THIS LEGISLATION, AT LEAST MY COLLEAGUES

ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE AISLE, BUT AS YOU CAN SEE THEY'RE NOT HERE AND IF

THEY ARE HERE, THEY'RE CERTAINLY NOT LISTENING TO WHAT I HAVE TO SAY. SO

I'M NOT GOING TO ASK FOR THAT BECAUSE I THINK THE CAKE IS ALREADY BAKED

AND WE KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN HERE. SO I WILL BE VOTING NO ON

THIS FOR A LOT OF VERY GOOD REASONS AND I THANK MY COLLEAGUES ON MY

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SIDE OF THE AISLE FOR THEIR SUPPORT AND FOR THEIR VOTES OF NO, ALSO. THANK

YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. MAHER.

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD FOR SOME QUESTIONS?

MS PAULIN: YES.

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU. WHERE TO START, OKAY.

THE FIRST QUESTION THAT I HAVE FOR YOU IS ALL OF THE EXEMPTIONS THAT

CURRENTLY TAKE PLACE FOR THE COUNTY OFFICES AND SOME OF THE OTHER

LOCALS, ARE THEY ALL SPECIFICALLY CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES?

MS. PAULIN: EXCEPT FOR GREEN ISLAND.

MR. MAHER: EXCEPT FOR, I'M SORRY?

MS. PAULIN: GREEN ISLAND. THAT WAS THE

COTERMINOUS TOWN VILLAGE THAT ACTUALLY ELECTS TOWN ELECTEDS AND VILLAGE

ELECTEDS TO KEEP IT ALL -- TO MAINTAIN THE SAME GOAL THAT WE'RE DOING FOR

EVEN YEAR, TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY VOTE IN THE SAME YEAR.

MR. MAHER: BUT THE REASON FOR ALL OF THE

EXEMPTIONS AND THOSE THAT ARE CURRENTLY IN THESE YEARS WERE BASED ON

CONSTITUTIONAL GROUNDS.

MS. PAULIN: YES, EXCEPT FOR THAT ONE.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. QUESTION: WHY WAS

CONSTITUTIONAL GROUNDS PUT IN HIGHER REGARD THAN SOME OF THE LOCAL

COUNTY CHARTERS WHICH ESTABLISHED THESE ELECTIONS? WHY WAS THAT

VALUED MORE IN TERMS OF CREATING THIS DOCUMENT IN THIS LEGISLATION?

MS. PAULIN: I MEAN --

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MR. MAHER: I CAN READ A SPECIFIC SECTION IF THAT'S

OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH.

MR. MAHER: ALL RIGHT.

MS. PAULIN: LOOK, I WOULD JUST SAY THAT WE CAN'T

OVERRIDE THE CONSTITUTION. YOU KNOW, WE CAN OVERRIDE COUNTY CHARTERS,

WE'VE DONE IT BEFORE TO MAKE CONSISTENCY IN THE STATE. SO, YOU KNOW,

IT'S NOT LIKE ONE WE OVER -- YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT THAT WE CHOSE IT. WE

CAN'T DO IT, YOU KNOW.

MR. MAHER: SO YOU DON'T BELIEVE THAT THERE'S ANY

LEGAL ISSUES WITH OVERRIDING A COUNTY CHARTER DESCRIBING HOW THEIR

ELECTION SHOULD PLAY OUT --

MS. PAULIN: ABSOLUTELY -- ABSOLUTELY NOT.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. THANK YOU FOR ANSWERING MY

QUESTION. GOING TO THE MACHINE SIZES AND THE DESIGNS. THIS IS

SOMETHING WHERE I KNOW YOU SPOKE QUITE A LITTLE BIT ABOUT IT AND I

KNOW FROM YOUR WORDS YOU SAID THIS WOULD BE A TREMENDOUS EXPENSE

FOR COUNTIES AND TAXPAYERS SHOULD THOSE SPECIFIC MACHINES NOT BE

VALID. MY QUESTION IS, DID YOU ALL DO A MOCK BALLOT IN THE EVENT THAT

WE HAD CONTESTED ELECTIONS FOR EVERY SINGLE OFFICE IN THE STATE,

CONGRESS, PRESIDENT, LOCALS? WAS THERE A BALLOT AND DID YOU

COMMUNICATE WITH THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS, A LOCAL COUNTY BOARD OF

ELECTIONS ON TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IF THAT WOULD ACTUALLY WORK

PHYSICALLY?

MS. PAULIN: I DID TALK TO THE STATE BOARD OF

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ELECTIONS THAT CLEARLY HAS OVERSIGHT OVER ALL THE LOCAL BOARD OF

ELECTIONS AND CERTAINLY IS FAMILIAR WITH ALL OF THE LOCALS AND THEY

BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE -- THAT MOST, MOST OF THE BALLOTS WILL BE ON ONE

PAGE SIMILAR TO WHAT WE HAVE NOW. THAT THERE WILL BE SOME LIKE WE

HAVE SEEN IN SOME ELECTIONS WHERE THERE MIGHT BE TWO, BUT THEY

BELIEVE THAT -- THAT WOULD BE THE MAXIMUM.

MR. MAHER: SO THEY DID NOT ANSWER WITH 100

PERCENT CERTAINTY --

MS. PAULIN: NO, THEY ANSWERED WITH 100 PERCENT

CERTAINTY.

MR. MAHER: I'M SORRY. YOU SAID BELIEVE.

MS. PAULIN: WELL, I MEAN -- I DON'T WANT TO -- YOU

KNOW, I'M NOT GOING TO SUGGEST TO YOU THAT I HAVE IT IN AN AFFIDAVIT, YOU

KNOW, BUT I CAN TELL YOU THAT THAT'S WHAT THEY TOLD ME.

MR. MAHER: SO A BOARD OF ELECTIONS ATTORNEY

SPOKE WITH LOCAL COUNTY --

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T KNOW WHO HE SPOKE WITH, I

JUST KNOW WHAT HE TOLD ME.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. SO YOU --

MS. PAULIN: AND I CAN TELL YOU HE'S BEEN THERE A

LONG TIME.

MR. MAHER: I BELIEVE THE PERSON YOU TALKED TO IS

EXTREMELY QUALIFIED AND KNOWLEDGEABLE. MY SPECIFIC QUESTION IS, WAS

A BOARD OF ELECTION, A COUNTY BOARD OF ELECTION EMPLOYEE OF ANY

LEVEL WHETHER THEY WERE A COMMISSIONER, AN EMPLOYEE, THAT WORKS

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WITH THESE MACHINES CONTACTED ON A POTENTIAL EXAMPLE OF WHAT THIS

WOULD LOOK LIKE TO BE ABLE TO VERIFY WHAT YOU JUST SAID? THAT'S --

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T -- I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE

SAYING. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE ASKING ME WHETHER OR NOT USING TWO,

YOU KNOW, BALLOTS WAS, YOU KNOW, WE KNOW THAT THAT'S BEEN DONE,

RIGHT?

MR. MAHER: WELL, IF YOU DON'T MIND I'LL BE PLAIN,

VERY SIMPLE.

MS. PAULIN: YEAH, OKAY.

MR. MAHER: IT IS MY BELIEF --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MAHER: -- BECAUSE I CAN'T SAY WITH A HUNDRED

PERCENT CERTAINTY BUT I'M ABOUT 99.9 PERCENT THAT THIS WILL CREATE AN

ISSUE AND THE MACHINES WE CURRENTLY HAVE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO HANDLE IT

AND I'M JUST LOOKING FOR A HUNDRED PERCENT VERIFICATION THAT WHILE WE

GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS POTENTIALLY COULD BE AN UNFUNDED MANDATE THAT

WILL REALLY CRIPPLE OUR COUNTIES WITH NO MONEY ATTACHED TO THIS BILL. I

WOULD LOVE FOR US TO BE ABLE TO SAY WE HAVE A HUNDRED PERCENT

CERTAINTY AND I'M JUST NOT HEARING THAT.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY YOU BELIEVE

THAT, YOU KNOW, THE MACHINES WON'T WORK SINCE THE STATE BOARD OF

ELECTIONS SEEMS TO BELIEVE THAT THEY WILL. I DON'T KNOW WHO YOU'VE

TALKED TO THAT'S TELLING YOU THEY WON'T WORK.

MR. MAHER: EVERY SINGLE COUNTY BOARD OF

ELECTIONS EMPLOYEE I'VE TALKED TO HAS TOLD ME THIS IS GOING TO BE A

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PROBLEM SO THAT'S ONE.

MS. PAULIN: BUT -- BUT IN WHAT REGARD?

MR. MAHER: THAT THE MACHINES WILL NOT BE ABLE TO

HANDLE A BALLOT THAT LARGE AND --

MS. PAULIN: BUT I EXPLAINED, THERE'S NO LARGE

BALLOT. THE BALLOT IS THE SAME SIZE.

MR. MAHER: UNDERSTOOD.

MS. PAULIN: THEY ARE -- THERE'S JUST POTENTIALLY TWO

OF THEM --

MR. MAHER: OKAY.

MS PAULIN: -- WHICH WE KNOW THEY CAN HANDLE

BECAUSE THEY'VE HANDLED THEM IN OTHER RACES.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. IS THERE A SPECIFIC REGULATION

ON THE BOOKS ANYWHERE THAT SPEAKS TO A FONT SIZE ON THE BALLOT?

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T KNOW.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. SO -- SO WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT

THE FONT SIZE, WE DON'T -- IN MY OPINION, WE STILL DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS ALL

GOING TO BE ABLE TO INCOHERENTLY FIT ON THE BALLOT, WHETHER IT'S ONE OR

TWO PAGES. OKAY. HOLD ON. I GOT A COUPLE THINGS HERE.

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. THE ATTORNEY THAT YOU SPOKE TO

- I WROTE THIS DOWN, BOARD OF ELECTIONS ATTORNEY - IS THAT JUST ONE

INDIVIDUAL ATTORNEY THAT WAS IN THAT MEETING? IS THAT A ASSEMBLY

MAJORITY ATTORNEY OR WAS THERE A BIPARTISAN GROUP OF ATTORNEYS THAT HAD

THIS DISCUSSION WITH YOU?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: IT -- IT WAS AN ATTORNEY AT THE STATE

BOARD OF ELECTIONS, NOT AN ASSEMBLY PERSON.

MR. MAHER: SO IT WAS NOT AN EMPLOYEE OF THE -- OF

THE MAJORITY? IT WAS A BOARD OF ELECTIONS ATTORNEY THAT WAS

NON-PARTISAN?

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE IS SUCH A THING

AS NON-PARTISAN --

MR. MAHER: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: -- AT THE STATE BOARD OF ELECTIONS. I

THINK YOU ONLY HAVE PARTISAN ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, RIGHT, AT ALL THE

BOARD OF ELECTIONS, THAT'S HOW WE WORK IT, BUT -- BUT HE WAS -- HE'S

BEEN THERE A LONG TIME, HE'S VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE AND HE WAS NOT AN

EMPLOYEE OF THE LEGISLATURE.

MR. MAHER: OKAY.

MS. PAULIN: AND I -- YOU KNOW, I JUST WANT TO SAY

THAT BROOME COUNTY, I DON'T KNOW WHO'S IN BROOME COUNTY, WHEREVER

YOU ARE, ALREADY DOES EVEN YEAR ELECTIONS AND THEY INCLUDE ALL THE -- ALL

THE RACES AND THERE'S NEVER BEEN A PROBLEM.

MR. MAHER: HOW MANY RACES IS THAT?

MS. PAULIN: IN BROOME?

MR. MAHER: YES.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T HAVE A CLUE. I DON'T LIVE THERE.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. I GUESS MY POINT WOULD BE I

DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S COMPARABLE TO WHAT A RACE WOULD LOOK LIKE IF IT

WAS IN A PRESIDENTIAL CYCLE WITH ALL THE TOWN AND ALL THE JUDGES AS

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ASSEMBLYMEMBER TAGUE HAD MENTIONED. I AM JUST SHOCKED THAT THAT'S

SOMETHING THAT MIGHT ACTUALLY HAPPEN. OKAY. GOING TO A SPECIFIC

QUESTION I HAVE. THE WAY THAT I READ THIS AND PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M

WRONG, IT LOOKED LIKE THERE WAS AN EXEMPTION FOR ANY TOWN OFFICE THAT

HAD A ODD YEAR, THREE-YEAR TERM.

MS. PAULIN: WE EXEMPTED THREE YEAR TERMS. WE

DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MANY THERE ARE. SO ONCE THIS GETS SETTLED, WE'LL

SEE IF THERE'S A WAY TO INCORPORATE THEM AS WELL. BUT FOR NOW WE

WEREN'T SURE HOW TO DO IT BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ADDING A YEAR IS -- COULD

BE PROBLEMATIC BECAUSE THE VOTERS DIDN'T ANTICIPATE OR, YOU KNOW, IT'S

HARD FOR THE STATE TO SAY OKAY, WE'RE GOING TO ADD A YEAR.

MR. MAHER: SO CURRENTLY, ANY TOWN OFFICE OR

COUNTY LEGISLATIVE OFFICE THAT HAS A THREE-YEAR TERM IN AN ODD YEAR IS

EXEMPT FROM THIS.

MS. PAULIN: FOR THE -- FOR THE TIME BEING.

MR. MAHER: SO IF A TOWN BOARD THIS YEAR DECIDED

TO CHANGE THEIR TERMS TO THREE YEARS IN AN ODD YEAR AND IT TOOK EFFECT

BEFORE JANUARY 1 OF 2025, IF THAT'S POSSIBLE, THEY WOULD BE EXEMPT

FROM THIS.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T -- I DON'T THINK THE TOWNS, I

DON'T KNOW WHERE'S -- WHERE'S MY STAFF, BUT I DON'T THINK THE TOWNS CAN

JUST MAKE THEIR OWN DECISIONS --

MR. MAHER: I'M SORRY. WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY

THAT?

MS. PAULIN: LIKE, IN OTHER WORDS, WE KNOW

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

COUNTIES CAN -- YOU KNOW, COUNTIES THAT HAVE CHARTERS ESPECIALLY CAN --

CAN DECIDE WHEN THEIR ELECTIONS ARE, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEIR TERMS ARE. I

DON'T KNOW --

MR. MAHER: SO -- SO I WAS A TOWN SUPERVISOR. WE

ABSOLUTELY HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO SET OUR OWN GUIDELINES, OUR TERMS,

TERM LIMITS, SO IF I'M ON THE TOWN BOARD --

MS. PAULIN: SO YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR TERM FROM

TWO TO THREE YEARS?

MR. MAHER: YES. YOU WOULD HAVE TO BE ON THE

BALLOT. SO WE WOULD BASICALLY AFTER THIS IS POTENTIALLY PASSED, ANY

TOWN IN UPSTATE NEW YORK OR WHEREVER THIS IS IMPACTED COULD SIMPLY

SAY HEY, WE'RE GOING TO MAKE A MOTION -- I'M TRYING TO GET YOU TO

CHANGE OR EDIT YOUR LAW -- BUT I'M JUST SAYING. I'M JUST TRYING TO VERIFY

IF THIS IS A PATH TOWARDS A LOOPHOLE.

MS. PAULIN: IT COULD BE.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. THANK YOU FOR, YOU KNOW, AT

LEAST TALKING ME THROUGH THAT ONE. OKAY. SO, I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR

YOU ON SOME OF YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT VOTERS. SO I THINK I WOULD NEVER

ARGUE WITH YOU THAT THIS WILL INCREASE VOTER TURNOUT IN LOCAL ELECTIONS.

MS. PAULIN: OKAY.

MR. MAHER: MY PROBLEM IS DIGGING A LITTLE BIT

DEEPER. YOU MADE A COMMENT SAYING THAT VOTERS ARE SMART, YOU HAVE

FAITH AND CONFIDENCE IN THE VOTERS, I DO TOO, I AGREE.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MAHER: MY QUESTION TO YOU IS, DO YOU BELIEVE

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THAT THE AVERAGE VOTER HAS ENOUGH TIME IN THEIR DAY TO EVALUATE THE

ELECTIONS THEY CURRENTLY HAVE TO EVALUATE AND THEN THOSE ADDED ON TOP

OF THAT THROUGH ALL THAT THEY HAVE GOING ON WITH THEIR KIDS AND THEIR

FAMILY AND THEIR LIFE. DO YOU BELIEVE THEY HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO TRULY

EVALUATE THEIR ELECTIONS?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK THAT VOTERS ARE SMART.

THEY PARTICIPATE WHEN THEY ARE GIVEN INFORMATION. THEY GET ENGAGED

AND HONESTLY THEY'RE CAPABLE OF MULTI-TASKING. SO YEAH, I DO THINK THAT

THEY COULD POTENTIALLY EVALUATE ALL THOSE RACES IF THEY WANTED TO. AND

IF THEY DIDN'T WANT TO, THEY WOULDN'T. BUT, THEY CERTAINLY ARE CAPABLE OF

DOING IT.

MR. MAHER: SO, MY QUESTION AGAIN ISN'T ABOUT

SMART OR CAPABILITY. MY SPECIFIC QUESTION TO YOU IS, DO YOU BELIEVE THE

AVERAGE VOTER HAS ENOUGH TIME TO RESPONSIBLY EDUCATE THEMSELVES ON

ALL OF THESE RACES THAT ARE GOING TO BE GIVEN AND PUTTING INTO ONE YEAR?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK AGAIN THAT THE NUMBER OF

PEOPLE THAT WOULD PARTICIPATE IN THE EVEN YEAR COMPARED TO THE NUMBER

OF PEOPLE IN THE ODD YEAR, THAT YOU WOULD HAVE A GREATER PROPORTION

PARTICIPATING KNOWLEDGEABLE BECAUSE YOU WOULD JUST HAVE AN

INCREASED AMOUNT OF PEOPLE.

MR. MAHER: WHY DO YOU THINK THEY'D BE MORE

KNOWLEDGEABLE IN THAT SCENARIO?

MS. PAULIN: I'M JUST SAYING THAT THERE WOULD BE --

SO YOU'RE SUGGESTING THAT SOME PEOPLE WHO VOTE ARE NOT GOING TO BE

KNOWLEDGEABLE BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE TIME AND OTHERS WILL

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BE.

MR. MAHER: NO. I'M SAYING THE OVERWHELMING

MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WILL NOT HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO APPROPRIATELY EDUCATE

THEMSELVES ON VERY IMPORTANT SERIOUS ELECTIONS AT EVERY LEVEL.

MS. PAULIN: JUST BECAUSE WE'RE ADDING PEOPLE?

MR. MAHER: JUST BASICALLY ON WHAT THEY HAVE NOW,

I'M SAYING A MAJORITY OF PEOPLE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH TIME.

MS. PAULIN: SO NOW YOU THINK THAT THEY'RE NOT

EDUCATED.

MR. MAHER: NO. I BELIEVE WITH CERTAINTY THAT

THERE'S NOT ENOUGH TIME IN THE DAY FOR PEOPLE TO PROPERLY EDUCATE

THEMSELVES CURRENTLY. AND IF WE MAKE THINGS WORSE WE'RE GOING TO PUT

THEM IN AN EVEN WORSE POSITION. AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING

WRONG WITH SAYING IT BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT'S THE TRUTH.

MS. PAULIN: I -- I BELIEVE THAT VOTERS ARE SMART --

MR. MAHER: ME TOO. I DO, TOO.

MS. PAULIN: -- AND THAT THEY'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO

DO THIS.

MR. MAHER: OKAY. WE'RE GOING TO RESPECTFULLY

DISAGREE BUT THANK YOU FOR ANSWERING THE QUESTION.

ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU. OKAY. SO SINCE I HAVE

REALLY ENJOYED MY TIME WORKING WITH THE SPONSOR ON PREVIOUS

LEGISLATION AND I WAS VERY TOUGH HOPEFULLY WITH THE QUESTIONS,

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HOPEFULLY SHE RESPECTS MY OPINIONS ON THEM, OR NOT. VERY, VERY MUCH

ENJOYED WORKING WITH THE VETERANS OF QUALITY ACT WITH SENATOR

LARKIN, WITH THIS SPONSOR. I KNOW HER HEART'S IN THE RIGHT PLACE, BUT

THIS SPECIFIC BILL WILL ABSOLUTELY HURT OUR ABILITY TO HAVE VOTERS THAT

HAVE TIME TO EDUCATE THEMSELVES. MY PARENTS WORK VERY HARD, VOTERS

WORK VERY HARD, I HAVE KNOCKED ON DOORS ON LOCAL ELECTIONS AND MOST

OF THE TIME I SPEND KNOCKING ON DOORS IS EDUCATING VOTERS ON THINGS

THEY JUST DON'T KNOW ABOUT. AND IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR WILL TO

LEARN ABOUT THE ELECTION. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM BEING SMART.

THEY DON'T HAVE THE TIME. AND THAT'S JUST A FACT. AND BY COMPOUNDING

THAT FACT THAT CURRENTLY EXISTS FOR THE MAJORITY OF VOTERS RIGHT NOW BASED

ON ME PHYSICALLY MEETING THEM AND KNOCKING ON THEIR DOORS AND

TALKING TO THEM ON THE PHONES AND E-MAILING THEM, WE'RE JUST MAKING IT

MUCH, MUCH WORSE. AND ANYONE, IN MY OPINION, IF YOU DON'T KNOW

THAT FOR A FACT, THEN YOU'RE NOT INTERACTING WITH VOTERS ENOUGH. AND MY

JOB RIGHT NOW IS JUST TO SPEAK ON THIS SPECIFIC BILL AND I THINK IT'S REALLY,

REALLY DANGEROUS THE THOUGHT OF HAVING VOTERS GO TO THE POLLS AND JUST

NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO HAVE THE TIME IN THEIR DAY TO APPROPRIATELY

EDUCATE THEMSELVES ON THESE ISSUES.

WHEN I KNOCKED ON DOORS FOR MY TOWN SUPERVISOR

RACE, WE HAD THIS AMAZING ABILITY TO FOCUS ON LOCAL ISSUES. AS

SOMEONE WHO HAS WORKED AT THE LOCAL LEVEL, THE FEDERAL LEVEL, THE

STATE LEVEL ON CAMPAIGNS, I KNOW THAT OUR INDUSTRY IS A BILLION,

MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR INDUSTRY. THAT'S WHAT CAMPAIGNS IS, THAT'S THE

REALITY. AND IN A PRESIDENTIAL CYCLE AND IN A CONGRESSIONAL CYCLE, IT IS

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THE JOB OF PROFESSIONALS TO CREATE A POLARIZING ENVIRONMENT. NOW WHAT

WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE ALLOWING THAT POLARIZING BILLION DOLLAR INDUSTRY TO

MANIPULATE LOCAL ELECTIONS AND THEN USE LOCAL ISSUES, WHETHER THEY'RE

TRUE OR NOT, TO HELP INFLUENCE THE TOP OF THE TICKET. IT'S GOING TO CREATE

MORE DISINFORMATION. IT'S GOING TO CREATE LESS EDUCATED VOTERS NO

MATTER HOW SMART THEY ARE AND THAT'S JUST SOMETHING THAT I STRONGLY

BELIEVE IN. I THINK AT THE END OF THE DAY LOCAL ELECTIONS ARE THE PURIST

FORM OF GOVERNMENT WE HAVE LEFT BECAUSE IT'S SO CLOSE TO THE PEOPLE.

THE MORE THE PEOPLE ARE INVOLVED IN THEIR GOVERNMENT, ESPECIALLY AT

THE LOCAL LEVEL, IT'S SPECIAL. THE MORE HONEST THE GOVERNMENT BECOMES

AND WE'RE REALLY TAKING THAT AWAY TO A LARGE DEGREE BY INCLUDING THEM

IN THESE ELECTIONS WHERE WE WILL JUST HAVE WAY TOO MUCH INFORMATION

FOR ANYONE, OURSELVES INCLUDED, TO REALLY EDUCATE OURSELVES PROPERLY ON

EVERY SINGLE RACE, ESPECIALLY IF THERE'S MULTIPLE CANDIDATES. AND IF

YOUR COMEBACK TO THAT IS, OH, YOU'RE SAYING PEOPLE AREN'T SMART, THAT'S

NOT WHAT I'M SAYING. IT'S NOT. IT'S JUST THE MATTER OF FACT AND IT'S THE

TRUTH OF OUR CURRENT POLITICAL PROCESS. THAT IS MY OPINION, THOSE ARE

MY COMMENTS. THANK YOU MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

WILL THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: ABSOLUTELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN?

GRACIOUS, MS. PAULIN.

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MR. BLUMENCRANZ: THANKS, SPONSOR. NOW

WOULD YOU CONSIDER OUR FEDERAL ELECTIONS RELATIVELY NOISY RIGHT NOW?

MS. PAULIN: WHAT DO YOU MEAN? WHAT DO YOU

MEAN?

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: LIKE OUR PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTIONS, CONGRESSIONAL.

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T KNOW WHAT NOISY IS, BUT I THINK

PEOPLE ARE ENGAGED, YES.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: WELL, I -- I JUST SAY THAT

BECAUSE I LIVE IN NASSAU COUNTY. I REPRESENT AN AREA OF THE TOWN OF

OYSTER BAY. WE HAVE A LOT OF COMPETITIVE ELECTIONS AROUND HERE AS

YOU KNOW THIS YEAR. WE HAVE A LOT OF MONEY IN THOSE ELECTIONS. MY

CONCERN IS WITH THESE CANDIDATES FOR OUR TOWNS AND COUNTIES BEING AT

THE SAME TIME AS OUR FEDERAL RACES IF WE'LL START TO SEE THE DIMINISHED

TURNOUT THAT MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES HAVE POINTED OUT. BUT BESIDES THE

-- THE STATE CONSTITUTIONAL CONCERNS, DO YOU SEE ANY CONCERNS WITH THIS

BILL WITH OUR FEDERAL CONSTITUTION?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: NO? SO YOU DON'T THINK THAT

THERE MIGHT BE ANY POTENTIAL THAT THIS BILL MAY CREATE ANY VIOLATIONS FOR

THE 14TH AMENDMENT FOR NEW YORKERS?

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: ALL RIGHT. SO I WOULD SAY

THERE MIGHT ALSO BE SOME ISSUES WITH REGARDS TO THE FIRST AMENDMENT

WITH MARGINALIZED GROUPS. YOU'RE GOING TO INCREASINGLY SEE LESS OF A

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VOICE FOR PEOPLE. WE'RE FACED WITH A LOT OF CONFUSION. DO YOU FIND

THAT YOUR CONSTITUENTS ARE A LITTLE CONFUSED AFTER THE CHANGE OF MAPS

POTENTIALLY?

MS. PAULIN: I HAVEN'T HEARD THAT THEY'RE CONFUSED,

NO.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: WELL, I'LL SAY QUITE A FEW OF

THE PHONE CALLS I GET IN MY OFFICE ARE WHO ARE YOU AND WHAT YOU DONE

WITH CHUCK LAVINE? I'M LIKE, DON'T WORRY. HE'S RIGHT NEXT DOOR.

(LAUGHTER)

BUT WITH REGARDS TO THE FIRST AMENDMENT, YOU KNOW,

OUR VOTERS ARE ALREADY CONFUSED. THEY'RE CONFUSED ABOUT THE CHANGE IN

MAPS. NOW WE'LL HAVE TO EXPLAIN OUR NEW FORM OF CAMPAIGN FINANCE

AND NOW WE'RE ALSO GOING TO MOVE OUR ELECTIONS. NOW AS MANY OF MY

COLLEAGUES HAVE POINTED OUT, NOT EVERYONE IS AS ENGAGED AS WE ARE.

DO YOU FIND THAT THIS CONFUSION MAY CREATE A CRISIS WHERE PEOPLE FEEL

LIKE THEIR -- THEIR RIGHTS ARE BEING VIOLATED IF THEY'RE UNAWARE WHEN

ELECTIONS ARE HAPPENING, WHEN TO VOICE THEIR OPINIONS BECAUSE THEY

DON'T KNOW WHEN ELECTION DAY IS ANYMORE?

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THEY'RE JUST GOING TO GET A

HAPPY SURPRISE WHEN THEY GO TO THE POLLING PLACE ON ELECTION DAY IN

AN EVEN YEAR AND SEE EVEN MORE PEOPLE THAT THEY DIDN'T EVEN KNOW

EXISTED BEFORE BECAUSE THEY NEVER PARTICIPATED IN THE ODD YEAR, THEY

WILL THEN SAY OH, MY GOODNESS. I GET TO VOTE FOR ALL OF THESE PEOPLE AND

IT WILL BE A CONVENIENCE, YOU KNOW, FOR -- I KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, WE

TALKED ABOUT PEOPLE BEING BUSY. THIS WILL BE A GREAT CONVENIENCE FOR

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PEOPLE.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: IS THERE ANY PLAN FOR ANY

SORT OF PUBLIC OUTREACH, RIGHT? ARE WE GOING TO START TO INFORM NEW

YORKERS OF THIS PRETTY SILENT THING?

MS. PAULIN: I WOULDN'T WORRY THAT CANDIDATES WHO

ARE RUNNING ARE GOING TO KEEP QUIET ABOUT IT. THEY ARE -- THEY ARE

GOING TO INFORM THE VOTERS THAT THEY'RE RUNNING IN THAT YEAR, AND THEY'RE

GOING TO ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO COME OUT AND VOTE FOR THEM. AND I'M

NOT REALLY WORRIED ABOUT ADVERTISING IT SEPARATE FROM THAT.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: SO YOU THINK JUST GRASSROOTS

OUTREACH, BY THE WAY, AN ELECTION YOU VOTED --

MS. PAULIN: I KNOW I KNOCKED ON A LOT OF DOORS IN

MY LAST CAMPAIGN.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: I'M SURE AND I FEEL LIKE WE

ALL MIGHT'VE, BUT THAT DOESN'T NECESSARILY ACCOUNT FOR REACHING ALL, YOU

KNOW, 130 OR SO THOUSAND RESIDENTS IN EACH OF OUR DISTRICTS. AND I

THINK THAT WE MAY VERY WELL SEE A LOT OF PEOPLE EXTREMELY CONFUSED FOR

MANY ELECTION CYCLES. IS THERE GOING TO BE A FINANCIAL COST TO THIS EXTRA

ELECTION IN RELATION TO CHANGE IN -- IN ADMINISTRATIONS, IN COUNTIES

NOW? NASSAU COUNTY IS A VERY LARGE PLACE. THE CHANGE OF

ADMINISTRATION IS AN EXTREMELY COSTLY ENDEAVOR AND WE'RE CREATING --

MS. PAULIN: DO YOU MEAN A CHANGE IN THE PERSON

WHO'S ELECTED?

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: THE PERSON, THEIR

ADMINISTRATION, ALL THE SIGNNAGE, THERE'S A LOT THAT GOES INTO REMOVING --

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: I THINK EVERY ELECTION HAS THE

POTENTIAL FOR CHANGING THE ADMINISTRATION IN A COMPETITIVE ELECTION SO

THAT DOESN'T CHANGE.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: WELL, THIS LAW WILL CREATE AN

ELECTION THAT SHOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED, RIGHT, FOR MANY --

MS. PAULIN: WELL, COUNTY EXECUTIVE RUNS EVERY

FOUR YEARS, RIGHT? SO ONE YEAR THEY'LL RUN FOR THREE YEARS, IT'S JUST NOT

THAT DIFFERENT.

MR. BLUMENCRANZ: ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU.

ON THE BILL.

THERE ARE SOME CARVE-OUTS FOR THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION

IN REGARD TO SOME AREAS OF THE STATE. I THINK ONE AREA THAT HAS BEEN LEFT

OUT OF THOSE CARVE-OUTS IS LONG ISLAND. I KNOW THE COUNTY OF NASSAU

IS VERY UNIQUE. IT'S LARGER THAN MOST MAJOR US CITIES. IT'S COUNTY

EXECUTIVE OVERSEES MILLIONS OF RESIDENTS. UNLIKE MANY TOWNS HERE IN

NEW YORK OR COUNTIES, OUR TOWNS HAVE OVER A MILLION PEOPLE IN THEM,

THE LARGEST IN AMERICA. ALSO, IN NASSAU COUNTY MANY OF THEM. AND

THE GOVERNMENT STRUCTURE DOESN'T EXACTLY EXIST IN THE WAY IT DOES IN

MANY OTHER TOWNS. AND WITH THAT COMES A LOT OF MONEY IN THESE LOCAL

ELECTIONS IN ORDER TO TRY AND -- AND GAUGE THE VOTER. I KNOW THAT OUR

COUNTY EXECUTIVE RACES COST MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, 2- TO 5 MILLION EACH

CANDIDATE, THROW THAT ON TOP OF OUR TOWN RACES WHICH COST MILLIONS, AS

WELL AS OUR CONGRESSIONAL RACES THAT OUR NEW SPEAKER, AS WELL AS THE

NEW MINORITY LEADER IN CONGRESS HAVE COMMITTED TENS -- $20 MILLION

FOR EACH RESPECTIVE RACE IN NASSAU COUNTY, AS WELL AS WHAT WOULD BE

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TAXPAYER FUNDS FOR THE GOVERNOR OR THE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WILL BE

SPENT IN OUR PRESIDENTIAL RACE. IT'LL BE A LOT OF MONEY, A LOT OF NOISE

AND AN AWFUL LOT OF ADVERTISING, ATTEMPTS FOR VOTER ENGAGEMENT. OUR

VOTERS WILL BE FATIGUED. OUR COUNTY ISSUES ARE LARGE BECAUSE OUR

POPULATIONS ARE LARGE AND THEY WILL CONTINUE TO BE NEGLECTED.

ON A TOWN LEVEL, VERY PRESSING ISSUES IN BOTH NASSAU

AND SUFFOLK TOWNS WITHIN THOSE COUNTIES ARE SERIOUS, ESPECIALLY WITH

REGARDS TO OUR ENVIRONMENT, OUR WATER SUPPLY. WE'RE STILL DEALING WITH

THE LEGACIES OF THE POLLUTION FROM POST-WORLD WAR II IMPACTS AND THAT'S

A SERIOUS CONCERN OF PEOPLE, EACH ELECTION CYCLE AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT

WILL NOT BE SPOKEN ABOUT WHEN WE HAVE OUR FEDERAL RACES DICTATING THE

CONVERSATION. IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE KEEP THESE RACES SEPARATE

BECAUSE THEY FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE NARRATIVE OF OUR RACES AND --

AND THE CANDIDATES WE WILL CHOOSE. IT WILL BE MUCH EASIER FOR OUR --

OUR PARTIES TO SHIFT THE NARRATIVE. IT WILL BE MUCH EASIER FOR CANDIDATES

DOWN BALLOT, JUDGES ESPECIALLY IN NASSAU COUNTY TO BE -- BE SWEEPED

UNDER THE RUG WHEN IT COMES TO THE POLITICAL CONVERSATION, AND IT'S

EXTREMELY TROUBLING.

I'M VERY SAD IN THE LAST FEW DAYS OF SESSION TO SEE

SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES INTRODUCE A PIECE OF LEGISLATION LIKE THIS THAT

DOESN'T REALLY ANSWER THE NEEDS OF WHAT WE WERE SENT HERE TO DO. IT

CONTINUES TO BRING PARTY POLITICS TO THE FOREFRONT OF OUR

DECISION-MAKING AND NEGLECT TO BRING WHAT I SEE AS THE MOST IMPORTANT

ISSUES SURROUNDING AFFORDABILITY TO MANY OF YOU, ISSUES LIKE HOUSING OR

-- OR MAKING SURE THAT OUR NEXT GENERATION IS EDUCATED PROPERLY AS

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WHAT WE'RE DEALING WITH IN OUR FINAL DAYS AND I FIND THAT VERY

DISPARAGING. SO I PERSONALLY DO NOT SUPPORT THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION

AND I URGE ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES TO NOT SUPPORT IT AS WELL. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. BENDETT.

MAY I REMIND COLLEAGUES THAT IF YOU ASK A COLLEAGUE

TO YIELD THAT'S FOR QUESTIONS. ONCE YOU END YOUR QUESTIONS YOU GO ON

THE BILL AND ANNOUNCE IT SO WE KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE

QUESTION AND THE ACCUSATION OR THE ACCEPTANCE, ONE OR THE OTHER.

MR. BENDETT, WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO?

MR. BENDETT: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL THE

SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THERE WE GO. MS.

PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. BENDETT: THANK YOU. WE SPOKE EARLIER ONE

OF MY COLLEAGUES MENTIONED ARTICLE IX OF THE NEW YORK STATE

CONSTITUTION. THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION UNDER ARTICLE IX

GRANTS LOCAL GOVERNMENTS A BILL OF RIGHTS SO THAT IT HAS THE AUTHORITY

NECESSARY TO CARRY OUT THE SERVICES FOR THE PUBLIC WITHOUT INTERFERENCE

FROM THE STATE. EVERYBODY -- MOST PEOPLE HERE COME FROM LOCAL

GOVERNMENTS. LOCAL GOVERNMENTS PROVIDE ALL THE PUBLIC SERVICES SUCH

AS WATER, SEWER AND MEALS, MEALS FOR SENIORS. IN MANY PEOPLES'

OPINIONS THAT THIS BILL WILL ERODE THE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS' RIGHTS AND

WITHOUT ANY STATE CONCERN JUSTIFIED FOR THE BILL THIS COULD BE

CONSIDERED UNCONSTITUTIONAL. WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IT'S NOT?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THAT IT DOESN'T CHANGE ANYTHING

THAT A LOCAL GOVERNMENT CAN DO. ALL WE DO IS INCREASE VOTER

PARTICIPATION. I DON'T SEE HOW INCREASING PEOPLES' ROLE IN GOVERNMENT

AND ELECTING PEOPLE COULD EVER BE DEEMED UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

MR. BENDETT: OKAY. BUT DON'T YOU THINK THAT

THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO SET THEIR OWN ELECTION SCHEDULE?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, MOST OF THAT IS ALREADY

CONTROLLED BY US IN THE STATE. SO I DON'T SEE, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW.

I -- I DON'T THINK THAT BY TAKING BACK SOME OF THAT TO MAKE VOTERS

PARTICIPATE MORE IN DEMOCRACY IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

MR. BENDETT: OKAY. YOU TALKED EARLIER ABOUT

ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES ASKED ABOUT AT THE END OF THE BALLOT ABOUT VOTER

DROP-OFF BASED ON THAT ELECTION AND YOU SAID IT WAS MINISCULE, THAT WAS

THE WORD THAT YOU USED. THERE IS A STUDY, ARE YOU AWARE OF IT? IT'S

PUBLISHED IN OXFORD'S REVIEW OF ECONOMIC STUDIES AND IT SAYS THAT

CHOICE FATIGUE SIGNIFICANTLY INCREASES THE LIKELIHOOD OF VOTER WILL

ABSTAIN OR TAKE DECISION SHORTCUTS LIKE BLINDLY PICKING THE FIRST NAME

ON THE BALLOT OR STICKING TO THE INCUMBENTS AND THEY SAY THAT THAT

FATIGUE NEARS 10 PERCENT.

MS. PAULIN: SO I WOULD SAY THAT SINCE WE'RE

ANTICIPATING THAT VOTER TURNOUT IS GOING TO INCREASE BY 50 PERCENT OR

100 PERCENT BY INCLUDING THEM IN EVEN YEARS, 10 PERCENT IS MINISCULE

COMPARED TO THE INCREASE THAT WE'LL SEE.

MR. BENDETT: OKAY. ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES JUST

RECENTLY TALKED ABOUT THE VARIOUS OTHER RACES AND ALL THE MONEY THAT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

COMES IN TO THESE RACES AND THESE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN THIS INDUSTRY.

DO YOU THINK THAT CAMPAIGN EXPENDITURES ESPECIALLY OPAQUE ONES WILL

INFLUENCE THESE DOWN-BALLOT ELECTIONS?

MS. PAULIN: WAIT. SAY THAT ONE MORE TIME.

MR. BENDETT: DO YOU THINK THAT THESE

EXPENDITURES WILL INFLUENCE DOWN-BALLOT ELECTIONS? SO DO YOU THINK

THAT IF -- AS MY COLLEAGUE JUST SAID THAT ON LONG ISLAND THERE'S GOING TO

BE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS SPENT ON CONGRESSIONAL CAMPAIGNS. DO YOU

THINK THAN THAT MONEY SPENT ON THOSE CONGRESSIONAL CAMPAIGNS WILL

INFLUENCE DOWN-BALLOT ELECTIONS?

MS. PAULIN: I GUESS ANY TOP BALLOT COULD INFLUENCE,

BUT I CAN TELL YOU THAT, YOU KNOW, WE ALL WATCH OUR NUMBERS AND ONE OF

THE THINGS THAT I THINK WE TAKE PRIDE ON, IS WHEN WE RUN AHEAD OF THE

TOP OF THE TICKET. SO I DON'T KNOW THAT -- THAT ALL OF THE PEOPLE RUNNING

AREN'T GOING TO BE TRYING TO DO THAT. MAKING THEIR VOICES HEARD AS

CANDIDATES AND REALLY TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO FOCUS ON THEM. SO SURE, I

THINK IT'S POSSIBLE, BUT HONESTLY IF THE CANDIDATES AREN'T WORKING IT, THEN

IT'S MORE POSSIBLE.

MR. BENDETT: OKAY. AND YOU DON'T THINK THAT

THIS WILL BE AN INCREASED BURDEN FOR ELECTION ADMINISTRATORS EVEN

THOUGH MANY COUNTY BOARD OF ELECTIONS PEOPLES FEEL THAT WAY?

MS. PAULIN: I -- I THINK WE'RE SEEING BROOME

COUNTY DO IT SUCCESSFULLY. I THINK IF THEY CAN DO IT, WE CAN DO IT AND,

YOU KNOW, AND THEN WE'LL JUST INCREASE VOTER PARTICIPATION. IF THERE'S

BURDENS I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW THAT WOULD BE BECAUSE WE'D HAVE THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SAME POLLING PLACES, THE SAME AMOUNT OF WORKERS, POTENTIALLY EVEN THE

SAME TURNOUT AS WE SAW IN 2020 WHERE THEY WERE SUCCESSFUL. SO I

DON'T KNOW WHAT EVERYBODY'S WORRIED ABOUT. ARE THEY WORRIED THAT

SOMEHOW WE'RE GOING TO SEE EVEN A MORE INCREASED TURNOUT THAN WE

DID IN THE MOST -- MOST POPULIST TURNOUT THAT WE'VE EVER SEEN? WE

SHOULD JUST BE SO LUCKY AND THEN HAVE TO DEAL. I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT IN

THE GUBERNATORIAL YEAR IN 2026 WHEN THIS FIRST TAKES EFFECT, THAT WE'RE

GOING TO SEE THAT LARGE AN INCREASE TO THE PRESIDENTIAL YEAR THAT WE SAW

IN 2020. BUT IF WE DO, THEN WE WILL THEN HAVE TO PREPARE FOR TWO YEARS

LATER, AND WE'LL HAVE TWO YEARS TO DO IT.

MR. BENDETT: THANK YOU.

ON THE BILL, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. BENDETT: THANK YOU. THIS BILL WILL INFRINGE

ON THE STATE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS GRANTED TO LOCAL GOVERNMENTS. IN

NEW YORK STATE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS IMPACT THE DAY-TO-DAY LIVES OF THE

PUBLIC MORE THAN ANY OTHER LEVEL OF GOVERNMENT. WITHOUT LOCAL

GOVERNMENT, PUBLIC SERVICES SUCH AS WATER, SEWER, MEALS FOR SENIORS

WOULD NOT BE DELIVERED. AND IT'S BECAUSE OF THIS IMPORTANCE THAT MANY

BELIEVE THAT ARTICLE IX OF THE NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION WHICH

GRANTS LOCAL GOVERNMENTS A BILL OF RIGHTS SO THAT IT HAS THE AUTHORITY

NECESSARY TO CARRY OUT THE SERVICES FOR THE PUBLIC WITHOUT INTERFERENCE

FROM THE STATE. THIS BILL WILL INCREASE THE BURDEN FOR ELECTION

ADMINISTRATORS. IT WILL INCREASE VOTER CONFUSION AND CONTRARY TO THE

CLAIM IN THE MEMORANDUM IN SUPPORT, THIS BILL WILL CREATE MORE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CONFUSION FOR VOTERS, CROWDED, LONG BALLOTS, SOME VOTERS MIGHT NOT

EVEN CASE A PREFERENCE FOR DOWN-BALLOT RACES, LESS CARE GIVEN TO

ANYTHING AFTER THE TOP OF THE TICKET SO MORE ETHNIC, SURNAME BINIS --

BIAS, PICKING WHOEVER IS FIRST AND RANDOM RANK CHOICE VOTING PICKS, IT

WILL POTENTIALLY DISENFRANCHISE VOTERS DUE TO THIS CONFUSION. THIS BILL,

MANY BELIEVE WILL ALSO FACILITATE NATIONAL PARTISANSHIP AND THAT WILL

PERMEATE TOWARDS LOCAL ELECTIONS. OPAQUE CAMPAIGN EXPENDITURES WILL

INFLUENCE DOWN-BALLOT ELECTIONS AND THIS WOULD DRAMATICALLY

STRENGTHEN THE IMPACT OF INDEPENDENT EXPENDITURE COMMITTEES AND

OTHER UNRESTRICTED SPENDING SOURCES. THIS IS A RARE SITUATION AND IT IS

BOTH BAD FOR DEMOCRACY AND THE CONSULTING INDUSTRIAL COMPLEXES

BOTTOM LINE AND THAT'S ESPECIALLY TRUE WITH CAMPAIGN FINANCING AND ALL

THE CONGRESSIONAL MONEY THAT WILL BE COMING IN.

IN SUMMARY, I'LL BE VOTING NO ON THIS BILL. I ENCOURAGE

MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME AND THIS BILL, IN MY OPINION, VIOLATES THE

NEW YORK STATE CONSTITUTION, ROLLS BACK THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT BILL OF

RIGHTS AND IS BAD FOR DEMOCRACY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. MCGOWAN.

MR. MCGOWAN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WILL

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. PAULIN YIELDS.

MR. MCGOWAN: THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU, MS.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PAULIN. I KNOW IT'S BEEN A -- A LONG NIGHT AND WE'RE PROBABLY COMING

CLOSE TO THE END HERE ON THIS BILL BUT I DO HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS AND I

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

MS. PAULIN: SURE.

MR. MCGOWAN: YOU'VE STATED MULTIPLE TIMES

TONIGHT THE GOAL HERE OF THIS LEGISLATION IS TO INCREASE VOTER TURNOUT --

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: -- CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND THE METHOD TO DO THAT, AS

PROPOSED BY THIS BILL, IS TO BASICALLY BRING ALL ELECTIONS INTO EVEN YEARS.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND THAT WOULD INCLUDE FEDERAL

DOWN TO TOWN, VILLAGE, COUNTY, STATE ALL WITHIN POTENTIALLY THE SAME

YEAR, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: ULTIMATELY, YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: I'M SORRY?

MS. PAULIN: YES, YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. YOU'VE DESCRIBED THIS SUCH

AS A MULTIPHASE PLAN, CORRECT? THIS ONE PIECE OF LEGISLATION WILL NOT

ACCOMPLISH ALL OF THAT IF IT'S PASSED INTO LAW DURING THIS SESSION,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: IT WOULD DO A LOT BUT NOT ALL.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. AND ONE OF THE EXCLUDED

MUNICIPALITIES ARE CITIES, CORRECT? THEY'RE NOT EFFECTED BY THIS

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

LEGISLATION.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND THE REASON THAT CITIES ARE

EXCLUDED IS BECAUSE IN ORDER TO CHANGE THE -- I GUESS THE VOTING TIME OR

YEARS FOR CITIES, WOULD REQUIRE A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: NOW TO ENACT A CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT THERE HAS TO BE LEGISLATION THAT'S PASSED IN TWO CONSECUTIVE

TERMS.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND THEN AFTER THAT, THE PROPOSAL

IS ON A BALLOT IN EITHER THE FOLLOWING -- YOU KNOW, THE NEXT YEAR'S

NOVEMBER ELECTION OR THE YEAR AFTER THAT, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO ULTIMATELY THAT DECISION

WHETHER TO AMEND THE STATE CONSTITUTION IS LEFT TO THE VOTERS.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH I

GUESS THE OVERALL GOAL THAT YOU'RE LOOKING TO ACHIEVE, UNIFORMITY ACROSS

ALL ELECTIONS IN ALL MUNICIPALITIES THROUGHOUT THE STATE, IT'S GOING TO

REQUIRE THE VOTERS PARTICIPATION, AT LEAST FOR THE CITY PORTION OF IT, RIGHT,

TO HAVE THAT AMENDMENT PASSED.

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO IT'S POSSIBLE THAT THIS IS PASSED,

PASSED INTO LAW. AND THE NEXT STEP IS TAKEN TO AMEND THE CONSTITUTION

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BUT ULTIMATELY THE VOTERS REJECT THAT. THAT'S POSSIBLE, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO WE WILL THEN HAVE AN

IMBALANCE, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: WE WILL STILL HAVE A BETTER SYSTEM

BECAUSE THESE RACES WILL STILL ALL BE ON THE EVEN YEARS.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT ISN'T THE WHOLE -- I'M SORRY. I

DIDN'T MEAN TO CUT YOU OFF.

MS. PAULIN: NO.

MR. MCGOWAN: ISN'T THE WHOLE PURPOSE AS YOU'VE

STATED, AS WE'VE HEARD, AFTER, YOU KNOW, QUESTION, AFTER QUESTION

TONIGHT, THE WHOLE PURPOSE IS TO ALIGN ALL ELECTIONS IN THOSE EVEN YEARS,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: AS MANY AS WE CAN.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. BUT WE'RE NOT -- WE'RE

LEAVING A PART OF IT THAT WE DON'T HAVE CONTROL. IT'S ULTIMATELY UP TO THE

-- THE VOTERS FOR ALL CITIES, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: WOULDN'T IT HAVE MADE, YOU

KNOW, NOT TO BE - I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE WORD WOULD BE BUT

CONSIDERING THE BILL WE PASSED LAST NIGHT, NOT TO PUT THE CART BEFORE THE

HORSE, I BELIEVE THAT WAS USED LAST NIGHT AS WELL, NOT TO PUT THE CART

BEFORE THE HORSE BUT AREN'T WE KIND OF DOING THAT HERE WHERE WE'RE

TAKING, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT EVERY MUNICIPALITY OTHER THAN

CITIES. VILLAGES, TOWNS, COUNTY ELECTIONS, WE'RE CHANGING WHEN THOSE

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ELECTIONS ARE HELD, YET TO ACCOMPLISH THE OVERALL GOAL OF UNIFORMITY WE

HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE VOTERS TO DO THAT. WOULDN'T IT MAKE MORE SENSE TO

DO THAT PIECE FIRST AND THEN IF IT DOESN'T PASS THEN YOU KNOW WHAT,

MAYBE -- MAYBE THE VOTERS REJECT THIS AND IT'S NOT UP TO US. WOULDN'T

THAT MAKE A LITTLE MORE SENSE IF WE'RE TRYING TO BRING THIS UNIFORMITY

AND LEAVE IT TO THE PEOPLE TO DECIDE?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, AGAIN, WE NEED TO START

SOMEWHERE. THIS IS A BIG STEP. IT DOESN'T REQUIRE TWO YEARS AND THEN A

VOTE, IT REQUIRES JUST A VOTE ONCE, THIS HOUSE RIGHT NOW. SO TO ME IT

MADE MORE SENSE TO GO AHEAD WITH SOMETHING THAT WE COULD EXPEDITE

SOONER.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY, BUT YOU'RE STILL LEAVING

OPEN THE POSSIBILITY THAT WE NEVER ACHIEVE THAT UNIFORMITY.

MS. PAULIN: I -- I AGREE. AND I WOULD BE

DISAPPOINTED IF MY CITIES COULDN'T DO THAT BECAUSE I HAVE TWO OF THE

LARGEST CITIES IN THE STATE. BUT, I KNOW THAT I WOULD STILL BE

ACCOMPLISHING A GREAT DEAL WITH THIS BILL.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT AGAIN, THOSE GOALS THAT YOU

STATED, UNIFORMITY, INCREASING VOTER TURNOUT, REDUCING COSTS. THOSE

COSTS ARE NOT REDUCED IF THERE WILL STILL BE ELECTIONS IN BOTH ODD AND

EVEN YEARS. AND THAT WILL HAPPEN IF THE VOTERS REJECT THIS CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT THAT WILL BE REQUIRED TO DO THAT. WOULD YOU AGREE WITH

THAT?

MS. PAULIN: SO THERE'S STILL GOING TO BE SOME

SAVINGS. AS I POINTED OUT EARLIER WHEN ASKED, THERE WILL STILL BE ALL OF

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THE MORE CONTENTIOUS RACES, YOU KNOW, WILL POTENTIALLY -- WILL -- THE

PRIMARIES WOULD ALL BE PROBABLY MUCH MORE SO IN THE EVEN YEARS WHEN

YOU LIMIT THE NUMBER OF RACES IN THE -- IN THE ODD YEARS. SO, THERE'S

LIKELY TO BE LESS PRIMARIES BY DOING THE BILL THAT WE'RE DOING WHICH WILL

SAVE MONEY. AND IN FACT ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES FROM LONG ISLAND WAS

KIND ENOUGH TO TEXT ME. SO I THINK, I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER WHO ASKED

ME THE COST, I THINK YOU DID, IN NASSAU COUNTY IT'S $2.6 MILLION FOR A

NOVEMBER RACE. SO POTENTIALLY WE COULD BE SAVING THAT COUNTY 2.6

MILLION IF WE ALIGNED ALL OF THE RACES IN, YOU KNOW, OR WE -- FRANKLY

WE'D BE SAVING 2.6 TWICE, RIGHT, SO THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO THAT'S A SPECIFIC EXAMPLE. I'M

SORRY. DID YOU SAY NASSAU COUNTY?

MS. PAULIN: NASSAU, THEY DON'T HAVE CITIES.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY, MY COUNTY DOESN'T EITHER.

ROCKLAND COUNTY HAS NO CITIES. SO, OTHER THAN NASSAU, THOUGH, I MEAN

WESTCHESTER --

MS. PAULIN: WE HAVE CITIES --

MR. MCGOWAN: -- WHERE YOU REPRESENT, RIGHT,

THERE'S SEVERAL CITIES IN THE -- IN THE COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER. HAS THAT

ANALYSIS BEEN DONE AS TO KNOW THAT HEY, IF THIS DOESN'T WORK OUT, THE

OVERALL GOAL IS NOT ACHIEVED AND WE CAN'T GET THE VOTERS OF THE STATE TO

PASS THIS CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT AND CITIES ARE EXCLUDED FROM THIS

PLAN, HAS THAT ANALYSIS BEEN DONE TO KNOW THAT COST IF WE HAVE

BASICALLY EVERY OTHER ELECTION ON EVEN YEARS, BUT THEN THE CITIES CAN

STILL HAVE ELECTIONS ON ODD YEARS. DO WE KNOW THAT COST DIFFERENCE?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. PAULIN: SO I THINK THAT YOU MADE A REALLY

GOOD POINT AND THAT IS MANY COUNTIES, SINCE THE COUNTIES PAY, RIGHT,

MANY COUNTIES DON'T HAVE CITIES. SO FOR ALL THOSE COUNTIES THAT DON'T

HAVE CITIES, WE'RE ALREADY GOING TO SEE A COST-SAVINGS. SO FOR THOSE

COUNTIES THAT DON'T -- THAT HAVE CITIES LIKE WESTCHESTER, YOU KNOW, IT'S

GOING TO BE A LITTLE BIT OF A TIME, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOING TO BE MORE TIME,

RIGHT? BUT THERE WILL BE AREAS IN WESTCHESTER, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT DON'T

HAVE CITIES. SO THERE WILL BE FEWER PLACES TO PERHAPS SET UP AND, YOU

KNOW, WHERE THERE'S ONLY VILLAGES AND TOWNS. SO, BUT IN ROCKLAND YOU

PROBABLY SAVE MONEY AND, YOU KNOW, IN ANOTHER -- OTHER -- NASSAU,

SUFFOLK, WHERE THEY DON'T HAVE CITIES YOU'D SAVE MONEY.

MR. MCGOWAN: WELL, DOESN'T NASSAU HAVE TWO

CITIES?

MS. PAULIN: I DON'T DO -- DO THEY? ALL RIGHT. SO

THEY HAVE TWO CITIES.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. SO NASSAU'S NOT GOING TO

BE ONE OF THOSE --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: -- COUNTIES THAT WOULD SAVE MONEY

UNDER THAT SCENARIO, RIGHT? AND THE COUNTY THAT YOU REPRESENT,

WESTCHESTER, WOULD ALSO NOT SAVE MONEY UNDER THAT SCENARIO WHERE IT'S

VERY POSSIBLE THAT THE VOTERS REJECT THIS BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: WELL, YOU WOULD HAVE AREAS WHERE --

YOU KNOW, IN WESTCHESTER, REMEMBER, YOU HAVE AREAS THAT DON'T HAVE

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CITIES IN THEM. SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S BY ELECTION DISTRICT. SO, IF YOU

HAVE -- I MEAN IT'S THE JUDGES THAT ARE GOING TO BE THE PROBLEM, RIGHT,

BECAUSE THERE'S ALWAYS JUDGES.

MR. MCGOWAN: I DON'T MEAN CUT YOU OFF BUT YOU

SAID THE COUNTIES ARE BEARING THAT COST.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: RIGHT? SO THE COUNTIES ARE

BEARING THAT COST. SO IF YOU HAVE ONE CITY AND THE CITIES DON'T MAKE

THIS PLAN BECAUSE THE VOTERS SAY NO TO IT, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: THAT COUNTY, INCLUDING THE COUNTY

YOU REPRESENT --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: -- IS GOING TO BEAR A COST THAT

PERHAPS MY COUNTY WON'T BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE CITIES, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT. SO YOU'RE VERY LUCKY, YOUR

TAXPAYERS WILL SAVE MONEY.

MR. MCGOWAN: WELL, MY QUESTION IS, THOUGH, MS.

PAULIN, IS HAVE WE DONE THIS ANALYSIS, HAVE WE -- HAVE WE FIGURED OUT

THOSE NUMBERS, THOSE FACTS AND FIGURES TO KNOW IN THAT SCENARIO AND

FRANKLY I DON'T KNOW HOW LIKELY IT IS BUT IT IS A SCENARIO. IF THAT

HAPPENS AND THE VOTERS REJECT THIS PLAN, HAS THAT ANALYSIS BEEN DONE TO

DETERMINE OKAY, WELL, HEY. WESTCHESTER IS GOING TO GET HIT WITH X

AMOUNT MORE --

MS. PAULIN: NOT MORE -- NO, NOT MORE.

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REMEMBER, IF YOU'RE SAVING MONEY, IT'S NOT MORE THAT YOU'RE PAYING.

IT'S JUST THAT YOU'RE NOT ACHIEVING A -- A COST-SAVINGS.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT, OKAY. SO ROCKLAND SAVES,

WESTCHESTER DOESN'T.

MS PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. HAS THAT ANALYSIS BEEN

DONE AS TO KNOW WHAT THAT DIFFERENCE IS THROUGHOUT THE STATE, IS

ULTIMATELY MY QUESTION.

MS. PAULIN: I WOULD IMAGINE THAT, YOU KNOW, IF I

WERE FROM ROCKLAND, I WOULD BE SAYING "YAY" TO THIS, RIGHT?

MR. MCGOWAN: WELL, I'M NOT SAYING "YAY" FOR

OTHER REASONS, BUT THIS IS A -- HEY, NICE BENEFITS, SO BUT OKAY. SO, SO

THAT ANALYSIS HASN'T BEEN DONE AS TO KNOW IF THAT SCENARIO PLAYS OUT

WHAT THE COST DIFFERENCE --

MS. PAULIN: NO. WHICH COUNTIES ARE GOING TO SAVE

MORE, WHICH ARE NOT, NO, NO.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. IS THAT SOMETHING THAT YOU

THINK MAYBE WE SHOULD DO? AGAIN, NOT TO USE THE HORSE ANALOGY AGAIN,

BUT ON THAT IDEA OF PUTTING THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE, IS THAT SOMETHING

YOU THINK MAYBE SHOULD'VE BEEN DONE IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ACTUAL,

YOU KNOW, FISCAL IMPACT IS ONE OF THE REASONS THAT YOU SAID TO JUSTIFY

DOING THIS IN THE FIRST PLACE WAS SAVING MONEY.

MS. PAULIN: I THINK THAT SAVING MONEY IS

WORTHWHILE EVEN IF IT'S NOT IN MY COUNTY AND IT HAPPENS TO BE IN YOURS.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. MAYBE, BUT AGAIN, NOT TO

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BEAT A DEAD HORSE BUT THAT --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THAT WAS YESTERDAY.

MR. MCGOWAN: ALL RIGHT. I'M DONE. THAT WAS THE

LAST ONE, THAT WAS THE LAST ONE I PROMISE. IT'S GETTING LATE SO... BUT

AGAIN, I GUESS MY ONLY QUESTION IS, IN YOUR OPINION, DO YOU THINK THAT

THAT WOULD'VE BE A WORTHWHILE ENDEAVOR TO DO THAT ANALYSIS BEFORE WE

GOT TO THIS POINT WHERE (INAUDIBLE/CROSS-TALK) --

MS. PAULIN: I THINK IF WE WERE TALKING ABOUT

INCREASING COST, MAYBE YOU COULD ARGUE THAT, BUT NOT WHEN YOU'RE

TALKING ABOUT DECREASING. EVERYBODY IS JUST SO HAPPY EVEN IF IT'S A

LITTLE. SO I'M NOT -- NO. I DON'T THINK IF WE ANTICIPATE -- WE KNOW WHAT

AN ELECTION COSTS AND EACH COUNTY KNOWS WHAT AN ELECTION COSTS. THEY

KNOW WHAT THEY'RE SAVING IF THEY DON'T HAVE TO DO IT. AND IT COULD BE A

LOT AS WE JUST SAW WITH NASSAU COUNTY. WHEN WE BRING NASSAU

COUNTY IN LINE THEY'RE GOING TO BE SAVING A LOT OF MONEY.

MR. MCGOWAN: EXCEPT, MS. PAULIN, RESPECTFULLY,

YOU TALK ABOUT $2.6 MILLION IN SAVINGS BUT WHEN YOU THOUGHT THAT THEY

DIDN'T HAVE CITIES AND IT TURNS OUT THEY DO. SO I JUST --

MS. PAULIN: BUT -- BUT REMEMBER. MOST OF

NASSAU, NASSAU IS PRETTY BIG, I MEAN IT'S -- IT'S PRETTY BIG. SO THERE'S

GOING TO BE A LOT OF PLACES IN NASSAU THAT THEY DON'T HAVE A CITY. SO

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE TO PUT POLLING PLACES IN ALL THOSE OTHER PLACES,

JUST IN THAT AREA THAT HAS A CITY.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT IT'S A COUNTY COST.

MS. PAULIN: IT IS STILL GOING TO COST THEM. NO, IT'S

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NOT - THEY'RE GOING -- THEY'RE GOING TO SAVE A LOT OF MONEY.

MR. MCGOWAN: BUT WE'RE -- WE'RE KIND OF

GUESSING, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: WELL WE'RE NOT GUESSING THAT THEY'RE

GOING TO SAVE MONEY. WE'RE JUST GUESSING AS TO HOW MUCH.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. I, RESPECTFULLY, I'M NOT SURE

I AGREE WITH YOU ON THAT POINT BUT I'M MOVING ON. COUNTY LEGISLATORS,

RIGHT. MY COUNTY, I WAS A FORMER COUNTY LEGISLATOR IN ROCKLAND. THE

GOAL WOULD BE TO LINE-UP IN HOWEVER IT FALLS, RIGHT? BUT IN A GIVEN

EVEN YEAR, GIVEN EVEN YEAR, PRESIDENTIAL OR GUBERNATORIAL, CONGRESS OR

SENATE AND THEN COUNTY OFFICE, RIGHT, SO COUNTY LEGISLATORS --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: -- WILL BE INCLUDED, ALL THE WAY

DOWN SUPERVISORS, TOWN SUPERVISORS, BOARD MEMBERS, EVERYONE

ESSENTIALLY, RIGHT --

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: -- CLERKS, THE WHOLE THING, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT

INCREASED NUMBERS IN THOSE EVEN YEARS WHERE WE HAVE PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTIONS, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: MM-HMM.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND HAVING LESS VOTER TURNOUT IN

THE ODD NUMBER YEARS WHEN IT'S JUST A LOCAL ISSUE, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: YES. YES.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. MCGOWAN: DO WE KNOW, THOUGH, IF IT'S

SAYING -- JUST USING SMALLER NUMBERS SO IT'S EASY, 25 VOTERS SHOW UP IN

AN ODD NUMBER YEAR AND THEN THE EVEN NUMBER YEAR MAYBE 100 SHOW

UP.

MS. PAULIN: RIGHT.

MR. MCGOWAN: DO WE KNOW IF THOSE 25 ARE PART

OF THAT 100 OR IS IT WELL, IF YOU BUNCH THEM ALL INTO THE SAME YEAR IT'S

ACTUALLY GOING TO BE 125; DO WE KNOW THAT?

MS. PAULIN: HAVING WALKED A LOT IN MY 23 YEARS IN

THIS JOB, I CAN TELL YOU THAT YES, USUALLY WHEN SOMEONE IS A VOTER IN THE

ODD YEAR, THEY'RE A VOTER IN THE EVEN YEAR. IT'S NOT THE OTHER WAY

AROUND.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO THAT 25 IS PROBABLY WITHIN THAT

GROUP THAT SHOWS UP --

MS. PAULIN: SO THEY'LL VOTE AND THEN THE OTHER 75

WILL VOTE.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. AND WOULD YOU AGREE WITH

ME THAT PEOPLE ARE PROBABLY MORE, THE AVERAGE PERSON IS MORE

KNOWLEDGEABLE OR HAS AWARENESS OF FEDERAL ISSUES, PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTIONS, THEN PERHAPS LOCAL ISSUES AND THAT COULD BE THE REASON WHY

MORE PEOPLE SHOW UP ON A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR THAN IN A LOCAL YEAR ONLY,

CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: IT'S POSSIBLE, I DON'T KNOW. I CAN'T GET

INTO THEIR MINDS BECAUSE I VOTE ALL THE TIME.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY. WELL, YOU SAID YOU'VE BEEN

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AROUND -- IN 23 YEARS YOU'VE KNOCKED ON DOORS, RIGHT?

MS. PAULIN: YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND HAVE YOU HAD THE OCCASION TO

KNOCK ON A DOOR AND SOMEONE WANTS TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT SOMETHING

THAT YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OVER LIKE THE FEDERAL ISSUE, HAVE YOU HAD THAT

EXPERIENCE?

MS. PAULIN: I HAVE HAD THE EXPERIENCE, YES.

MR. MCGOWAN: AND THE SAME WAY, YOU KNOW,

RATHER THAN THE FEDERAL LEVEL, PERHAPS A SOLELY LOCAL ISSUE, OH, YOU'RE AN

ELECTED OFFICIAL, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT SOMETHING

THAT'S SOLELY BETWEEN YOUR TOWN OR VILLAGE THAT YOU DON'T NECESSARILY

HAVE CONTROL OVER. YOU'VE HAD THAT EXPERIENCE AS WELL, CORRECT?

MS. PAULIN: YES, OF COURSE.

MR. MCGOWAN: OKAY, ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU, MS.

PAULIN. I APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

MR. SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. MCGOWAN: SO I LOOK AT THIS, I'VE LISTENED TO

THE DEBATE TONIGHT AND I APPRECIATE THE SPEAKER, I'M SORRY, I APPRECIATE

THE SPEAKER OF COURSE. I APPRECIATE THE SPONSOR AND HER COMMENTS AND

HER RESPONSES TO MY COLLEAGUES' QUESTIONS BUT ULTIMATELY I'M LEFT VERY

REALLY KIND OF UNSATISFIED WITH WHERE WE ARE AND WHY WE'RE HERE AT THIS

POINT WITH THIS BILL. THERE'S A LOT OF UNKNOWNS. THERE'S A LOT LEFT TO BE

DECIDED, THERE'S A LOT -- WHEN WE'RE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH THE GOALS OF

SAVING MONEY OR REDUCING COSTS, WE DON'T REALLY HAVE A CLEAR ANSWER

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ON THAT. WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT UNIFORMITY ACROSS ALL ELECTIONS,

WELL, THAT'S NOT REALLY UP TO US BECAUSE TO DO THAT, TO BRING THE CITIES

INTO THIS, IT'S GOING TO REQUIRE THE VOTERS TO WEIGH IN. AND WE DON'T

KNOW HOW THAT'S GOING TO GO. AND THAT'S ALSO A FEW YEARS DOWN THE

LINE BECAUSE OF THE PROCESS REQUIRED IN ORDER TO PASS A CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENT. SO TO ME THERE'S A LOT OF UNKNOWNS AND RESPECTFULLY I'LL

BE IN THE NEGATIVE ON THIS BILL. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: I'M REMINDED THAT

YOU ARE THE LAST TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM.

MR. GOODELL: LOOK AT THAT BIG GRIN ON MS.

PAULIN'S FACE.

ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, SIR.

MR. GOODELL: THE REAL ISSUE ON THIS BILL, IN MY

OPINION, IS A TOTAL LACK OF RESPECT FOR OUR LOCAL OFFICIALS. THIS CHANGE

IN THE ELECTION SCHEDULE DOESN'T AFFECT A SINGLE ONE OF US. WE'RE

ALREADY ELECTED ON -- ON EVEN YEARS. IT DOESN'T AFFECT US AT ALL, DOES IT?

IT DOESN'T AFFECT THE SENATORS. IT DOESN'T AFFECT ANY STATEWIDE ELECTED

OFFICIAL. SO THIS IS A BILL THAT ONLY AFFECTS LOCAL GOVERNMENT. AND

EVERY ONE OF US I HOPE KNOWS THAT LOCAL GOVERNMENT HAS THE POWER

ALREADY TO CHANGE THEIR SCHEDULE AND THEY HAVEN'T. WE WERE TOLD

TONIGHT THAT WE WERE NOT ASKED BY COUNTY GOVERNMENTS TO OVERRIDE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THEIR LOCAL CONTROL AND CHANGE THEIR SCHEDULE, WE WERE TOLD THAT. AND

WE WERE TOLD WE WERE NOT ASKED BY THE TOWN SUPERVISORS OR THEIR

ASSOCIATION TO OVERRIDE THEIR GOVERNMENT AND MANDATE A DIFFERENT

SCHEDULE. AND WE WEREN'T TOLD BY THE HIGHWAY SUPERINTENDENTS

ASSOCIATION THAT THEY WANTED TO BE ELECTED IN A DIFFERENT SCHEDULE. IN

FACT, WE HAVEN'T BEEN ASKED BY ANY LOCAL OFFICIALS, AS FAR AS I KNOW, FOR

US TO DICTATE TO THEM WHEN THEY SHOULD RUN FOR OFFICE. SO IF NO ONE ON

THE LOCAL LEVEL, NOT OUR COUNTY EXECUTIVES, NOT OUR COUNTY LEGISLATORS,

NOT OUR TOWN SUPERVISORS, NOT OUR TOWN COUNCIL MEMBERS, NO ONE ON

THE LOCAL LEVEL IS ASKING US TO CHANGE OUR ELECTION SCHEDULE, WHY DO WE

FEEL COMPELLED TO IGNORE THEIR WISHES AND IMPOSE A SCHEDULE ON THEM

THAT THEY DON'T WANT? WHY? NOW WE KNOW IT'S NOT GOING TO ELIMINATE

THE ELECTIONS IN THE OPPOSITE YEAR BECAUSE JUDGES AND COUNTY CLERKS

AND SHERIFFS AND DAS ARE STILL RUNNING AND CITY PEOPLE ARE STILL RUNNING

SO WE'RE NOT ELIMINATING ANY ELECTION CYCLE. WE KNOW THAT. WE'RE TOLD

THAT. IT'S NOT AN ISSUE. SO IF WE DON'T HAVE A PROMISE THAT HAS BEEN

BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION BY THE LOCAL OFFICIALS AND THE LOCAL OFFICIALS

DON'T NEED US TO ACT BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO IT ON

THEIR OWN AND WE'RE NOT ELIMINATING ANY ELECTION CYCLES, WHY ARE WE

SPENDING FOUR-AND-A-HALF HOURS ON THIS DEBATE? WHY ARE WE DOING IT?

WOULDN'T OUR TIME BE BETTER SPENT FOCUSING ON HOW WE CAN ADDRESS

PROBLEMS THAT ARE BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION BY LOCAL OFFICIALS RATHER THAN

SHOVING OUR WILL DOWN THEIR THROATS? I THINK WE NEED TO RESPECT OUR

LOCAL OFFICIALS, I THINK WE NEED A LITTLE BIT OF HUMILITY. I'D HATE TO GO

BACK AND ACTUALLY LOOK AT THE LANGUAGE OF THE BILL AFTER FOUR HOURS OF

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

DEBATE. BUT I WILL POINT OUT, THAT UNDER THIS BILL, PEOPLE WHO RUN THIS

YEAR, THIS YEAR, UNDER THIS BILL FOR A TWO-YEAR TERM, THOSE FOLKS WILL

HAVE TO RUN AGAIN NEXT YEAR. THAT'S WHAT THIS BILL LANGUAGE SAYS. SO

WHEN YOU GO HOME, AND I HOPE ALL OF YOU REGULARLY MEET WITH YOUR

MAYORS AND SUPERVISORS AND YOUR -- YOUR TOWN BOARDS AND YOUR COUNTY

LEGISLATORS, LET THEM KNOW THAT ALL OF THEM THAT ARE RUNNING THIS YEAR FOR

A TWO-YEAR TERM ARE GOING TO BE RUNNING NEXT YEAR. AND LET THEM KNOW

THAT THEY'RE GOING TO RUN BACK-TO-BACK ELECTIONS OVER THEIR OBJECTIONS

BECAUSE WE'RE SHOVING IT DOWN THEIR THROAT. WE DON'T NEED TO DO THIS,

NOR SHOULD WE. AND FOR THAT REASON I WON'T BE SUPPORTING IT. AND I

RECOMMEND THAT ALL OF US RESPECT ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS FOR

ALL OF OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS WHICH IS THEIR OWN ELECTION AND THEIR OWN

ELECTION SCHEDULE, BECAUSE WHEN THEY FIND OUT THAT YOU EXERCISED YOUR

AUTHORITY WITHOUT THEIR CONSENT AND WITHOUT THEIR REQUEST AND WITHOUT

THEIR PERMISSION THEY WILL UNDERSTANDABLY AND CORRECTLY BE UPSET. AND

FOR THAT REASON I'M VOTING NO AND I'D RECOMMEND, OUT OF A SENSE OF

HUMILITY AND RESPECT, THAT WE LET THEM DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES THEIR

SCHEDULE FOR THEIR ELECTION. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK -- A PARTY

VOTE HAS BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THE

REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE IS OPPOSED TO THIS LEGISLATION. IF THERE'S

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SOMEONE WHO WANTS TO VOTE FOR IT, THEY CAN CERTAINLY DO SO HERE ON THE

FLOOR. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER. THE MAJORITY DEMOCRATIC CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY GONNA BE

IN FAVOR OF THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION; HOWEVER, THERE MAY BE SOME OF US

WHO WOULD DESIRE TO BE AN EXCEPTION, THEY SHOULD FEEL FREE TO DO SO AT

THEIR SEAT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

THE CLERK WILL RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. PIROZZOLO.

MR. PIROZZOLO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I

WOULD LIKE AN OPPORTUNITY TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. SO, THERE'S A LOT OF

CONFLICTING INFORMATION THAT WE HEARD HERE, AND ACTUALLY JUST BETWEEN

THE LAST DIALOGUE BETWEEN OUR FELLOW MEMBERS. SO, WE'RE TOLD THAT THIS

IS TO INCREASE PARTICIPATION, YET NOTHING EXTRA'S BEEN PURCHASED, BUT IT'S

REALLY NOT TO INCREASE PARTICIPATION, IT'S TO INCREASE PARTICIPATION IN

LOCAL VOTES THAT WILL BE -- ON LOCAL ELECTIONS THAT WILL BE HELD ON THIS

DAY. SO I THINK THAT HAS KIND OF GONE BACK AND FORTH. I DO TAKE

EXCEPTION TO THE FACT THAT WE KEEP ASKING HOW MUCH, HOW MUCH, HOW

MUCH, WE DON'T GET AN ANSWER, WE DON'T GET AN ANSWER. THE DEBATE IS

PRETTY MUCH OVER AND I GET AN ANSWER OF $2.6 MILLION. WELL, SO MANY

OTHER THINGS ARE FULL OF HOLES. I BELIEVE THIS $2.6 MILLION IS PROBABLY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FULL OF HOLES, TOO, AND THE USEFULNESS OF THIS $2.6 MILLION AT THIS POINT

IN THE GAME IS NOT VERY USEFUL TO ME BECAUSE I CERTAINLY DON'T HAVE AN

OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK ABOUT IT.

MY COLLEAGUES ARE VERY UPSET BECAUSE THEY FEEL THAT

THEIR LOCAL ELECTIONS CAN BE SKEWED, AND IT'S NOT WHAT THEY WANT TO DO

AS FAR AS WHAT THEIR VILLAGES AND THEIR TOWNS ARE DOING, AND THEY FEEL

THAT WE'RE STEPPING ON THEM BY DOING THIS AND THAT IT MIGHT GREATLY

AFFECT THE AMOUNT OF REPRESENTATIVES THAT WE HAVE HERE FROM THEIR

VILLAGES AND TOWNS. I THINK WE NEED TO RESPECT THEM. THE CITY IS NOT

DOING THIS BECAUSE IT'S PROBABLY TOO BIG, SO WE ARE EXERCISING OUR

MUSCLE, WE'RE FLEXING OUR MUSCLE BY PUTTING IT ON THE NECKS OF -- OF THE

UPSTATE AND THE LONG ISLAND REPRESENTATIVES.

SO I STAND WITH THEM IF THEY'RE UNHAPPY WITH THIS, AND

I THINK IT'S A BAD IDEA. AND AS I SAID BEFORE, I'M NOT GOING TO ASK MY

COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE AISLE BECAUSE SO FEW OF THEM ARE

HERE -- ARE NOT HERE. THE ONES THAT ARE HERE ARE PROBABLY NOT LISTENING

TO WHAT I HAVE TO SAY, AND - AND I FEEL THAT THE -- THE CAKE IS ALREADY

BAKED, WE ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE OUTCOME IS --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: SO MR. PIROZZOLO, WE

EARLIER TALKED ABOUT NOT CHARACTERIZING WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE DOING.

YOU'RE SPEAKING TO YOUR POSITION ON THE BILL, RIGHT? IT WAS SOMETHING

YOUR SIDE REQUESTED AND REMINDED US.

MR. PIROZZOLO: I (INAUDIBLE) AND I DO APOLOGIZE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU VERY

MUCH. GO AHEAD.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. PIROZZOLO: WELL ANYWAY, I'M -- I'M VOTING IN

THE NEGATIVE AND I WILL TRY NOT TO LET THAT HAPPEN AGAIN. I APOLOGIZE TO

MY COLLEAGUES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. SLATER TO EXPLAIN

HIS VOTE.

MR. SLATER: WELL, THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. NOW

THAT WE'RE ALL WARMED UP, I FIGURED I'D ALSO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. YOU

KNOW, DURING THE QUESTIONING OF THE DEBATE, THE SPONSOR -- WHO I TRULY

APPRECIATE TAKING SO MUCH TIME AND RESPECT HER FOR SPENDING SO MUCH

TIME ON THIS ISSUE -- SAID SHE HAD NOT RECEIVED ANY MEMOS FROM LOCAL

MUNICIPALITIES OR COUNTIES ASKING FOR THIS TO BE DONE. IT'S IRONIC,

BECAUSE SINCE SITTING HERE TODAY, I'VE BEEN SENT CORRESPONDENCE FROM A

MULTITUDE OF TOWNS AND MUNICIPALITIES IN WESTCHESTER COUNTY AND

PUTNAM COUNTY, REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS, WHO ARE ALL OPPOSING

THIS VERY LAW. THEY RECOGNIZE THE TREMENDOUS IMPACT IT'LL HAVE ON

LOCAL ISSUES, AND ONE EVEN SAYS, ONE OF THE BEST THINGS ABOUT -- ONE OF

THE BEST THINGS ABOUT LOCAL POLITICS IS THAT THEY ARE NOT IN PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTION YEARS. THIS ALLOWS THE DISCUSSION OF LOCAL ISSUES WITHOUT

DRAGGING INTO NATIONAL ISSUES.

MY BIGGEST CONCERN IS THAT THIS IS JUST ANOTHER CHAPTER

OF THE CONTINUED STORY OF ALBANY. WE'RE MASKING POLITICAL ACTION AS

POOR PUBLIC POLICY. IF WE WANT TO MAKE CHANGES ON THE LOCAL LEVEL,

THEN I ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES HERE, THEN GO RUN FOR OFFICE ON THE

LOCAL LEVEL. BUT TO SIT HERE AND STRIP LOCAL CONTROL AWAY WITHOUT EVEN

HAVING A PROPER DISCUSSION IN COLLABORATION WITH OUR COLLEAGUES ON THE

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LOCAL LEVEL IS WRONG.

I'LL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU, MR.

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. MAHER.

MR. MAHER: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. MY

COLLEAGUE, MR. GOODELL, HAD A GREAT POINT AND THAT WAS TO ENSURE AND

RESPECT THE VOICES OF OUR LOCAL OFFICIALS. SO WITH THAT SAID, I GOT A

NUMBER, DOZENS OF LOCAL OFFICIALS AND BOARD OF ELECTIONS EMPLOYEES

THAT REACHED OUT TO ME, SO I WANTED TO SPEAK ON A FEW OF THEIR POINTS

THAT THEY WERE MAKING AND GIVE THEM THIS TIME.

THE FIRST IS A BOARD OF ELECTIONS COMMISSIONER FROM

ORANGE COUNTY, AND ONE THOUGHT THAT -- ONE SPECIFIC STATEMENT THAT SHE

HAD WAS THAT THIS IS NOT PRACTICAL FROM AN ELECTIONS STANDPOINT IN

OPERATIONS. THAT'S COMING FROM THE PEOPLE THAT DO THIS EVERY DAY.

AND THE ULSTER COUNTY BOARD OF ELECTIONS COMMISSIONER SAYS IT'S

GOING TO MAKE IT HARDER, NOT EASIER, TO GET ELECTION INSPECTORS, AND

AGAIN, SOME CONFUSION AS TO HOW THIS BILL WILL -- THE BALLOT WILL EVEN

LOOK. ONE AREA IN ULSTER COUNTY IS A -- IS A -- ULSTER COUNTY

LEGISLATIVE MAJORITY LEADER, LOCAL ELECTIONS MATTER. THERE IS NOT A

REPUBLICAN OR DEMOCRAT WAY TO PAVE ROADS OR CLOSE -- PLOW SNOW.

MOVING LOCAL ELECTIONS TO EVEN-NUMBERED YEARS WILL INCREASE

PARTISANSHIP OF LOCAL ELECTIONS. AND ANOTHER FROM A TOWN SUPERVISOR,

OUR SMALL TOWNS AND OUR LOCAL ISSUES ARE GOING TO BE LOST IN THE SHUFFLE

IF THIS BILL IS PASSED. THINK ABOUT ALL THE CONGRESSIONAL AND STATE

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CANDIDATES' LAWN SIGNS ON TOP OF THE LOCAL CANDIDATES' LAWN SIGNS AND

MAIL AND PHONE CALLS. OUR VOICES ARE IMPORTANT, AND TO TRY TO

MINIMIZE LOCAL GOVERNMENT IN THIS WAY IS UNCONSCIONABLE.

I JUST WANT TO ADD THAT ALTHOUGH THIS IS ALL VERY

POINTED, I DO WANT TO SAY THANK YOU AND APPRECIATE THE SPONSOR FOR

SPENDING SO MUCH TIME ON HER FEET ANSWERING ALL OF OUR QUESTIONS.

I WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MR. BEEPHAN.

MR. BEEPHAN: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I HAVE

HAD THE PRIVILEGE, LIKE MANY OF YOU HERE IN THIS ROOM, TO SERVE ON A

LOCAL LEVEL OF GOVERNMENT. THAT GAVE ME THE OPPORTUNITY DURING OUR

DOOR-TO-DOOR INITIATIVES TO TALK ABOUT KEY ISSUES THAT IMPACTED MY

COMMUNITY, LIKE INFRASTRUCTURE, ROADWAY IMPROVEMENTS, ECONOMIC

DEVELOPMENT, THE FACT THAT PEOPLE WANT MORE THAN JUST A CHINESE

RESTAURANT IN OUR TOWN. BUT THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT IMPACT THE LOCAL

TOWNS. AND AFTER RUNNING FOR STATE OFFICE LAST YEAR, THE CONVERSATIONS

ARE DIFFERENT BEING ON A MIDTERM YEAR OR A PRESIDENTIAL YEAR. PEOPLE

ARE ASKING YOUR VIEWS ON WHO YOU'RE GONNA VOTE FOR FOR THE PRESIDENT,

PEOPLE ARE DISTRACTED AWAY FROM THE MAIN FOCUS OF YOUR LOCAL

MUNICIPALITIES. I SPOKE TO ALL NINE OF MY TOWNS TODAY AND ASKED THEM

WHAT THEY THOUGHT ABOUT THIS BILL, INCLUDING MY COUNTY GOVERNMENT,

AND ALL OF THEM ARE OPPOSED. YOU KNOW, THERE'S NO HOME RULE ON THAT

BOARD. AND LIKE THE SPONSOR MENTIONED, THERE WAS NO SUPPORT LETTER

FROM ANY MUNICIPALITIES ASKING FOR THIS.

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AND WITH THAT, I CAN'T SUPPORT A BILL THAT MY OWN

MUNICIPALITIES CAN'T SUPPORT, EITHER. I ASK THAT NEW YORK STATE LEAVE

THE LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES AS IT IS, IT IS WHAT'S BEST FOR OUR COMMUNITIES.

MR. SPEAKER, I'LL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU, SIR.

MS. GIGLIO.

MS. GIGLIO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL.

MS. GIGLIO: SO, I'M NOT SURE WHY THIS IS BEING

RUSHED THROUGH TWO DAYS BEFORE THE END OF SESSION. IN THIS CHAMBER

EVERY DAY, OR ONE DAY BEFORE THE END OF SESSION BECAUSE TOMORROW IS

OUR LAST DAY, SO IT'S -- YOU KNOW, WE STUDY EVERYTHING, WE TALK ABOUT

HEALTH EMERGENCIES AND HOW WE HAVE TO BE PREPARED, WE HAVE TO BE

READY. WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE OUR HOSPITALS HAVE THE PROPER PPE, GOD

FORBID WE HAVE ANOTHER EVENT LIKE COVID. WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, BE

PREPARED, HAVE VACCINE REGISTRIES. WE HAVE TO KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING

OUT THERE. BUT WITH OUR ELECTIONS WE'RE TAKING A WAIT AND SEE ATTITUDE?

THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS IS GOING TO HAVE EXTRA BALLOTS, THEY'RE GOING TO

NEED EXTRA BOOTHS FOR VOTERS, THEY'RE GOING TO NEED EXTRA PEOPLE AND

THEY'RE ALREADY HAVING PROBLEMS AS IT IS, TRYING TO FILL THE POLLING PLACES

WITH WORKERS TO ACCOMMODATE THE PEOPLE. THE POST OFFICES ARE GOING

TO BE INUNDATED. I DON'T KNOW ABOUT ANY OF YOU, BUT I HAVE A P.O. BOX,

AND EVERY SINGLE TIME DURING ELECTION YEAR, YOU SEE ALL THE CAMPAIGN

LITERATURE IN THE GARBAGE. BUT AT LEAST NOW OUR CAMPAIGN LITERATURE WILL

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SAY THAT IT MUST BE RECYCLED, SO IT'LL GO INTO THE RIGHT BIN, HOPEFULLY.

HOMEOWNERS ARE GOING TO BE INUNDATED WITH

COMMITTEE MEMBERS ASKING THEM TO SIGN PAGES AND PAGES AND PAGES OF

PETITIONS WITH MANY CANDIDATES, AND THEN KNOCKING ON DOORS, MANY --

AND ALL THE CANDIDATES KNOCKING ON PEOPLE'S DOORS ASKING FOR THEIR

ATTENTION ON THE ISSUES THAT THEY THINK ARE MOST IMPORTANT TO THEIR

CONSTITUENTS.

YOU KNOW, WE TALK ABOUT LOCAL CONTROL. WE -- WE

ADOPTED A BILL TWO DAYS AGO THAT SAID THAT LOCALITIES SHOULD HAVE

CONTROL AS TO WHETHER OR NOT PESTICIDES ARE SPRAYED IN THEIR FRESHWATER

WETLANDS. WE CONSTANTLY SHIFT FROM THE STATE AND GIVE POWER BACK TO

THE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, AND IN THIS CASE WE'RE TAKING THE POWER AWAY.

WE -- WE TALK ABOUT OFTEN ABOUT THE OUTCOMES OF ELECTIONS AND HOW

IMPORTANT IT IS TO GET PEOPLE OUT TO VOTE. IF WE CARE ABOUT OUTCOMES OF

ELECTIONS, WE SHOULD TAKE TIME TO PLAN PROPERLY AND BE READY.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. PALMESANO.

MR. PALMESANO: YES, MR. SPEAKER, TO EXPLAIN

MY VOTE. FIRST, I JUST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU TO MY COLLEAGUES ON OUR

SIDE OF THE AISLE FOR THE WONDERFUL JOB YOU DID TONIGHT DEBATING THIS

BILL, POINTING OUT THE PROBLEMS IN THIS MISGUIDED LEGISLATION. I FIGURED

I'D ALSO GIVE YOU GUYS A BREAK FROM LISTENING TO ME FOR ASKING A BUNCH

OF QUESTIONS FOR AWHILE. ALSO, I KNOW THE -- I HAVE GREAT RESPECT FOR

THE SPONSOR, BUT VEHEMENTLY DISAGREE WITH HER ON THIS LEGISLATION.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FROM MY PERSPECTIVE, THIS IS PURELY A POLITICAL POWER GRAB OF ONE-PARTY

RULE. I BELIEVE IT'S NOT -- IT'S NOT ABOUT INCREASING VOTER PARTICIPATION,

BUT WE ALL KNOW THAT. THIS IS A VIOLATION OF THE CONSTITUTION, FROM MY

PERSPECTIVE, A VIOLATION OF A HOME RULE AUTHORITY AND THE ABILITY FOR

LOCAL GOVERNMENTS TO MAKE DECISIONS ON HOW TO HANDLE THEIR LOCAL

ELECTIONS. BUT THIS IS JUST PAR FOR THE COURSE WHERE THE STATE SAYS THEY

KNOW BEST. THEY DID IT WHEN THEY TOOK AWAY LOCAL CONTROL FROM LOCAL

GOVERNMENTS DEALING WITH THE SITING OF RENEWABLE ENERGY PROJECTS, AT

THE SAME TIME CHANGING THE ASSESSMENT MODEL THAT HURT LOCAL

GOVERNMENTS AND LOCAL TAXPAYERS. YOU KNOW, THERE WAS AN EFFORT TO DO

THIS WITH HOUSING. NOW, HERE WE DO IT WITH LOCAL CONTROL OF ELECTIONS

FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES, IS ALL. WE ALL KNOW IT SO DON'T KID YOURSELF.

YOU KNOW, DURING THE DEBATE I HEARD THE SPONSOR SAY

THE LOCALS HAVE -- HAVEN'T MOVED ON THIS, SO WE BASICALLY NEED TO MOVE

FOR THEM. LOCALS DON'T WANT IT, THAT'S WHY THEY HAVEN'T MOVED ON IT. I

ALSO HEARD THE SPONSOR SAY WE'RE A REPRESENTATIVE FORM OF GOVERNMENT;

YES, WE ARE. BUT THIS IS NOT WHAT REPRESENTING WHAT LOCALS WANT, THIS IS

DICTATED TO LOCALS WHAT YOU WANT AND WHAT ONE-PARTY CONTROL IN ALBANY

WANTS. I BELIEVE IT'S AN ABUSE OF POWER AND IT'S WRONG.

I ALSO HEARD THE -- THE SPONSOR SAY THEY HAVE FAITH IN

THE VOTERS. BUT BEFORE THAT DURING THE DEBATE, I HEARD COMMENTS

SAYING VOTERS DON'T KNOW ABOUT THEIR LOCAL ELECTIONS BECAUSE THEY DON'T

PARTICIPATE. I JUST THINK THAT'S WRONG. THIS IS GOING TO LEAD TO VOTER

CONFUSION, IT'S GOING TO BE A STRESS ON OUR LOCAL BOARDS OF ELECTIONS.

IT'S NOT GONNA TO SAVE COSTS, IT'S GONNA END UP BEING AN UNFUNDED

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MANDATE FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS. NOW LOCAL ELECTIONS ARE GOING TO GET

CAUGHT UP IN NATIONAL ISSUES, WHICH THEY DON'T WANT. THAT'S WHY THEY

HAVE LOCAL ELECTIONS THAT SEPARATE THEMSELVES FROM THE NATIONAL

POLITICS, NOW THEY'RE GONNA BE CAUGHT UP WITH ALL THAT. THAT'S NOT WHAT

THEY WANT. AND IT'S QUITE CONVENIENT HOW THIS BILL EXEMPTS NEW YORK

CITY AND OTHER CITIES. IT'S WRONG AND I JUST THINK THIS IS A SAD DAY IN

THIS CHAMBER IN HOW WE'RE MOVING FORWARD ON THIS LEGISLATION.

I VOTE NO.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. LAVINE.

MR. LAVINE: THANKS. I -- I WANT TO TAKE AN

OPPORTUNITY TO THANK THE SPONSOR FOR PUSHING FOR THIS BILL, FIGHTING FOR

THIS BILL, AND HANDLING A LOT OF QUESTIONS. AND I GET TO SIT BEHIND THE

SPONSOR AND I WAS TRYING TO UNDERSTAND SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS AND

SOME OF THEM WERE BEYOND ME.

I COME OUT OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT. I WAS ON MY CITY

COUNCIL, I WAS ATTORNEY FOR THE CITY, ATTORNEY FOR AN IDA, A CDA. I

TRUST THE VOTERS. WHAT I HAVE HEARD THAT TROUBLES ME DURING THE COURSE

OF THIS DISCUSSION IS THERE'S A CERTAIN CONTEMPT FOR THE CAPACITY AND THE

ABILITY OF THE VOTERS TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON. AND I ALMOST SENSE THAT

THERE'S MORE COMPASSION FOR SOME PEOPLE ABOUT THOSE ELECTED IN LOCAL

GOVERNMENT THAN THERE IS SYMPATHY OR CONCERN FROM THE ACTUAL

CITIZENS. I TRUST THE VOTERS. AND I ALSO THINK THAT ANYTHING WE CAN DO

TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR OUR CITIZENS TO VOTE, THE BETTER OFF WE WILL ALL BE.

AND THAT'S SIMPLY WHAT THIS BILL DOES.

I'M VERY HAPPY TO VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE. AND ALSO,

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JUST BY THE WAY, IF MY MEMORY SERVES ME CORRECT FROM WHEN I WAS

CHAIR OF THE ELECTIONS LAW COMMITTEE, I THINK A STATEWIDE ELECTION IS

A WHOLE LOT MORE THAN $2.5 MILLION, AND YOU CAN MULTIPLY BY THAT MANY

MULTIPLIERS. A STATEWIDE ELECTION HAS GOT TO RUN SOMEWHERE TODAY AND

-- TO AT LEAST $40 MILLION, IF NOT MORE. SO IN THE END WE WILL SAVE

MONEY FOR THE TAXPAYERS AND WE WILL SIMPLY MAKE IT EASIER FOR THE

PEOPLE WHO COUNT, THE VOTERS, TO GO TO THE POLLS AND CAST THEIR BALLOTS.

I'M VERY HAPPY TO VOTE IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. RA.

MR. RA: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. SO, THERE'S

BEEN A LOT OF TALK ABOUT SAVING MONEY, AND -- AND I'M GLAD THE RECORD

WAS CORRECTED EARLIER, WE DO HAVE TWO CITIES IN -- IN NASSAU COUNTY.

WE HAVE THE CITY OF LONG BEACH AND THE CITY OF GLEN COVE. SO THOSE

WILL OBVIOUSLY BE ELECTIONS THAT WILL HAVE TO BE CONDUCTED BY OUR

BOARD OF ELECTIONS. BUT OVERALL ON THE CONCEPT OF SAVING MONEY,

WE'VE ALREADY SAID, RIGHT, THERE'S THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS THAT WILL

STILL BE UP FOR ELECTION. THERE ARE JUDICIAL CANDIDATES THAT WILL STILL BE

UP FOR ELECTION. SO ALL THESE ELECTIONS WILL STILL NEED TO BE RUN. ARE WE

TALKING ABOUT REDUCING THE NEED FOR EARLY VOTING DAYS IN THOSE -- IN

THOSE OFF YEARS, OR LESS POLLING PLACES OR ANYTHING? NO. THE COST WILL

BE EXACTLY THE SAME. IT'S NOT GONNA SAVE ANY MONEY. AND WE KNOW

THAT IF THEY HAVE TO INCREASE THEIR CAPACITY BECAUSE OF THE AMOUNT OF

THINGS ON THE BALLOT, THE POTENTIAL FOR NEW -- NEW TYPES OF BALLOTS, I

CAN'T IMAGINE SOMETHING MORE CONFUSING THAN SOMEBODY HANDING THEM

TWO PAGES OF A BALLOT? THEY'RE GOING TO GET CONFUSED AS ALL HECK.

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THEY'RE GOING TO SAY, OH, YOU GAVE ME TWO. THEY'RE GONNA LEAVE -- I

MEAN, IT -- IT IS NOT GONNA BE GOOD FOR -- FOR VOTERS IN TERMS OF THEIR

CONFUSION AND THEIR UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THEY'RE VOTING FOR. AND LIKE

WE SAID EARLIER, THE LOCAL ISSUES ARE GOING TO GET SWALLOWED WHOLE.

LASTLY, I WANT TO SAY, AND MY COLLEAGUE SAID IT AS WELL,

WHAT MESSAGE DOES THIS CHAMBER CONTINUE TO SEND TO OUR COUNTIES AND

LOCAL GOVERNMENTS? WE WANT TO TAKE AWAY YOUR ZONING CONTROL. WE

WANT TO TAKE AWAY MEDICAID FUNDS FROM YOU. WE WANT TO TAKE AWAY

YOUR -- YOUR -- YOUR ABILITY TO CONTROL WHEN YOUR ELECTIONS ARE

HAPPENING. THE MESSAGE IS NEW YORK STATE WANTS TO CONTROL

EVERYTHING AND TELL YOU WHAT TO DO. AND I'M TELLING YOU, I HEAR FROM

MY CONSTITUENTS ALL THE TIME, THEY'RE TIRED OF NEW YORK STATE TELLING

THEM WHAT TO DO.

I VOTE IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. ANGELINO.

MR. ANGELINO: MADAM SPEAKER, MADAM

SPEAKER, I RISE TO MY EXPLAIN MY VOTE. ON BEHALF OF THE PRESIDENT OF

THE NEW YORK ASSOCIATION OF CLERKS OF COUNTY LEGISLATURES, WHO ARE

NOT IN FAVOR OF THIS BILL, THEY ASKED THAT THEY BE INCLUDED IN DISCUSSIONS

ON HOW TO GET BETTER GET VOTER TURNOUT. THEY DO NOT FEEL THIS IS THE

WAY. AND ON THEIR BEHALF, AND ON MY OWN, I WILL BE VOTING IN THE

NEGATIVE.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MRS. PEOPLES-

STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, MADAM

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SPEAKER. AS A FORMER COUNTY LEGISLATOR, I -- I DO UNDERSTAND WHAT IT

MEANS TO SERVE IN LOCAL GOVERNMENT. AND, IN FACT, WHEN I WAS SERVING

THERE WERE CLEARLY MORE DEMOCRATS ELECTED THAN THERE WERE

REPUBLICANS. AND SO I WAS THE MAJORITY LEADER. WELL, WHAT WE DIDN'T

HAVE CONTROL OF WAS THE COURTS. AND OUR COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER SIDE

OF THE AISLE DECIDED TO CHALLENGE THEIR OPPORTUNITY TO SAY THAT THEY

SHOULD HAVE MORE WEIGHTED VOTE BECAUSE OF GEOGRAPHY, NOT FROM

NUMBERS OF PEOPLE, BUT THE SIZE OF LAND. THEY WON THAT IN COURT. THEY

BECAME THE MAJORITY, JUST LIKE THAT.

NOW, I'M NOT SUGGESTING THAT THIS EVER JUSTIFIED TO USE

POLITICAL MANEUVERING TO PUT YOURSELVES INTO A POSITION. I THINK WHAT

HAS BEEN DESCRIBED HERE BEFORE US TODAY IS A FAIR OPPORTUNITY TO MOVE

FORWARD A POSITIVE DIRECTION TOWARDS ELECTIONS. BUT I DON'T WANT

PEOPLE TO ASSUME THAT SOME PARTIES HAVE A DESIRE TO TAKE SOME

AUTHORITY THAT OTHERS DON'T WHEN THEY THINK THEY CAN. I WANT TO ALSO

REMIND, YOU KNOW, WE TALKED A LOT TODAY ABOUT LETTING PEOPLE MAKE

THEIR OWN DECISIONS. THERE'S ONE DECISION THAT HALF OF THE PEOPLE WILL

NOT -- MAYBE NOT HALF, BUT A FEW PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM ARE CONSISTENTLY

DESIGN -- DENYING PEOPLE THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE. IT'S OKAY TO ALLOW

EVERYBODY ELSE TO HAVE THE CHOICE THEY WANT EXCEPT WOMEN CANNOT

HAVE A CHOICE OVER THEIR BODY. AND SO DON'T ACT LIKE IT'S OKAY THAT

EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE A CHOICE TO DO WHAT THEY WANT TO DO IN THEIR

COMMUNITY, TO MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT THEIR OWN SELVES, BUT WHEN IT

COMES TO WOMEN MAKING A DECISION WITH HER AND HER DOCTOR ON THE

CONDITION OF HER BODY, WE WANT TO SAY NO TO THAT.

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SO LET'S BE CLEAR, THERE ARE ALWAYS CHOICES IN LIFE.

TODAY, WE ARE MAKING A CHOICE TO GIVE ALL NEW YORKERS AN

OPPORTUNITY TO GET ELECTIONS THROUGH IN A FASTER, MORE EXPEDIENT

MANNER. SO I'M LOOKING FORWARD AND I'M VERY HAPPY TO BE ABLE TO VOTE

YES.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. FLOOD.

MR. FLOOD: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. FIRST, I

DO WANT TO CONDEMN THE SPONSOR -- I'M SORRY, IT'S BEEN A LONG NIGHT. I

DO COMPLIMENT THE SPONSOR OF THIS BILL. WE GAVE A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND

SHE WAS GRACEFUL IN ALL HER ANSWERS, SO THANK YOU. ONE OF MY

COLLEAGUES JUST SAID WE MIGHT HAVE AN ISSUE WITH TRUSTING THE VOTERS. I

DON'T THINK THAT'S THE POSITION WE MADE. WHAT WE WERE SAYING IS WE

TRUST THE VOTERS SO MUCH TO TELL US OR TELL THIS BODY WHAT THEY WANT TO

DO. WE WANT TO PUT IT OUT TO A REFERENDUM TO THOSE WHO DON'T HAVE THE

ABILITY TO VOTE ON A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT. I THINK THAT IS -- WOULD

BE ABSOLUTELY FAIR.

AND THEN THE OTHER PART WHERE WE SAID WE DON'T THINK

THAT -- YOU KNOW, IT'S TOO MUCH ON -- ON -- YOU KNOW, THE VOTERS ARE

PUTTING -- YOU KNOW, BY ME, WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN ELECTION -- WE'RE

GOING TO HAVE A BALLOT THAT PROBABLY HAS 30 NAMES ON IT. IT'S THE SAME

THING IF I WAS A TEACHER AND I GAVE MY CLASS A BOOK TO READ DURING THE

WEEK. I WOULDN'T SAY, HERE, READ ALL 100 PAGES TONIGHT AND THEN HAVE

NOTHING ELSE TO DO FOR THE LAST FOUR DAYS, BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE JUST

TOO MUCH INFORMATION AT ONCE TO DO. IT'S JUST COMMON SENSE.

SO TO SAY THAT WE'RE NOT DOING TOO MUCH OR THAT VOTERS

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WON'T CONFLATE THE ISSUES, THERE -- THERE'S A LOT GOING ON WHEN YOU HAVE

A PRESIDENTIAL, YOU HAVE A CONGRESS, YOU HAVE A -- YOUR STATE ELECTIONS.

THEN YOU MAY HAVE A COUNTY CLERK'S RACE, THEN YOU MAY HAVE TOWN --

A COUNTY LEGISLATURE RACE. THEN A DA'S RACE IF YOU'RE THE SAME -- IF

IT'S THE ODD YEARS ALREADY, OR EVEN, I APOLOGIZE. THEN YOU MAY HAVE

TOWN BOARD RACE. AGAIN, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT EIGHT OR NINE DIFFERENT

ELECTIONS, AND IF ANYONE IS GOING TO PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT THE JUDGES

ARE RUNNING ON, YOU'RE LOOKING AT 20 TO 25 ISSUES FOR, YOU KNOW, LIKE

ME, I'M A PARENT OF FIVE THAT GETS MAYBE 15, 20 MINUTES OF FREE TIME

AFTER YOU GET HOME FROM WORK, GET TO DINNER, GET YOUR KIDS TO WHATEVER

EVENTS THEY'RE GOING TO GO TO, GET THEM TO BED, AND SOMEWHERE IN THOSE

15 TO 20 MINUTES A NIGHT THAT YOU GET TO, I'M GOING TO STUDY WHAT'S

GOING ON THE ELECTIONS? IT'S NOT REASONABLE.

FOR THAT REASON, THAT'S WHY MYSELF AND I -- I DON'T WANT

TO INTERJECT ONTO MY COLLEAGUES, BUT I'M PRETTY SURE THAT'S THE REASON

WHY WE'RE SAYING WE SHOULD KEEP THESE SEPARATE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. MCGOWAN.

MR. MCGOWAN: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER, TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I -- I THINK THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT WHAT DOES IS IT

DILUTES LOCAL ISSUES. IT DILUTES THE VOTERS' ABILITY TO WEIGH IN ON LOCAL

ISSUES BY BUNCHING EVERYTHING TOGETHER, BY PUTTING ALL -- YOU KNOW,

PRESUMABLY THE GOAL IS TO PUT EVERY ELECTION IN THE SAME YEAR, FROM

FEDERAL ELECTION, STATE, COUNTY AND LOCAL. AND I THINK THAT'S A PROBLEM.

PEOPLE ARE REALLY PASSIONATE ABOUT THEIR LOCAL ISSUES, UNDERSTANDABLY,

BECAUSE OUR LOCAL ISSUES PROBABLY AFFECT US MORE SO ON A DAY-TO-DAY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BASIS THAN PERHAPS NATIONAL ISSUES DO AND PERHAPS STATE ISSUES DO. BUT

WHAT WE'RE DOING IS WE'RE PUTTING ALL THESE RACES TOGETHER, ALL THESE

ISSUES TOGETHER, AND THERE'S ONLY JUST SO MUCH TIME AND BANDWIDTH THAT

PEOPLE HAVE. PEOPLE HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO CAMPAIGN ADS, MAILERS,

NEWSPAPER ADS, SOCIAL MEDIA ADS. ALL CANDIDATES ARE COMPETING FOR THE

SAME BANDWIDTH, COMPETING FOR THE SAME SPACE. AND THAT'S JUST GONNA

GET WORSE WHEN WE HAVE ALL OF OUR ELECTIONS IN THE SAME YEAR, RATHER

THAN SPREADING THEM OUT TO GET THE PROPER ATTENTION AND CARE THAT THEY

SHOULD HAVE.

I THINK THIS IS A REALLY BAD PIECE OF LEGISLATION. I

APPRECIATE THE SPONSOR FOR ANSWERING ALL OF OUR QUESTIONS. BUT

UNFORTUNATELY, AND WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, IT CAME UP SHORT. I'M NOT

CONVINCED THIS IS BETTER. I DON'T THIS MAKES NEW YORK STATE BETTER, I

DON'T THINK THIS MAKES THE ISSUES CLEARER OR ANY LESS CONFUSING; IF

ANYTHING, IT'S MORE CONFUSING. AND YES, MAYBE OUR RESIDENTS DON'T

HAVE TO GO TO THE POLLS AS OFTEN, BUT I THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING BECAUSE

IT GIVES THOSE LOCAL ISSUES TIME TO BREATHE AND TO GET THEIR DUE COURSE TO

BE ADDRESSED BY THE VOTERS, TO BE ADDRESSED BY THE LOCAL LEADERS AND

ELECTED OFFICIALS.

SO DOING THIS SENDS THE WRONG MESSAGE TO OUR

COUNTIES, SENDS THE WRONG MESSAGE TO OUR LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES AND,

FRANKLY, SENDS THE WRONG MESSAGE TO OUR VOTERS. THIS IS, ONCE AGAIN,

OVERREACH BY OUR STATE GOVERNMENT, AND I THINK WE'RE HEADED IN THE

WRONG DIRECTION BY DOING THIS, AND IT REALLY IS NOT A GOOD THING MOVING

FORWARD FOR OUR STATE. SO MADAM SPEAKER, I'LL BE IN THE NEGATIVE.

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THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MS. SILLITTI.

MS. SILLITTI: THANK YOU SO MUCH, I WANTED TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. SO THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT I LEARNED TONIGHT THAT

I'M KIND OF EXCITED ABOUT FROM MY COLLEAGUES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE

AISLE. EVERYBODY'S EXCITED ABOUT BALLOT REDESIGN AND MAKING THE BALLOT

EASIER AND MORE UNDERSTANDABLE FOR OUR VOTERS, SO I'M EXCITED TO GET TO

WORK ON THAT. I ALSO LEARNED THAT WE'RE ALL -- WANT TO SEE MORE

INCREASED VOTER PARTICIPATION, AND WE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT VOTER

PARTICIPATION. SO THINGS LIKE NO EXCUSE ABSENTEE VOTING I'M SURE WILL

SAIL THROUGH NEXT GO-AROUND.

ALSO, PURITY OF LOCAL ELECTIONS AND PURITY OF LOCAL

ISSUES. YOU KNOW, IN 2021 IT REALLY WASN'T ABOUT LOCAL ISSUES NEAR ME.

I CAN GIVE YOU TWO WORDS OF WHAT IT WAS ABOUT. SO I AM SURE THAT THIS

YEAR IT WILL BE ALL ABOUT LOCAL ISSUES AND WHAT'S HAPPENING ON THE LOCAL

LEVEL RATHER THAN ON STATE ISSUES BECAUSE WE ALL -- WE CARE ABOUT,

AGAIN, THE PURITY OF LOCAL ISSUES.

I WILL BE VOTING IN FAVOR OF THIS, SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE

INCREASED VOTER PARTICIPATION. I DON'T KNOW WHY WE'RE SCARED OF IT; I'M

CERTAINLY NOT SCARED OF IT. IT'S A GOOD THING WHEN MORE PEOPLE GET

INVOLVED, IT'S A GOOD THING WHEN MORE PEOPLE WANT TO VOTE. IT'S A GOOD

THING WHEN PEOPLE ARE INTERESTED IN THEIR GOVERNMENT. THESE ARE NOT

DIRTY WORDS. SO I VOTE IN FAVOR OF THIS LEGISLATION, AND KUDOS TO MY

COLLEAGUE FOR HER MARATHON DEBATE. JOB WELL DONE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MS. WALSH.

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MS. WALSH: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER, TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. SO, WE'VE BEEN GOING AT THIS FOR SO LONG I STARTED TO

KIND OF GET A LITTLE TIRED AND SLEEPY, STARTED TO KIND OF FALL ASLEEP A LITTLE

BIT, I'LL BE HONEST. AND THEN I -- I HEARD SOMETHING COME FROM THIS AREA

OVER HERE FROM ONE OF MY DEMOCRAT COLLEAGUES WHO SAID THAT HE TRUSTS

THE VOTER, AND -- AND THAT WOKE ME UP BECAUSE I'M A -- I'M A BIG

BELIEVER IN CALLING IRONY OUT WHEN I -- WHEN I HEAR IT. THERE WAS NO

TRUST OF THE VOTER WHEN THE VOTERS VOTED AGAINST NO EXCUSE ABSENTEE

VOTING ON THE BACK OF THE BALLOT NOT SO VERY LONG AGO. THAT WAS

QUICKLY CONDEMNED AND BLAMED ON BIG MONEY THAT WAS SPENT TO SKEW

THAT RESULT. THAT -- THAT WASN'T THAT THE VOTERS DIDN'T REALLY WANT NO

EXCUSE ABSENTEE VOTING, IT WAS ALL BECAUSE MONEY GOT INVOLVED AND

THAT'S WHY THE VOTERS GOT CONFUSED AND THEY VOTED AGAINST IT AND HOW

CRAZY THAT WAS. AND THEN -- THEN LAST YEAR WHEN THE -- YOU COULDN'T

TRUST THE VOTER, BUT THE VOTERS ELECTED SO MANY REPUBLICAN MEMBERS OF

CONGRESS LAST YEAR THAT IT FLIPPED THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. THAT

WAS JUST A COMPLETE ANOMALY AND THAT WAS JUST BECAUSE OF, I DON'T

KNOW, DIRTY POLITICS OR WHATEVER. SO, YOU KNOW, YOU TRUST THE VOTERS

WHEN THE VOTERS COME OUT THE WAY YOU WANT THEM TO, BUT WHAT I'M

SAYING THIS THAT BILL IS ABSOLUTELY, IN MY OPINION, AN EXAMPLE OF THE

MAJORITY WANTING TO FLEX ITS MUSCLE TO RECEIVE EVERY SINGLE ADVANTAGE

IT CAN IN THE NEXT ELECTION AND BEYOND. AND IT IS POLITICAL

MANEUVERING. I'M CALLING IT, WE ALL CALLED IT FOR WHAT IT IS. AND, AGAIN,

I'M AWAKE NOW AND I WILL BE VOTING IN THE NEGATIVE. THANK YOU.

(APPLAUSE)

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ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. JENSEN.

MR. JENSEN: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MADAM

SPEAKER, TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I, TOO, LIKE MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES,

RESPECT AND TRUST THE VOTERS. IF WE DID, WE WOULDN'T BE DOING THIS BY

LEGISLATIVE FIAT TO BE DECIDED BY 213 MEMBERS OF THE ASSEMBLY AND THE

SENATE AND GOVERNOR OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK, WE'D ALLOW THE PEOPLE,

THE VOTERS OF NEW YORK STATE TO MAKE THIS DECISION FOR THEMSELVES.

WE'D ALLOW OUR LOCAL MUNICIPALITIES TO OPT INTO THIS PROGRAM,

SOMETHING THEY HAVE NOT DONE EVEN THOUGH THEY HAVE THE

CONSTITUTIONAL OPTION TO DO SO TODAY. IF WE TRUSTED THE VOTERS, WE

WOULD PUT THIS UP TO A REFERENDUM VIA CHANGES TO THE CONSTITUTION.

RATHER THAN TRUST THE VOTERS, AS SO MANY OF US DEVOUTLY CLAIM, WE

WOULD BE DOING SOMETHING THAT RESPECTS THEIR WILL RATHER THAN THE WILL

OF 213 NEW YORKERS IN THIS LEGISLATIVE HOUSE AND THE GOVERNOR ON THE

FLOOR BELOW US. BECAUSE WE'RE NOT DOING THAT, MADAM SPEAKER, I VOTE

NAY.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MS. LUNSFORD.

MS. LUNSFORD: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I DO WANT

TO COMMEND THE SPONSOR FOR HER TENACITY AND HER PERSEVERANCE. I RISE

BECAUSE I'M IN A SOMEWHAT UNIQUE POSITION IN THIS STATE IN THAT I

ACTUALLY RUN WITH A VILLAGE THAT HAS A NOVEMBER EVEN-YEAR ELECTION.

AND I GET TO RUN MY RACE WITH THE GOVERNOR AND THE AG AND THE

COMPTROLLER AND A CONGRESS PERSON AND A SENATOR AND MYSELF, AND A

WHOLE SLATE OF VILLAGE CANDIDATES. AND WHEN WE KNOCK DOORS, YOU

KNOW WHAT THEY TALK TO ME ABOUT? THE LANDFILL. THEY TALK TO ME ABOUT

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LOCAL ISSUES BECAUSE ALL ARE POLITICS ARE LOCAL. AND WHEN I RUN WITH MY

VILLAGE CANDIDATES, I KNOCK DOORS WITH THEM AND WE TALK ABOUT THE

WAYS GOVERNMENT WORKS WITH EACH OTHER. WE TALK ABOUT THE LAYERS OF

GOVERNMENT AND HOW WE CAN RELY ON EACH OTHER AND WHAT GOOD

PARTNERS MAKE, AND IT MAKES PEOPLE MORE ENGAGED. AND IN 2022, I HAD

THE ABILITY TO RUN WITH THAT VILLAGE SLATE, AND I HAD ONE OF THE HIGHEST

TURNOUT RACES IN THE ENTIRE ASSEMBLY. SIXTY-FIVE THOUSAND PEOPLE

TURNED OUT IN THE RACE I RAN IN. THE EARLY VOTING SITE CLOSEST TO THAT

VILLAGE HAD BY LEAPS AND BOUNDS THE HIGHEST TURNOUT OF ANY EARLY VOTING

POLLING SITE IN THE COUNTY BECAUSE IT TURNED PEOPLE OUT AND IT MADE

THEM ENGAGED IN ISSUES FROM TOP TO BOTTOM. SO I DON'T BUY THIS

ARGUMENT THAT IT'S GOING TO BURY THE ISSUES. IF ANYTHING, I THINK IT'S

GOING TO ENHANCE IT. IT'S GOING TO BRING MORE PEOPLE TO THE POLLS AND

THEY'RE GOING TALK ABOUT THE THINGS THAT MATTER TO THEM, WHICH BY AND

LARGE ARE KITCHEN TABLE ISSUES. AND THE PRESSURE FROM THE BOTTOM

MAKES US MORE ACCOUNTABLE TO THE PEOPLE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BALLOT. I

HAVE GREAT RELATIONSHIPS WITH MY VILLAGE AND MY TOWNS AND MY

COUNTIES. MY COUNTIES, WHICH I'LL MENTION, SOME OF THE NASTIEST, MOST

TOXIC RACES WE HAVE ARE AT THE COUNTY LEVEL. SO AGAIN, THIS IDEA THAT IT'S

GOING TO INTRODUCE TOXICITY I DON'T THINK IS VALID, EITHER.

AND I DO JUST WANT TO POINT OUT, WE'VE BEEN HEARING A

LOT ABOUT THE VOTE ON THE CONSTITUTIONAL REFERENDUM FOR MAIL-IN VOTING,

WHICH WAS AN ODD-YEAR VOTE. AND AS I RECALL, THAT WAS ABOUT A

32 PERCENT TURNOUT, AND I THINK THAT'S A GREAT EXAMPLE OF WHY WE NEED

TO PASS THIS BILL TO GET MORE PEOPLE TO THE POLLS. I'LL BE IN THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AFFIRMATIVE. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: ARE THERE ANY

OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 19, RULES REPORT NO. 743, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07690, RULES REPORT

NO. 743, HEASTIE. AN ACT TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE

CONDUCTING OF THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY, TO PROVIDE FOR THE ELECTION OF

DELEGATES TO A NATIONAL PARTY CONVENTION OR A NATIONAL PARTY CONFERENCE

IN 2024, AND THE "PRESIDENTIAL" AND "JUNE" PRIMARY IN SUCH YEAR; TO

AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO ELECTING DELEGATES TO A NATIONAL

PARTY CONVENTION; TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO CURE

AFFIRMATIONS RECEIVED BY THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS; TO AMEND THE ELECTION

LAW, IN RELATION TO WRITE-IN VOTES FOR CANDIDATES; TO AMEND THE ELECTION

LAW, IN RELATION TO BALLOT ENVELOPES WITHOUT A POSTMARK; TO AMEND THE

ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO CERTIFICATES TO FILL A VACANCY IN A

DESIGNATION; TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO CANVASSING OF

ABSENTEE AND AFFIDAVIT BALLOTS; TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION

TO CONDITIONS FOR FULL MANUAL RECOUNTS OF BALLOTS; TO REPEAL CERTAIN

PROVISIONS OF THE ELECTION LAW RELATING TO WRITE-IN VOTES FOR

CANDIDATES; AND PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF CERTAIN PROVISIONS UPON

EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: AN EXPLANATION

HAS BEEN REQUESTED, MS. WALKER.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALKER: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. THIS

BILL WOULD AMEND CERTAIN PROVISIONS OF THE ELECTION LAW TO SCHEDULE

THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY ELECTION FOR APRIL 2ND, 2024 AND UPDATE THE

POLITICAL CALENDAR ACCORDINGLY. AND IT ENACTS THE NEEDED STATUTORY

CHANGES AND RESPECTIVE PLANS FOR THE ELECTION OF DELEGATES AND

ALTERNATE DELEGATES TO THE NATIONAL PARTY CONVENTIONS. IT ALSO MAKES

NECESSARY CHANGES TO THE ELECTION LAW TO RECOGNIZE COMMON ERRORS IN

THE ABSENTEE BALLOT PROCESS, AND PROVIDES VOTERS WAYS TO CURE THESE

ERRORS, ALL THE WHILE PROTECTING VOTER AND VOTING RIGHTS. THE BILL ALSO

GIVES CANDIDATES THE ABILITY TO HAVE OBSERVERS WITNESS THE OPENING OF

ABSENT -- AFFIDAVIT BALLOTS AND THE ABILITY TO CHALLENGE CERTIFICATES TO FILL

VACANCIES IN A DESIGNATION. IT ALSO ENSURES THAT CANDIDATES ARE ABLE TO

GET INITIAL COUNTS DURING RECOUNTS AND ARE NOT PENALIZED FOR BEING

WRITTEN IN BY A VOTER IF THEIR NAME IS ALREADY ON THE BALLOT.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MR. NORRIS.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER. WILL

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: WILL THE SPONSOR

YIELD?

MS. WALKER: YES, MADAM SPEAKER, I WILL.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MADAM --

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: THE SPONSOR

YIELDS.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MADAM SPEAKER, AND

THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. I JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY DATE. I BELIEVE THAT'S GOING TO BE ON APRIL 2ND?

MS. WALKER: THAT'S CORRECT, APRIL 2, 2024.

MR. NORRIS: AND THAT FOLLOWS HOLY WEEK WITH

EASTER BE -- FALL ON MARCH 31ST?

MS. WALKER: YES, IT DOES.

MR. NORRIS: YES. AND WHEN WILL EARLY VOTING

TAKE PLACE?

MS. WALKER: THE VOTING WILL -- SO EARLY VOTING

WILL TAKE PLACE DURING THE TEN DAYS PRIOR TO THE ELECTION DAY OF APRIL

2ND FOR 2024, AND HOWEVER, THE DATES ARE BEING CHANGED AND RESPECT --

THE HOURS ARE BEING CHANGED WITH RESPECT TO THE HOURS IN OUR RESPECTIVE

EASTER HOLIDAY. BY REMOVING ONE DAY OF EARLY VOTING FOR EASTER FOR --

IN OBSERVANCE OF ONE OF THE HOLIEST DAYS ON THE CALENDAR FOR PEOPLE

WHO ARE OBSERVING, THE NUMBER OF HOURS PER DAY DURING EARLY VOTING

WILL CHANGE FROM EIGHT HOURS TO NINE HOURS PER DAY.

MR. NORRIS: BUT THERE WILL BE NO VOTING ON EASTER

SUNDAY, CORRECT?

MS. WALKER: THERE WILL BE NO VOTING ON EASTER

SUNDAY.

MR. NORRIS: WHAT ABOUT GOOD FRIDAY AND HOLY

THURSDAY?

MS. WALKER: YES, THERE WILL BE.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. ALSO, I HAVE A CONCERN -- I'LL

GET TO THAT ON THE BILL -- I HAVE A CONCERN. I UNDERSTAND THERE'S ALSO A

JEWISH HOLIDAY IN HERE, OR AT LEAST A DESIGNATION, ON MARCH THE 23RD;

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WOULD THAT BE CORRECT? PURIM?

MS. WALKER: I HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE CALENDAR

AGAIN TO DOUBLE CHECK, BUT ASSUMING THAT YOU ARE CORRECT.

MR. NORRIS: I CHECKED WITH ONE OF OUR COLLEAGUES

AND THEY'VE EXPLAINED THAT TO ME, SO I JUST WANTED TO DO THAT FOR THE

RECORD. I -- I JUST WANT TO MENTION TO YOU, MADAM CHAIR, THAT I DO

HAVE CONCERNS THAT DURING HOLY WEEK THERE WILL BE THIS VOTING,

PARTICULARLY ON HOLY THURSDAY AND GOOD FRIDAY, FOR MANY IN THE

CHRISTIAN FAITH, AS WELL AS THOSE IN THE JEWISH FAITH, WHERE I MENTIONED

BEFORE WITH PURIM. THAT IS A CONCERN THAT THESE VOTING WILL BE TAKING

PLACE DURING THIS TIME, PARTICULARLY WHEN OUR STAFF SHOULD BE ALLOWED

TO -- BOARD OF ELECTION STAFF AND THE VOTERS HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO

THAT. SO I JUST WANTED TO EXPRESS THAT ON THE RECORD THAT I HAVE

CONCERNS ABOUT THAT AND THAT I HOPE THAT COULD BE ADDRESSED IN A

CHAPTER AMENDMENT IF THIS BILL MOVES FORWARD.

NOW, IF I COULD JUST TURN YOUR ATTENTION TO SOME OF THE

OTHER CHANGES THAT REALLY DON'T DEAL SPECIFICALLY WITH A PRESIDENTIAL

PRIMARY. AND I FIND IT IRONIC THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH A BILL REGARDING

THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY AND SETTING THE DATES AND SO FORTH, BUT WE'RE

ALSO MAKING SOME SIGNIFICANT CHANGES TO THE ELECTION LAW. AND IF I

COULD JUST POINT OUT ONE OF THEM, WOULD BE WRITE-IN VOTES. SO ANY

WRITE-IN FOR A CANDIDATE, WHETHER OR NOT SUCH CANDIDATE'S NAME IS ON

THE BALLOT O FOR THAT CONTEST SHALL BE COUNTED FOR SUCH CANDIDATE UNLESS

SUCH WRITE-IN VOTES CREATE AN INVALID OVER-VOTE IN THE CONTEST. SO IT'S

MY UNDERSTANDING UNDER CURRENT LAW, THAT IF SOMEONE WHO IS A

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DECLARED CANDIDATE ON THE BALLOT RECEIVES A WRITE-IN VOTE, THEN THE

WRITE-IN VOTE IS NOT ALLOWED, NOT COUNTED. IS THAT CORRECT UNDER THE

CURRENT LAW?

MS. WALKER: THAT IS CORRECT.

MR. NORRIS: WHY ARE WE MAKING THIS CHANGE?

MS. WALKER: WELL, I BELIEVE THAT THE WILL OF THE

VOTER AND THE INTENT OF THE VOTER SHOULD SOME -- SHOULD BE SOMETHING

THAT IS ALWAYS RESPECTED AND HELD IN THE HIGHEST REGARD. THERE ARE

MANY INSTANCES WHERE INDIVIDUALS WILL GO INTO A POLL SITE, PERHAPS IT

COULD BE ANY REASON WHY THE NAME WHICH IS PRINTED IS OVERLOOKED.

MAYBE THEY DIDN'T SEE IT, PERHAPS THEY DIDN'T HAVE THEIR GLASSES THAT

DAY. PERHAPS THEY WERE READING, YOU KNOW, SO QUICKLY THAT IT WAS AN

OVERSIGHT. AND SO THEY WILL TAKE IT UPON THEMSELVES BECAUSE THEY WANT

TO SEE THIS PARTICULAR CANDIDATE BE ELECTED. THEY WILL WRITE THAT

PERSON'S NAME IN ON THE BALLOT. AND WE BELIEVE THAT THE INTENT OF THAT

VOTER SHOULD BE COUNTED AND WE SHOULD NOT BE PENALIZING ANY

CANDIDATES SIMPLY BECAUSE OF -- OF AN OVERZEALOUS VOTER.

MR. NORRIS: NOW, THIS WOULD APPLY ALL ELECTIONS,

JUST NOT THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY. SO WHAT IF THERE WERE TWO OFFICES,

LET'S SAY TWO TOWN BOARD SEATS THAT ARE OPEN, RIGHT, SO I APPEAR IN

COLUMN A, MICHAEL NORRIS RUNNING FOR THE TOWN BOARD ON THE

REPUBLICAN LINE, IT WOULD SAY THAT, RIGHT, BUT IT COULD BE ON ANY LINE.

BUT THEN IN COLUMN 2 AND COLUMN B THERE MIGHT BE OTHER CANDIDATES.

WHAT IF SOMEONE WRITES IN MIKE NORRIS OR THAT CANDIDATE IN COLUMN

NUMBER TWO. WILL THE MACHINE CATCH THAT?

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALKER: WELL, IF IT'S A WRITE-IN I BELIEVE THAT

NOTWITHSTANDING WHATEVER THE CIRCUMSTANCES ARE, WHETHER THE PERSON

WROTE MICKEY MOUSE, THE MACHINE WILL STILL CAPTURE THE FACT THAT THAT

PARTICULAR -- ON THAT PARTICULAR LINE THE PERSON WROTE IN.

MR. NORRIS: MADAM CHAIR, IF I COULD JUST POINT

OUT, I DO HAVE A CONCERN THAT THERE MIGHT BE SOME OVERLOOK,

PARTICULARLY WHERE THERE'S MORE THAN ONE OFFICE, PARTICULAR OFFICE ON THE

BALLOT WHERE THERE MAY BE TWO SEATS BUT THE SAME OFFICE AND THEY GO IN

TWO DIFFERENT COLUMNS, THAT THAT MIGHT GET SLIPPED THROUGH BY HAVING

SOMEONE -- AND I DON'T ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO DO THIS WITH MY NAME --

BUT -- BUT IF THEY HAD A CANDIDATE ON A AND THEN A -- THEN ON COLUMN B,

THEY WRITE THE NAME IN OF A CANDIDATE IN COLUMN A. I DON'T KNOW IF

THAT WOULD SLIP THROUGH, BUT I THINK IT'S A POSSIBILITY AND THAT'S ONE OF

THE REASONS WHY I HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT THIS STATUTORY PROVISION BEING

CHANGED.

MS. WALKER: SO I'M JUST -- I'M A LITTLE CONFUSED,

MR. NORRIS.

MR. NORRIS: YES.

MS. WALKER: SO ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE VOTER FOR

YOU WOULD OVER-VOTE FOR YOU?

MR. NORRIS: THEY COULD OVER-VOTE, BUT IT COULD

APPEAR IN A TWO -- BECAUSE THERE WOULD BE TWO COLUMNS IN THAT CASE

BECAUSE THERE ARE TWO OFFICES FOR THE SAME OFFICE, BUT TWO SPOTS FOR THE

SAME OFFICE OPEN, AND I'M CONCERNED THAT ON COLUMN A WHERE THE

NAME MAY APPEAR, THEY FILL IN THE BUBBLE, AND THEN COLUMN B, THEN

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THEY WRITE IN THAT SAME CANDIDATE WHO APPEARED IN COLUMN A AND IT

MAY GET MISSED. SO I JUST HAVE A CONCERN THAT THERE COULD BE A

POTENTIAL ISSUE OF FRAUD IN THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES, AND THAT'S WHY I'M

CONCERNED ABOUT HOW THIS STATUTORY LANGUAGE IS DONE.

MS. WALKER: WELL, IF THERE ARE ANY INSTANCES OF

FRAUD, WHICH WE BELIEVE SHOULD BE PROTECTED TO THE UTMOST, THERE ARE A

NUMBER OF PLACES WITHIN THE ELECTION LAW THAT DEALS WITH FRAUD. AND

IF THE INTENTION OF THE INDIVIDUAL WOULD BE TO COMMIT SUCH FRAUD WHILE

VOTING, WE WILL, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WILL HANDLE THAT

PERSON ACCORDINGLY. BUT OF COURSE, IT HAS TO BE WITH THE INTENTION OF

COMMITTING A FRAUD, NOT SIMPLY BY MAKING A MISTAKE BECAUSE THEY

DIDN'T UNDERSTAND.

MR. NORRIS: I UNDERSTAND, MADAM, YOUR POINT, BUT

I -- I JUST DO HAVE CONCERNS THAT THERE MIGHT BE UNINTENTIONAL

CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE DOUBLE VOTES ARE COUNTED, AND THAT'S JUST A

CONCERN OF MINE.

MS. WALKER: RIGHT, BUT MR. NORRIS, IF IT'S

UNINTENTIONAL, THEN CAN IT QUALIFY AS FRAUD?

MR. NORRIS: WELL, IF -- IF THEY'RE DOING IT

PURPOSELY, LET'S PUT IT THAT WAY. I'LL REPHRASE THAT, IF THEY DO IT

PURPOSELY WHERE THEY VOTE IN COLUMN A AND THEY INTENTIONALLY WRITE IN

ON COLUMN B INTENTIONALLY, THAT WOULD BE A FRAUD SITUATION.

MS. WALKER: POINT WELL TAKEN.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I WANTED TO JUST TURN YOUR ATTENTION TO ONE MORE

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SECTION, WHICH IS A PERMANENT CHANGE. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS MANY

TIMES, AND YOU KNOW MY POSITION ON THIS THAT AN ABSENTEE BALLOT

SHOULD BE POSTMARKED THE DAY BEFORE ELECTION DAY. BUT THIS HOUSE

AND THE GOVERNOR THE SIGNED BILL, THE PREVIOUS GOVERNOR MAY HAVE, I

KNOW IT'S A LAW NOW WHERE IF IT'S ON ELECTION DAY POSTMARKED OR

RECEIVED THE DAY AFTER, IT DOES COUNT. NOW IT'S GOING EVEN FURTHER,

UNDER THE PERMANENCY, WHERE IF IT'S UN-POSTMARKED AND RECEIVED

BETWEEN TWO AND SEVEN DAYS AFTER THE ELECTION, IT'S UN-POSTMARKED AND

IT'S RECEIVED TWO TO SEVEN DAYS AFTER THE ELECTIONS, THEN SOMEONE CAN

ACTUALLY DO AN AFFIRMATION CURE TO CORRECT IT; IS THAT RIGHT?

MS. WALKER: THAT IS CORRECT.

MR. NORRIS: ALL RIGHT. AGAIN, I -- I JUST HAVE

CONCERNS REGARDING THAT BECAUSE THE POSTMARK IS VERY IMPORTANT,

BECAUSE IT IS A TIMESTAMP TO WHEN THE VOTER ACTUALLY PUTS THE BALLOT

INTO THE MAIL. AND I'VE EXPRESSED THOSE CONCERNS BEFORE. AGAIN, I'M

EXPRESSING THEM HERE THAT I THINK THIS GOES TOO FAR IN HAVING THOSE

BALLOTS COUNTED WITHOUT ANY POSTMARK AND IT NOW BEING RECEIVED FROM

THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS TWO TO SEVEN DAYS AFTERWARDS, PARTICULARLY,

SOME -- I DON'T KNOW HOW SOME OF THESE BALLOTS MAY APPEAR THERE, AND

I THINK THAT IT'S IMPORTANT TO HAVE THAT, DESPITE AN AFFIRMATION, BECAUSE

I UNDERSTAND NOW UNDER A DIFFERENT SECTION OF THE LAW WHICH IS GOING

TO BE PERMANENT, THAT THEY CAN DO AN AFFIRMATION THAT IS NOW RECEIVED

BY THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS AND NOT FILED; WOULD THAT BE CORRECT?

MS. WALKER: WELL, I JUST WANT TO MAKE A NOTE --

MR. NORRIS: SURE.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MS. WALKER: -- ON YOUR LAST POINTS, MR. NORRIS.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU.

MS. WALKER: THE BILL SIMPLY CODIFIES A DECISION,

A RECENT DECISION, IT'S A U.S. DISTRICT COURT CASE WHEREIN FOR THE AUGUST

AND NOVEMBER 2022 ELECTIONS, VOTERS WERE ABLE TO CURE THEIR BALLOTS IF

A BOARD OF ELECTIONS RECEIVED A NON-POSTMARKED ENVELOPE BETWEEN

TWO AND SEVEN DAYS AFTER ELECTION DAY. SO THERE IS LEGAL PRECEDENCE IN

ORDER TO BACK UP THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF LEGISLATION. AND IN ADDITION TO

THAT, THERE IS AN ATTESTATION CLAUSE THAT THE VOTER HAS TO SIGN, AND

BASICALLY THAT ATTESTATION CLAUSE MUST INDICATE THAT THE VOTER DID,

INDEED, MAIL THE BALLOT ON OR BEFORE ELECTION DAY. AND AS WE'VE

TALKED ABOUT PREVIOUSLY DURING THIS DEBATE, IF YOU MAKE A FALSE CLAIM,

THAT IS ILLEGAL, IT IS FRAUD AND IT IS AND WILL BE DEALT WITH UNDER ARTICLE

17.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. CAN I JUST ASK ONE QUESTION,

TOO, REGARDING ARTICLE 16? I SEE THAT THERE IS ADDITIONAL LANGUAGE BEING

ADDED FOR A CERTIFICATE TO FILL A VACANCY. IS THERE A REASON WHY THIS IS

BEING ADDED TO THE ELECTION LAWS? DID I MISS A COURT CASE OR THERE'S

SOMETHING WHY THIS IS NOW BEING ADDED IN?

MS. WALKER: WELL, PRESENTLY THERE IS NO

MECHANISM TO CHALLENGE THE -- THE VALIDITY IN THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION.

CURRENT LAW ALLOWS FOR THE OBJECTION TO, AND SUBSEQUENT SUPREME

COURT PROCEEDINGS INVOLVING CERTAIN PETITIONS WITHIN CERTAIN TIME

FRAMES. THE CERTIFICATE TO FILL A VACANCY IN A DESIGNATION IS NOT

INCLUDED, HOWEVER. THIS OVERSIGHT MEANS THAT THE CANDIDATE NAMES ON

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THAT CERTIFICATE IS GUARANTEED A PLACE ON THE BALLOT EVEN IF THE PETITIONS

ARE INVALID OR OTHERWISE FAULTY. SO THIS BILL CLOSES A VERY IMPORTANT

LOOPHOLE TO ENSURE THAT ONLY QUALIFIED CANDIDATES ARE PLACED ON THE

BALLOT, AND WE ARE ENSURING THAT PEOPLE ARE NOT TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THE

FACT THAT THIS LOOPHOLE EXISTED.

MR. NORRIS: OKAY. IF I COULD JUST BOUNCE BACK TO

THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY, BECAUSE I FORGOT A POINT. WAS THERE ANY

CONSIDERATION GIVEN IN YOUR DISCUSSIONS ON THIS BILL WITH THE BURDENS

ON THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS? BECAUSE WE'RE GONNA (INAUDIBLE) HAVE --

WE'RE GONNA HAVE HOLY WEEK DURING THE MIDDLE OF AUGUST [SIC],

INCLUDING EASTER. WE'RE GONNA HAVE THE ELECTION OCCURRING, AND THE

POLITICAL CALENDAR WOULD SEEM TO INDICATE THAT THERE WILL BE FILING OF

DESIGNATING PETITIONS AROUND THE FIRST WEEK OF APRIL. WAS THERE ANY

CONSIDERATION TO ALL THIS ACTIVITY TAKING PLACE AT THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS

AND HOW THEY'RE GONNA HANDLE ALL THIS?

MS. WALKER: WELL, I AM SURE THAT THERE IS

CONSIDERATION OF THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS WHENEVER IT IS THAT WE ACT AS A

BODY, MR. NORRIS; HOWEVER, I CAN STATE THAT I HAVE NOT BEEN

APPROACHED WITH ANY OF THE CONCERNS THAT YOU JUST MENTIONED.

MR. NORRIS: GREAT. THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR, I

APPRECIATE YOU ANSWERING MY QUESTIONS.

MADAM SPEAKER, ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: ON THE BILL.

MR. NORRIS: REGARDING THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY,

MY REAL CONCERN LIES WITH THE EARLY VOTING THAT'S GOING TO OCCUR DURING

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

HOLY WEEK. I'M GRATEFUL THAT EASTER SUNDAY, THERE WILL BE NO VOTING

ON EASTER SUNDAY, BUT I'M ALSO CONCERNED THAT HOLY THURSDAY AND

GOOD FRIDAY THERE WILL BE VOTING TAKING PLACE WHEN MANY OF OUR

ELECTION INSPECTORS, MANY OF OUR VOTERS, MANY OF THE PEOPLE AT THE

BOARD OF ELECTIONS WILL WANT TO OBSERVE THOSE DAYS, BEING THE HOLIEST

WEEK IN THE CHRISTIAN CALENDAR. I ALSO WANT TO JUST POINT OUT THAT I DO

BELIEVE THAT HAVING THE PRIMARY DURING THIS PERIOD OF TIME IN

CONJUNCTION WITH THE DESIGNATING PETITION FILING PERIOD WILL CAUSE A

BURDEN ON OUR BOARD OF ELECTIONS AND WE SHOULD MAKE SURE THEY HAVE

THE ADEQUATE STAFFING AND RESOURCES AVAILABLE TO HANDLE ALL THESE ITEMS.

AND JUST THE PERMANENT CHANGES TO THE ELECTION LAW, WHICH I'M JUST

BAFFLED WOULD BE IN WITH THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY BILL SETTING THE RULES

AND REGULATIONS FOR DELEGATES, HOW THEY'RE NOMINATED AND SO ON AND SO

FORTH. THESE ARE, AGAIN, PERMANENT CHANGES TO THE ELECTION LAW THAT I,

QUITE FRANKLY, BELIEVE IS A SLIPPERY SLOPE WHICH LEADS ITSELF TO POTENTIAL

FRAUD. WE'VE RAISED SOME OF THOSE CONCERNS HERE ON THE RECORD, AND I

JUST BELIEVE STRONGLY THAT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE ELECTIONS ARE DONE IN

THE MOST FAIR AND TRANSPARENT WAY. AND THESE ITEMS, PARTICULARLY THESE

PERMANENT CHANGES, PARTICULARLY WITH THE POSTMARK, IS VERY CONCERNING

TO ME AND, THEREFORE, I WILL BE OPPOSING THE BILL FOR THOSE REASONS. I

ENCOURAGE MY COLLEAGUES TO DO THE SAME. AND AGAIN, THANK YOU,

MADAM SPEAKER, FOR HAVING TO BE HEARD ON THIS BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: READ THE LAST

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: A PARTY VOTE HAS

BEEN REQUESTED.

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SPEAKER. THE

REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE IS GENERALLY OPPOSED TO THESE PROPOSED

AMENDMENTS; HOWEVER, THOSE WHO SUPPORT THEM ARE CERTAINLY

ENCOURAGED TO VOTE YES HERE ON THE FLOOR. THANK YOU, MADAM

SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: MRS. PEOPLES-

STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MADAM SPEAKER, THE

MAJORITY CONFERENCE IS GOING TO BE IN FAVOR OF THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

THERE MAY BE A FEW WHO WOULD LIKE TO BE AN EXCEPTION. THEY SHOULD

FEEL FREE TO DO SO AT THEIR DESK. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER SHIMSKY: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ARE THERE ANY OTHER

VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

PAGE 6, RULES REPORT NO. 681, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01722-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 681, ZINERMAN, DINOWITZ, WALKER, SILLITTI, TAYLOR, BURGOS,

FALL, LEVENBERG, SIMON, AUBRY, JEAN-PIERRE, DE LOS SANTOS, TAPIA,

339

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

NOVAKHOV, SOLAGES, JACKSON, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, FORREST, SHRESTHA,

ZACCARO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE FORM IN

WHICH A PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION OR OTHER QUESTION

PROVIDED BY LAW TO BE SUBMITTED TO A STATEWIDE VOTE SHALL BE

SUBMITTED TO THE PEOPLE FOR THEIR APPROVAL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

ZINERMAN -- ZIMMERMAN [SIC], THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.

THE SENATE BILL IS ADVANCED.

AN EXPLANATION IS REQUESTED.

MS. ZINERMAN: CAN YOU ALL HEAR ME? OH, GREAT.

GOOD EVENING. I AM HAPPY TO STAND HERE AND PROVIDE AN EXPLANATION

AND CONTINUE THIS WONDERFUL CONVERSATION ABOUT EXPANDING OUR

DEMOCRACY. THIS BILL REQUIRES THAT THE PROPOSED CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENTS AND OTHER QUESTIONS BE SUBMITTED TO A STATEWIDE VOTE,

WILL BE SET FORTH ON A BALLOT IN PLAIN AND EASILY-UNDERSTOOD LANGUAGE

THAT IDENTIFIES PRACTICAL IMPACTS OF ADOPTING OR REJECTING THE

AMENDMENT OR OTHER MEASURE, AND REQUIRES NO MORE THAN AN EIGHTH-

GRADE READING LEVEL. ACADEMIC RESEARCH SHOWS THAT PLAIN LANGUAGE

HELPS VOTERS. RESEARCH ESTABLISHES THAT VOTERS RECOGNIZE THE DIFFERENCE

BETWEEN PLAIN LANGUAGE AND TRADITIONAL LANGUAGE BALLOTS AND PREFER

THOSE WRITTEN IN PLAIN LANGUAGE. VOTERS VOTE MORE ACCURATELY AND

QUICKLY ON PLAIN LANGUAGE BALLOTS AND ARE MORE LIKELY TO COMPLETE THE

ENTIRE BALLOT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD

340

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. ZINERMAN, WILL

YOU YIELD?

MS. ZINERMAN: YES, I WILL YIELD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU VERY MUCH. NOW, THIS

REQUIRES THAT A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT BE DESCRIBED IN EIGHTH-GRADE

ENGLISH OR SIMPLER, CORRECT?

MS. ZINERMAN: MM-HMM, WHAT WE LOVE.

MR. GOODELL: AND ALSO WITH A DESCRIPTIVE TITLE

THAT DOESN'T EXCEED 15 WORDS, CORRECT?

MS. ZINERMAN: IN -- IN -- PER SENTENCE, OR ARE YOU

SAYING IN TOTAL, IN TOTALITY?

MR. GOODELL: WELL, I SHOULD SAY A DESCRIPTIVE

TITLE OF UP TO 15 WORDS.

MS. ZINERMAN: OH, THE TITLE ITSELF.

MR. GOODELL: YES.

MS. ZINERMAN: LESS THAN, YES.

MR. GOODELL: AND A TOTAL DESCRIPTION NOT TO

EXCEED 30 WORDS; IS THAT CORRECT?

MS. ZINERMAN: THAT'S CORRECT.

MR. GOODELL: SO I APPLAUD THE OBJECTIVE OF

HAVING CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS WRITTEN IN SHORT, SIMPLE LANGUAGE.

MS. ZINERMAN: RIGHT.

MR. GOODELL: WHO DECIDES WHETHER THIS MEETS

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AN EIGHTH-GRADE READING LEVEL? DO WE HAVE A PANEL FROM STATE ED, FOR

EXAMPLE, AND --

MS. ZINERMAN: IN -- IN ADDITION, THERE ABOUT 80

ORGANIZATIONS WHO HAVE SIGNED ON TO THIS PARTICULAR PIECE OF

LEGISLATION, AND WE CONSULTED ALL OF THE NEW YORK STATE AND NEW YORK

CITY LITERACY EXPERTS TO WEIGH IN ON THIS LEGISLATION AND THEY'VE ALL

PROVIDED MEMOS OF SUPPORT, AND OF COURSE ONGOING SUPPORT IN HELPING

THE DEPARTMENT OF ELECTIONS, THE BOARD OF ELECTIONS, TO WORK ON THE

LANGUAGE FOR ANY BALLOT MEASURE.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, I MUST TELL YOU THAT I ENJOYED

THE DESCRIPTION OF HOW AN EIGHTH-GRADE READING LEVEL WOULD BE

CALCULATED, AND IT SAYS THE STATE BOARD OF ELECTION IS REQUIRED TO

CALCULATE AN AUTOMATED READABILITY INDEX SCORE. HARDLY EIGHTH-GRADE

LANGUAGE, SINCE MOST OF US PROBABLY DON'T KNOW WHAT AN AUTOMATED

READABILITY INDEX SCORE IS.

MS. ZINERMAN: IT'S LESS THAN 15 WORDS.

MR. GOODELL: IT'S LESS THAN 15 WORDS, AND IT'S

CALCULATED BY DIVIDING THE NUMBER OF CHARACTERS, EXCLUDING SPACES, BY

THE NUMBER OF WORDS AND MULTIPLYING THAT NUMBER BY 4.71, AND THEN

WE DIVIDE THAT NUMBER BY THE NUMBER OF WORDS AND THE NUMBER OF

SENTENCES AND MULTIPLY THAT NUMBER BY 0.5, ADD THE RESULTS OF

PARAGRAPH A AND B AND SUBTRACT 21.43 FROM THE RESULTS OF THAT AND

ROUND TO THE NEAREST WHOLE NUMBER.

MS. ZINERMAN: YES.

MR. GOODELL: COULD YOU EXPLAIN THAT FORMULA

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MORE TO ME AND --

MS. ZINERMAN: THAT'S WHY THE LITERACY -- SO THAT'S

WHY WE THE LITERACY EXPERTS WILL BE WORKING ON THAT SO THAT IT WOULD

NOT APPEAR ON THE BALLOT SO THAT THE VOTERS WOULD HAVE TO READ AND

COMPREHEND WHAT YOU JUST READ.

MR. GOODELL: THANK GOD.

MS. ZINERMAN: THANK GOD. THAT'S WHY WE

CONSULTED WITH THEM.

MR. GOODELL: WELL, SOMETIMES --

MS. ZINERMAN: YES.

MR. GOODELL: -- WE HAVE COMPLEX CONSTITUTIONAL

AMENDMENTS. IN FACT, JUST THIS LAST ELECTION CYCLE, RIGHT, WE HAD A

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT THAT DEALT WITH HOW WE WERE GOING TO

REDISTRICT THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

MS. ZINERMAN: YES.

MR. GOODELL: WHAT WAS THE AUTOMATED

READABILITY INDEX SCORE OF THAT BALLOT PROPOSITION; DO YOU KNOW?

MS. ZINERMAN: I MYSELF DID NOT CALCULATE THAT,

BUT I COULD READ ONE RECENT ONE AND -- AND REALLY ILLUSTRATE FOR PEOPLE

THE DIFFERENCE OF THE LANGUAGE. WOULD YOU LIKE TO HAVE THAT

ILLUSTRATION PROVIDED TO YOU?

MR. GOODELL: PROBABLY NOT TONIGHT, BUT PERHAPS

IN THE MORNING.

MS. ZINERMAN: OKAY. WELL, WE ONLY HAVE A LITTLE

WHILE LONGER FOR -- FOR MORNING. WE COULD PROBABLY DO IT IN THE NEXT

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

COUPLE OF MINUTES.

MR. GOODELL: WE COULD, BUT I HAVEN'T LINED UP

ANY OTHER DEBATERS. SO UNLIKE MS. PAULIN, THIS IS JUST A SHORT -- SHORT

DEBATE.

MS. ZINERMAN: OKAY, VERY GOOD. LUCKY ME.

MR. GOODELL: NOW, IF -- IF, FOR EXAMPLE, THE

BALLOT PROPOSITION IS MORE COMPLEX AND CANNOT BE DESCRIBED AT AN

EIGHTH-GRADE READING LEVEL WITH 30 WORDS OR LESS, IS THERE A MECHANISM

FOR AN EXCEPTION?

MS. ZINERMAN: SO, I WOULD PROBABLY PUSH BACK

ON THE IDEA THAT WE COULD NOT BREAK DOWN A VERY COMPLEX AMENDMENT

OR PROPOSAL INTO EIGHTH-GRADE LEVEL AND I'LL -- AND I'LL TELL YOU WHY. IT

REALLY STARTS OUT BY ASKING A VERY SIMPLE QUESTION, SO YOU WOULD ASK A

SIMPLE QUESTION. SO YOU ALL REMEMBER WHEN WE HAD NO EXCUSE

ABSENTEE BALLOTS, IT CAME UP THIS -- THIS EVENING. SO THE QUESTION

WOULD BE, SHOULD NEW YORK STATE ALLOW NO EXCUSE ABSENTEE BALLOT,

RIGHT? THE -- WHAT APPEARED ON THE BALLOT WAS ACTUALLY AN ENTIRE

PARAGRAPH OF WORDS THAT EXCEEDED 15 WORDS. AND THEN AT THE END WE

SIMPLY ASKED PEOPLE A YES VOTE WOULD ALLOW ANY VOTER TO USE AN

ABSENTEE BALLOT, A NO VOTE WOULD KEEP ABSENTEE BALLOTS IN PLACE. SO

VERY SIMPLE LANGUAGE GETTING TO THE ESSENCE OF WHAT THE MEASURE WAS

ATTEMPTING TO EXPLAIN, BUT PEOPLE OF ALL LEVELS UNDER EIGHTH GRADE, I

MEAN, EIGHTH GRADE AND UNDER WOULD BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND, OR EIGHTH

GRADE AND ABOVE, I'M SORRY, WOULD BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND.

MR. GOODELL: NOW THIS BILL WOULD APPLY TO THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

NEW YORK STATE ATTORNEY GENERAL WHO IS GIVEN THE RESPONSIBILITY OF

DRAFTING THAT LANGUAGE, CORRECT?

MS. ZINERMAN: MM-HMM.

MR. GOODELL: AND I SUPPOSE IF THE ATTORNEY

GENERAL FINDS THAT THE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT IS TOO COMPLEX AND

CANNOT BE DRAFTED IN SIMPLE LANGUAGE WITH 30 WORDS OR LESS SHE WOULD

HAVE TO COME BACK TO US?

MS. ZINERMAN: SHE WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK TO

US. SHE'D CONSULT WITH THE LITERACY EXPERTS AND THEN THEY WOULD

PROVIDE PRO -- PROPOSED LANGUAGE FOR HER FOR WHICH AT THAT POINT SHE

COULD ADOPT.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR HELPING

ME.

MS. ZINERMAN: YOU'RE SO WELCOME.

MR. GOODELL: ON THE BILL, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE BILL, MR.

GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: I ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH THE

OBJECTIVE OF MY COLLEAGUE TO HAVE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS

DESCRIBED IN SIMPLE LANGUAGE WITH THE TEXT NOT EXCEEDING 30 WORDS,

MEANING THE MEETING THE AUTOMATED READABILITY INDEX SCORE WHICH

INVOLVES A COMPLEX MULTI-VARIABLE FORMULA WHICH MIGHT EVEN BE

CHALLENGING FOR EIGHTH-GRADERS TO EVEN UNDERSTAND, MUCH LESS THOSE OF

US WHO HAVE NEVER REALLY DEALT WITH AN AUTOMATED READABILITY INDEX

SCORE. I'M -- I -- I WILL SUPPORT THE -- THE BILL BECAUSE I -- LIKE THE -- THE

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

PURPOSE. BUT I HAVE TO CAUTION MY COLLEAGUES THAT SOMETIMES WE HAVE

CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS THAT ARE COMPLEX. IT'S JUST THE NATURE OF

HAVING A CONSTITUTION. AND WHEN YOU WANT TO WRITE IN A LOWER LEVEL OF

ENGLISH, THOSE OF MY COLLEAGUES WHO KNOW ENGLISH AND WRITE FOR A

LIVING KNOW THAT IT SOMETIMES REQUIRES MORE WORDS. BECAUSE RATHER

THAN USING A SIMPLE PHRASE LIKE AUTOMATED READABILITY INDEX SCORE, YOU

HAVE TO ACTUALLY WRITE OUT IN SIMPLE LANGUAGE WHAT THAT MEANS. SO I

SUPPORT THE OBJECTIVE, I -- I APPRECIATE YOUR INTENT. I'M NOT SURE IT CAN

BE DONE, BUT IF IT CAN'T I'M SURE THE ATTORNEY GENERAL AND ANY PARTICULAR

AMENDMENT WILL COME BACK TO US AND ASK US FOR SPECIAL DISPENSATION.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, AND AGAIN, THANK YOU TO MY

COLLEAGUE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THANK YOU.

MR. PIROZZOLO.

MR. PIROZZOLO: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. WOULD

THE SPONSOR YIELD?

MS. ZINERMAN: I'LL YIELD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE SPONSOR YIELDS.

MR. PIROZZOLO: SO (INAUDIBLE) BEFORE I SAID GOOD

MORNING AND I'LL SAY GOOD MORNING TO YOU, TOO. IT'S ALMOST --

MS. ZINERMAN: GOOD MORNING.

MR. PIROZZOLO: -- IT'S ALMOST THERE. I LIKE YOUR

LEGISLATION. I WANT TO TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT OF A STORY TO GET TO MY

QUESTION.

MS. ZINERMAN: OKAY.

346

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MR. PIROZZOLO: RIGHT NOW, I AND MY CHILDREN

HAPPENED TO BE INVOLVED IN A LAWSUIT BECAUSE WE FELT THAT THE NEW

YORK STATE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION, THE NEW YORK STATE BOARD OF

REGENTS AND THE NEW YORK CITY DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION FAILED TO

PROVIDE AN ADEQUATE EDUCATION TO STUDENTS. AND PART OF THE

CONSTITUTION IS THAT WHEN WE GIVE STUDENTS AN EDUCATION, THAT PART OF

THAT EDUCATION IS SO THAT THEY CAN BE CIVIC-MINDED.

MS. ZINERMAN: ABSOLUTELY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: OKAY. SO, I'M GONNA ASK, AND I

DON'T MEAN ANYTHING NEGATIVE BY IT --

MS. ZINERMAN: OKAY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: HOW DID WE CHOOSE EIGHTH GRADE

FOR THE SIMPLE FACT THAT THERE ARE SO MANY SCHOOLS WITHIN OUR DISTRICTS

WHERE OUR CHILDREN CAN -- 90 TO 95 PERCENT OF THE CHILDREN IN THAT

SCHOOL CANNOT READ, WRITE OR DO MATHEMATICS AT GRADE LEVEL. THIS WAS

BEFORE COVID, AND WE KNOW THAT THE THINGS DROPPED -- HAVE DROPPED

PRECIPITOUSLY. SO, IT'S NOT THAT I -- I REALLY WANT THE ANSWER TO THAT

PARTICULAR QUESTION, BUT WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SAY IS THAT THERE'S SO MUCH

IMPROVEMENT THAT WE REALLY NEED TO DO, THAT WE SHOULDN'T NECESSARILY

BE DROPPING THE LITERACY SO PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND IT. WE SHOULD BE

INCREASING THE EDUCATION OF PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT

MORE COMPLEX. AND IF THERE WAS EVER A WAY THAT I COULD WORK WITH

YOU TO DO THAT, I WANT YOU TO COUNT ME AS AN ALLY.

MS. ZINERMAN: WELL, I WILL COUNT YOU AS AN ALLY

BECAUSE I ACTUALLY AGREE WITH YOUR -- YOUR ASSESSMENT THAT WE SHOULD

347

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

BE WORKING TO INCREASE THE LITERACY LEVEL IN OUR STATE. BUT I'LL TELL YOU

A LITTLE STORY OF MY OWN.

MR. PIROZZOLO: PLEASE.

MS. ZINERMAN: BEFORE COMING TO THE ASSEMBLY I

WORKED FOR AN ADULT LITERACY PROGRAM FOR 14 YEARS. AND IN THAT TIME

THE LITERACY LEVEL OF NEW YORKERS HAS ACTUALLY GOTTEN WORSE, SO WE ARE

NOW AT 25 PERCENT OF OUR POPULATION WHO ARE CONSIDERED LOW LITERACY

LEARNERS. 1.8 MILLION PEOPLE IN OUR STATE DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH OR ARE

CONSIDERED NON-PROFICIENT ENGLISH. BUT THEY LIVE HERE NOW AND THEY

HAVE THE RIGHT TO UNDERSTAND THE DECISIONS THAT WE ARE PROPOSING TO

THEM TO CHANGE OUR CONSTITUTION OR TO HAVE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS OR

QUESTIONS WITH REGARD TO HOW WE EITHER SPEND OUR MONEY OR HOW WE

CONDUCT THE BUSINESS OF THE STATE. AND SO WE THINK THAT THIS IS A FAIR

AND INCLUSIVE MEASURE TO HAVE BALLOT MEASURES BE IN THE SIMPLEST

LANGUAGE POSSIBLE SO THAT THOSE 16-YEAR-OLDS WHO WE'RE INVITING TO

VOTE AND THOSE WHO ARE CONSIDERED LOW LITERACY CAN PARTICIPATE FULLY IN

OUR DEMOCRACY.

MR. PIROZZOLO: I AGREE. IT STUNS ME EVERY YEAR

THAT WE CONTINUE TO FUND THE EDUCATION SYSTEM THAT WE HAVE --

MS. ZINERMAN: I AGREE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: -- WITH THE RESULTS THAT WE GET.

AND SOMETIMES PEOPLE MISTAKE MY COMMENTS FOR THINKING THAT I'M NOT

HAPPY WITH TEACHERS. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH TEACHERS.

MS. ZINERMAN: IT DOES NOT.

MR. PIROZZOLO: WE HAVE SOME OF THE BEST, MOST

348

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CARING TEACHERS THAT WE HAVE --

MS. ZINERMAN: I AGREE.

MR. PIROZZOLO: -- AND WE'RE FORTUNATE FOR THAT.

BUT WE DO, IN MY OPINION, HAVE A SYSTEM THAT DOES NOT WORK, THAT FAILS

OUR STUDENTS. AND I THINK WE REALLY HAVE TO STOP FUNDING SOMETHING

THAT WE KNOW IS BAD. THE DEFINITION OF INSANITY IS DOING THE SAME

THING OVER AND OVER AGAIN, EXPECTING DIFFERENT RESULTS, AND WE KEEP

DOING IT. SO AGAIN, I'D BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO HELP.

MS. ZINERMAN: I LOOK FORWARD TO THE -- TO THE

PARTNERSHIP AND ENSURING THAT OUR EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM IS IMPROVED,

BECAUSE RIGHT NOW I AM NOT HAPPY WITH THE FACT THAT WE ARE AT -- WHERE

ARE WE IN TERMS OF STATES? I CAN'T REMEMBER, I THINK WE'RE LIKE 44TH OUT

OF (INAUDIBLE) --

MR. PIROZZOLO: WE'RE AT THE BOTTOM.

MS. ZINERMAN: WE'RE AT THE BOTTOM, EXACTLY. SO I

WELCOME YOUR PARTNERSHIP. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

MR. PIROZZOLO: THANK YOU FOR THE LEGISLATION.

MS. ZINERMAN: YOU'RE WELCOME.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MS. ZINERMAN: ON THE BILL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. ZINERMAN TO

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

EXPLAIN HER VOTE. ON THE BILL OR YOU'RE EXPLAINING YOUR VOTE? WELL,

NOW YOU'RE EXPLAINING YOUR VOTE.

MS. ZINERMAN: I'M EXPLAINING MY VOTE. AS NEW

YORKERS WE VOTE ON CRITICAL CHANGES TO OUR STATE CONSTITUTION AND

WEIGH IN ON IMPORTANT FISCAL DECISIONS THAT WILL IMPACT THE ENTIRE STATE

IN THE FORM OF STATEWIDE BALLOT PROPOSALS. UNFORTUNATELY, TOO OFTEN

THESE QUESTIONS ARE CONVOLUTED AND OVERLY COMPLEX LANGUAGE AND ARE

IMPENETRATABLE [SIC] TO THE AVERAGE VOTER. THIS IS DUE TO THE ALARMING

REALITY IN OUR STATE, AGAIN, I STATE THAT NEARLY 25 PERCENT OF ALL NEW

YORKERS ARE LOW LITERACY OR NON-ENGLISH PROFICIENT. BY SIMPLIFYING THE

LANGUAGE AND ELIMINATING CONFUSION JARGON, WE EMPOWER VOTERS WITH

THE KNOWLEDGE AND CONFIDENCE TO MAKE INFORMED DECISIONS. WHEN

VOTERS FEEL HEARD AND ARE UNDERSTOOD THEY ARE MORE LIKELY TO ACTIVELY

PARTICIPATE IN THE ELECTORAL PROCESS, KNOWING THAT THEIR VOICES TRULY

MATTER.

SO I ASK ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES - AND IT LOOKS LIKE YOU

HAVE - TO JOIN ME UNANIMOUSLY IN SUPPORTING THIS GREAT PIECE OF

LEGISLATION. THANK YOU ALL.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. ZINERMAN IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

MR. NOVAKHOV TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. NOVAKHOV: I KNOW EVERYBODY HATES ME

BECAUSE I WANT TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE AT 11:45 P.M., BUT I'LL BE VERY SHORT.

YEAH, I CO -- COSPONSORED THIS BILL. I WANT TO THANK THE SPONSOR FOR

BRINGING THIS BILL. IN MY DISTRICT IN PARTICULAR, PEOPLE WERE STOPPING BY

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AT -- AT THE ELECTION DAY, AND THAT'S GONNA BE MY GOAL; WOULD YOU

EXPLAIN TO US WHAT IS WRITTEN HERE? AND SOMETIMES I, YOU KNOW,

MYSELF I -- I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT I WAS READING THERE. SO THANK YOU

SO MUCH, IT'S A GREAT BILL. THANK YOU.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. NOVAKHOV IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR. WELL,

IT'S BEEN A GREAT DAY SO FAR, NOW WE'RE WELL INTO THE EVENING. BUT WE

ARE GOING TO MOVE FORWARD AND ASK YOU TO PLEASE CONSENT OUR A-CA --

TO MOVE OUR A-CALENDAR SO WE CAN GO RIGHT INTO CONSENT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON MRS. PEOPLES-

STOKES' MOTION -- WE ADVANCED IT ALREADY.

PAGE 3, RULES REPORT NO. 666, THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00075-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 666, SAYEGH, GIBBS, AUBRY, SANTABARBARA, GUNTHER, CRUZ,

MCDONOUGH, BRABENEC, BEEPHAN, DESTEFANO, SLATER, FLOOD, SIMONE,

BUTTENSCHON. AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION

TO NOTIFICATION OF PAST AND PRESENT BUSINESSES AND THEIR EMPLOYEES OF

POTENTIAL ELIGIBILITY FOR THE SEPTEMBER 11TH VICTIM COMPENSATION

FUND AND THE WORLD TRADE CENTER HEALTH PROGRAM.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT --

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: OH, ON A MOTION BY

MR. SAYEGH, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON 270TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. SAYEGH TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. SAYEGH: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. I KNOW IT'S

BEEN A LONG DAY, BUT THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION IS REALLY CRUCIAL FOR ALL

NEW YORKERS AND EVEN THROUGHOUT THE NATION, POSSIBLY IN THE WORLD.

AFTER THE ATTACKS ON THE WORLD TRADE CENTER, SEPTEMBER 11, 2001, WE

REALIZED THAT AT THE TIME THE MESSAGING WITH REGARDS TO WHO WAS

ELIGIBLE FOR COMPENSATION AND HEALTHCARE BECAUSE OF MANY RESPIRATORY

AND CANCER-RELATED ILLNESSES, REALIZED THAT THE PEOPLE THAT WERE

RESPONDING WERE FIRST RESPONDERS. AND WHEN WE LOOKED AT THE DATA

OVER THE LAST 20-PLUS YEARS, OVER 80 PERCENT OF FIRST RESPONDERS

RESPONDED TO THE INFORMATION AVAILABLE AND APPLIED FOR THE BENEFITS

AVAILABLE. THE SAD PART ABOUT IS IT IS WE REALIZED THAT THE MESSAGING

WAS SO GEARED TO FIRST RESPONDERS THAT EVERYONE ELSE THAT WAS

ENCOURAGED TO GO BACK TO THE SITE OF THE ATTACKS BACK THEN WAS -- WAS

REALLY MISINFORMED BECAUSE THE AIR QUALITY WAS NOT SAFE. AND THERE'S

MANY INDIVIDUALS IN THE RETAIL INDUSTRY, PEOPLE THAT WERE INVOLVED WITH

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NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

RELIGIOUS INSTITUTIONS, FINANCIAL, HEALTHCARE, PEOPLE THAT WERE SICK AND

MANY THAT HAVE DIED AND NEVER KNEW THAT THEY WERE ELIGIBLE FOR THESE

BENEFITS. SO THIS LEGISLATION REQUIRES THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT

DEPARTMENT AND THE DEPARTMENT OF LABOR TO GIVE NOTICE TO BUSINESSES

PAST AND PRESENT, TO EMPLOYEES PAST AND PRESENT, TO JUST MAKE THEM

AWARE AND GIVE THEM NOTICE OF THE SERVICES THAT ARE AVAILABLE. SO THIS

IS REALLY CRUCIAL, IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO, AND 20-PLUS YEARS LATER SO

MANY PEOPLE ARE STILL SUFFERING AND THIS PROVIDES THEM THE PROPER

NOTICE TO GET THE CARE THEY NEED.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. SAYEGH ON -- IN

THE AFFIRMATIVE, EXCUSE ME.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00113-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 667, L. ROSENTHAL, BICHOTTE HERMELYN, RAGA. AN ACT TO

AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO PROVIDING MENSTRUAL

PRODUCTS IN NON-PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

ROSENTHAL, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT JULY 1ST.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

353

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00154-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 668, CRUZ, AUBRY, DESTEFANO, DICKENS, COOK, FALL,

EPSTEIN, WILLIAMS, MCMAHON, WEPRIN, VANEL, MCDONOUGH, RAMOS,

JACOBSON, STECK, LUPARDO, BRABENEC, BURGOS, DINOWITZ, COLTON,

ROZIC, REYES, LUCAS, CARROLL, THIELE, BUTTENSCHON, BENEDETTO,

SANTABARBARA, TAPIA, ANDERSON, SIMONE, ZACCARO, DE LOS SANTOS,

CUNNINGHAM, PHEFFER AMATO, RAGA, GIBBS, CHANDLER-WATERMAN,

DURSO, SILLITTI, ALVAREZ, ARDILA, LEE, DAVILA, L. ROSENTHAL. AN ACT TO

AMEND THE PENAL LAW, IN RELATION TO WAGE THEFT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

CRUZ -- ON A MOTION BY MS. CRUZ, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE.

THE SENATE BILL IS ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00295-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 669, CARROLL, SHRESTHA, DICKENS, LUPARDO, REYES, RIVERA,

ANDERSON, JACKSON, L. ROSENTHAL, THIELE, ARDILA, SEAWRIGHT, GUNTHER,

SANTABARBARA, KELLES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC OFF -- PUBLIC

SERVICE LAW, IN RELATION TO ADJUSTMENT OF ELECTRIC RESIDENTIAL FIXED

CHARGES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

CARROLL, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

354

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00372-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 670, BRONSON, SEAWRIGHT, DINOWITZ, GLICK, SIMONE,

SEPTIMO, KIM, EPSTEIN, BURDICK, SIMON, SILLITTI, CLARK, FORREST. AN

ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING THE

LESBIAN, GAY, BISEXUAL AND TRANSGENDER AND PEOPLE LIVING WITH HIV

LONG-TERM CARE FACILITY RESIDENTS' BILL OF RIGHTS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

BRONSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00530-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 671, WEPRIN, OTIS, PAULIN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE ELECTION

LAW, IN RELATION TO WATCHERS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

WEPRIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A00928, RULES REPORT

NO. 672, JACOBSON, PAULIN, EACHUS, MCDONALD, GIBBS, KIM, REYES.

AN ACT TO AMEND THE ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING ELECTORS TO

VOTE FOR THE PRESIDENTIAL AND VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE WHO WERE

NOMINATED BY THE POLITICAL PARTY THAT NOMINATED THE PRESIDENTIAL

ELECTOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

JACOBSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

355

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. JACOBSON TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. JACOBSON: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. AS EVERYONE IN THIS CHAMBER IS AWARE, WHEN WE

VOTE FOR PRESIDENT WE'RE NOT VOTING DIRECTLY FOR THE CANDIDATE FOR

PRESIDENT AND VICE PRESIDENT, WE'RE VOTING FOR ELECTORS. THUS, WE HAVE

THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE. WHAT THIS BILL WILL DO WHEN SIGNED INTO LAW, IT

WILL PROHIBIT FAITHLESS OR ROGUE ELECTORS SO THAT WHOEVER WINS THE

PRESIDENTIAL VOTE, THE ELECTORS WHICH -- WHO REPRESENT THAT PARTY MUST

VOTE FOR THE NOMINEE OF THAT PARTY. AND SHOULD THE ELECTOR REFUSE OR

FAIL TO DO THAT OR TRY TO VOTE FOR SOMEONE ELSE, IT WILL BE DEEMED A

RESIGNATION AND THERE WILL BE A SUBSTITUTION. SO THIS IS JUST ANOTHER WAY

OF MAKING SURE THAT THE ELECTIONS ARE RUN FAIRLY AND TO AVOID FRAUD.

BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT IF -- PEOPLE WOULD WANT TO KNOW THAT IF THEY'RE

VOTING FOR A CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT THAT THE ELECTORS WILL VOTE FOR THEIR

WISHES.

THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. JACOBSON IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01029-C, RULES

356

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REPORT NO. 673 IS HIGH.

ASSEMBLY NO. A01202-B, RULES REPORT NO. 674,

JOYNER, ARDILA, REYES, SIMON, TAYLOR, GIBBS, WALKER, ZACCARO, LUCAS,

LUNSFORD. AN ACT TO AMEND THE LABOR LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING

TRAINING TO REDUCE ABUSIVE CONDUCT AND BULLYING, AND CYBERBULLYING IN

THE WORKPLACE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01246, RULES REPORT

NO. 675, PEOPLES-STOKES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE LOCAL FINANCE LAW, IN

RELATION TO FACILITATING THE MARKETING OF ANY ISSUE OF SERIAL BONDS OR

NOTES OF THE CITY OF BUFFALO ISSUED ON OR BEFORE A CERTAIN DATE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

357

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. GOODELL.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, SIR. THIS -- THIS BILL

EXTENDS FOR ONE MORE YEAR THE AUTHORITY TO THE CITY OF BUFFALO TO

ARRANGE FOR THE PRIVATE SALE OF ITS -- OF ITS BONDS, ITS DEBT, RATHER THAN

FOLLOWING A COMPETITIVE BID PROCEDURE THAT APPLIES TO VIRTUALLY EVERY

OTHER MUNICIPALITY ACROSS THE STATE, AND I THINK THE EXPERIENCE HAS

GENERALLY SHOWN THAT A COMPETITIVE BID SALE GIVES US THE BEST PRICE,

AVOIDS QUESTIONS OF COLLUSION OR FAVORITISM AND -- AND IS IN THE BEST

INTEREST OF THE PUBLIC. THIS WAS ORIGINALLY AUTHORIZED WHEN THE CITY OF

BUFFALO WAS FACING A SERIOUS FINANCIAL SITUATION; I THINK THEY ACTUALLY

HAD A CONTROL BOARD. THANKFULLY, THE CITY OF BUFFALO IS DOING MUCH

BETTER NOW AND I'M NOT SURE THAT THEY NEED THAT SAME LEVEL OF -- OF

AUTHORITY.

FOR THAT REASON I WILL NOT BE SUPPORTING IT. I DID ASK

THAT THIS BE A FAST VOTE, RECOGNIZING, HOWEVER, THAT IT IS A LOCAL BILL.

THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

NEGATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01256-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 676, ZEBROWSKI, SIMON, WILLIAMS, BURGOS, PAULIN,

WALLACE, K. BROWN, SIMONE. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW,

358

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IN RELATION TO CHILDREN'S NON-REGULATED CAMPS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

ZEBROWSKI, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01297-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 677, BICHOTTE HERMELYN, SIMON, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, REYES,

COLTON, WALKER, GIBBS, KELLES, FORREST. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC

HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING HOSPITALS TO ADOPT, IMPLEMENT AND

PERIODICALLY UPDATE STANDARD PROTOCOLS FOR THE MANAGEMENT OF FETAL

DEMISE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 30TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

359

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01514, RULES REPORT

NO. 678, J.M. GIGLIO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TOWN LAW AND THE PUBLIC

OFFICERS LAW, IN RELATION TO AUTHORIZING THE TOWN JUSTICE OF THE TOWN

OF RUSHFORD, COUNTY OF ALLEGANY, TO BE A NONRESIDENT OF SUCH TOWN.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01673-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 679, HUNTER, DINOWITZ, BRONSON, RAGA, LAVINE, ALVAREZ,

MCDONALD, PAULIN, GUNTHER, SEAWRIGHT, SEPTIMO, THIELE, SHIMSKY, DE

LOS SANTOS, STECK, DAVILA, L. ROSENTHAL, SANTABARBARA, WILLIAMS,

BICHOTTE HERMELYN, FAHY, BUTTENSCHON, BURDICK, SIMONE, JACOBSON,

BENEDETTO, AUBRY, CRUZ, CLARK, SIMON, ARDILA, ZEBROWSKI, DICKENS,

CUNNINGHAM, BURGOS, DURSO, MAHER, BRABENEC, SLATER, MANKTELOW,

DESTEFANO, BARCLAY, EACHUS, MAGNARELLI, NOVAKHOV, LEVENBERG,

WEPRIN, MEEKS, ROZIC, PRETLOW, REYES, PHEFFER AMATO, WALKER, KIM,

TAYLOR, BURKE, HYNDMAN, RAMOS, WALLACE, SOLAGES. AN ACT TO AMEND

THE INSURANCE LAW AND THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW, IN RELATION TO

REQUIRING HEALTH INSURANCE POLICIES AND MEDICAID TO COVER BIOMARKER

360

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

TESTING FOR CERTAIN PURPOSES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

HUNTER, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT APRIL 1,

2024.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MS. HUNTER TO EXPLAIN HER VOTE.

MS. HUNTER: YES. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE. IT HAS BEEN A -- A PRIVILEGE AND HONOR TO BE ABLE TO

CARRY THIS BILL IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK, WORKING WITH THE -- THE FOLKS,

MANY DIFFERENT WONDERFUL ORGANIZATIONS LIKE THE AMERICAN CANCER

SOCIETY. THIS IS FOR MY MOM WHO DIED OF CANCER, AND MY HUSBAND

WHO'S HAD CANCER, AND BOTH MY SISTERS THAT WILL DEFINITELY ALLOW FOLKS

WHO HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH CANCER TO BE ABLE TO GET BIOMARKER

TESTING TO REALLY HONE IN AND PROVIDE HEALTHCARE PROVIDERS TO GIVE THEM

THE -- THE NECESSARY TREATMENT REALLY TARGETED FOR THEIR ILLNESS. THIS IS

EXPANSION, OF COURSE, THAT THEY HAVE BEEN ALLOWING BIOMARKER TESTING

FOR SEVERAL YEARS, BUT THIS REALLY IS STATE-OF-THE-ART, WE'RE -- WE'RE

JOINING TEN OTHER STATES WHO ARE ALREADY DOING THIS, INCLUDING OUR -- OUR

FRIENDS IN TEXAS WHO PASSED THIS BILL BEFORE WE DID.

SO I APPRECIATE ALL OF MY COLLEAGUES WHO HAVE BEEN

COSPONSORS AND WHO HAVE BEEN LISTENING TO THE STORIES OF THOSE FOLKS

361

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AFFECTED BY CANCER AND MANY OTHER ILLNESSES WHO WILL NOW BE ABLE TO

HAVE THIS WONDERFUL DIAGNOSTIC TESTING. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MS. HUNTER IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A01721-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 680, CUNNINGHAM, RIVERA, L. ROSENTHAL. AN ACT TO AMEND

THE PUBLIC SERVICE LAW, IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING ELECTRIC VEHICLE

CHARGING STATION RELIABILITY REPORTING AND STANDARDS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. PALMESANO TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. PALMESANO: YES. THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER

AND MY COLLEAGUES, TO EXPLAIN MY VOTE. I KNOW THIS IS GOING TO COME

AS A BIG SHOCK TO EVERYONE IN THIS CHAMBER, BUT I'M NOT A BIG

PROPONENT AND ADVOCATE OF ELECTRIC VEHICLES.

(JEERS)

NO, NO, I KNOW IT'S TRUE, REALLY. JUST IT'S TRUE, SO I DON'T

WANT TO SHOCK YOU THIS LATE. BUT THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS I UNDERSTAND

THIS IS THE PATHWAY WE'RE HEADING DOWN AS A STATE, AND I'VE BEEN

362

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

OPPOSED TO THESE FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS, BUT RELIABILITY AND RANGE

ISSUES ARE A BIG PROPONENT -- BIG ISSUE WITH ELECTRIC VEHICLES, AND I

THINK THIS LEGISLATION IS A GOOD THING. I'M GOING TO BE SUPPORTING IT

BECAUSE WE NEED TO ADDRESS THE RELIABILITY OF OUR ELECTRIC VEHICLES. BUT

I ALSO JUST WOULD URGE MY COLLEAGUES TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION WITH

THIS ALONG -- THERE ARE SAFETY ISSUES WITH THIS. WE KNOW THERE ARE VERY

DANGERS AND REAL DANGERS OF EV FIRES WE SEE HAPPENING OVER AND OVER

AGAIN, SO IT'S MY HOPE WHEN WE ARE LOOKING AT THESE E -- EV CHARGING

STATIONS, WHETHER THEY'RE IN GARAGES OR ALONG THE ROAD, WHEREVER IT MAY

BE, THAT WE LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, SAFETY FOR EMERGENCY SHUTOFFS AND FIRE

SUPPRESSION SYSTEMS TO -- WATER SUPPRESSION SYSTEMS TO STOP FIRES FROM

HAPPENING BECAUSE THAT'S A REAL SAFETY ISSUE. ALSO, I'M VERY CONCERNED,

DEPENDING ON WHERE THESE ARE, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES WHEN YOU GO TO

THESE CHARGING STATIONS IT TAKES A LONG TIME TO CHARGE AND I JUST WORRY

ABOUT FAMILIES AND MAYBE IF IT'S A MOTHER AND HER CHILDREN ALONE IN A --

IN A RURAL AREA, WHEREVER THEY MAY BE, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THERE'S

LIGHTING AND SECURITY AND CAMERAS AND MAKE SURE -- BECAUSE WE DON'T

WANT CRIME TO HAPPEN IN THESE AREAS, WHICH IT COULD, ESPECIALLY IF

YOU'RE THERE FOR A PROLONGED PERIOD OF TIME THAT CAN LEAVE THAT OPEN.

AND FINALLY, I'D BE REMISS IF I DIDN'T MENTION AS WE

MAKE THIS PUSH FOR EVS, LET US PLEASE NOT FORGET, THERE ARE CHILDREN IN

THE CONGO RIGHT NOW THAT ARE -- ARE HAND MINING AND EXTRACTING COBALT

TO PRODUCE THE -- THE -- THE COBALT TO PRODUCE LITHIUM ION BATTERIES THAT

ARE USED TO POWER THESE ELECTRIC VEHICLES. SO IT'S MY HOPE AS WE

CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD AND THIS PASSED, THIS CHAMBER WILL KEEP THAT

363

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IN CONSIDERATION AND MAYBE TAKE SOME ACTION TO ADDRESS THAT ISSUE AS

WELL.

SO BUT I WILL BE SUPPORTING THIS LEGISLATION, I THINK IT'S

A GOOD BILL SO I VOTE YES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. PALMESANO IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A02452, RULES REPORT

NO. 682, JONES. CONCURRENT RESOLUTION OF THE SENATE AND ASSEMBLY

PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO SECTION 1 OF ARTICLE XIV OF THE

CONSTITUTION, IN RELATION TO THE MOUNT VAN HOEVENBERG OLYMPIC

SPORTS COMPLEX IN ESSEX COUNTY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

JONES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

364

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, IF YOU WILL

PLEASE CALL THE RULES COMMITTEE TO THE SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: RULES COMMITTEE,

SPEAKER'S CONFERENCE ROOM IMMEDIATELY, PLEASE.

THE CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A02816, RULES REPORT

NO. 683, JONES, SIMPSON. CONCURRENT RESOLUTION OF THE SENATE AND

THE ASSEMBLY PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO SECTION 1 OF ARTICLE XIV OF

THE CONSTITUTION, IN RELATION TO CONVEYING LAND TO DEBAR POND INSTITUTE,

INC., IN ORDER TO FACILITATE THE PRESERVATION OF HISTORIC BUILDINGS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ARE THERE ANY OTHER

VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A02818, RULES REPORT

NO. 684, FITZPATRICK. AN ACT TO AMEND CHAPTER 397 OF THE LAWS OF

1996, RELATING TO AUTHORIZING THE TOWN OF ISLIP TO LEASE CERTAIN LANDS TO

A BUSINESS CORPORATION, IN RELATION TO THE LEASE TERM.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY

FITZPATRICK, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

365

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGING [SIC] IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL HAS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A03116-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 685, HUNTER, JEAN-PIERRE. AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL

MUNICIPAL LAW AND THE VETERAN'S SERVICE LAW, IN RELATION TO DIRECTING

COUNTIES AND THE CITY OF NEW YORK TO REQUEST A CONGRESSIONALLY

CHARTERED VETERANS' ORGANIZATION TO ARRANGE FOR THE FUNERAL AND BURIAL

OF DECEASED VETERAN WHO HAS NO NEXT OF KIN OR OTHER PERSON TO MAKE

SUCH ARRANGEMENTS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MS.

HUNTER, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT JANUARY 1ST.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

366

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A03412-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 686, EPSTEIN, SIMON, BURDICK, SEAWRIGHT, KELLES,

GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, MEEKS, FORREST, MAMDANI, CRUZ, TAYLOR, CARROLL,

SHRESTHA, RIVERA, RAGA, GIBBS, DARLING, AUBRY, PRETLOW, GALLAGHER,

ARDILA, CUNNINGHAM, ANDERSON, BURGOS, BORES, WALKER, LEVENBERG,

NOVAKHOV, REYES, SEPTIMO, DE LOS SANTOS, SOLAGES, JACKSON, GLICK,

SIMONE, CHANDLER-WATERMAN, ALVAREZ, BRONSON, CLARK, L. ROSENTHAL,

HEVESI, TAPIA, MITAYNES, DICKENS, ZACCARO, BICHOTTE HERMELYN, LEE,

LUCAS, OTIS. CONCURRENT RESOLUTION OF THE SENATE AND ASSEMBLY

PROPOSING AN AMENDMENT TO ARTICLE 1 OF THE CONSTITUTION, IN RELATION TO

THE ABOLITION OF SLAVERY FOR PERSONS CONVICTED OF CRIMES.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

EPSTEIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04018, RULES REPORT

NO. 687, PHEFFER AMATO, WOERNER, JONES, WALLACE, BURDICK, ROZIC,

TAPIA, LAVINE, ZEBROWSKI, SILLITTI, GUNTHER, STERN, THIELE, FAHY,

LUPARDO, CLARK, CONRAD, AUBRY, RAMOS, FALL, COLTON, BARRETT,

DESTEFANO, DURSO, DARLING, JEAN-PIERRE, J.A. GIGLIO, BUTTENSCHON,

SAYEGH, WALSH, ANGELINO, SANTABARBARA. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

RETIREMENT AND SOCIAL SECURITY LAW, IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING A

TWENTY YEAR RETIREMENT PLAN FOR MEMBERS OR OFFICERS OF LAW

ENFORCEMENT.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: READ THE LAST

367

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IN 60 DAYS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04048-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 688, GANDOLFO. AN ACT AUTHORIZING THE GRACE GOSPEL

CHURCH OF SUFFOLK TO FILE AN APPLICATION FOR RETROACTIVE REAL PROPERTY

TAX EXEMPTION.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

GANDOLFO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04055-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 689, JACOBSON, EACHUS, GUNTHER, SHRESTHA, GALLAGHER,

ARDILA, BUTTENSCHON, COLTON, SHIMSKY, THIELE, SEAWRIGHT, CLARK,

368

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

DICKENS, MILLER, BRABENEC, K. BROWN, SIMON, RAGA, SANTABARBARA.

AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC SERVICE LAW, IN RELATION TO THE FINALITY OF

CERTAIN UTILITY CHARGES AND THE CONTENTS OF UTILITY BILLS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

JACOBSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04529, RULES REPORT

NO. 691, STIRPE, DICKENS, LUPARDO, REYES, HEVESI, BURGOS, GLICK,

SIMON, JEAN-PIERRE, FAHY, MAGNARELLI, MCMAHON, COLTON. AN ACT TO

AMEND THE GENERAL BUSINESS LAW, IN RELATION TO THE SECURE CHOICE

SAVINGS PROGRAM AND PARTICIPATING INDIVIDUALS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

STIRPE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. THE CLERK WILL READ -- I'M SORRY, READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04599-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 692, WEPRIN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE INSURANCE LAW, IN

RELATION TO CERTAIN CHARITABLE ANNUITIES.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

369

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

WEPRIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IN 90 DAYS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04611-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 693, JEAN-PIERRE. AN ACT TO AMEND THE VETERANS' SERVICES

LAW, THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW AND THE VEHICLE AND TRAFFIC LAW, IN

RELATION TO REMOVING THE REQUIREMENT THAT A VETERAN SERVED DURING

WARTIME TO BE GRANTED CERTAIN BENEFITS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: READ THE LAST

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04618-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 694, PEOPLES-STOKES, LUPARDO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

370

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

CRIMINAL PROCEDURE LAW, IN RELATION TO MAKING TECHNICAL CORRECTIONS

REGARDING THE UNLAWFUL POSSESSION AND SALE OF CANNABIS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE

BILL IS ADVANCED. THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04876, RULES REPORT

NO. 695, SOLAGES, SIMON, PHEFFER AMATO, THIELE, HEVESI, DARLING,

STERN, ANDERSON, SHIMSKY, MAMDANI, REYES, STIRPE, KELLES, LUNSFORD,

WALLACE, SHRESTHA. AN ACT TO AMEND THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW, IN

RELATION TO PROVIDING FOR THE AUTOMATED IDENTIFICATION OF AFFORDABILITY

PROGRAM PARTICIPANTS.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MS.

SOLAGES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A04942-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 696, FORREST, TAYLOR, DARLING, HYNDMAN, LEVENBERG,

SILLITTI, MAHER, SIMON, RAGA, OTIS, MCDONALD, CHANDLER-WATERMAN,

CLARK, PRETLOW, DE LOS SANTOS, TAPIA, ALVAREZ, GIBBS, REYES,

371

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SEPTIMO, EPSTEIN, WEPRIN, ZACCARO, STIRPE, MAMDANI, SHRESTHA,

GALLAGHER, CUNNINGHAM, MITAYNES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE EDUCATION

LAW, IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING POLICIES FOR THE AWARDING OF

POSTHUMOUS DEGREES.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: READ THE LAST

SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05092, RULES REPORT

NO. 697, OTIS, SAYEGH, LEVENBERG. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PENAL LAW, IN

RELATION TO FEES CHARGED FOR A LICENSE TO CARRY OR POSSESS A PISTOL OR

REVOLVER IN THE COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: ON A MOTION BY MR.

OTIS, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS ADVANCED.

HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER EACHUS: THE CLERK WILL

RECORD THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ARE THERE ANY OTHER

372

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05324, RULES REPORT

NO. 698, NORRIS, PIROZZOLO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE NOT-FOR-PROFIT

CORPORATION LAW, IN RELATION TO EXEMPTING THE CRITTENDEN VOLUNTEER

FIRE DEPARTMENT, INC. FROM THE FORTY-FIVE PERCENT LIMIT ON NON-RESIDENT

MEMBERS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

NORRIS, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05381, RULES REPORT

NO. 699, PAULIN, SAYEGH, ARDILA, DE LOS SANTOS. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

SOCIAL SERVICES LAW, IN RELATION TO DETERMINATION AND APPROVAL OF

REIMBURSEMENT RATES FOR MANAGED CARE PROVIDERS UNDER MEDICAID.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

PAULIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

373

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05394, RULES REPORT

NO. 700, JOYNER, ALVAREZ, HEVESI, HYNDMAN, REYES, JACKSON, WALKER,

RAGA, TAPIA, KELLES, CLARK. AN ACT TO AMEND THE FAMILY COURT ACT

AND THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW, IN RELATION TO ESTABLISHING PROCEDURES

REGARDING ORDERS OF POST-TERMINATION VISITATION AND/OR CONTACT BETWEEN

A CHILD AND SUCH CHILD'S PARENT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

JOYNER, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05468-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 701, GUNTHER, ZEBROWSKI, WALLACE, GLICK, SANTABARBARA,

BUTTENSCHON, OTIS, SAYEGH. AN ACT TO AMEND THE GENERAL BUSINESS

LAW, IN RELATION TO THE USE OF VOICE RECOGNITION FEATURES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IN 120 DAYS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

374

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05630, RULES REPORT

NO. 702, JONES, PHEFFER AMATO, BUTTENSCHON, SILLITTI, AUBRY,

SANTABARBARA. AN ACT TO AMEND THE RETIREMENT AND SOCIAL SECURITY

LAW, IN RELATION TO ALLOWING BENEFICIARIES OF CERTAIN DECEASED

MEMBERS TO ELECT TO RECEIVE DEATH BENEFITS IN A LUMP SUM.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05710, RULES REPORT

NO. 703, PHEFFER AMATO, FALL, SANTABARBARA, COLTON, BUTTENSCHON. AN

ACT TO AMEND THE RETIREMENT AND SOCIAL SECURITY LAW, IN RELATION TO

CERTAIN DISABILITIES OF UNIVERSITY POLICE OFFICERS APPOINTED BY THE STATE

UNIVERSITY OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

375

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05718-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 704, KELLES, FAHY, LEVENBERG, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, ARDILA,

MCMAHON, OTIS, BRONSON, LUNSFORD, EPSTEIN, CLARK, SHRESTHA,

BURDICK, REYES, CONRAD, SHIMSKY, STIRPE, JACOBSON, SIMONE, STECK,

BURGOS, BORES, MCDONALD, L. ROSENTHAL, RAGA. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

INSURANCE LAW AND THE VEHICLE AND TRAFFIC LAW, IN RELATION TO OWNER'S

POLICIES OF LIABILITY INSURANCE ISSUED BY A RISK RETENTION GROUP NO

CHARTERED WITHIN THIS STATE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

KELLES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05734-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 705, PRETLOW, DINOWITZ, REYES, BURGOS, SAYEGH,

376

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

MCMAHON, COLTON, HYNDMAN, AUBRY, TAYLOR, WILLIAMS, SOLAGES,

ROZIC, KELLES, CUNNINGHAM, CRUZ, CHANDLER-WATERMAN, GUNTHER,

BENEDETTO, LUNSFORD, LEVENBERG, SANTABARBARA, STERN, GIBBS, WALLACE,

DAVILA, COOK, ANDERSON, ALVAREZ, ZINERMAN, JOYNER, SEPTIMO,

BENDETT, K. BROWN, MORINELLO, PIROZZOLO, DESTEFANO, FLOOD, HEVESI,

MEEKS, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, SIMONE, LUCAS, PEOPLES-STOKES, L.

ROSENTHAL. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC HEALTH LAW, IN RELATION TO

CONDUCTING EDUCATION AND OUTREACH PROGRAMS FOR INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE

SUFFERED A PREGNANCY LOSS OR INFANT LOSS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

PRETLOW, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. PRETLOW TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. PRETLOW: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER, I'D LIKE TO

EXPLAIN MY VOTE AND I WOULD ASK YOU FOR A LITTLE INDULGENCE ON MY

TIME. LAST YEAR, KAI (PHONETIC), FORMERLY OF MY OFFICE, AND HER

PARTNER, CHRIS, WERE PREGNANT WITH THEIR BABY GIRL, AVA. JUST BEFORE

KAI'S THIRD TRIMESTER, THE COUPLE RECEIVED THE NEWS THAT AVA WASN'T

GOING TO SURVIVE. AND THIS EARTH-SHATTERING PAINFUL EXPERIENCE FOR

THEM. SO MANY NEW YORKERS GET THIS SAME INFORMATION. AFTER LOSING

377

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AVA, THE COUPLE WAS GIVEN A STAMP OF AVA'S TINY FOOTPRINTS,

INFORMATION TO CALL WHEN THEY'RE READY TO SEARCH FOR A FUNERAL HOME,

AND AN EMERGENCY MEDICAL NUMBER. NOTHING ELSE, THAT WAS IT.

BUT HER BODY DIDN'T FULLY REALIZE WHAT JUST HAPPENED.

HERE'S WHAT I MEAN. THE BODY STARTS TO PREPARE FOR WHAT IT DOES AFTER A

BABY IS BORN. SO KAI THEN BEGAN TO EXPERIENCE POST-PARTUM

SYMPTOMS, A DROP IN HORMONES, BREAST ENGORGEMENT, MILK PRODUCTION,

TERRIBLE POST-PARTUM STRESS AND DEPRESSION. BUT AS AWFUL AS THIS WAS,

KAI HAD RESOURCES. THANKFULLY, SHE AND CHRIS HAD A DUELLA, NAMED

MICHELLE WHO WAS ABLE TO HELP THEM NAVIGATE THESE CHALLENGES AND

PROVIDE THEM WITH THE RESOURCES AND INFORMATION THEY NEEDED. THEY

COULD ALSO AFFORD TO SEEK OUT THERAPISTS AND MEDICAL AND EMOTIONAL

SERVICES.

UNFORTUNATELY IN NEW YORK, THIS LEVEL OF SUPPORT IS

NOT A -- IS A PRIVILEGE AND MANY DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO IT. THEN KAI

REALIZED THAT NO MATTER HOW GOOD NEW YORK IS ON WOMEN'S HEALTH,

THERE WAS A MAJOR GAP BECAUSE THERE'S NO MANDATE IN NEW YORK'S

HEALTH SYSTEM TO PROVIDE THOSE EXPERIENCING SUCH LOSS WITH

INFORMATION AND RESOURCES FOR WHAT HAPPENS NEXT AND WHO TO REACH OUT

TO. SO THAT'S WHEN KAI CAME TO ME SO WE COULD FIND A SOLUTION IN THE

LEGISLATURE TO GIVE THOSE EXPERIENCING PREGNANCY LOSS THE SUPPORT AND

RESOURCES THEY NEED, AND TO CREATE A SYSTEM WHERE THOSE EXPERIENCING

PREGNANCY LOSS WON'T FEEL ALONE.

UNDER AVA'S LAW, HOSPITALS AND BIRTHING CENTERS MUST

PROVIDE INFORMATION WHEN THE UNTHINKABLE HAPPENS. THEY WILL LET

378

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THOSE EXPERIENCING PREGNANCY LOSS KNOW THE PHYSICAL AND MENTAL

SYMPTOMS TO EXPECT, WHERE TO TURN, WHAT TO ASK AND WHAT RESOURCES ARE

AVAILABLE. UNDER AVA'S LAW, THOSE WHO DO NOT HAVE THE RESOURCES OR

WORK OF SUPPORT CAN GET ANSWERS AND NOT BE LEFT ALONE. I'M PROUD TO BE

HERE TODAY TO SEE AVA'S LAW PASSED IN THE ASSEMBLY AND FORMALLY

PASSED IN THE SENATE, AND I'M GRATEFUL AND PROUD TO KNOW THAT KAI IS AN

AWESOME YOUNG WOMAN WHO FOUGHT FOR THIS, AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO --

YEAH, I GET EMOTIONAL NOW. I'M SORRY. LOOKING FORWARD TO THE PASSAGE

OF THIS AND I'M JUST THANKFUL THAT SHE HAD THE FORESIGHT TO DO THIS AND

MAKE THIS A LAW IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK. SO I PROUDLY VOTE YES,

THANK YOU.

(APPLAUSE)

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. PRETLOW --

(APPLAUSE)

MR. PRETLOW IN THE AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05774-A RULES

REPORT NO. 706, FRIEND, PALMESANO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN

RELATION TO EXTENDING THE AUTHORIZATION OF THE COUNTY OF CHEMUNG TO

IMPOSE AN ADDITIONAL ONE PERCENT OF SALE AND COMPENSATING USE TAXES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

FRIEND, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

379

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05844-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 707, DESTEFANO. AN ACT IN RELATION TO AUTHORIZING THE

ASSESSOR OF THE TOWN OF BROOKHAVEN, COUNTY OF SUFFOLK TO ACCEPT AN

APPLICATION FOR A REAL PROPERTY TAX EXEMPTION FROM DE BATHESDA

EGLISE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

DESTEFANO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05879-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 708, SEAWRIGHT, MCDONALD, GUNTHER, ALVAREZ, MCMAHON,

LUNSFORD, SANTABARBARA. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PRIVATE HOUSING FINANCE

380

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

LAW, THE PUBLIC AUTHORITIES LAW AND THE NEW YORK STATE MEDICAL

CARE FACILITIES FINANCE AGENCY ACT, IN RELATION TO REPLACING THE TERMS

"MENTALLY RETARDED" AND "MENTAL RETARDATION" AND VARIANTS THEREOF WITH

"DEVELOPMENTALLY DISABLED" AND "DEVELOPMENTAL DISABILITY".

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

SEAWRIGHT, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05927, RULES REPORT

NO. 709, THIELE. AN ACT PERMITTING THE VILLAGE BOARD OF THE VILLAGE OF

SOUTHAMPTON TO PROVIDE HEALTH INSURANCE COVERAGE FOR ENROLLED

MEMBERS OF THE SOUTHAMPTON VILLAGE OCEAN RESCUE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: HOME RULE MESSAGE

IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

381

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A05931, RULES REPORT

NO. 710, THIELE. AN ACT PERMITTING THE TOWN BOARD OF THE TOWN OF

EAST HAMPTON TO PROVIDE HEALTH INSURANCE COVERAGE FOR ENROLLED

MEMBERS OF THE EAST HAMPTON VOLUNTEER OCEAN RESCUE AND AUXILIARY

SQUAD.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: HOME RULE MESSAGE

IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06040, RULES REPORT

NO. 711, BRONSON, CRUZ, ROZIC, SIMON, REYES, BICHOTTE HERMERLYN,

SEAWRIGHT, DICKENS, HEVESI, GALLAGHER, DINOWITZ, BURGOS, KELLES,

MITAYNES, BURDICK, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, EPSTEIN, GLICK, L. ROSENTHAL,

BORES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE LABOR LAW, IN RELATION TO ENACTING THE

"FREELANCE ISN'T FREE ACT".

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

BRONSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

382

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 180TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06049, RULES REPORT

NO. 712, MCMAHON. AN ACT TO AMEND THE SOCIAL SERVICES LAW, IN

RELATION TO MEDICAL ASSISTANCE TO CERTAIN DISABLED INDIVIDUALS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

MCMAHON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06100, RULES REPORT

NO. 713, WEPRIN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE ADMINISTRATIVE CODE OF THE

CITY OF NEW YORK, IN RELATION TO REPAIR OR REPLACEMENTS OF DAMAGED

RESIDENTIAL LATERAL SEWER AND WATER PIPES.

383

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

WEPRIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06132-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 714, CARROLL, THIELE, BURGOS. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

ELECTION LAW, IN RELATION TO REGISTRATION OF VOTERS DURING EARLY VOTING.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

CARROLL, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06167, RULES REPORT

NO. 715, DIPIETRO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PARKS, RECREATION AND

HISTORIC PRESERVATION LAW, IN RELATION TO THE USE OF SNOWMOBILES IN THE

TOWN OF CONCORD, COUNTY OF ERIE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

DIPIETRO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06171, RULES REPORT

NO. 716, MORINELLO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN RELATION TO

384

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

AUTHORIZING THE COUNTY OF NIAGARA TO CONTINUE TO IMPOSE AN ADDITIONAL

RATE OF SALES AND COMPENSATING USE TAXES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

MORINELLO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06289-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 717, HEVESI, GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS. AN ACT TO AMEND THE FAMILY

COURT ACT, IN RELATION TO THE CONFIDENTIALITY AND EXPUNGEMENT OF

RECORDS IN JUVENILE DELINQUENCY CASES IN THE FAMILY COURT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06310-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 718, K. BROWN. AN ACT RELATING TO ESTABLISHING THE POWER

PLANT TAX ASSESSMENT CHALLENGE RESERVE FUND.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

385

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06567, RULES REPORT

NO. 719, DIPIETRO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE HIGHWAY LAW, IN RELATION TO

DESIGNATING A PORTION OF THE STATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM AS THE "SPECIALIST

PETER J. LORETTO, JR. MEMORIAL BRIDGE".

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

DIPIETRO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06624-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 720, DIPIETRO. AN ACT TO AMEND THE HIGHWAY LAW, IN

RELATION TO DESIGNATING A PORTION OF THE STATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM AS

"SPECIALIST GERALD B. PENN MEMORIAL BRIDGE".

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

DIPIETRO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

386

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06689-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 721, GANDOLFO. AN ACT IN RELATION TO AUTHORIZING THE

CHABAD OF ISLIP TOWNSHIP, INC. TO RECEIVE RETROACTIVE REAL PROPERTY TAX

EXEMPT STATUS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

GANDOLFO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06701-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 722, SLATER. AN ACT TO AUTHORIZE THE TOWN OF YORKTOWN,

COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER, TO DISCONTINUE AS PARKLANDS AND LEASE CERTAIN

LANDS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

387

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

SLATER, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06738, RULES REPORT

NO. 723, TAGUE. AN ACT TO AMEND THE CRIMINAL PROCEDURE LAW, IN

RELATION TO PERMITTING CERTAIN DEFENDANTS IN A CRIMINAL ACTION IN

DELAWARE, OTSEGO OR SCHOHARIE COUNTY TO APPEAR ELECTRONICALLY, WITH

THE APPROVAL OF THE COURT.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

TAGUE -- READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06812-B, RULES

REPORT NO. 724, SIMPSON. AN ACT TO AMEND THE PUBLIC OFFICERS LAW,

388

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IN RELATION TO WAIVING THE RESIDENCY REQUIREMENT FOR CERTAIN COUNTY

ATTORNEY POSITIONS WITHIN ESSEX COUNTY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06834-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 725, JEAN-PIERRE. AN ACT TO AMEND CHAPTER 154 OF THE

LAWS OF 1921, RELATING TO THE PORT AUTHORITY OF NEW YORK AND NEW

JERSEY, IN RELATION TO MILITARY LEAVE FOR ALL REPRESENTED AND

NON-REPRESENTED PERSONS EMPLOYED BY THE PORT AUTHORITY OF NEW YORK

AND NEW JERSEY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06916-A, RULES

389

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

REPORT NO. 726, CURRAN. AN ACT AUTHORIZING UNITED CHURCH OF GOD

SEVENTH DAY TO RECEIVE RETROACTIVE REAL PROPERTY TAX EXEMPT STATUS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

CURRAN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06924, RULES REPORT

NO. 727, HUNTER. AN ACT IN RELATION TO THE STUDY OF THE UTILIZATION OF

STATE GOVERNMENT PAYMENTS AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO TRANSITION UNBANKED

AND UNDERBANKED STATE RESIDENTS INTO THE BANKING SYSTEM.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

MR. GOODELL TO EXPLAIN HIS VOTE.

MR. GOODELL: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THIS BILL

CALLS FOR THE STUDY OF THE UTILIZATION OF STATE GOVERNMENT PAYMENTS AS

AN OPPORTUNITY TO IMPROVE BANKING OPPORTUNITIES. I THINK THAT'S A GREAT

390

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

IDEA. IT WOULD BE EVEN BETTER IF THE REPORT THAT IS PRODUCED WAS

PROVIDED TO THE MINORITY, AS WELL AS THE MAJORITY SINCE WE TEND TO

REPRESENT ABOUT ONE-THIRD OF THE STATE. AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, FOR THE

PURPOSE OF THIS BILL REPRESENT MANY AREAS THAT COULD USE SOME

IMPROVEMENT IN BANKING OPPORTUNITIES. SO I WOULD IMPLORE THE

MAJORITY TO INCLUDE THESE REPORTS AND HAVE THEM SENT TO THE MINORITY

AS WELL. THANK YOU, SIR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MR. GOODELL IN THE

AFFIRMATIVE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A06972, RULES REPORT

NO. 728, OTIS. AN ACT TO AMEND THE STATE TECHNOLOGY LAW, IN RELATION

TO STATE AGENCY WEBSITES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

OTIS, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS ADVANCED.

READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: CLERK WILL RECORD THE

VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

391

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07098, RULES REPORT

NO. 729, BENDETT. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN RELATION TO

EXTENDING THE AUTHORITY OF THE COUNTY OF COLUMBIA TO IMPOSE AN

ADDITIONAL RATE OF SALES AND COMPENSATING USE TAX.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

BENDETT, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07129-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 730, SLATER. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN RELATION TO

AUTHORIZING AN OCCUPANCY TAX IN THE TOWN OF PUTNAM VALLEY, IN

PUTNAM COUNTY; AND PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON

EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

SLATER, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

392

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07164, RULES REPORT

NO. 731, SEPTIMO, EPSTEIN, STIRPE, REYES, COLTON, ALVAREZ,

GONZ�LEZ-ROJAS, SEAWRIGHT, CUNNINGHAM. AN ACT TO AMEND THE REAL

PROPERTY TAX LAW, IN RELATION TO TAX EXEMPTIONS FOR PERSONS WITH

DISABILITIES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

SEPTIMO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 90TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07173, RULES REPORT

NO. 732, JEAN-PIERRE, RAGA, EACHUS, SANTABARBARA, BUTTENSCHON. AN

ACT TO AMEND THE VETERANS' SERVICES LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING ALL

STATE AGENCIES TO APPOINT VETERANS' LIAISONS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: READ THE LAST SECTION.

393

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 90TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07287-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 733, LEMONDES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN RELATION

TO AUTHORIZING AN OCCUPANCY TAX IN THE VILLAGE OF SKANEATELES; AND

PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

LEMONDES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07333, RULES REPORT

NO. 734, BRONSON. AN ACT TO AMEND THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT LAW,

AND THE NEW YORK STATE URBAN DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION ACT, IN

394

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

RELATION TO CERTAIN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

BRONSON, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED AND THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07334, RULES REPORT

NO. 735, BICHOTTE HERMELYN. AN ACT TO AMEND THE NEW YORK CITY

CHARTER, IN RELATION TO THE PROCUREMENT LIMIT FOR BUSINESSES OWNED BY

WOMEN AND MINORITIES.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE BILL IS LAID ASIDE.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07391-A, RULES

REPORT NO. 736, LEMONDES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE TAX LAW, IN RELATION

TO AUTHORIZING AN OCCUPANCY TAX IN THE VILLAGE OF WEEDSPORT; AND

PROVIDING FOR THE REPEAL OF SUCH PROVISIONS UPON EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

LEMONDES -- OH, I'M SORRY. HOME RULE MESSAGE AT THE DESK. READ THE

LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07404, RULES REPORT

NO. 737, SOLAGES, MCDONALD, ZEBROWSKI. AN ACT TO AMEND THE STATE

395

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

FINANCE LAW, IN RELATION TO REQUIRING THE PUBLIC POSTING OF CERTAIN

CONTRACTS OTHERWISE SUBJECT TO PRIOR APPROVAL OF COMPTROLLER.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

SOLAGES, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT ON THE 30TH

DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07415, RULES REPORT

NO. 738, HAWLEY. AN ACT TO AMEND THE HIGHWAY LAW, IN RELATION TO

DESIGNATING A PORTION OF THE STATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM AS THE "SP4 GEORGE

HAROLD FRY MEMORIAL HIGHWAY".

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

HAWLEY, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

396

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07615, RULES REPORT

NO. 739, SMULLEN. AN ACT TO AMEND CHAPTER 326 OF THE LAWS OF 2006

AMENDING THE TAX LAW RELATING TO AUTHORIZING THE COUNTY OF HAMILTON

TO IMPOSE A COUNTY RECORDING TAX ON OBLIGATIONS SECURED BY MORTGAGES

ON REAL PROPERTY, IN RELATION TO EXTENDING THE EXPIRATION THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

SMULLEN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07645, RULES REPORT

NO. 740, THIELE. AN ACT TO AMEND CHAPTER 438 OF THE LAWS OF 2022

RELATING TO THE ADOPTION AND SUBMISSION OF AN ANNUAL BUDGET BY THE

TRUSTEE OF THE FREEHOLDERS AND COMMONALTY OF THE TOWN OF

SOUTHAMPTON, IN RELATION TO THE EFFECTIVENESS THEREOF.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

THIELE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

397

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07647, RULES REPORT

NO. 741, THIELE. AN ACT AUTHORIZING THE TOWN OF SOUTHAMPTON, COUNTY

OF SUFFOLK, TO ALIENATE CERTAIN PARKLANDS FOR THE PURPOSE OF INSTALLING

AN ALGAE SKIMMER IN LAKE AGAWAM, AND TO REPLACE SUCH ALIENATED

PARKLAND WITH A NEW, DEDICATED PARKLAND.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS

PAULIN [SIC], THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE -- OH, I'M SORRY. WE'RE

ON MR. THIELE. ON A MOTION BY MR. THIELE, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE

THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE

DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07674, RULES REPORT

398

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

NO. 742, PAULIN, BURDICK. AN ACT IN RELATION TO AUTHORIZING THE CITY OF

WHITE PLAINS TO ALIENATE PROPERTY OWNED BY THE CITY OF WHITE PLAINS

AND OPERATED AS THE FORMER GALLERIA OF WHITE PLAINS PUBLIC PARKING

GARAGE.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MS.

PAULIN, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. HOME RULE MESSAGE IS AT THE DESK. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07692, RULES REPORT

NO. 745, ZACCARO, PEOPLES-STOKES. AN ACT TO AMEND THE

ADMINISTRATIVE CODE OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK, IN RELATION TO

PERMITTING CERTAIN TAX DEDUCTIONS RELATED TO THE SALE, PRODUCTION, OR

DISTRIBUTION OF CANNABIS PRODUCTS.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MR.

ZACCARO, THE SENATE BILL IS BEFORE THE HOUSE. THE SENATE BILL IS

ADVANCED. READ THE LAST SECTION.

THE CLERK: THIS ACT SHALL TAKE EFFECT IMMEDIATELY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE CLERK WILL RECORD

THE VOTE.

399

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

(THE CLERK RECORDED THE VOTE.)

ARE THERE ANY OTHER VOTES? ANNOUNCE THE RESULTS.

(THE CLERK ANNOUNCED THE RESULTS.)

THE BILL IS PASSED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. A07755, RULES REPORT

NO. 746 IS HIGH.

ASSEMBLY NO. A07757, RULES REPORT NO. 747 IS HIGH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, MEMBERS

HAVE ON THEIR DESK A B-CALENDAR. I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE TO ADVANCE THAT

CALENDAR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON A MOTION BY MRS.

PEOPLES-STOKES THE B-CALENDER IS ADVANCED.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: THANK YOU, SIR. NOW IF

WE COULD CALL OUR ATTENTION TO THE MAIN CALENDAR AND GO TO OUR

RESOLUTIONS ON PAGE 3.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE MAIN

CALENDER, PAGE 3, RESOLUTIONS, ASSEMBLY NO. 687. CLERK WILL READ.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 687, MR. THIELE.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM JUNE 10, 2023, AS DRAGONFLY DAY IN THE

STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

400

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 688, MRS. GUNTHER.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM JUNE 2023, AS POST-TRAUMATIC STRESS INJURY

AWARENESS MONTH, AND JUNE 27, 2023, AS POST TRAUMATIC STRESS INJURY

AWARENESS DAY IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 689, MS. REYES.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM JULY 25, 2023, AS AFRO-LATINA,

AFRO-CARIBBEAN, AND AFRICAN DIASPORA WOMEN'S DAY IN THE STATE OF

NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 690, MS. SOLAGES.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM JULY 2023, AS FIBROID AWARENESS MONTH IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 691, MR. JONES.

401

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM AUGUST 1-7, 2023, AS ADIRONDACK WATER

WEEK IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 692, MR. ALVAREZ.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM AUGUST 16, 2023, AS HISPANIC MEDIA DAY IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 693, MR. BRONSON.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM OCTOBER 11, 2023, AS COMING OUT DAY IN

THE STATE OF NEW YORK, IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE OBSERVANCE OF NATIONAL

COMING OUT DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 694, MR. SMITH.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM OCTOBER 24-28, 2023, AS STRANGER SAFETY

AND EDUCATION AWARENESS WEEK IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

402

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 695, MS. JEAN-PIERRE.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM OCTOBER 29-NOVEMBER 4, 2023, AS VETERANS

AWARENESS WEEK IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 696, MS. HUNTER.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM OCTOBER 2023, AS CAREERS AND CONSTRUCTION

MONTH IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE OBSERVANCE OF

NATIONAL CAREERS AND CONSTRUCTION MONTH.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 697, MR. BRABENEC.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM OCTOBER 2023, AS GERMAN-AMERICAN

HERITAGE MONTH IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

403

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 698, MR. MCDONALD.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM NOVEMBER 2023, AS EPILEPSY AWARENESS

MONTH IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION IS

ADOPTED.

THE CLERK: ASSEMBLY NO. 699, MR. SANTABARBARA.

LEGISLATIVE RESOLUTION MEMORIALIZING GOVERNOR

KATHY HOCHUL TO PROCLAIM NOVEMBER 2023, AS ALPHA-1 AWARENESS

MONTH IN THE STATE OF NEW YORK.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: ON THE RESOLUTION, ALL

THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTION

ADOPTED.

MR. NORRIS.

MR. NORRIS: THANK YOU, MR. SPEAKER. THERE WILL

BE A REPUBLICAN CONFERENCE IN THE MORNING AT 9:00 A.M. IN THE PARLOR.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: REPUBLICAN

CONFERENCE 9:00 A.M. IN THE PARLOR.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: MR. SPEAKER, DO YOU

HAVE ANY FURTHER HOUSEKEEPING OR RESOLUTIONS?

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: WE CERTAINLY HAVE A

FEW RESOLUTIONS, ALL FINE I'M SURE.

ON THE RESOLUTIONS, WE WILL TAKE THEM UP WITH ONE

404

NYS ASSEMBLY JUNE 8, 2023

VOTE.

ON THE RESOLUTIONS, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SIGNIFY BY SAYING

AYE; OPPOSED, NO. THE RESOLUTIONS ARE ADOPTED.

(WHEREUPON, ASSEMBLY RESOLUTION NOS. 700-713

WERE UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED.)

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES.

MRS. PEOPLES-STOKES: I NOW MOVE THAT THE

ASSEMBLY STAND ADJOURNED UNTIL 9:30 A.M., FRIDAY, JUNE THE 9TH,

TOMORROW BEING A SESSION DAY.

ACTING SPEAKER AUBRY: THE ASSEMBLY STANDS

ADJOURNED.

(WHEREUPON, AT 1:38 A.M., THE ASSEMBLY STOOD

ADJOURNED UNTIL FRIDAY, JUNE 9TH AT 9:30 A.M., FRIDAY BEING A SESSION

DAY.)

405